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Author Topic: A new lightgun?  (Read 5405 times)

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Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #80 on: June 27, 2018, 06:08:58 am »
I have the top gun 2, its sat in the loft.
10mm is alot of drift for a light gun game, But my experiences with it was getting closer to 25mm of accuracy loss which is why it ended up in the loft!

I liked the design of the gun looking like a beretta but that was about all the praise I have for it tbh.

My aim traks are far superior to it and never need re calibrating as long as you are roughly in the same location which is easy for me as theirs a wall I have my back to LOL.

thet0ast3r

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #81 on: June 27, 2018, 06:44:18 am »
@Tichgamer: im gonna shoot a video sometime, demonstrating the accuracy of the lcd topgun. (as accurate as i can calibrate it)

Why i don`t like the aimtraks:

I have 4 wiimotes, loved to play wii games. I hooked them all up to my pc reading the sensor data. Turns out that newer/fake wiimotes have a sensor that can only track 2 instead of 4 points. -> cheaper hardware. The cheaper, new sensor is the one used in aimtracks. I don`t like the narrow viewing angle of these sensors (sometimes i wanna be very close to the screen, like 20cm away on a 20" monitor) , and i don`t like how they get horribly inaccurate if you move from side to side, when you hold them sideways it`s a whole other story...(not a lot of people do that, tho).
Simply put: I don`t really wanna support ultimarc by giving them 50 dollars for the module alone that costs at most 5$ in production... i can get a fake wiimote with the same sensor & bluetooth capability for 10 $ including shipping.
thet0ast3r

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #82 on: June 27, 2018, 07:28:52 am »
My AT's stay accurate if I move a few feet either side no problem at all, Cant say I have ever tried shooting them sideways though so cant comment on that LOL

As for playing 20cm from the screen, why they hell would you do that? You will get square eyes  :lol

Mike A

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #83 on: June 27, 2018, 07:54:52 am »
20 cm away? Stop playing light gun games. You are doing it wrong.

Malenko

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #84 on: June 27, 2018, 08:19:36 am »
I refuse to kickstart anything, Ive had zero return on investment on anything I've backed. Once you have an actual finished product up for sale I'll probably snag one. Shooting Gallery is phenomenal for being a master system game, but its no Point Blank.
No matter one's station in life, the Dance of Death unites us all.

AndyWarne

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #85 on: June 27, 2018, 11:51:31 am »
The cheaper, new sensor is the one used in aimtracks.

Incorrect. Furthermore the Aimtrak uses another set of parameters for operation which the Wiimote does not. I alluded to this in an earlier post.

I can elaborate on this via PM if you wish as this thread is not about the Aimtrak.

Le Chuck

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #86 on: June 27, 2018, 11:53:56 am »
Howler was what sprung to mind, man was the product a total piece of junk.  I'm gutting an America's army cab, so I'll have a "coveted" USB2gun for sale soon.

Dibs?  Dibs.

I refuse to kickstart anything, Ive had zero return on investment on anything I've backed. Once you have an actual finished product up for sale I'll probably snag one. Shooting Gallery is phenomenal for being a master system game, but its no Point Blank.

Fact fact and moar fact. Also, unless you can play point blank within a foot of the screen while furiously pulling the trigger using the old straight-finger-bump-stock method whilst yelling the sinden gun won't be for me.


pbj

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #87 on: June 27, 2018, 01:05:14 pm »
I'll make the same tired point I always make in these threads, but I've found that the light gun games that are designed for the magic wand style guns are quite fun.  There's several good ones native to the Wii, and no annoying white flash.  Not sure that there's a better way to play Big Buck Hunter at home short of the actual arcade hardware.

But, hey, you want to kludge a solution to play some old ass 90s shooting game nobody cares about...

 :dunno

RandyT

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #88 on: June 27, 2018, 01:59:09 pm »
old ass 90s shooting game nobody cares about...

Heretic.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #89 on: July 02, 2018, 07:44:39 am »
Never thought about doing lightgun games on a SNES mini but hell why not?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wnbDnOFcTlM&feature=push-u&attr_tag=dJ-ZGjkicJLlODfE-6

Mr Lightgun, Fancy getting it going with a Rpi? :p

JDFan

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #90 on: July 02, 2018, 10:28:20 am »
Not looking good for funding -- 12 days left and they've made it to 1% of the goal.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #91 on: July 02, 2018, 10:31:50 am »
Not looking good for funding -- 12 days left and they've made it to 1% of the goal.

Yeah not looking hopeful!

