*BACK* Side Design Thread - 2005 BYOAC Tokens

[Santoro]

This thread is for the detailed design discussions and proposals regarding the back side of the 2005 BYOAC tokens.

They will be .984" tokens.

[patrickl]

Woohoo! New tokens

[Lilwolf]

So no nude photos of Ms Pacman wearing Mr. T's necklaces?

[BobbyG66]

When is the deadline?
...we are five months into 2005. 

[Santoro]

At this rate we'll have to go into 2006.  I thought a few people would have had something ready already.

Seriously though, 3 weeks or so depending how things go.

[MrSaLTy]

Santoro,

It might be nice instead of having the same side shown in the 2 design threads... to have the images of the correct side from last year in each thread.  This may give people who did not see the tokens from last year a better idea as to what to do. 

[Flinkly]

what was the CL for under the cabinet?  a signiture from the artist?  the place of minting?

[SirPeale]

It was a signature.  Chris is the one who designed it.

[DrewKaree]

Santoro,

It might be nice instead of having the same side shown in the 2 design threads... to have the images of the correct side from last year in each thread.  This may give people who did not see the tokens from last year a better idea as to what to do. 

Is the atari guy the "heads", since he's got one?  And I agree, where's Pixel's design? 

[Pixelhugger]

I think the heads side should have BYOAC on it and the tails side should have related artwork but no retreatment of BYOAC.

my 2 cents

[Santoro]

I am still trying to fing a B&W GIF of Pixel's front.

[MrSaLTy]

I think the heads side should have BYOAC on it and the tails side should have related artwork but no retreatment of BYOAC.

my 2 cents

Not that it really matters but technically, the front or 'heads' side is known as the 'obverse' and the back is the 'reverse' when talking in terms of coins, tokens, medels etc.

[Felsir]

Not that it really matters but technically, the front or 'heads' side is known as the 'obverse' and the back is the 'reverse' when talking in terms of coins, tokens, medels etc.

[Santoro]

Let's keep the focus of the thread on the graphic portion of the back design for now. We can doink around with slogans, "No Cash Value," etc after the graphic portion of the design is complete.  (Though if any of the text is somehow integral to your design submit it anyway.)  I would like the date to be on the front if possible.

I will post this in the instructions also.

[Chris]

Not that it really matters but technically, the front or 'heads' side is known as the 'obverse' and the back is the 'reverse' when talking in terms of coins, tokens, medels etc.

[GadgetGeek]

I have zero ability to draw, but I have an idea that might look cool if rendered by someone with talent.
Angled view of a coin door with a token going into it, and on the token is an angled view of a coin door...the whole infinity thing
Would go good with a "where the game never ends" type of slogan on it.

[Joystick Jerk]

Another idea I threw together, minus the copyrighted material on my DK Jr. coin! This one is partly based on the american penny.

And about the two coin threads. Can't we just merge them into one thread? A coin face is a coin face, whether back or front. We pick the two best designs and put one on one side, and the other on the reverse.  I think we'd get a lot more designs and responses if people didn't have to keep keep track of two seperate threads that cover the same subject.

[Santoro]

Hey, that's classy.  I like it

As for the threads, there are a few reasons.

I am trying to make it clear from the outset what side you are designing for.

[AmericanDemon]

I really like that JJ.  Very nice.

[Chris]

Another idea I threw together, minus the copyrighted material on my DK Jr. coin! This one is partly based on the american penny.

This is really really nice.  The top text may need to be bolded so the lines aren't too fine to engrave.  I would consider dropping the BYOAC as it should already be on the front and increase the size of the date, and as a very tiny nitpick, the button bezel should probably be a half bullnose rather than a full  bullnose.  But this is an excellent design.  Very clean and right to the point.

[Flinkly]

um...i think the one token thing needs to be dropped for something else.  i mean, it's not like were idiots, we know we're holding a single token.

also, remember that this is just constructive critisizm...

and i'm not too sure abuot that circle stuff around the edge...too busy around the edge and too empty in the middle.

[missioncontrol]

I'd replace the "ONE TOKEN" to "NO CASH VALUE"

my $.02

[Santoro]

To offer another opinion, it is busy, but I think it works nonetheless.

[Chris]

To offer another opinion, it is busy, but I think it works nonetheless.

