Video Game crash of 1983

[TJCOMBO]

Having never experienced it, was the crash in 1983 really that bad?  How did you guys survive? Yars Revenge and Pitfall?

[SavannahLion]

My personal memories are of a glut of catridges coupled with a mentality that carried over well into the XEGS line. I was a moron back then. You were able to buy a full shoebox of 2600 games for around $5. That kind of mentality existed with the XEGS where one could buy (used) a full 1/3 of the library for less than the price of a brand new game.

When Nintendo brought us the NES, a lot of parents had no interest in buying another piece of "crap". So we had to do some cut throat things to get the new breed. At the time, I had limited knowledge  of the big N. But I was far more familiar with the Fuji so I shelled out $200-300 for XEGS. To a kid, that represented a lot of holiday cards (mowing lawns was not an option, noone had a yard) only to get crazy flak from mom and dad. Yeah, I was stupid.

Review magazines for the new generation were critical, getting bit by craptastic games  was still a risk and getting a refund back then was a little more complicated (no barcodes so receipts was a must).

Arcades weren't affected much that I recall. But I grew up in an area where cab turnover rate was very very low and would stay that way until the introduction of SFII.

[yotsuya]

It's funny- I saw the same thing as SavannahLion, but we thought it was cool when we could get a new game for a buck. We didn't realize a crash was going on.

[Gatt]

I was pretty young,  I remember the poor quality high profile games (Pac-man,  ET) on the 2600.  I remember cartridges suddenly becoming cheap.  I guess I was too young to realize the flow of new games just stopped.

A couple of years later,  the C64 hit the scene,  and did quite well.  TBH,  the "Crash" really wasn't all that noticeable IMO.  I'd argue that what's happening right now is a far bigger crash than 1983.

[ahofle]

I honestly don't remember noticing anything.  Even after the 'crash' there were still about 20 times as many arcades around as there are now.  I only remember a couple of small arcades in strip malls closing down, but they were still everywhere else (restaurants, malls, family entertainment places, etc.  I actually think there were a number of good games produced during those years (mid to late eighties).  Atari System 1 and 2 comes to mind.

[mgb]

I don't really remember even knowing there was a crash at the time. I was 10 in 83 and I didn't even realize that pacman for the 2600 sucked. we played and we enjoyed it.
And through 84 and 85 we went on playing games and loving them.
I still remember being introduced to Jumpman on my friends c64 and I think that even if all other games went away, I would be fine as long as I can play Jumpman.

[wp34]

I remember very distinctly sitting in my room the first time I fired up Donkey Kong on the Colecovision and thinking now I can stop bugging my parents to take me to the Nickelodeon Arcade.  Of course I did keep bugging them.   

We still had several thriving arcades into the early 90's in this area so I really didn't notice a "crash".  The main thing I noticed was a glut of fighting games.  But that was a bit of a golden age for pinball so I played a lot of pinball in college.

[mgb]

Remember though the crash was in 83 and things started coming back up after nes and things were going pretty well with the fighters in the 90s

[SavannahLion]

It's funny- I saw the same thing as SavannahLion, but we thought it was cool when we could get a new game for a buck. We didn't realize a crash was going on.

Don't get me wrong, I thought it was cool. I just wasn't smart enough to suck those games up like a 80's cocaine addict. With the introduction of eBay and the retro-demand for some of those games, I would have easily made back the money and then some.

It was so  bad, I was once offered a full office-sized box of choice 2600/7800 games for free. I didn't have either at the time so I turned it down. 

[yotsuya]

Don't get me wrong, I thought it was cool. I just wasn't smart enough to suck those games up like a 80's cocaine addict.

It was so  bad, I was once offered a full office-sized box of choice 2600/7800 games for free. I didn't have either at the time so I turned it down. 

There was a kiosk at a long-since bulldozed mall that sold Atari games for a great deal. I remember getting Moon Patrol for $4. I got my $4 out of that sucker that very day, and then some. I also picked up Real Sports Baseball for a buck, and that was a great sports game.

We got games like Chopper Command, Kangaroo, Battlezone, Frogs & Flies, Activision Skiing and so on for $0.50 EACH at a long-since demolished Revco. Of course, we also picked up turds like Swordquest, so what did we know.

