Opening up arcade? Ideas?

[Negativecreep0]

Guys let me tell you a little something about my venture. I am 22 years old currently blessed with a good enough job that I have some cash sitting around not doing anything. So what I have done is bought a building next to a main mall in my area. There used to be arcades in every mall near me (Near Philadelphia area (suburbs)) but then the malls asked the arcades to close down because they didn't like the type of people the arcades attracted. This was an actual quote from an owner i talked to. So no arcades are around this area, and the population is lots of (not to sound like an ignorant ass) black people with lots of kids and poorer white people. But also high class people and middle class people frequent this area due to the mall's location here. What I plan to do is open up an arcade/family fun center that has arcades, those win tickets machines to redeem for cheap toys, food, and computer stations for email network game player etc., Do you believe that a venture like this would be succesful I know a lot of these old time family fun zones closed down a while ago like fantasy zone and a few others i can't remember. But i would like to know your guys opinions on this matter. Is it feasable to think that the arcade would make good business. I believe so because there is not a lot for kids to do around the area (legal anyway) and if it is open late night it would be the only place open for them to go. Thanks guys, also any other opinions as what to do with the place are welcomed too.


Almost forgot, anyone know a place that has lots and lots of arcade machines for sale of popular games that are realllllllll cheap. Or something like that like a surplus arcade store with used machines

[StarChild]

Honestly, I've been seriously considering a very similar idea myself, but I'm not nearly as far along in the action plan as you, Creep  hehehe  Something inside of me refuses to let the idea die that an arcade (of any type) is always a failed business model.  Honestly though, I think in order to be successful, you'll need something different to either supplement the income or pull the customers.  That could definitely be the "net cafe" side you're talking about dropping in there because I certainly haven't seen that at all mixed with an arcade.

You're ahead of the game plan since in all of the old-school arcades I used to frequent, the owners never fixed their own machines or touched them more than to open up the coin door and dump the buckets.  The mere fact that you'd be more knowledgeable of the technical side is a big advantage right there.

Something else I've noticed about arcades (at least from my childhood) is they tend to carry a "word of mouth" reputation with your younger clients. Performing legendary acts of "coolness" goes a long way with the neighbor kids and will keep giving you regular customers.  On the other hand, I remember an arcade where the owner was fond of kicking kids out as soon as you ran out of money.  I saw that in action one day and I didn't go back there for a while, but he quickly gave up/lost interest/failed because it changed ownership shortly (a few months) afterwards.

Anyways...just tossing out some random thoughts.  I guess I'm more tagging this thread because of my own curiosity.  I've been tossing around the idea of something similar myself and I wanted to see the reaction.

Oh...anyone know the legality of having a MAME cab accessible to the general public, but not charging for it...just as an "attraction"?

-*

[Xiaou2]

 Running an arcade isnt that easy as people would think.  I managed one from a namco chain for 3yrs.  

 we had 42 games in there... and every week.. there was like 3 problem games that were out of order - waiting for repairs.   I had trouble myself tring to figure out how to fix them.. esp while being inturupted with customers.   We luckily had off-site techs that we could call, and send boards in to them.  Otherwise... I couldnt have done it... as Im just 'basic mechanical knowledge guy'.    So... you will need a great repair guy as a staff member... or better be good at it yourself.
 
 A downed game can be a loss of 5$ to 300$ a week... depending on iits popularity.  

  However... games today are pretty stale.   There really hasnt been anything made new that will frenzy people into dropping loads of cash into it. (except maybe dancing games)  Classics are a cool idea... but youd have to bump the prices up to .50  a game to make a thing.. as many are experts on them and can last for hours on a single quarter.   We had a galaga and ms pacman... and they were both the lowest earning games we had... at like 10$ a week combined.

  Quality crew is also a thing to note.   Lots of workers will just start playing games on shift - and will piss customers off.   They will also steal merchandise, or give it away to cute girls or friends... or trade free games in exchange for something.   Threats do not seem to work too well... eventually, they keep at it.   So plan on making weekly random suprise visits 3 days a week on your off time to try to stop it. (tho they may have lookouts to help out)

  Money is also a factor.   Take a look at how much a new game costs.  It will make you cry.   Its a huge gamble... as if you buy it and nobody likes it... you lose thousands of dollars... if you could even afford it in the first place.   Its token intake will also start to fade in a few months... as people get board of it.    

