My advice to beginners

[bulbousbeard]

[Brian B]

Those video cards you are recommending have DVI outputs.  How does that work?

B.

[bulbousbeard]

[yotsuya]

I watched the first 3-4 minutes of that then had to turn it off due to too much hyperbole. I didn't realize I was I the presence of the one person who loves arcade games more than anyone else on the planet. 

Too bad, too, because I initially agree with your point about figuring out what you want your cabinet to be. But you talk like you type here, and so I wasn't interested in continuing.

[Generic Eric]

I thoroughly enjoy having philosophical debates on the finer points of arcades, the jedi connection to building your own cabinet and all of that. You are all over the map on the idea of an intro to building a mame cabinet.

Even if you only showed a text list of the games that met your 3 criteria, you should have shown them.

Did you listen to this before you published it?  Your pacing is kinda off.  You are upset and it shows.  The major takeaway from this video is you are upset.  Over video games.

I've shown my POS on here, where is yours?  More importantly, where is it on the video?  You spend too much time on one picture.

It was kinda neat you displayed the links, but I would have preferred you actually showed it and it would lend to the credibility of the statement. 

Consider redoing this video and linking to deeper discussions with pop ups, that way you can maintain the 30,000ft view during your introduction.

Lastly, you haven't built anything.  If I was looking for building instructions and came across this, I'd have kept going.

[yotsuya]

I thoroughly enjoy having philosophical debates on the finer points of arcades, the jedi connection to building your own cabinet and all of that. You are all over the map on the idea of an intro to building a mame cabinet.

Even if you only showed a text list of the games that your 3 criteria, you should have shown them.

Did you listen to this before you published it?  Your pacing is kinda off.  You are upset and it shows.  The major takeaway from this video is you are upset.  Over video games.

If shown my POS on here, where is yours?  More importantly, where is it on the video?  You spend too much time on one picture.

It was kinda neat you displayed the links, but I would have preferred you actually showed it and it would lend to the credibility of the statement. 

Consider redoing this video and linking to deeper discussions with pop ups, that way you can maintain the 30,000ft view during your introduction.

Lastly, you haven't built anything.  If I was looking for building instructions and came across this, I'd have kept going.

If you want some constructive criticism, BB, you spend way too much time on that CrapMAME image of Pac-Matt while you wax poetic of the evils of Cabinet Building. Again, I don't think you necessarily have bad ideas per se, but your presentation leaves a lot to be desired. If I were a n00b, I would have moved on to the next video after a few minutes. I only listened out of morbid curiousity. You should make one video showing HOW TO set up GroovyMAME specifically, and a separate video for your Unibomber Gaming Manifesto.

[leapinlew]

It's his opinion, it's mostly wrong for a lot of people, but it's right for him - I guess. The problem is he lists this as beginner advice.

For example, he lists his games you should have as "Is this game endlessly re-playable?" and then lists beat-em-ups as games you wouldn't want to play more than once which is silly since everyone has different tastes. Beat-em-ups specifically is a subset of games that can take on a whole new level of fun if you have guests, play with different people, try to get through on a single quarter, etc.

Sure, that would change the answer to the question of "Is this game endlessly re-playable?" to yes, but my point is a few minutes into the video and it already doesn't apply to many people and would only serve to confuse beginners.

Best advice I can give for beginners? Buy the book, read the forum, and take in as much info as you can.

[yotsuya]

It's his opinion, it's mostly wrong for a lot of people, but it's right for him - I guess. The problem is he lists this as beginner advice.

Yeah, that's been an on-going issue. BB presents ALL his opinions as a MATTER OF FACT. Some of us try to act as buffers, lest beginners think you NEED to spend $800 on a monitor to play Galaga.

[bulbousbeard]

This video isn't aimed at any of the people who replied here. It's aimed at the people who will go through the whole process of building something without actually thinking about the games they want to play, which is the most important thing.

[yotsuya]

This video isn't aimed at any of the people who replied here. It's aimed at the people who will go through the whole process of building something without actually thinking about the games they want to play, which is the most important thing.

Yeah, but I think you're going to lose those people about 4 minutes into the video when they see you just offer theory and not any practical tips. If you consider yourself a monitor/GroovyMAME expert, do a HOW TO video, not a WHY video.

