question about speaker position?

[shateredsoul]

So I'm working off Knievel's woody build



and this is what my friend said (the guy who's helping me build the cabinet), It's not an

"putting the speakers in the top firing down to the floor is awful in terms of sound quality for an adult sized person (because the sound comes at you almost 90 degrees from the forward axis of the speaker), but it does appear to be the arcade norm. Having them fire towards you from the marquee panel would be much better, but i understand you might not like that. just something to think about. i suggest we dismantle the subwoofer and install it in the top, between the other two speakers. it can fire downwards regardless of how the left and right speakers are placed."

Opinon's thoughts? Any other ideas of where to place the speakers?

[Samstag]

I angled my monitor panel down and added a panel between the monitor and marquee for the speakers.  So they're pointing right at the player.

I left the subwoofer out because the cheap mains I'm using are already way better than a classic cabinet needs.

[shateredsoul]

I angled my monitor panel down and added a panel between the monitor and marquee for the speakers.  So they're pointing right at the player.

I left the subwoofer out because the cheap mains I'm using are already way better than a classic cabinet needs.

Cool, I want to keep the subwoofer in.. I think he suggested a good spot for the subwoofer, but I'm just worried that the speakers are going to look weird if they are on the marquee area (and would mean the marque will not cover the whole area and needs to slide in from the top.

[nitz]

I have my speakers behind the marquee and facing outward. I decided to do that partly because it let me avoid making speaker holes and partly because I plan on putting jukebox software on it and I think having the speakers facing the floor would likely suck for that. Not very authentic, but it sounds "normal" to me when playing games, and should be better for sending the sound out into the room for when I play music on it.

[shateredsoul]

Oh nice, and does the fact that your speakers are behind the marquee affect the clarity of the sounds? I don't want it to sound muffled (as if they were behind a wall or something.

I have my speakers behind the marquee and facing outward. I decided to do that partly because it let me avoid making speaker holes and partly because I plan on putting jukebox software on it and I think having the speakers facing the floor would likely suck for that. Not very authentic, but it sounds "normal" to me when playing games, and should be better for sending the sound out into the room for when I play music on it.

[nitz]

It sounds just fine to me.

Perhaps I should point out here though that I am using middle of the road PC speakers, play mostly classics where the sound was not as "dynamic" let's say, I haven't tried it with the jukebox software yet, and am not really an audiophile.

But yeah, it definitely doesn't sound muffled or like it's behind a wall or anything like that.

I suggest trying it out before you actually go to a lot of work mounting the speakers and such. Depending on how much you care about sound quality, what kind of speakers you have, and what kind of cabinet you have, your mileage may vary.

[shateredsoul]

Cool I'll give it a try before we set it up to see how it sounds, thanks for the suggestion!

[leapinlew]

"putting the speakers in the top firing down to the floor is awful in terms of sound quality for an adult sized person (because the sound comes at you almost 90 degrees from the forward axis of the speaker), but it does appear to be the arcade norm. Having them fire towards you from the marquee panel would be much better, but i understand you might not like that. just something to think about. i suggest we dismantle the subwoofer and install it in the top, between the other two speakers. it can fire downwards regardless of how the left and right speakers are placed."

blech... these kinds of guys annoy me. They think your trying to create stereophonic 19.1 sound or some crap. Your playing Galaga or Street Fighter. Neither of which had great sound to start with. How important is it then?

I've placed the speakers in a variety of locations from under the marquee, on the control panel and underneath the cab (bartop). They all sound fine. The only thing I would recommend as an upgrade is ensuring you use a subwoofer.

[shateredsoul]

Yeah I'm using a subwoofer.. yeah he's an audiophile, but that's going to be helpful in this situation since I also want it to double as a jukebox. I won't just have 80's games, I have up to 2004 for arcade games, nintendo wii games, dreamcast, gamecube, ps2, and pc games (such as split second, blur, and code of honor). Sure some console games don't fully integrate, but that's why I have my xbox 360 controllers and the xbox 360 guitar.