[RandyT]

I don't know... I've heard an awful lot of griping from oldsters about how Atari kept releasing the same games every 2 years on a new system and abandoning the old one.  Factual or not, it was a popular sentiment.

I guess I am technically an "oldster", and never had that particular gripe.  I had plenty of gripes, just not that one.  Technology was advancing rapidly at that time.  Once market demand was established, and the example of what a successful home gaming console looked and acted like was easily observed, the big corporate players of the time tried to outdo one another.  Every new technological advancement led to advances in the games for the systems, and eventually, new systems.  It was all about jockeying for market position.  Companies like Atari had a rough time of it.  Consumers were not ready to accept that investments in expensive gaming systems, and the games, would so quickly dwindle in value.  They expected the games to get better for the systems they already owned, not realizing the technical limitations.  Enterprising 3rd party developers learned ways to squeeze more from the 2600 than even the designers realized was possible.  Eventually, 1st party titles caught up and this kept consumers happy...and the system alive longer.  But there was a downside.  Games which pushed the system required more development time, and the bean counters didn't like that one bit.  Focus was placed on selling games through marketing techniques (E.T. anyone?), and getting them on the shelves quickly.  3rd party developers started crawling out of the woodwork, and the consumers, hungry for new games, bought a lot of really poor ones, which lead to a loss of faith in the marketplace.  They couldn't even rely on 1st party titles to be safe bets, because they had been burned a number of times by them as well.  Even those who had moved on to other systems saw poor support in the way of new titles, poorly performing control implementations, short system life and high costs.   The loss of faith and consumer uncertainty was responsible for a large percentage of the mainstream market giving up on the idea entirely.  With the 7800, Atari sought to bring those consumers back into the fold through backward compatibility with the 2600, but it was too late.

The hardcore gamers of the time welcomed every new version of the arcade classics, as each one brought them closer to the true arcade experience.  But there just weren't enough of those folks to sustain the market.  Most of those folks eventually turned to computer gaming, with primarily the C-64 and eventually Amiga computers filling the void until Nintendo and Sega made console gaming attractive to a new mainstream gaming market.

Honestly, I could see it all when it was happening, and happily bought discounted systems and games when the bottom fell out.  I paid attention to magazines (the only real source of information at the time) and knew which to avoid.  The aftermath was a great time for true enthusiasts with little money to spend.

It's a different world today, and developers who put out garbage aren't able to get away with it as easily as they could back then.  An educated and informed marketplace, which holds developers and system makers to higher standards, and an ingrained acceptance of eventual obsolescence as a condition of participating in, what is now, a very common pastime, is what is responsible for keeping a crash of the same magnitude from occurring today.

[chiLLbiLLy]

Like most others, I didn't realize at the time when games were being marked down, that it was a "crash".  In fact, I've always pinned the crash more as 1984, rather than 1983.  I don't recall seeing the extreme markdowns on home console cartridges until at least a few months into 1984.  But I was thrilled at the time to be able to pick up Colecovision games for $5 bucks a pop, rather than the usual $30 to $40.

And, I don't really recall seeing much difference in the arcades at all.  Sure, a few of the lessers ones folded up eventually by 1985, but most of the ones in my area, at that time (Arlington, Texas) were going strong, well into the late 80's and early 90's.  Now if you want to talk quality of the arcade games, that's another story, but that's probably more personal preference than anything.  Needless to say, pinball certainly kept going strong throughout the 80's and well into the 90's, once the arcades really started to falter.  But honestly, I never knew there was really a "video game crash", until many years after the fact.

[alfonzotan]

It didn't really look like a crash if you were a teenager... the arcades stayed open for many years afterwards (there was still a well-stocked Alladin's Castle at the mall when I started college in 1987, and plenty of games in pool halls, student unions, etc.).  As for console games, they got a lot cheaper, which was great from a kid's perspective.  I remember buying a Starpath Supercharger and most of the games available for it for a total of maybe $15--at a retail store, not a garage sale.