[ChadTower]

Those half circles have got to go... that is what is pulling the eye.

"One Token" seems a bit wonky, considering that you can tell it's one token by counting it.  "One.  I must have one token.  Oh yeah, I must, it says it right here.  Oh, there's another... now I have two one tokens.  What does that mean..."

[RayB]

Chad, you're being overlay critical. Those half-circles pull the eye only because they are in BLACK, but when pressed, they would be the same color as the rest of the coin, but raised up. In other words, it wouldn't distract the eye at all.

As for the "one token", I agree and disagree. A penny says "1 cent" on it does it not?

[ChadTower]

Chad, you're being overlay critical. Those half-circles pull the eye only because they are in BLACK, but when pressed, they would be the same color as the rest of the coin, but raised up. In other words, it wouldn't distract the eye at all.

Disagreeing is not being overly critical.

[quarterback]

Great submission JJ.

To offer another opinion, it is busy, but I think it works nonetheless.

[Troz]

Does anyone have an image of an actual coin that uses this type of border.  I'm having problems visualizing it myself.  Aside from that I really like the design of the joystick!

[Troz]

Also, the "One Token" text is actually used on some arcade tokens...

[ChadTower]

Also, the "One Token" text is actually used on some arcade tokens...

Yeah, because they modeled them too closely after real coins, IMO.  If it's not legal tender, no reason to follow someone else's model...

[Troz]

I'm not saying I agree with having that text, just supplying an example of it.  I'd rather have "No Cash Value" as well.

[DrewKaree]

This is really really nice.  The top text may need to be bolded so the lines aren't too fine to engrave.  I would consider dropping the BYOAC as it should already be on the front and increase the size of the date, and as a very tiny nitpick, the button bezel should probably be a half bullnose rather than a full  bullnose.  But this is an excellent design.  Very clean and right to the point.

Top text definitely needs to be bolded, whatever it ends up being.  The BYOAC will be on the front, as should the date as well, so both could/should be dropped.

As for a tiny nitpick, I'd like to point out something in order to back up your view there.  Take a look at the joystick base.  The button should match up with the joystick.

The stars have to be a single star on either side, or three on either side.  Two will look odd to the eye.

All in all though, excellent design!  I especially like the "shading" on the balltop, and think it will translate well to the actual pressing.

[Joystick Jerk]

Thanks for the feedback guys. I'll make some changes when I get home later.

BUT, if any of you want to take my design and tinker with it yourself in photoshop, go right ahead. I'll post the base psd file later on as well for those that do want to mess around with it.

[DrewKaree]

Now, I know the basics and the "feel" of it won't come close to equaling the real thing, but what about the back as a button...that curvy shape, your thumb just seeming to fit it just so as you hold it....some plain text around the outer edge.....I know it'd be plain as hell and boring and HIGHLY unlikely that folks would want it, but now that I've said it, just picture it in your mind.

[Flinkly]

i'm with you drew...then again, i think we're being overly nitpicky when we want the flip to be the same as real coins.  quite frankly, i never noticed or logged in memory the way a coin flips in order to read the text upright.

[Pixelhugger]

I really like those highlights on the ball. Nice clean design, and the worms eye view works well.

As far as the text goes, we might want to stick to something sans serif unless the mint confirms they can press those fine lines. I think they requested sans serif type last time, but I can't remember... Dave? Chris? Regardless, I think it would look better with a single typeface.

I also really like the bumps around the edge. That'd really look cool in relief.

[Chris]

I think they requested sans serif type last time, but I can't remember... Dave? Chris? Regardless, I think it would look better with a single typeface.

They suggested them, but I think big chunky serifs like the headline in your Mission Control "Radical^max" poster would be fine.  It's the thin serifs in that font (looks like Garamond?) that would be problematic.

[Joystick Jerk]

I unfortunately won't have time to make any changes tonight or tomorrow, but here's the PSD file I promised for those that want to play with my design:

Coin-Design PSD File

[xar256]

Not to be "overly critical"...But I really don't like that "In joysticks we trust" quote.  It totally doesn't work for me.  I wish I had an alternate suggestion, but I can't come up with any right now.

