Soft-15KHz - slim new tool for 15KHz on normal vga cards

[wilch]

Ok, thanks. Is there any way to get a 4:3 ratio using this setup with DOSBOX without blurring the image? I suppose changing the resolution to 640x480 would do it, but I like to keep the resolution low on the TV. Or is there an optimum config to use with DOSBOX for TV output?

[SailorSat]

640x480 won't help either

I used to work with a special modeline that has black borders all around.
So the image is 4:3 with borders. Not the best way to do it though

P.S. HD5000 on the way, stay tuned folks

[wilch]

thats a shame. i'd be interested in that special modlines you mentioned though

[SailorSat]

On topic...
My HD5450 arrived yesterday and... well... It's quite mysterious!
Basically I can reproduce the 640x480 4Bit (16 Colors) only problem.

But... If I enable the 25 or 31kHz modes, everything works fine.
Seems the card only does a certain amount of resolutions now...

[SailorSat]

Oh boy... ATI finaly blew it...

HD5000+ series cards need a dongle.
No EDID = VGA safe-mode (I'm still trying to find out what the card is sending to my monitor...)

640x480, 800x600 and 1024x768 are upscaled and output at some higher resolution. Looks like 1280x960 with bilinear filtering...
My m2c can't sync it (30-48kHz). I measured 56kHz, 60Hz (1440x900?).

With the "standard" 15kHz dongle the driver crashes (640x480 31kHz, BLACK screen) on boot.
With an "faked" 31kHz dongle it doesn't seem to work either.

[wilch]

Hi SailorSat, I managed to get a 4:3 ratio with DOSBOX using 368x240. There is a black border around the entire image like you said. Now I'm trying to get the border as small as possible so need some modelines. I see the lowest vertical resolution supported with soft-15khz is x240, can i get this any lower with a custom modeline?

thanks

[lodoss118]

Hi Sailor are you saying even with a dongle it doesn't work? I am thinking of geting a new gfx card anyways maybe a gtx 460. So i was wondering if you still make those e dongles or know a place i can order online?

[greenoneten]

Hi SaliorSat, Thats a bit bad about HD5000+ but i still need a dongle for my XFX GT240 if thats possible.
Many thanks
Ian

[lodoss118]

i also need a dongle sailor moon :@

[lodoss118]

? 

[SailorSat]

I am NOT Sailor Moon

[lodoss118]

i bet you have the cosplay uniform 

[lodoss118]

any news on ati 5000 series

[SailorSat]

I don't want to be impolite, but reading my post would actually help.

It doesn't work.

Also, I don't have all day to play with the drivers. I got a job and several other stuff to do.

[Solstar]

hi all i have a geforce 800,wil lthis program work with it and how?

[rjpe]

Hi SailorSat!

Soft15KHz is a wonderful piece of Software, thank you so much!

It's working with my ATI RADEON HD3650 AGP through a VGA->Scart cable.
I have a problem with the TV... it only displays nicely at 640x480@60hz or 720x480@60hz...
I posted this problem at http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=105268.0

Do you have any clue? The 640x288 (progressive) looks like interlaced....
I'm still trying to find other CRT, but it costs a lot having to throw away a 6 months-old tv.

[SailorSat]

Most likely its a 100Hz Chassis that doesn't like progressive scan.
Best would be to check with an old SNES.

On the other Hand, 640x288 is 50Hz, try 640x240 (which is 60Hz)

[Solstar]

saliorsat,i'lask again..will it owrk with my geforce 8800?because i have a visrtua striker 99 cabinet,i hooked up the monitor and it just smply doesn't show anything,even if its reocgnized in windows

[SailorSat]

Should work fine with a dongle. Though I'm wondering if Virtua Striker had a 15k/25k/31k Chassis.

[Solstar]

i don't even know what this dongle is nor where to get it.apparently it has,its double frequencies.i tried an ati radeon sapphire and it works,but only at 30 and at the resolution of 720 x something,and i can only see a "corner" of my dektop...how to fix it?