[Hoopz]

More people read the forums without replying than those who reply.  I watched a few minutes of the video.  I'd focus on your presentation and take advantage of your coding skills.  Use graphics, text, examples, etc.   

[Malenko]

first of 2 replies.   This one will cover what I got from watching your video. The next will be more about the video itself.


1) You love GroovyMAME
2) You hate hyperspin
3) you don't know how to title videos.

[Malenko]

*click*...............         20 minute advice video? Oh ---fudgesicle---, you started to lose me around the 4 minute mark. I powered through the entire thing.  15 minutes after you started, you're still on your first point of " Decide what you wanna play before you build"


I agree on deciding what you want to play, then build the cab around that. I agree that CrapMAME is a fine example of what not to do. However CrapMAME is severely outdated.
I would suggest even looking over the "First cab" thread: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143792.msg1492753.html#msg1492753
instead of some internet random poking fun at misc cabs, the builders of the cabs tell you what they did wrong, myself included.

You seem to imply that every cab on CrapMAME is also a frankenpanel,   Ms.Stacie was just low build quality, not too many controls: http://www.wickedretarded.com/~crapmame/8.html
Your 3 criteria , should only be 2; and slightly different.   "Will this game get played enough to warrant having it on the machine?" and "Will this game be playable on this machine?"

Points you stated as fact that I think are completely wrong: (I'm ad-libbing a few)
"There aren't that many good arcade games"
that you are "somebody who loves arcade games more than almost anyone on the planet"
"Less than 200 games on an arcade cab"
Advocating that newbs START with an arcade monitor and groovyMAME
No one should make money on this hobby (of course then you suggest a JPAC, which last I checked werent free; or are you saying Andy isnt important to this hobby?)
Suggesting people hotswap jamma instead of using a switcher. At least suggest that they cold swap.
You cant enjoy a game if its not running at its native res /refresh
games sound like Alvin and the chipmunks if not running at their native refresh
the implication that all Wells Gardner monitors are great ( http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,64564.0.html )
"You cant beat the real thing" yet saying GroovyMAME is as good as the real thing
Im waiving my wiener because my front end has menu's and videos (not using hyperspin though)
That *I* Don't care about quality because Im using an LCD.
Hyperspin interferes with MAME. I personally dont like HS, but I wouldnt lie about it. Citation needed.
You think this ---smurfy--- video is going to ignite the fire of selling old crummy ATI cards.


You keep trying to coin the phrase "Arcade cabinets are made for games , Games aren't made for arcade cabinets". It's wholly inaccurate. You do know that JAMMA conversion kits came out explicitly to put games into existing arcade cabs, ie games made for arcade cabs , right?

I love the contradiction of signing the praises of the MAME team and all they do (for free), but then pointing out the features of GroovyMAME that the MAME team doesnt like (nag screen removal, high score keeping, etc)  Also, Super Metroid is totally playable on an arcade cab.

Your video really didnt cover any advice for newbs, it was a poorly made "video" about giving groovyMAME a handy (with spit)

[DietCoke]

Your video really didnt cover any advice for newbs, it was a poorly made "video" about giving groovyMAME a handy (with spit)

[AzureKnight]

I'd have to agree, props for taking the time to make a video and I do agree with some of your points.  But too much of what you present is your opinion pushed as fact.  I will replay beat em ups over and over again.  There is a recent build (Beat 'em Up X) in the User's Choice Awards dedicated to them...I'm guessing that is another user that will play them over and over again.  Meanwhile...I can't play certain other games like Asteroids.  I find it boring, but there are several beautiful machines dedicated to that game on this forum.  I built a Frankenpanel, it IMO is a rather nice looking Frankenpanel.  I am happy with it and I am willing to postulate that I will remain that way.  It currently has menus for 800+ Mame games and if I play some of them once and only once I don't consider that a waste at all.  I consider it fun time well spent.  My needs/desires obviously differ from yours.

If my opinion is worth anything to you at all in regards to this video I would say take another crack at it, you do present some good ideas and I'm going to take another look at GroovyMame due to your suggestion, but stick to the advice on how to plan and make the right choices based upon the creator's values over your own.  Help that rookie to ask the right questions and find the right answer for them and then offer guidance based on those possible answers.

