Ram Controls?

[Havok]

Anybody heard anything about Ram Controls recently?

I have been anxiously awaiting a repro Star Wars Yoke, and it looks like the last update they did to their website was in July of last year. I hope they are still going strong, and plan to bring the yoke to market...

[Donkey_Kong]

Anybody heard anything about Ram Controls recently?

I have been anxiously awaiting a repro Star Wars Yoke, and it looks like the last update they did to their website was in July of last year. I hope they are still going strong, and plan to bring the yoke to market...

That would be sweet as my 11 year old keeps insisting on playing spy hunter with like a joy stick or something. Myself, I can't take my eyes off of that 720 stick they got brewing. 

[Hoopz]

Maybe Charlie (Gamecab) went over there to help. . . .   

[Sizzler]

Maybe Charlie (Gamecab) went over there to help. . . .   

 

[Daviea]

Hey guys,

This is David, the owner of RAM Controls.  I decided it was about time I chime in on Arcade Controls.

First of all, I want to thank everyone for taking such an interest in what I'm doing.  I appreciate the attention very much.

Here's the short of it.  I took a contract job in Texas a few months ago because it was just too good to pass up.  Anyhow, all of the open projects at RAM Controls were put on hold at that time.  I recently finished up my contract job and returned home.  I've already picked up where I left off with regard to the ongoing controller projects. Namely, the Star Wars flight controller/yoke is at the very top of my to-do list.  While I have most of the parts completed, there are a few minor issues I'm dealing with. 

Gears - While I was out of state, I missed the delivery of the gears (whoops) so I'm just waiting on the redelivery attempt now. 

Handles - I was originally going to machine these from solid chunks of aluminum.  After finishing up my fifth revision of the prototype handles, I've decided to go with a casting process.  The machined parts just aren't coming out the way I want them to.  I believe that going with a casting process will be the best choice which will provide a superior part in a more timely fashion.  Casting technology has advanced quite a bit since the days of Atari and I know that the alloy choice, the process itself and the ultimate finish of the handles will surpass that of the original parts.

Wire - Believe it or not, an exact match for the control wire used in these yokes is impossible to find.  I tried using many different types of commercially available wire, sampling pretty much everything I could get my hands on.  None of them were acceptable, so I passed time and time again.  It's too thick, it's too thin, it's too stiff, it's the wrong color, it's shielded and shouldn't be, etc.  It was never perfect.  Finally, I decided to bite the bullet and contract with a local wire manufacturer to produce the wire.  This single item may hold up the project more than the above items combined.

I know what you're all thinking, too.  Why so picky about everything?  Why not just bring the yoke to market NOW?!  Well, if you know me, you already know the answer.  I'm incredibly meticulous and pay attention to the details.  If it's not perfect, I won't accept it nor will I release it.  Hey, I really appreciate the small amount of praise I receive for what I do.  In return, I plan to offer nothing but the best in reproduction parts.

So, standby everyone, the SW yoke project is very alive and about to break free.  I believe everyone will be pleased with the final product.  If you have any specific questions, please feel free to contact me directly.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Xiaou2]

 Daviea,

 Really man.. I seriously doubt anyone would care about what wire is in thier yoke.

 When I worked in the arcades,  the Atari game  "Road Riot"  was always breaking
its internal wires.   They were too thin and snapped after all the constant
abuses.   Finally, I ripped them all out, and rewired with some thick gauge
wire.  Never had to fix it again.

 I think durrability is much more important than an exact replica.   If there
is a feature that is known to wear and break..  people would be much
happier knowing that thier New controller had been equipped with a
better longer lasting part.

 The gears for example, were known to break.  People would rahter have
gears made of materials that were stronger.. less prone to crackage.


 Thanks for your efforts

[tranq]

Yeah, the whole replica thing turns me off - especially as it generally means higher cost:  for example, a certain online company that charges $600 dollars for a yoke...a valid market price, perhaps, but sheesh.  I just want something that's decent looking and durable.

[Daviea]

Hey Guys,

Thanks for the input.  I agree that durability is a very important factor.  This is why many of the components are upgraded to tougher materials and/or manufacturing processes.

The wire is 50/50 a matter of keeping the project "pure" and a matter of functionality.  The larger OD cable was simply too large to fit through the steering shaft without binding up, particularly with three cables being required.  The smaller OD wire was too weak, IMHO, to withstand normal use.  The original OD wire really is perfect from all standpoints.  It fits quite well without binding and it's strong enough to withstand normal (and abusive) use.  So, aside from being a purist at heart, I do have a legitimate reason for wanting to stick with the original size cabling.  The custom wire I'm having manufactured is far superior to the original wiring, anyhow.  Being picky about the color of the cable was an attempt at humor, btw.  I am not aware of there being any issues specifically with the original wiring in the SW yoke, with regard to durability.  I worked on the repair end of the arcade industry for a very long time and I had dozens, if not several hundred SW machines pass through the shop.  I never once found a yoke problem that consisted of wire failure.  It was almost always the gears, pots or the cherry switches.  If you have information to the contrary, please advise.

As for the gears, the 14-tooth is notorious for failure.  No argument there.  This is one area where my purist beliefs were set aside.  I opted for an "upgraded" 14 tooth gear which should not suffer the same design flaw.  I believe that my version will last much longer than the original.

Speaking on the subject of price, I have seen used SW yokes sell for as little at $50, as much as $400.  I don't know who's selling a yoke for $600, but that seems rather extreme.  My original price point was anticipated to be at or near $200.  Maybe this price is a little steep, but I'm producing a quality replica for arcade collectors who want to outfit their machines with a superior, though nearly identical in appearance/function, controller.  I agree that "replica" generally means higher cost, but I believe my anticipated price is fair with all things considered.  Although many of the design changes I've made have increased the production cost, there's no indication that I will need to raise my original price estimate.

Thanks for all the constructive criticism.  I'm going to further consider everything you guys brought up.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Donkey_Kong]

Baaahhh 

You didn't even mention the 720 stick. Not that it compares to the priority compared to the SW yoke...I just want to hear ya say "720" Thats all 

[CheffoJeffo]

David ... thanks for taking the time to post and, more importantly, for taking the time with your projects for RAM Controls.

Man do I wish I had a Major Havoc project, if only to justify the purchase of one of your gorgeous controllers!

And thanks for not straying too far from the purer path.

 

Cheers.

[Daviea]

DK,  regarding the 720 controller.  The project is alive, albeit slow-going. I have two minor concerns and one major concern with the project which is holding me up for the time being.

The two minor concerns:

- I'm having trouble locating a source for the chain used in the controller.  This is only a matter of continued searching.

- I don't have the lower mechanical half of a 720 controller to size up for reproducing (encoder wheel, centering disc, centering disc spacer, encoder disc shield and the pcb bracket).  I have a possible source for these components, however.  I just need to take the time to find out if I can get them from this possible source.  If not, I need to either purchase a complete controller or find someone willing to share their spare long enough for me to draw up the parts.

The Major concern:

- I absolutely cannot find the opto devices used in the encoder board.  This means I would have to completely redesign the entire board.  This means that I need a 720 machine to randomly test prototypes on.  Reproducing this part isn't impossible.  Not even close, just going to be a lot of work.  If anyone wants to team up with me on this project to create a new encoder board, I can source the parts and provide the funding for PCB manf. and final assembly.

