Main Restorations Software Audio/Jukebox/MP3 Everything Else Buy/Sell/Trade
Project Announcements Monitor/Video GroovyMAME Merit/JVL Touchscreen Meet Up Retail Vendors
Driving & Racing Woodworking Software Support Forums Consoles Project Arcade Reviews
Automated Projects Artwork Frontend Support Forums Pinball Forum Discussion Old Boards
Raspberry Pi & Dev Board controls.dat Linux Miscellaneous Arcade Wiki Discussion Old Archives
Site News

Unread posts | New Replies | Recent posts | Rules | Chatroom | Wiki | File Repository | RSS | Submit news


  

Author Topic: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)  (Read 7803 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« on: February 27, 2015, 10:47:30 pm »


Introducing Dainamikade, a modular control panel, bartop arcade cab, that displays game specific bezel, marquee and sideart, dynamically, while playing and previewing your favourite arcade games (at least that is the plan).






Quick background...I built a CNC over the past year to build bartops for myself, family and friends http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,131934.0.html. During the build, I became friends with Yvan256 (a member of the community and if you don't recognize his handle, here is his forum profile-http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?action=profile;u=19349) as he was commenting on the build, and had asked me to test his G-code program. So after a couple of months of back and forth messaging, testing, cutting, etc, I asked Yvan if he minded coding me a bartop. This benefited both of us as I could use his Sketchup expertise/g-code program and we could use my CNC to cut them out (for both of us) and test his g-code. If ever there was feature creep, this is it. What started out as a simple bartop turned into a 4 x LCD monster that not only displays marquee, bezel, and sideart depending on the game you play (hopefully), but will also have modular control panels, including 4/8 way joystick switching.
 
Unfortunately (cause I know you guys and gals love your pictures), I am starting this thread at the end of the prototype/build stage, however, because I like everyone on here so much, I am going to walk through every aspect of the final cab and its construction, from start to finish (with pictures), including all the software and programs we will need to run the 4 x LCD's. Here it is in its current state with the marquee and main LCD installed in mock sides for testing...



So first, the name: "Dainamikade", a combination of the Japanese word for dynamic, "Dainamikku" and of course "Kade" for arcade (and cause it will probably use Kades for the keyboard encoding). I think "Kade" can sometimes seem played out when attached to the back of a cab name, but in this instance, and in mine and Yvan's opinon anyway, I think it works well.
 
We started with the basic shape of the bartop I built for my god son a few years back http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,121910.0.html, but quickly transitioned to an MVS styled cab do to the fact that the LCD we sourced for the marquee area was an almost exact match in size once we reduced the scale of a full size MVS into a bartop and also Yvan already had lots of Sketchup models of MVS cabs as he built (is building) his own MVS style bartop...MVS-99-6 http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=94770.0.
 
We might as well work top to bottom and I can explain each item, why we chose it and provide links to those who might want to do something similar in the future.

MONITORS:
 
MARQUEE LCD-This is a 12.3" LCD, ultra wide screen sunvisor monitor, 1280 x 480, I ordered off ebay http://www.ebay.ca/itm/DVI-VGA-lcd-controller-board-12-3inch-1280-480-LQ123K1LG03-lcd-panel-/181460591337?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a3fe4e2e9. I have ordered all the LCD's off of Chintobby and he has been quick to respond and shipping has been fast. I have no issues whatsoever with the picture quality. Viewing angles, colour and brightness are all 9/10. Here is a pic of it displaying a Neo Geo marquee.


       
MAIN LCD SCREEN-This is a 15" LCD, 4:3, I haven't hooked it up yet, but there is no reason it won't fit the bill http://www.ebay.ca/itm/HDMI-DVI-VGA-Audio-Lcd-control-board-15inch-LQ150X1LG96-1024-768-1050cd-m2-lcd-/181272151361?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a34a98541.
 