[opt2not]

Why did this need to be 20 mins??

Personally I don't think anyone who doesn't have a project example to show should be giving advice.
You should have started the video off with an example of your work, then followed with your opinion.

Checking through your posts, you don't have one cabinet posted here. Not one.  You have only one Project Announcement post, and that's in reply to someone else's build to push Groovymame!

This video is strictly an opinion piece.  Unfortunately, not solid beginner advice.

[Le Chuck]

I'm only commenting to subscribe to this thread

[Vigo]

I'll watch the vid when I get a chance. 

[yotsuya]

I'll watch the vid when I get a chance. 

If you've read his other posts,  it's the same info,  but in aural, PBR-fueled form.

[yotsuya]

Which, I want to repeat, I actually agree with his opening points. He just needs to learn to be a better communicator. And a better filmmaker.

[shponglefan]

This video isn't aimed at any of the people who replied here.

So why'd you post it here?

[Le Chuck]

So it would not get commented on, get buried in the forum, but remain a key-word rich link so any unsuspecting googler would run across is and steered clear of making a "bad" cab by being subjected to a 20min rant that shows only a bad cab.  Doi. 

[bulbousbeard]

It's hilarious how much this offended weiner wavers. Deal with it. You know who you are. Yeah, I haven't shown off any of my stuff, because I'm not a show off. We've got some real brains in here.

[yotsuya]

I didn't watch that much of the video, did he actually use the term "wiener wavers"?

[Malenko]

It's hilarious how much this offended weiner wavers. Deal with it. You know who you are. Yeah, I haven't shown off any of my stuff, because I'm not a show off. We've got some real brains in here.

So tell me, how does not showing your work help or inspire others? 

I didn't watch that much of the video, did he actually use the term "wiener wavers"?

Yes. Well he said "waving their wieners"

[Le Chuck]

What's a wiener waver?

[yotsuya]

What's a wiener waver?

[harveybirdman]

This video isn't aimed at any of the people who replied here. It's aimed at the people who will go through the whole process of building something without actually thinking about the games they want to play, which is the most important thing.

Dude,  remind me who you are again?

All I see here are established veterans of this forum providing fair criticism to which you've failed to respond.  Most if not all the respondants have highly acclaimed builds on this site.  Perhaps you should reevaluate your position or at least agree that they have a point about the nature of your content not lining up with your intent.

The sad thing is that some of the decent points you do make are rendered less effective by the way they are communicated.   It would be dissapointing if anyone were to think less of Groovymame or the effort to use real arcade monitors as a result of what sort of amounts to snobbery.

[keilmillerjr]

It was HIS advice. It was actually GOOD advice. Video could have been shorter. Some people, including mods, need to get the ---fudgesicle--- over themselves. There is nothing wrong with the video posted. Keep up the good work bulbousbeard.

Creating an alternate thread of same title? Seriously? Grow the ---fudgesicle--- up.

[mgb]

It's hilarious how much this offended weiner wavers. Deal with it. You know who you are. Yeah, I haven't shown off any of my stuff, because I'm not a show off. We've got some real brains in here.

 

sooo, you post a 20 minute long video rambling about how to properly build an arcade cab, and you have "stuff" that you just chose not to show, for fear of being a showoff?
I don't know about that.
anyway, I agree with your advice about being sure what games you aim to play before building, but like everyone else I sense your attitude of superiority like your way is the only way. you could have summed that advice up a lot quicker.

Showing off your stuff is part of how to help beginners, not lengthy wanna be tedtalks about the zen of choosing a game list. and who are you to list what games are worth playing again.

another way we help beginners around here is by sharing our failures in order to let others know what didn't work for us.
But you tend to come off as though you do no wrong.

[yotsuya]

It was HIS advice. It was actually GOOD advice. Video could have been shorter. Some people, including mods, need to get the ---fudgesicle--- over themselves. There is nothing wrong with the video posted. Keep up the good work bulbousbeard.

Creating an alternate thread of same title? Seriously? Grow the ---fudgesicle--- up.

I left what I felt to be honest, critical feedback. I've left the same feedback on his posts as well. It's good advice wrapped in a ---smurfy--- package.