In the business, I'm sure it looked like a real crash that happened all at once.  Out in the sticks, it was slow-motion.  Atari just fell out of favor thanks to being old technology with a stuffed supply of redundant games (from Atari and the other software vendors as well).  Intellivision and ColecoVision software died on the vine (sadly) pretty quickly, though.  But lots of people just shifted over to computers for their games in the interim between Atari and Nintendo.

[vanrose72]

I was 7 in '83 and I didn't even realize that E.T. for the 2600 sucked.

I had a deep collection of other Atari carts to dig through, too, so I stayed fairly occupied.

[Haze]

I guess it was a very american thing, growing up in the 80s over here in the UK I'd say if anything it was the best / most exciting period for games and computing I've known.  Had my classic 8-bit computer systems as a kid, massive selection of cheap but good games from a large range of publishers, machines where if you tinkered enough with them and were willing to put in the effort you could create stuff on par with what was in the shops etc. (which is exactly what people were doing)  There was strong competition and you lived or died by the quality of your games.

I'm sure there was a crash, but IMHO the reasons given are bogus, and were simply used to force stuff like the NES lockout chips upon us which weren't about 'protecting the consumer from crap games to avoid another crash' but more about locking out cheap competition and keeping prices high so that money could be squandered on big budget projects with no consequence.

You're seeing the same now tho, the medium to big studios are struggling, and trying to sell games for £40 on a mobile gaming device when you can pick up just as playable, just as fun and twice as original indie games / apps for £2 on a phone just doesn't work so I kinda expect another 'crash' any day now.

[Trip]

I'm sure there was a crash, but IMHO the reasons given are bogus, and were simply used to force stuff like the NES lockout chips upon us which weren't about 'protecting the consumer from crap games to avoid another crash' but more about locking out cheap competition and keeping prices high so that money could be squandered on big budget projects with no consequence.

There was definitely a crash in the USA and it had nothing to do with NES.  You could say NES resurrected the video game industry because they werent even around in the US when this happened and they got the market profitable again, which is why they protected themselves with stuff like lockout chips and only allowing 3rd party companies to a few games a year.

The industry went from 3 billion dollars a year to 100 million a year.  Stores started refusing to sell video games because they were losing money badly on stock they couldn't move.  Nintendo had a hell of a time getting them to start carrying them again.

A lot of knockoffs, overproduction, too fast turnover of next gen consoles, very low sales, combined with terrible games made the US consumer stop buying them.

[Necro]

I was 5 and loving the Atari 2600 we had just gotten maybe a year before...so...zero effect on me.  They still sold games in Toys R Us and Kiddie City, and I remember getting one game that came with an extra keypad (a space shooter thing) that was just WAY too complicated for me at that age that we returned.  I think I got Taz or something else that I ended up loving. 

Given, I didn't get a NES until near the end of it's life-cycle though.

[SavannahLion]

Trip, Nintendo has been making (card) games since 1889, Sony wasn't even established until 1946. Nintendo most certainly had an existence in the U.S. at that time, I have Nintendo carts for the 2600 as the proof.

[mgb]

Yeah maybe Trip is wrong about nintendo having no presence in the us in 83. We know because we were all playing DK. But he's still correct about how it went down with a market flooded with crap games that wouldn't sell. And Nintendo bassically did save the day with the nes.
But the crash wasn't some kind of corperate conspiricy in order to lockout programmers and all that. And even though Nintendo has been around for over a hundred years. They wernt in the us market all that time until the videogame craze.

[Trip]

Trip, Nintendo has been making (card) games since 1889, Sony wasn't even established until 1946. Nintendo most certainly had an existence in the U.S. at that time, I have Nintendo carts for the 2600 as the proof.

Didn't spell it out clear enough, sorry.  Nintendo as a company had stuff here, but the NES didn't appear til 85 in the US.  Like October 85 for the holiday season if I remember right.  Famicom came out in Japan in like 83 though.  I meant to say NES wasn't around in 83.  Nintendo was definitely in the states before that.

[SavannahLion]

I've always wondered about that mgb. The U.S. had a reasonably sized Asian population whom the U.S. threw in to "camps" during WWII. Nintendo didn't have a regional office here then but how many of their cards were imported into the country?  American troops often carried playing cards wherever they went, I just find it astonishing Japanese immigrants would not have done the same.