 Old games are hard as hell to find parts for.  And parts in general are going to take a good deal of money.  Youll need a good stock of them, and lots of tools as well.  

 Security is also an issue.   If employees turn thier backs for 5 minutes... a games can be trashed, broken into, boards stolen..ect.   Change machines can be cracked open in 5 min as well.   And theres the 'inside' jobs - like employees selling tokens for cash directly.  Planned theft..ect.   At any one time, you will need like 500$ in your store for change...   So you need very trustworthy people under you to make sure they do not walk away with it.   If you do not plan on working 7 days a week... you will need a trusty assistent manager.

 Cleaning...  youll need tons of cleaning supplies, polishes, paints, ect... and be prepared to clean up spilled drinks and food constantly.

  Prize booths.   A nightmare in itself.   You sit there counting thousands of tickets for customer kiddies... and wait for them for 30 minutes to finally decide what they want... all the while listening to kids cry that they can not get the item they want, and arguing with parents... : (    

  Collection - every week, comming in very early or late, and emptying each games tokens - then getting meter readings to verify that there isnt too much theft going on per machine.  Counting all tokens in store, and moneys, and making sure that it all ballences out.  Making dialy deposits to the banks with the extra cash earned, and getting change needed for the day.  

 
 And since you are not inside a mall... then youll have to deal with things like snow removal, putting salt down, possible lawsuits, no super security nearby, parking lot maintnence?, landscaping?, and more.

 And finally... since youll be there like 9+ hrs a day, prolly 50hrs a week... you will start to dislike games.   You wont have time to play them anyways.  

 Phew- Im glad I got out before my mall store closed on me : P  
 

[Gunstar Hero]

Legendary acts of coolness. Awwww jeah!

I hate to have to say this, but there's almost no way for a dedicated Video Game Arcade to survive these days.

There are too few arcade games released and the home consoles are just as good, so the kids don't go to the 'cade for the games anymore.

To succeed you need a sideline (or two, ot three!). I'm thinking an arcade/lan gaming center/net cafe/snackbar.

The snackbar makes the money. The other business act as "hang outs" and feed the snack bar customers. They all bring some income too, but they can't be TOO expensive, cause to be attractive to the younger crowd/players, they need to be "cheap" entertainment.

[quarterstringer]

Do some research on video arcade game vendors. Go to bowling alleys and see which companies they are using. The advantage is that you won't have to waste your capital on games that become outdated. These vendors will split the revenues with you, around 50-50 and will rotate the games and repair them for you.

[AmericanDemon]

I've been toying with the idea of making a 21 years and older arcade.  Make it an adult version of Chuckie Cheese.    Alcohol, snackbar/kitchen, games, and probably a few kiosks set up for people to check e-mail and such.

I know that these exist other places, but its just an idea.

[D_Zoot]

I'm sorta in the biz myself, I do repair work for a local op and refurb machines to sell to the public (consignment at a local retail store).    Here's some of my observations on the industry these days:

In the 80's arcades were a destination, in general now, they aren't.   In my area, the only arcades that do much of anything are ones that are attatched to something else, such as a bowling ally or right in a mall.  These days it's the "something else" that draws the people in, the games are secondary.

There are  two arcades near me that do well,  one is right IN the biggest mall, the other has additional attractions such as karts, mini-golf, batting cages etc....      All the others have closed down due to lack of biz.  

There is also another one 150 mi from me that does killer, but they have indoor rides, one of those climbing/maze things for kids, food. The whole place is huge, that outfit has made it a destination and it's easy to take the kids there for a good part of a day.  

The op I work for has his best locations are bowling alleys.  He had a classic arcade for awhile, he rounded up all the classics he had and set them up at a small mall site.  It didn't even pay the rent and he had to close it.

Classic games won't make you any money, but you have to have a couple. Maintence is high, they might cost you more then they make.  People just don't pump quarters in them anymore.  Sure, you get people like us to wonder in and play a couple of games for "old times sake",  but we won't spend hours there dropping lots of quarters like we did in the 80's.  Pins are the same way,  you should have a couple,  but they cost 2-3 grand new and they won't pay for themselves.

Redemption games are a must-have, period.   So there's the hassles that goes with that,  staffing,  keeping prizes in inventory etc.....