I know you like his FE, but come on. If you think there's NOTHING wrong with the video, well...

[shponglefan]

nm.

[shponglefan]

It was HIS advice. It was actually GOOD advice. Video could have been shorter. Some people, including mods, need to get the ---fudgesicle--- over themselves. There is nothing wrong with the video posted. Keep up the good work bulbousbeard.

Creating an alternate thread of same title? Seriously? Grow the ---fudgesicle--- up.

The bit about designing a game cabinet for the games you want to play is good advice.  But honestly, as a beginner I think the rest of the video would have lost me.  Not to mention slagging on other arcade cabinet designs right off the bat.  It sets a negative tone (kinda like this thread) which is more likely to discourage rather than encourage.

[yotsuya]

Now that I look at it, not a single mod has posted in this thread.

[Le Chuck]

You heard the man you fuckwits. Get over yourselves and get in formation! We're going to run this beyotch like North Korea. There will be no dissent. Much wow! All praise! Very spoken! 

[Malenko]

It was HIS advice. It was actually GOOD advice. Video could have been shorter. Some people, including mods, need to get the ---fudgesicle--- over themselves. There is nothing wrong with the video posted. Keep up the good work bulbousbeard.

Creating an alternate thread of same title? Seriously? Grow the ---fudgesicle--- up.

His video wasn't about advice, I don't even know what it was about to be honest with you. I made a thread with the same title, yes, but I (and others) actually gave solid beginner advice.



 As for growing the ---fudgesicle--- up?

[bulbousbeard]

The bit about designing a game cabinet for the games you want to play is good advice.  But honestly, as a beginner I think the rest of the video would have lost me.  Not to mention slagging on other arcade cabinet designs right off the bat.  It sets a negative tone (kinda like this thread) which is more likely to discourage rather than encourage.

It's funny you mention that, because one of my intentions was to discourage people who don't actually like games from doing this. That's why I kept harping on the importance of the games.

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

[yotsuya]

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

 

[bulbousbeard]

All I see here are established veterans of this forum providing fair criticism to which you've failed to respond.  Most if not all the respondants have highly acclaimed builds on this site.  Perhaps you should reevaluate your position or at least agree that they have a point about the nature of your content not lining up with your intent.

Yeah, "fair criticism" from people who didn't even listen to what was said or are incapable of understanding English.

Just as an example, Malenko said that I told people that they don't care about quality if they use an LCD. I didn't say that. I use an LCD in one of my cabinets. I said that you don't care about quality if you don't run games at their native refresh rate. It isn't the same thing. How is that a "fair criticism" when it shows that the critic didn't even understand what was said?

Let me go through these supposedly insightful observations and show you how stupid most of them are:

"No one should make money on this hobby (of course then you suggest a JPAC, which last I checked werent free; or are you saying Andy isnt important to this hobby?)"

I never said that nobody should make money. I said that unimportant freeloaders who are providing no value to anyone (ie. stealing other people's work and then reselling it) are shady opportunists, which is true. Actually building useful hardware for people? VALUABLE. Yeah! Valuable! Selling a Hyperspin theme you didn't even make? Shady freeloader! Yeah! Shady! Sorry, but this guy's about as dumb as Georgia clay.

"Suggesting people hotswap jamma instead of using a switcher. At least suggest that they cold swap."

You CAN hotswap JAMMA. So what?

"You cant enjoy a game if its not running at its native res /refresh"

I didn't say you can't enjoy it. I said you don't care about quality if you're going to run games like malformed butt, and it's true. If you really did care, you wouldn't tolerate it.

"games sound like Alvin and the chipmunks if not running at their native refresh"

They DO sound like that. Play Mortal Kombat at 60hz and tell me that the pitch isn't hilariously off.

"the implication that all Wells Gardner monitors are great ( http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,64564.0.html )"

Wells Gardner monitors are great. Just because the late digital models had problems doesn't mean that there aren't awesome and reliable WG monitors. You're just grasping for straws because I offended you. It's pathetically immature.

'"You cant beat the real thing" yet saying GroovyMAME is as good as the real thing'

GroovyMAME is the real thing. It's running original arcade code on original monitors and the original resolution and original refresh rate. That's the whole point. It IS the real thing.