@Trip, that's a better statement.

[yotsuya]

They still sold games in Toys R Us and Kiddie City, and I remember getting one game that came with an extra keypad (a space shooter thing) that was just WAY too complicated for me at that age that we returned.

Star Raiders for life, yo!

[Necro]

Yeah.  I regretted returning it a few months later.

[yotsuya]

I STILL have a boxed Star Raiders in my shed. I loved that game, although it all honesty, it really didn't need the keypad.

There's an Activision game called Starmaster that was the same basic game without the maps that was just as fun.

And I know I was just a dumb kid who loved everything Atari/video game related, but I loved playing Pac-Man on the 2600. I was surprised recently when I read that the game was criticized when it came out.  As a kid, I never had the expectation that the Atari version of any game would look as good as the arcade version- maybe that's why it didn't bother me as much? 

Confession: Once I learned that E.T. was a puzzle game and not an action/adventure game, I enjoyed the heck out of it.

[Ravenger]

Here in the UK we didn't really have a video game crash. What happened instead was the rise of low cost microcomputers like the Sinclair ZX81 and Spectrum, (sold as the Timex/Sinclair 1000 and 2000 in the US), Commodore VIC 20 and C64, which rapidly took over from the VCS, Intellivision and other consoles.

The games were cheaper as they were on cassete tape, and you had the excuse that your parents would buy you a computer for 'educational use' but you ended up playing games on it all the time anyway! One of the reasons the UK became one of the major producers of video game software is that kids experimented with the machines and made their own games.

The NES didn't get much of a look-in. It wasn't until the SNES and Megadrive that console gaming became popular again.

I worked in a computer store in the early 80's, selling Atari 8 Bit, MSX, VCS, Intellivision, Colecovision, Vectrex and later the Atari ST computers. I remember when the order came down to discount all the Vectrex machines and software as MB was pulling out of video games. My boss at the time said that in the US it was a flop because it was considered by the markets as 'too expensive for a hand-held toy'.  My biggest regret was being on a minimal wage at the time which meant I couldn't afford to buy any of the Vectrexes or games. It's one of my all-time favourite machines (I love vector games) and I completely missed my chance of getting a machine and the entire catalogue for a cheap price. 

[Thenasty]

Did not really notice. I just got myself the C64 (seen the a2600 graphics, ewww.) cause graphics was better.

This is when I got addicted to COPYing    (any1 remember RENEGADE for C64 ?)

[Arimack]

  I never owned an Atari 2600 as a child because parents could not afford it back then.  I did have friends who owned either it or an Atari 400 when they first came out.  I played a ton of it because there was nothing else other than going to a real arcade. 
  My main experience during the crash was that my family finally got a system to play video games on thanks to Texas Instruments.  My folks bought a TI-99/4A for Christmas that year thanks to a $100 rebate that let us buy it for $99 on sale at Sears.  It ended up being orphaned that next year during the crash, 1983.  I think we had five games for it.  Great choice Mom and Dad!
  But as for gaming, my friends who had the Ataris quickly moved on to the Commodore 64 around that time. For the next five years or so, we played exclusively on the Commodore.  I went to college in 1987 and took my Commodore with me.   I was not really too aware of Nintendo in college (I think most people my age thought of it as a kids system).  Then I ended up buying a Sega Genesis in 1990 (the adult system as it was marketed then!) 
  So I think the crash was not really that noticeable to most kids at the time.  Atari 2600/Coleco/Intellivision just became old hat and went to the bargain bin.  No one was playing them anymore.  We did not really pay attention to the economics of the thing.  Honestly, it just became the old system and there was better stuff out there.  There were not a lot of dedicated video game stores out there so it disappeared from the catalog for Sears and JC Penny and new stuff replaced it.  I mean who wanted to play a bad copy of PacMan on the 2600 when you could play UltimaIV/Beachhead/Impossible Mission/Archon/etc on a Commodore....with the same controls plus a keyboard!
  I think most of us did not notice that everything got so cheap because we were all looking at the next shiny thing on the screen and did not notice the crash.  Plus we still had video arcades to go to!

[RandyT]

I STILL have a boxed Star Raiders in my shed. I loved that game, although it all honesty, it really didn't need the keypad.