JDFan

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #92 on: July 02, 2018, 10:38:44 am »
Not looking good for funding -- 12 days left and they've made it to 1% of the goal.

Yeah not looking hopeful!

Since he's got it working with the Mini's perhaps he should contact Nintendo and see if they'd buy the concept for the next Mini release that they could do as a lightgun game system - since the have the funding to develop it and a few games that could be released on it as well.

I know I'd be willing to pay the $60 - $80 price point for a retro lightgun Mini - if they made the lightgun look like the old Zapper and it came with a few of the old Nintendo lightgun games to play on an LCD TV/Monitor.
« Last Edit: July 02, 2018, 10:41:33 am by JDFan »

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #93 on: July 02, 2018, 11:43:59 am »
Not looking good for funding -- 12 days left and they've made it to 1% of the goal.

Yeah not looking hopeful!

Since he's got it working with the Mini's perhaps he should contact Nintendo and see if they'd buy the concept for the next Mini release that they could do as a lightgun game system - since the have the funding to develop it and a few games that could be released on it as well.

I know I'd be willing to pay the $60 - $80 price point for a retro lightgun Mini - if they made the lightgun look like the old Zapper and it came with a few of the old Nintendo lightgun games to play on an LCD TV/Monitor.


Trouble is going that route it would be looked into Nintendo.

The beauty of his system is it could theoretically work with anything so broader market and gives rise to the prospect of new games.

BadMouth

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #94 on: July 02, 2018, 12:00:17 pm »

Since he's got it working with the Mini's perhaps he should contact Nintendo and see if they'd buy the concept for the next Mini release that they could do as a lightgun game system - since the have the funding to develop it and a few games that could be released on it as well.

I know I'd be willing to pay the $60 - $80 price point for a retro lightgun Mini - if they made the lightgun look like the old Zapper and it came with a few of the old Nintendo lightgun games to play on an LCD TV/Monitor.


Trouble is going that route it would be looked into Nintendo.

The beauty of his system is it could theoretically work with anything so broader market and gives rise to the prospect of new games.

I don't know what you guys are excited about.  It requires a PC to be connected between the light gun and Nintendo Mini.
Might as well just use the PC.

Mike A

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #95 on: July 02, 2018, 12:05:18 pm »
I am just bummed out that the guy hasn't raised enough money for his escape to Tahiti.

JDFan

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #96 on: July 02, 2018, 12:11:22 pm »
Trouble is going that route it would be looked into Nintendo.

The beauty of his system is it could theoretically work with anything so broader market and gives rise to the prospect of new games.

Yes but if it doesn't get funded and is never released it doesn't work with anything including the nintendo devices - Better to be tied to a single company for a few years than never released !

JDFan

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #97 on: July 02, 2018, 12:12:19 pm »
I don't know what you guys are excited about.  It requires a PC to be connected between the light gun and Nintendo Mini.
Might as well just use the PC.

At 2:10 of the video he explains that with the proper driver it could be connected directly to the mini which would also give better performance and remove the need for the PC..
« Last Edit: July 02, 2018, 12:16:24 pm by JDFan »

pbj

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #98 on: July 02, 2018, 12:20:01 pm »

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #99 on: July 02, 2018, 12:50:39 pm »
I don't know what you guys are excited about.  It requires a PC to be connected between the light gun and Nintendo Mini.
Might as well just use the PC.

At 2:10 of the video he explains that with the proper driver it could be connected directly to the mini which would also give better performance and remove the need for the PC..

Beat me to it lol

Getting it going on a PI would be cool.

Just think of the possibilities of that lol

Mike A

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #100 on: July 02, 2018, 01:15:18 pm »
Yeah. Then you could play crappily emulated light gun games to go with the crappily emulated regular games.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #101 on: July 02, 2018, 03:46:11 pm »
Yeah. Then you could play crappily emulated light gun games to go with the crappily emulated regular games.

They aint that bad Mike.

tony.silveira

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #102 on: July 03, 2018, 12:54:25 pm »
i have had a few email exchanges with him and he seems legit to me.

i used to work for a very large video game publisher and offered to reach out to some folks that i still stay in contact with.  when i asked him about his prototype, if he felt it was ready for a demo, he said all he needs is a tv with hdmi.

so iím going to call legit on his product.  the goal is way too high and i will be offering my manufacturing experience to him.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #103 on: July 03, 2018, 02:07:47 pm »
i have had a few email exchanges with him and he seems legit to me.

i used to work for a very large video game publisher and offered to reach out to some folks that i still stay in contact with.  when i asked him about his prototype, if he felt it was ready for a demo, he said all he needs is a tv with hdmi.

so iím going to call legit on his product.  the goal is way too high and i will be offering my manufacturing experience to him.