SIDE ART LCD's-These are 12.1", 16:10, IPS panels http://www.ebay.ca/itm/HDMI-VGA-AV-Audio-USB-FPV-Controller-board-12-1-HV121WX5-120-1280-800-IPS-LCD-/181567950019?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item2a464b0cc3. I also haven't hooked these up yet, but being IPS panels, my only concern right now based off the specs is brightness. These panels weigh less than my iPhone and are like 3-4mm thick. There were better monitors (visually) for me to choose from on Chinatobbys store, but the LVDS cables exited the screens in horrible positions. Also, these panels have a very smooth flat bottom making it easy for us to embed them in the cab sides. Another reason for choosing them were their 16:10 aspect ratio, it seems to be a better match for side art than the wider (or thinner if you are mounting them vertically like we are) 16:9's.
 
COMPUTER-Due to the size of a bartop (and with all these LCD controller boards flopping around inside), I went with a Mini-ITX board http://www.asrock.com/mb/AMD/AM1H-ITX/.
 
Computer specs...
       OS-Win7 64bit
       CPU-AMD AM1 Kabini 5350
       RAM-4G AMD Radeon DDR3 AE34G1609US
       PSU-Corsair CX430M
       SSD-Crucial 128GB MX100
 
How to display to 4 monitors? There is a few different routes here...
 
1. Add a video card that supports 4 monitors
 
pros:
would probably give me the most flexablility in regards to resolution, refresh rates
based on most 4 monitor graphics cards they would be uber powerful
 
cons:
cost
heat
power consumption
driver issues
 
2. USB 3.0 to HDMI/DVI
 
pros:
dead easy to set up
cool running
low power
 
cons:
not as configurable
cost
 
3. RasberryPi
 
pros:
cost
HDMI out
cool running
 
cons:
I have no clue on how to make it display, maybe https://pipresents.wordpress.com
SD cards can exibit premature failure, finite read/write
High res art will fill an SD card fast
 
CABINET CONSTRUCTION-I am using the same melamine chip board shelving I have used on all my builds. I get it from Home Depot and it comes in 30" x 60" and 30" x 72". We are using wood dowels for are joinery as it is strong and is completely hidden, giving the cab a clean profession look. One of our first projects together was creating a dowel jig to accurately locate dowels into opposing panels...the jig works perfect.
 
CONTROLS/MODULAR CONTROL PANELS-None of these items have been ordered yet, but think Kade/Servo Sticks/Happ buttons. I currently have an X-Arcade stick and buttons inserted into the first prototype control panel and they can stay in the prototype. We will probably make a 4/8 way with 7 buttons CP, a trackball CP and 360 wheel CP (we can build anything we want and we will go into greater detail on these once the basic cab is built). Here is a pic of the first prototype...
 


ART-Last fall I bought a large format printer that prints 24" wide by as long as I want, so we will be designing and printing our own artwork on adhesive poly (already bought the poly and tested a few prints, they look good). Also bought a cold roll laminator and I have gloss and matte over laminate to test (the matte is close to the polycarb textured overlay you see on some control panels). Since we are doing two cabs, and art is very subjective, Yvan will design his own and I will design mine. I think Yvan wants to go a little more traditional and kind of hide or seamlessly integrate it into his art and I think I want to go the obnoxious, bright "Yes I am an LCD in a cab side" MALA layout kind of side art, maybe anime styled.
 
SOFTWARE-Going to run MAME (obvious), but which version I am not sure. I have a complete .106 and a complete .156. I know after .106 MAME gets more demanding and with the AMD Kabini 5350, and multi monitor, not sure I want to tax it with the latest. I might have to use a specific build to use marquees? I don't think I need to worry about it as bulbousbeards "Big Blue Frontend" now supports more than 2 monitors (4 in total), I asked him to add the 4 monitor support a couple of days ago and he graciously did it...thanks BB. His dynamic marquees don't care about ROM name, you just add the image you want displayed when you edit the game list, it doesn't rely on MAMEs built in marquee support. For those interested http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,142948.0.html.
 
