Scared Newie - Please help

[savj14]

I just bought a used but working Arcade Monitor to replace my old non-working Monitor. They guy I bought the Cabinet from said the monitor stopped working one day, and I estimate the monitor has not been working and sitting there for a couple of years now.

My question is.......... Would it be safe to take my old monitor out and not worry about getting shocked, or should it still be discharged. Since the Monitors are the same size I would assume all I need to do it unbolt the frame and take the entire thing out. The new monitor comes with a frame as well, so I would just bolt the new one in.

The Monitor I bought was pulled from a working cabinet, and they guy I bought it from said it is not discharged. So I assume he just unbolted the frame. How safe is that???

I am going to be driving to his house to pick the monitor up. Do I need to be cautious when putting it in my car, as far as what I should be touching on the monitor??? And should I bring a box and/or packing material to avoid any incidents.

I really don't know to much about Monitors, and from what I read about the Voltages that are charged in these it scares the hell out of me.

**How Long does it take for a Monitor to Discharge on its own**

Any help would be greatly appreciated.

[lloydcom]

Can you not get a TV repair guy out and recap it?

If you are uncertain about removing/replacing it, just leave it alone until you can get a qualified person to assist you.  There are scary stories about tube discharges.  Read:

http://arcadecontrols.com/arcade_monitors.shtml  [sorry] 

If you are feeling brave, get someone to help you and discharge the tube and be careful or you will be riding the lightning the cheap way.

[MustardTent]

I don't think your link points where you want it to.

[shardian]

Can you not get a TV repair guy out and recap it?

If you are uncertain about removing/replacing it, just leave it alone until you can get a qualified person to assist you.  There are scary stories about tube discharges.  Read:

http://arcadecontrols.com/arcade.htm

If you are feeling brave, get someone to help you and discharge the tube and be careful or you will be riding the lightning the cheap way.

You have to right click on the page, and hit properties. There you can copy the actual link to the thread.

As to your monitor, the dangerous part is the bright red wire that is attached to the suction cup on the tube. Don't go anywhere near that suction cup. Also, you should never work on high voltage equipment alone. If something goes wrong, you want someone close by to call for help.

[savj14]

Thanks for the input.

How long do Monitor's usually hold their charged for???

I have this thread posted on a different site to get more input on this as it is very important for me to understand this process.

This is what one person said:

"The only time you need to discharge a monitor is if you are removing the large red wire from the picture tube. A monitor swap does not require this"

All I really want to do here is do a monitor swap.Both the old and new monitors have a frame, so I would just need to unbolt the frame of the old monitor and bolt the new frame in In theory I should not have to touch the Red Wire or anything else so I don't see why this would be a dangerous thing to do. The guy that pulled this monitor said he had no issues at all.

 I guess the safe and best bet would be to discharge the monitor just in case???

I would definitely not do this by myself. I have a friend that is an electrician that I am hoping can take care of most of this for me.

[Thenasty]

if you jsut gonna swap it, no need to discharge it. In order for you to discharge it, you need to take the RED SUCTION cup off and sticka SCREWDRIVER that is attach to the METAL part of the chassis and stickt the screwdirver by/in the HOLE where the suctio came off, and still will HOLD some charge after dischargin it anyway.

So, I say just swap and off you go.... 

[Kremmit]

You can unbolt it, pick it up, move it around, swap it into your new game, and call it dirty names, all without discharging it.  Just don't go poking around under that suction cup and you'll be fine.

Now, if you get it hooked up and it doesn't work, then you'll have to discharge it before you do any work on the electronics, but that's a different story.  Just swapping it is no problem.

[shardian]

if you jsut gonna swap it, no need to discharge it. In order for you to discharge it, you need to take the RED SUCTION cup off and sticka SCREWDRIVER that is attach to the METAL part of the chassis and stickt the screwdirver by/in the HOLE where the suctio came off, and still will HOLD some charge after dischargin it anyway.

So, I say just swap and off you go.... 

ummm...yeah, that's kind of a dangerous post, don't you think? I can just see some newbie who know nothing about electronics say "Boy that don't seem too hard..."and then promptly kill themself.

