AimTrak: First Impressions

[Neverending Project]

This is not a review. I have only had the AimTrak for one night, and haven't had enough time that I feel I should make a qualified review. But I do feel I have had enough time with it to offer my first impressions, so here goes. Warning: long post to follow.

Like most who have received their AimTraks already I would imagine, as soon as I opened the box I did a crude setup to see how it worked. I taped the LED bar to the top of a 17" monitor I had on my desk. I plugged the sensor PCB into a USB port and started pointing it at the screen. Wouldn't you know it, it worked very well. By that I mean the mouse tracked my hand movements precisely, even tracking some hand-shake at times. The calibration was all messed up, but that was to be expected out of the box. I didn't have a trigger hooked up so I couldn't perform the calibration, so I put it away until I could get to my gun installation.

My installation into the Act-Labs gun did not go as smoothly as I had hoped. I'll save the details for another thread, since I want to keep this one about the AimTrak. But suffice it to say that the issues were not related to the AimTrak fitting, but rather with some Act-Labs modifications I had to make. I think I had the same "grounding" issues that Syph007 had.

After I got it installed and working correctly, I wanted to try out some calibration on my MAME arcade machine. I had the LED bar already installed (thread here), so I just needed to plug in my gun and perform the calibration. For the life of me it seems I wasn't able to get the thing calibrated at first. I tried over and over again, but it would either not register my "calibration shots" or once I got it calibrated the mouse would jump all over the place and stay in only a fraction of the screen. I tried changing the Device ID. I tried changing the other settings in the AimTrak utility. I tried unplugging my mouse. I tried all combinations of heights and distances.

I thought I would try to upgrade the firmware, so I followed the instructions from the website. Once I figured out you have to select Device 1 from the pop-up menu to get it to see the gun (even if Device 1 is already shown in the pop-up menu, you have to select it again), I could muddle my way through. I tried the firmware update, but it was a very convoluted, confusing process. It involves downloading two files from the website (three if you don't already have the utility), clicking on some button on the utility which opens another window, then clicking something there which asks you to navigate to the folder you downloaded. Then this changes the way Windows sees your gun, and you can then run the firmware utility which is supposed to allow you to find the new firmware to send to your device. I couldn't get past this point. It wouldn't see my gun. I assume this means that my gun already had the latest firmware, but I had no way of knowing, and wasn't even sure I did everything correct.

I was about ready to quit for the night, when I noticed that the mouse cursor was all of a sudden tracking very smoothly on the screen. But the gun was pointed nearly at the floor. Surely the sensor couldn't see the LED bar way up above the monitor from there. I noticed that my coin door was open, and there are three coin slots in my coin door. It occurred to me that the lights behind the coin returns (three of them in a row) must appear a lot like an LED bar to the gun.

Now the gears were really turning in my head. I got to thinking that the gun might not be seeing my LED bar, and that must be why I couldn't get it to calibrate. But I knew the LEDs were working - I verified with a camcorder. So I tried putting the LED bar in front of my bezel, to make sure the LEDs weren't being blocked by the cardboard, or something stupid like that. Still same issues. That's when I had a revelation. An epiphany, really. I saw the reflection of the hanging light from the room in my monitor. I wondered if it could be causing interference. So I turned off the light and tried again.

Perfection.

The first time I tried calibration in the dark it worked great and the mouse cursor tracked very smoothly on the screen. I watched it through the sight of the gun and it appeared to line up very well. Light back on, all screwy. Light off, perfect. I should qualify that my game room is a former (formal) dining room. So the light is actually a chandelier of about ten 30W candle bulbs. And it is only about 5 feet from the screen and LED bar. Not a typical situation, and very bright I must imagine. Today I will try it in the day time, both with and without the light on and report back. But last night it was very late, and I was very tired. I went to bed.

So in summary of this long winded vent post (it is supposed to be my first impressions, after all), I can't wait to try it out in game not that I have it calibrated. I will say so far that although there are instructions on the website, they don't seem to be quite enough. The software utility seems thrown together, and very counter-intuitive to use. I understand that it was probably not intended for the general population, as most of the time you will be able to plug it in, calibrate and have it work (set it, and forget it). But that wasn't my case. So I will say that this whole process isn't for the faint of heart. It is understood that this is for the do-it-yourselfer, but I think there are still a lot of kinks to work out before this is a plug-and-play situation. Once I have mine set up, I am hoping it will all fall behind me and be forgotten. In fact, knowing now that I could have turned out the lights in the beginning I might have had an entirely different experience. But I didn't.

