WIP Photos and Explanations of builds

[rablack97]

Is it me, or has anybody else noticed that folks lately are just posting finished projects and or just posting a part of the project once its complete with no documentation on how it was done.

I've seen a few members here mention that this thread isn't a showcase thread of finished projects but its a thread to show the process in regards to what your building.

I'm just wondering if all the recent arguing etc has chased away that desire to show detailed documentation, and folks are just building in private and then saying this is what i built take or leave it and disappearing.

Just wondering if anyone else is noticing this lately.

[vwalbridge]

Just wondering if anyone else is noticing this lately.

You are not alone. Sure, it doesn't "hurt" anyone but it really would be swell if guys didn't swing by just to drop a showcase picture.

Meanwhile, other builders are using that section for what it is actually intended for.

[Token]

Generally there are three types of project threads.

The Egoist
Look at how great my cab is! Please tell me I am amazing.

The Newb
I have lots of questions about how to build my project. I'll show some pictures along the way.

The Master Builder
I'm an experienced builder. I'd like to help others by showing how I do what I do.


 

[vwalbridge]

Generally there are three types of project threads.

The Egoist
Look at how great my cab is! Please tell me I am amazing.

The Newb
I have lots of questions about how to build my project. I'll show some pictures along the way.

The Master Builder
I'm an experienced builder. I'd like to help others by showing how I do what I do.

The Squatter
I'm an undecided builder. I like to submit dozens of sketchup plans for review, never really making up my mind. Fast forward a few months and I still have made zero progress on my build.

The go getter
I'm can't stop myself. I like to get working without consulting with others and end up making mistakes. I usually let my eagerness and lack of patience get the best of me. Please help me take a deep breath, slow down and go back to square one.

[harveybirdman]

The Cloner

The only acceptable designs for my cab are Project Mame, Weecade, Revolution, Flynn's, and Metropolis.



I KID I KID, PEACE be with all of you.

[wp34]

Is it me, or has anybody else noticed that folks lately are just posting finished projects and or just posting a part of the project once its complete with no documentation on how it was done.

I've seen a few members here mention that this thread isn't a showcase thread of finished projects but its a thread to show the process in regards to what your building.

I'm just wondering if all the recent arguing etc has chased away that desire to show detailed documentation, and folks are just building in private and then saying this is what i built take or leave it and disappearing.

Just wondering if anyone else is noticing this lately.

I've noticed this as well.   Detailed project builds are the best thing about this site IMHO.  It may not be for everybody though.  Just getting the project done sometimes is work enough in itself. 

It is possible the recent arguing and posturing may be impacting the content of build threads. 

[BadMouth]

This board seems to shift every few years.

When I first arrived, the build threads were pretty direct.  OP would ask for opinions on specific things, people would give their 2 cents, then OP would either take their advice or not.
There wasn't much in the build threads that wasn't build related.

Then it shifted to a lot of banter in the build threads; 30 page threads with the majority of pages not containing any actual build progress or information.

Then it shifted to people giving their two cents, not being happy that OP doesn't agree with them and continuing to argue or pile on for five pages.

Here is an example of a thread that if posted a month ago would have been turned into a 30 page debate:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,81520.0.html
People give their opinion and moved on.  Strange times.

LOL at the Egoist.  Not calling him out, but I found one build on over a half dozen sites. 
The person posting it did not have any other posts on any of them except to post pics of their project and respond to the praise.
After a few weeks, they were never heard from again. 

I'll add:
The Conversationalist (not to be confused with the Squatter)
The build thread is 80% unrelated banter.  The cab is getting built, but any useful info is buried in pages and pages of unrelated chatter that nobody wants to dig through.
Sometimes it isn't even the OP that is filling pages with unrelated stuff.

As far as why people are dropping completed build pics and moving on, only the people who are doing it can say why.

[rablack97]

Well, I would think finished builds would go here in the stickied thread.

I completed my project! I posted a pic and a link to my project thread

It is a catch 22, I glanced at Frank Drebins build and he was nice enough to document, but yet wasn't receiving any feedback.

So its weird, the only threads that get love are "your doing that wrong" or "damn you just did something different"  the tweeners mostly get lectured because they copied another design or they arent doing anything new.

I mean another reason may also be posting the photos, which is a PITA, i switched to snagit reflect and screencast, which is so much faster.  I dont know if Saint will switch but some forums have a function where you just drag your photos into the dialogue and it uploads and shows up in your post.

I guess what im missing is that techniques, tools and engineering have changed over the years, so its cool to see how people do things differently.  If everyone just posts the shells with no documentation on the guts and or how they attained the goal, then the forum will no longer get educated.

So for any of the noobs, or anyone else for that matter, if you came here and read a crap load to get knowledge to build your machine, if possible, return that favor and document your build so others can read how you did what you did.

Just my thoughts.

[harveybirdman]

MEH I'll take my measly 500 views per month when feedback comes from people I respect such as Yots, Opt, wp34, Locke, as well as many others.

[Token]

It is a catch 22, I glanced at Frank Drebins build and he was nice enough to document, but yet wasn't receiving any feedback.

So its weird, the only threads that get love are "your doing that wrong" or "damn you just did something different"  the tweeners mostly get lectured because they copied another design or they arent doing anything new.

I was just about to say this. The gems and the garbage get the feedback.

I'm MAMEing an old cab. It is nothing new or revolutionary. I greatly appreciate people taking the time to read about my ideas and project and helping me avoid making mistakes. I've been pointed in the right direction for suppliers, artwork, etc. But its been slow going (which is fine 'cuz I haven't had the time to work on it). If I was trying to quickly build a project from the ground up and had lots of questions, I would have more luck getting feedback by posting a proposed control panel with 8 buttons and two spinners.

[harveybirdman]

I try to make a point of posting feedback in every build that I see potential in, even if it isn't exactly what I'd do.

For builds I really don't like, I try to refrain from posting in them at all, unless the user has specifically requested feedback.

Heck if posters have multiple builds you might see me post in one, and not in the other.

[tomstewdevine]

Generally there are three types of project threads.

The Egoist
Look at how great my cab is! Please tell me I am amazing.

The Newb
I have lots of questions about how to build my project. I'll show some pictures along the way.

The Master Builder
I'm an experienced builder. I'd like to help others by showing how I do what I do.

And then there is me, building sub par bartop arcades, slowly getting better with every build, and documenting each step in my thread.  I do this because of all the project announcement posts that come up, the ones where I get to see the build and the OP takes recommendations in a positive way, and we get to see the process are the best to follow. IMO.

But I'm not "hating", I like all the posts including the master builder, the newb and the Egoist.

[tomstewdevine]

Here is an example of a thread that if posted a month ago would have been turned into a 30 page debate:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,81520.0.html
People give their opinion and moved on.  Strange times.

I've never seen that build but you are totally right, there would have been 30 pages on the admin buttons alone.

[rablack97]

and yeah looks like it was never finished, but that was the norm back in the day, shove as many peripherals on the CP as possible.

[vwalbridge]

Here is an example of a thread that if posted a month ago would have been turned into a 30 page debate:
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,81520.0.html
People give their opinion and moved on.  Strange times.

I've never seen that build but you are totally right, there would have been 30 pages on the admin buttons alone.

Ho. Lee. Cow.  Things have really changed since 2008. There is no way anyone would let him build a CP like that now.  ...and thank goodness

[wp34]

I'll add:
The Conversationalist (not to be confused with the Squatter)
The build thread is 80% unrelated banter.  The cab is getting built, but any useful info is buried in pages and pages of unrelated chatter that nobody wants to dig through.
Sometimes it isn't even the OP that is filling pages with unrelated stuff.

As far as why people are dropping completed build pics and moving on, only the people who are doing it can say why.

Good point.  That does seem to happen from time-to-time.

[Aceldamor]

I think it's a bit of both personally.

People get caught up in the excitement in building their projects so the forget to document / pic on the way, while others don't bother because the only responses they get are negativity. Having been on here a while ago, and now there is a difference in the type of posts at times.



Back in the day, the biggest issue were large all in 1 CPs, or basterdizing a fantastic restore opportunity. Overall though, people were very helpful and there was overall sense of enthusiasm about helping people get their projects done. Folks were encouraged to use an existing design, or hell even flattered if someone else was inspired enough to make a cab based on your design. Constructive criticism was given, not combative.

The forums now seem to be in a weird place, where there is a pile of negativity if you do one of the following trifecta:

clone and existing original build (Flynn, Weecade, etc)
LED control panel
Theme - this can be anything from the "trapper keeper" icon theme, to a theme not related to arcade, etc., etc.

Is it all bad, no. There are still plenty of folks who want to and do help, but you have to wade through the diarrhea of  "Ugh, another "XXX" clone" or "traditional buttons or GTFO" style comments. I understand that people have their opinions and they may be strong in favor of one type of thing vs. another but there have been threads where people were almost chased off , or they just stopped coming altogether because of stuff like that.

Hell people, there is so much passion about how to build a cabinet to house a program that EMULATES original video games..isn't it weird that there is so much drama over people building a copy of something to play a copy of something?

[Aceldamor]

I think it's a bit of both personally.