How's about posting a link to a safe, proper method.

[CheffoJeffo]

You can unbolt it, pick it up, move it around, swap it into your new game, and call it dirty names, all without discharging it.  Just don't go poking around under that suction cup and you'll be fine.

Now, if you get it hooked up and it doesn't work, then you'll have to discharge it before you do any work on the electronics, but that's a different story.  Just swapping it is no problem.

Kremmit's right, of course.

I have never discharged a monitor inside a cabinet anyway -- I always remove it first.

Just don't grab the anode cap (aka the Suction Cup) and you'll be fine.

EDIT: Folks below have corrected me -- you should also not touch the circuitry, flyback, etc. I hold the monitor by the frame and I do discharge once I get it out of the cabinet. The reason I remove the monitor first is imply because some cabinets make it hard to disharge inside the cabinet.

Cheers

[savj14]

Thanks for all the help.......A couple of those posts made me a little nervous for a second.
But I'm glad it is all cleared up for me. I hope once the new Monitor is installed it will work and I won't have to come on here asking about the suction cup.......Does not sound like too much fun playing around with that thing.   

[Thenasty]

rule of thumb.... if you a see a HOLE don't stick anything in it 
so if that suction came off accidently and see the hole from the tube, don't stick your fingers in 

Good Luck....

[CheffoJeffo]

Does not sound like too much fun playing around with that thing.   

It is no big deal, really... I think that I have only had a single instance where I got a SNAP when discharging.

Once you know the specifics, it is easy to handle monitors safely.

Cheers

[Thenasty]

... I think that I have only had a single instance where I got a SNAP when discharging.

I did got SNAP lots of times myself. Some of this instances was when i left the suction off for a couple days and when its time for me to move that tube out of the way, when I carried it, my hand/arm was right by that BIG HOLE. 

Conclusion, I probably have 3 lives left 

[Keypel]

I was working on a TV once and was trying to pull that suction cup off. I can't tell you how bad it hurt when I got zapped. It left a pretty big mental scare, I've never played around with the insides of a TV since.

Is there a guide to handling monitors safely, anyone got a link?

[shardian]

better to take your time and have a proper tool:
http://homearcade.org/BBBB/sb.html

And here it is in a nutshell:
http://www.instantarcade.com/discharge.php

[ChadTower]

That advice in bold above about only having to discharge a monitor to remove the anode cap is geared to people who know what they are doing.  It's not for newbies.  You could very easily discharge the HV circuit into yourself by touching two coincedental HV circuit components on the chassis. 

It's also very possible that you didn't intend to touch the anode cap but the monitor slipped while carrying it and that's what your frantic hand landed on.  Or that you're moving the anode wire aside to reach the chassis connectors but don't notice the insulation cracks on the anode wire.

I always advise people not to play with their monitors unless they have a passing familiarity with its layout and the HV circuit in particular.  You don't have to memorize it but if you're going to reach and and grab something vicious you damn sure would be well served to know where the teeth are.  It doesn't take more than a couple hours of study to figure out what you need to know and how to get that info.  It is worth the time investment.

[Glaine]

Now whats scarry is when you put the cap back on and it keeps popping off and touching you cuz you didn't get a good seal on it. I didn't get a shock from that but it was still scarry stuff. I did get zapped from that monitor when I was adjusting the flyback with the power on to adjust the picture. The tube was only comming on when I would push on the flyback, so I pushed on it with both of my hands which made a circuit through ME, threw me in the air where I layed on the ground a good while with burns under my fingertips and a mental scar.

I HATE BEING ELECTROCUTED.

[ChadTower]

That's exactly the sort of thing I'm talking about.  His defective flyback electrocuted him even though he followed the advice above by not needing to discharge unless he was touching the anode cap.

BTW, the anode cap has no seal.  It's just a rubber insulator that covers the conductors underneath it.  It is not a suction cup.

Frankly, you're damn lucky, seeing as how you gave a powered HV transformer a path directly across your heart.  Think about the potential consequences of that for a minute.