Ya savvy? A good GroovyMAME setup is indistinguishable from real hardware.

"Hyperspin interferes with MAME. I personally dont like HS, but I wouldnt lie about it. Citation needed."

Go to the GroovyMAME forum. It's well documented. The program SUCKS.

"You think this ---smurfy--- video is going to ignite the fire of selling old crummy ATI cards."

GroovyMAME has already got people buying older AMD cards. I never suggested that my video would have anything to do with it. The word was out about how useful these cards were as soon as GroovyMAME popped up. You're the one making stuff up. I'm just telling it how it is.

I really love the implication that it's a contradiction to respect what MAME's done and remove the nag screens. See, I'm not a psychopath. I can actually like a program while disagreeing with the people who made it on some philosophical points. MAME puts in the nagscreen to cover themselves legally, and that's fine, but for anyone actually playing games and not building cabinets so they can brag about them on forums, they really don't want to deal with the nag screens. So no, weirdo, it's not a contradiction to have a great deal of respect for what MAME's accomplished and still remove the nag screens with glee.

The only "valid" points raised were that the video was too long, sloppy, and visually boring. Those are all valid points, and I agree with them. I could have covered all the points in less than 10 minutes.

[Malenko]

Just as an example, Malenko said that I told people that they don't care about quality if they use an LCD. I didn't say that. I use an LCD in one of my cabinets. I said that you don't care about quality if you don't run games at their native refresh rate. It isn't the same thing. How is that a "fair criticism" when it shows that the critic didn't even understand what was said?

Ok, so then you have an LCD that runs games like R-Type in their native resolution and or refresh rate? Or do you also not care about quality?
If you only reply to one part of this, make it this part^





I also said I was ad-libbing perhaps I should have said paraphrasing. Either way for the most part you picked up the gist of it, not sure why we are arguing semantics.
Allow me to rebut.

You didnt cite any specific examples of who was making money (or how), and stressed about people who do a lot of work for no money. Its a logical conclusion I came to. If you said "people who sell hyperspin themes are ---meecrobs---" we may have actually have had common ground.

You can hotswap JAMMA, but you shouldn't.  Just like you can put a condom machine in a rape crisis center, but you shouldn't.

Mortal Kombat sounds fine on my MAME cab (luckily for me, I have an actual MK cab to compare it to)

Not all Wells Gardner monitors are great, your video makes no mention of any issues with any of them. I'm not grasping at straws, they are actually my preferred monitor. You have yet to offend me and I have thick skin.

I'm not saying Hyperspin doesn't suck (I use MaLa) , but you said Hyperspin messes with MAME, I dont recall you specifying groovyMAME.If you did specify GM, I redact this part. I don't use GroovyMAME or Hyperspin, thats why I suggested you add citation, like I did with WellsGardner monitors.

GroovyMAME is not the real thing. By its very definition its an EMULATOR, not actual hardware running, so its not the same thing.
"It's running original arcade code on original monitors and the original resolution and original refresh rate." does not equal "It's running original arcade code on original monitors and the original resolution and original refresh rate on original hardware."
granted its *VERY* close and pretty much indistinguishable but that doesn't make it the real thing.

We're just going to have to agree to disagree on nag screens. While I love that you think having a project thread (on a forum that's all about making MAME cabs, in a section that's all about featuring MAME builds) is showing off, I don't have nag screens disabled on my cabinet. I also don't think my cab is really all that great of an example of wiener waving either.  An MK4 cab covered in black vinyl with some re-created open ice art that I put up for download that anyone can use.  My project cab is up there as an example of what I feel makes a solid 2 player 4 player hybrid control panel without having "50 billion buttons". Something I thought even you would appreciate.

Your video really could have been about 5 minutes long, depending on how in depth you went with GM , or if you added advice on setup/config of GM.

