Star Wars 7 SPOILERS!

[Token]

Just saw it for the second time, this time in 3D.

I'm even more impressed with Daisy Ridley's performance now. She will carry this franchise for the next two movies and our daughters will spend the next ten years trying to be just like her. It is only a matter of time before arm-wraps are worn by every junior high school girl.

Harrison Ford steals every scene he is in. Han needed to die for the story to progress.

The internet wants to hate on Kylo Ren for his emo daddy issues, but I loved the character. Just wait until he completes his training.

JJ Abrams wants us to think Rey is a Skywalker. Anakin/Luke's light saber was attracted to her, after all. I really hope this isn't the case. I hope there is a better twist in store for us in Episode VII.

And George Lucas needs to shut his pie-hole. He is two for six with this franchise.

[Generic Eric]

And George Lucas needs to shut his pie-hole. He is two for six with this franchise.

Word yo!

GL had 32 GD years to make hay out of Star Wars.  He couldn't and didn't. Not to mention he shitcanned all of the EU. 

[yotsuya]

Yeah, the only thing that would be more obvious is if Kylo and Rey were twins separated at birth.

And leave Lucas alone. I hope he takes that kajillions he made from the franchise and goes back and makes the deep, personal films he wanted  to make back in college.

[Token]

And leave Lucas alone. I hope he takes that kajillions he made from the franchise and goes back and makes the deep, personal films he wanted  to make back in college.

That George Lucas is long dead.

[yotsuya]

And leave Lucas alone. I hope he takes that kajillions he made from the franchise and goes back and makes the deep, personal films he wanted  to make back in college.

That George Lucas is long dead.

If he is, you nerds killed him.

[Token]

If he is, you nerds killed him.

George Lucas' loss of talent has nothing to do Star Wars fans (as obnoxious as they tend to be).

Are you actually trying to argue that Lucas hasn't lost his touch? He hasn't done anything significant since 1989.

[yotsuya]

I think the reaction he got towards the prequels definitely killed his appetite for making more.

I'm not arguing anything. I'm stating that I hope he takes his money and technology and uses it to become the Filmmaker he wanted to be.

[harveybirdman]

What George failed to realize is that it was the studio pressure that he hated so much that acted as a perfect catalyst for his greatness.

They reigned him in when he started doing stupid ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- and wisely kicked his ass out of the directorial chair of episodes 4 and 5.

No one challenged him on the prequels, and well.... we've got Anakin building C3P0 and Jar Jar Binks stepping in ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

[wp34]

What George failed to realize is that it was the studio pressure that he hated so much that acted as a perfect catalyst for his greatness.

They reigned him in when he started doing stupid ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- and wisely kicked his ass out of the directorial chair of episodes 4 and 5.

No one challenged him on the prequels, and well.... we've got Anakin building C3P0 and Jar Jar Binks stepping in ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

It was George's idea to not direct 5 & 6. He felt he needed to focus on the special effects.  He was so busy building ILM during EP5 he was almost never on the set.   After EP4 he has never had to listen to the studio for anything.  He does what he wants.  Even with EP4 I don't think he had a lot of pressure because they had no idea what he was doing it was so new and different.

All that aside I do agree with you that George's downfall as a filmmaker is that he got so big that nobody could give him constructive criticism.  If you saw any of Rick McCallum's interviews during the 90's his job seemed to be to both kiss George's ass and promote him as a genius.  He got Producer credit for it.

[Token]

I'm stating that I hope he takes his money and technology and uses it to become the Filmmaker he wanted to be.

He has been unbelievably wealthy for 30 years. If he wanted to be make more films like THX 1138 he could have. Instead he chose Howard the Duck and Jar Jar.

[Locke141]

There was Red Tails.

[Locke141]

Good read.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/seth-abramson/10-reasons-star-wars-the-force-awakens-_b_8895598.html

[dkersten]

And leave Lucas alone. I hope he takes that kajillions he made from the franchise and goes back and makes the deep, personal films he wanted  to make back in college.

That George Lucas is long dead.

If he is, you nerds killed him.