As for the remainder of the 720 controller, I've got almost all of the components manufactured.  So, yeah, this project is still alive and close to completion.  Just a matter of getting over the above listed hurdles.  No biggie, it just pushes back the completion date.


Cheffo, regarding the MH topic.  I'm going to produce a SpaceDuel/Gravitar/Blackwidow and a Tempest conversion control panel which will accept the MH roller on the conversion games.  I'm only waiting for word on the artwork for the CPO.  Once I have a commitment, it's only a matter of days to crank out these panels.  This will make the MH Roller look more appealing to a larger group of people, I think.

Thanks for all the input, guys.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Donkey_Kong]

Daviea,

Tell me you need some parts off of a 720 machine so I finally get off my but and go check on something...just up the road a ways.

I think I got that out of your post, that you ARE CURRENTLY in need of parts?

EDIT: never mind, you are...Road trip for me Monday.

[tranq]

Okay, I admit I had a little piss an vinegar in me, earlier.  The aforementioned company that does yokes refabs original equipment.  $200 is VERY reasonable.

720: I'm curious to see how it was connected inside an all; anyone know of an pictures of this?  Still, a crank - similar to a hand-cranked drill - would be optimal.  I don't know why they came up with that funky tilted stick, cos it's weird on the wrist.

Wait.  After .69, Mame doesn't recognise an optical device properly; it flips one way or the other, instantly, and stops; it has to be an AD stick, or mapped accordingly for digital sticks.  There was something nagging at me at first mention of this control in the thread.

[Havok]

Thanks for the response David, I'm VERY glad to see that you will be offering this sometime soon, and $200 is a very reasonable price. I will definitely be on the lookout for when you release the final product, I need a yoke to complete the arcade experience on my cab, and I feel much better about not taking an original yoke away from a Star Wars machine.

Any chance of you offering the buttons/switches to compliment the button cones you are selling?

[Daviea]

I'm glad we're all good with the $200 pricetag for the SW yokes.  This is a part I've needed time and time again for many several years.  I've come across stripped out SW cabs and couldn't find the parts to restore them.  What a sad situation.  More recently, I started up a few cabinet reproduction projects, all of which will require my repro controllers.  To be more specific, they'll require MH rollers and SW yokes.  I've got no set timeframe, but I intend to release reproduction SW upright, SW cockpit and MH dedicated cabinets.  Wordworking isn't my specialty, but being in the business of manufacturing, I have many friendly contacts with wordworking shops.  It's only a matter of time before I have these completed.  Some of the repro projects I've got under lid will blow you away.  2007 is going to be a good year for reproduction parts.

Since my earlier posting today, several people have offered to help with the 720 controller project.  Namely, offering parts for me to sample.  Thank you, everyone.  I'll be taking up someone on the offer if my other solution doesn't pan out. Thank you.  Also, I decided to do a little Saturday afternoon research on the controller.  I was able to source the chain and possibly the opto device.  I won't know for sure on the opto coupler until early in the week.  If this source works out, the 720 project is back in full swing immediately.

As for the buttons, are you talking about the buttons that mate up with the cones?  I have these available and they're currently listed on my website.  Here:  http://www.ram-controls.com/order-cones.html  way down at the bottom of the page.  I have the LED and the non-LED versions available.

As you can imagine, I've got a pile of repro projects on my plate.  Are there any other Atari or non-Atari repros I should start considering?

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Havok]

I've got no set timeframe, but I intend to release reproduction SW upright, SW cockpit and MH dedicated cabinets.

That is great news - I would love to see a reasonably priced kit that I could assemble, and wouldn't cost a fortune for shipping. I'm interested in the SW cockpit!

As for the buttons, are you talking about the buttons that mate up with the cones?  I have these available and they're currently listed on my website.  Here:  http://www.ram-controls.com/order-cones.html  way down at the bottom of the page.  I have the LED and the non-LED versions available.

Yes - those were what I was referring to. I didn't realise you sold them as well. Thanks for the response, and I'll be checking in at the website to see your progress!

 

[Xiaou2]

 Thanks for the replies,  Sounds good.   

 As for other replicas..

 Maybe something that  part replica & part mod...

 The Best shifter Ive ever used was in the Hard Driven sit-down games.

 It would be great to have these for use in many driving games
in mame, and even PC. 

 However, since Hard Driven only has 4 gears and reverse..  It would
be better to modify them to a 6 gear + reverse setup.   This would be
great for Ridge Racer!     And many other racing games.

 Of course, some convincing would have to be done to get the
mame team to allow propper gear functionality.

 And for non mame, it may be good to have a multifunction
board which you can select how it outputs the data.  So,
if in 6th gear.. it might send 6 keystrokes (or joystick buttons) in a row to
switch the gears in games that do not support direct gears.

 And a dual mode..  so that it can support games that allow digiital
input, and an analog mode, for those games (like hard drivin) that
allow true analog gearing.

 Hard Drivin also had the best pedals and Force feedback wheels...
however, that may be pushing the extremes.  As mame doesnt
support force feedback yet    And the atari wheel unit would be
way too costly I believe. 

 The best thing about Driving controls, is that the PC sim people
might jump all over them...  as I do not believe there are
too many high quality, extrememly durrable, and realistic
feeling sim controls...
 
 

[Daviea]

The repro cabinet projects are coming along very slowly.  It took awhile to get all the dimensional drawings ready.  The toughest one was the SW cockpit as it uses quite a bit of wood.  I finally found a cabinet which had been completely torn apart and I had it shipped to me ($450 for shipping. Ouch!)  I received a pallet with a pile of wood pieces stacked about 3ft tall.  I used the bits and pieces to create my drawings.  The wood was severely damaged, but it was good enough to get exact dimensions.  The artwork was another story.  It was destroyed and impossible to use as an original sample.

The artwork for the cockpit is going to be a bear.  I'm still not sure I'll be able to offer the artwork at a reasonable price, but I'm trying.  First, I need to find intact (ideally NOS) artwork to start with.  This will be the most difficult task.  From that point, I need to create new vector drawings, using the original art as a template.  Then I can determine the cost to produce maybe 200-300 sets.  I know that the cabinet will use a lot of material for the artwork, so I can see that cost going up and up every time I think about it. 

The MH dedicated cabinet was tough, too.  I didn't want to disassemble a perfectly intact cabinet to get my drawings, so it held me up a bit.  The artwork for this game is already available, though somewhat on the expensive side. 

I never thought about repro'ing the shifters or wheels.  I have a few wheels for Hard Drivin' packed away in storage.  I'll take a look at them when I have the time to dig 'em out.  If they're complete, it shouldn't take me long to figure out if I can repro them.  From memory, I don't recall anything too special about their construction so I could probably repro them.  The only concern I could imagine is construction of the actual steering wheel.  That may be an issue, but I won't know for sure until I have a sample in hand and research the subject.  As for the shifters, I'm fairly certain that I don't have any of them in my possession, so I'll need to pick up a couple before I can comment.  You think there would really be a market for these?  Honestly, I've never been much for the driving games, so I never bothered looking into them.

Thanks, more to think about now.  If anyone has spare NOS artwork for SW (upright and/or cockpit) or MH I can borrow for awhile, I'd be very grateful.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[MaximRecoil]

Are there any other Atari or non-Atari repros I should start considering?