[MonkeyJug]

ok guys (and SS) - i've literally spent the last 3 days digesting, as best i can, this thread.  ironically, if i'd started from the back, i'd have discovered within 5 minutes that my 5750 card doesn't work with soft15khz!

anyway, can't get that time back now...

i've just popped out and bought a hd4350 and it was working within minutes, with CCC 10.8 installed. i have installed all options in soft15khz, as i believe i should for my particular monitor spec and i can see all the resolutions listed when i run quickres.  i have an arcade cabinet, with a 29" tri-sync LG-Philips monitor.  the exact spec is as follows, as per the sticker on the chassis:

H-Freq: 15/24/31khz
V-Freq: 47-70hz

i have hyperspin setup on my cab, running about 10 different emulators, but MAME will be my main focus of attention.  i have SS's excellent cabMAME 0.139 installed.

i have set the deskop to 640x480, because i also intend to play a fair bit of nullDC, which is also setup to run at the native DC resolution of 640x480.  hyperspin is also set to fullscreen, 640x480.

i shrunk the desktop down as far as it would go using v-size and h-size, then adjusted them accordingly to get the maximum screen size i could - i then came in about 1cm from the edges just to avoid the problem of the screen distorting to much at the edges.


so far so good...



now i believe my problem is this:

my monitor isn't digital - at least i don't think it is.  the controls for v-size etc are wheels/knobs which must be turned, as opposed to buttons that need to be pressed (does this mean it's manual?), ie. when i try to play a game in mame, it adjusts the resolution automatically, as it should per the .ini file in cabMAME, and it looks beautiful, but the screen is off for v-size/pos and h-size/pos, because obvioulsy my screen is calibrated/centered for 640x480.  the majority of games are close height-wise, but way off width wise, only taking up about the middle third segment of the screen...

i need to manually adjust these using the knobs inside the cab to get a particular game to display in the correct aspect ratio, but of course this then has the side-effect of knocking hyperspin out of proportion, and obviously also, my nullDC and other emus like project64.

i understand that there is no 'one-size fits all' solution, and it's just a case of finding a happy medium, but that brings me onto my main question (finally):

so my question is this:

am i screwed because i have an analog monitor?  is this normal practice?  if i was to buy a digital monitor, would i be able to select each resolution in quickres from the desktop, adjust the v/h-size/pos for each one so it is the correct aspect ratio, and save each one in turn.  will the screen positions then be remembered and therefore when i launch a game in mame, will it display correctly without any need to further adjust the v/h-size/pos?  then when i switch back to play nullDC, will it still be there in all her 640x480 beauty?




i'd really appreciate it if someone could actually find the time to read this and help me out.  i know it's long post, but i'm desperate now!

tia

[Brenry]

SailorSat: I've upgraded to a multisync WG and using a nvidia gtx 9800 card.  I cant use your registry editor because it blocks out the options for nvidia cards.  Using the nvidia control panel I can pluck in a dozen or more 15khz resolutions which work fine, anything above 288.  But when I go to even lower res like 320x240 the screen will change to that res and I get a popup saying your monitor does not support this resolution.  Which clearly does if I leave the popup open and play a mame game at that res its fine.

Regarding your EDID dongle hack.  Is this all that is needed?  I think i have a couple of these laying around.

Quoted from http://www.overclock.net/ati/47962-way-disable-edid.html

If i remove the two pins from a dvi-vga adapter it will prevent edid info from being sent to windows ?

[newmanfamilyvlogs]

On my final cab PC I'm using Soft15Khz on an HD4350, but I'm have some resolution issues.

My monitor is a WG K7400. I have tested this monitor with Soft15Khz on another PC using some older generation Radeon and worked fine, removing non-working resolutions and adding everything I expected. However on this new system I'm missing 640x480, and have several higher resolutions the monitor cannot support (eg: 1280x720, 720x480). The other low resolution modes like 320x240, 640x288 work fine.

What am I doing wrong? What's the recommended way of remedying this?

Thanks for the awesome tool.

Edit: picture of end of resolution list:

[Solstar]

SailorSat: I've upgraded to a multisync WG and using a nvidia gtx 9800 card.  I cant use your registry editor because it blocks out the options for nvidia cards.  Using the nvidia control panel I can pluck in a dozen or more 15khz resolutions which work fine, anything above 288.  But when I go to even lower res like 320x240 the screen will change to that res and I get a popup saying your monitor does not support this resolution.  Which clearly does if I leave the popup open and play a mame game at that res its fine.

