New Republic Flight Trainer

[Le Chuck]

Coming soon to an arcade near you

[harveybirdman]

[Louis Tully]

.

[alfonzotan]

Niiiice.

Do I get a free test-flight for pointing out the cheap-ass SW Trilogy Arcade?  (No, it doesn't matter if you'd already seen it...) 

[emphatic]

Whoah. 

[ark_ader]

Dooku's speeder would be easier to incorporate electronics and the projection display.

[Le Chuck]

SEGA has allowed us to take a special behind the scenes look at how the New Republic Flight Trainer will coming together.  Here at the Micro Arcadia R&D division we're busy salvaging parts and pieces from some classic SEGA builds so we can produce an all new product from retrofitted parts.  Today was tear down of a Super Hang On.  Don't worry, the boards are intact and will soon find a good home.  The bike itself had seen better days but the chassis was in good condition and is being lovingly re-purposed for this exciting prototype build. 


Here we have the initial tear down


A good head on shot of half the bike


And after a thorough cleaning.  There is still prep work to be done and some touch up painting required.  Following that we'll begin MDF and foam mockup to test for ride-ability. 

Stay tuned as we take you through the creation of SEGA's newest coming attraction.   

[AlienInferno]

Awesome!

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I997 using Tapatalk 2

[Le Chuck]

Emphatic, LT, and harveybirdman,  Thanks guys, let's hope it comes together well

Alfonzotan - totally man.  If I pull this off I'll probably have a release party for it. 

Ark - I went back and forth on this, finally decided on the 74-z because of the sleek design and more physical interaction.  If I built Dooku's swoop it would contain all the hardware, be a large immobile mass, have that really awkward front piece that splits the field of vision (no idea why it's designed like that) but would look great and be a lot of fun.  The speeder is more of a challenge and I like the platform a bit better. 

[drventure]

Ark - I went back and forth on this, finally decided on the 74-z because of the sleek design and more physical interaction.  If I built Dooku's swoop it would contain all the hardware, be a large immobile mass, have that really awkward front piece that splits the field of vision (no idea why it's designed like that) but would look great and be a lot of fun.  The speeder is more of a challenge and I like the platform a bit better.

Good call. I had to google Dooku's speeder, but, the speeder bikes from the movies that you've picked just look so much more interesting.

Can't wait to see how this build progresses!

[yaksplat]

Welcome back to full size builds.  Looks like you've got a fun one planned. 

[BadMouth]

In another thread, you mentioned teaching yourself how to work with fiberglass.
Do you have a particular method you plan to use for this? 
(i.e. mold, stretching fleece over frame, carving foam, other?)

Keep an eye out for things that already have a shape close to what you need.
It saves a ton of time to use other objects as a mold, or part of a mold...or stretch fleece from them to a base.
Some of the body panels from the Hang-on look like they might be useful. 
You can sink a lot of time in trying to get 3D shapes with multiple contours perfectly symetrical.
Thin flexible plastic or plexiglass can come in handy for areas where you only need one uniform curve.
The better your initial fiberglass lay, the less bondo/weight/problems you'll have.

[Vigo]

bookmarking thread. 

[Le Chuck]

Today the boys over in R&D stripped the decals off the SHO frame and did some light repair to a bent foot panel.  The resident welder came over to consult on what will be needed.  Mock-up to commence shortly.  That will give us the measurements we need to send off for the initial round of fabrication. 

This evening we broke apart the controllers from SW Racer to notate what changes will be needed.



The axle will be extended and the original handle will be modified for internal support between the two.  A quick release system is still being designed to allow the handles to selectively operate independently but we're confident a solution will soon present itself.  The side panels will need to be squared off and the support tabs will need to be redone in a new position.  Before we send the units out of the shop we'll need to get the Uhid in and ensure they are getting full range of motion in MAME or we may need to adjust the stops.  Doing so will likely not make the pod racer go any faster but it could  .     

- - -

DrV, Yak and Vigo 

BadMouth:  I'll be shaving foam for days.  I'm totally intending to have the garage completely covered in green dust in order to cover all the brown MDF dust I still haven't cleaned out.  I have experience in that so I'm confident I can get the shapes I'm after.  I have no experience in laying fiberglass over foam tho so there will be a learning curve.  I have a buddy who has done some minor stuff like boat repair and between the two of us I'm sure we'll make a huge mess, get high off glue, drink a few beers and eventually get something workable produced.  I'll be spending the prep time to get the foam perfect so I don't have to so as much fill and sanding on the back end hopefully. 

[yaksplat]

Have you tried using a hot wire for the foam over shaving?

Although i don't know what's worse, foam smoke or foam dust.... 

[Le Chuck]

Have you tried using a hot wire for the foam over shaving?