I know you are primarily concerned with Atari stuff, but I'd like to see the 5-way Super Punch-Out!! joystick reproduced; or even a set of parts reproduced to convert a normal Nintendo joystick to an SPO joystick (longer shaft, the brass "bell", and an L-shaped stamped sheet metal bracket for holding the 5th microswitch). The "conversion kit" would probably be pretty easy for someone with your abilities and resources to do, but I don't know how much of a market there is for it. The SPO joystick is probably one of the hardest Nintendo parts to find.

Be nice to see a reproduction of the "Big Blue Button" used as the KO punch button on Nintendo PO/SPO machines too.

[Kremmit]

There's still no solution for the Frontiline/Tin Star/Wild Western controller, either.

In all fairness, though, I don't know how much market there is for any of the suggestions in this thread, mine included.  Probably not as big as the market for the parts you've already announced. 

[tranq]

And whilst it's good to continually think of new stuff, it's good to keep effort in a few things at a time.  (I just get spent thinking about new stuff, and don't get a whole lot done.  Good thing no one's paying me, etc.)

[Xiaou2]

I never thought about repro'ing the shifters or wheels.  I have a few wheels for Hard Drivin' packed away in storage.  I'll take a look at them when I have the time to dig 'em out.  If they're complete, it shouldn't take me long to figure out if I can repro them.  From memory, I don't recall anything too special about their construction so I could probably repro them.  The only concern I could imagine is construction of the actual steering wheel.  That may be an issue, but I won't know for sure until I have a sample in hand and research the subject.  As for the shifters, I'm fairly certain that I don't have any of them in my possession, so I'll need to pick up a couple before I can comment.  You think there would really be a market for these?  Honestly, I've never been much for the driving games, so I never bothered looking into them.

David Adams
RAM Controls

 Heya David,

 I did a small it of research on wheels and shifters...

 There seems to be only one comparable product that looks "decent" for Racing games:



From a Japanese source..  which doesnt seem to be very friendly to
order from.. as well as most likely high shipping cost.  The prices are
a high too..  But worse than that..  Its uncertain how durrable
they are.  (oh, and I prefer a balltop )

 
 There is also a cheaper Shifter solution from ActLabs..  however, thier
products are known for high failure rates, and poor characteristics
of feel and control.  Thier customer support is also Awefull.


 Seems that there are only 4 choices for Racing equipment:

1) Cheap flimbsy poor control/feel Mass manufactured PC stuff.
2) Expensive, unknown quality, unknown seller reputation, etc...
3) Build Your Own (May be tricky, unknown lastability, need tools..etc.)
4) Pre-Existing Arcade hardware from Happs
  (All pre-existing arcade equipment is junk.  Poor lastability, high
costs, poor feel and control)
 
 I Believe its a good untapped market if prices can be brought to
reasonable levels.  The current arcade stuff is just pure garbage.
The PC stuff in unacceptable, and wont hold up to hard and fast
play.

 Atari Really nailed the perfect driving controls.  Great feel, control,
feedback, and durrability.    The biggest problems with these,
is thier weight, and probably costs.  The shifter housing is a heavy,
thick metal beast.  Maybe it could be made of alternate materials
(hardened aluminum?)  or in a different form.

 

 

[KonkeyKong]

Love what you're doing for the hobby, awesome stuff!

Wondering if you'll be selling the Star Wars yoke gears separately, and if so any thoughts on what a full set of 4 would cost?

[Havok]

I see you updated your site - thanks for keeping us in the loop.

[Daviea]

Well, I've been one busy guy today.  I've managed to get quite a bit done, though I've been stuck on the phone for the better part of the day.

First thing, I was able to source the optical device needed for the 720 controller.  What's that mean?  The project is going from a holding pattern and being put right back into production mode.  Now, I'm going to need at least one complete NOS controller and, hopefully, a selection of NOS parts as well.  This isn't too critical since I've got a bunch of offers of help, so I'm good.

Next, the SW yoke.  I just got off the horn with the casting company I'm utilizing for the handles and it looks lke I'll have a prototype (first article) set on Friday, possibly next Monday.  If all is well, this will put me near 90-95% complete for this project.  This one is very close to being complete.  I'm pretty excited about this project.  It's been my pet project for some time now and I'm glad to see it coming to a close.  As for the gears, yes I will make them available separately.  I don't have any pricing structure setup for the individual components just yet, but I'll have one ready sometime soon. 

SPO joystick - I need to SEE one of these up close before I can comment.

Frontline/Tin Star/ Wild Western controller - This one too.  I need to see one of these before I can really say anything about it.

Atari Hard Drivin' Shifter and Steering wheel.  I dug up my paperwork on the parts in question.  The shifter would be an easy repro project, overall.  The steering wheel may be somewhat difficult due to the large MOTOR used in the controller.  However, I think I can come up with something close if not dead-on.  I'll put these controllers on the backburner while I finish up all the current controller projects.  I'm going to seriously look into reproducing both of these items.

Thanks everyone.

Ok, back to work.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[edge]

(David)

A 720 controller would be incredible.  Thanks for all your work on these repros.

[Kremmit]

That's awesome news on the 720.  If it's possible, you might make the pivot balls, especially the upper one, the first part you produce on that.  I believe the upper ball is used on most (all?) other Atari logo-top joys, including Gauntlet, Xybots (twist-to-turn), and the Road Runner and I, Robot Hall-Effect sticks. 

They also are made of a soft nylon compound, and they wear out.  Most Atari logo-top joys out there play like crap these cays, because they are desperately in need of new pivot balls.  Last time I saw NOS Ataro logo-tops on ebay, they went for serious bank, and the premium price was because of this.  You could probably sell quite a few of those, and help restore a lot of Atari games in the process.

If you haven't got a line on an NOS pivot ball already, I have ONE.  Holler if you want to borrow it for casting.

[MaximRecoil]

SPO joystick - I need to SEE one of these up close before I can comment.

An SPO joystick is a standard Nintendo joystick with a few modifications, which is why I think it would be more practical to make a "conversion kit" for a regular Nintendo joystick, rather than reproduce the whole thing (standard Nintendo joysticks are common as dirt).



The main 3 parts of such a kit would be (1) a new shaft which is longer than a standard Nintendo joystick shaft and has a threaded part on the bottom which is smaller in diameter than the rest of the shaft, to accept the brass "bell", (2) the brass "bell" itself, (3) and the stamped steel L-shaped bracket which holds the 5th microswitch, and is secured to the side of the joystick base with 2 screws. Anyone converting a regular Nintendo joystick would of course have to drill the holes themselves in the side of the base to screw on the L-bracket. The only other part is a small allen-type set screw that keeps the brass "bell" screwed on tight to the bottom of the joystick shaft.

I realize you'd need an actual SPO joystick to look at before even thinking about such a project, but I figured the picture would at least give you a better idea of what I am talking about.

 

[u_rebelscum]

That's awesome news on the 720.  If it's possible, you might make the pivot balls, especially the upper one, the first part you produce on that.  I believe the upper ball is used on most (all?) other Atari logo-top joys, including Gauntlet, Xybots (twist-to-turn), and the Road Runner and I, Robot Hall-Effect sticks. 

They also are made of a soft nylon compound, and they wear out.  Most Atari logo-top joys out there play like crap these cays, because they are desperately in need of new pivot balls.  Last time I saw NOS Ataro logo-tops on ebay, they went for serious bank, and the premium price was because of this.  You could probably sell quite a few of those, and help restore a lot of Atari games in the process.

