Medium res 25hz games (Paperboy, Championship Sprint etc.) on WG D9800?

[dekar24k]

I have a question for those with a WG D9800 (or equal) monitor; what resolution do you run medium res 25hz games at (Paperboy, 720, Championship Sprint etc.)?

AVRes set those games to 512x448 and they flicker like mad. I get a headache after playing for 30 seconds. I really want to play Championship Sprint as it's a really cool game.

[isucamper]

I can't remember what resolution I have them at (I'll fire up the cab and check this weekend for you) but I do know that medium res games don't look good on my 9800.  It doesn't seem to like the signals in this range.  I don't get flicker, but the games have an hourglass shape to them I can't tweak out with the OSD controls. 

I'm very happy with the monitor, but it definitely has a weakness in this area.

[dekar24k]

I can't remember what resolution I have them at (I'll fire up the cab and check this weekend for you) but I do know that medium res games don't look good on my 9800.  It doesn't seem to like the signals in this range.  I don't get flicker, but the games have an hourglass shape to them I can't tweak out with the OSD controls. 

I'm very happy with the monitor, but it definitely has a weakness in this area.

Hmm .. The reason I'm asking is because I read a review (don't remember the URL) where it said that the D9800 looked awesome in 25hz med-res games. Anyways, I appreciate that you'll take a look. Thanks!

Oh and while you're at it, do you mind checking what you've set your vertical games to as well (newer games like Aero Fighters etc.)? Bomb Jack and older vertical games are working great but I haven't figured out what res to set the others at yet without hw stretch or cutting off too much of the game.

[MonMotha]

Medium Res aka EGA is usually in the neighborhood of 512x384 progressive.  Standard Res aka CGA is either ~320x240 progressive or 640x480 interlaced.  Some games have a resolution vs. refresh tradeoff (higher resolution means lower refresh and more flicker).  Exact resolution used varies by game.

512x448 seems unusually high and a strange pixel aspect ratio (though those are not unheard of with arcade games).  I kinda wonder if perhaps you've chosen a CGA compatible resolution and are software scaling.  That resolution at CGA would be interlaced which might explain the flicker.  If it's progressive EGA compatible timings, it would be at a low framerate, which might also explain the flickering.

[ahofle]

Definitely 512x384

[dekar24k]

Thanks for all the advice guys. I will try setting it to 512x384 now and see if it looks better!

[dekar24k]

I tried 512x384 and it looked awesome, except for one small flaw. I couldn't quite center the image the way I wanted to (I couldn't move the image to the left or right with the OSD functions, only resize it). Are you guys experiencing this as well with your D9800's?

[isucamper]

I'm running 512x384 for 720, narc, and paperboy and i'm running 496x384 for virtua fighter.  VF looks great on my monitor, but the other three have the weird hour glass shape that I've complained about in the past.  Even the MK games have it (which I run at 399x253) but its not as bad.  I can't get rid of it by tweaking the controls.  All other resolutions look great which is why I haven't complained too loudly about this. 



And yes, I can't seem to center the 512x384 games either.  Do you get the hour glass shape?  I also get pretty bad warping during paperboy as the screen scrolls.  I'm using soft15KHz by the way. 

[secret80sman]

Have you tried the individual screen adjustment controls within the game itself instead of just on the OSD? I have a 9800 but have yet to play these games. Still trying to pull myself away from Frenzy and Amidar (my faves this week). 

[dekar24k]

I'm running 512x384 for 720, narc, and paperboy and i'm running 496x384 for virtua fighter.  VF looks great on my monitor, but the other three have the weird hour glass shape that I've complained about in the past.  Even the MK games have it (which I run at 399x253) but its not as bad.  I can't get rid of it by tweaking the controls.  All other resolutions look great which is why I haven't complained too loudly about this.  



And yes, I can't seem to center the 512x384 games either.  Do you get the hour glass shape?  I also get pretty bad warping during paperboy as the screen scrolls.  I'm using soft15KHz by the way.  

Same happens to me, weird hour glass shape which I can't get rid of with the OSD. The MK games look great though, can't remember having trouble with those.

Also, I haven't played Paperboy alot yet, so don't know about warping. As long as I can play Championship Sprint then I'll be happy.

[dekar24k]

Have you tried the individual screen adjustment controls within the game itself instead of just on the OSD? I have a 9800 but have yet to play these games. Still trying to pull myself away from Frenzy and Amidar (my faves this week). 

Haven't tried it, but I don't think it'll work as the screen/image itself can't be moved to the right at all. So there's something about the resolution that the D9800 don't like.

[wp34]

Might be a dumb question but would an older version of Mame be worth a try?

I'm hoping to order a DG9800 as soon as I get my taxes done.     I would love to see this problem resolved first but don't see this as a show stopper.