I still have high hopes for this product. In the end if it takes me a couple of evenings to get it set up the way I want, it will have been a small price to pay for the gaming happiness I hope it brings. If you made it this far in my post, feel free to ask questions and I will do my best to answer them.

[Ginsu Victim]

I had the same thing happen with the coin reject lights up close, but luckily it doesn't read them at a distance.

[smalltownguy]

To Summarize:

Issue: Gun experiences 'issues' with nearby light sources being too bright.
Solution: Turn down lights.

Issue: Firmware update and config software a bit cryptic.
Solution: Take your time, and be patient.

Did I get it all? 

We, as 'early adopters' get to face these challenges. But that's our job -- see the issues, work through them, communicate them, and hopefully impact the results of future versions.

Thanks for the informative post! I'm right in the middle of my configuration too.

[Neverending Project]

Yes, and my door was open all the way. So the gun was actually seeing the bulbs undiffused. When I closed the door it wasn't an issue.

But I got worried that all my lit buttons on my control panel would be a problem. I don't think they will even register to the gun.

Issue: Gun experiences 'issues' with nearby light sources being too bright.
Solution: Turn down lights.

True dat.

Issue: Firmware update and config software a bit cryptic.
Solution: Take your time, and be patient.

And ask for help. It isn't easy to figure out, even for the patient.

We, as 'early adopters' get to face these challenges. But that's our job -- see the issues, work through them, communicate them, and hopefully impact the results of future versions.

I agree.

[Neverending Project]

As promised, a follow-up in the daytime. I had a chance to try out my rig in the daytime, lights off and it worked great. Lights on in the daytime, still gets confused.

The only issue I see is playing at night. I mean arcades were dark and all, but who wants to stand in a dark room lit only by arcade marquees just to play a game? I guess I'll get a dimmer.

[TheShanMan]

I do! Actually, I wonder how it does with blacklights. I assume that would be OK since they're not as bright. That will probably be my primary lighting in my new game room.

[Neverending Project]

Blacklights are UV, and the LED bar is IR. So I am assuming that there will be absolutely no interference. In fact, it is on the complete opposite end of the spectrum.

That gives me an idea, though. I wonder if I replace my bulbs with CFL bulbs if they will still be an issue.

[speedklz]

Or put a red filter over the unit. like in a remote to filter out all light but the IR.

[Ginsu Victim]

The only issue I see is playing at night. I mean arcades were dark and all, but who wants to stand in a dark room lit only by arcade marquees just to play a game? I guess I'll get a dimmer.

I turn on my neon clock behind my cab at night.

[crzywolf]

As promised, a follow-up in the daytime. I had a chance to try out my rig in the daytime, lights off and it worked great. Lights on in the daytime, still gets confused.

The only issue I see is playing at night. I mean arcades were dark and all, but who wants to stand in a dark room lit only by arcade marquees just to play a game? I guess I'll get a dimmer.

How close to the tip of the gun is your Aimtrak mounted ?

[Epyx]

The only issue I see is playing at night. I mean arcades were dark and all, but who wants to stand in a dark room lit only by arcade marquees just to play a game? I guess I'll get a dimmer.

I turn on my neon clock behind my cab at night.

I turn on my cabs cathode blue and like it dark in the basement other than the glow from the screen and blue cathode

[Neverending Project]

Second impression: this thing is incredible. I just spent about an hour playing some lightgun games that I have never played before, and some that I have. I calibrated the AimTrak once on the windows desktop before I launched my front end, and not again for the rest of the evening. I turned off the crosshairs and was able to hit most of my shots right on. I really got the feeling that the calibration was rock solid. The biggest pain was MAME really. Some games require two buttons, and I don't have the second hooked up on my Act Labs gun yet. Some I could not get reloading to work, but I'm sure trial and error will get those kinks worked out.

I was sitting on a stool about 3 or 4 feet back from the screen (the gun tip, that is) and I was shooting from my somewhere around my chin. It sounds funny now that I think about it, but when I was playing it seemed to give me the most accuracy, without needing to look down the gun sight.