So to wrap things up, Yvan and I are going to do another week of testing on the laminated particle board with our router bits for a smooth, chip free finish and cut our last prototype sides. I will then do final assembly on the prototype cab so we can trouble shoot and make adjustments. Then it will be time to cut two cabs and start final assembly. I promise to take as many pictures as I can and document as much as I can. Once we complete this MVS styled cab (and a host of modular control panels), we look forward to designing 4 or 5 more styles of side panels based on other popular cab designs (think Gauntlet/Taito/Centipede...etc). Here is the current state of my gamesroom bar...LCD central...


 
Note: This build is a complete 50/50 collaboration between Yvan and myself...this is not mine or Yvans, it is both of ours. Special thanks again to BB for the multi monitor support (in his PM to me, he said he was already thinking about adding additional monitiors for instruction cards, so it looks like it was already planned, but nice of him to add it when I asked).

         Hopefully Yvan can chime in now and go over the main LCD, the scaling of cab and artwork and talk about us going in a new direction with the main monitor, as the bezels are more square than 4:3, so we are thinking IPS widescreen with a portion hidden behind the speaker panel similar to Griffs MvC redux.

   Please feel free to comment and offer suggestions.  :cheers:

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #1 on: February 27, 2015, 10:47:55 pm »
(reserved for future comments - I will update this space with more details about things like resolution, the modular control panels, etc)

A bit of history about the feature creep: we already had the main cabinet, which then got an LCD marquee, then swappable control panels and finally displays for the side art. The thing about arcade cabinet side art is that a lot of cabinet were either generic (earlier Taito cabinet) or were conversion kits which included stickers so we decided that a 16:10 LCD was the best way to go (16:9 being too narrow in portrait mode).

To get completely dynamic side art that covers all the sides we'll have to wait for custom-cut, colour e-ink/e-paper with at least 72 DPI resolution.

P.S.: the lack of updates on my side of things is caused by Typefighter01's CNC and his help with CNC2116.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2015, 03:05:21 pm by Yvan256 »

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #2 on: February 27, 2015, 11:21:55 pm »
Here's the modified version of Big Blue with quad monitor support that you can use for testing:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z2zxf37bm3944m6/BigBlueFrontEndQuad-02272015.zip

You can tell it which monitors you want to output which image type:


Then you can pick an image for each game:

harveybirdman

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 2525
  • SHMUP'EM
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #3 on: February 27, 2015, 11:42:27 pm »
Looks exciting,  props to all three of you.

emphatic

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1949
  • -"Suck it, Donny!" -"No, YOU suck it.... more".
    • Emphatic's Video Game Collection
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #4 on: February 28, 2015, 07:25:57 am »
This is an epic undertaking, will be fun to follow your progress. Best of luck! :cheers:

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #5 on: February 28, 2015, 08:36:35 am »
Looks exciting,  props to all three of you.

Yeah, this should be a fun one...

This is an epic undertaking, will be fun to follow your progress. Best of luck! :cheers:

I am thinking the displaying to 4 monitors and creating/scaling the art will be the biggest undertaking...thanks for following.

Here's the modified version of Big Blue with quad monitor support that you can use for testing:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/z2zxf37bm3944m6/BigBlueFrontEndQuad-02272015.zip

I appreciate you posting the modified version in the thread, it will make it easy others to follow along  :applaud:

BorgDog

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 436
  • Not a hipster for over 50 years!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #6 on: February 28, 2015, 11:37:41 am »
Holy crap!   :notworthy:  What a crazy, in a good way, project.  On the monitor front do you plan on putting different images on each side of the cab?  If not a 3 monitor video card could be had fairly cheaply and is not to hot running and just use a splitter for the same image on both.  Of course having both I'm sure the option for having separate images on either side is desirable.  I think it might be cool if you could mirror the main monitor onto one of the sides so spectators could watch without have to crowd around and look over your shoulder.
My Projects:
MisSpent Youth a Vigolix bartop,  Little Bastard a rotating tablet/display bartop,
Pin-Dog a mini pin-cab on vpforums.org  Star Wars a wedgehead pincab on vpinball.com

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #7 on: February 28, 2015, 07:40:38 pm »
On the monitor front do you plan on putting different images on each side of the cab?