Just my 2 cents,
Xar256

[Cyber Axe]

i agree i dislike that "in joysticks we trust" thing too i like the central design though how about using last hears border with a new center image it would keep a continuity with last years and have a cool new central design plus

personally i think the byoac and 2005 dont look 100% right though i do love the design how about having 2005 in white at the bottom of the center in the same position were 2004 was last year and leave out byoac since that will be on the front of it?

still, great design good work!

[Cyber Axe]

ive just done a hybrid version of Joystick Jerk's excelent design a mix between his and last years plus i changed the font for the year and fixed some imperfections such as the ball of the joystick not beeing 100% round

[AmericanDemon]

Heh.  Drew didnt design it.  It was Joystick Jerk.  The one thing that still bugs me is the bezel under the button.  Its shown as a full bullnose as mentioned earlier in the thread.  It should be a half bullnose. 

[Cyber Axe]

oops got the names mixed up i was looking at the stuff left in the reply which doesnt show everything!

i'll fix the post

ive also fixed what i think the bullnose is (ive never heard the term before today)

[AmericanDemon]

You got it right.   

Yeah I wouldnt have known it either but I worked in a countertop manufacturing facility for a couple years and that was an edge profile that was commonly done.    Looks much better.

[monkeybomb]

Maybe change "the game is never over"  to "game not over"

"The game is never over." seems so long.  game not over - instead of game over.

If we go the long route why not make it "The game is never over and therefore we build games to play and have fun with." 

[Chris]

Maybe change "the game is never over"

[Joystick Jerk]

"The Game Is Never Over" was on the 2004 tokens, and "Game Not Over" was on the MAME tokens, so we definately need something different...

Game over? NEIN! 

[Pixelhugger]

Here's a version with an upright. Still can't think of any good text for the back other than "no cash value" or "one credit" so I left it blank. Although the clean look of the rim is growing on me. Maybe no text needed since its the back and doesn't really need BYOAC spelled out or the URL like the front does.

[UndeadMeat]

I kind of like the blank rim too. Gives it a very clean look. Not overly cluttered. Might look even nicer with the year moved off the rim IMO. Nice job Pixelhugger.

-UndeadMeat

[Pixelhugger]

And another. Background stippled.

EDIT: Ooops. Forgot to put ball tops on the foreground cab. Will fix later....

[Santoro]

Love that one!

[monkeybomb]

Love that one!

Fantastic!!!

I see a bit of ambiguity in the two rear cabinets.  Sometimes when I look at them my mind assumes that the sides are hidden behind the other cab.  Sometimes they look like floating bartops. 

**please note - I cannot see "The Magic Eye"

[Felsir]

Great designs Pixel!
I personally like the one with one cab and the one-player button. The style is very cool and feels more consistent dan the one with the three cabs on it.

The 1up button could represent that this token is 1 credit for 1 player

[Chris]

I'm worried that it's too similar to the MAME token...

[Cyber Axe]

those designs look more likely the belong on the front of the tokens than the back imo but still, they're cool

[Flinkly]

what about making those three cabs different in some way?  i know you will lose the symmetry, but i like the idea of balltops on one, and maybe a certain layout on the other and the third being a vertical...

i do like the idea of multiple cabs, kind of alludes to the wives that byoac projects come in numbers greater than one...

[AmericanDemon]

I think the marquees should be different and say "Build" "Your" "Own"  That way its a staggered banner.

[DrewKaree]

1)  Single star instead of 2
2)  Smaller text around the rim.  Lower text dominates the outer rim
3)  Outer line (before outer rim with dentils) seems too thick comparable to the inner ring
4)  Perhaps make the machine the joystick is sitting on smaller-ish looking - something seems "off" with the machine itself

Good job on the tinkering!



1)  Seems to only need the inner ring (around the cab) making it one thicker solid raised ring going around the outer edge
2)  Button seems to need the definition where the trim ring "blends" into the button
3)  Black line under marquee would denote higher point, making that seem like a thick raised line, yes?
4)  Less/larger segments perhaps.  Seems like a basketball.

EXCELLENT design!



1)  Text around rim seems "cartoon-ish"
2)  Same issues with the black line under the marquees as the above
3)  That's the kind of rim I'm imagining on the above design.
4)  CP's on rear cabs seem like they should be straight or curved like the marquee
5)  Wonder how a coin door would look on the front cab

Yet ANOTHER excellent design!