Regarding your EDID dongle hack.  Is this all that is needed?  I think i have a couple of these laying around.

Quoted from http://www.overclock.net/ati/47962-way-disable-edid.html

If i remove the two pins from a dvi-vga adapter it will prevent edid info from being sent to windows ?

that's an interesting find,as i have your same video board.now,i ihave two of those dvi ports in my video card,so whenever i had to connect the arcade monitor,i use a vg to dvi adapter.i have to remove those tw pins in the adapter,or in the main dvi cable of my pc monitor?

[SailorSat]

@cotmm68030: What catalyst drivers are you using? I use 9.12 currently

@edid pins: there seems to be some missunderstanding... the problem is that there is no edid on arcade screens. so removing the pin won't change anything.

[newmanfamilyvlogs]

@SailorSat: I was using a newer version of the drivers. I uninstalled them, deleted them, uninstalled the card as well and then re-installed using your recommended 9.12 and re-installed Soft15kHz. The same set of resolutions came up as before.

[Brenry]

[lodoss118]

sailorsat i need an edongle for my 4850 card on my tri synch arcade monitor, i have to connect to a pc monitor first then set it to 640 then plug in
my arcade monitor then it is in synchwhich is weird i thought ati 4850 would work out of the box?

[cyb]

I'm having a bit of a problem switching to low resolutions.

I'm using an nvidia 6600gt with windows xp 32 bit.

I use a vga->scart cable, which plugs in to my rgb scart->component converter which runs to my crt tv. (i live in US so scart tvs are not available here) anyway, when the desktop is at 640x480i the picture looks fine, but if I try to switch to a lowe res, 320x240 for example, the screen becomes all messed up and rolls a bit. could it be a sync issue? I didn't make the cable, I purchased it from ebay, but it said it would work with soft15khz. should I try an ATI card?  I don't think the rgb converter is the problem, it works fine with all of my retro consoles.

[81ramirez]

@SailorSat: If I understood it right, you don't do the edid dongles anymore. But it's still needed for who have some vgas(8800 for example), and there is no way to emulate the edid information without it.
If i'm right, could you post the edid information you burned in those eeproms and the right way to connect it to the vga connector?

And do you know if this one would work?
http://www.hallresearch.com/page/Products/EM-EDID-HD15
They charge you an extra if you want other resolutions programed in it.
Aparently they ship it around the globe, but I would prefer to do one my self if possible(or just buy yours, who is a respected member of this comunity). Thanks...

[SailorSat]

Thats not entirely correct.

I still do dongles, but currently only on request and it usually takes up to 4 weeks.

I'll upload the dongle stuff (specs'n'rom) soon.
Theres actualy two versions right now.
First the classic version with a "special" EDID IC; it keeps everything very small and simple.
And the "cheap" version with a standard I2C serial eeprom and a few resistors. Cheap standard components but may not fit a small case anymore.

I believe best would be a small pcb layout. Then I'd go for a small series production and just solder the connectors on and upload the firmware.

Whatever...
holiday time incoming! (still two weeks at work though)

[dosmame]

Hi, I wonder if somebody could help with my issue

specs
4350 HD (drivers v10.10, and I've tried 9.20)
WG K7000 @ 15Khz
J-PAC (with 15khz & 31khz jumpers set)
Windows (tried XP, XP64 and Windows 7)

From a fresh install;

I install the catalyst drivers
Install soft15khz, selecting 15khz for both 'cards'
Run quickres and selected 640x480
reboot

I see the BIOS halved
I see windows loading halved
But i get a blank screen after the desktop

If I plug into an LCD I get invalid video input, so I know it's set something

If I go to safe mode on the LCD and roll back the reg files and reboot, I get a halved screen

Randomly, I got the desktop good once. But after I rebooted, it was back to halved

any suggestions ? am I doing this right ?

PS quick res only shows the standard resolutions, is that normal?