I plan on making some video showing the tracking of the gun/mouse, and how the calibration changes slightly when you move the gun to different positions. But I will tell you that in a real gaming situation that doesn't really matter. You adjust your gun based on the feedback and seeing where the shots land. So if you fire and miss by a quarter inch, you move the gun and keep shooting. You never even know if where you shoot is just slightly off from where the gun is aimed. And if you use the crosshairs, then it's a no-brainer.

Hopefully some video will show what I mean. I'll put something together soon.

How close to the tip of the gun is your Aimtrak mounted ?

Very close. The camera lens on the PCB is just behind the opening of the gun barrel. If you look sideways you can't see the camera, but just barely.

[RandyT]

You adjust your gun based on the feedback and seeing where the shots land. So if you fire and miss by a quarter inch, you move the gun and keep shooting. You never even know if where you shoot is just slightly off from where the gun is aimed. And if you use the crosshairs, then it's a no-brainer.

While this sounds like it might make for a fun game, it sounds very counterintuitive to those who actually have used real guns and look at shooting games as a way to re-produce that experience.  Shooting enthusiasts make the gun a natural extension of their arm and typically don't (read: can't) always see where shots land in reality.  IMHO, this is the bar that needs to be reached, for a gun solution to be "incredible". 

It sounds like the product makes the games playable with some limitations, but in all honesty, if my shots don't land where I think they are supposed to, or are negatively affected by moving the gun too far out of the "calibrated area", then it will probably fall short of what I was hoping for.  That is, unless these limitations are being overstated and others aren't seeing them (which I would love to be the case.)

RandyT

[Neverending Project]

I have used real guns, and it is not counterintuitive in the least. We're talking about popping ghosts, shooting zombies and hitting animated people here. Or in some cases I suppose video game animals as well. These are video games, and we are standing 3 feet from the screen. I am sure this device is far more accurate than you are wanting to believe. In fact, I would be willing to bet that in some games it is more accurate than the original video game. Although not knowing the optics and programming for most of the games, this is just a guess. What games are you referring to that you can't see your shots hit and adjust accordingly? I'll fire it up and check it out.

As I was testing my rig (which is an Act Labs, BTW, with a barrel that would shoot the equivalent of a 25mm bullet, BTW - and as an aside I prefer the arcadey feel over the real gun for my video games) I attached a laser pointer to the gunsight, as a poor-mans laser sight. I watched in windows as the mouse cursor tracked my laser pointer very well. There were cases on some corners of the screen where my laser pointer dot was maybe a quarter of an inch away from the mouse, and there were areas where it was right on.

There were no crosshairs in the original video games, so it would be highly subjective to compare gameplay from the original to this device. I can compare it to the Wii, which as we know has poor at tracking. I can compare it to Act Labs, which was very inaccurate. I can compare it to video games I played in arcades, and in almost all cases I would say this is a superior experience. Especially when you factor in the miscalibration you usually see in video games in arcades. And I can compare it to when I used to shoot a 9mm beretta with real bullets at a room sized kevlar movie screen which played a DVD scene-like game which responded to where your bullets hit the screen. They are entirely different experiences. No recoil. No loud explosion. No smell of gun powder. No rush of adrenaline. But I hit more targets at home. 

It's a $40 video game device, and for that it rocks (once you get past the hiccups of a brand new product). Extend your arm and look down the sight (and stand that much farther from the screen). You'll see (or not see) those virtual bullets hit (or miss) however you want. But in the end it sounds like you're trying to downplay a competitor's product that you haven't seen for yourself in action. Buy one, Randy, and then post your honest HO. 

[Beretta]

while it's great the solution is working for you randy makes a valid point here.

surely no one is silly enough to expect a video game to reproduce firing of an actual firearm in it's entirety.. it is not at all unreasonable to expect the shots to land where you're aiming.

the spray and pray approach is strictly for button mashers.. some of us actually like hitting what we're aiming at with 1 shot.

so i gotta go with randy on this one.

[RandyT]

I have used real guns, and it is not counterintuitive in the least. We're talking about popping ghosts, shooting zombies and hitting animated people here. Or in some cases I suppose video game animals as well. These are video games, and we are standing 3 feet from the screen. I am sure this device is far more accurate than you are wanting to believe.