1) "Hi this has nothing to do with any beginner advice for building a cab, but when you do build it I suggest looking into GroovyMAME."
2) *insert examples of why you like groovyMAME and that it works best with a real arcade monitor*
3) maybe show some clips of it running, and comparative clips of the same game running on vanilla MAME at the wrong refresh rate.
3)  give examples of video cards to use , give words to search for on eBay since auction links aren't valid forever and some people dont use or want to use eBay.
4) Let people know that you don't like Hyperspin and that it has issues with Groovy MAME, If I were you I'd even plug my own front end of BigBlue.
5) maybe close it out with some shout outs to people like Andy and Calamity etc



Sorry you are so offended and butt hurt about replies. Name-calling is the cornerstone of any solid discussion. However,  I am quite capable of comprehending English; I have not been offended by you; I feel I'm immature but not to the point of it being pathetic; I have not been diagnosed as a psychopath by a qualified mental health expert; weirdo is relative so I suppose I'll have to accept that one.


Perhaps instead of trying to defend the video, make a better one?

[shponglefan]

It's funny you mention that, because one of my intentions was to discourage people who don't actually like games from doing this. That's why I kept harping on the importance of the games.

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

That... makes no sense.  Anyone building cabinets regardless of perceived quality or who they sell to is good for the hobby.  Because then they are supporting existing manufacturers/retailers of arcade hardware.  The survival of those businesses is good for the rest of us.

Given that the DIY arcade cottage industry has arguably a finite lifespan, discouraging people from making cabinets is counter-productive to the hobby as a whole.  If that's your real goal, then you're not doing anyone any favors.

[Generic Eric]

It's funny you mention that, because one of my intentions was to discourage people who don't actually like games from doing this. That's why I kept harping on the importance of the games.

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

Hopefully, you'll continue the series you alluded to in your intro video.  But hopefully, you'll consider the feedback and do a new video.

Yeah, I haven't shown off any of my stuff, because I'm not a show off.

It is a matter of showing real examples as tools in your presentation.  If you have a cabinet wired to for a PC and for jamma boards, why not show it?

If you want to make a case for the superiority of CRT over a LCD, show an example.     Side by side, double blind.

You don't have to post your cabinet, but consider this.  Even Howard Casto showed his cab,  (granted it was a long time ago) and most recently, the start of his driving console.  Even X2 showed his cabinet, well the rotating control panel at least.

Lets not forget, that this whole endeavor is an exercise in cost vs benefit.  Thats why a person is compelled to build a frankenpanel or rotating monitors, or adding a pinball emulator; because they can't afford multiple cabinets. 

[Vigo]

Love the graphic, Eric. 

It's funny you mention that, because one of my intentions was to discourage people who don't actually like games from doing this. That's why I kept harping on the importance of the games.

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

Let me just say this. I don't build cabinets to play them. I build them to build them, to share the experience. Maybe I am a shady weirdo, but it is nothing for me to not play video games for weeks straight. I think it is better to say I appreciate games, and love keeping a part of my childhood alive. You think that this is a hobby only for certain people, but I have a different philosophy -



When it comes to our duty to this community, our job, as experienced hobbyists, is cultivate talent, to develop passion, enrich creativity and be a guide and mentor. Acting elitist and saying that you either gotta know how to do it right or GTFO is not productive. Sure as ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- that some people don't get the hobby, but that doesn't give us the right to show them the door if they are not doing it to your liking.

[shponglefan]

^ Well said, Vigo.

Personally, I've never understood the adoption of elitist views when it comes to video games of all things.  Heck, building/designing cabinets and controls arguably has far more value-add in terms of skillsets than merely playing games.

[pbj]

The complete lack of affect and inflection in your speech really implies a mild cognitive disorder.  Further evidenced by your responses to this thread and inability to understand different opinions.

Things can be improved by various mental exercises and help from professionals and there's really no shame in it these days.  I hope that you will avail yourself of whatever local resources can be found.

 

[dkersten]

You heard the man you fuckwits. Get over yourselves and get in formation! We're going to run this beyotch like North Korea. There will be no dissent. Much wow! All praise! Very spoken!

OMG I lol'd hard at this.. You made my day Chuck!

@bb, like all your posts, the problem is the way you come off as an elitist whose opinion is actually fact, when (in fact) it is simply opinion.  This is a forum meant to share ideas regarding arcade controls.  You won't share what you have created, but you offer your opinions (stated as facts) freely without actually sharing what you have created.  That tells me you are looking for a pedestal to stand on and garner attention without opening yourself to critique.  Yet we end up critiquing you anyway, and you get all kinds of mad about it. 