I know there is some right/left specific side art, so the intention right now is to have 4 seperate displays.

I think it might be cool if you could mirror the main monitor onto one of the sides so spectators could watch without have to crowd around and look over your shoulder.

That would be cool  :cheers:

I picked up a USB 3.0 to HDMI adapter today and I am testing it now and it seems to be working well. Big Blue and Windows both recoginize it as monitor 2.

This is the one I picked up http://www.j5create.com/our-products/external-video-adapters-usb3/jua350.html

TheDude

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 109
  • Bartops all the way !
    • BARTOPMANIA
Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #8 on: March 01, 2015, 08:26:38 am »
This is a pretty good idea  :applaud:
Looking forward to follow your build  :notworthy:

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #9 on: March 03, 2015, 05:26:34 pm »
This is an epic undertaking, will be fun to follow your progress. Best of luck! :cheers:

Looks exciting,  props to all three of you.

This is a pretty good idea  :applaud:
Looking forward to follow your build  :notworthy:

Holy crap!   :notworthy:  What a crazy, in a good way, project.

Thank you. I do have to say that this epic undertaking is much easier because of Typefighter01's CNC.

It's already been a few months since we started but I think we made a lot of progress so far. Being able to send files for Typefighter01 to cut on his CNC sure helps but it feels strange to be designing things in one place and cutting them in another hundreds of kilometres away.


On the monitor front do you plan on putting different images on each side of the cab?  If not a 3 monitor video card could be had fairly cheaply and is not to hot running and just use a splitter for the same image on both.  Of course having both I'm sure the option for having separate images on either side is desirable.

Some cabinets do have distinct artwork on each side and given all the work and cash required to build these cabinets it would have been a shame not to have that capability.


I think it might be cool if you could mirror the main monitor onto one of the sides so spectators could watch without have to crowd around and look over your shoulder.

You know what Typefighter01 said about feature creep earlier? Yeah... it's a nice idea but I think we already have our plates full.   ;)
« Last Edit: March 03, 2015, 05:30:16 pm by Yvan256 »

Generic Eric

  • Trade Count: (+2)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 4517
  • Restore! Don't maim for MAME, build from scratch!
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,143226.0.html
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #10 on: March 03, 2015, 05:33:02 pm »
Hey Zeus!

How tasking is that on the PC to drive 4 monitors?  Also, when you are selecting from the frontend, do each monitors change output or only once the game is selected?
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 12:51:15 am by Generic Eric »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #11 on: March 03, 2015, 06:41:36 pm »
This is a pretty good idea  :applaud:
Looking forward to follow your build  :notworthy:

Hey Dude,

I usually pop in to BARTOPMANIA around once a month to see whats new...thanks for following. When I get a minute, I need to set up an account and post my two bartop builds.

Hey Zeus!

How taking is that on the PC to drive 4 monitors?

Looks like the potential exists, using these USB to HDMI adapters, for it to tax the PC quite heavily. Where as a dedicated graphics card usually does the heavy graphics lifting, these USB adapters rely on the CPU to do the lifting. Taken directly from their website:

*minimum system requirements*
1~2 Dongles-i3 Dual Core 2.4GHz and 4GB RAM
3~4 Dongles-i5 Dual Core 1.6GHz and 4GB RAM
Full HD with 1~4 Dongles-i5 Quad Core 3.10GHz and 4GB RAM

Other than the 4GB of RAM, I am short on the other specs. I have to assume these spec are based on running video and currently we only plan on static images (and I am sure the specs are bloated so consumers don't buy these things and complain cause they lag for a second while watching HD video). I currently have the 1 extra monitor running and MAME shows no visible signs of lag, so I guess we will see this weekend when I grab two more of these adapters and do more testing.

Also, when you are selecting from the frontend, do each monitors change output or only once the game is selected?

I haven't got that far, but launching Big Blue for the first time, it displayed a graphic on the second monitor that was tied to the favorites list.

