21" OEM PC Monitors $50

[Santoro]

http://www.computersurplusoutlet.com/viewproduct.asp?productid=MON-KDS21

Edit - these are used and shipping will cost almost as much.  The case looks nice for a Mame cab though.

[paigeoliver]

I have 3 of those, they totally rock.

They actually DO have power and control buttons, they are hidden on the side, and you need a pen or something to stick in to access them.

[crashwg]

Everyday, Paige, your place sounds more and more like a warehouse.    
I can just picture it now... "where's the bathroom?"  "Go that-a-way, past the cocktail, turn left and go between the pinball and the shelf with all the monitors on it.  You may have to turn sideways to fit through, but it's through there I swear.  Also, you may want to tie a string to the front door and hang on to the other end in case you get lost."  

[paigeoliver]

I keep a lot of stuff in my basement storage.

Although the amount of stuff I do have is truly frightening. It would be even worse if I didn't have the habit of trading 19" standard res monitors for favors (game pickup and/or delivery), and if I hadn't traded that truckload (literally) of parts for a nice pin a while back.


But, my stash is tiny compared to what some guys have. I know guys who have entire barn/storage buildings, basements, etc just jammed with games and parts. I have seen guys who literally have ROOMS filled with 19" monitors.

[jerryjanis]

I'm using that monitor for my desktop right now.  I think I paid $75.00 plus another $75 for shipping (it was used, but not very much), and it was probably one of the best purchases I've ever made!  I was expecting that it would be a substandard monitor, but when I plugged it in (and actually took it apart before I found the hidden power button) and saw it come alive, my jaw dropped!  It really produces an incredibly crisp, clear image.  I run it at 1600x1200, and I would probably run it at a higher resolution if I had any use for the real estate, but I don't.  It goes up to (I forget) something like 1920x1440 I think.

[Karman]

Has anyone here ordered from computersurplusoutlet.com before?

[Psychosylph]

* Psychosylph smiles about 21" monitor I picked up at a garage sale for $35...

[SirPeale]

Has anyone here ordered from computersurplusoutlet.com before?

Many times.  Great place.  Bargains all the time.  Their stuff is constantly changing, keep your eye on the site.

[pathdoc2]

I just order one of these for my next project.  Looks perfect for a Mame machine.  Thanks.  Shipping to TX was $68.

[paigeoliver]

Those are perfect. The tube size is just slightly larger than a standard 19" arcade monitor and a standard 19" bezel fits up to it fairly well.

They DO tend to poke out of the back of most cabinets just slightly when you replace a standard 19" arcade monitor with one of them.

I have one in my "Galaga" mini (which pokes WAY out the back because that cabinet originally came with a frameless 19" tube, that only had a half inch clearance to begin with).

I also have one in my Defender cabinet, sticks out about an inch.

Finally, I used one in the recent Donkey-Tron (Frogger style cabinet), that I made for a customer, sticks out a half inch in back.

I usually mount them this way. set the monitor on the "shelf", take the back metal cover off, run six screws through the bottom of the monitor enclosure (through the shelf), and then put the cover back on.

[rampy]

I didn't buy from these guys (I think...) but this the monitor I used in my cabinet and have been pretty happy with it (yeah i'd rather have a real arcade monitor and AVGA card, but that wasn't an option at the time... )

so yeah.. thumbs up.. .it's heavy as hell.  I got mine off of ebay used for 50 bucks plus 50 bucks shipping...

rampy

[paigeoliver]

I bought mine from a local warehouse for $75 each. I should have bought more of them.

[Karman]

This is starting to sound too good to be true!  Is this monitor multisync like a standard PC monitor?  If I run Pac-Man, Galaga, or one of the other vertical games on it while mounted horizontally, will it look as good as it does on my regular PC without the need for ArcadeVGA, Adv Mame, etc.?  

The reason I ask, is that I'm already running an open frame VGA (640x480) but its a fixed freq. monitor at 31.5.  I set up Adv Mame (ugh!) but the vertical games still have lines missing.

[paigeoliver]

These are essentially PC monitors. PC monitor tube, PC monitor boardset, only the frame is different than a stock PC monitor.

[Karman]

These are essentially PC monitors. PC monitor tube, PC monitor boardset, only the frame is different than a stock PC monitor.

So you can throw a 15khz vertical game at them with no problems and it fills the screen?

These are starting to sound like an economical (and smaller) substitute for the WG 9200.

[Knievel]

There's one up on Ebay right now, you can see what the back looks like...

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=187&item=4124702157&rd=1&ssPageName=WDVW

[Superdude]

Thanks for the tip! I just bought one myself!

[Arcadiac]

Thanks for the tip! I just bought one myself!

Me too!  Thanks as usual for the tip, I can now reclaim my IBM monitor for my regular PC!  ARCADIAC!

[Santoro]

These are essentially PC monitors. PC monitor tube, PC monitor boardset, only the frame is different than a stock PC monitor.

So you can throw a 15khz vertical game at them with no problems and it fills the screen?

These are starting to sound like an economical (and smaller) substitute for the WG 9200.

No!

These are PC monitors, not Arcade montitors, and don't do 15khz.  There are some peope that prefer a PC monitor for various reasons and these are better than your average PC monitor. {edit: for MAME anyway}

[Lilwolf]

I wish there was someone selling them local... I would drive and pick up two... but for my PC systems.