Although i don't know what's worse, foam smoke or foam dust.... 

For rough cuts I'll do that but all finish work is done with a hand rasp or sandpaper. 

[BadMouth]

I should probably mention that certain types of foam & fiberglass resin heat up and produce smoke when curing.
Stick a foam brush in a cup of resin and see what happens.
I've never seen it catch fire, but the fumes can't be good for you.

Toss some of your foam shavings in resin and see if there is any reaction before laying mat on it. 

[yaksplat]

For rough cuts I'll do that but all finish work is done with a hand rasp or sandpaper.

ooo raspy 

[selfie]

  Very Cool. I'll be watching with interest!

[TopJimmyCooks]

subscribe.

[mcseforsale]

Subscribing,......BIGTIME!  You're local so when you have its party, I'd like to see it.   

Waiting with pregnant anticipation.

AJ

[yaksplat]

You obviously need to get the new shirt at nowherebad.com

[Le Chuck]

New subscribers:   

Yak: Purchased.  Awesome-sauce.

X2 - I'll take it under advisement.  I do like this style of racing game, which is why I'm building one. 

No pics this time, it'll be about a fortnight before I have a good set of pics with metal shavings and wires and tape and cardboard and maybe even foam.  Bear with me.  I'll be out of town this coming week and then I want to put in a good week on the bike so there is actually something to check out. 

In the meantime, UHID came in.  Testing has commenced and I am confident that I'll be able to integrate the needed peripherals into the emulators, while ensuring that they are still compatible with the SEGA boards.  Wiring question:

I'm reusing the Super Hang-On throttle and brake.  They are wired together.  4 wires total.  Separate ground wires but the resistance wires switch between the two pots. 

<edit for correct labeling>
On Throttle Pot:
Lug 1 - Red
Lug 2 - Black 1 (wiper)
Lug 3 - Green

On Brake Pot:
Lug 1 - Green
Lug 2 - Black 2 (wiper)
Lug 3 - Red

I understand why it is wired up like this, so braking is actually controlled deceleration, but I'm not sure if I want to keep this configuration.  Any pros and cons to splitting it up?  SWRacer isn't wired like that but that doesn't matter as the throttle will be inert in that game.  Are there other racing games that benefit from this setup?  My gut says to split them into their own channels on the UHID so they assign independently in emulators.  That way I can accelerate while I brake... which doesn't seem to be overly necessary but what do I know.   

[PL1]

I'm reusing the Super Hang-On throttle and brake.  They are wired together.  4 wires total.  Separate ground wires but the resistance wires switch between the two pots. 

On Throttle Pot:
Lug 1 - Red
Lug 2 - Grd 1
Lug 3 - Green

On Brake Pot:
Lug 1 - Green
Lug 2 - Grd 2
Lug 3 - Red

I understand why it is wired up like this, so braking is actually controlled deceleration, but I'm not sure if I want to keep this configuration.  Any pros and cons to splitting it up?  SWRacer isn't wired like that but that doesn't matter as the throttle will be inert in that game.  Are there other racing games that benefit from this setup?  My gut says to split them into their own channels on the UHID so they assign independently in emulators.  That way I can accelerate while I brake... which doesn't seem to be overly necessary but what do I know.   

Unclet had a single axis Virtua racing pedal on B/S/T a while back with this diagram . . .



. . . and a link to this thread.

He might be the one to ask.   


Scott

[DaOld Man]

Sweet project!!

[Le Chuck]

PL1, good links.  Chased the rabbit to here.  Really comes down to this:

one analog input axis to two game axes is okay, two analog linput axes to one game axis is not.

Which means that if I wire in series (single axis) I can play every game but can't burn out.  If I wire in parrallel (dual axis) I am limited in game selection or just can't brake in that game.  I think the best solution is to add another brake.  I've got more than enough inputs on the UHID.  I can do the throttle side brake in series and the left brake in parrallel.  That will match the styling of the speeder and give me added functionality once I start mapping games.  The catch will be knowing which brake is active in which game.  I guess that's why they make LEDs. 

Sweet project!!

Welcome aboard!

[TheShaner]

Wow, just saw this thread for the first time.  Very ambitious.  I can't wait to see it come together!

[PL1]

Crazy spitball idea.  Couldn't you wire it BOTH ways?   

I'm picturing a 6 contact double throw relay used to switch U-HID connections for the pedals from dual axis to single axis.

Maybe use DaOld Man's Control Choose to switch to single axis for the games that use it?