Thats awesome Tony.

Ive sent him a few emails also and he seems a decent bloke.

Really hope he can fullfill his dream but 250k is a awfull high target for such a small niche market.

Theres few of us who love lightgun games and even fewer who would risk a kickstarter for one sadly.

Also despite great potential people wont see it or care until its released mainstream as a official accessory.

Osirus23

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #104 on: July 03, 2018, 03:15:44 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't all of these different Zapper gimmicks and workarounds be unnecessary if we could just get a LCD or other new display technology with the same response time as old CRTs?

BadMouth

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #105 on: July 03, 2018, 03:37:43 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't all of these different Zapper gimmicks and workarounds be unnecessary if we could just get a LCD or other new display technology with the same response time as old CRTs?

Ok, you're wrong.

The LCD would have to draw the white flash image top to bottom, left to right, like an old CRT.
The guns wouldn't track so they wouldn't work on positional gun games. 
The position would only be known when the trigger was pulled.
It would be an interesting exercise, but in modern times I'd rather not have the white flash.


Osirus23

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #106 on: July 03, 2018, 03:52:35 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't all of these different Zapper gimmicks and workarounds be unnecessary if we could just get a LCD or other new display technology with the same response time as old CRTs?

Ok, you're wrong.

The LCD would have to draw the white flash image top to bottom, left to right, like an old CRT.
The guns wouldn't track so they wouldn't work on positional gun games. 
The position would only be known when the trigger was pulled.
It would be an interesting exercise, but in modern times I'd rather not have the white flash.


The NES Zapper merely looked for, on trigger pull:

- black screen (anti-cheat frame)

- white box (the target you're shooting at)


They didn't use the electron beam scanning technique that the Super Scope did afaik. And the white flash is done by the game, there's no getting rid of it.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #107 on: July 03, 2018, 06:32:01 pm »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't all of these different Zapper gimmicks and workarounds be unnecessary if we could just get a LCD or other new display technology with the same response time as old CRTs?

Ok, you're wrong.

The LCD would have to draw the white flash image top to bottom, left to right, like an old CRT.
The guns wouldn't track so they wouldn't work on positional gun games. 
The position would only be known when the trigger was pulled.
It would be an interesting exercise, but in modern times I'd rather not have the white flash.


The NES Zapper merely looked for, on trigger pull:

- black screen (anti-cheat frame)

- white box (the target you're shooting at)


They didn't use the electron beam scanning technique that the Super Scope did afaik. And the white flash is done by the game, there's no getting rid of it.

Thats how the zapper worked but pretty much every lightgun after that used the CRT scan lines.

I still stand by the Zapper was the most accurate lightgun I have ever used, The problem being that you have no multi hit detection capability's for differentiating between a body shot and a head shot for instance.

RandyT

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #108 on: July 05, 2018, 09:52:25 am »
Correct me if I'm wrong, but couldn't all of these different Zapper gimmicks and workarounds be unnecessary if we could just get a LCD or other new display technology with the same response time as old CRTs?

At standard VGA resolutions, the same trick on an LCD, as used on CRTs, would need to have a refresh rate of over 300,000 frames per second.  An alternative method could allow 5 pixel accuracy with a refresh rate of "only" 960 fps with simple hardware or 480fps with more complicated hardware, but would only track when the trigger is pulled.  Still much faster than LCD TVs can manage. 

I.e. not gonna happen any time soon. 
« Last Edit: July 05, 2018, 10:03:51 am by RandyT »

ghibu

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #109 on: July 29, 2018, 02:39:33 pm »
Hi,
Allright everybody!
Nice project.

And did u heard about that?
https://www.google.com/amp/s/venturebeat.com/2018/06/07/mars-is-a-pdps-light-gun-for-couch-players/amp/
Someone could explain the difference between these camera technology?
 :)

RandyT

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #110 on: July 30, 2018, 12:35:17 pm »
Very interesting.  From the YT video, there appears to be a camera pointed at the screen, and the wireless gun looks to be pulsing an IR laser.  My guess from the limited information available, is that the camera would need to be a fairly specific distance from the screen and calibrated to it's borders.  It would then pick up the laser reflected from, or scattered by the screen to map out the shot placement.  Being IR, the actual imagery from the display shouldn't interfere.  Seems like a simple and effective approach, but may not work with all types of TV/monitors.  The external camera would also limit the types of installations it is suited for. 