I'm a little worried about getting a few bad ones...  Are they being sold asis?

[Karman]

My knowledge on scan rates, etc. has reached its limit so I can use some advice before I order one of these.  

When I run a classic game on my pc, the monitor "clicks" and seems to change the scan and/or refresh rate.   The games (even verticals like Galaga) look great.  They don't have the perfect arcade look with scan lines, etc. but they look perfect in the way of not missing any lines, filling up the screen, etc.  What exactly is the monitor doing to change the scan and/or refresh rate and what is coming into play in the way of hardware stretching?  I was under the impression that the monitor (being "multisync") was bumping down to emulate 15khz somehow.  I know it doesn't actually run at 15khz like the WG 9200 does, but what is the monitor doing when it "clicks"?

And a question for anyone that owns one of these 21" KDS monitors - how do vertical games look on it?

[rampy]

ms pacman (granted not perfect photography, but... should be enough to answer your question re:vertical games, no?)

I've got dig dug screenie somewhere (but not in my gallery...) i'll dig it up... (no pun intended) and post it.

mr do old crappy bezel no tint slightly fuzzy (250k jpgs -- was just dumped there never bothered to resize... )

 note that technically the software scanlines are going the "wrong way"

another large do shot


another large do shot


sfII for comparison

rampy

[Karman]

Thanks Jerry and rampy - I'm going to give it a go.  

[Iori]

Anyone who has one of these mind measuring how much space is between the bottom of the case and the screen on this monitor?  I think that it is just a little bit too big for my mini cab...    But hoping that I could squeeze it in there if there is enough room at the bottom there....     Thanks...  

[paigeoliver]

These things are monsters. I am not at home to measure mine right now, but the real size issue with these is depth.

[jerryjanis]

Anyone who has one of these mind measuring how much space is between the bottom of the case and the screen on this monitor?  I think that it is just a little bit too big for my mini cab...    But hoping that I could squeeze it in there if there is enough room at the bottom there....     Thanks...  

Here are some quick measurements:

From bottom of case to bottom of screen: ~2.5 inches
From top of case to top of screen: ~1.5 inches
From side of case to side of screen: ~1.5 inches

[Iori]

Anyone who has one of these mind measuring how much space is between the bottom of the case and the screen on this monitor?  I think that it is just a little bit too big for my mini cab...    But hoping that I could squeeze it in there if there is enough room at the bottom there....     Thanks...  

Here are some quick measurements:

From bottom of case to bottom of screen: ~2.5 inches
From top of case to top of screen: ~1.5 inches
From side of case to side of screen: ~1.5 inches

Cool...  That just may be perfect!  Hate to be a bother again, but if you don't mind measuring distance from the front on the top to where the slanted edge on the back side starts that would be awesome too...  Thanks again!  

[GamingGreg]

My knowledge on scan rates, etc. has reached its limit so I can use some advice before I order one of these.  

When I run a classic game on my pc, the monitor "clicks" and seems to change the scan and/or refresh rate.   The games (even verticals like Galaga) look great.  They don't have the perfect arcade look with scan lines, etc. but they look perfect in the way of not missing any lines, filling up the screen, etc.  What exactly is the monitor doing to change the scan and/or refresh rate and what is coming into play in the way of hardware stretching?  I was under the impression that the monitor (being "multisync") was bumping down to emulate 15khz somehow.  I know it doesn't actually run at 15khz like the WG 9200 does, but what is the monitor doing when it "clicks"?

And a question for anyone that owns one of these 21" KDS monitors - how do vertical games look on it?

The clicking is just changing the video mode to a different resolution. (I'm assuming your running MAME fullscreen).  It's not changing the refresh rate, just the resolution.  If your not telling it what resolution to run, it picks something close to the original game (and possibly hardware streches it).  At least that's my understanding.

[jerryjanis]

Cool...  That just may be perfect!  Hate to be a bother again, but if you don't mind measuring distance from the front on the top to where the slanted edge on the back side starts that would be awesome too...  Thanks again!

That's about 3 1/4 inch.

[paigeoliver]

Whee, the place I used to buy them from has another couple pallets of them. I am going to go buy three more!

[Lilwolf]

paige... where do you live?  I'm hoping to find some in the ohio area... One of my PC monitors is about to die... and I would LOVE to get too... but I don't like shipping monitors... especially from someone I don't know enought to trust the (I tested it perfect before I sent it).

[paigeoliver]

I am in St. Louis, and my source is actually higher ($75 + tax) than the online source, but, no shipping costs to deal with.

What is your PC monitor doing? Many faling PC monitors can get good as new again by simply opening them up and adjusting the assorted POTS inside (which provide a MUCH wider range of adjustment than the onscreen controls).

[Iori]

Cool...  That just may be perfect!  Hate to be a bother again, but if you don't mind measuring distance from the front on the top to where the slanted edge on the back side starts that would be awesome too...  Thanks again!

That's about 3 1/4 inch.

Are you sure that is right?  On the site describing the monitor they say that it is about 20" deep...  I would think it would be more around 10" or so for this...

[jerryjanis]

The photo from www.computersurplusoutlet.com looks a little different than my monitor, actually.