You have to rotate games out on a semi-regular basis so they don't get stale...  You have to consider that buying games isn't a one-time thing, but a steady thing.  Auctions are one source, other ops.  Outfits like Namco do sales every so often and sell the stuff they have rotated out.  You'd have to keep on top of that.

It's really going to come down to your location. There are many arcades around the country that do very well as just arcades, other's can't make it without additional incentives to draw people in.  Location/area seems to be the biggest factor and when starting out it's something you can never be sure about.

Try to offer as much as you can,  do birthday parties/events,  food (or get hooked up with a local pizza place to deliver/discount),  Try to get as much varity as you can,  vids, pins, air hockey,  foozball...  appeal to all ages so parents don't mind bringing the kids and hanging out with them.   If you have the room,  pool tables, indoor video driving range (and booze ) etc....      

My point is, the more you have to offer, the better your chances will be.

I hope it works super for you, it's exciting to start a biz doing something you enjoy  

Good luck!
D
   

[GGKoul]

Save your cash and buy a house... you'll make more from the house then you would ever make at an Arcade.

[krick]

Just in case you didn't know, Philly already has the following...

Dave & Busters
Gameworks Studios

However, both places have a lousy selection of games, in my opinon.  Start something with a large selection of classic titles and you might have a chance.

Though, from what I understand, the real problem is the undesirable elements... gangs, drugs, alcohol, fighting, etc... that arcades attract.   Be prepared to have full time security roaming your arcade.

[Magnet_Eye]

Make this place of yours really cool. Have a jukebox with current music. listen to the kids requests for cd's they want in there. Make this place a cool hangout. Have a snackbar, have it themed. Have a "Classics Corner" and have it themed...cool artwork painted on the walls, etc...

I think you should divide the place into areas, each with different appealing themes, but that all work together as a whole. Maybe the snack bar can have a 50's theme to it?

Make it like a mini theme park in a way, but with cool music, decent food and so on. It has to cater to both the young and the old.

Use tokens and have special deals like a "Happy Hour" that gives 6 for a dollar or something. Maybe even have giveaways once in a while or a raffle or some crap like that.

definately have an area with a network of pc's for them to play current games on. I have a place in town that survives on that alone. kids love to go LAN game with eachother.

just random ideas.

[Thenasty]

had the same Idea but drop it cause, did a little re-search to why some of the places here just went belly up. I've seen 3 places shut down and there is one barely hanging in there. I bet if the ownere did not own that peice of property (if his renting it) it would have closed too. I did hear that it was going to close but at this point its still there making around $150.00 a week. Good luck in your adventures.

[Mooters]

This is from a 14 yr. olds point of view... You need a game called "Dance Dance Revolution" made by Konami. It is what ppl here love to play and will dump tokens into, Also we have a place called Galactic Hurricane and it is an outer space-ish theme and im guessin what is holding it around is Lazer Tag. but Pool, Air-Hocky, and prize/ticket games are a MUST but this is just the help from a 14 yr. old that goes to the arcades alot.
 
Spyder

[Yoodaa]

This may be the worng place to post such a question because most of the people in here would love to have an arcade opened up. The question is, how many people of the public are going to be as keen as we are? With pc's, consoles, and piracy, your percentages are slimming . Just my 2c.

[pcates]

Almost forgot, anyone know a place that has lots and lots of arcade machines for sale of popular games that are realllllllll cheap. Or something like that like a surplus arcade store with used machines

In the Philadelphia area I would call Todd at TNT amusements. I konw he rents/loans out machines. He would be able to give you an idea about how much the game expenses would be.

Good Luck...

[fastredpacman]

First off let me start by saying that it sounds like a good idea. But just consider everything before you go ahead. The people on these boards make alot of sense. I live in LA and in the area where I live there used to be about six arcades when I moved here. Now there is only one and barely. Someone tried that whole idea youre thinking of and it failed. They had $5 days when you could pay $5 and get in, and all the machines were on free play. Even that didnt work and this place was right in front of a mall and close to a school.

[mcdo15]

this is a great topic..
i think the main reason why arcades are on the way out is the home console and online genere...

i remember when i was young and going to the mall late night, you have to wait on a line to play your favorite game (every game no matter what game was being used)..now i can walk into blockbuster and rent it or EBGAMES, trade in  and old game and get somthing newer.