No, him putting his name on the extended universe and even personally approving some of the story arcs (like chewy's death) then turning around a decade later and cashing out on the name by shitting on the fans that got him to where he was is what made hardcore fans hate him.  What killed him was insisting that he knew how to write dialogue and producing three movies that never would have made it past "now on dvd" if they hadn't used the Star Wars name.  The story he wrote for them was bad enough, but the dialogue is hard to watch, not just bad, but actually makes you squirm in your seat because it is so horrible.  It's like awkward humor without the humor, and with half as many words.  A five year old could have done better with the script, and that is being generous.  Lucas wasn't killed by fans, he committed suicide because his big head couldn't fit through the door but he forced it through anyway.  If he had just hired someone with a speck of talent to write the script the movies might have had a redeeming factor...

Seriously, sit and watch ep 1-3, and the FIRST emotional dialogue comes at the end when Anakin is fighting Obi-wan.  That's the first time in the entire trilogy where dialogue flows and feels right for the movies.  And the only time.

To say that he would make something with emotion or even to suggest he has any talent whatsoever is a joke, purely and utterly.  His only talent lies in branding.. his money came from brands like Star Wars and THX...

[emphatic]

Kylo Ren has wild inconsistency in his force power

Are you referring to his inability to fight off Finn and Rey with his light saber? He's been hit by Chewbacca's BFG in the previous scene. Did you not see the damage that thing can deal? Pretty sure he has to use the force to the max just to walk around at all... 

[harveybirdman]

I got no problem with Rey using the force.  Kylo being injured is enough explanation for me.

Agreed

[ark_ader]

All that aside I do agree with you that George's downfall as a filmmaker is that he got so big that nobody could give him constructive criticism.  If you saw any of Rick McCallum's interviews during the 90's his job seemed to be to both kiss George's ass and promote him as a genius.  He got Producer credit for it.

John Dykstra is a good example of this.  Lucas didn't invite him back to do the other films.  They clashed constantly.  ILM at the time was bunch of hippies in a garage,screwing around while camera equipment was not being used on the film was scattered around the place.  Lucas had 8 weeks to get the special effects done.  I would have loved to be a fly on the wall when Lucas showed up and went ape ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- in that garage/hanger.

[deadmoney5]

And leave Lucas alone. I hope he takes that kajillions he made from the franchise and goes back and makes the deep, personal films he wanted  to make back in college.

That George Lucas is long dead.

If he is, you nerds killed him.

No, him putting his name on the extended universe and even personally approving some of the story arcs (like chewy's death) then turning around a decade later and cashing out on the name by shitting on the fans that got him to where he was is what made hardcore fans hate him.  What killed him was insisting that he knew how to write dialogue and producing three movies that never would have made it past "now on dvd" if they hadn't used the Star Wars name.  The story he wrote for them was bad enough, but the dialogue is hard to watch, not just bad, but actually makes you squirm in your seat because it is so horrible.  It's like awkward humor without the humor, and with half as many words.  A five year old could have done better with the script, and that is being generous.  Lucas wasn't killed by fans, he committed suicide because his big head couldn't fit through the door but he forced it through anyway.  If he had just hired someone with a speck of talent to write the script the movies might have had a redeeming factor...

Seriously, sit and watch ep 1-3, and the FIRST emotional dialogue comes at the end when Anakin is fighting Obi-wan.  That's the first time in the entire trilogy where dialogue flows and feels right for the movies.  And the only time.

To say that he would make something with emotion or even to suggest he has any talent whatsoever is a joke, purely and utterly.  His only talent lies in branding.. his money came from brands like Star Wars and THX...

I watched Episodes 1-3 over the weekend and I forgot how boring the first 2 were..I almost fell asleep during both movies..i don't care enough about the characters.

Episode 3 was actually pretty good for me.

[harveybirdman]

Just pointing out again that the whole Finn's the Jedi "ruse" was piss poor and stupid.

I actually believe Hasbro when they say that Rey was left out of the Monopoly game to hide the LMFAO "major" plot point that she was going to be the Jedi and fight Kylo Ren.... Like we didn't know that after watching her fly the Falcon naturally like young Anakin.... Come on...

What a stupid moronic plot device to shove the feminist agenda into Star Wars.  Like many women she was already bad ass, they didn't need to tear down perceived stereotypical story lines and detract form the only truly original character of the movie to shame everyone for their "misogynistic" thinking.

[Grasshopper]

I finally got round to seeing this on Saturday. I’m probably repeating what’s already been said, but FWIW, here are my thoughts:

There was a lot to like about the film. The special effects were great. The new cast was very good, especially Daisy Ridley. However, my overall feeling was one of slight disappointment.