Mine is a KDS PixelTouch 21 inch monitor, so I don't know why the pictures are different.  It might be worth emailing computersurplusoutlet.com and finding out what the actual dimensions are.  Maybe the picture is wrong, or maybe the case is different than mine.

[Santoro]

Looks like they raised the price to $59.

[Iori]

The photo from www.computersurplusoutlet.com looks a little different than my monitor, actually.





Mine is a KDS PixelTouch 21 inch monitor, so I don't know why the pictures are different.  It might be worth emailing computersurplusoutlet.com and finding out what the actual dimensions are.  Maybe the picture is wrong, or maybe the case is different than mine.

Sounds like a good idea... thanks!  Very close to being the right size for my machine.    Thanks again for the help!

[Lilwolf]

It will only turn on if I set it up to 640x480 @120hz.  Other wise it tries to start... and then turns itself back off.

Once I change resolution, and turn it on... I can set any setting I want.  So I can only use it as a second monitor (which is ok for now).  

but it USED to work at 1024x768@85, and then 800x600... so its getting harder and harder to get it to click on...

I am in St. Louis, and my source is actually higher ($75 + tax) than the online source, but, no shipping costs to deal with.

What is your PC monitor doing? Many faling PC monitors can get good as new again by simply opening them up and adjusting the assorted POTS inside (which provide a MUCH wider range of adjustment than the onscreen controls).

[Karman]

Looks like they raised the price to $59.

They also raised the shipping cost by a couple of dollars.

[MonitorGuru]

For those of you not around about 2 years ago, here are the threads that talk about these 21" Hitachi tube/KDS PixelTouch monitors. Good and bad info galore.

Summary:
- Heavy, bulky, big, expensive to ship
- Can remove metal shield for smaller size
- Hidden on screen control buttons behind metal shield
- Some arrived with nicks in the glass/anti-glare coating
- Some arrived with light burn-in from KIOSK use
- A few arrived DOA or died soon


Original Thread:
http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=2;action=display;threadid=1820

Other threads:
http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=2;action=display;threadid=1958

http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=2;action=display;threadid=6566

http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=2;action=display;threadid=6372

[Lilwolf]

lol!

considering buying one... started the thread the first time  

forgot..

remembered seeing them before..

[Karman]

Has anyone that ordered one of these from computer surplus outlet received notice that it shipped?  

By the way - they have a "sale" going on right now with $2.99 shipping.  Only problem is, they raised the price of the monitor to $109  

[pathdoc2]

I ordered one over a week ago and it has not been shipped.  I don't know what's up.

[pathdoc2]

Mine finally shipped and should be here on 5/7.

[Arcadiac]

Ordered mine on 4-22, didn't ship until 5-4, arriving (estimated) by 5-10.  
BTW CSO email support is non-existent, I wrote asking if, since they can't seem to get the monitors shipped in a timely fashion and that now they are running the $2.99 shipping "special" could they please adjust my shipping to reflect the current sale, no reply at all, imagine that.
I'd like to hear from others regarding their experience with this vendor and the monitor they received.  I'll post as soon as mine arrives and I can check it out.  All the older posts about this have me a bit leery now.
And since passing on a deal is an implied endorsement I think we need to watch out for each other on this one.  Thanks all, ARCADIAC!

"Is it paranoia if everyone really is out to get you?"

[ithrowbags]

I am in St. Louis, and my source is actually higher ($75 + tax) than the online source, but, no shipping costs to deal with.

What is your PC monitor doing? Many faling PC monitors can get good as new again by simply opening them up and adjusting the assorted POTS inside (which provide a MUCH wider range of adjustment than the onscreen controls).

I'm in the St. Louis area.  Where do you find these at?

[Superdude]

Still have recieved mine.  I did recieve a notice that it was sent out.

[Chris]

I'm in the St. Louis area.  Where do you find these at?

I'm guessing he's talking about http://www.bizsyscon.com/ .   They were very friendly and helpful when I bought my WG D9100 from them (the PixelTouch wouldn't fit in my cab).

--Chris

[Lilwolf]

Did their version have the touch screen portion working?

If so, I might look into having some sent to me.  

[Chris]

Did their version have the touch screen portion working?

No.

[Arcadiac]

As always if it sounds too good to be true it probably is.  Monitor arrived, set it up, plugged it in, great picture IF you can live with what looks like a line of magnetic intereference 8" tall by 2" wide along the right side.  And before anyone asks no there are no speakers etc. next to the monitor that would cause a bad pic.  So now its off to try to deal with getting a replacement, either that or I just gained a 90 pound doorstop.  This really pisses me off that these were recommended and evidently CSO doesn't even bother to check them out before shipping.
I should have known better.  Damn!!

[Spaced Invader]

Arcadiac, does the monitor have a degauss button? It looks like that's your problem. If it doesn't degauss itself you may need one of these...

http://www.datadev.com/dc13.html

Note: a lot of monitors degauss at startup...might try turning it on and off a few times...

[Arcadiac]

It appears that I have over-reacted.  After locating the hidden buttons degaussing and adjusting the picture, all is well.  
Sometimes the simplest solutions are the hardest to remember.  You all saved ---my bottom--- again!!  Thanks all! ARCADIAC

[Superdude]

Mine looks real good except it looks really used.  No burn in though...  Looks like a good deal so far.