Ignore the quality of the pic (iPad) and ignore the quality of the image on the left screen as I believe it is scaled to only run in the small square in the game menu.



I have to guess based on that, Big Blue either changes output during both preview and selection or if it doesn't, I am sure BB can add it (the hope is to have them change during preview and game selection).

Here is a pic of a test pocket to hold sideart monitors. Monitor fits snuggly and plexi fits flush.



Next is full size cab side test and get all four monitors working (hopefully this weekend).

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #12 on: March 03, 2015, 07:21:15 pm »
It does change during the preview, and it persists through launching the game.

By the way, depending on the resolution you run at, to make sure the the text fits, adjust the "Text Size Divider" option in the Big Blue configuration utility to a larger number. The larger the number, the smaller the text.

I just realized that the configuration utility didn't give you a way to set the flyer and instruction card images for the game list categories. I added that. You can get it here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/a3x9nllmockfu9k/BigBlueFrontendQuad-03032015.zip

Tonight I'm going to work on the display of Damnd on the secondary screens, because when I added the marquee display output, I was thinking ultra widescreen horizontal orientation (not portrait mode displays on the sides of a cabinet). I'm going to put in some extra logic to make sure that Damnd's head doesn't get cropped when he's displayed in portrait mode on your side monitors during the shutdown sequence.

This is already done. Damnd should be aspect ratio correct on your side monitors now (I updated the dropbox link).
« Last Edit: March 03, 2015, 08:35:37 pm by bulbousbeard »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #13 on: March 12, 2015, 06:25:44 pm »
It does change during the preview, and it persists through launching the game.

By the way, depending on the resolution you run at, to make sure the the text fits, adjust the "Text Size Divider" option in the Big Blue configuration utility to a larger number. The larger the number, the smaller the text.

I just realized that the configuration utility didn't give you a way to set the flyer and instruction card images for the game list categories. I added that. You can get it here:
https://www.dropbox.com/s/a3x9nllmockfu9k/BigBlueFrontendQuad-03032015.zip

Tonight I'm going to work on the display of Damnd on the secondary screens, because when I added the marquee display output, I was thinking ultra widescreen horizontal orientation (not portrait mode displays on the sides of a cabinet). I'm going to put in some extra logic to make sure that Damnd's head doesn't get cropped when he's displayed in portrait mode on your side monitors during the shutdown sequence.

This is already done. Damnd should be aspect ratio correct on your side monitors now (I updated the dropbox link).

Thanks for changing the side monitor displays to show in portrait mode and providing updated dropbox link  :cheers:
Do you know offhand what the default rotation is when displaying in portrait in Big Blue? Is Damnd rotated to the left or right? We haven't cut our test sides yet, so if I know the default, we might as well cut them left or right now to save extra software rotation.
Watched all your Youtube videos last week as I was home sick for two days. Looking forward to the release of Blue Balls :laugh2:

Not a whole lot was accomplished this week as I am getting over a cold and Yvan has his CNC up and running (so he has been busy cutting and coding).

Wife did manage to snag me two more adapters, so tomorrow I will grab some HDMI/DVI cables so I can do some testing this weekend.


markc74

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 634
  • Definitely my last Cab. Yeah I said that last time
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137295.0.html
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #14 on: March 12, 2015, 08:33:07 pm »
LOVE the idea behind this! I don't envy the amount of work it will be though!

The thankless task of assimilating hi res marquees awaits  ;). Give me a shout if you need what I've accumulated.

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #15 on: March 13, 2015, 09:09:22 pm »
LOVE the idea behind this! I don't envy the amount of work it will be though!

The thankless task of assimilating hi res marquees awaits  ;). Give me a shout if you need what I've accumulated.

Wow, that is a generous offer, I am sure Yvan and I will hit you up when we get a little farther along. If I could get 50 good art packages together (including all my favorite games), then I would be happy.

So, here is the fruits of a ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- load of money and a whole slew of cables, adapters, LCDs and power supplies.