People get caught up in the excitement in building their projects so the forget to document / pic on the way, while others don't bother because the only responses they get are negativity. Having been on here a while ago, and now there is a difference in the type of posts at times.



Back in the day, the biggest issue were large all in 1 CPs, or basterdizing a fantastic restore opportunity. Overall though, people were very helpful and there was overall sense of enthusiasm about helping people get their projects done. Folks were encouraged to use an existing design, or hell even flattered if someone else was inspired enough to make a cab based on your design. Constructive criticism was given, not combative.

The forums now seem to be in a weird place, where there is a pile of negativity if you do one of the following trifecta:

clone and existing original build (Flynn, Weecade, etc)
LED control panel
Theme - this can be anything from the "trapper keeper" icon theme, to a theme not related to arcade, etc., etc.

Is it all bad, no. There are still plenty of folks who want to and do help, but you have to wade through the diarrhea of  "Ugh, another "XXX" clone" or "traditional buttons or GTFO" style comments (using generalized examples). I understand that people have their opinions and they may be strong in favor of one type of thing vs. another but there have been threads where people were almost chased off , or they just stopped coming altogether because of stuff like that.

Hell people, there is so much passion about how to build a cabinet to house a program that EMULATES original video games..isn't it weird that there is so much drama over people building a copy of something to play a copy of something?

[vwalbridge]

I understand that people have their opinions and they may be strong in favor of one type of thing vs. another but there have been threads where people were almost chased off , or they just stopped coming altogether because of stuff like that.

I'd much rather have someone start a build wrong, roll with the punches and fix their errors. Make it though the gauntlet and see it to the end. Much respect from me. Rather than "be too afraid" to post along the way and drop the mic with a final build pic.

A final build pic is great and all. BUT no matter how sophisticated your build is, a final build pic does very little to help the community get better.

I think the "wrong" builds tend to work themselves out. And if you were so worried about what people would say along the way...then why are you not worried to drop a showcase picture?

EDIT: I'll also add that the only reason that builder was able to drop that showcase picture is because he read through the threads of other builders that took the time to document their process. I really like to give credit to other builders that provided inspiration for me.  We all like to stand on each others shoulders and you can't do that with project announcement drops.

[Aceldamor]

I understand that people have their opinions and they may be strong in favor of one type of thing vs. another but there have been threads where people were almost chased off , or they just stopped coming altogether because of stuff like that.

I'd much rather have someone start a build wrong, roll with the punches and fix their errors. Make it though the gauntlet and see it to the end. Much respect from me. Rather than "be too afraid" and drop the mic with a final build pic.

A final build pic is great and all. BUT no matter how good your build is, a final build pic does very little to help the community get better.

I think the "wrong" builds tend to work themselves out. And if you were so worried about what people would say along the way...then why are you not worried to drop a showcase picture?

But therein might lie part of the community issue. Is it "wrong"  because you personally don't like how it looks or is it wrong on some technical level. Being "wrong" on an aesthetic level is completely subjective to the viewer. Additionally, if it's technically wrong or the OP asks a technical question are they getting an answer on the question or giving an opinion on what was seen vs what was asked.

 For example, asking a question on button placement and getting a tirade on how many, what style, and if they are back-lit or not isn't helping the community or the poster either.

[harveybirdman]

Since that was directed at me (at least it seems that way)  I will reiterate, I tend to only post in builds that I do not like if the OP asks for feedback.

Also I try (not always, but hopefully more often than not) to keep my critical responses to one post and not a prolonged debate.  Especially when my POV was clearly not considered in their retort. Also pbj is most wise when he says, once boards have been cut you stow the design flaw takes, of course that's hard to do when people only post finished builds.

[rablack97]

It really needs to be, ok this is what i'm going to build watch or dont watch.

The can of worms gets opened when folks start asking questions and or asking for opinions, then you either get a helper elf or a hooved bearded goat that just ate a can of rotten potted meat.

Bottom line is regardless what you do post your progress, yes the end result is awesome, but it doesnt give back, knowing that you leeched info from the threads of previous builds.  I dont care if its ugly as hell, there will be something in there that will help another hobbyist.

Its a project announcement thread, which means PROJECT, which means steps, photos, etc.  Not look at what i built to get a few awesomes.  100% of the time what follows is what did you do to make it, thats what people come here for, to learn, not just necessarily find eye candy.

[Aceldamor]

Since that was directed at me (at least it seems that way)  I will reiterate, I tend to only post in builds that I do not like if the OP asks for feedback.

Also I try (not always, but hopefully more often than not) to keep my critical responses to one post and not a prolonged debate.  Especially when my POV was clearly not considered in the the retort. Also pbj is most wise when he says, once boards have been cut you stow the design flaw takes, of course that's hard to do when people only post finish builds.

Not sure if this is because of my post or not, as it wasn't quoted. I'm not pointing any fingers anywhere, as I've seen it from all angles from a lot of different posters. Hell, I may have even been guilty of it as well. I think my point was more that there are a lot of passionate people here whom have strong beliefs on what makes a cab "great" and perhaps sometimes personal opinion might outweigh helpfulness in more instances than not as of late.

IDK, I'd just hate for people to be afraid to post anything on here showing what they achieved. If it's what they could do the best tools they had (physical or knowledge) more props to them for even trying. I'd much rather people were encouraged to seek guidance or hell be motivated to the point where they want to tear down and re-build a newer better, start a 2nd, or move on to bigger restore projects than be pushed away with a poisoned outlook on the hobby and the people in it.

[wp34]

Since that was directed at me (at least it seems that way)  I will reiterate, I tend to only post in builds that I do not like if the OP asks for feedback.

Also I try (not always, but hopefully more often than not) to keep my critical responses to one post and not a prolonged debate.  Especially when my POV was clearly not considered in their retort. Also pbj is most wise when he says, once boards have been cut you stow the design flaw takes, of course that's hard to do when people only post finished builds.

This is exactly how I try to participate as well.  Zipping it after sawdust has flown is also such great advice.   

[wp34]

Its a project announcement thread, which means PROJECT, which means steps, photos, etc.  Not look at what i built to get a few awesomes.  100% of the time what follows is what did you do to make it, thats what people come here for, to learn, not just necessarily find eye candy.

You just crystalized exactly what the Project forum should be.  Show us what you did start to finish.  Leave a legacy for someone else to learn from or build on and improve. 

[tomstewdevine]

Agreed WP, even if you are not the best builder, there maybe some sliver of information that will help that next noob looking for help.  I know I have used a lot of things from different posts where the OP was from varied talent levels.  I was blown away when a dude, said they wanted to make a bartop like one of mine, when I feel like everything I have build so far are just warm ups for a bigger full size build.

I realize after reading this and my last post that I relate a lot to my personal build threads but that's the only experience I guess I have.

[BorgDog]

Sorry guys, but I take each thread for what it is, even its just a posting of a completed setup I can still find something I may want to incorporate.  Threads like this one (and WTF is this in the Project Announcements section for???) and all the other discussing the problems with the quality of the forum posts really make me not want to come back, all this whining and complaining about how it's not how you want it.  Who gives a f what you want, this is the internet and an open forum (for the most part) so if you don't like what someone posts don't read it or look at it, but to sit around and ---smurfette--- that other people don't post enough details for you just discourages anyone from posting anything, then where the f will you be.

Good luck with your project.

[johnrt]

I agree with BorgDog. Stop whining! Let people post their projects in whatever way they want.

[mattsoft]

My 2 cents as a newb here -- I read through this entire forum for inspiration on my build(s) ... from controls, to cabinet style, to amp and speakers, to artwork. I don't care if the build is new, done, for ego, whatever -- the fact that people are posting what they've done, with pics, and tips & tricks is very helpful for us new builders. I saved myself a lot of headache from reading the posts here and am grateful! I wish I could have some insight to share with others, but I don't (yet) -- so for now, I'm posting back in case someone else like me up here needs some inspiration and happens to like what I've done.

[opt2not]

I guess what im missing is that techniques, tools and engineering have changed over the years, so its cool to see how people do things differently.  If everyone just posts the shells with no documentation on the guts and or how they attained the goal, then the forum will no longer get educated.

^ This.

So for any of the noobs, or anyone else for that matter, if you came here and read a crap load to get knowledge to build your machine, if possible, return that favor and document your build so others can read how you did what you did.

^ And this.

Stop whining! Let people post their projects in whatever way they want.

Not this.

[johnrt]

I think I've identified a common some common denominators here. Some nicknames repeatedly shows up as sourpusses...

[brihyn]

The Cloner

The only acceptable designs for my cab are Project Mame, Weecade, Revolution, Flynn's, and Metropolis.



I KID I KID, PEACE be with all of you.

The ONDer
See brihyn.

[harveybirdman]

Come on brihyn, you're telling me with that shop you can't turn out an original design.... You vastly underestimate yourself!

[rablack97]

Sorry guys, but I take each thread for what it is, even its just a posting of a completed setup I can still find something I may want to incorporate.  Threads like this one (and WTF is this in the Project Announcements section for???) and all the other discussing the problems with the quality of the forum posts really make me not want to come back, all this whining and complaining about how it's not how you want it.  Who gives a f what you want, this is the internet and an open forum (for the most part) so if you don't like what someone posts don't read it or look at it, but to sit around and ---smurfette--- that other people don't post enough details for you just discourages anyone from posting anything, then where the f will you be.