[Nannuu]

Alright, I'm an idiot.  I got mine, hooked it up but I get nothing.  The monitor powering up sound is there but no picture.  I've pushed every button at least 327 times.  And it did come with a nasty gash in the box (yay, go Fedex) but the monitor seems to be in nice condition.  Not broken glass or anything jiggling around in the case.  There is a power button and 4 other buttons right?

[Nannuu]

Did I say I'm an idiot?  Yep, yes I did.  Well it works now.  Have no idea what I did.  I plugged and unplugged everything a couple more times and now it pops on no problem.  Excellent!

[jerryjanis]

Did I say I'm an idiot?  Yep, yes I did.  Well it works now.  Have no idea what I did.  I plugged and unplugged everything a couple more times and now it pops on no problem.  Excellent!

This is great!  It's scary to recommend something and watch the negative responses start rolling in.  So far, it looks like everyone has had decent luck.  The tear in your cardboard box looks pretty scary, though.

[Iori]

Damn!  Saw all the negative feedback and was ready to give up on it for me that is... now that people are getting them going and liking them so much...    I want to get one again!    But that is how it goes eh?  Glad to hear that they are working well for you guys.

[Karman]

Mine is supposed to be delivered today.  A question for those that received theirs already - did they come with the power and VGA cables?

By the way - Computer Surplus Outlet is offering the $2.99 shipping deal on entire PALLETS of these monitors.    I wonder how many can fit on a pallet.  Not many, I suppose.

[Lilwolf]

Crud... I thought the 2.99 special was for individuals (50 + 50 shipping changed to 109 + 3 to get rid of local walkins).

Oh well.. wanted to get 2... but I let my wife talk me out of it... Now the price doubles... sigh...

[Witchboard]

Do you get the discount shipping after you make the online purchase?  I don't see anywhere where it talks about it, but I could be blind.

Edit:  Ah, there it is.  I went ahead and ordered one.  With all the praises and the smaller cabinet I'm building this will be cheaper than the alternative I was looking at.  I'll let you know how mine is when it shows up.

[Arcadiac]

$109 + $3 = $112, for me this still would have been a few bux cheaper, my total was $120 .  The only gripe I have now is the e-mail support is terrible and there is no support phone number to get your questions answered.  Good thing we have each other, eh?  BTW, the vga and power cables do come with the monitor.  Be sure to do all of your video adjustments before installing this beast, you definitely will not be pulling this thing in and out of your cab often and all of the adjustment buttons are on the side.  Now on to figure out how to mount this monster in my cab!  I'm a fairly large guy but I almost dropped the damn thing trying to put it in my cab to check dimensions and angle.  Gonna have to get some help with it for sure.  As always Thanks! ARCADIAC!

[rampy]

regarding mounting:  

I guess you could either go the "shelf" route or the *danger exposed innards warning* remove the outer metal casing and bolt it on rails like an arcade monitor.

Granted my project was a conversion of an existing cabinet so I could sorta follow the mounting of the previous (missing) monitor.  If you make your way to my photo gallery (or go through the diary of a madman) on my ubercade site you can see how I mounted mine (it's actually kind of comical "custom" job, but it's wedged in there pretty good and survived one move without issue.

*shrug*  good luck to everyone on their projects.

Rampy

[Karman]

I just received mine.  Works perfect and looks great.  I may pick one of these up for my home computer if the wife doesn't think the case is too ugly.  This thing is built like a tank.

[Lilwolf]

Where is it?  I didn't see it!  I'm thinking of getting 2 and need to confirm the shipping before getting 'wife oks'

Do you get the discount shipping after you make the online purchase?  I don't see anywhere where it talks about it, but I could be blind.

Edit:  Ah, there it is.  I went ahead and ordered one.  With all the praises and the smaller cabinet I'm building this will be cheaper than the alternative I was looking at.  I'll let you know how mine is when it shows up.

[Witchboard]

Where is it?  I didn't see it!  I'm thinking of getting 2 and need to confirm the shipping before getting 'wife oks'

Do you get the discount shipping after you make the online purchase?  I don't see anywhere where it talks about it, but I could be blind.

Edit:  Ah, there it is.  I went ahead and ordered one.  With all the praises and the smaller cabinet I'm building this will be cheaper than the alternative I was looking at.  I'll let you know how mine is when it shows up.

I had to make the purchase and the shipping cost changed when I finalized.  I didn't see it listed anywhere on the description.  In fact the description states it's around $70 or so to ship.  I don't even know how these guys knew it was $2.99 shipping.

Edit:  Wow, that's kind of scary.  I've read where you guys have waited almost a week for them to even ship it.  I've already got my shipping verification and I just ordered it today.