Scott

[BadMouth]

I understand why it is wired up like this, so braking is actually controlled deceleration, but I'm not sure if I want to keep this configuration.  Any pros and cons to splitting it up?  SWRacer isn't wired like that but that doesn't matter as the throttle will be inert in that game.  Are there other racing games that benefit from this setup?  My gut says to split them into their own channels on the UHID so they assign independently in emulators.  That way I can accelerate while I brake... which doesn't seem to be overly necessary but what do I know.   

Model 2 Emulator requires a separate axis for gas and brake.
I'd separate them for the sake of having Manx TT and Motoraid play properly.
If you want to get crazy (like this build needs extras?!),
you could add banking for Wave Runner.

IIRC the pc versions of Crazy Taxi and Outrun 2006 require the pedals to be on one axis, but you're not building this to play them.
Newer games can be configured either way.

I haven't tried it, but H2Seq will allow you to use an Up/Down shifter for MAME and Model 2 games that required a 4 speed.
http://www.racermame.altervista.org/download.htm

[rockyrocket]

Now this looks like a "build!", no point in half measures eh?.
The thing that impresses me most is that the "family" agreed to it in the first place - well done!.

[PL1]

I'm picturing a 6 contact double throw relay used to switch U-HID connections for the pedals from dual axis to single axis.

Maybe use DaOld Man's Control Choose to switch to single axis for the games that use it?

As requested in a PM, here's what I had in mind.

This is based on the unclet threads here and here mentioned in my earlier post in this thread.

Disclaimer:  This is general electronic design/application, not personal experience.  I have not verified precisely how everything works together.  Possible snags/adjustments noted below.   

To energize/deenergize the relay, I pictured a 4/8 way joystick servo switch type assembly connected to a toggle switch instead of the restrictor plate.  There are probably better ideas on how to do that part, but I haven't researched them.   

This application will only require one 4-pole double-throw (4PDT) relay since the brake pink and the blue/yellow are connected and used the same for either configuration.  If you prefer, you can substitute two double-pole double-throw (DPDT) relays with the coils wired in parallel in place of the 4PDT relay.

I don't know for certain if the default position of the wipers (blue/yellow and blue/red) would be next to the brown or next to the pink -- I'm assuming brown.  If someone with a working single-axis setup can confirm that the ohms reading between brown and blue on the throttle is ~1 Ohm when the pedal is not pressed, that will help me confirm if the attached diagrams are correct.

For the relay diagram, I am assuming that the pink wires are Vcc and the brown wires are ground.  They could be wired the other way, depending on the default position of the wipers.

The second diagram shows how single-axis wiring works in general.  Operating voltage (Vcc) from the brake pink wire is applied to the pots as shown.  For this configuration, the blue/red wire from single axis is connected to ground.


Scott

[Le Chuck]

The R&D crew was back at it again trying to make some progress on this behemoth.  Brackets from the SHO frame have been removed to make way for soon to be custom brackets, bits and pieces have started to trickle in, and templates have been printed.  Not a ton of headway but important ground work has been laid and the crew is confident that the Flight Trainer will one day live.  Our resident welder has had to call out for a few days due to other obligations but once he's back we'll be cranking out the new brackets and the handle bar mounts.  Once complete that will allow us to start the foam plug phase but these things can't be rushed. 

Before we go to pics the design department has asked that I address an issue that is sure to come up:  The final product will not be movie accurate.  Big shocker I know but a movie prop accurate full size 74-Z just wouldn't make a great arcade ride-on.  Scale has been reduced to 3:4, certain liberties will be taken with materials and interfaces both for aesthetic reasons and also durability.  Finally, the biggest and perhaps most controversial decision, the foot rests will not be present.  This is both a safety as well as an engineering decision.  Nevertheless the crew is excited and I think I speak for all of them when I say that despite the lack of foot rests you won't be disappointed.     


This is Barb.  Barb is our local connection for all our printing needs.  Here she is seen standing in complete amazement at our 16ft long template print. 


A 1:10 scale model has also been completed to help us visualize some of the curves and connections.  This model is not bad but isn't film accurate.  We'll be splitting the difference between the model, the template prints, the film speeder, and a bit of our own design.  For reference the model is seen here on the template seat.


Le Chuck should never be allowed to use a grinder.


Here we are bracket free and ready for finish grinding once Brent finally comes back to the R&D dept.



Profile template against the bare frame for reference


Contour template on frame.  This gives a very rough idea of what we're basically shooting for.


That's it for this update.  We'll be back again once we have the brackets completed and are getting ready to start shaving foam.  Thanks for looking!


- - - - - -

PL1, thanks for the awesome explanation.  It gives me a lot to think about but don't know if I'm going to tackle that or just go with the second brake.  I may need to incorporate a servo to help with one of the game settings I'm looking to incorporate and if I'm adding one servo I may as well add more.  We'll have to see once I get further along.