Good luck with your project.

OK so let me get this straight, are you that bad ass of a builder that you created, designed and innovated the art of this hobby.  Did you not read what somebody else did to assist with your project.  Nobody is bitching about anything.  It was an observation, if somebody is asking you to speak more about your build, and this makes you pout and leave the forum.  Then keep the build to yourself.  Some folks around here like to learn from other experiences and not just look at finished arcade units.

However your right sir, just let people post WTF ever they want and you watch this hobby start deteriorating over time, cause it will get stale, cause everybody will keep their skills to themselves.  I've built tons of machines, I don't NEED anyone to do anything, i just saw a trend starting to happen and vocalized it.

I just made a statement about giving back to the site, that probably spawned all of our inner arcade intelligence, but it you want to promote leeching that's your call.

I agree with BorgDog. Stop whining! Let people post their projects in whatever way they want.

I just made a statement about giving back to the site, that probably spawned all of our inner arcade intelligence, but it you want to promote leeching that's your call.

I'm off to go post my finished projects in software, retail, jukebox, not give any detail, and gloat over my accomplishments that I gleaned off everyone else in the forum.

Damn man, you bring up a valid point, and still people complain.   

[opt2not]

My 2 cents as a newb here -- I read through this entire forum for inspiration on my build(s) ... from controls, to cabinet style, to amp and speakers, to artwork. I don't care if the build is new, done, for ego, whatever -- the fact that people are posting what they've done, with pics, and tips & tricks is very helpful for us new builders. I saved myself a lot of headache from reading the posts here and am grateful! I wish I could have some insight to share with others, but I don't (yet) -- so for now, I'm posting back in case someone else like me up here needs some inspiration and happens to like what I've done.

^ Exactly. Great 2 cents.
Some of these newer skilled-members (johnrt) have their heads so far up their asses they can't give a ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- about the rest of the community. I'm just going to relax and wait till these type of --bags of cream-filled twinkies-- eventually get tired of this place and leave. Which they all eventually do.
And if not, no worries, I'll be fine with checking them at every pass.

I think I've identified a common some common denominators here. Some nicknames repeatedly shows up as sourpusses...

See johnrt? I don't need to be a passive-aggressive ---Bad words, bad words, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when saint censors you?--- to call you out. I'll do it directly.

[johnrt]

See johnrt? I don't need to be a passive-aggressive ---Bad words, bad words, whatcha gonna do? Whatcha gonna do when saint censors you?--- to call you out. I'll do it directly.

[rablack97]

What i find funny is this Borgdog built a bartop VIGOLIX, now where the hell did he get that idea from?

My guess is from VIGO's thread where he documented the build for others to learn.........INCONCEIVABLE

[vwalbridge]

As the old saying goes...I thought this was BYOAC. Build Your Own Arcade Controls.

Not....SYOAC. Showcase Your Own Arcade Controls.

Jeesh man, If I wanted to just see pictures of final builds, I would just use Google or go to the "I completed my project" sticky.

I have not been on this forum very long but one of the reasons I joined is because of the great builds and detailed documentation behind them. I also noticed people gave good honest feedback...good or negative. Not just a bunch of people stroking each others' egos.

I come here each day to LEARN about the hobby and have some fun in between. How the heck am I going to do that with a showcase picture?

This ain't Instagram, Imgur, or Flicker. Just do the right thing and post a few pictures of your build process. It's not hard.

[yotsuya]

I had a cheese steak for lunch today. It was badass.

[rablack97]

I had a cheese steak for lunch today. It was badass.

[yotsuya]

I had a cheese steak for lunch today. It was badass.

[rablack97]

I had a cheese steak for lunch today. It was badass.

[harveybirdman]

Alright you two, pipe down or you're going to piss BadMouth off.

[yotsuya]

[johnrt]

So what will be the next subject of whining? Anyone up for a bet? :-)


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[wp34]

So what will be the next subject of whining? Anyone up for a bet? :-)


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My money is on people calling a discussion whining.   

[opt2not]

[yotsuya]

So what will be the next subject of whining? Anyone up for a bet? :-)


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My money is on people calling a discussion whining.   

That's kind of like how giving an honest opinion is considered being a hater, am i right?

[johnrt]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


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[yotsuya]

Anyhoo, I think it's a good topic for discussion. I know I get so busy during a build that I don't take the time to document it.  So therefore, I don't make a thread.  I only make a thread if I want community feedback,  since I'm not that thin skinned when it comes to listening to what others say. My friends here have helped me with design decisions that in the end I know were the right ones. I'm also not afraid to say, slow down, I've decided I'm going to stick with this idea. Honest, quality feedback goes both ways.

I suppose the only time it bothers me is when people post links to finished projects that are on other sites. I'm not interested in going to your Photobucket to look at all these photos of your project in a gallery. Post your process here.

[yotsuya]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


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Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

[vwalbridge]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


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Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

No!  Showbiz Pizza Posse 4 life yo.

[Aceldamor]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


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Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

ugh....card readers, phone app based redemption games, nostalgia based redemption games, redemption based redemption games, redemption games, and oh yeah, pac-man

[yotsuya]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

No!  Showbiz Pizza Posse 4 life yo.

Rebel Arcade, south Phoenix, 1983. With all the other OGs. Not a single LED in sight.

[Aceldamor]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

No!  Showbiz Pizza Posse 4 life yo.

Rebel Arcade, south Phoenix, 1983. With all the other OGs. Not a single LED in sight.

---smurfette--- please, Video Round up crew - fo sho.

[yotsuya]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

ugh....card readers, phone app based redemption games, nostalgia based redemption games, redemption based redemption games, redemption games, and oh yeah, pac-man

It's the wave of the future, man!

[yotsuya]

Well you old timers. Maybe it's time to consider whether you self are outdated? Questioning every new trend may be a sign you know...


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Yeah, I suppose it's time to move over for the Dave & Busters set.

No!  Showbiz Pizza Posse 4 life yo.

Rebel Arcade, south Phoenix, 1983. With all the other OGs. Not a single LED in sight.

---smurfette--- please, Video Round up crew - fo sho.

Oh, you're a rich guy...

The CircleK on 7th and Baseline was my other go to place.

[winnydapoo]

Rebel Arcade, south Phoenix, 1983. With all the other OGs. Not a single LED in sight.

Well now that the thread is well and truly derailed I might as well ask, what is it you have against LEDs?

[yotsuya]

Who said I have anything against LEDs? My comment was that in '83, we didn't see them.

[harveybirdman]

I'll take this one Yots, since I've already taken the rep hit for it.

Unauthentic:  No arcade game ever had LEDS
Expensive: Mofos ---smurfette--- about the price of custom artwork yet have no problem unloaded hundreds of dollars on light up buttons, wire, and LED controllers.
Tacky:  Are there classy well done LED panels? Sure there are but most of the time they don't integrate with the theme or add anything other than bling for the sake of bling
Distracting: Sure it's nice to know what the active buttons are but the light/heat pollution can be irritating to some during gameplay.  Not everyone would have a problem with it but in a dark arcade setting I'd be afraid of unwanted glare on bezel glass.

[Frank Drebin]

Well, I would think finished builds would go here in the stickied thread.

I completed my project! I posted a pic and a link to my project thread

It is a catch 22, I glanced at Frank Drebins build and he was nice enough to document, but yet wasn't receiving any feedback.

So its weird, the only threads that get love are "your doing that wrong" or "damn you just did something different"  the tweeners mostly get lectured because they copied another design or they arent doing anything new.

I mean another reason may also be posting the photos, which is a PITA, i switched to snagit reflect and screencast, which is so much faster.  I dont know if Saint will switch but some forums have a function where you just drag your photos into the dialogue and it uploads and shows up in your post.

I guess what im missing is that techniques, tools and engineering have changed over the years, so its cool to see how people do things differently.  If everyone just posts the shells with no documentation on the guts and or how they attained the goal, then the forum will no longer get educated.

So for any of the noobs, or anyone else for that matter, if you came here and read a crap load to get knowledge to build your machine, if possible, return that favor and document your build so others can read how you did what you did.

Just my thoughts.

I do the same on a lot of build threads too, I'll take a look, and if there aren't any questions I can't answer I'll just leave without leaving a comment.  Which kind of sucks because like you mentioned (thanks for noticing btw) you get the feeling that you are talking to yourself.

I do notice there is a hefty amount of sarcasm on this site that almost borders on cynicism for a lot of builds.  Take a comment from my thread: 

Should I bother updating anymore?  Seriously no replies?

Sorry, let me drop everything and pay attention to this build.

Looks neat.

Keep up the good work 

Chrome T-Molding would look really good on this.

Maybe I took that the wrong way but to me it comes off as rather dickish.  And lots of posters here have that tone.
Weecades, mame cabinets, 4 player control panels and multicade artwork are all kind of snickered at by a lot of the regulars which probably dissuades a lot of people who want to build and document, and who actually like and want that in a cabinet.

Maybe I'm wrong but I get the feeling that this site is becoming kind of elitist towards certain types of hobbyists (the mame cabinet crowd) and the only thing that is respected on here is restorations or nintendo cabs.