[Arcadiac]

Witchboard an Lil Wolf, the CSO main page claims $2.99 ground shipping on all orders.  I ordered mine about 2 weeks ago when they were $49.99 plus $70.00 fedex ground shipping, no $2.99 "special".  For $120.00 they were a good value, however I can't say I would pay any more than that for these monitors.  I can see problems down the road with making adjustments because of the controls being on the side and the monitor being so heavy.  But I, like many others here, like a good deal and I bought one knowing that there could be problems, expensive return shipping included.
A warranty that doesn't include return shipping costs for me is worthless.  And I was unaware however of the non-existant tech support.  I still have heard nothing from the 2 emails I sent, one this week and one last week.  That's just bad business and I won't recommend dealing with CSO for that reason alone.  In future I will not buy another of these unless some appear in my area, where I could just go pick one up.  
It will be interesting to find out what happens is one of us has to return one of these, I know we have to pay our own return shipping and I for one would be wary of doing that as I don't believe CSO would refund that bit.
I can only share my experience, mixed as it is and you make your own decisions about whether to buy or not.
Just for reference, the last 21" monitor I bought online was a refurb IBM branded Trinitron from newegg.com for $309 plus $2.99 ground shipping and 3-yr warranty for additional $29 for a total of about $341.  Not bad for an $1100 monitor, but considerably more than the KDS at CSO.  Best of luck with whatever you decide to do for your projects!  I hope some of this drivel helped.  Thanks all, ARCADIAC

[Witchboard]

Witchboard an Lil Wolf, the CSO main page claims $2.99 ground shipping on all orders.  I ordered mine about 2 weeks ago when they were $49.99 plus $70.00 fedex ground shipping, no $2.99 "special".  For $120.00 they were a good value, however I can't say I would pay any more than that for these monitors.  I can see problems down the road with making adjustments because of the controls being on the side and the monitor being so heavy.  But I, like many others here, like a good deal and I bought one knowing that there could be problems, expensive return shipping included.
A warranty that doesn't include return shipping costs for me is worthless.  And I was unaware however of the non-existant tech support.  I still have heard nothing from the 2 emails I sent, one this week and one last week.  That's just bad business and I won't recommend dealing with CSO for that reason alone.  In future I will not buy another of these unless some appear in my area, where I could just go pick one up.  
It will be interesting to find out what happens is one of us has to return one of these, I know we have to pay our own return shipping and I for one would be wary of doing that as I don't believe CSO would refund that bit.
I can only share my experience, mixed as it is and you make your own decisions about whether to buy or not.
Just for reference, the last 21" monitor I bought online was a refurb IBM branded Trinitron from newegg.com for $309 plus $2.99 ground shipping and 3-yr warranty for additional $29 for a total of about $341.  Not bad for an $1100 monitor, but considerably more than the KDS at CSO.  Best of luck with whatever you decide to do for your projects!  I hope some of this drivel helped.  Thanks all, ARCADIAC

What kind of problems are you experiencing with your monitor?  Have you tried the KDS website to see if they have a FAQ or support page?

[Arcadiac]

The problem was almost 2 weeks to ship, no way to effectively track the monitor shipment until then, almost 3 weeks to arrive and no reply to my support e-mails.  Bad business, not responding to your customers, especially when I had a problem with the display and was considering returning the thing.  Everything has worked out so far, the monitor problem was fixed with advice from this board.  I guess I am spoiled by the way most other vendors treat their customers.  Oh, well.
ARCADIAC!

[Witchboard]

Ah, so it was more of a customer service problem than a product issue.  Yeah, dealing with Bob Roberts and Andy Warne really spoils you.  They are quick to reply with great customer service.  I'm hoping everything works out also.  Hopefully since I know the controls are on the side I won't have any need to attempt to contact them.  I guess I lucked out.  I got the fedex confirmation the evening after I ordered and it's scheduled to hit my door step this Friday.  If it shows up on time that will be like 4 days including Tuesday when i ordered it to the time I sign for it.

[hunky_artist]

does anyone know of anywhere in the UK that would do these (or even just something similar?)

also, how well do these monintors play vector games? are they essentially just PC monitors?

thanks

[Lilwolf]

The ARE just PC monitors.  So don't expect it to be great for emulation.  I'm not interested for that reason.  They are just cheap 21" monitors.

You will get MUCH better output with a true arcade monitor and an ArcadeVGA video card.

BUT for vector games.  Higher the resolution the better they look.  Because the original was at near infanite resolution (not detail, but resolution) based on the technology it uses.  

[Witchboard]

Okay.. got my monitor in the mail today.  Box was beat up pretty bad, but the unit looks  to have no burn in and like it's in real good condition... physically.  I won't know how the picture looks until Monday since I didn't receive any cables with mine.  No big deal, I can get cables from work.. but I was wanting to play with it this weekend.  

Okay... comparison time.  What model did you guys get?  Mine has a model number of KVS-21.

I have the option of using a VGA cable or looks like RGB.  Which should I use?  Is one better than the other?

[Xiaou2]

 Supposedly the  R g b H V   cable is supposed to be a cleaner signal.  Maybe due to the thicker cables.

 But I honestly see no differences with the test ive done.

[Arcadiac]

regarding mounting:  

I guess you could either go the "shelf" route or the *danger exposed innards warning* remove the outer metal casing and bolt it on rails like an arcade monitor.

Granted my project was a conversion of an existing cabinet so I could sorta follow the mounting of the previous (missing) monitor.  If you make your way to my photo gallery (or go through the diary of a madman) on my ubercade site you can see how I mounted mine (it's actually kind of comical "custom" job, but it's wedged in there pretty good and survived one move without issue.

*shrug*  good luck to everyone on their projects.