But if it works well, it could be a great solution for those with projectors, and I'll certainly be keeping my eye on it.  I've always dreamed of being able to use an accurate light gun with life-sized targets.
« Last Edit: July 30, 2018, 02:06:27 pm by RandyT »

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #111 on: July 30, 2018, 12:37:50 pm »
Playing a lightgun game on a projector would be fricking amazing!

pbj

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #112 on: July 30, 2018, 12:42:50 pm »
Pretty cool to see all these new options coming soon.


Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #113 on: July 30, 2018, 12:49:44 pm »
Pretty cool to see all these new options coming soon.

I hope they come soon!

Seems to be more and more games landing by the month.

I got elevator action going yesterday!

SammyWI

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #114 on: July 30, 2018, 09:32:05 pm »
Very interesting.  From the YT video, there appears to be a camera pointed at the screen, and the wireless gun looks to be pulsing an IR laser.  My guess from the limited information available, is that the camera would need to be a fairly specific distance from the screen and calibrated to it's borders.  It would then pick up the laser reflected from, or scattered by the screen to map out the shot placement.  Being IR, the actual imagery from the display shouldn't interfere.  Seems like a simple and effective approach, but may not work with all types of TV/monitors.  The external camera would also limit the types of installations it is suited for. 

But if it works well, it could be a great solution for those with projectors, and I'll certainly be keeping my eye on it.  I've always dreamed of being able to use an accurate light gun with life-sized targets.

Well now that's interesting.  I've been messing with this basic idea for a while now both as a shooting range simulator and for shooting games.  An open source program called ShootOff works pretty well with a webcam with both visible and IR lasers.  Getting a webcam without an IR filter is a pain but possible.  ShootOff has it's own shooting range simulator and a mode called shot to click that just passes a mouse click through.  Unfortunately shot to click has not worked in MAME or any other emulator I've tried.  Pretty much just works with browser based games.

Another approach I'm trying is another program called Wiimote Whiteboard.  This uses a Wiimote as the IR camera for instructors to "write" on a projector screen with a "pen" that has an IR LED at the tip.  This program can also produce a mouse click which is all I need.  A 10mw IR laser works in place of the LED on a projector screen.  (be an adult, be careful, don't point IR lasers at eyes, pets, mirrors, bla, bla, bla.)  This program also won't work with any emulator I've tried.  But works well with most standard Windows programs and browsers.  It is also finicky about connecting to a PC - Bluetooth only - blech. 

This is all for a projector screen setup only so kind of limited in its' appeal here maybe.

s8n187

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #115 on: October 04, 2018, 07:28:15 am »
no activity in this thread for a couple of months and the Kickstarter total wasn't reached.  Has anyone heard any news or spoken to Sinden in the last 2 months ,  i'm hoping the project hasn't stalled or been cancelled.

Titchgamer

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #116 on: October 04, 2018, 09:53:33 am »
no activity in this thread for a couple of months and the Kickstarter total wasn't reached.  Has anyone heard any news or spoken to Sinden in the last 2 months ,  i'm hoping the project hasn't stalled or been cancelled.

No news since the KS failed.
I signed up with them for future updates but nothing as yet.

MrLightgun

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #117 on: October 08, 2018, 05:34:04 am »
Don't worry everyone, I've been working hard to develop the product (hardware and software) and got some exciting updates to come soon, hopefully within a month.

Regards

Mr Lightgun

s8n187

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #118 on: October 10, 2018, 01:40:37 am »
holy s*it great news ,  thanks for chiming in can't wait for future developments.

Zebra

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Re: A new lightgun?
« Reply #119 on: October 10, 2018, 12:31:33 pm »
Playing a lightgun game on a projector would be fricking amazing!

I play PS3 games on a projector. Shooting and driving games are espiecially awesome on my 110" screen in my living room. My son loves Sega Ralley on the PS3 with the force feedback wheel.

With vintage games, you have the same issues as using any fixed pixel display - and poor upscaling does not look any better on a larger screen. Also, unless you have a black projector screen (like I use) then you need to play in a dark room to get a decent image which I don't really like.

You could buy an old CRT projector (one capable of native 240p without line-doubling). But they have their own issues. Most are not bright enough and the gaps between scanlines get larger as the screen size increases (which is why people started using line doublers).

The best set-up for large screen vintage gaming is one of those old 50" or 70" crt rear projection TVs or monitors (like the ones they use on Time Crisis deluxe and House of the dead games). They usually sell for next to nothing on Craigslist as you need a truck to move one...

  
 

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