TIA
DM

[dosmame]

Hi, I wonder if somebody could help with my issue

specs
4350 HD (drivers v10.10, and I've tried 9.20)
WG K7000 @ 15Khz
J-PAC (with 15khz & 31khz jumpers set)
Windows (tried XP, XP64 and Windows 7)

From a fresh install;

I install the catalyst drivers
Install soft15khz, selecting 15khz for both 'cards'
Run quickres and selected 640x480
reboot

I see the BIOS halved
I see windows loading halved
But i get a blank screen after the desktop

If I plug into an LCD I get invalid video input, so I know it's set something

If I go to safe mode on the LCD and roll back the reg files and reboot, I get a halved screen

Randomly, I got the desktop good once. But after I rebooted, it was back to halved

any suggestions ? am I doing this right ?

PS quick res only shows the standard resolutions, is that normal?

TIA
DM

got it working....i was using the 15 pin d then the video would swap to DVI for some stupid reason....got it plugged into the DVI now, works a treat! great software, thanks ;-)

[DizzyNYC]

Hey Guys!
Here are my new specs:
WG K7191
Nvidia Quadro NVS 280 wSoft15k
JPAC
Current Working Resolution: 800 x 600 

Small issue I haven't figured out and I've been playing with the resolution but it hasn't helped.

Get half screens until boot.
Boot looks fine except the start menu blurred and barely visible.
When I try to change to 640 x 480 I get constant flickering. Anything that goes 000 X 288 seems to be stable. However, I still see this white blurry bar at the bottom of the screen. I've tweaked the v-hold, vertical and horizontal settings. Nothing. Other resolution settings just make the screen jump. I've searched the boards and read some threads, but I still can't figure this out.
I'm assuming its a resolution setting. I'm also worried that I possibly screwed the 91 up.  Pictures in the A.M.

[DizzyNYC]

Gonna tweak the 50 60hz pot later tonight. See if that resolves it.

[S_Akuma]

My problems have been solved.. Moved to winXP64 and installed the catalyst 8.7 CD software for the HD 4550.  Windows 7 64bit did not work for me.  My arcade monitor sees 800 x 600 and bellow.. Taito Type 2 games are know playable.  I also installed this costum15khz.txt..............Thank you very much SailorSat for the cool software

I can also confirm that ATI HD 5000 series do not work with soft15khz.

# -= 15KHz Progressive =-
modeline '240x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 5,16592 240 264 288 328 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '256x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 5,417916 256 280 304 344 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '288x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 6,173904 288 320 352 392 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '296x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 6,299902 296 328 360 400 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '304x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 6,551898 304 336 368 416 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '320x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 6,803894 320 352 384 432 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '336x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 7,181888 336 368 400 456 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '368x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 7,811878 368 408 440 496 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '392x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 8,315871 392 432 472 528 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '448x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 9,575851 448 496 544 608 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '512x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 10,961829 512 568 616 696 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '640x240-15,750KHz-59,885Hz' 13,607788 640 704 768 864 240 243 246 263 -hsync -vsync
modeline '256x256-15,750KHz-55,456Hz' 5,417829 256 280 304 344 256 260 264 284 -hsync -vsync
modeline '320x256-15,750KHz-55,456Hz' 6,803786 320 352 384 432 256 260 264 284 -hsync -vsync
modeline '352x256-15,750KHz-55,456Hz' 7,559762 352 392 424 480 256 260 264 284 -hsync -vsync
modeline '400x256-15,750KHz-54,686Hz' 8,567765 400 440 480 544 256 261 266 288 -hsync -vsync
modeline '256x264-15,750KHz-54,497Hz' 5,417874 256 280 304 344 264 268 272 289 -hsync -vsync
modeline '352x264-15,750KHz-54,497Hz' 7,559824 352 392 424 480 264 268 272 289 -hsync -vsync
modeline '632x264-15,750KHz-54,497Hz' 13,481686 632 696 760 856 264 268 272 289 -hsync -vsync
modeline '352x288-15,750KHz-50,808Hz' 7,56023 352 392 424 480 288 291 294 310 -hsync -vsync
modeline '384x288-15,750KHz-50,808Hz' 8,19025 384 424 464 520 288 291 294 310 -hsync -vsync
modeline '512x288-15,750KHz-50,808Hz' 10,962334 512 568 616 696 288 291 294 310 -hsync -vsync
modeline '640x288-15,750KHz-50,808Hz' 13,608415 640 704 768 864 288 291 294 310 -hsync -vsync