First time all four screens were fired up, the mouse cursor did a little dance around the screen and there was some noticeable lag, but after a restart, all seems fine now.

Initial impressions: Marquee LCD and side LCDs look fantastic...main LCD has horrible light bleed, but I can only notice it during start-up BIOs screen (all black) and looks good every other way (viewing angle, colour, etc...).

I will play around with it the rest of the weekend and see if I can get some images on side LCDs and a marquee or two.

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #16 on: March 14, 2015, 12:44:45 am »
LOVE the idea behind this! I don't envy the amount of work it will be though!

The thankless task of assimilating hi res marquees awaits  ;). Give me a shout if you need what I've accumulated.

Got a list?    ;D


Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #17 on: March 14, 2015, 10:19:58 am »
Not a whole lot was accomplished this week as I am getting over a cold and Yvan has his CNC up and running (so he has been busy cutting and coding).

I do hope you're feeling better for the week-end, it's been a rough week. As for my CNC, I guess I really need to update my thread about it but there's still a few things I want to modify on it. Too many hand-made parts on it still and it looks like crap.


Wife did manage to snag me two more adapters, so tomorrow I will grab some HDMI/DVI cables so I can do some testing this weekend.



I don't even want to calculate the number of pixels involved in our setup.   :lol
« Last Edit: March 14, 2015, 07:48:10 pm by Yvan256 »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #18 on: March 14, 2015, 04:16:08 pm »
I don't even want to calculate the number of pixels involved in our setup.   :lol
3,320,832  :dunno



 :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy: mad props to bulbousbeard...BigBlue just works. Setting up multi monitor could not be easier. Ignore the images as I am just testing, but each display was recoginized by his FE, so I just browsed the "snaps" folder and randomly grabbed some images and associated them to each screen. This is the images I set for the "1 on 1 fighters", and it will be nice to have default game list art, including game specific art. I could not be happier with how this is turning out.

Next step is running MAME and testing bezel art. I will try to get one complete game running with art on all four monitors and then hopefully post a small video.

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #19 on: March 15, 2015, 05:59:08 pm »
Do your drivers let you change the rotation of your side art monitors? If you change them to portrait mode, Big Blue will automatically display your side art images at the correct aspect ratio.

Let me know if your drivers don't let you rotate the side monitors. If that's the case, I may need to do the rotation in software. Right now, Big Blue is only allowing you to change the rotation of the main window.

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #20 on: March 15, 2015, 07:07:50 pm »
Do your drivers let you change the rotation of your side art monitors? If you change them to portrait mode, Big Blue will automatically display your side art images at the correct aspect ratio.

Let me know if your drivers don't let you rotate the side monitors. If that's the case, I may need to do the rotation in software. Right now, Big Blue is only allowing you to change the rotation of the main window.

I have full control over all four monitors rotation, so no issues there. I tested BigBlue with side monitors rotated and Damnd and art looked aspect correct.

One small issue though, during preview and game selection, art displayed correctly on all monitors, but returning to list after exiting game only showed default Win 7 desktop and I had to select a different game to populate screens with art again. Not sure if it is the USB adapter behaviour or is it some kind of lost focus issue while exiting. I will do some more testing to see what is going on.

Edit:Damnd displays on marquee and side art displays during shutdown...its pretty cool :cheers:

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #21 on: March 15, 2015, 09:23:48 pm »
I'm not losing focus when exiting a game. Let me try to send you the MAME build I use.

Also, try disabling Global Inputs in the Big Blue config. It's possible that the global inputs being on are letting you press something that's changing the focus in the game.

scoodidabop

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 134
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #22 on: March 16, 2015, 12:27:24 pm »
Great idea! Love it.  It's such a shame that when building multicades you lose the rad original sidearts and marquees, which add a lot to the experience.  This build addresses those losses and will probably be great fun to play on once you get it finished.  Looking good dude.

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #23 on: March 16, 2015, 06:21:33 pm »
I'm not losing focus when exiting a game. Let me try to send you the MAME build I use.