When I finally scraped together enough money for an Atari 400 (my first actual computer), Star Raiders and Pac-Man were the two games I ordered with it.  When I first booted Star Raiders, I was in heaven, and Pac Man, compared to the 2600 version, was fantastic.  It was that moment I knew what the future held and my quarters started flowing toward buying games, instead of into the arcades (well...some quarters still went to the arcades, just not as many  )

Here in the UK we didn't really have a video game crash. What happened instead was the rise of low cost microcomputers like the Sinclair ZX81 and Spectrum, (sold as the Timex/Sinclair 1000 and 2000 in the US), Commodore VIC 20 and C64, which rapidly took over from the VCS, Intellivision and other consoles.

I lived in Germany (stationed there by the US Army) from late '83 to '87.  I have to say, it was the same there.  Consoles just didn't have the same following as they did in the US, and arcades never took off to the same extent.  But it was a great time to be there, as it seemed that folks weren't just playing games, but getting very involved in development of both hardware and software, at the smallest of scales.  I still remember riding a train to a city hours away to buy an inexpensive MIDI interface kit from a guy who had designed his own and was selling them from his small apartment.  There were a lot of items out there you had to know someone, who knew someone else, in order to find.  Different days.

[yotsuya]

I STILL have a boxed Star Raiders in my shed. I loved that game, although it all honesty, it really didn't need the keypad.

When I finally scraped together enough money for an Atari 400 (my first actual computer), Star Raiders and Pac-Man were the two games I ordered with it.  When I first booted Star Raiders, I was in heaven, and Pac Man, compared to the 2600 version, was fantastic.  It was that moment I knew what the future held and my quarters started flowing toward buying games, instead of into the arcades (well...some quarters still went to the arcades, just not as many  )

So when can we expect the USB Groovy StarRaidersWiz??? I'd like to preorder. 

[PL1]

So when can we expect the USB Groovy StarRaidersWiz??? I'd like to preorder. 

I don't know if Randy's got anything in the development pipeline, but Degenatron is talking seriously about adding keypad support to his KADE/AVR encoder. (Matrix encoder support)  Atari 2600 keypad support is at the top of the layout list I compiled for him.


Scott

[RandyT]

If you have 5 buttons on your panel, that's enough for the 2600 version.  No need for a special keypad controller, unless you really want one.  The 400 version has about 21 buttons for controlling the game, so you might as well use a keyboard for that one.

[Necro]

Well, you and someone else get on that.  Not so much because we need the product, but I want to see a thread where you and someone else debate whose pad is better and why. 

[Trip]

Well, you and someone else get on that.  Not so much because we need the product, but I want to see a thread where you and someone else debate whose pad is better and why. 

hahahhaahha lol

[PL1]

Well, you and someone else get on that.  Not so much because we need the product, but I want to see a thread where you and someone else debate whose pad is better and why. 

LOL.  Haven't seen a good Randy vs. Andy knock-down-drag-out thread in a while. 

The reason I asked Degenatron about matrix encoder support is because Tony Silveira is adding flipover keypads on his system.  When DaOld Man looked at the keypads that Tony was planning on using, he noticed that they needed a matrix encoder.  When I looked around, the only ones I could find were Hagstrom (very expensive) or one made by a flight sim guy.    Tony ended up buying new keypads that don't require a matrix encoder.

I know that matrix encoders suck for most gaming applications because of the ghosting issues with multiple button presses, but they are useful for some functions like some of the old console controllers (Atari 2600/5200, ColecoVision, Intellivision, etc.), jukeboxes, or maybe even the infamous Sundance.


[/thread derail]


Scott

[RandyT]

Or one could just buy this, or any of the many like it,  and call it a day. 

There's a reason why keypads built into controllers went the way of the dodo.  With the notable exception of Star Raiders, there weren't enough games to justify the purchase, and controllers like those sold with the ColecoVision and Intellivision, were almost universally panned by players.  Nothing is less fun than holding onto something you don't need, while knowing it's inclusion just made the controller more difficult to use.  One of the first things I did after getting my ColecoVision was run wires to the joystick (term used loosely) PCB, drilled a hole in the back and mounted them to the surface of my arcade panel.  Used a WICO leaf arcade stick instead.