[Hoagie_one]

the arcades that used to work had tourneys and special crap going on all the time.  They'd get clowns and ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- on the weekends for the kiddies and a pizza place inside, so people can eat.

They also had a pool hall \ Bar next door which had a connecting door.  Bar is big cash cow when mixed with an amusment area.

Sadly, its not about video games as much as its about ticket games.

Sigh

[Lilwolf]

I personally think that an arcade near a mall could do well with 'free' games.

IE, a parent checks in their kids.  And they get free games until the check them out.   So parents can pay for their kids to be entertained while their parents shop.  But this would require a bunch of older cheap games... Maybe make some games take quarters... some just have buttons or tokens.  And tokens are given away if they are in there by hour.

Or something to make it more then just an Arcade.

PoolHalls... but they are expensive.

Bar... another can of worms.

Skiball... paying someone to give away crap.

laundrymat?  I like the idea... but it would depend on the area.

Online Console games perhour?  Great way to play some games.

Coffee house?  Probably not...

Massage / Whore house?  I would go... Especially if you have classic games...



I don't know... I would like to see

[RayB]

My advice... Listen to what Xiaou2 and D-Zoot posted. They seem to speak from experience. And what I would come away with from that is find a different business otherwise you're in for a world of pain.

Like ANY business, you need to research and write up a business plan. A business plan isn't an optimistic list of reasons why you'll succeed. A business plan is a realistic document that outlines all the realities of what you're going to face and get out of it. If you do your homework right, I bet you'll find out that it's a really risky venture fraught with more obstacles than not.

Here in Toronto (biggest city in Canada, or 2nd biggest?) Sega had opened up a "Playdium" amusement center right smack downtown. It was right in the middle of the "club district", so it had the adult audience right at its door. It was also right on the same block as the Paramount movieplex, so it had the movie-goers as its audience too. They had a bar in the top floor, motion games, traditional games, multiplayer linked up games and some traditional games. Air hockey, pool tables too. No redemption games though (that I remember?).

You'd think it was ideally suited to succeed. Well guess what? It lasted maybe 2 years.

People used to go to the arcade as something to do. Now, people don't. Just remember that. Classics can be played at home. The best 3D games can be played at home.  People go out for things they can't get at home, and that's food, movies on the big screen, drinking, socializing, sports activities, etc.

The fact that you'd be in a low-income area is a problem too. Games are something people are supposed to spend disposable income on. Setting yourself up in an area where no one has disposable income is going to A. make no money and B. invite theft and other undesirable elements. You mentioned upper-class goes to the mall there. But do you think they will feel right leaving the mall to go next door, when the neighborhood isn't so hot? I doubt it. People with money to spend like to feel safe.

Other things I'd research are local and state laws about amusement devices. I know in most cities (Toronto especially) there were so many laws, restrictions and permits required that it made it impossible to open new arcades, and eventually it squeezed out the existing ones. I only know of 1 left and I haven't even set foot in there in the last 4 years.

Good luck, and let us know what you decide.

~Ray B.

[fredster]

I dabble in the arcade business.  I have a few machines out.

It's seasonal, and it's been really bad for a while. There are more and more people getting out of the business because of various reasons.

Getting sued because of faulty equipment, destruction and theft, and plain expense of keeping the equipment running.  There are very few manufacturers of arcade machines in the world now.  IT games are still poplular, but otherwise, the market is dying.

However they still survive in Movie Theaters, some gas stations, and spots here and there in laundrymats.  But as far as I can tell, you can't make a good living at it anymore.  Too many Xboxes.

The new model is the cybercafe type atmosphere/coffee house and the chuckie cheeses type model.  They still make money.

In the cyber cafe model you have computers that can play licenced games.  There's one in Paducka Kentucky. You pay a $3.00 an hour fee to play.

The other is the token model like Chuckie Cheeses.  Sell package deals with tokens.

People don't let their kids run about like they did 20 years ago. Kids are a lot meaner than they were 20 years ago too.  They have all the games they want at home.  20 years ago you didn't have home video games.
So it has to be flashy for the kids now.

For kids to pay to play the game must be very interesting.  For adults, it had to be nostalgic or cards and gambling.  

Consider this, there are probably lots of good economic reasons there isn't more arcades.  Likely for the same reason there are very few full service gas stations that pump the gas and clean your windshield too.

They don't make as much money as they used to.

[Hoagie_one]

i had an atari 20 years ago.