Rampy

Thanks Rampy with minor adjustments your idea worked for me, see this thread:
http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=10;action=display;threadid=17788
Got another battle scar fron the front of the monitor frame pinching the tip of my finger, all part of the process! I appreciate your input and help. How did you end up dealing with the thing sticking out of the back?  I could cut my backboard down a bit but that won't solve the monitor poking out and would spoil the look of the original cab.  I really don't want it bumping the wall as the monitor could get damaged.  Thanks again all for your help! ARCADIAC!  

[Witchboard]

Well, looks like I may have gotten a bad apple.  I haven't plugged it into a computer yet, but when I put power to it and turn it on... it makes a funny noise and I can hear the monitor trying to turn.  It's almost sounds like a bad hard-drive trying to start up.  I'll give it 'til Monday and get a cable and see what happens.  I've turned it off for now in case it was a component frying inside.  May have to crack it open and see if it's fixable, but who knows.

[Kremmit]

Is the shipping special still on?  I can't find mention of it anywhere.

I see they've got pallets of 8 for $89 each and lots of 4 for $99 each.

[rampy]

Thanks Rampy with minor adjustments your idea worked for me, see this thread:
http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=10;action=display;threadid=17788
Got another battle scar fron the front of the monitor frame pinching the tip of my finger, all part of the process! I appreciate your input and help. How did you end up dealing with the thing sticking out of the back?  I could cut my backboard down a bit but that won't solve the monitor poking out and would spoil the look of the original cab.  I really don't want it bumping the wall as the monitor could get damaged.  Thanks again all for your help! ARCADIAC!  

LOL I've got a scar on my right thumb from when one of the kds's corners "bit" me =)

Well, realize that my original monitor is mounted a much flatte angle than yours... i.e. you look more downard at mine, where as your's is at a 90 degree angle... so it works out that I only have one corner peeking out that won't clear the door.  I drilled a hole in the back door and then used a jigsaw to cut out a squareish hole in the back of the coor for the corner to stick out...

It was my plan to then cover the hole with some sort of a "wire" guard... like the kind you sometimes see on case fans...    or create some sort of box enclosure/bumpout thingie ... but that part faces the wall so it doesn't get noticed or bother me (and it's not THAT exposed on mine... )  i'll take a picture at some point and attach it, but i reckon that you'll have much more monitor to protude from the back of your cabinet to deal with...

good luck!

rampy

[cica]

I just got mine this morning.  Powered it up, and it looks great.  The picture is as good as my current 19" PC monitor but it's about 2" wider and 1 1/2" taller.  No burn in, no scratches.

-Tom

[Lilwolf]

I started the first post on these guys a year ago...

And I JUST ordered 2.  Hopefully I get as good results as everyone else here.  

It will be nice to have in my dual monitor development system at home to have two of the same monitors

[AlanS17]

How well would one of these work for a cocktail cabinet? Would it fit (at least decently) well into a standard 19" machine? Also, did the price go up or something? It says $109 on the website. Perhaps thee things got popular cuz of this site.

By the way, I'm not finding this deal on shipping that everybody is talking about. It's only quoting me full-priced shipping (and even mentions it in the item description).

[AlanS17]

Regarding mounting, I noticed these things don't come with any rails. There are still a couple of alternatives, though. First, make some rails out of angle iron. Second, build a shelf. I don't know about these monitors, but my ELO has holes across the bottom to lock it into place on a shelf as well as railings on the sides to lock it into place.

Second, it's a lot easier to mount the monitor onto a board and then mount the board into the machine. This gives you something to hold onto and you can screw the board down directly instead of trying to hold a monitoe in mid air and line it up. You just need to make sure the board fills up the full interior space where the monitor will go so it will catch the side railings of the machine. Maybe this is what everybody does anyways, but just in case... it's a good diea.

[cica]

How well would one of these work for a cocktail cabinet? Would it fit (at least decently) well into a standard 19" machine? Also, did the price go up or something? It says $109 on the website. Perhaps thee things got popular cuz of this site.

By the way, I'm not finding this deal on shipping that everybody is talking about. It's only quoting me full-priced shipping (and even mentions it in the item description).

This thing's a monster.  I don't think you could fit it in a standard-sized cocktail cabinet.  You wouldn't have enough ventilation around it.

As for the price, it was $50 + $70 shipping, then it went to $59 + $70 shipping.  Now it's $109 + $2.99 shipping.  You won't see the reduction in shipping costs until the final screen before placing the order.  If you go to their homepage though, it says the $2.99 shipping is applied to this monitor.  

-Tom

[oldskoolcade]

what truly sucks is the fact that the 2.99 only applies to shipping within the U.S..

I put it in a cart to see how much shipping would be to Ontario, and it was something like $315....

Cripes...it's only about an hour and a half away from Buffaloto my place...not like it'd take that much more to get to me  :-)

oh well...looks like it's back to the 25" TV idea...

[Witchboard]

Well, I plugged my monitor in today to show my neighbor what was going on with it (He

[Arcadiac]

How well would one of these work for a cocktail cabinet? Would it fit (at least decently) well into a standard 19" machine? Also, did the price go up or something? It says $109 on the website. Perhaps thee things got popular cuz of this site.

By the way, I'm not finding this deal on shipping that everybody is talking about. It's only quoting me full-priced shipping (and even mentions it in the item description).