Actually, I want it to be good.  I don't have a product in the game, so it's just silly to think that it has anything to do with my comments.  I have commented about scores of items offered to this community, and where they come from really makes no difference.  Either something does what it's supposed to, or it does not.  One common thing I have been seeing is people commenting about accuracy and calibration issues related to user position.  These are major parts of a gun solution, so they must be "on target."  I have yet to see people talk about this solution without adding caveats, similar to the ones you added.  Caveats that were / are my biggest concern about the Wii-esque approach.

I can compare it to video games I played in arcades, and in almost all cases I would say this is a superior experience. Especially when you factor in the miscalibration you usually see in video games in arcades.

Well, this is where the rubber meets the road.  So either you play particularly poorly while being watched by others, the arcades you frequent are shoddy, or the device performs much better than the stated caveats lead one to believe.

But in the end it sounds like you're trying to downplay a competitor's product that you haven't seen for yourself in action. Buy one, Randy, and then post your honest HO. 

I think I will, but it's plain that what I say won't really be taken seriously by anyone wishing to color my comments in a way that implies prejudice.  Too bad you think selling encoders negates my experience not only with real weaponry, but with myriad technologies which simulate their use.

Tip:  If it "works better than the arcade", you should have come right out and said that so as to not short-change the product.  That is the bar most all of here are using, and watching to see if someone states that it meets it.   Is that your conclusion?

RandyT

[syph007]

I think people are making too big a deal out of the minor downpoints here.  The bottom line is it works, and its a hell of alot of fun.   Absolutely 100% worth the money.  Buy one and try it and you'll see.

If you pass on this just because of a few perceived imperfections, you're truly missing out.   Valued addition to any home arcade machine.

[smalltownguy]

I got my AimTrak up and running today. Very simple to calibrate.

Of course the first game I tried was a positional gun game, Terminator 2. Can anyone share the proper configuration I need to do in order to remap my controls to get my AimTrak to control the crosshairs in this game?

[AndyWarne]

Some interesting comments here.

Lets start with the design philosopy of the device. It was intended to reproduce or exceed the performance of all original arcade guns. The first step in this was to design a system which can be used as close to the screen as original arcade gun games. This is definitely achieved, no question about that.
The second was to make sure it is accurate. If you calibrate and then test by looking at the mouse cursor you will see that it is indeed very accurate.
If you then move the gun up or down, it will be slightly out but probably no less inaccurate than any original arcade guns. Moving up or down you would normally lose line-of-sight anyway, so slight inaccuracy is not really an issue.
If you move a large distance back from the screen without recalibrating, it will also become less accurate, but this is not a very realistic situation since arcade guns are tethered by a hose, so the shooting distance is very limited.
What about moving sideways (I mean the shooting position not just pointing off center)? This depends on the firmware, in the next version, sideways movement compensation will be enhanced but in the current version you are still going to be well within the accuracy of all arcade guns.

I take the point about the firmware upgrade being cumbersome. This is going to be a very difficult one to address. One of the downsides in having upgradeable firmware is that users with a install problem may try this as a first action, when its not supposed to be. So I will probably need to explain on the website page that the gun should be working fully before thinking about firmware. There will also be a way to check current version and avoid unnecessary upgrading.

From the comments above it would seem there are other issues with the config utility as well, and I would welcome any other feedback.

I will also add a section on light issues. Maybe copy from the Wii manual hehe. On my test rig I can see what the camera sees, and it does see bright point light sources such as halogen and these will interfere but only if in field of view, or a reflection is in field of view.

CCFLs and fluorescents are completely invisible to the camera.

[wp34]

The only issue I see is playing at night. I mean arcades were dark and all, but who wants to stand in a dark room lit only by arcade marquees just to play a game? I guess I'll get a dimmer.

I turn on my neon clock behind my cab at night.

Nice looking cab.  Do you have build information posted?

[crzywolf]

Quote from: crzywolf on Yesterday at 07:12:47 PM
How close to the tip of the gun is your Aimtrak mounted ?

Very close. The camera lens on the PCB is just behind the opening of the gun barrel. If you look sideways you can't see the camera, but just barely.