[RacerX]

i had an atari 20 years ago.

True, but Asteroids on the Atari 2600 didn't look anything like Asteroids in the arcade.  The same can't be said for today's games.

[dmish82]

As much as I'd love to see an arcade open back up in my area, there's probably more reasons not to open one then there are to open one. With the decreased cost, and increased popularity in console gaming, many people are quite frankly, too lazy to drive out to play games at an arcade. I know there's some classics I'd love to play again, however, I think it'd be more of a "quick play for old-time sake" type thing. If the arcade was coupled with the family fun type idea it could probably succeed however. I have a couple places here in NW Indiana that are go-karting, mini-golf, and then a small inside arcade (mostly prize games and pinball machines with a few actual arcade games) that does very good business, but it is mainly due to the go-karts & mini-golf. They hold b-day parties, etc and they have the eating area inside the game room. There is also a Dave & Busters in downtown Chicago that seems to do well as they have a mix of arcades & prize games and an eating area/bar. Whatever you decide on, I hope it goes well for you and I think we'd all like to hear how it goes for you. Good luck.

[Hoagie_one]

you need some schtick to get people to come other than arcade games.   something to draw kids and family in.  in fact, the more family based it is, the better.  Pizza, prizes, costume contests during holloween, large moronic costumed freaks waving their hands at kids, etc etc.

[melarky]

we have a few nicklecades here where I'm from, and they seem to do really well.  You pay something like $2.50 to get in, and then every game is a nickel once you're inside.  They have the ticket booth where you can cashin your tickets etc...

The only problem I see with the nicklecades here is that most of the old machines were broken, and the owners seem very uninterested to fix anything.  The place stays fairly busy (I beleive they have a rule about not allowing school aged kids play during school hours, and they still stay fairly busy).

Me and my wife passed one on the way home from our honeymoon, and SHE asked me to stop so we could go (marriage was off to a good start ).  We had a lot of fun for the 30 minutes to an hour that we were there, and it was much easier to plunk down the nickels for games when in fact I probably spent more than I would've if they charged quarters.  I've often thought it would be nice if they had a nicklecade a little closer to me (they have 2 in this state, but the closest to my house is about an hour away).

[Hoagie_one]

wonder how difficult it is to change the coin mechs to run on nickles

[Kremmit]

wonder how difficult it is to change the coin mechs to run on nickles

There's an arcade in Eugene, OR called "The Nickel Arcade" where everything costs (you guessed it), a nickel!  I haven't been in yet, the last time we were through there (about a year ago) I spotted it, but could not stop, as I was travelling with a car full of non-gamers (read: stupid in-laws).  My wife used to go there when she was a kid though, so apparently they've found a way to make it successful over the long term.

Any Oregonians know what it's like inside these days?

[ericball]

In downtown Toronto there was/is a bar called Vinnie's that had arcade games, pool tables, skee ball & similar.  Unfortunately, the games were priced like the drinks at a bar.  They were also token driven, with high incentives to change larger bills.  (e.g. 1 token = $1, but for $20 you got 30 or 40)

I can just picture drunks trying to play DDR . . .

I can still remember back in the 80s seeing four guys in suits pumping quarters into Gauntlet.

[exibar]

I remember way back when me and my best friend pumping $20 - $30 into gauntlet!  It was awesome, we played for the looooongest time! :-)


  Mike B

[daywane]

1st of all check into getting a permit for a teen hang out.
its just plain CRAZY. I know of 3 bars that were being built for teens only (dance soda pop ect...) It became to expencive and a adult bar was 1/2 the trouble.
every one got to you before about .05 cent arcades
in AZ thay were $5.00 to get in the door.
I would locate beside a $1.50 movies. Thay seem to thrive there
In phnx AZ it did. its been 8yrs since I was in AZ but it was a great place then.
there is a few empty buildings here I always dream of ....IF I could win the loto.....
Yes the employees will rip you off
News flash , It happens in all places.
in factories I see all kinds of theft.
wal mart ... most of the theft is from the workers.
as a teen I even did at alladins castle.
sell tokens and pocket $5.00 cash each day.
not happy with what I did but I was young and wild then. It will happen

[StarChild]

wonder how difficult it is to change the coin mechs to run on nickles

There's an arcade in Eugene, OR called "The Nickel Arcade" where everything costs (you guessed it), a nickel!  I haven't been in yet, the last time we were through there (about a year ago) I spotted it, but could not stop, as I was travelling with a car full of non-gamers (read: stupid in-laws).  My wife used to go there when she was a kid though, so apparently they've found a way to make it successful over the long term.

