Gorrila Glue = No Bolts for joys

[acevedor2]

I did get that it was a joke, and the reply was my attempt at the same.....

Cheers.

[patrickl]

One question would be how do you recess the holes for the T-nuts.  Which bit and what jig.  Or would you just try and free hand.  I guess I am just a little daunted by the fact that I will be trying to route a recess about 1/2 wide and about 1/16 of an inch deep so the t-nuts fit flush.  Does anyone have a good jig setup idea for for this?

I used a simple wood drill. Well 3 actually. With decreasing  diameter, one for the recess of the top, one for the threaded part of the nut and one (entirely through the wood) for the bolt. The biggest one was a spade bit and the other two are standard drill bits.

[acevedor2]

Thanks.  I appreciate the info.  Spade bit sounds like the way to go for the nut itself.  Any thoughts on how to mount the trigger joy flush?  Again, the metal plate must be mounted from the top, and even if recessed will need a bolt going down through the top.

[patrickl]

I'm not familiar with the "trigger stick" that you are using. I guess most (if not all) joysticks were designed to be mounted under a metal CP. Is there a problem with the handle length? Or you don't want to take it apart to mount it?

I "mid" mounted my happs galaga/ms pacman reuninon. I put the stick between two layers of wood. The top layer had the t-nut and the bottom layer was routed out from the top. So it is sandwiched between the layers of wood. The screws bond the layers of wood together so it is strong anyway.

I wanted it to have artwork on top with no bolts showing, have the ability to be taken apart and the galaga/ms pac has a short handle. The short handle makes people say it can only be mounted in a metal mounting plate. Mine works fine in a wood CP. But then I don't like the stick so it was useless  anyway

[acevedor2]

Because of the design of the trigger joy, it is designed to be mounted from the top - (see below). You can see by the design that there really is no way to mount it from the bottom. 

Right now I am exploring 2 options:

Recess the top enough so that the cariage bolt heads are flush with the top.  This will work, but will then require me fill or place some kind of material to fill the distance between the plate and the CPO.

Option 2 is to countersink the bolt holesa little so that flat head bolts will sit flush.  This might be doable, but will be tricky because the factory holes that exist for the bolts are for square. 

[ahofle]

Just looking at the picture, it looks to me like it's designed to be mounted below a metal control panel with carriage bolts on top. 

[acevedor2]

Yeah - got that.  Poblem is it is going into a wood cab and I want it flush under the CPO.  Any thoughts?

[Chris]

Yeah - got that.  Poblem is it is going into a wood cab and I want it flush under the CPO.  Any thoughts?

I think you had the right idea... recess it all 1/8" to bring the bolt heads below CPO level, and fashion a cover plate out of 1/8" plexi or hardboard with recesses on the bottom of the coverplate for the bolt heads.  With the CPO going over that, you won't need to fasten the coverplate down at all, although a little spray adhesive on the back will allow it to tack down and still be easy to pry out for maintenace if you like.

[acevedor2]

Will it be hard to make the cover plate?  Not sure how I would get a piece of MDF that thin to fill in?  I was actually thinking maybe cardboard.  It is easy to cut and shape and should provide the necessary support to the CPO.  Thoughts?

[Chris]

Will it be hard to make the cover plate?  Not sure how I would get a piece of MDF that thin to fill in?  I was actually thinking maybe cardboard.  It is easy to cut and shape and should provide the necessary support to the CPO.  Thoughts?

Not MDF, just a small plate of plexi or hardboard (Masonite, fiberboard, whatever you want to call it).  Or even 1/8 balsa wood from a hobby store.  Cardboard would probably be fine too.

[patrickl]

You will not be able to remove it easily if you use a coverplate which is then covered by a CPO. I guess it's not a problem really if you don't think you will ever want to take it a apart. On the other hand I liked to keep that option available (for addition of new controls or replacement or something) So I went for the "mid" mounting. Use a thinner layer of wood (or lexan or whatever) on top and a thicker one on the bottom.