I get it, a lot of you have been around here for 10+ years so nothing really surprises you anymore, and there doesn't seem to be a new group of members to replace the old guard so it is what it is.

[winnydapoo]

Who said I have anything against LEDs? My comment was that in '83, we didn't see them.

Right sorry I stand corrected.

Good luck with your build! 

[harveybirdman]

I hear what you're saying Naked Gun but C'mon man.....

Should I bother updating anymore?  Seriously no replies?

Could that not be interpreted as fishing for ego boost and just as irritating?  I'm sure that's not what you meant, I know cause I have the same experience.  I hate seeing builds I don't care for that have tens of thousands of views and my build thread is crickets by comparison, but I'm not making my cab for them.  Just as you aren't making yours for me or any of the old timers.

BTW, Mal hasn't posted here in weeks,  Nep is gone, surely most of you don't take pbj serious.  So who exactly is this crew of negative naysayers? Me I assume,  but where else is the hate coming from?

Maybe we should just pm people when we have a problem instead of letting things fester.

[yotsuya]

Well, I would think finished builds would go here in the stickied thread.

I completed my project! I posted a pic and a link to my project thread

It is a catch 22, I glanced at Frank Drebins build and he was nice enough to document, but yet wasn't receiving any feedback.

So its weird, the only threads that get love are "your doing that wrong" or "damn you just did something different"  the tweeners mostly get lectured because they copied another design or they arent doing anything new.

I mean another reason may also be posting the photos, which is a PITA, i switched to snagit reflect and screencast, which is so much faster.  I dont know if Saint will switch but some forums have a function where you just drag your photos into the dialogue and it uploads and shows up in your post.

I guess what im missing is that techniques, tools and engineering have changed over the years, so its cool to see how people do things differently.  If everyone just posts the shells with no documentation on the guts and or how they attained the goal, then the forum will no longer get educated.

So for any of the noobs, or anyone else for that matter, if you came here and read a crap load to get knowledge to build your machine, if possible, return that favor and document your build so others can read how you did what you did.

Just my thoughts.

I do the same on a lot of build threads too, I'll take a look, and if there aren't any questions I can't answer I'll just leave without leaving a comment.  Which kind of sucks because like you mentioned (thanks for noticing btw) you get the feeling that you are talking to yourself.

I do notice there is a hefty amount of sarcasm on this site that almost borders on cynicism for a lot of builds.  Take a comment from my thread: 

Should I bother updating anymore?  Seriously no replies?

Sorry, let me drop everything and pay attention to this build.

Looks neat.

Keep up the good work 

Chrome T-Molding would look really good on this.

Maybe I took that the wrong way but to me it comes off as rather dickish.  And lots of posters here have that tone.
Weecades, mame cabinets, 4 player control panels and multicade artwork are all kind of snickered at by a lot of the regulars which probably dissuades a lot of people who want to build and document, and who actually like and want that in a cabinet.

Maybe I'm wrong but I get the feeling that this site is becoming kind of elitist towards certain types of hobbyists (the mame cabinet crowd) and the only thing that is respected on here is restorations or nintendo cabs.

I get it, a lot of you have been around here for 10+ years so nothing really surprises you anymore, and there doesn't seem to be a new group of members to replace the old guard so it is what it is.

You got that response because you asked if you should bother updating anymore, which in turn might be seen as dickish.

[yotsuya]

Who said I have anything against LEDs? My comment was that in '83, we didn't see them.

Right sorry I stand corrected.

Good luck with your build! 

I don't have any builds going on right now that need luck.

[winnydapoo]

I'll take this one Yots, since I've already taken the rep hit for it.

Unauthentic:  No arcade game ever had LEDS
Expensive: Mofos ---smurfette--- about the price of custom artwork yet have no problem unloaded hundreds of dollars on light up buttons, wire, and LED controllers.
Tacky:  Are there classy well done LED panels? Sure there are but most of the time they don't integrate with the theme or add anything other than bling for the sake of bling
Distracting: Sure it's nice to know what the active buttons are but the light/heat pollution can be irritating to some during gameplay.  Not everyone would have a problem with it but in a dark arcade setting I'd be afraid of unwanted glare on bezel glass.

I'll agree with you on cost and maybe heat, other than that I think all subjective reasons. Unauthentic is fair if you're trying to reproduce or restore an original cabinet, otherwise irrelevant. And i think "Unauthentic" is the main reason they get a bad wrap around here.

[opt2not]

Unauthentic:  No arcade game ever had LEDS

Well, some cabinets had incandescent bulbs, but they were few and far between, and they were never on the main play buttons.
For instance, Robotron had dimly-lit blue translucent start buttons. They were very faint and subtle when lit up, not distracting from the gameplay at all.

Now-a-days people go overboard with lit-up controls, or put too much emphasis in that aspect of their project that the rest of the cabinet gets a minimal effort.
Take for instance that NASA cabinet. Very cool black etching work on the CP, but as pretty as that is the lighting could be toned down a bit to be more subtle and less-in-your-face. But the rest of the cabinet pales in comparison to the CP. It's like, all the eggs were put in the CP's basket while the rest of the cabinet didn't get the same attention.  From the standard cabinet design, to the artwork, it's very uninspiring and doesn't "attract" you as much as the CP does.  IMO he should have just made pedestal out of that CP since it's definitely the best thing about that cab. 
But would I say that in his project thread?  Naw, he doesn't want to hear that kind of feedback...he' content with the circle-jerk rather than anything constructive so oh well.

[winnydapoo]

Who said I have anything against LEDs? My comment was that in '83, we didn't see them.

Right sorry I stand corrected.

Good luck with your build! 

I don't have any builds going on right now that need luck.

I'm sure you'll post them when you want criticism amirite? Along with some Denzel Washington of course.

[yotsuya]

Who said I have anything against LEDs? My comment was that in '83, we didn't see them.

Right sorry I stand corrected.

Good luck with your build! 

I don't have any builds going on right now that need luck.

I'm sure you'll post them when you want criticism amirite? Along with some Denzel Washington of course.

If I want feedback, I know where to find it. It will be honest feedback, and I value it. I don't need sunshine blown up ---my bottom---.

[Frank Drebin]

You got that response because you asked if you should bother updating anymore, which in turn might be seen as dickish.

I hear what you're saying Naked Gun but C'mon man.....

Should I bother updating anymore?  Seriously no replies?

Could that not be interpreted as fishing for ego boost and just as irritating?  I'm sure that's not what you meant, I know cause I have the same experience.  I hate seeing builds I don't care for that have tens of thousands of views and my build thread is crickets by comparison, but I'm not making my cab for them.  Just as you aren't making yours for me or any of the old timers.

BTW, Mal hasn't posted here in weeks,  Nep is gone, surely most of you don't take pbj serious.  So who exactly is this crew of negative naysayers? Me I assume,  but where else is the hate coming from?

Maybe we should just pm people when we have a problem instead of letting things fester.

Maybe it came across as looking for an ego boost.  Certainly wasn't meant as such.  And while you're right I'm not making my cab for you or the old timers, I am making the build thread for you guys, and for anyone else who ventures on this site.  So the question wasn't directed at anybody in particular, but I was seriously wondering if anyone cared if I continued or not....and I normally wouldn't comment or complain but thats kind of the question being asked in this thread.

And I like PBJ.

[yotsuya]

You got that response because you asked if you should bother updating anymore, which in turn might be seen as dickish.

I hear what you're saying Naked Gun but C'mon man.....

Should I bother updating anymore?  Seriously no replies?

Could that not be interpreted as fishing for ego boost and just as irritating?  I'm sure that's not what you meant, I know cause I have the same experience.  I hate seeing builds I don't care for that have tens of thousands of views and my build thread is crickets by comparison, but I'm not making my cab for them.  Just as you aren't making yours for me or any of the old timers.

BTW, Mal hasn't posted here in weeks,  Nep is gone, surely most of you don't take pbj serious.  So who exactly is this crew of negative naysayers? Me I assume,  but where else is the hate coming from?

Maybe we should just pm people when we have a problem instead of letting things fester.

Maybe it came across as looking for an ego boost.  Certainly wasn't meant as such.  And while you're right I'm not making my cab for you or the old timers, I am making the build thread for you guys, and for anyone else who ventures on this site.  So the question wasn't directed at anybody in particular, but I was seriously wondering if anyone cared if I continued or not....and I normally wouldn't comment or complain but thats kind of the question being asked in this thread.

I hear you, brother. Just post. People like seeing progress. No comments generally means you're doing something right.

[winnydapoo]

Unauthentic:  No arcade game ever had LEDS

Well, some cabinets had incandescent bulbs, but they were few and far between, and they were never on the main play buttons.
For instance, Robotron had dimly-lit blue translucent start buttons. They were very faint and subtle when lit up, not distracting from the gameplay at all.

Now-a-days people go overboard with lit-up controls, or put too much emphasis in that aspect of their project that the rest of the cabinet gets a minimal effort.
Take for instance that NASA cabinet. Very cool black etching work on the CP, but as pretty as that is the lighting could be toned down a bit to be more subtle and less-in-your-face. But the rest of the cabinet pales in comparison to the CP. It's like, all the eggs were put in the CP's basket while the rest of the cabinet didn't get the same attention.  From the standard cabinet design, to the artwork, it's very uninspiring and doesn't "attract" you as much as the CP does.  IMO he should have just made pedestal out of that CP since it's definitely the best thing about that cab. 
But would I say that in his project thread?  Naw, he doesn't want to hear that kind of feedback...he' content with the circle-jerk rather than anything constructive so oh well.