If you remove the metal case it MIGHT fit, measure carefully.  Mine fit into my upright cab, in the same wooden frame used for the 19" monitor AFTER I removed the metal case and cut 1" from the top horizontal area of the wooden frame.  I simply used the metal front frame of the monitor to attach it to the frame.  Be aware that the tube length will add some to the depth of the monitor area, mine sticks out of the cabinet about 1/2".
See this for mounting pic: http://www.arcadecontrols.org/yabbse/index.php?board=10;action=display;threadid=17788

Witchboard I don't have any suggestions other than try to find a repair shop in your area that will treat you right, I still have gotten NO response to the e-mail I sent when I thought I had a lemon.  Again for that reason alone I would not recommend buying from these folks to anyone else.  Its too big of a gamble because of the support/return shipping issues IMO.  Best of luck all and thanks again for your help.  ARCADIAC!

[Witchboard]

Well, it's been 4 days since I requested an RMA from CSO.  No word yet.  I guess I'll be going to local route and hopefully I'll be able to get it fixed for less than the price of another one.  I'm glad I'm the only one that had problems.  I guess it's hit and miss with these sort of things.

[Lilwolf]

ohh  bad sign.... the first bad review here.

btw, I got an email back from sales a day later when I asked about shipping.

So you might try emailing to sales..

[Arcadiac]

ohh  bad sign.... the first bad review here.

btw, I got an email back from sales a day later when I asked about shipping.

So you might try emailing to sales..

Read back thru the thread, I still haven't received a response from sales (sent on Mar. 3) or request for a RMA (sent Mar. 10).  Fortunately my monitor worked out, but as I stated in previous posts, lack of support and return shipping costs will keep me from buying from CSO in the future. I think that constitutes a bad review.  
Lilwolf I'm glad that your experience has been better than mine, maybe CSO will get their stuff together.  Still hoping that those who have current experiences with CSO will also keep us posted, as you guys have.  Lets hear from more of you who have actually placed an order so in future other cab builders will have this base of knowledge to draw from.  After all isn't that what we are really here for, to help each other out by sharing our experiences with building a cab, thru all phases including dealing with parts vendors?  Keep up the good work all!
ARCADIAC!

[Chris]

I had gotten great sales service from http://www.bizsyscon.com, but I don't know if they do any tech support for anything they sell.  They still have a number of these monitors available...

--Chris

[Lilwolf]

btw, the good reviews where on the monitors... Not the company.

I haven't received mine (tomorrow I'm hoping) so hopefully they will work well.

I would still be happy if I bought 3 for 100 bucks shipped... if only 2 worked.  Crossing fingers...

ohh  bad sign.... the first bad review here.

btw, I got an email back from sales a day later when I asked about shipping.

So you might try emailing to sales..

Read back thru the thread, I still haven't received a response from sales (sent on Mar. 3) or request for a RMA (sent Mar. 10).  Fortunately my monitor worked out, but as I stated in previous posts, lack of support and return shipping costs will keep me from buying from CSO in the future. I think that constitutes a bad review.  
Lilwolf I'm glad that your experience has been better than mine, maybe CSO will get their stuff together.  Still hoping that those who have current experiences with CSO will also keep us posted, as you guys have.  Lets hear from more of you who have actually placed an order so in future other cab builders will have this base of knowledge to draw from.  After all isn't that what we are really here for, to help each other out by sharing our experiences with building a cab, thru all phases including dealing with parts vendors?  Keep up the good work all!
ARCADIAC!

[Lilwolf]

Well, I just got two of them beauties..

WHERE IS THE HIDDEN BUTTONS??

The look great!  Huge!  easy!  Came with cables!  

Only trouble with them....

They are !@#!@$%! HEAVY and my computers are on the 3rd floor.... after getting the second upstairs I was sweating like a pig.

[Witchboard]

Don't rub it in.    j/k

The hidden buttons are on the left side of the monitor when your looking from the front.  The screws are a dead give-away that hold them to the metal housing.

[vputz]

How are these stacking up as PC workstation monitors?  Good enough quality for that, or pretty much best used as Mame monitors?

-->VPutz

[Witchboard]

Okay... I'm about to be damned impressed.  I just got a shipment notification from UPS for a package that weighs 90lbs from CPO.  It's not in the system yet, but it's an automatic generated email.  This looks like to me that CPO has sent me another monitor WITHOUT having to ship the first one back.  I'll see if there is instructions to ship the first one back and I'll keep an eye on my credit card to see if I'm charged for two.  If this shows up and they don't require a return, I'll be exremely happy.  Odd thing is, there has been absolutely no email dialog between us besides me requesting a RMA and explaining the symptoms of the monitor.

[Xiaou2]

  Woohooooo!   Im typing this on my new 21" monitor  ^_^


  I have to say - that i was definitely worried.  Its a big gamble with monitors due to the fact that shipping can damage the internal shadow mask's.  

  A work of WARNING  -  Thier included monitor cord is GARBAGE.
When I first fired her up... i noticed that I was getting a 'ghosting' effect...  I first thought it was a convergence issue... or worst case - a bad shadow mask...  

 Luckily... After searching for a monitor testing program or snapshot... I found this site:

 http://www.monitorsdirect.com/toolkit/

 Click on the bottom to run the tests.