This is my first cab.. so it's going to be a monster that includes too many things.  Like everyone else I know I'll probably learn that including everything was a bad idea, but that's why people build a second and third cab right ?

I guess it's more like a game center than a arcade alone.  The only thing I don't have are movies. 

[shfifty]

I wouldnt worry about the position, i would just mount them in the normal position. It wont make that much of a noticeable difference.

i suggest we dismantle the subwoofer and install it in the top, between the other two speakers. it can fire downwards regardless of how the left and right speakers are placed."

I would highly recommend leaving the sub in its original enclosure. Subwoofer enclosures are specially designed according to the sub specifications to get the maximum efficiency. Taking the sub out of its enclosure could actually make it sound really crappy. And being a subwoofer, it generates low frequency waves which are omni-directional unlike your satellite speakers  and penetrate most surfaces. So it shouldnt really matter where you put the sub, i just leave mine in the bottom of my cab and it sounds fine 

[Edwards80]

I placed the speakers behind my marquee to see if it sounded muffled. It sounds fine to me.

I'm sure someone who will turn their nose up at listening to anything less than FLAC on a £1500 set of headphones would moan, sounds fine to me though!

[DashRendar]

I have 4.1 PC speakers in my cab.

Front-Left and Front-Right speakers are in the marquee overhang, facing down.  They don't interfere with the marquee light.

The sub is on the floor inside my cab.

The Back-Left and Back-Right speakers are mounted below the monitor, in the part of the cab just before the control panel.

I run multiple emulators and DW Jukebox on mine.  Not sure if any of that utilizes surround sound, but I do get sound out of all 4 speakers, which sounds good coming from 4 points in the cab.

[shateredsoul]

that sounds pretty good dash, do you have a thread for your cab?

I might be able to do something similar to yours.. and just put the center speaker right behind the marquee.

Hmm.. I didn't know that about sub-woofers, maybe he knows something I dont? He's built cases for his own subwoofers before.. we'll we're suppose to go buy the wood and other supplies tomorrow. I'll talk about it with him.

[BadMouth]

Actually, the best possible sound would be obtained by mounting the speakers at ear level, pointing directly at your ears, & equal distance from your ears. (assuming that the speakers were designed to be used "on-axis".  Most computer speakers are. Most car speakers are not.)  Having the subwoofer equal distance from your ears would also keep the sound from "smearing" around the crossover point, but that is getting way too picky for an arcade cab IMHO.

As far as music goes, is it important that the jukebox sound amazing for exactly one person, standing directly in front of it. 
I can't see myself standing in the sweet spot in front of an arcade machine, just to listen to music (unless maybe I'm playing games at the same time).

I'd put the arcade speakers where arcade speakers go & run another line out to a home stereo receiver with speakers placed high on the walls around the room  (think nightclub or bar).  Keep the arcade experience an arcade experience & the jukebox experience be an experience for everyone.

That being said, I was very picky when I mounted the speakers in my driving cab.  They are at ear level.
It does give an extra "immersive" quality to the experience.
But then again, that's where the original speakers were on the cab I used (Virtual-On...same cab as Daytona USA)


Experiment, experiment, experiment!

[shateredsoul]

Oh man.. too many choices 

My friend was big on having the speakers at ear level  or at least facing the player, when I asked him about mounting the other speakers he told me to wall mount them, but ... then you can see the wires.  I guess that's not too bad,  but let's say I do something like that (2 on the cab and subwoofer on the cab).. I can mount the 2 rear speakers, and then what do I do with the center speaker?  Put it underneath the monitor for kids? Implant it into a stool?

I also asked if he had any ideas of whether a 15" monitor would fit in there.. he said underneath the monitor.  He already went and drew upmeasurements for for my monitor and so it could hold my cp (my cp is larger than this one... a lot larger). So my cab will be wider because my monitor is wider (especially if you include the light gun sensors).