I totally agree.  Seems to me the pivot ball was designed to wear down (vs the black joystick case wearing down).  With all five of my atari sticks I have that use it (shifter (hi/low), cyberball (2, 8way), roadrunner (hall effect), 720), I have exactly one pivot ball not in bad shape.  It's still NOS, actually, since I don't want it used until I have more backups.    Until now, it's been

To paraphrase kemmit, "If [you need] I have ONE [NOS pivot ball].  Holler if you want to borrow it for casting."   (If you need any other parts except for a working 720 sensor board , I can help, too.)

Another issue caused by all the worn pivot balls is the shape of the joystick cases out there.  If the pivot ball gets badly worn (rough), the case also wears down.  Especially after the ball get so worn the metal pin holding the ball sticks out.   Two of my five joystick case tops are like this, and I'll need to replace them when I replace the pivot balls, or I won't be able to tell that there's a new ball in there.  Luckily, the case top part is also common between all these joysticks, so if you make a few extras of this part too, you might find a nice niche market for them (although not nearly as big as the pivot ball).

Good luck!

[Daviea]

Maxim, thanks for the pic of the SPO joystick.  I can tell from that pic alone that the repro would not only be possible, but it would also be very easy to do.  It would super easy to release as a retrofit kit, as well.

As for the 720 controller, I'm going to run off a few hundred spares of both the pivot ball and the upper/lower housings.  These parts (well, the upper housing and pivot ball anyway) are used across many different joystick types that Atari made, so I planned on stocking up not only to sell as individual parts but to also supply the additional reproduction projects I've got brewing.  Additionally, I plan to run off spare lower balls, pivot arms, encoder discs and centering discs.  Once I'm done with a few more of these projects, there won't be a lack of parts available any longer.

I'm probably going to go with delrin for the pivot ball, as opposed to nylon 6/12.  I believe the wear properties of delrin exceed those of nylon in a situation like this.  The only concern I have is that the delrin may be too hard which could potentially cause some binding.  Then again, my first impression is that this would be a definite upgrade to the original.  I'll think it over some more before I make my final decision on the subject.  Either way, I *need* a NOS pivot ball as well as NOS upper/lower housing components before I can move any further on those parts.  Speaking of which, I'm tossing around the idea of reproducing the upper and lower housing components out of aluminum and then hard black anodizing them.  I know this will bring up production cost somewhat, but the parts sure would look sweet!  Not to mention the obvious durability gains.  Any comments on the subject?

Unless I hear otherwise sometime soon, I'm going to take you guys up on the NOS parts as well as the complete (or mostly complete) 720 controller.  I'll reciprocate by handing over a few spare repro parts in return.

Thanks guys.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Daviea]

Ok, I've had some more time to go over the 720 controller today while I've got SW parts taking up the machine time. 

I was just thinking about the optical board and realized that I could use two or three *dead* boards for my purposes.  One to strip clean to create new negatives, one for parts placement and a third for backup.  If anyone has one or more dead 720 optical boards they'd like to hand over, I would be willing to send a working replacement as soon as I get them fabricated.  However, it could take days, weeks or months (read: no completion date set yet) before I send out the repro optical boards.

Also, I'm ready to accept a whole controller (to use as a build model) and any NOS components that can be spared due to the fact that my samples are either missing or too worn.  I'll return any parts that are loaned to me.  I'll swap out a brand new repro unit if I can *keep* a complete NOS or near-NOS unit in return.

Lastly, does anyone have a whole 720 machine (local to Huntington Beach, CA) that they'd like to sell to me?  While I'm sure I'll get this right the first time, I would prefer having a machine to fully test form, fit and function before releasing anything.  I'd like to get a nice minty machine, but anything will do as long as it's functional.

That's about it for the 720 controller for right now.  Contact me directly on Arcade controls or at the email address listed in my profile.

Thanks everyone.

David Adams
RAM Controls

[Kremmit]

Looks like that SPO joy has a 4-way restrictor plate on it.  If you do a repro on those, you ought to make the 4-way restrictors as well.  Most of the Nintendo sticks out there on the used market have an 8-way restrictor, or no restrictor plate at all.  4-ways are hard to find.  And the 2-way plates for Mario Bros.?  Forget about it. 

PM sent re:  Pivot Ball

[usedelectronics]

My offer still stands on the loan of my NOS 720 controller.
I also have a bunch of NOS pivot balls, and other parts as well.
Let me know.

[MaximRecoil]

Maxim, thanks for the pic of the SPO joystick.  I can tell from that pic alone that the repro would not only be possible, but it would also be very easy to do.  It would super easy to release as a retrofit kit, as well.

No problem. I had a feeling it would be easy for you to do, considering it is just a couple of machined parts + a stamped part. Let me know if you ever want to reproduce one and I might be able to lend you my SPO joystick to go by, depending on how long you would need to keep it for. I can't go very long without it because SPO is my favorite game. Another option, if you decide to to go with this, would be to put out a call on RGVAC for one. There may be someone who has one that isn't as attached to it as I am that could lend it out for a longer time.

Looks like that SPO joy has a 4-way restrictor plate on it.  If you do a repro on those, you ought to make the 4-way restrictors as well.  Most of the Nintendo sticks out there on the used market have an 8-way restrictor, or no restrictor plate at all.  4-ways are hard to find.  And the 2-way plates for Mario Bros.?  Forget about it. 

Yeah, no restrictor plate at all seems to be the most common. But yeah, PO/SPO joysticks use a 4-way restrictor that should be as easy as the other parts to reproduce (a while back someone on RGVAC said they ran off a bunch of them on a CAD machine). Speaking of the 2-way restrictors, the Nintendo game "Arm Wrestling" also used an SPO joystick (SPO and Arm Wrestling being the only two games to use that joystick), but the Arm Wrestling version used a 2-way restrictor.

The SPO joystick still works fine as a regular Nintendo 4-way joystick for any Nintendo 4-way game, so some people might want to convert an extra Nintendo joystick they have kicking around even if they don't have an SPO machine, just in case they ever come across one, or want to have an authentic way of playing SPO in MAME.

[Xiaou2]

 Hmm, another Repo Idea...

  Wico balltop  8-way leaf joysticks.

  These are really desired for many classics. 

 Id love a few sets of these...   and Im sure  Tons of people would too.

[pointdablame]

 Hmm, another Repo Idea...

  Wico balltop  8-way leaf joysticks.

  These are really desired for many classics. 

 Id love a few sets of these...   and Im sure  Tons of people would too.

I think a more pressing need would be a good source for replacement Wico leafswitches.  I know I could use quite a few switches, but my joysticks are holding up alright.

Repro joys would be great too though.

[Hoopz]

Since Oscar stopped making restrictor plates, would that be something that you can do?

[Daviea]

Anyone have any of these restrictor plates in NOS condition?  If it's what I think it is, it wouldn't take much time or $$ to make up a batch.  I could easily squeeze these into the middle of everything else I've got going on.  Whatever the material was that they originally used for these parts, if they're prone to wearing out, I can probably upgrade the material to make it a longer lasting part.

Maxim, when I get to the point where I'm ready to work on the SPO joystick, I'll contact you.  Thanks for the offer.  I would need the joystick for a week or two at most.