# -= 15KHz Interlace =-
modeline '640x480-15,750KHz-60iHz' 13,608 640 704 768 864 480 486 492 525 -hsync -vsync interlace
modeline '720x480-15,750KHz-60iHz' 15,372 720 792 864 976 480 486 492 525 -hsync -vsync interlace
modeline '512x512-15,750KHz-54,497iHz' 10,961745 512 568 616 696 512 521 530 578 -hsync -vsync interlace
modeline '800x600-15,750KHz-50iHz' 17,136 800 880 960 1088 600 604 608 630 -hsync -vsync interlace


# -= remove fake 1024x768 =-
remove 1024x768



Original Post
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

SailorSat,
Thank you very much for soft15khz.. cool software.

My setup
i7-950, Windows 7 64bit, catalyst 9.2, Gigabyte ATI 4550, arcade monitor WG2056424 USA, soft15khz.


640x480 and bellow resolutions works great:)

700x and above resolutions gives me a side by side image (display is repeated twice horizontally)

I would like to add 720 x 480 resolutions and 800 x 600 if possible. I'm looking for the right modeline to add to a custom15khz.txt or usermodes.txt.  I have tried a few but they don't show up on quickress

Your help is highly appreciated

S_Akuma

[ahofle]

Can anyone recommend the best AGP card that works perfectly with Soft15khz?  I think it's time to replace my old Radeon 9800, but I'm stuck with AGP unfortunately.

[deega]

I'm pulling my hair out!

Motherboard: Compaq P5LP-LE, which I believe was made by ASUS by the model number font.  Has onboard Intel graphics set as primary in BIOS
Video: Sapphire Radeon HD4650 512MB PCI-E Model 100253HDMI-64BITL
Monitor: K4600 which probably needs a capkit.
OS: XP SP3, NOT nlite-ed
Catalyst: 9.8
Video Driver: ATI Radeon HD 4600 Series, 7/14/2009, version 8.640.0
Soft-15KHz + QuickRes from 2 days ago

Let me see if I can organize this properly.

Booting with onboard video disabled and the monitor attached to the HD 4650 I can see the BIOS output and Windows startup, though slanted, but once the driver is loaded I get no display.

Booting with onboard video disabled and a VGA monitor attached, I can swap cables after the driver loads and see a display.  There are problems with sync, though, which may be related to the monitor needing some work.  I'll go into more on this below.

Booting with onboard video enabled and the monitor attached to the HD 4650 I only see some flicker as the drivers are loading, then nothing.

Booting with onboard video enabled and a VGA monitor attached to the HD 4650 I can swap cables after drivers are loaded and see a display.  Same problem as above and detailed below.

Questions:

There MUST be some way to tell ATI drivers to NOT check for EDID and treat the adapter as if it has an unidentified monitor attached, right?  I do not want to deal with a dongle.

With the onboard video enabled and a VGA monitor attached to it so I can work with the problem, the HD 4650 must be set in Windows as the primary display or quickres will not work properly.  Is there some way to make QuickRes work on a secondary display??  How about an alternative to quickres?

Now the weirdest thing, and this may be related to the K4600 having old and dry caps in it, but I have managed to get the monitor to sync with my LCD's resolution of 1366x768.  Sure, there were three images displayed, but it synced!  I've also been able to sync at VGA 640x480 with two images displayed.  I have NOT, however, been able to sync at 320x240 using Soft15KHz..  I can ALMOST adjust it to sync, but cannot get rid of a very slow roll both V and H.  Could this mean I need some modelines??

Thanks a bunch, everyone, for getting me this far!

[SailorSat]

Try the external card only, and use the OTHER connector (DVI most likely)
Black screen in windows = wrong connector used.

[deega]

Thanks for the super fast, and accurate, reply.  This is exactly what I did and it does work.  I would have preferred to have a second head on this thing while I'm configuring it, but in the end it's going to be the lonely K4600 anyways..  Now it's on to using a laptop + VNC and RDP.  No biggie.  I'm looking forward to my Mouser delivery so I can REALLY see this monitor light up!

Thanks for all your time and effort in building and supporting this valuable tool.