[Alpha17X]

Old arcade games didn't have to care about good sound, because their sound sucked, really badly. And that was okay. But some of the later games, particularly in the mid to late 90s had some really impressive sound and sound systems. It makes sense to orient them as best as possible. And in a custom cabinet that isn't dependant on mass production requirements, why not take that extra step?

[BadMouth]

You don't have to use the center speaker.  If it matches the others, keep it as a spare.

I don't think there are any MAME titles in 5.1 surround.  
(If someone proves me wrong, I will be in awe)

Experiment with your current speakers.
You are building the cab for yourself.
Do what gives you the experience YOU are looking for.

[eds1275]

I would personally install them in the admin panel if you are using one. If not, and there is space, in the bezel. If there isn't enough room, do the marquee thing. Or add some ears to your cab and put them in there. If your cab already has a wingspan due to the control panel, adding some more sticky-outey bits could be done nicely. Behold my 30 second ms paint skillz!!!

[shateredsoul]

I would personally install them in the admin panel if you are using one. If not, and there is space, in the bezel. If there isn't enough room, do the marquee thing. Or add some ears to your cab and put them in there. If your cab already has a wingspan due to the control panel, adding some more sticky-outey bits could be done nicely. Behold my 30 second ms paint skillz!!!

Great ideas (and painting)! I do want to remind people that I will have some of the newer systems and pc games and will be using it as a jukebox, so the sound does matter for my arcade 

[Alpha17X]

You don't have to use the center speaker.  If it matches the others, keep it as a spare.

I don't think there are any MAME titles in 5.1 surround.  
(If someone proves me wrong, I will be in awe)

Experiment with your current speakers.
You are building the cab for yourself.
Do what gives you the experience YOU are looking for.

Not in MAME, but there are plenty of non-mame games that are arcade cabinet worthy that do use more. On the other hand though. I find that a soundbar covers all the bases very nicely.

[Samstag]

Here's a (bad) pic showing how I mounted mine.  I got some speaker cloth on Ebay to cover the panel.

[shateredsoul]

Here's a (bad) pic showing how I mounted mine.  I got some speaker cloth on Ebay to cover the panel.

hmm very nice! Trogdor! I like the theme.. are you going to add some more strongbad art?

[Samstag]

Here's a (bad) pic showing how I mounted mine.  I got some speaker cloth on Ebay to cover the panel.

hmm very nice! Trogdor! I like the theme.. are you going to add some more strongbad art?

Someday.  I have the side art from Strongbad's original Trogdor cabinet (from one of the cartoons) but I need to clean it up a lot before it'll be useable.  Not to mention I need to paint the cabinet.

[92greenyj]

In the Pac-Man cab I am converting, the speaker (6x9) is positioned above the screen firing down into the monitor area. A fair amount of the games in my work arcade are set up this way as well. However some have the speakers aimed at you, I find these to actually be too loud for me a lot of the times though.

[HanoiBoi]

It sounds a bit like your helper is trying to drive the build.  It's nice that he has opinions and offers his suggestions, but the angle ot the speakers won't make that much of a difference for you to want to compromise the aesthetics of your cab.

I would also suggest keeping the sub in tact.  Subwoofers move air.  They need the case that they're in.

You say that this thing will do everything short of playing movies (which would be an easy add).  While that's neat, personally I would keep it simple.  Or, do all that stuff...but don't do it in an arcade cabinet.

For those who also use their cabinets as jukeboxes.....can you (do you) utilize both at the same time?  Like, can you have the juke kicking and also be playing your games?  If not, I don't see the point.

I'm curious to know if you've figured out your control panel setup.  If speaker mounting is a tough choice, wait until you have to design your CP.

[Thenasty]

here are my speaks placement.

One on top underneat the marquee, and one inside above the lower monitor.
Left the Sub inside.

[shateredsoul]

hmmm interesting, why do you have 2 monitors? one for vertical games? I ask because I have an extra monitor

here are my speaks placement.

One on top underneat the marquee, and one inside above the lower monitor.
Left the Sub inside.