I'm using a Namco guncon that came with a Ps 1 game . I have the Aimtrak mounted inside just a tad away from the tip of the gun so , that the barrel of the gun shields the camera lens from other light sources . So far this works for me pretty well but, I'm using this on a desktop pc and not in a cabinet .

[bkenobi]

I'm not sure that the camera would see the lights directly.  On my cab, if I have the lights turned on in the room, I can see some reflections off the front glass and acrylic on the CP.  I would guess this is more significant than the direct light.  When I have the lights on too bright, I do sometimes get inaccuracy on my GunCons2's.

[Neverending Project]

I think I will, but it's plain that what I say won't really be taken seriously by anyone wishing to color my comments in a way that implies prejudice.  Too bad you think selling encoders negates my experience not only with real weaponry, but with myriad technologies which simulate their use.

Randy, I do respect your opinion. It may not be evident from this thread, but I think your experience, engineering and contributions definitely give you better renown on these subjects than most (IMHO, of course). But I think that is just the way it is with competitors. If Bill Gates picked up an iPhone and said, "Well see this thing isn't really that great. It doesn't hold up to everyone's expectations." We would say, "Yah right, of course you're going to say that." But if he picked it up and said, "Wow, this thing is really awesome." We would say, "Wow, coming from Bill Gates is must be an amazing product." The disclaimer is already built into his (and your) opinion of competing products. At least for most people, I think.

But when I looked at everyone else's comments and replies and opinions on the AimTrak who hadn't yet seen the product work, they seem to be just that - opinions and comments. But yet in your first reply on the subject it appeared you were already drawing a conclusion. That is why I made the comment that I did. Save the conclusion for when you review the product. That's what I was trying to say.

I agree that a comparison to an actual gun is moot. Or at least I would say that if you were comparing, then any accuracy discrepancy would be far lower on the list of disparities than things such as weight, feel, recoil and, of course, the "---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- yeah" factor. So my other point is that any inaccuracies get lost in the noise of perception.

Take an example: a shooting range. You sight your shot down the gun barrel and fire a shot. If you can't see where the shot lands you either lower the weapon and use a scope or binoculars to view, or you keep firing sighting every shot the best you can. Either way, you aren't really going to know (unless you use a tripod or something) if your gun sight is slightly off or the wind carried your bullet, or you just tensed a little bit when you pulled the trigger. If you know it is windy, you assume the wind carried your bullet off course.

Take a vide game example: You sight your gun in the same way and fire a shot. If you see the little graphic showing where you shot (like a bullet hole), you continue firing and adjusting your aim to get it where you want. I am not saying that when you see your shot land it is miles off from where you sighted. On the contrary - it is very accurate on most parts of the screen. My point is that in a video game it is your perception that gives you the sense of accuracy. If you fire 5 consecutive shots and the first one lands slightly off-center, you adjust your aim slightly and keep firing, and the other four land closer to the bullseye. But your perception wasn't that the sight is off, just that you missed your first shot slightly. I am not explaining myself very well, probably.

I hope this doesn't get heated. I appreciate the discussion, and it will be interesting to see what others (including you) think about the accuracy after they have a chance to use it.

[PsychoAU]

I took your suggestion and tried a real gun on my cab this morning.  It is definitely not like I remember in the arcades...  After the first shot, the screen went black.  I didn't even have time to adjust my aim...

[Beretta]

Neverending Project again you go back to real firearm comparison

no on is expecting them to be like a real gun.. infact not even the ones that have recoil are anything like shooting a real gun.

what is expected and is completely within reason is accuracy.

some games ya it's ok spam away.. other games like duck hunt, police trainer and hogans alley (still a great gun game) REQUIRE you to be accurate you get finite amount of bullets, time or misses.

mine is not an opinion.. i dont currently have one on the product because i've never tried it.

mine is a "concern" a concern based on what is written on it's product page and about what others are expressing who do have the product.

i think the "concern" was also what randy was trying to express.

if peoples concerns, opinions and comments are only valid once they've tried it then that really defeats the purpose of even talking about it.. as you've already spent your money to find out it's not suitable for you (if thats the case)

my primary concern is 1. having ot recalibrate all the time.. especially when people of different heights or people who hold the gun differently play.. which leads to 2. ultimately the accuracy.. i have no doubt under "controlled" conditions the product is very accurate it's the day-to-day operation that worries me.