And the most offensive thing I have seen from you to date is how you assume that people who don't have the same motives or experience in this hobby somehow don't have the right to pursue it.  Considering this forum is in place specifically for people who have no experience in the field to learn how to build their own arcade controls, I would say your efforts to keep new people from getting into this hobby are contradictory to this forum, and hence you should just see yourself to the door and go spew your elitist opinions somewhere else. 

We NEED new, shady wierdos and bored hipsters so we can laugh at their frankenpanels and then teach them how to do it right.  It gives us meaning.  Quit messing with that.   

[yotsuya]

Remember kids, MAME cabs aren't for hipsters, weirdos, and poor people.

[Le Chuck]

I'm with Vigo, my hobby is building cabinets.  I started off building so I could play, now I build so others can play.  I like playing but if you look where the preponderance of my time is spent it is with stain on my hands and sawdust in my nose. 

[dkersten]

I admit my cab hasn't been turned on for at least 2 months, and I have a ton of LED's to replace, some stuck buttons to attend to, and I have about 250 gigs of videos, snaps, roms, CHD's, and other updates sitting on my work computer that I need to move onto my cab and get dialed in.

Yet, despite my lack of playing, I am thinking more and more about building a new cab, maybe 2.  If I weren't dedicated to getting my second book finished first, I would already be in the shop.

Just because I don't love PacMan the way BB does, doesn't mean I shouldn't be in this hobby.

[johnrt]

I admit my cab hasn't been turned on for at least 2 months, and I have a ton of LED's to replace, some stuck buttons to attend to, and I have about 250 gigs of videos, snaps, roms, CHD's, and other updates sitting on my work computer that I need to move onto my cab and get dialed in.

Yet, despite my lack of playing, I am thinking more and more about building a new cab, maybe 2.  If I weren't dedicated to getting my second book finished first, I would already be in the shop.

Just because I don't love PacMan the way BB does, doesn't mean I shouldn't be in this hobby.

Hehe... I now what you're talking about. I have built an upright and three bartops. And the only cab I'm playing on is my driver bartop. But this I play on every single day. And I'm also using it as a computer. In fact, this is the one I'm using right now. I just connect a mouse and keyboard on the backside and use it as an arcade, computer and jukebox.

[opt2not]

I only use my MAME setup to sample games like a filthy casual. 

[bulbousbeard]

The complete lack of affect and inflection in your speech really implies a mild cognitive disorder.  Further evidenced by your responses to this thread and inability to understand different opinions.

Things can be improved by various mental exercises and help from professionals and there's really no shame in it these days.  I hope that you will avail yourself of whatever local resources can be found.

 

So I sound upset and lack affectation. I'm glad we've got all our bases covered.

[bulbousbeard]

Just as an example, Malenko said that I told people that they don't care about quality if they use an LCD. I didn't say that. I use an LCD in one of my cabinets. I said that you don't care about quality if you don't run games at their native refresh rate. It isn't the same thing. How is that a "fair criticism" when it shows that the critic didn't even understand what was said?
Ok, so then you have an LCD that runs games like R-Type in their native resolution and or refresh rate? Or do you also not care about quality?
If you only reply to one part of this, make it this part^

I've got a G-Sync monitor. It runs R-Type at 55hz. It's 3840x2160, so there's enough resolution for CRT shaders to look good on it.

For what it's worth, I like a lot of your suggestions. I'll never plug Big Blue when talking about frontends, though, because it's too much of a conflict of interest. Besides that, I actually think that Mala and Attract Mode are the best choice for most people.

[paigeoliver]

Eh, I say the majority of people involved with the hobby for money are either destroying classic cabinets left and right, committing criminal copyright infringement for profit, building total garbage or misleading their customers. Most of them are doing all four. They make the hobby look bad. I don't know if the extra joysticks are worth the bad mojo they bring to the hobby.

Full disclosure. I do game stuff for money sometimes. Mostly repairs of other people's games and I occasionally sell full games.

It's funny you mention that, because one of my intentions was to discourage people who don't actually like games from doing this. That's why I kept harping on the importance of the games.