And just to keep this on topic, I'll add keypads to the list of things which contributed to the video game crash of '83 

[ark_ader]

My main experience during the crash was that my family finally got a system to play video games on thanks to Texas Instruments.  My folks bought a TI-99/4A for Christmas that year thanks to a $100 rebate that let us buy it for $99 on sale at Sears.  It ended up being orphaned that next year during the crash, 1983.  I think we had five games for it.  Great choice Mom and Dad!

I got a TI 99/4A too with the $100 rebate, and got the tape cassette player with the change.  Spent all summer working at my Dad's shop saving up for the Expansion box with a floppy, CPM and voice box.  I just loved that computer.  1983 crash wasn't that big a deal.  I know Sega Centers were being bought out by Time Out, but every arcade in Los Angeles was in full swing.  Things started to taper off in 1988 and we started seeing arcade machines selling for $200-400.  About the time the NES started getting all the attention.

Yeah the 2600 cartridges were selling at $59.00 (Donkey Kong for example)  in 1983 but the year later you could go to Toys R Us and buy a bunch for $20.  About the same time Dinky Toys made by Mecanno was going out of business and I was buying up all their old stock for $5 a toy.  Now they go for $300.  I wonder how much that ET 2600 cartridge is worth today?  I remember my best 2600 cartridge: The Empire Strikes Back.  That game was so cool.  Yars too.

[alfonzotan]

They still sold games in Toys R Us and Kiddie City, and I remember getting one game that came with an extra keypad (a space shooter thing) that was just WAY too complicated for me at that age that we returned.

Star Raiders for life, yo!

Word.  Maybe the best ported game ever on the 2600 (it originated on the Atari 8-bit computers).

[teeuwen]

I bought a Ti 99/4a at a garage sale for like $20 in 1992ish.  Turns out there was quite a weird and vibrant collector community in Dallas and they had figured out how to install hard drives and such.  I guess someone wrote a word processing program that allowed you to save files on a diskette and take them back and forth with another program on a DOS computer.  Recall them insisting you were basically getting a 286 computer for virtually nothing.

Who knows... but it was kind of fun to tinker with.

My first computer was a Ti 99/4a, the delorian of computers with its stainless steels case elements. I bought mine in 1998, it had the voice expansion module i believe aswell, I never had a computer growing up and though i had used better computer previous to owning the ti 99/4a and owned a Nintendo and a super nintendo previously to owning the Ti 99/4a it was my first computer, full keyboard and all, i believe i was 12 or 13 at the time when i bought it from a friends garage sale, i think i paid $20 aswell.

The Ti 99/4a's life ended pretty roughly though, the short of the long story would envolve my dad getting mad at me for something and then proceeding to shot put my ti 99 and tv monitor off our patio and over the fence into the back alley.

I would love to get another one though!

[Namco]

At my house we got an Odyssey 2, so no cheap $1 games for us. We had to drive up to Zody's department store to pick out a new game for $39.99. If there was a bargain bin full of games, I never saw one. But then again my parents weren't all that excited about taking us out to spend money on home video games consoles. 

Then one day we heard that the Odyssey was discontinued and that was it. I do recall seeing all the Atari clones appearing in TV commercials and remember being confused by it all and noticing the drop in quality of the games. The rift between arcade graphics and Atari clone graphics was huge and widening. I was happy just going with my parents to the bowling lanes where I could play real arcade games.  I remember seeing Pac-Man coming out and laughing at how much it the graphics sucked. We were playing K.C. Munchkin at home and having a blast.

It would be a few years later before the NES came out and upon seeing how arcade perfect Super Mario Bros. was, practically literally BEGGED my mother to buy us one.

[dfmaverick]

I like looking at the old Sears & Wards Christmas catalogs. I'm thankful for the scans by someone on the 'net to provide a remembrance of my youth. (Oddly enough, I was going through the scans and suddenly I had that distinctive wet paper smell of the catalogs in my head...weird)

Here's a sample of some of the 2600 games. You can see them starting to slash prices for Christmas '83 and the low prices ($5) of many games in '84.

Sears 1982
Sears 1983
Wards 1984