I've already got the Wico 8-way leaf joystick on my list of to-do's.  I could use quite a few, myself. :-)  I'll need a NOS part to work with, but I've got some time before I start work on this project, so no hurry. 

Anyone on the board know of a person or a company that can produce a quality ball top for the shafts?  This is one issue I'm coming across for several projects, but I have some options.  The only problem is that while the companies I have found are capable of molding the ball top right onto the shaft, it's not what they "do" so it will be inherently more expensive than it should be.  I was hoping I could find someone/someplace that already does this, so I can avoid the step of explaining (in detail) what exactly it is that I need and save a few bucks while I'm at it.

The leaf switches are another story.  I've looked high and low for replacements and I've yet to find a reliable source of good/high quality leaf switches.  I have metal stamping capabilities as well as laser metal cutting equipment, so I can probably make the leafs, I just need a good sample to start with.  Every single Wico joystick I have is missing it's entire set of leaf switches. Yeah, nice. Are the original leaf switches serviceable?  Can the leafs and leafswitch base be disassembled to replace the leafs?   If not, I feel that an update is about due.

David

[RayB]

I'm pretty sure the leaf switch casing is molded....

Regarding 720 parts, this guys sells some:
https://www.videogameparts.com/categoryNavigationDocument.hg?categoryId=15

But they are pricey!

[quarterback]

Anyone on the board know of a person or a company that can produce a quality ball top for the shafts?  This is one issue I'm coming across for several projects, but I have some options.  The only problem is that while the companies I have found are capable of molding the ball top right onto the shaft

I believe that RandyT's Versa joystick balls can be removed from his shafts (insert joke here) so he would know somebody who can make them. 

Every single Wico joystick I have is missing it's entire set of leaf switches. Yeah, nice. Are the original leaf switches serviceable?  Can the leafs and leafswitch base be disassembled to replace the leafs?

I don't have any NOS Wicos, but I have a number of Wico 8-ways and the leaf switches all appear to be molded with the metal leafs securely inside the plastic.

[Daviea]

Heads up.

The optical devices (used on the 720 dual optical coupler board) arrived this morning via FedEx Priority Sat. Delivery.  I grabbed up enough to supply the 720 project for many years.  I've done some initial testing and determined that the parts conform with regard to form and fit.  I'm going to spot check the parts on Monday in my test rig to ensure that they function as expected.  I've already sent the PCB's off to fab, so they'll be in my hands in a week or two.  I figure that if all goes as planned, I'll be able to make the optical boards individually available before the remainder of the controller.  So, if you've been looking for a replacement dual optical coupler board for 720, the wait is almost over.

FYI, I know it's not exactly controller related, but I'm also working on the Tempest to Major Havoc conversion boards and the Space Duel, Gravitar, Blackwidow to Major Havoc conversion boards.  I've got 99% of the parts in and the boards are off to fab as well.  The only piece I'm having trouble with sourcing is the VDR/Varistor used on nearly all of the Atari color XY boards.  This might hold things up a bit, but I'll find a solution eventually. If anyone has any insight into this part, I'm listening.

That's about it for right now.

David

[Xiaou2]

I think the biggest problem with Vector machines is the Vector monitors themselves.

 Either the monitor damaged, burned in, or missing..  or the monitor boards
themselves are toasted.  (afaik)

 Would be great to have real vector monitors available for use in mame..  however,
I imagine the cost may be quite high to reproduce such a thing.  Also,
there is no support in the official build for vector monitors.

 Another idea, is a Laser projector.. as thats about the closest to a
true vector image... however, that may cost even more.  There is
a new 3 color laser projector comming in 2008..  but because its
made to  display typical  images... it may lack the overall power
and look of a typical laser beam used in lightshows.

 

[Havok]

David,

Is there any updated timeframe as to completion of the Star Wars yoke?

[pointdablame]

You've got me extremely excited about the prospect of having a new supply of Wico leafswitches.  I have a few leafswitches in good condition if you need to see one, but I wouldn't say they were NOS.

I'd love the chance to replace all my leafswitches though, as most are quite bent and messy from when I got them.

[ahofle]

Don't current pinball machines still have leafswitches for the flipper buttons?  Just wondering because that would imply they are still being made by someone.

[pointdablame]

Wico leafs are specific to Wico joys.  You can find generic leafswitch replacements but they won't fit correctly on the underside of the joystick base.

[ahofle]

Ahhh bummer.

[Daviea]

Hey everyone,

Here's the latest update to keep you in the loop.

Star Wars yoke. I took receipt of the sample handle castings.  They look GOOD.  Slightly off, but good.  I made some slight changes and I'm having a second set of first articles produced, so I'm just waiting on them.  I received the gears and they're spot-on and look perfect.  The wire is in production now, I should have it by the end of next week, possibly the middle of the following week.  Everything is progressing nicely.  I hope to have the yoke completed and released by the end of Feb. but I cannot commit to an exact release date yet as I'm waiting on the outside vendors to produce the handles and wire.

720 controller.  I have parts reproduced for most of the controller with the exception of the handle shaft, pivot ball, lower mechanical half and the dual opto board.  I received a NOS pivot ball to work from (Thanks Kremmit) and I'm expecting a complete controller and some spare parts sometime soon (Thanks usedelectronics).  I've already drawn up the pivot ball and expect to put it into production next week.  I should have samples, possibly the entire production run, ready by end of next week.  I've upped my production count to 1000pcs on the pivot ball since I'm going to need it for several other controllers I'm reproducing.  The handle shaft is an interesting topic.  I was very focused on having the knob cast right onto the shaft, using a polished up phenolic-like material.  I realized I could make the knob from aluminum and hard anodize it (in black) and screw it right onto the shaft.  I think it would look MUCH better, though obviously not "exact" when compared to the original.

Lunar Lander thruster.  I've got most of this controller done.  The only part I'm waiting on is the plastic thrust controller cover.  This is a vacuum formed part and since my vacuum form machine is down, I'm relying on an outside vendor for help.  Naturally, they're backlogged on jobs, soooo.... I'm waiting.

Hall Effect Joystick.  This project is coming along nicely.  I'm considering options on the handle knob (just like the 720 controller) and the hall effect sensor.  It's proving to be a challenge.  The mechanical components of the controller itself isn't an issue.

Analog joystick.  This project is pretty much in the same boat with the hall effect joystick, however I could use a few NOS parts which would help push along this project.

Tempest Spinner.  I recently added this project to the lineup.  I'm tired of the BrrrRRrrrRRRRrrrr sound that my OEM part makes everytime I spin it (yeah, I even have the new bearing/bushings installed!).  So, I'm making a spinner unit that fits the same footprint, but also incorporates real bearings which will provide a nice smooth spin once and for all.

Assault joystick.  My Assault game has been on the fritz for the last couple of years and it's due to failing controllers.  I went out looking for some replacements and realized that they are near impossible to locate.  Time to repro!  This will be an easy repro given the other projects I've got going on as some parts will swap between the different controllers.

Hard Drivin' shifter.  I've looked over an original shifter and I'm confident I can reproduce this.  As an added bonus, I believe I can also offer a 6+R shift plate and 6+R knob for the MAME users.  This project is on the backburner while I work on the above projects, but I have to admit that I'm somewhat anxious to work on this one.  There are some aspects of this project that interest me quite a bit.

Ok, I think that's about it for now.  If anyone has comments or suggestions, I'm listening.