[javeryh]

Why don't you just use wood screws and attach the joystick from underneath? You might need to get a longer shaft for the joystick if you aren't going to route any material away underneath though.  This is what I did on my current cabinet - the joystick will be secured using 4 wood screws.  I don't think it will move once the screws are in place.  ??Here are some pics (of course the screws aren't in yet but you get the idea).

 

Couldn't you do the same thing but without routing out the material like I did?  Would this work or am I completely missing something?

[acevedor2]

It is impossible to mount the trigger joy to the bottom without signifcant modifications to the joystick - -which by the way was 105 bucks!  It is not  anormal joy.  The normal joys can be bottom mounted no sweat.  Only one giving me issues now is the mounting of the trigger joy.  I might end up using bolts through the top for that one.  Wouldn't be optimal because you could see them on the top but at least it would only be 4 instead of for all of the joys.

[leapinlew]

I would just use Gorilla Glue.





 




Seriously, just mount it from the top and be done with it.

[patrickl]

if you open up the handle, can't you mount it from below then? you will need to take it apart to put the dust washer on top of the Cp anyway. I really doubt the joy was designed to be mounted from the top.

[miles2912]

Route the top of your CP so the plate sits flush.  Same way most of us mount trackballs and the way I mounted my 4 way.  Check out the pic -4-way's mounting plate is nect to the hole.




Don

[markrvp]

Route the top of your CP so the plate sits flush.  Same way most of us mount trackballs and the way I mounted my 4 way.  Check out the pic -4-way's mounting plate is nect to the hole.




Don

DING, DING, DING - we have a winner.

You're going to HAVE TO remove the handle from the base at some point to put on your artwork, unless your planning to cut a hole big enough for the trigger stick in your artwork.

Route out enough space for the base ON TOP of the panel and then route it deep enough so that the top of your carriage bolts will be flush with the top of the panel.  Then use some type of filler on the top of the base to make it even with the top of the panel.  Even if you don't use a filler, you can NOT ADHERE the artwork to the base (to hide the recess and bolt tops).  Put plexi over the top of the artwork and no one will ever know. 

THIS IS HOW I MOUNTED MY ORIGINAL TRON TRIGGER STICK.

[ChadTower]

Little by little it *will* crack and break down, then one day when you're attempting a cool finishing move your joystick will suddenly just pop down inside your control panel.

Hopefully he'll get lucky and the rabbit won't die.

[Mattiekrome]

Lew - what did you do - countersink the carriage bolts from the top and then recess the joy base in the bottom? 

Judging by some of the pics in the "Show your CP thread", this is a fairly common mounting method?  I'm going to be putting an 8 way comp and a 4 way super in a small CP i'm making, and I found this thread while trying to figure out how to mount these things.

I'm just thinking though... I will have a a 5/8" MDF CP with a 1/8" sheet of Lexan on top.  If I recess the bottom of the CP by 1/4" then countersink the bolt holes y 1/4" on top, isnt that going to mean there is only 1/4" MDF actually holding on to these sticks?  Since so many people use this method, I would assume its still quite strong, but sort of makes me cringe...  After reading some other threads I'm now thinking of doing a 1/4"recess on the bottom with some T-nuts flush mounted on top.

[Jdurg]

On my CP I'm mounting the joysticks and trackball from the top.  So I've routed out a good deal of the plywood from the top, and it still is quite strong.  Once the Joystick bases and the trackball plate have been installed, I'll be putting a solid piece of study cardboard or paper to flatten out the top.  The artwork will go on top of that, then the lexan on top of that.  The buttons will hold down everything and the bolts will be fully hidden.  This will work out just fine.

[kegger]

T-nuts used for mounting underneath CP

[ErikRuud]

First off, I wouldn't use any method of permanently mounting any of my controls.

Secondly Gorilla Glue is really formulated for porous materials and very tight tolerances.  It loses a lot of it's strength with non-porous matrials or if there are gaps in the joint.

With proper planning, you can have no visible mounting hardware, plenty of strength, and flexibility to change out the controls.

Take a look at these two pictures.