There are way too many dumb builds that get thrown together by shady weirdos who are just trying to flip the cabinets they made and bored hipsters who have no intention of actually playing anything. Weeding some of those out isn't going to hurt anyone.

That... makes no sense.  Anyone building cabinets regardless of perceived quality or who they sell to is good for the hobby.  Because then they are supporting existing manufacturers/retailers of arcade hardware.  The survival of those businesses is good for the rest of us.

Given that the DIY arcade cottage industry has arguably a finite lifespan, discouraging people from making cabinets is counter-productive to the hobby as a whole.  If that's your real goal, then you're not doing anyone any favors.

[DeLuSioNal29]

Now that I look at it, not a single mod has posted in this thread.

First I'm hearing about this...  But I'm in!  The same thread title threw me off at first.

Admittedly, I need to read through the entire thread first before I add some "flava" to the convo.

D

[Malenko]

Eh, I say the majority of people involved with the hobby for money are either destroying classic cabinets left and right, committing criminal copyright infringement for profit, building total garbage or misleading their customers. Most of them are doing all four. They make the hobby look bad. I don't know if the extra joysticks are worth the bad mojo they bring to the hobby.

Most and Majority are debatable, I'm totally on board if you say "too many" ; and if you say of those who do usually do all 4.

Haruman, ebarlow, and Rick make CNC kits
Opt2Not, Snaaaake, and myself do artwork (this is sometimes a copyright grey area or worse)
Andy and Randy and others make hardware

I also repair, restore, and resell cabs but Im not sure Ive actually made any money off of it yet.

[dkersten]

They make the hobby look bad.

To who?  It isn't like this is a mainstream hobby that is competing for attention from other hobbies.  I have yet to run into a single person outside of the internet who I have ended up in a conversation about arcade cabinets and he said something like "Arcades, huh.  Yeah, I was going to get into that, but all the hacks out there destroying good arcade cabinets to build crappy mame cabs ruined the hobby, so I opted for knitting instead."

I mean, come on.  They annoy YOU, and it is OK you feel upset about it.  But don't get all elitist and decide you are too good for people who don't see things the way you do.  I think elitism drives more good people from the hobby than newb hacks do.

[opt2not]

Opt2Not, Snaaaake, and myself do artwork (this is sometimes a copyright grey area or worse)

And I don't really break even on these artwork commissions, I mean if you count the amount of hours and effort for the money I receive. (which is why I've taken a little break on doing artwork for other people -- gotta work on my own things every so often).  For instance I did the math on my last commission I finished, turned out if it were counted in $$/hr, I made well below minimum wage...

[pbj]

Not my fault you insisted on putting so many veins on konkey's dong.

[opt2not]

But I was going for realism.

Besides, I give you old-timers a break on the prices. It's really only the newbs that I fail to fleece. 

[shponglefan]

Eh, I say the majority of people involved with the hobby for money are either destroying classic cabinets left and right, committing criminal copyright infringement for profit, building total garbage or misleading their customers. Most of them are doing all four. They make the hobby look bad. I don't know if the extra joysticks are worth the bad mojo they bring to the hobby.

For the most part, the only people who seem to care about those things are people already in the hobby.

And a lot of the current arcade hobby is built around copyright infringement.  I don't think anyone in the hobby can really take the moral high-ground here.

[Generic Eric]

Eh, I say the majority of people involved with the hobby for money are either destroying classic cabinets left and right, committing criminal copyright infringement for profit, building total garbage or misleading their customers. Most of them are doing all four. They make the hobby look bad. I don't know if the extra joysticks are worth the bad mojo they bring to the hobby.

For the most part, the only people who seem to care about those things are people already in the hobby.

And a lot of the current arcade hobby is built around copyright infringement.  I don't think anyone in the hobby can really take the moral high-ground here.

I think this "hobby" is more akin to reproductions of parts to things that aren't available.  The vintage snowmobile guy called them repops


 

We've done this before.  Lets not turn this thread into bread crumbs for ambulance chasers.  Someone turn off the lights I hear a car coming up the road.   Rover doesn't bark this way unless its a stranger... Or the Sheriff.


But seriously, this was a good thread, if we can stay on point...