[RandyT]

rule of thumb.... if you a see a HOLE don't stick anything in it 
so if that suction came off accidently and see the hole from the tube, don't stick your fingers in 

To add to the above and what Chad wrote, stay away from all the circuitry and wires, whether the monitor is on or off.  There are usually big capacitors on the boards and these can hold a pretty good charge as well.

Some may view it as paranoid, but unless you have your resurrection skillz  honed, it's worth a little extra precaution.

I've been nailed by house current a bunch of times and it tickles compared to HV.  I accidentally came in contact with the pins on the yoke board of an old monitor while it was on once.  The zap burned a pinhole in my fingertip that went to the bone.  It was one of the most painful injuries I had ever experienced and it hurt for a long time.

I also have friend who has worked on a few thousand monitors in his lifetime (after watching his dad work on thousands more.)  He always discharges them before he even thinks of doing anything with them where he might come in contact with the circuitry.  And that includes carrying them without a case.

Be safe and learn before doing.

RandyT

[ChadTower]

And just to say this again since I see this all the time:

IT'S NOT A SUCTION CUP.  IT HAS NO MECHANICAL CONNECTION TO THE TUBE BEYOND BEING PULLED AGAINST IT BY THE ANODE CONDUCTOR CLIP.  IT IS A RUBBER INSULATING SHIELD TO PREVENT ARCING AWAY FROM THE HV ANODE CONNECTION.

And I'm sure I'll get tooled on for saying this, but if you don't completely understand what that means, don't play with the back of your monitor until you do.  Odds are too high you'll be very sorry.

[shardian]

More good advice:

When messing with high voltages, ALWAYS keep one hand in your pocket. For the same reason Chad mentioned, if you become part of a circuit with two hands, the quickest way for the juice is from fingertip to fingertip. Guess what lies in between your arms? Yep, your heart. When you use one hand, you just creat a low resistance ground.

[Thenasty]

just for fun.....

What if we use the TOES to TOES ? Whats lies between the TOES 

fried motzerella balls 

[ChadTower]

More good advice:

When messing with high voltages, ALWAYS keep one hand in your pocket. For the same reason Chad mentioned, if you become part of a circuit with two hands, the quickest way for the juice is from fingertip to fingertip. Guess what lies in between your arms? Yep, your heart. When you use one hand, you just creat a low resistance ground.

I wonder how much different it really makes which hand you get zapped with.  Your heart is offcenter left, so theoretically it would be better to keep your left hand in your pocket.  Probably not, though.

[WaRpEd]

Chad
If you want to try that left hand vs right I'll send you a nice card at the hospital IF you survive.
The man I worked for at a local arcade when I was in my late teens Had never been Bit as He put.
Fortunatley for him I had a CPR course I had just taken to restart his heart while his wife called the EMT's. ( He survived)
I can't state STRONGLY enough how dangerous monitors can be if your careless or think that can't happen to me.
BE CAREFUL!

[ChadTower]

Well, I'm not dumb enough to TRY it.  I've never been bitten and don't plan on it.  I discharge any monitor I work on, stand on wood while tweaking them with one hand on the MDF/plywood cab side.  Built my own discharging tool, nearly memorized the HV circuit before I had ever touched a chassis.  I overkill my preparation for stuff.

[savj14]

Some people are saying it is no big deal to Swap monitor's out and some people are telling tales of how bad monitors are and what can happen.

I just want ot swap an old monitor with a new one. I am not in any way going to play with anything. I am not going to be repairing or touching the red wire or the anode. This post is getting off track here.

Bottom line.........Is it safe to do a simple monitor swap? Unblot the frame take it out and bolt the new one in.

It seems as if it would be more dangerous trying to Discharge the monitor than to actually do a swap. Am I wrong here.........I was under the impression that repairing the monitor means touching the anode and a monitor swap would not need it

[SirPeale]

Yes, you'll be fine.  Just hold the monitor by the frame and you'll be just fine.

[ChadTower]

Bottom line.........Is it safe to do a simple monitor swap? Unblot the frame take it out and bolt the new one in.

You have multiple answers reflecting different opinions.  You're just going to have to process them and decide for yourself.  There is no "right answer".