The biggest issue for me was that the film borrowed far too many ideas from the previous films. I mean seriously, did we really need to have the rebels flying down a trench to destroy a Deathstar for a third time? Is the empire (or whatever it’s called these days) really dumb enough to leave their biggest and most expensive weapon insufficiently protected three times in a row? Did we really need to have another droid carrying a secret message, and being pursued over a desert planet by Storm Troopers? Did we really need to have another cantina populated with funky looking aliens? Did we really need to have the good guys hiding under the floor of the Millenium Falcon again? Did we really need to have the heroine being rescued from the Deathstar again? Did we really need to have it revealed that the main bad guy is a family member who turned to the dark side again? Etc, etc, .....

The thing is, I was expecting (and actually looking forward to) the occasional nod towards the earlier films. But the amount of recycled material was ridiculous. At times, it felt more like a remake than a sequel. The only real surprise for me was the death of Han Solo (assuming of course that he is actually dead). I definitely didn’t see that coming. However, even that ended up being a bit of a damp squib.

I can’t help thinking that if I was part of the 0.001% of the population who have never seen the original Star Wars movies, then I would have really enjoyed the latest film. However, as it was, there were just too few surprises to really hold my attention.

[Grasshopper]

All that aside I do agree with you that George's downfall as a filmmaker is that he got so big that nobody could give him constructive criticism.  If you saw any of Rick McCallum's interviews during the 90's his job seemed to be to both kiss George's ass and promote him as a genius.  He got Producer credit for it.

Agreed. Didn't Harrison Ford famously say to Lucas on the set of episode 4 "you can type this ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---, but you can't say it!". He could get away with it because, at the time, George Lucas was an unknown hack director, directing a cast of unknowns, in a cheesy sci-fi B movie, that was expected to go straight to video.

[harveybirdman]

I too was disappointed but we're definitely in the minority and easily dismissed by the majority of fans who enjoyed the movie.

I've not lost all hope, we'll see how Rouge One goes.... But I have a feeling we're due for more nostalgia driven, Mcguffin laden, Finn bumblin, no sense making eye candy.

[CCM]

I too was disappointed but we're definitely in the minority and easily dismissed by the majority of fans who enjoyed the movie.

I've not lost all hope, we'll see how Rouge One goes.... But I have a feeling we're due for more nostalgia driven, Mcguffin laden, Finn bumblin, no sense making eye candy.

You were disappointed... hmm that's the first you mentioned it in this thread...

[harveybirdman]

easily dismissed by the majority of fans who enjoyed the movie.

 

[Grasshopper]

Well, I decided the horse hadn't been flogged enough, so I went to see the film again yesterday. And, as several people here have already pointed out, it is indeed a lot more enjoyable the second time around.

I haven't suddenly become blind to the film's many faults. However, without the weight of expectation, it was easier for me to just sit back, put my brain into neutral, and enjoy what is basically a popcorn movie, without over-analysing things too much.

Also, for obvious reasons, the lack of plot surprises is less of an issue when you're watching a film for a second time.

[dkersten]

Usually when I go to a movie, I go with the lowest possible expectation; that way even a crappy movie is better than expected and a "win".  Unfortunately, Star Wars was impossible to go to without expectations.  That's why I think I enjoyed it more the second time - I had no expectations, and actually expected to dislike it more.  I was pleasantly surprised. 

[Xiaou2]

After the Pre-Quills,

 I had pretty low expectations... and despite JJ directing... I was hesitant, and decided not to put but a ticket in advance... waiting for a feeler of the reviews before hand.

 I liked it.    Did not "Love it".    Ill still keep ROTJ as my top fav.

 I really Loved seeing the original characters back in action.   The action was good, scenes were a nice throwback.. done quite well,  and the new girl was nice...


 That said... I also kind of expected JJ to just "Remix" the film ...much like he did in the new Star Trek.   I liked that movie was well.. but, the remix aspect becomes a bit of a disappointment.    Its almost like he wants to show that he can redo movies better than the originals... rather than rebuild new movies, with original ideas.


 After my initial feelings of shock and awe... and the nostalgia effect wore off...  I was left feeling that the movie moved way too fast.   Sort of ADHD.

  In the originals.. you had some build up to the events.   Got to know characters in greater depths.  Establish more emotional connections... and have more realistic time-frames for the presented actions.    In this film... its like it tried to roll 3 movies worth of material.. into one film.