I dunno how you guys even come up with the original designs, I've got a hard time looking at all of these and trying to think of ways to improve 'em (even though it seems as if I've got no problems doing it, it really IS hard to figure out what exactly might be "off")

You guys have some sweet designs for a back!

[DrewKaree]

My own terrible modifications (somehow I lost the highlight on the balltop )

[monkeybomb]

I spent half of saturday sorting tokens and I like where drew is going.  They need to be a little less busy. Many tokens don't have these boarders at all and a lot of the good ones have open space.  Just something I noticed.

[DrewKaree]

For the record, I don't like my own font, but for you skilled guys, my mods would be a 5-10 minute job, instead of the half-an-hour job it took me, and the font was my last concern other than to make it SOMEWHAT nice looking.

I also don't like the scallop look, but I think a dentil would look nice...couldn't figure that out, so that's up to you guys   Something THICK, not as thin as last year's BYOAC token dentils.  OR what about an edge treatment similar to the cheap checkers sets you can find here and there?

See, don't feel like I'm criticizing your work, I even have issues with my (copy)work

*edit*
and looking at it again, I'd prefer to see "No Cash Value" in place of "One Credit", but I'm feeling too lazy to change it

[DrewKaree]

I spent half of saturday sorting tokens and I like where drew is going.  They need to be a little less busy. Many tokens don't have these boarders at all and a lot of the good ones have open space.  Just something I noticed.

Yeah, I'm kinda imagining the "heft" feel to a plain rim, and it would kinda "frame" the image on the token, make it more like a bas relief....give it more "pop"?  MAN it's hard trying to explain what I mean visually!

*edit*
Found a visual explanation.  Check out how the Sacajawea coin looks more like a framed picture compared to even the newer quarters...the quarters are less eye-catching.  While still having a 3D effect, the plain somewhat thicker rim makes the inner design even moreso.

Hopefully this explains what I'm talking about

[Pixelhugger]

Great ideas drew. I love the idea of the beefy rim frame with no text. Leave the ring of type for the front and make the back more of a picture. Nice.

I'll put a coin door together and tweak the CPs.

I like the vertical monitor suggestion as well.

Now to find some time. ARGH

[monkeybomb]

Okay, I'm just trying to add a little inspiration, I don't expect a big reaction on this, but - I would like to give half of these tokens to each winner of the contest.  For scale the tokens are in the top of a case from a 100 cd spindle.  There are many chucky chese tokens and tokens from arcades all over the country.

I've also added a photo of a few tokens to help however it might.

[GGKoul]

And another. Background stippled.

EDIT: Ooops. Forgot to put ball tops on the foreground cab. Will fix later....

Ok, the contest is over... this with Pixels "TweaK" ball top would be AWESOME!!

[Pixelhugger]

Here's a major tweak to address Chris' concern about the Mame token.

I'm only going to submit one design for the back so I'd love some feedback on which of these people like best for the final.

[Flinkly]

i like, i like. 

also, not to offend our other artists, but if your design wins for the back, pixel, won't most other entries for the front look funny due to your more curvy view of arcade cabinets?  everyone elses designs have been based on simple geometric shapes, while yours takes on a more cartoonistic feel to it.  i guess i just hope that the back and front designs don't look odd being on the same coin.

[Joystick Jerk]

I like that one quite a bit! You may need to thicken up some the lines though as it may be too fine to be pressed into metal.

[DrewKaree]

I'm only going to submit one design for the back so I'd love some feedback on which of these people like best for the final. 

The button looks like it's too tall, like it's too high above the button bezel.

The sides of the button still seem to get lost/meld into the bezel.  I'll see if I can tinker with the jpeg to see if I'm just nuts, or to show what I mean.

The letters....the "Y" needs a longer tail, it's kinda hard to make out that it's a "Y" at first glance.  The "B" and the "O" (that's right, B.O. ) "holes" seem too small

The right side joystick seems to get lost

I think the roundish shape is fine, but mebbe the lower front edge (from under the CP to the ground) could be straightened to look more "real-world", but I don't think it's vital. 

[GGKoul]

Looks good!!!

Can't wait to get mine!

[KevSteele]

Just a quick design:



I don't know if comes across, but it's supposed to be a start button (duh...)