situation 1: you're one of only a few if any who use the gun.. the gun is very accurate.. the product in your opinion is good.

situation 2: you have 5 or 6 friends over, perhaps a small party.. accuracy suffers due to the variation in height, stance and grip on the gun.. you're forced to recalibrate constantly or suffer the accuracy loss, the product preforms poorly.

i do not know to what degree the accuracy is im simply say that given the 2 situations the product could both GOOD & BAD, not universally bad but not universally good either.

me personally i want a gun that any one can pick up and get good accuracy with.. no we dont need it to shoot the butt of a flea at 50 yards but it needs to preform well under all orientations, we're not robots the product needs to be flexible enough ot adapt to different users indeed even the same user could hold the gun differently at times.

again perhaps the accuracy loss is being overstated, but that is my concern, there are already other guns out there is there not? but they all suffer from accuracy problems from what i understand.. so obviously you can see how accuracy is a sticking point here.. rather or not it goes bang, has massive recoil, or burns oil so smoke comes out the barrel is a bit beyond what people are expecting.

randy was expressing his concern as a player not a business man.. he does'nt even have a competing product so it's not like he's trying to steal andy's business or something.

[ammitz]

I took your suggestion and tried a real gun on my cab this morning.  It is definitely not like I remember in the arcades...  After the first shot, the screen went black.  I didn't even have time to adjust my aim...

[Ginsu Victim]

Neverending Project: I took Randy's comments as genuine. Though he and Andy have had their battles, they are first and foremost enthusiasts like the rest of us and I saw Randy's comments and concerns in the same light as the rest of ours.

Nice looking cab.  Do you have build information posted?

Thanks. It was a Track and Field cab conversion. http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=78532.0

[TPB]

What games are you referring to that you can't see your shots hit and adjust accordingly? I'll fire it up and check it out.

Randy was simply commenting on your own reports of perceived inaccuracy.  His quote from your own post made that clear.

He didn't say he'd tested it himself.

It's only natural that people will garner impressions from what yourself and others post.

[Minwah]

My first impressions are...great!

I spent an hour or two on Friday night getting things working. Modded my Zapper to fit the AimTrak inside. Wired up to the standard trigger microswitch (had to solder to the contacts as there is not enough room for the included spade connectors to go on). Taped the LED bar to my desktop monitor and went for it. I decided to update the firmware straight away which I found easy, once reading the instructions of course

My first concern was that the mouse cursor tracked a little faster towards the edge of the screen, which I put down to being too close (only just the minimum distance away for it to work). I played a quick game or two but decided to pack it up until I could try on my cabinet...

Yesterday I took to installing into my cabinet. I had limited time to play games, and I mostly did so with the crosshairs on to check accuracy. It seemed very good. The only game I played without the crosshairs was Space Gun, which I played almost all the way through...this alone was a good enough experience to own the gun (even though I didn't have a pedal or 2nd button on my gun!).

Hopefully I will be able to give it some more testing tonight!...

Couple of things that might be useful to know:

1) Use lightgun inputs (not mouse).
2) Use the gamepad/joystick buttons, NOT the mouse buttons (for trigger etc). The mouse inputs could not repeatedly be sent fast enough in some games. Probably a Windows limitation I would guess.

[RayB]

Is this a wireless version in the future?

[smalltownguy]

2) Use the gamepad/joystick buttons, NOT the mouse buttons (for trigger etc). The mouse inputs could not repeatedly be sent fast enough in some games. Probably a Windows limitation I would guess.

I noticed this too. After I configured Terminator 2, I felt like the grenade shots were a bit sluggish if I were repeatedly hitting them (I had it mapped to mouse button 3).

I'll give it a shot mapped to a gamepad button, and see if I see any change.

[KonkeyKong]

2) Use the gamepad/joystick buttons, NOT the mouse buttons (for trigger etc). The mouse inputs could not repeatedly be sent fast enough in some games. Probably a Windows limitation I would guess.

I'm a bit confused on this one... are you referring to hardware wiring or software settings, and if software settings, where are they located?

[Minwah]

I'm a bit confused on this one... are you referring to hardware wiring or software settings, and if software settings, where are they located?

Software...in the AimTrak utility, look at the 'Button Assignments' section.

[Neverending Project]

Videos uploaded here. Hope it helps.