Thanks

David

[usedelectronics]

Update:
I found a couple NOS wico's and packed them in with the 720 controller. I also included  a bunch of extra 720 controller parts.

Question, since you have the required "skill" have you considered reproducing the tron joystick bases? (Handles are being done by others already.)

[jerryjanis]

I am really excited to hear that you are working on a 720 joystick!  In case it's of any use, I have some pictures on my website that may (or may not) be useful for you.  The last two pictures are pages from the game's manual that someone sent me:

http://www.jstookey.com/arcade/720/720-pictures.php
http://www.jstookey.com/arcade/720/720man_controller_a.jpg
http://www.jstookey.com/arcade/720/720man_controller_b.jpg

An interesting thing about the pictures from the manual is that some of the parts on the original joystick that I own are slightly different from the ones in the manual.  For example, the shaft on my joystick is solid - mine doesn't have the lathed section in the middle.  My best guess is that maybe some of the joysticks broke, and they redesigned that part on newer revisions.

[Daviea]

I've considered the Tron joystick, but I thought someone else was working on it, though I could be mistaken.  The last time I looked into this, I was having one heck of a time locating a decent handle to work from.  I can make the molds for the handles if I had a NOS version to work with.  But then I heard that someone else had made the handles and I could have sworn I heard that someone (possibly the same person) was going to make whole repro controllers.  Who's doing the handles?  Is it specialty plastics? 

If the handles are really being made AND I can work out a decent price on a rather large order (200-300pcs) AND nobody is already making the base of the joystick, I think I can get involved in this one.  I'd rather incorporate already made parts into any design I work on, provided that said parts are of excellent quality/workmanship and I can get them for a price near (or UNDER) what it would cost me to do them myself.  I'll gladly reopen this project if nobody else is already working on it and I have options for the handles.

Now that I think about it, I seem to recall that Fozzy was working on the handles... did he ever make the base for the joystick?

David

[Kremmit]

Who's doing the handles?  Is it specialty plastics? 
....

Now that I think about it, I seem to recall that Fozzy was working on the handles... did he ever make the base for the joystick?

Tom from Specialty Plastics has dissapeared again.  Last anybody heard from him, his handle mold was shot and he couldn't find a good enough handle to cast from.  Fozzy was working on casting handles only, but it's a spare-time project for him, and he's short on spare time.

[Daviea]

Was there anyone else working on the Tron handles?  If they're not easily available right now, that puts this project idea in a bit of a pickle. 

On the one hand, I can easily do the handles myself if I had a NOS part (or very close to NOS part) to work with.  But I might be stepping on the toes of people(?) who already have time/money invested into a spare-time project.  I'd hate to do that to anyone.  I know how it feels because I drop bank into my projects, so I worry about others bringing a similar product to market before I'm finished. 

On the other hand, if I knew for a fact that whomever is working on the handles has already dropped the project, I could begin without worry of walking over anyone.  So, Tom's out.  Fozzy....is in, but no announced time table.

I guess I could look into making the base without the handle in the meantime, but I specifically recall 1UP (I think that's who it was) stating that the base units were being worked on?  Again, if this is the case, I don't want to step on any toes. 

I have a habit of going way over the top when I work on projects.  The cone wars was a good case in point.  I produced a whopping 5000pcs each of the short black, short silver and tall black cones and began selling them off to my vendors (of which "Arts Arcade Games" was one) and little did I know that an alternate manufacturer (AtariSwitch) was quietly working on the same thing (however, only the tall cones).  I believe he only made a couple hundred parts.  Anyhow, seeing as I made so fricken many cones and it was done using my own equipment, I was able to offer a price which allowed Art to conduct some stiff competition.  Why'd I make so many cones?  Because I could and gosh darnit, I *hate* running out of parts.  Yeah, over the top.    Same will go for just about anything I make.  There'll never be a shortage of anything once I get involved.  I just don't want to trample over anyone while I'm doing it.

So, I need to know where the Tron handles and Tron bases really are before I commit to this one.  I'd LOVE to work on it because it seems like an excellent challenge, but I need some peace of mind beforehand.

David

[Fozzy The Bear]

On the other hand, if I knew for a fact that whomever is working on the handles has already dropped the project, I could begin without worry of walking over anyone.  So, Tom's out.  Fozzy....is in, but no announced time table.

Hi David....... Yes I'm still working on handles..... You're also correct that there's no announced timetable. As for supplying 300 of them, sorry! Not my thing at all. I'm not mass producing them If I do 100 in total that's probably all it will be.

You wouldn't be treading on my toes at all by producing complete units. As long as you understand that as soon as I can, I will be selling handles only, to members who want them. I have to recoup my development costs, regardless of any other production that might be going. So you'd have to be prepared for the fact that I might end up treading on your toes in that respect.

Other than that, I've no problem with it at all mate!  You feel free to go ahead. I wouldn't be looking at production runs of the size that you do them in any case.

The only thing that confuses me with what you do David is the sheer number of projects you already have in development. From a commercial point of view, you seem to have a lot of projects that are incomplete right now. Excepting Atari Cones that is......   Doesn't make a lot of commercial financial sense to me.  I would have thought you would want to get product to market and concentrate on doing that with one thing at a time, so that you actually have a stable grounding.

The only reason I mention the above is that my concern would be that you turn into another vendor that vanishes overnight, because your cashflow on these products could well end up very much in the red.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Daviea]

Hey Fozzy.  Thanks for the quick follow-up.  I understand where you're at in this.  Once your production run starts, can you give me a heads up?  We should talk at that point in time just for good measure.

OK, I'm going to put some serious consideration into the Tron controller project.  Now, does anyone know if anyone else (1UP??) is working on the controller base?  If not, that should pretty much be a GO as far as I'm concerned.

I'll need a NOS Tron handle before I can start.  Anyone?  I'll need it for about.. oh, let's call it 6 weeks.  That should give me ample time to get some dimensional drawings done.  With that, I can make some molds, compare to the originals and then send the job off to fab.  I'll have to do some in-depth research to get the color and material properties matched up, but it shouldn't be too time consuming.  In fact, if I'm not mistaken, the original material used for the Tron handles was somewhat brittle or prone to breaking.  I'll have to see about correcting that flaw.

Sounds like fun to me.  I love this stuff.

David

[Fozzy The Bear]

Hey Fozzy.  Thanks for the quick follow-up.  I understand where you're at in this.  Once your production run starts, can you give me a heads up?  We should talk at that point in time just for good measure.

No Problem.... I'll drop you a line when I get to that stage.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Kremmit]

Heh.  I got some of your cones (via Art) as well as some of the Atariswitch ones "back during the war".     Both parts are very, very nice, btw.

I don't believe 1UP was making acutal repro Tron bases- I think he was working on a new base that would mimic the Tron restriction but fit in a standard Happ mounting template.  I could be off on this, though.  In any event, he hasn't been seen around these parts much in the last year or so.

[Havok]

I hope to have the yoke completed and released by the end of Feb. but I cannot commit to an exact release date yet as I'm waiting on the outside vendors to produce the handles and wire.

Great news! Looks like this is going to make a perfect birthday present for me, hopefully you can deliver on your projected availability. One question: I assume this is going to be an exact reproduction, so us Mame folks will have to supply our own pc interface (sidewinder hack/aki, etc)? Or, are there also plans to include an optional pc interface?