Kevin

[DrewKaree]

If that's essentially a negative of the actual image, that'd be cool.  It'd feel somewhat similar to a start button too!

[Flinkly]

dang you guys...i had that idea in the other side page 20 minutes before you.

what about a start button guy without words over it?  and make the guy a bit larger?  also, i think we need some different words around the outside and a date in the bottom left, and to make it the front design (heads).  then we can have pixels latest single cabinet design on the back.  done, mint, everyone gets to go home.

 

[DrewKaree]

"Good for one game" is no good....it sounds.....wrong.  One credit or no cash value are tried and true.

BYOAC 2005 - just drop the BYOAC.

Either the web url or nothing at all seems better, BYOAC should be part of the design, since it's essentially a nickname, if it's used at all.

[aumameman]

To offer another opinion, it is busy, but I think it works nonetheless.  I prefer "No Cash Value" , "One Credit", or something 'tokeny' like that.

I like that Idea.

I think the KISS princpal needs to be put into play on the back side of the token.

"GAME OVER...NOT"

"GOOD FOR ONE CREDIT"

"NOT REFUNDABLE" instead of the classic "NO CASH VALUE"

Maybe even a $ symbol with a / or X through it could even be the picture on the back. Remember, "A picture says a Thousand words". This is just a sample of what I mean:

[Pixelhugger]

I think the KISS princpal needs to be put into play on the back side of the token.

I respect that. And agree certainly as far as slogans or taglines go. I do think however that from a graphic standpoint the token ought to have a "special edition" sort of feel to it, since many of us are buying it for it's... errr... collectible feel. I'm guessing many people interested in it bought last years, and maybe the Mame token as well. So I think it ought to be something graphically unique, that feels like a "this year's concept" sorta thing....one design in a lineup that changes every year. If this were going to be the only BYOAC token...an official design thats always available, then I'd say keep things more generic. But as for me I'd prefer something more unique graphically, that sets the token apart from the other year's (hopefully years'). I guess I'm thinking of the tails side of the state quarters for example.

[Pixelhugger]

Revised back. Background stippled to help cabinet stand out. O and Y fixed... thanks Drew. Lines adjusted to conform to mint's minimum dimensions. Superfluous foreground button removed. Super happy funtime phillips head woodscrews added. Neato!

[DrewKaree]

That "Y" now reminds me of the extra-special super-bonus mucho points dude in Galaxian (or Galaga, don't shoot me, but I just enjoyed those games, didn't really become a big fan)

Considering it's for us....that's a cool thing.

I like the screw heads too, especially if, as you suggest, it's done raised, almost like a real screw head.

[AmericanDemon]

I like it PH!  Both side of the coin that you have designed....  now if you could only sneak in your rocket sprocket. 

[Chris]

I don't think the 3-D shading is going to read right on a metal surface that actually IS 3-D.  And I'm sorry, but the screwheads don't work for me at all, especially at .984 inches across for the token.  Shrink it down to life-size and look... they're just dots.

I hate to be critical since I haven't offered my own design, and you know how much I love your work, Pixel...

--Chris

[aumameman]

I don't think the 3-D shading is going to read right on a metal surface that actually IS 3-D.  And I'm sorry, but the screwheads don't work for me at all, especially at .984 inches across for the token.  Shrink it down to life-size and look... they're just dots.

I hate to be critical since I haven't offered my own design, and you know how much I love your work, Pixel...

--Chris

I have to agree. If we were making a much bigger token, like an australia .50c coin (for those who know how big the old round 50c looks like) it might work but not at the size .984"

[Cyber Axe]

ive designed a new token based on KevSteele idea of a p1 start button ive based it on a low resolution picture (since i dont have a camera and couple be botherd unscrewing my own and sticking it in my scanner) though dont know if the gradient would work on the real coin

i would have designed a new text for around the outside however i dont know how to do that roundness in photoshop so just reused the text from the the last years design as an example

d'oh i forgot the picture last time here it is

[Timoe]

Should we now change the date to 2006? Or leave it off entirely?

[quarterback]

Should we now change the date to 2006? Or leave it off entirely?

No token activity make Donkey Kong cry

[aumameman]

Idea for a slogan on the token (I hope no one gets offended)

"IN GAMES WE TRUST"

OR

"IN MAME WE TRUST"

[tristan]

Well, I'd leave it off the back.