Any Oregonians know what it's like inside these days?

There used to be one in Beaverton, but I can't remember the name of it.  Same type of model:  charge like 5 bucks to get in and all games were a nickel...some of the newer games were two nickels.  

This was like 8 years ago though, no idea if it's still there (I live up in the Seattle area)

In the 80's arcades were a destination, in general now, they aren't.

THIS is the main problem.


My idea was the adult arcade with the nostalgia-type games.  Basically a bar with nickel games.  A token income on the games (as a draw), but with beer/booze to make the money.  No messing with the crappy prize booths, no dealing with little kids wailing on the control panels (although I imagine some drunk adults doing it :rolleyes: )

For you guys who've seen places like these, how are they doing?  I'd love to get out of IT.  

-*

[RayB]

My idea was the adult arcade with the nostalgia-type games.  Basically a bar with nickel games.  A token income on the games (as a draw), but with beer/booze to make the money.  No messing with the crappy prize booths, no dealing with little kids wailing on the control panels (although I imagine some drunk adults doing it :rolleyes: )

For you guys who've seen places like these, how are they doing?  I'd love to get out of IT.  

I've got news for you... what you're describing isn't an arcade, it's a BAR.

I think the original thread poster should just give up the idea and pursue something more lucrative. There's no sense pissing away money into a venture that has proven to be on the way out. I've even heard Dave & Dusters is losing money big time, so even that whole adult/redemption model isn't working.

[GGKoul]

As I said before.  Buy rental property and by the time your 30, you'll probably have enough so you can purchase more rental properties.  Then you'll be rolling in the $$$.

[RayB]

YEah! Student housing! My father in law sold a townhouse condo for $100,000. The average RENT to rent a place like that is $800-900 a month. Mortgage payments are about the same if you own.

It had 3 bedrooms. The guy who bought it built an extra bedroom in the basement and one on the main floor. He rents each room for about $450 a month to students who go to the nearby college.

Do the math. What a profit!

~Ray B.

PS: All this discussion and Negativecreep0 hasn't even come back to read this...  

[LOKIOLR]

There's an arcade in caifornia that's pretty much a whole in the wall but they're always packed. It's Arcade Infinity. Their specialty is import games. Mostly the Konami music games (DDR, IIDX, Pop N Music, etc.). There's a huge following there. Plus with carrying those games you'll have exposure through DDRFREAK. Alot of business can be made from just those games alone. I know our local arcade has a DDR machine that's been the same mix for 2 years now and still brings in like $450 a week by itself.

I myself would love to open a huge arcade but unfortunately do not have the capital to do that.

[the3eyedblindman]

Its kinda sad that "Dance Dance Revolution" is the game people want to play.....

[versapak]

Its kinda sad that "Dance Dance Revolution" is the game people want to play.....

Why's that? You too cool to play a dancing game?

Extremely fun play, plus it actually gives a decent physical work out. = More happy than sad.


I personally have never played the game in an arcade, as I haven't been in one in several years, but I love playing it at home. I think it would be great fun in an arcade with a good crowd and competition.





[EDIT]

Oh yeah... For topic post...

I would have to recommend against the arcade thing. As others have mentioned, your location, and just the general costs involved in running one, are not a profitable thing these days. Wouldn't want you to be just another story of an arcade going under.

[the3eyedblindman]

LoL, I dont know, I just have always stayed away from that game, I just think its sad how people pass up mrs pacman, nfl blitz, mortal kombat ect. and stand in line for this dancing game.

[pointdablame]

LoL, I dont know, I just have always stayed away from that game, I just think its sad how people pass up mrs pacman, nfl blitz, mortal kombat ect. and stand in line for this dancing game.

Just because they are playing DDR doesn't mean they are "passing up" other games.  Plus, there are always people who despise sports games, or those who can't play those "old crappy games"  Personal preference....

DDR is very fun actually, try it one day.

[StarChild]

I tried it a couple of times and spent about 3 bucks trying to learn it.  I promptly stopped.  It was prob the equiv of not making it up the first ladder in donkey kong.  :

-*