[Xiaou2]

 David,

  As far as I recall, 1up was trying to make modified bases that were less
bulky..  of course,  this would have caused them to be less durrable.
It coudl have also been some sort of restrictor for place over typical
8ways.  Again, not a very durrable solution.

  One special thing about the Tron sticks were the specialized
restrictors.   Making a 4 way restrictor but out of some sort of
rubber.  This then allowed 8way movment if you pressed hard
enough.   Quite ingenious   ... and the only way to play the
lightcycle section of the tron game.

 Someone was considering making the restrictors only, so that
they could be transplanted onto the other non-tron 8way
joysticks.   However, it never got completed.  Also, the materials
were not correct.  And finally, I dont think anyone makes the
leafs for them either. 

 Another great Repro would be the 4  way Pacman joys.  As most
are completely devestated by now.  Many people are
replacing them with joys that really are not very good
feeling nor controlling.   They actually have a very simular base
to the tron sticks.

[u_rebelscum]

An interesting thing about the pictures from the manual is that some of the parts on the original joystick that I own are slightly different from the ones in the manual.  For example, the shaft on my joystick is solid - mine doesn't have the lathed section in the middle.  My best guess is that maybe some of the joysticks broke, and they redesigned that part on newer revisions.

Thanks for the reminder!  Atari has done that to other controls, too.  Not counting minor sensor board changes that you could switch without regard to what version, I know of two others.  The sprint steering wheels had a pretty major revision (from plastic to alum & loose the 4" bolt for two, one on each end that the aluminum allowed).  The hall effect boards had at least three revisions that effected how it was calibrated: from hardware POT adjustments, to all software calibration in game, to automatic calibration at power up (& possibly more that didn't change the calibration).

All three of these controller changes (720, sprint, hall effect) were for the better.  So make sure you're repro-ing the best revision.

[tommyinajar]

If no one is going to make a base or some kind of restrictor for it, How about an UltraStik  with an easy 4-way / difficult diagaonal mapping and a repo tron handle ??

 I KNOW if someone cast a sturdy Tron handle they would sell, probably too good unless mass produced

[Daviea]

Hey Everyone,

Here's an overdue update on everything.

The Star Wars yoke is almost ready.  I'm waiting on the handles and the wire.  I'm running my third set of prototype handle castings right now.  Just can't seem to get the outside radius on the shaft connection correct and I think it's a function of the actual casting process as my CAD drawings are *perfect*.  Wire should be done this coming week.  Initially, I'm going to provide the yoke WITHOUT artwork applied.  The artwork is taking far too long to get done, so I probably won't be able to offer the option immediately.  Oh well, I figure since the artwork is available from other sources, it shouldn't be too much of an issue.

720 controller.  All this one is waiting on is the upper/lower housing components and the handle shaft.  I decided to cast these from Delrin as opposed to machine from Delrin.  Silly question, but can anyone tell me with 100% certainty what color the ball top is supposed to be on the 720 controller?  Although the majority of the units I have seen are black in color, I have also seen a good number of red and yellow ball tops. Weird.

Lunar Lander thruster.  Still waiting on the controller cover.  My backup vendor is still backlogged.....yawn.

Hall Effect joystick.  Waiting on upper/lower housing components and handle shaft.  I've already manufactured the remainder of the components, including the X-Y sliders and the Hall Effect circuit boards.  The magnets were a chore to source, but I was able to find an exact replacement from a local vendor.

Assault - upper and lower housing, shaft and handle grips.

Tempest spinner.  I've got my proof of concept prototype spinner done and it works great.  Now I need to make changes to the design to trim manf. cost down a little bit and streamline the construction.  I'm considering options for a new opto board, too.  I'm tired of paying Happ their inflated prices for their version of the opto board (currently, the RED opto's).  Besides, their opto doesn't even fit on the spinner due to all of the surface mount parts getting in the way.

Ok, that's it for the updates... now onto addressing some of the recent messages in the thread.

Kremmit - thanks for the comments on the cones.  I think they look pretty nice, too.  I almost went with a powder coat to simulate the texture of the original plastic cones, but the anodized cones just looked too nice to pass up.  I'm glad to know that nobody is working on the tron joystick base.  That leaves it wide open for me to consider.  Right now, I've got so many projects going on, I've decided to keep my focus on them until I complete a few, then I'll toss new projects in the mix.  That shouldn't be too much longer, though.

Havok - I wasn't planning on offering a PC interface with any of my controllers.  While I have an extensive background in EE and CS, my one desire is to recreate the controls/parts as accurately as possible.  However, if anyone would like to partner up with me to make this a viable possibility, let's talk.  I would be pleased to go above and beyond my initial goal, but I'll need some help.

Xiaou2 - I'd like to see one of these Tron restrictor plates up close.  From your description, I don't see any reason why I couldn't make this part.  As for the Pac Man joysticks, isn't someone else working on those? 

u_rebetscum - I'm aware of the various revisions of different controllers that Atari made.  I usually go with the latest revision when planning out my designs.  The hall effect joystick was an easy choice as the last revision was obviously the best, hands down.  BTW, I already have the hall effect circuit boards completed.  They turned out quite nice.

tommyinajar - I've already started the process of making the Tron handle (but I have no details on official release notes yet).  What I really need is a NOS controller handle to measure up and determine the material characteristics (color, fluoresce, thickness, etc).  I have an all-black handle which is *very* used, but it's proving to be somewhat useful at least for initial cost analysis (volume of material use, etc).  It looks like I'll be able to run these off in a full injection mold production run and offer a pretty decent target price.  I intend to upgrade the material thickness if possible to help strengthen the handle and keep it from breaking so easily.

Here's what I'm currently looking for: 720 machine, NOS (or near perfect) TRON handle and joystick base.

David

[PoDunkMoFo]

If you are going to run these you might consider offering them in Satans Hollow red as well.

[Kaytrim]

Havok - I wasn't planning on offering a PC interface with any of my controllers.  While I have an extensive background in EE and CS, my one desire is to recreate the controls/parts as accurately as possible.  However, if anyone would like to partner up with me to make this a viable possibility, let's talk.  I would be pleased to go above and beyond my initial goal, but I'll need some help.

David,

You might want to check with Randy from Groovy Game Gear and Andy form Ultimark.  They have the knowledge and experience creating PC interfaces.  Randy has created interfaces for Keyboard, Mouse and Gamepad style input devices and interfacing the 49-way joysticks to PC.  Andy has created Keyboard and mouse style interfaces and what I believe is a Hall joystick (U360) with interface to the PC.

I may not use any of the things that you are working on unless I get into the restoration side of the hobby.  However I am very interested in what you are doing because I am learning from you about the various devices used to create the games I loved to play as a kid.

Keep up the good work, 
Kaytrim

[freckleface]

Restoration project or not an afforadable Star Wars yoke would be worth hacking.  Though for those not PC would be nice.

[ArcadeMaze]

X

[Daviea]

Hey Everyone,

Since the project is getting so close to completion that I can taste it, I've put the Star Wars controller up for pre-sale as of today.  I've also made available a selection of parts for the SW yoke as well.  I'm not finished fleshing out the order page just yet, but you can get an idea of what's going to be available by looking at the page as-is.  I've decided to do the pre-sale because the project is almost done.  Also, after going through three versions of the handles, I realize my original estimate is going to be surpassed by a good chunk of change and I want to keep my promise to everyone here when I stated the price would be $200.  So, I'm offering to anyone who wants to jump in early, a cost that's equal to my original estimate (ie: about $25-$35 cheaper than I'll offer it once the production unit is actually ready).  Right now is your chance to get the controller for a great price.  Granted, I'm about 30-60 days from completion, but it's a done deal, more or less.  Just waiting on the the powder coating of the frame assemblies and the last version of the handle prototypes to get finished up.  Check out the order page:

http://www.ram-controls.com/order-sw.html

On a side note, anyone see what that NOS yoke controller went for on ebay?  $355.25!  Wow! 