[Namco]

I love carriage bolts. Pac-Man had carriage bolts. Every Street Fighter I've ever seen had them. Centipede, Donkey Kong, and NeoGeos too. I rub them with my fingertip between rounds. I often try to get my fingernail underneath them to check for proper Sometimes I'd talk to them and ask them why they've turned brown. Oxidation or cigarette burns they would always tell me. I would notice that some were bigger than others and some were smoother than others. I use their helpful presence like braille to help find the buttons and stick.

Our relationship has turned sour recently however. I took the ones that came to live with me in my Carrier Airwings cabinet, pulled them from their pre-drilled homes and subjected them each to 30 seconds in the drill against some sandpaper. It was for their own good and they look shiny and as good as new in their new Street Fighter 2 panel, but I feel their resentment with every downward glance.

Anyway, in summary if you don't use visible carriage bolts on your control panel in the same way that it's been done in the arcade industry since Space Wars, then you're against the arcade industry... and you're a terrorist too no doubt. 

[MaximRecoil]

I like carriage bolts too. They have a solid, industrial, no-nonsense look to them. When you see those 4 carriage bolts around a joystick, you know that joystick isn't going anywhere, no matter how aggressively you play the game.

My Punch-Out control panel has 10 carriage bolts (not to mention 6 carriage bolts on each side of the machine for the monitor brackets) and I wouldn't have it any other way. I especially like the pair of carriage bolts below the big blue KO punch button. I always wondered what those were for when I was a kid. Now that I know their purpose I like them even more.

[Mattiekrome]

I'm just thinking though... I will have a a 5/8" MDF CP with a 1/8" sheet of Lexan on top.  If I recess the bottom of the CP by 1/4" then countersink the bolt holes y 1/4" on top, isnt that going to mean there is only 1/4" MDF actually holding on to these sticks?  Since so many people use this method, I would assume its still quite strong, but sort of makes me cringe...  After reading some other threads I'm now thinking of doing a 1/4"recess on the bottom with some T-nuts flush mounted on top.

Finally tracked down some Tee Nuts at Lowes tonight and noticed that they all came in 1/2" deep sizes.  Along the same lines as the above query...  If you have a 5/8" MDF CP, recess the sticks on the bottom by 1/4", then use these 1/2" Tee Nuts on top to flush mount on top of the CP, there will literally be no MDF inbetween the stick base and the thread of the tee nut... is this how others have done it? (or did you use 1/4" tee nuts?)

And I also found some of the threaded inserts that I saw RandyT mention in a diff. thread, those were all 1/2" deep as well.  So, I guess its the same application for those?

   So many Q's

[severdhed]

i mounted my joysticks from the bottom of my wooden panel using wood screws.  they have held up just fine, and there are no holes in the top of the panel at all.  and they are easy to remove if you need to replace/repair something.

[brandon]

T-nuts are nice.. and its not anti-classic or anything.. My Robotron cabinet has T-Nuts and I've seen other classic machines with them as well.  It personally preference but like everybody else said I wouldnt do anything perminent and I dont think glue will hold up as well as a mechanical attachment.

[ids]

Just tried under mounting with 1/4" chicago bolts - drilled a 3/16" hole for the outer piece - works like a charm, I think I'll be going with this.

[patrickl]

I'm just thinking though... I will have a a 5/8" MDF CP with a 1/8" sheet of Lexan on top.  If I recess the bottom of the CP by 1/4" then countersink the bolt holes y 1/4" on top, isnt that going to mean there is only 1/4" MDF actually holding on to these sticks?  Since so many people use this method, I would assume its still quite strong, but sort of makes me cringe...  After reading some other threads I'm now thinking of doing a 1/4"recess on the bottom with some T-nuts flush mounted on top.

Finally tracked down some Tee Nuts at Lowes tonight and noticed that they all came in 1/2" deep sizes.  Along the same lines as the above query...  If you have a 5/8" MDF CP, recess the sticks on the bottom by 1/4", then use these 1/2" Tee Nuts on top to flush mount on top of the CP, there will literally be no MDF inbetween the stick base and the thread of the tee nut... is this how others have done it? (or did you use 1/4" tee nuts?)

I used 1/4" deep t-nuts

[spacies]

Bolts all the way.