 We saw a girl not only start to get the "force",  but master it to a level that even Luke would be envious of.    Luke had a lot of difficulty channeling and developing his connection to the force... and it took him quite some time before he presented great skill in it.   Yet she was able to channel and blast it out, in a single episode.    It would have been far more interesting.. to see her build her connection in a more realistic timeframe.

 Her fighting skills were nice... and she has the potential to become far more effective a fighter with a laser-weapon, based on her staff skills alone.

 As I may have said before... I didnt like Kylo's   "Cross"  sword guards.   The guards would have easily been chopped off as a saber slid behind their projectors.   Also, the width of the cross would have caused far too easy injury, to the actual wielder.

 It was disappointing that not so much as a Kiss was had between Leia and Han...  and that Leia had little part in any of the action.
Also disappointing, to see Han lit up.  Ford was one of the best parts of the series.  It may be incredibly difficult to find an actor to fill such epic shoes.   

 Also, Han, knowing his own inner struggle to walk the right path...  Im not so sure he would have really trusted his son like that.

 Chewie -   Just seemed odd at times.   The medical scene was fun...  but there were times when he seemed far unlike the original..  a former cardboard cutout stand-in.   The look seemed different,  and so were his expressive manners.

 Finn - He seemed decent.   A little over-the-top in some scenes... but, decent.

 Rey - I liked her strong willed, good natured character.   She was nice on the eyes..  a good fighter,  as well as having great presence on screen.   Her mechanical and electrical knowledge seemed a bit too deep ... as were he skills in pretty much everything she did.  If only we got to see some progression...

 Kylo - (in-Vader #2)  I have mixed feelings about this character.   I still do not understand the reason he swapped sides.  And I found him far less intimidating than Vader.   Removing the mask probably didnt help.. because his appearance and even his mannerisms..   just didnt seen gritty and wicked enough.. to be cast as a lead baddie.

 Some of the most notoriously good "baddies",  rarely ever get to play 'good' guys in other films.   They often keep getting the lead baddie roles.. because they have certain inner qualities that allow them to portray such a character far more realistically than others.   And while some people can be made to look the role... their verbal and facial portrayal.. just never really matches up.

 Kylo's ability to stop a laser blast in mid-fire... was going way too far.    Not just for realism sake... but for the fact that he didnt seem trained well enough for such a feat.    It was a bit of a stretch to think that Luke could deflect laser fire with his saber...  but that was far more believable than stopping a beam completely.

 Poe - Fighter pilot.   I liked this actor.  Nice portrayal, and good on screen presence.

 BB-8  -  Ball-bot ?  Balancing Bot?   heh     Well...  I liked some of the scenes of this bot.   And although Id heard he was a real physical robot... rather than CGI,  ... he looked a bit too clean for a rolling bot,  which essentially made him look like a CGI model.


 Death- "Star-Eater"   -   I think the concept is interesting... but maybe going a little too far in capabilities.    But mostly,  as said,  there was no real build up of this being devised and built.   Id think rebel forces would have caught wind of this massive project far long ago.... and hampered its early development.    Even in Jedi... the DS was made to look incomplete, for a surprise timeframe attack.


 Imax 3D  -   I have only seen the Imax 3d version,  so I cant compare to a 2d version... but the 3d really was good... adding to the depth and excitement of the action and interactions.   One particular scene.. where you were inside a fighter pilots ship during a fierce battle, looking through the dirty front panel glass... was quite spectacular.

 It wasnt as profound as Avatar in Imax3d,  nor the incredible 2d to 3d  "Predator"  movie conversion,  ...  but it was good.


 It was also great to finally see Luke on screen.   Making the imagination really light up... as to what could happen next.


 Adding to what I would have liked to see, and possibly see in the future,  would have been far more use of different light-weapons... as well as a more complex / Chinese method of wielding and fighting.     The Japanese use of swordplay is more about pure power and timing ..  where as the Chinese sword play is far more flowing, using soft-deflecting methods, deceptive / tricky movements,  pretty and acrobatic moves, as well as use of many other body parts during the interactions.

 How about a plasma-globe rope dart that lights up at impacts greater than 2 ft away from its wielder?
 How about some shorter dual Butterfly swords?   Shorter but Wider flat laser blades.
 How about some use of close range projectiles / mini-explosives,  temporary expanding light-shields,  leg-binding bolos,  smoke balls,  poison dust/ smoke gas/ or poison pointed tips?