It's fine to have that opinion dude. I don't think there'd be much point to offering it at the end of the build though because it's not like he can go back and make it a pedestal now. Also a person not liking your opinion doesn't mean they only want good opinions. The fact that you're critiquing it like piece of art is recognition in itself.

[harveybirdman]

I love me some pbj too.

 

[harveybirdman]

And they ARE pieces of art!

And some REALLY great artists are also ---Deutsche Frankfurters---.

And some art critics are ---Deutsche Frankfurters---!

I think the point that everybody who isn't a giant dick is trying to make is that we care about the gallery as much as its contents.

[Frank Drebin]

I hear you, brother. Just post. People like seeing progress. No comments generally means you're doing something right.

Cheers Yots.  I will.

[yotsuya]

I hear you, brother. Just post. People like seeing progress. No comments generally means you're doing something right.

Cheers Yots.  I will.

To piggyback, I've kind of got away from offering feedback for reasons mentioned in this thread. If I really like something I'll say so, but just because I don't post anything doesn't mean I'm not following along. I've gotten a kick out of The Mongrel, and I'd still like to see the nickname worked into the Marquee somehow.

[Frank Drebin]

To piggyback, I've kind of got away from offering feedback for reasons mentioned in this thread. If I really like something I'll say so, but just because I don't post anything doesn't mean I'm not following along. I've gotten a kick out of The Mongrel, and I'd still like to see the nickname worked into the Marquee somehow.

It is encouraging for rookie members to have the old dogs post in our builds, I appreciate that you have in mine.  Even if its not "contributing" to the build, it shows interest.

[tomstewdevine]

So what will be the next subject of whining? Anyone up for a bet? :-)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My money is on people calling a discussion whining.   

 

[wp34]

So what will be the next subject of whining? Anyone up for a bet? :-)


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My money is on people calling a discussion whining.   

That's kind of like how giving an honest opinion is considered being a hater, am i right?

You are correct  I should have had a thicker skin and not let the word "whining" get to me.  I threw my opinion out there and John responded with his opinion.  No harm no foul.  My response really didn't add to the discussion either.

[harveybirdman]

Bro I'm pretty sure he was giving you a virtual high five.

[jennifer]

   What?... Somebody needs an opinion?...Stand back boys, Jennifers here now.

[wp34]

Bro I'm pretty sure he was giving you a virtual high five.

The more I thought about it the more I realized my response was hypocritical.  Having a thick skin works both ways. 

[jennifer]

 
     (A few minions, to worship Jennifers awesomeness)
                                 

[harveybirdman]

Pics or gtfo.....

 

[jennifer]

   That in a nutshell could be the problem,  ... I bought a new camera for making posts, But apparently the resolution was to high to upload (**Jennifers upload test thread) It was ridiculously difficult to get the pic uploaded for me, had to drag it into some photo manager, or edit it or something don't remeber now, But I cant be the only one who thinks that's just not worth the extra effort.

[harveybirdman]

No plenty people including cool guys like vwallbridge complain about that.

Seriously? open the image in ms paint click image reduce size to 25% and the resize the resulting pic again to about 75%.

Upload and done.

[winnydapoo]

And they ARE pieces of art!

And some REALLY great artists are also ---Deutsche Frankfurters---.

And some art critics are ---Deutsche Frankfurters---!

I think the point that everybody who isn't a giant dick is trying to make is that we care about the gallery as much as its contents.

I agree they are pieces of art. Some people see them as functional pieces of equipment and not art and that's fine too.

Either way this is a community not an art competition. If it was competitive then go right ahead be a harsh critic but if some guy just wants to wip up something quick in his garage to play some games from his past then let it be.

I agree with your statement about caring about the gallery and its contents. But neither of those things exist without the artists themselves so how about considering them too?

And if they are art, I don't know a lot of artists who document and display their entire process before releasing their art(I am sure some do exists though), they usually just put it out there and let the finished product start the conversation. So I have no problem at all with people that just want to post a finished product, we can then ask questions if we're interested in the process.

There was no need to insult everyone who wasn't on point with you by the way.

[vwalbridge]

No plenty people including cool guys like vwallbridge complain about that.

Seriously? open the image in ms paint click image reduce size to 25% and the resize the resulting pic again to about 75%.

Upload and done.

+1 I've been critical of the image uploading process here but harveybirdman is right. It's real easy to resize a picture for uploading. Something everyone should do anyway so that the picture isn't so big that you can't see it on a 24" 1080p screen.

I think the frustration/confusion come into play when builders have to figure out how to embedd the image from the "not a project" thread into their build thread.

I'm guilty of linking to photobucket but I really should knock it off. Mostly because I actually want other members to see my pictures when they are viewing BYOAC from behind their company firewall. 

[harveybirdman]

Sounds like we have plenty of common ground winnydapoo, so I'll leave it at that but I have no idea where I insulted anyone I was just talking figuritively. Not sure what Saint's swearing filter has against ---Deutsche Frankfurters---.

[mgb]

I agree it's best when someone documents their project well.
But I understand it's not always the first thing on your mind when you're dealing with typical life stuff plus trying to get the cabinet done.

what I don't get is when guys seem to get offended by certain builds.
I'm closer to a purist than many but I still like designs to be fun. The NASA project that was mentioned. Not what I would build (I don't even care for 4 player CPs) but I still think it's cool what he did.
at the end of the day, this is still a diverse community of different tastes. Some like a certain style while others like a different style.
Hell, some even like cup holders and 8 buttons per player.

I've been on this forum for a long time (even longer than my current user name) and there have been some trends.
there was the point where everyone was either building an Ultimate Arcade 2 cabinet with a Slikstik controller or a marbled laminate mess with the trackball mount in full view
there was the game changing phase when many were building Neo-Mame copies and then later, thin LCD, Woody copies.
then more recently, the damn flood of bartops.
I love some and others aren't my taste but it's all cool.
Either way, when it comes to this hobby, the best place to experience it is here on byoac

[harveybirdman]

Bad design shouldn't be proliferated, but people will build what they want (as they should and to Rodney's point so should they document accordingly) and you are right MGB, to each his own.

As for the offended, I feel that the group that acts "offended" wants to influence builders in a certain way, in the end maybe it's not the ones that they are replying to but those browsing those threads that they hope to reach.

 

[Token]

what I don't get is when guys seem to get offended by certain builds.
I'm closer to a purist than many but I still like designs to be fun. The NASA project that was mentioned. Not what I would build (I don't even care for 4 player CPs) but I still think it's cool what he did.

Are you me?

[reptileink]

I'm a forum veteran for approx. 20 years (not here obviously).

I used to customize action figures, and now I make custom dioramas an miniatures. Seems every forum runs the same as mentioned previously. Let's face it, cutting wood pictures is pretty boring especially if someone is making a clone. Some people just don't have time to sit and post a lengthy comment, and some feel bad leaving a two word response.

However, we are all here for the same purpose. Teach each other, show off our work, and maybe get a pat on the back. I know when posting WIPs of a diorama or scene I am working on gets no love, it kind of deflates the sails. As much as we do this for ourselves, it's still nice to be noticed once in a while.

I have one crappy arcade build under my belt and I am still here checking out threads, making hopefully useful comments/advice, and just enjoying the learning process. I know I will eventually build my own from scratch, whether it be a bartop or full sized, so I want to make sure I am still learning.

Sadly, my work blocks Photobucket images, and it seems a lot of people are still uploading through them, so I can't really make comments as I can't see the pictures. Then I get home and don't want to spend another couple hours on the computer going back to see the builds since I spend 10 hours a day on the computer as it is.

I do have to second the notion that there has been more in-fighting and people getting butt hurt over comments than I've seen in my short time here, so that might be why people just want to show finished builds (hey, can't fix it now, right?).  I am also aware of the "egoist" that just drops their project on multiple sites without contributing anything else.

All in all, it's a hobby, it's supposed to be fun.

[rablack97]

Good discussion folks.....

You right it should be fun, and learning is part of it.  It's probably just a mindset,

Some noobs read the forums and feel its a common courtesy to document like most of the other trailblazers. 

Some noobs as stated in prior comments are so excited that they built something they just want to show it off. 

The innovators and veterans tend to document more and thats where the learning curve begins. 

So it doesn't really matter what people post, cause somebody else will fill the showoff and leave gaps.  I guess we all should start looking and leaving as well.

Yot, I had a brisket taco this morning, it was bad ass....