[dekar24k]

Might be a dumb question but would an older version of Mame be worth a try?

I'm hoping to order a DG9800 as soon as I get my taxes done.     I would love to see this problem resolved first but don't see this as a show stopper.

I don't think it has to do with MAME, rather how the D9800 handles the 512x384 resolution. I don't see it as a "problem" though, as the picture looks great and there's only a slight percentage of the right side of the screen which is not covered by it.

[ahofle]

Seems like pincushion should at least help minimize that a little bit.  Does it not help?

[isucamper]

Seems like pincushion should at least help minimize that a little bit.  Does it not help?

It does help but there's always that buldge that won't go away.  And you'll notice in the screenshot I posted, the bottom of the picture is angleing in and the top is angleing out.  Pincushion won't bring them both in.  I have messed extenstively with the controls to try and fix it and I can't really get close. 

[MonMotha]

the bottom of the picture is angleing in and the top is angleing out.

Have you tried adjusting the "trapezoid" control?  It looks like you could adjust that out using a combination of "trapezoid", "pincushion", and maybe (if it has it) "bottom corner", probably adjusted mostly in that order.  The adjustments interact a little, so you may have to go back and forth for a while.

[isucamper]

the bottom of the picture is angleing in and the top is angleing out.

Have you tried adjusting the "trapezoid" control?  It looks like you could adjust that out using a combination of "trapezoid", "pincushion", and maybe (if it has it) "bottom corner", probably adjusted mostly in that order.  The adjustments interact a little, so you may have to go back and forth for a while.

yeah.  i've messed with it extensively.  perhaps a professional calibrater could do better than me, but even messing with the trapazoid to even up the top and bottom, there's still the bulge in the middle

[dekar24k]

Another thing that's annoying me is the fact that I never get that "perfect" image. I just adjusted every single available resolution with Nokia Monitor test earlier today and then I started testing different games. Some games were centered/stretched correctly and some weren't. If I adjusted one game, then another was completely off.

Are you all (D9800 owners) experiencing the same?

[ssndk]

Another thing that's annoying me is the fact that I never get that "perfect" image. I just adjusted every single available resolution with Nokia Monitor test earlier today and then I started testing different games. Some games were centered/stretched correctly and some weren't. If I adjusted one game, then another was completely off.

Are you all (D9800 owners) experiencing the same?

I think this is perfectly normal. I found it annoying too at first.. I have a D9400 (same chassis) and you wont have every single game fit perfectly on the screen (unless you adjust your screen settings in some games). You'll have to fiddle around with the settings until all games are either perfect or acceptable. I think I've found settings where almost all the horizontal games are either perfect or very acceptable. For vertical games its more difficult (without rotating the monitor) and sometimes requires the software stretch.

[ahofle]

For vertical games its more difficult (without rotating the monitor) and sometimes requires the software stretch.

Not to thread hijack, but the solution for vertical games is to select a resolution with more horizontal pixels.
For example, Centipede/Donkey Kong/etc: MAME wants to select 256x256 or 321x256.  352x256 looks WAY better.

[dekar24k]

Another thing that's annoying me is the fact that I never get that "perfect" image. I just adjusted every single available resolution with Nokia Monitor test earlier today and then I started testing different games. Some games were centered/stretched correctly and some weren't. If I adjusted one game, then another was completely off.

Are you all (D9800 owners) experiencing the same?

I think this is perfectly normal. I found it annoying too at first.. I have a D9400 (same chassis) and you wont have every single game fit perfectly on the screen (unless you adjust your screen settings in some games). You'll have to fiddle around with the settings until all games are either perfect or acceptable. I think I've found settings where almost all the horizontal games are either perfect or very acceptable. For vertical games its more difficult (without rotating the monitor) and sometimes requires the software stretch.

Good to hear.

Although I believe I have a close-to-perfect setup now as well. I went through all my MAME favorites last night (more than 150, at least) and they are all looking good now. Most games are perfectly stretched, those that aren't are perfectly centered although not stretched to the very corners. So I'm happy with my setup now, as long as everyone else are having the same "issues".

[dekar24k]

For vertical games its more difficult (without rotating the monitor) and sometimes requires the software stretch.

Not to thread hijack, but the solution for vertical games is to select a resolution with more horizontal pixels.
For example, Centipede/Donkey Kong/etc: MAME wants to select 256x256 or 321x256.  352x256 looks WAY better.

Weird thing is that Donkey Kong looks perfect on my setup, but Pac-Man/Ms. Pac-Man etc. is clipped. I thought these games ran at the same res. I will try setting Ms. Pac-Man/Pac-Man etc at 352x256 later and see how it turns out. Thanks for the tip!