Badmouth, I think I have the banking already taken care of but will have to see if the game supports what I have in mind.  Looks like fun tho, thanks for turning me on to Wave Runner. Incidentally I've been power reading your driving threads for tips.  Awesome stuff. 

Shaner & rockyrocket, thanks guys.  Welcome!

[harveybirdman]

Don't worry about the liberties. I'm confident you'll steer clear of any, "Greedo shoots first" catastrophes.   

[PL1]

Apologies for any confusion.  I didn't review this thread carefully enough before posting my earlier answer about single/dual axis wiring.  It's not wrong--just not necessarily relevant to the controls that Le Chuck is using.

   I missed where it said 4 wires.   

I'm reusing the Super Hang-On throttle and brake.  They are wired together.  4 wires total.  Separate ground wires but the resistance wires switch between the two pots. 

<edit for correct labeling>
On Throttle Pot:
Lug 1 - Red
Lug 2 - Black 1 (wiper)
Lug 3 - Green

On Brake Pot:
Lug 1 - Green
Lug 2 - Black 2 (wiper)
Lug 3 - Red

I understand why it is wired up like this, so braking is actually controlled deceleration, but I'm not sure if I want to keep this configuration.

Just confirmed on pg 42 (top center) of the SHO schematic that the acceleration and brake 5k pots are wired as dual axis.

1 red (or green) wire is operating voltage
1 green (or red) wire is ground
2 black wires are separate gas and throttle inputs to the board

Ground is ground and operating voltage is operating voltage -- whether 2 guys jump up and hit their heads (black wires) on the ceiling (red wire) or fall down and hit their heads on the floor (green wire), the ceiling and floor don't move, just them and their heads. (black wires)  They can stand, sit, jump or fall independently. (dual axis)


According to pg 39 of the manual, SW Racer Arcade uses 2 throttles and 1 brake = 3 separate inputs.

Pg 141, item 102 shows that the throttles use analog 5k pots.

Pg 146, item 101 shows that the brake uses a "PHOTO INTERRUPTER GP1A71A" which acts as a switch.  No idea how it is wired, or if it is low level active or high level active.


Since form follows function, several questions to clarify the list of what controls you will need before you accidently start rolling putty:   

1. Besides SW Racer, are you thinking about using other dedicated PCBs?

2. What physical consoles/games do you want to connect/run?

3. What emulators and specific games do you want to run?

4. Are there any controls or parts that you definitely prefer to use for mechanical or asthetic reasons?


Scott

[jmike]

  
      Le Chuck,
                    that 16 foot print out looks sweeet!!  Can't wait to see it come together.


 

[yaksplat]

Now i just want to make sure....


Your speeder isn't going to just be a glorified version of this:


 

[yotsuya]

Now i just want to make sure....


Your speeder isn't going to just be a glorified version of this:


 

 

[Sjaak]

Bookmarked

Notifications ON

This is going to be awesome!

[Le Chuck]

   I missed where it said 4 wires.   

Just confirmed on pg 42 (top center) of the SHO schematic that the acceleration and brake 5k pots are wired as dual axis.

Doesn't matter, it's no longer a SHO and I'm rewiring the throttle and brake to be single axis.  Wanna buy a SHO board?  Still leaves me with the same single axis and dual axis control implementation question previously mentioned but let's say I already have two brake handles on hand.

According to pg 39 of the manual, SW Racer Arcade uses 2 throttles and 1 brake = 3 separate inputs.

Pg 141, item 102 shows that the throttles use analog 5k pots.

Pg 146, item 101 shows that the brake uses a "PHOTO INTERRUPTER GP1A71A" which acts as a switch.  No idea how it is wired, or if it is low level active or high level active.

Correct, all of said hardware is on hand, brake is being wired to the single axis right hand brake as that throttle is not being used in SW Racer.  Those throttles are being re-fabricated to control fore and aft handle bar movement and will selectively operate in tandem sampling only the right throttle for games where Y axis movement is required but retain the ability to operate independently for games where dual throttles are required (ie SW Racer, tank style games, and perhaps Wave Runner)

1. Besides SW Racer, are you thinking about using other dedicated PCBs?

Perhaps, depends on space availability later in the build.  Read Gonk vs PLNK droid. 

2. What physical consoles/games do you want to connect/run?

None

3. What emulators and specific games do you want to run?

My aren't we nosy 

4. Are there any controls or parts that you definitely prefer to use for mechanical or asthetic reasons?

Yes. 

[Le Chuck]

Now i just want to make sure....

Your speeder isn't going to just be a glorified version of this:


 

Well, yeah actually 

I mean, it all goes back to the age old question, "which horse/chariot/car/speeder will get me the most chicks?"

Sjaak - welcome!