[yotsuya]

You know, last night, while everyone was bitching about LEDS and Winnydapoo was playing this passive-aggressive game of footsies with me, I took the skills I have learned from arcade cabinet building and restoration and I made me a nice, solid 4 foot patio bench for my backyard since we're going to be entertaining during the holidays. That's what this hobby has given me - the ability and skill set to do things I couldn't do 5 years ago. Many of the tips and tricks I've learned to pull that off came from looking at builders like Mission control and Spyridon, who showed through documentation what they could do, in turn giving me the confidence to try it for myself. That's where documenting the process became a valuable thing. Guys like smalltownguy2 and their threads taught me tons about monitor repair, and Neph's LED wiring documentation gave me the confidence to roll my own. I'm grateful to these guys because their photos and documentation served as learning guides. And not once did their photos and words come across as a poorly disguised reason to seek attention. The purpose was to share what they had learned, not to garner praise. The end result didn't matter... the process did.

Rodney, my man, I'm having lunch with a good friend of mine today, but she wants foo-foo sandwiches. Lunchin' ain't easy...

[rablack97]

You know, last night, while everyone was bitching about LEDS and Winnydapoo was playing this passive-aggressive game of footsies with me, I took the skills I have learned from arcade cabinet building and restoration and I made me a nice, solid 4 foot patio bench for my backyard since we're going to be entertaining during the holidays. That's what this hobby has given me - the ability and skill set to do things I couldn't do 5 years ago. Many of the tips and tricks I've learned to pull that off came from looking at builders like Mission control and Spyridon, who showed through documentation what they could do, in turn giving me the confidence to try it for myself. That's where documenting the process became a valuable thing. Guys like smalltownguy2 and their threads taught me tons about monitor repair, and Neph's LED wiring documentation gave me the confidence to roll my own. I'm grateful to these guys because their photos and documentation served as learning guides. And not once did their photos and words come across as a poorly disguised reason to seek attention. The purpose was to share what they had learned, not to garner praise. The end result didn't matter... the process did.

Rodney, my man, I'm having lunch with a good friend of mine today, but she wants foo-foo sandwiches. Lunchin' ain't easy...

[vwalbridge]

[yotsuya]

[rablack97]

[ChanceKJ]

.

[rablack97]

holy crap, that escalated quickly.    i just skimmed the thread, but i'd like to weigh in on my 2 cents.

Is it me, or has anybody else noticed that folks lately are just posting finished projects and or just posting a part of the project once its complete with no documentation on how it was done.

I've seen a few members here mention that this thread isn't a showcase thread of finished projects but its a thread to show the process in regards to what your building.

I'm just wondering if all the recent arguing etc has chased away that desire to show detailed documentation, and folks are just building in private and then saying this is what i built take or leave it and disappearing.

Just wondering if anyone else is noticing this lately.

I agreed, this kinda sucks.  NASA is a prime example of a build that we lost out on because the thread was stifled by negativity. Hence my rant that saint moved to its own thread.

Thats not fair, and i was worried about this.  But if thats the way this place shifts then cool. Improvise, Adapt, and Overcome.

That NASA cab going to the "next level" is exactly what i wanted to see when i finished my thread and posted the CAD. I'd really have liked a more granular documentation of how Chris built certain things. Even though its based on a design i'm so familiar with. Not that i'm going to build them myself, but so i can build off those ideas on future projects. Thats what the spirit of these things is, and should be. Not a hate fest telling people that they're doing it wrong. Theres a fine line between giving advice, and shitting on someones ideas. Even i don't know where that line is sometimes. Some people take this WAY too serious, "Guardians of the Hobby", like they're some cultural preservation cop. I've even felt like i'm about to write something with that badge on, then i take a step back, breath, and go outside. If i don'y post in a thread i don't agree with, i won't see it show up in the "New Replies" section. 

I think one of the reasons why the WeeCade, Metropolis, Flynn's, etc is copied so much is because of the ease in which you can obtain answers to really big stumbling blocks. One being the CAD for the wood cutting. I remember the first month of planning before i made my first post, i had a MILLION questions, visited a ton of build pages, documented what i liked, and what i needed to know, and the look and design was still a frightening challenge in front of me. "How tall does it need to be?", "Will my display fit?", "how do i make it look slim, but still not ugly?". If those questions are already answered, thats a HUGE step towards making something. That and the "Cool factor", you see something you think is cool, and you want it, you design your build around it. Like i did with 90% of my build. All the credit for how it turned out needs to go to the people i thanked in the first post when i finished.  (This also makes me want to add a "Things I'd Do Different Next Time" Section to my FLYNN's build thread). We're always going to see "Open Source" designs like that be cloned as long as they appeal to other builders.

Also, this seems relevant:

"People who have abandoned their dreams and aspirations will always discourage others from pursuing theirs."
-Casey Neistat

I really dont care about the cloning, weecade thing, I don't care what you build, just share the knowledge while doing it, if you so happened to gain knowledge from others.

I make weecades, mashed up your design, and onds design for my MKX build.  Trust me i'm no old school police the forum guy, people are gonna do what they want.

When you post your gonna get negativity from somebody about something, but who cares.  Man-up and keep going, don't post thinking everyone is gonna pat you on the back on every part of the build, you will get suggestions and praise if you just continue.  People will learn something from it.

it may be just me but i dont get jack out of look at what i did, as far as im concerned you bought it prefabbed from a manuf. and i cant get that anywhere off the net.

So your documentation was great, learned from it, and its cloned for a reason, cause you documented it.  Go back 6 months or so and just post the final pic and see how many clones would show up.

As far as the back and forth, i say again, if you post MAN-UP and take the beatings, all of us have, in the end you'll finish your project and contribute back to the community your learned from.

[opt2not]

I like how Kanadian Kaneda over here states the "Guardians of the Hobby" are acting as misguided cultural preservation cops when he's got a sticky of how a Nintendo Cabinets should be made or what controls it should be populated with.   Then another on how we all should handle our relationship with our wives. Was this before or after taking a step back, breathing, and going outside? Kettle meet pot. 

[ChanceKJ]

.

[yotsuya]

Roast Beef and Gorgonzola sandwich, Rodney. It was aces.

Clearly there is a divide between those who grew up in arcades, who played these machines in actual locations and have fond memories of them and appreciate them for what they were and want to recreate that, and those who want something awesome that plays videos game, the more the better, for their mancave. There certainly is room for everything and everyone in this hobby. One isn't "more right" than the other. I think we can probably all agree on that.

But I do take umbrage with those who think that people's opinions are fueled by a hatred of new things. New things, if implemented with care, thought, and planning, can turn out great.

For example, my favorite cabinet last year, the well-deserved winner of the UCA Blip!, did two things I don't like in new cabinets - swappable panels and an LCD marquee monitor. But he did them SO WELL, and integrated them in such a well-thought out, well-planned manner, that I fell in love with the cabinet. Doesn't mean I now care for those two things, but I can appreciate the foresight and planning - the way make did them makes them look like less of an afterthought and more like the intended design. It's a beautiful arcade cabinet, not a video game playing machine, but a real arcade cabinet.

Yes, some people probably put way more importance on these things than they should. And maybe they need to move over for the Dave & Buster's set. But like harveybirdman pointed out, there is an art to these things, and some people like to look at them with a critical eye and offer feedback and suggestions that appeal to them. It cracks me up when people vilify movie critics because they don't like their favorite blockbuster ("What do they know!"). The job of a critic isn't to tell you how you should feel about a movie, it's to tell you what THEY thought so you can make an informed decision if you want to see it. You don't HAVE to change your artwork because someone like Opt tells you to, but wouldn't the opinion of a trained artist who makes money for what he does be of some value to you?

In the end, do what you want. Angle your joysticks, collage your characters, widescreen your LCDs. This Guardian of the Hobby doesn't really care anymore. It's all about having fun, right? In the end, no one cares about the wire looms you made by hand, the light up joysticks, the ground effects package, or the artwork you vectorized by hand.

They just want to play some Galaga.

[rablack97]

[harveybirdman]

As far as the back and forth, i say again, if you post MAN-UP and take the beatings, all of us have, in the end you'll finish your project and contribute back to the community your learned from.

THIS

I have no problem if someone quotes me and says, don't listen to this jack hole your build is awesome.

Remember how much thread crapping LeChuck had to deal with Xiaou2?  He took it like a man and didn't let it deter him in the slightest.  But someone make one aircraft carrier joke and then we have to run tell Saint?  C'mon.... If you guys like what you're doing, then tune out the hate.  There are obviously plenty more of the "new school builders" than there are of the old farts.

And again, when there are debates going on in your build thread at least your build is getting attention, like Frank said, you want to have feedback in your thread, good or bad, it feels nice to be noticed.

[BadMouth]

I don't see things that way. 

If someone wants to post their progress in a build thread, it sucks that there be a requirement to spend a good deal of their time responding to someone berating them with the same criticism over and over again.  Post your criticism, others post in agreement if there is agreement, OP acknowledges/responds.......and everyone moves on.
At least that's the way I would like for it to work.  This forum isn't about what I want.  That's what the driving cab subforum is for. 

[Token]

I like how Kanadian Kaneda over here states the "Guardians of the Hobby" are acting as misguided cultural preservation cops when he's got a sticky of how a Nintendo Cabinets should be made or what controls it should be populated with.   Then another on how we all should handle our relationship with our wives. Was this before or after taking a step back, breathing, and going outside? Kettle meet pot. 

Hey opt, you throw a lot of shade at Chance, but "Kanadian Kaneda"?

Dude, that's low! 

[ChanceKJ]

.