 How about use of pressure point finger strikes, using internal power or "force" effects?
 Hologram tricks?
 Mental force invisibility cloaks?
 
 More use of Weapons that reflect/absorb  laser / plasma energies.

 Besides weapons / fighting...  lets see something other than "planet killers".   Planet killers make little sense really... as a planet is full of exploitable and valuable resources.    Wicked things can be shown and accomplished, without merely vaporizing entire planets.   Besides... whats next?  Vaporizing an entire solar system in one shot ?!  >_<

 Hopefully, they are not trying to make this a Marvel-like franchise...  eventually trying to cross breed it with x-man or superman...etc.  Ugg
The "Force" was not initially about Genetics.   It was about connecting to the source...   and changing that,  IMO,  is not the way to go.


 Lets see more character building, emotional depth,  personal trials, internal growth,  skill building / training...etc.
Lets see some originality in the kinds of battles, more timely realistic and complex defeats, spies and traitor relationships...
as well as personal relationships... some love, lust,  jealousy, and personality conflicts...


 And finally...  as much as I love a strong female...  I definitely felt the extreme, unrealistic,  "Feminism" propagandist
slant... and it aggravated me a bit.

[Token]

Xiaou2, you are the James Joyce of BYOAC.

[yotsuya]

Xiaou2, you are the James Joyce of BYOAC.

Infidel.

[harveybirdman]

I'm still coming to terms with the fact that I agree with 98% of what X2 posted.....

[Token]

Xiaou2, you are the James Joyce of BYOAC.

Infidel.

He's just misunderstood. You have to chew through a bit of bone to get to the marrow.

...But then, I never managed to finish Ulysses. 

[CheffoJeffo]

I'm still coming to terms with the fact that I agree with 98% of what X2 posted.....

LoL.   You really are off your rocker.

[pbj]

Rewatching the prequels in our household.  They're decent. 

 

[pbj]

BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT

[yotsuya]

BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT

The DVD should be out in like 2 weeks. Chill.

[Malenko]

I'm still coming to terms with the fact that I agree with 98% of what X2 posted.....

Baiting me to read it. I hate you.

First off, he cant spell prequel even with spellchecker/auto correct.  I thought the pacing was good, it certainly didn't feel like a 2 hour and 20 min movie. If Rey got no force powers the movie would have kinda blown and the fight with Kylo would have lasted about 1 second . Yeah she learned a lot way too fast but it was sort of implied shes mega force sensitive and some how had a connection to Luke. Im not gonna nerd-fight it, but its easy for me to suspend disbelief when you're watching a fantasy movie.

So tired of hearing about the vents/cross guards , how dare they try something new!

I was kinda sad that the big 3 didn't reunite on screen, and now they never can unless Solo comes back as a ghost. Ford wanted to die in the second star wars film so I wasnt surprised when he was offed in this movie.  Kylo was/is a ---meecrob----box. BB was a practical effect, and a great one. Never looked CGI to me. Star Eater was a lame concept, the giant mega gun has already been done twice in the SW universe, didnt need a 3rd try.  Luke was the biggest let down part of this movie.

Im not going to even reply to the other stuff except to say I thought Rey was a great lead and I never felt any sort of feminist agenda with her lead.

[dkersten]

BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT
BOOTLEG IS OUT

The DVD should be out in like 2 weeks. Chill.

April 1st isn't it?
Hmm.. my carpet goes in the theater on the 1st, and I should just about be done with the rest by then.. sounds like my Friday night is now planned out - perfect "official" first movie in the completed theater, considering seeing it in the imax is what got me on the track of upgrading my theater... Of course, I started out wanting a new subwoofer for around $500 and ended up spending $10k, lol...  Talk about feature creep...

edit: aww, looks like April 5th.  Bummer.

[Malenko]

digital release on April first, DVD/Blu Ray April fifth

[pbj]

Digital release was almost two days ago, noob.

[harveybirdman]

I'm not going to buy it...  I know I never really loved it, but now I've  completely soured on it, even harder than I've soured on LOTR trilogy (which I acutally liked at the time of it's release).

It's really a shame because I still believe a worthy Star Wars sequel can be made, but I have little faith in Disney to do so.

[pbj]

You sound joyless.  Here's to hoping your life improves some day.