Cover, handle assembly frame and steering assembly frame are all out getting powder coated, so they'll be available shortly.  Ok, more to come shortly.  Also, expect to see some 720 controller parts show up on the site in the near future.

For those curious to get some more insight into the SW project, here's a link:

http://www.ram-controls.com/blog-sw.html

If you notice any discrepancies, please bring it to my attention.

Thanks

David

[ahofle]

Man that is absolutely impressive.  Nice work!   

[Havok]

Woohoo!!!

Payday is coming up, and you're getting my pre-order!!!

 

[Breaker]

Hi David,

Are these units available for shipment to Canada?

Thanks,
Breaker.

[Daviea]

Shipment to Canada (as well as the rest of the world) is available on this pre-order item.  Further, the standard $15 shipping fee applies no matter where you're located (ie: I'll eat the difference in cost).  Domestic shipments will be via UPS Blue (2-day) and foreign shipments will be via USPS (post office) Express EMS service (it has limited tracking capabilities).

Thanks

David

[horseboy]

Didn't GameCab do preorders? 

[Havok]

Didn't GameCab do preorders? 

We'll see - I'll be pre-ordering one tomorrow. I can be the guinea pig. I figure it'll be a credit card order, so there is always the dispute path if it turns out to be a scam. I don't think so though, others have his cones and Major Havoc controls, so I think it's legit...

 

[Havok]

Took the plunge - I pre-ordered today. I'll keep everyone posted.

Hey David, what kind of documentation can I expect to get with this? I would love to see an exploded view diagram, and also pinouts of the connector...

Also, as a bonus for the early order, can you throw in a female plug (or male? whichever applies) to the output plug for me? I will be hacking a dual strike to interface this with my pc, and would like to make it a nice neat hack so that I can just plug in the DS to the yoke connector...

[MameMaster!]

WOW BIG NEWS!

I just posted this on Retroblast.com

Hey...I recommend teaming up with Mamemarquees for repro yoke stickers for sale as well!

(FYI- I ordered one too...and agree with Havok if you can toss that in!).

 

[2600]

Great assortment of parts for repairs, but do you plan on putting the gears up for sale as well?


Also, if parts are purchased will they ship out now or wait till after the yoke is completed?

[Daviea]

Havok,  I'll toss in a freebie male connector (with pins) for anyone here who asks.  Anything to help create a solid interface (and curb hacking up my controllers.)  I'm attempting to create an exploded view.  Since I have Atari's original, it won't be too difficult.  I'll include pinouts.

MameMaster, you got it.  Thanks for the post on Retroblast.

2600, the gears will be up soon.  I have received my first batch of gears.  They're coming to me in a scheduled manner (ie: a few here, a few there).  I have JUST enough from the first run to cover the repro units.  As soon as the second run comes in, they'll be available on the website.  Any individual components listed and available for order on the website right now will be shipped out right away if you place an order.

As an update for the yoke, it looks like the last prototype of the handles turned out as expected, so I'm going to give it a thumbs up for a production run today.

David

[Havok]

Cool!

So, do you have a better idea of expected shipment time yet?

[Daviea]

The dates have not firmed up any further than before.  However, If I had to guess, I would put it all the way to the beginning of April.  I based this on the fact that a full production run at the casting company could take awhile.  I'm hoping for sooner rather than later, though.

On a side note, does anyone have a 720 controller within reach?  I need the values of R1 through R6 and C1.  I'm slapping together the first production units of the 720 Dual Opto boards today, but I forgot to bring the BOM (bill of materials) with me. Whoops.  OC1, OC2, IC1 and C2 are easy, but the resistor values as well as the value of C1 elude me.

Thanks

David

[freckleface]

Male pin connector....what kind is that? And I remember you having a listing on the parts page for 100k resistors for those who had MAME cabs; what happened to that?

[Havok]

Male pin connector....what kind is that? And I remember you having a listing on the parts page for 100k resistors for those who had MAME cabs; what happened to that?

The male connector is the one that will plug into the controller. Remember, this is a 100% repro - it is designed to be plugged into a Star Wars game. I asked for one so I could connect my pc hack to it, and just plug it into the controller. The 100K pots are there if you want to hack this into an analog joystick. Since I am using a USB sidewinder, I will not need the pots...

[shorthair]

Yeah, pots (well, he said potentiometers; but I haven't seen these on the site, lately).  I couldn't even find it to change it. Okay, but I'm still uncertain on the connector and sidewinder.  What kind of port does it have on it?

[RetroBorg]

If no one is going to make a base or some kind of restrictor for it, How about an UltraStik  with an easy 4-way / difficult diagaonal mapping and a repo tron handle ??

 I KNOW if someone cast a sturdy Tron handle they would sell, probably too good unless mass produced

I'd be in for one of these. 

[horseboy]

Okay, but I'm still uncertain on the connector and sidewinder.  What kind of port does it have on it?

It has an I-hack port. An easier option would be to go with an A-pac or something similar.

[Havok]

Yeah, pots (well, he said potentiometers; but I haven't seen these on the site, lately).  I couldn't even find it to change it. Okay, but I'm still uncertain on the connector and sidewinder.  What kind of port does it have on it?

The pots are on his website, look about 2/3 of the way down. $10 gets you 2:

http://ram-controls.com/order-sw.html

As far as the sidewinder, this won't just be a plug and play solution. Do a search for 1UP's dual strike hack, and you should be able to find it...

An easier option would be to go with an A-pac or something similar.

But would cost a lot more - there are a bunch of Dual Strikes on feebay for $6 BIN. The A-pac or similar will run you $35+

[Havok]

It's April!  Any update? I don't see anything new on the blog...

[shorthair]

Ya, I've just been thinking the same. Wishing I'd known about that panel on ebay as I'd already be playing now - and with extra goodies for other things!

[Tiger-Heli]

Tron did not use a rubber restrictor.  It used a metal or plastic restrictors and a large actuator and leaf switches which made is possible but difficult to hit the diagonals.

See this thread and the linked images on OSCAR's site: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=44;start=msg283#msg283

[Hoopz]

Tron did not use a rubber restrictor.  It used a metal or plastic restrictors and a large actuator and leaf switches which made is possible but difficult to hit the diagonals.

See this thread and the linked images on OSCAR's site: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?board=1;action=display;threadid=44;start=msg283#msg283

Pics of the restrictor can be found here if anyone is interested:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=53406.0

[ChadTower]

Wow, had somehow missed this.  I have two yokes to rebuild in the fall.  These parts will come in super handy.

[Havok]

FYI -

Just got an update from David, and figured I would let everyone know:

He's in the middle of transferring hosts, so that is why there haven't been any updates to his website recently. More importantly, the frames are back from powder coating, and he is just waiting on the handles!

Hopefully soon...

 

[whynotpizza]

  Cool...

[Havok]

Just shot another e-mail for a status update...