[yotsuya]

In the end, do what you want. Angle your joysticks, collage your characters, widescreen your LCDs. This Guardian of the Hobby doesn't really care anymore. It's all about having fun, right? In the end, no one cares about the wire looms you made by hand, the light up joysticks, the ground effects package, or the artwork you vectorized by hand.

They just want to play some Galaga.

I couldn't agree more.   More people should take a page from you when you almost passive aggressively, but politely say "Enjoy your build" and peace out. I appreciate that.

I'm really not being passive-aggressive about it. I'm wishing them good luck with the build because I think they'll truly need it. Since I'm not offering any critical feedback anymore, it's the least I can do.

Hey opt, you throw a lot of shade at Chance, but "Kanadian Kaneda"?

Yeah, haha, i really don't know where thats coming from, or where it started. With Mal either.  I'm guessing they felt i said something, some where that was directed at them, or something. But thats also an assumption. Thats just not my style. If i had beef with anyone i would directly call them out, by name, in public or via PM.   haha, whatever. 

Actually, that's not how it happened. Look at those PMs we exchanged when it went down.

[harveybirdman]

someone needs to make sure they get a vacation from that place.... comes to mind...

which is interesting since the primary member in question seems to be on a self imposed sabbatical

[mgb]

I think I see a big virtual group hug coming

[yotsuya]

LET'S HUG IT OUT, BITCHES!

[vwalbridge]

I think I see a big virtual group hug coming

Yots has a meme for that.

[ChanceKJ]

.

[rablack97]

I mean the whole purpose of the thread was documentation of builds, not who beat up who.

[vwalbridge]

I mean the whole purpose of the thread was documentation of builds, not who beat up who.

+1 And the best part is....this thread will end up with more views than most of project threads on here. 

[yotsuya]

Scott, can you lock this thread.... oh, wait...

[harveybirdman]

Delusional will move it to Forum discussion....


in 2018

[yotsuya]

Actually, forum discussion IS the place for it....

[ChanceKJ]

.

[yotsuya]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

[Token]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

Agree

[vwalbridge]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

Agree

Agree

[ChanceKJ]

.

[yotsuya]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

Agree

Agree

This makes me think of this:

“Well, I guess this is a case where we’ll have to agree to disagree.” – Ned Flanders
“I don’t agree to that.” – Principal Skinner
“Neither do I.” – Mrs. Krabappel

Chance killed it.

[mgb]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

Agreed

And with all this in mind, I promise to properly document the process as I build my new 4 player, 8 buttons per player, dual trackball He-man themed, 55" juke-kegarator-cade so you all may learn.

I'm just waiting on a huge shipment of LEDs to come in. Hello bling

[yotsuya]

Let's just all agree that we all have different tastes, and that it would be really nice if people used project announcements to document their builds for learning purposes.

Agreed

And with all this in mind, I promise to properly document the process as I build my new 4 player, 8 buttons per player, dual trackball He-man themed, 55" juke-kegarator-cade so you all may learn.

I'm just waiting on a huge shipment of LEDs to come in. Hello bling

Document all you want, brother. I ain't saying ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

[mgb]

Just a teaser.
But picture it with angled player 3&4 sticks.
 

It'll also function as the family television

[yotsuya]

Just a teaser.
But picture it with angled player 3&4 sticks.
 

Your build has greatly inspired me.

[mgb]

Actually in all seriousness, that thing is kinda cool

[opt2not]

If people are too worried about getting critiqued on their build progress, perhaps we need a separate forum that is for just Showcasing projects.   KLOV has this, Restoration Showcasing that is a subsection of the main Restorations project board.  Thoughts?

[mgb]

Then maybe there should be a separate showcase aside from the restorations one or that one can be just changed to showcase and restorations just posted in the project announcements.

There's also that "I finished my project.." Sticky

[rablack97]

If people are too worried about getting critiqued on their build progress, perhaps we need a separate forum that is for just Showcasing projects.   KLOV has this, Restoration Showcasing that is a subsection of the main Restorations project board.  Thoughts?

Oh lookie, ideas and suggestions....This is why i brought this up   

[jennifer]

If people are too worried about getting critiqued on their build progress, perhaps we need a separate forum that is for just Showcasing projects.   KLOV has this, Restoration Showcasing that is a subsection of the main Restorations project board.  Thoughts?

  OPPPS (Sorry KLOVE)....I ment to say awesome?

[BradleyA]

As a noob here I can say I am guilty of some of the showcase posts.  This is mostly due to not really knowing what or where to post.  I am pretty new to this hobby and I really like it.  I am amazed at the projects I see on here.  There are some truly talented builders around here. With that said, it can sometimes be a harsh environment for new people.  If you don't know the ropes or the "norms'" around the forum there can be a lot of negativity from some.  I see lots of "Why would you do that!?!" kind of posts about things like paint vs artwork, bat sticks vs ball tops, button layouts, LCD vs CRT, emulation,LEDs, etc.  It can sometimes make people not want to post and that is never a good thing.  I know it can be frustrating for the guys that have been here a while to have new people come in who don't know the ropes posting stuff that, in your mind, is completely wrong.  At least the people are here and interested in this hobby we all love.  I feel if the builder loves their project and the people that play it remember or discover and love all these classic games then it is a good project.  I will do a better job on future projects of documenting the build to help those that come later.  I don't mean to ruffle any feathers.  I have great respect for you guys that have been around here a while.  Thanks for paving the way.  Please be patient with us noobs.   

[jennifer]

As a noob here I can say I am guilty of some of the showcase posts.  This is mostly due to not really knowing what or where to post.  I am pretty new to this hobby and I really like it.  I am amazed at the projects I see on here.  There are some truly talented builders around here. With that said, it can sometimes be a harsh environment for new people.  If you don't know the ropes or the "norms'" around the forum there can be a lot of negativity from some.  I see lots of "Why would you do that!?!" kind of posts about things like paint vs artwork, bat sticks vs ball tops, button layouts, LCD vs CRT, emulation,LEDs, etc.  It can sometimes make people not want to post and that is never a good thing.  I know it can be frustrating for the guys that have been here a while to have new people come in who don't know the ropes posting stuff that, in your mind, is completely wrong.  At least the people are here and interested in this hobby we all love.  I feel if the builder loves their project and the people that play it remember or discover and love all these classic games then it is a good project.  I will do a better job on future projects of documenting the build to help those that come later.  I don't mean to ruffle any feathers.  I have great respect for you guys that have been around here a while.  Thanks for paving the way.  Please be patient with us noobs.   

Don't let it scare ya, If you read those posts closely its not critical judgment, Its about making your game the best (and safest) it can be. a collaborative pool of ideas... Sometimes it does go off the rails in terms of high end quality, But that's the nature of the beast, always looking for a better way, and learning from mistakes....BTW welcome. 

[yotsuya]

As a noob here I can say I am guilty of some of the showcase posts.  This is mostly due to not really knowing what or where to post.  I am pretty new to this hobby and I really like it.  I am amazed at the projects I see on here.  There are some truly talented builders around here. With that said, it can sometimes be a harsh environment for new people.  If you don't know the ropes or the "norms'" around the forum there can be a lot of negativity from some.  I see lots of "Why would you do that!?!" kind of posts about things like paint vs artwork, bat sticks vs ball tops, button layouts, LCD vs CRT, emulation,LEDs, etc.  It can sometimes make people not want to post and that is never a good thing.  I know it can be frustrating for the guys that have been here a while to have new people come in who don't know the ropes posting stuff that, in your mind, is completely wrong.  At least the people are here and interested in this hobby we all love.  I feel if the builder loves their project and the people that play it remember or discover and love all these classic games then it is a good project.  I will do a better job on future projects of documenting the build to help those that come later.  I don't mean to ruffle any feathers.  I have great respect for you guys that have been around here a while.  Thanks for paving the way.  Please be patient with us noobs.   

Don't let it scare ya, If you read those posts closely its not critical judgment, Its about making your game the best (and safest) it can be. a collaborative pool of ideas... Sometimes it does go off the rails in terms of high end quality, But that's the nature of the beast, always looking for a better way, and learning from mistakes....BTW welcome.

Well said, Jennifer! :-)

[Wyo]

Also, this seems relevant:

"People who have abandoned their dreams and aspirations will always discourage others from pursuing theirs."
-Casey Neistat

Hey, another Casey Neistat fan!  I'm addicted to that channel! Haha

In other news, I really need to finish my build.....thanks for the guilt everybody! Haha

[Dal1980]

Just browsing through the what people have done. I'm new to all of this but I've definitely caught the bug with wanting to build my own "barcade"/bar top.

Reading what this thread was originally about I just wanted to say how amazing everyone is who even contributes slightly to this community. I mean there's just so many levels to this whole thing it takes so much of people's strengths and develops their weaknesses but also brings everyone together and unites them on a single goal.

Anyway, how do you all get around your partners is what I want to know, I'm going to wait until Christmas has passed before I ask my mrs for permission

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

Is there a dating section on the website as a contingency to my failed marriage, but then again, I'll have a warm bar top to keep me warm at night and you guys to talk to

Hahaha, but seriously, I'm humbled to be here amongst enthusiasts and clearly very talented people.