Should we now change the date to 2006? Or leave it off entirely?

[aumameman]

Hmmm one has to wonder if BYOAC 2005 will happen. Theres very little activity on the boards this time and we're already in mid July. I will be very dissapointed if this falls through although it looks that way to me... 

[tristan]

Why not just run last year's with a new date on it if there isn't enough interest in designing a new one? I've seen several people trying to get last year's coins anyway.

[Pixelhugger]

My final "back" submission, tho I think the poll won't separate front and back. I think the iconic look of the button is better for the token than the full cab. Plus it works well as either heads or tails.

[Flinkly]

too many circles on that one pixel, if you ask me.  also, as an optical illusion thing, the circles towards the center seem to become more oval then circle, even though i know they aren't.  also, it just seems to be missing words...or something.

[aumameman]

My final "back" submission, tho I think the poll won't separate front and back. I think the iconic look of the button is better for the token than the full cab. Plus it works well as either heads or tails.

YUK!!!  Something not right about this design, im not sure what it is, it just seams too busy but at the same time its missing something

[JoyMonkey]

My final "back" submission, tho I think the poll won't separate front and back. I think the iconic look of the button is better for the token than the full cab. Plus it works well as either heads or tails.

Well I like it. I'd imagine that the eyeball-warping-circles are more a refult of looking at it on a computer monitor. If you picture the design as relief on a little token in the palm of your hand, I don't think you'd have the same problem.

[KevSteele]

Too many rings - my recommendation would be to take out the outer ring (with the "screws") and expand everything else to fill the token.

Kevin

[Pixelhugger]

Hrm.... OK, so maybe not my final submission. Now I'm seeing the ovalizing illusion too.  I'll post a new final before the polls go up. Santoro.... please don't poll on this one 

[AlanS17]

Going back to the idea of a plain rim...

Have a high relief rim will keep the rest of the image on the coin from wearing down easily.

[DrewKaree]

Going back to the idea of a plain rim...

Have a high relief rim will keep the rest of the image on the coin from wearing down easily.

Best point I've read all day! 

[Pixelhugger]

Is this a better back? I'm only going to submit one design for the back (to keep from Nadering myself) So as my own sort of primary I'd love to know if people prefer this over the button design I posted. The ovalizing effect on the button is driving me nuts now. If people prefer that one I'll rework the circles/rings and submit it. Otherwise I'll submit this. Thoughts? Opinions? Should I get a life??

[pointdablame]

I MUCH prefer that one to the button.  I also liked the one posted in Reply #66, but I think this latest one is better.

[quarterback]

I MUCH prefer that one to the button.

ditto

[Kremmit]

I want the upright on the front, and the coctail on the back!

Oh, wait, the poll's not here yet..

[monkeybomb]

Pixel the last one is the best.  I will be disappointed if it's not there to vote for.

[quarterback]

I MUCH prefer that one to the button.

ditto

FWIW, I'd put the text in the outside ring.   When I look at the coin in 'real size', the text isn't ver readable, plus there is all that blank space out there.

Quick!  Only 2 days (or less!)

[Pixelhugger]

Well, there's this thinking out there *cough* you *cough* know who *cough* you are. That it'd look cool to frame the coin like the Sacajawea dollar with a nice clean rim.    Though maybe I should reduce the width of the ring.

As far as legibility goes it really is deceptive to look at a screen image or paper printout. The mint is capable of resolving incredible detail.. and when seen in relief on metal it's amazing how small you can actually go. I've been checking all my dimensions against the mint's smallest tolerances and everything should be mintable (?) To your point though, yeah the details on these coins get teeny. Definitely make you squint. 

[GameOver]

I'm switchin' my front design to be my back design - too many words on the front & the letters were too small.  I've created a new 'front' design to go with this 'back' design.  Go check it out!  I FEEL THE NEED...THE NEED FOR SPEED!

[Flinkly]

pixel, i love your last design.  just like your cabinet, it throws out most ideas of what a token should be and it looks incredible. 

[Pixelhugger]

 

[Santoro]

Polls are up in the main forum, topic locked.

[quarterback]

Polls are up in the main forum, topic locked.

In Russia, topic locks YOU!