 One note it mentioned was about power levels...  which led me to the discovery.   It looks like the SVGA cord they provide is about half as thick as most of todays cords.  I swapped it with another cord I had - and BOOM!  AWESOME PICTURE - No Ghosts!  ^_^

 I was trying to use the 5 BNC connectors in the rear... but they arnt labled on mine as far as I can see.  This probably would result in an even better picture.   Can anyone identify thier order?

 My pc picked the driver automatically as a
 
 " Visual Sensations - vs21e "
 
 It lets me go up to 1920*1440 !!!!!!  Which is uselessly small - but sickly cool that it can do it!

 You can find info about vs21e on KDS's site.  Pixeltouch had no data on it that I could find.  I believe that this kds monitor was just outfitted in a pixeltouch shell for mounting purposes.  It has no touch screen capabilities as far as its listed.

  The picture is damn near perfect.  Theres no burn.  Colors are brilliantly saturated, and great contrast / brightess.  
 
 Theres a Ton of adjustments... more so than ive seen on many newwer monitors.   I was able to make an almost perfect straight line on both sides of the screen - which is usually only possible with the new flatscreen tubes.

 The thing is a BEAST...  Its monster huge - and Heavy!  (pictures ive seen do not do its size justice!  you have to see to understand) Youll prolly need to add thicker or additional piece of wood to your desk to hold it without fear of sevear desk warpage.

  Ive just ran a few games with mame - and all look good.  Scanlines do help.  This isnt the best arcade-ish display... as its just a pc monitor... so its gona look blocky as usual.   However - it makes a great pc monitor and or cheap alternative display.

  The packing was nice.  They shippied it in a huge box that had plenty of room all arround the sides for adequate foam surround. They used the 'expando- styro' type foam, that molds to the monitor shape.

 Shipping time was good.  I think was about a week.

 Ive got to put a nice black bezel arround the front tho - as the silver front is an eyesoar !  heh

   Ohh - and finally... the description about where the hidden control are was a bit confusing for me.   They are located on the left side of the metal case, next to the green power LED.  Theres 5 buttons right behind the metal holes in that area.

 I was also worried about the open frame design causing some huge static charge near the edges... but the thing seems to be grounded very well.

 At 100$ this monitor turned out to be a steal.  Hope all are as fortunate.

 Sincerely,
 Steve


 edit:  I dont know how i missed this last night... but there is very faint burn in on the thing.  I think i thought it was just dirty.  However... its very light and hard to see so alls good.  Just wanted to warn.

[Witchboard]

Just thought I would let everyone know that I got my second monitor in today.  I'm glad to say that this one works.  I wasn't told to ship the old one back so that means I'm not out of shipping costs.  I'm glad it all turned out and glad that CSO shipped me another one.

[AlanS17]

Witchboard, what exactly is wrong with the one you have? Wanna sell it for cheap?  

[Witchboard]

My neighbor said it was the transformer.  He works on TVs, so I'm thinking about letting him take a look at it.  I was waiting to make sure they didn't want me to send it back before I broke the stickers on the case.  Besides.. this thing is a beast... The shipping probably wouldn't make it cheap.  

[AlanS17]

Exactly how much shipping are we talking about???

[Witchboard]

The shipping weight was 90lbs and the size was 26"x27"x27".  I don't know how much it cost, but if CSO is still running thier special, it would probably be cheaper to buy one from them with the $2.99 shipping.

[jmh139]

I have two of these non working that I would be happy to have someone pick up for free.  I am located in West Monroe, Louisiana.  

I bought one from GroupMidwest.com.  It came in bad, and the next one came in bad.  Third time worked great.  I think I paid about $150 shipped., and would highly recommend Bill at GroupMidwest.com, he really helped out with the bad monitors.  Price seems to be cheaper from the other place though.  

The bad monitors both do the exact same thing.  Grey screen with lines in it.  You can bring up the on screen display and see it, but get nothing from the computer.  I tried the BNC plugs and the regular VGA plug.  

If anyone wants to swing by and pick these up, let me know.  I will NOT ship, sorry.  I will throw them out in the next few weeks.

Jay

[jmh139]

Forgot my email address.  maps@leagh.com

Jay

[GCS]

Just to bump this as I just finished my sister's cab for X-mas last night using this monitor and it turned out AWESOME!

This monitor is really the easy way to go -- had some minor issues getting it mounted right in the cabinet but once done it looked good and I am very pleased.

Thanks to the original poster for this deal.

Now if they only had these in 25" size I would replace the TV that's in my cabinet with one of these ASAP!!

Happy Holidays folks!

Greg

[Chris]

I wonder if there's a big enough difference going from 19" to 21" to make it worthwhile...

[Gunstar Hero]

If they still have them, those KDS 21 monitors rock. MUCH bigger than a PC monitor.

A 19 inch PC monitor is really only like 17.5 inches viewable.

[Chris]

If they still have them, those KDS 21 monitors rock. MUCH bigger than a PC monitor.

A 19 inch PC monitor is really only like 17.5 inches viewable.

I have a Wells-Gardner D9100.  It's listed as a 19", but since it's a PC monitor on an arcade frame, it's about 18" viewable.  But it goes almost all the way to the back door; a 21" would probably hang out the back...

[Gunstar Hero]

Yeah, the KDS monitors come in a steel shell and are big... but I understand you can remove it no problem.

Mine JUST barely fit.