Keep up the good work guys!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

[Frank Drebin]

Just browsing through the what people have done. I'm new to all of this but I've definitely caught the bug with wanting to build my own "barcade"/bar top.

Reading what this thread was originally about I just wanted to say how amazing everyone is who even contributes slightly to this community. I mean there's just so many levels to this whole thing it takes so much of people's strengths and develops their weaknesses but also brings everyone together and unites them on a single goal.

Anyway, how do you all get around your partners is what I want to know, I'm going to wait until Christmas has passed before I ask my mrs for permission

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

Is there a dating section on the website as a contingency to my failed marriage, but then again, I'll have a warm bar top to keep me warm at night and you guys to talk to

Hahaha, but seriously, I'm humbled to be here amongst enthusiasts and clearly very talented people.

Keep up the good work guys!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,148126.0.html

Some comments on the spouse approval, good and bad. (You can tell who the married guys are ha ha)

[Dal1980]

Thanks Frank Drebin

  that was a great thread to read regarding 'the wife'... I feel better knowing that there's others in the trench waiting to go up and over.

[Betafini]

"spouse approval"... So that's the correct wording. Had to negotiate real hard to get this one. 

I decided to post my progress on the bartop I'm building after reading this topic.
At first I wanted to take time to build the "ugly and useless piece of furniture" (as my beloved once named it), taking pictures and notes about my progress, my mistakes and the tools and materials I had to purchase to finish it, posting a one and only message here with as much detail as I could to repay you guys for all the useful info, building tips and inspiration I sucked out of this forum...

But after all, why not post as I go along with this! That way I can be stopped in time before I make a stupid mistake by someone kind enough to warn me. 

[mgb]

Just browsing through the what people have done. I'm new to all of this but I've definitely caught the bug with wanting to build my own "barcade"/bar top.

Reading what this thread was originally about I just wanted to say how amazing everyone is who even contributes slightly to this community. I mean there's just so many levels to this whole thing it takes so much of people's strengths and develops their weaknesses but also brings everyone together and unites them on a single goal.

Anyway, how do you all get around your partners is what I want to know, I'm going to wait until Christmas has passed before I ask my mrs for permission

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

Is there a dating section on the website as a contingency to my failed marriage, but then again, I'll have a warm bar top to keep me warm at night and you guys to talk to

Hahaha, but seriously, I'm humbled to be here amongst enthusiasts and clearly very talented people.

Keep up the good work guys!



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My first cabinet was in the dirty unfinished basement. When I built VR, I had gotten my wife to reluctantly agree upon a location in the house for it.
The day I got all the dirty work done on it and moved it into it's new home in the house, the whole thing really hit my wife and she was quite upset and didn't talk much for a couple of days.
She's gotten over it now.

If your wife does dump you, no there's no dating section here on the forums but I suppose you can always go to this years Zapcon & share a room with PBJ and see where it goes 

[dkersten]

So its weird, the only threads that get love are "your doing that wrong" or "damn you just did something different"  the tweeners mostly get lectured because they copied another design or they arent doing anything new.

Missed all the excitement but this stood out as what I have seen since coming here a little over a year ago.  Is what it is though.  I like feedback when I am questioning a choice, and like everyone here I like a little praise when I do something I think is pretty damn cool.  But frankly if I ever do another build I will wait until it is over before starting a thread, and of course I will post the build pics and highlights of the process.

I was the type who came here because it seemed to fit the other hobbies/jobs I spent my life doing.  I can't say I learned much in the way of workshop skills, although I learned a ton about arcade stuff.  In general I like the crowd though, which is why I stick around.  Despite differing opinions, we are all people who like to get our hands dirty, create something from something less, and figure out how to make stuff work.

[Token]

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

You joke, but... A cautionary tale.

I ask: Do you still hope that you and your ex might work things out?

“I hope so,” he says. He’s still eating her raw food diet, to feel close to her.

A week later, on the phone, he’s not as hopeful. “It’s ---smurfing--- perfect that the LORD OF THE RINGS pinball is getting here the same night she’s going on her first date with someone else, which means I won.”

We ease off the subject and onto the unexpected news that he bought a pinball machine.

It won’t fit in the bedroom, so it’s going in the living room, over the boundary that he once promised would separate his hobby from the rest of his life. But there’s a silver lining: Now that the arbitrary limit has been crossed, Kooluris can start buying more pinball games and hanging out on pinball forums—Pinside, he tells me, is a really positive community.

“Arcades are a gateway drug for a pinball collection,” he says matter-of-factly, as if this had been the plan all along.

[Dal1980]

Oh what a story! This guys still can't see. I understand the obsession but omg! Thanks for the caution


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[mgb]

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

You joke, but... A cautionary tale.

I ask: Do you still hope that you and your ex might work things out?

“I hope so,” he says. He’s still eating her raw food diet, to feel close to her.

A week later, on the phone, he’s not as hopeful. “It’s ---smurfing--- perfect that the LORD OF THE RINGS pinball is getting here the same night she’s going on her first date with someone else, which means I won.”

We ease off the subject and onto the unexpected news that he bought a pinball machine.

It won’t fit in the bedroom, so it’s going in the living room, over the boundary that he once promised would separate his hobby from the rest of his life. But there’s a silver lining: Now that the arbitrary limit has been crossed, Kooluris can start buying more pinball games and hanging out on pinball forums—Pinside, he tells me, is a really positive community.

“Arcades are a gateway drug for a pinball collection,” he says matter-of-factly, as if this had been the plan all along.

That guy in the wired story is not one of us.
That punk has moved on from here

[wp34]

I'm looking through the project builds for any changes in the background of photos going from family home to bachelor pad or divorce lawyer letters on tables and such like. Maybe I should post updates of progress of build and marriage

You joke, but... A cautionary tale.

I ask: Do you still hope that you and your ex might work things out?

“I hope so,” he says. He’s still eating her raw food diet, to feel close to her.

A week later, on the phone, he’s not as hopeful. “It’s ---smurfing--- perfect that the LORD OF THE RINGS pinball is getting here the same night she’s going on her first date with someone else, which means I won.”

We ease off the subject and onto the unexpected news that he bought a pinball machine.

It won’t fit in the bedroom, so it’s going in the living room, over the boundary that he once promised would separate his hobby from the rest of his life. But there’s a silver lining: Now that the arbitrary limit has been crossed, Kooluris can start buying more pinball games and hanging out on pinball forums—Pinside, he tells me, is a really positive community.

“Arcades are a gateway drug for a pinball collection,” he says matter-of-factly, as if this had been the plan all along.

That guy in the wired story is not one of us.
That punk has moved on from here

Good point.  People can't seem to let him go for some reason though.

[jennifer]

    ** Jennifer gets all misty eyed for Tully**.... (Sarcasm)

[Frank Drebin]

Wait... That guy was a member here?

[wp34]

Wait... That guy was a member here?

In about the same way as Ashley Judd.

[harveybirdman]

Dude c'mon all BYOAC's need to know this one...

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,135635.0.html

[Token]

Wait... That guy was a member here?

In about the same way as Ashley Judd.

Shhh... Jennifer doesn't want to be doxed.

[Frank Drebin]

Dude c'mon all BYOAC's need to know this one...

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,135635.0.html

lmfao I stumbled across that one the other day.  3 grand for that garbage. 

[mgb]

Yeah that guy was on here showing off his piece of crap pedistal build that someone was building for him.
When things were critiqued in order to help him, he got all hurt.
He didn't hang around for too long.

[opt2not]

Dude c'mon all BYOAC's need to know this one...

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,135635.0.html

[harveybirdman]

see how concerned I used to be about people's feelings in that thread?

LOL how things have changed....

[opt2not]

You used to be such a nice boy. 

[yotsuya]

Jeez, I've been harping on the value of honest opinions for two years now? I need to find a different hobby.

[wp34]

Jeez, I've been harping on the value of honest opinions for two years now? I need to find a different hobby.

 

[BadMouth]

Wait... That guy was a member here?

In about the same way as Ashley Judd.

That was just another one of David Adams' aliases.

[BadMouth]

Jeez, I've been harping on the value of honest opinions for two years now? I need to find a different hobby.

Nothing wrong with honest opinions.  It's when the one giving them refuses to stop debating the issue after OP has demonstrated that they understand the concerns, but have chosen not to take the advice because their goals are not the same as the advice givers.

[vwalbridge]

I'm not really sure where we are with this thread anymore but let me just say I'm glad the mods have allowed it to stay right where it is. 

[Brouhaha]

Here's my take on it, for what it's worth... 

The different reactions/opinions/suggestions I see here in this hobby are very comparable to the DJ world. Purists vinyl DJs from the 80's to mid-90s very much criticize, even hate, CDJs and everyone else. But then CDJs became the norm in clubs and venues. So now the ones spinnings CDJs kinda hate on the ones using controllers (no vinyl, no cds, just straight mp3 mixing through usb controllers). Fact is, some venues and clubs are already moving on to controllers... It's evolution. So now we have the djs spinning vinyl hating everyone else, CDJs hating controller DJs and controller DJs not giving a ---fudgesicle--- and enjoying themselves 

Fact is, I LOVE vinyl, eat vinyl, ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- vinyl. But them controllers are pretty ---goshdarn--- cool IMO!