Also, try disabling Global Inputs in the Big Blue config. It's possible that the global inputs being on are letting you press something that's changing the focus in the game.

Un-checking Global Inputs did not change behaviour. The second I press Esc, all 3 screens flicker black and then show desktop. I left it for a good 20 seconds and they didn't change. I had to scroll up or down a game for it to populate screens with art again. Thing is, from preview, to game launch and during game play, the screens do not flicker or budge at all...they display rock solid, it is just the exit. I will try your MAME build, but having said that, thought maybe you could give it a quick debug. Actually, you list the last BigBlue release as having "Official" multi-monitor support and I haven't downloaded that one yet. So hold on and let me update to the latest and test global Inputs again before you waste any time checking. I will do this Wednesday night as I am busy tomorrow.

Great idea! Love it.  It's such a shame that when building multicades you lose the rad original sidearts and marquees, which add a lot to the experience.  This build addresses those losses and will probably be great fun to play on once you get it finished.  Looking good dude.

Agree and thanks...

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #24 on: March 16, 2015, 09:40:34 pm »
My hardware is very different than yours (one Nvidia card driving all screens). I'm afraid it might be a driver issue or issue with the USB --> HDMI devices. From what I understand, video card IHVs basically do minimal testing on multi-monitor setups because the vast majority of people don't use them, so we're kind of in no man's land out here.  :-\ Regardless, though, I could throw together a custom build for you that will force focus/refresh the secondary displays after exiting the program that was launched. Since manually selecting a different game seems to bring them back, it's a safe bet that programmatically triggering the same event will have a similar effect. Past that, it's hard for me to do much besides put in some logging code to see what's going on with your configuration.

Also, another interesting experiment might be launching a program besides MAME from the frontend to see whether it does the same thing. Because MAME recognizes multiple monitors, maybe it's somehow interfering.

Here's a modified BigBlue.exe that programmatically refreshes the game list after you return from a game. Shouldn't have to do this, but I'm curious if it works.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/y037d5qm0brso3g/BigBlueTypeFighter.zip
« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 10:01:07 pm by bulbousbeard »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2015, 07:30:37 pm »
Here's a modified BigBlue.exe that programmatically refreshes the game list after you return from a game. Shouldn't have to do this, but I'm curious if it works.
https://www.dropbox.com/s/y037d5qm0brso3g/BigBlueTypeFighter.zip

Your modified BigBlue to refresh game list did not work, displayed same behaviour. I have your latest BigBlue and MAME build sitting on desktop. I started testing, but got my MAME paths and artwork all mixed up. I will start from scratch on the weekend and see if latest BigBlue and your MAME build fix focus issue. Worst case, I will set-up software and deal with lost focus by having an all black desktop...not the end of the world. Sounds like a traditional video card works fine, so at least those who take the video card route can expect normal behaviour. I will report back Saturday night.

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2015, 08:55:50 pm »
I've worked too hard on this thing to accept a ---smurfy--- black screen after you return from the game. That's not good enough.  :badmood:

I can still try programmatically activating the secondary windows after returning from a game to see if that helps. I'll put up a build when I'm done.

https://www.dropbox.com/s/nlglp5uyy3ipz3e/BigBlueTypeFighter2.zip

This build cycles through each display and shows it if it's not visible, changes the window state to normal if it's minimized, activates it, sets it to the top, and then focuses it. If this works, I'll make it part of mainline Big Blue, because it doesn't seem to hurt anything and is a more thorough solution.
« Last Edit: March 18, 2015, 09:56:49 pm by bulbousbeard »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2015, 09:35:14 pm »
I've worked too hard on this thing to accept a ---smurfy--- black screen after you return from the game. That's not good enough.  :badmood:

Yeah your right, no point in doing it half ass.

This build cycles through each display and shows it if it's not visible, changes the window state to normal if it's minimized, activates it, sets it to the top, and then focuses it. If this works, I'll make it part of mainline Big Blue, because it doesn't seem to hurt anything and is a more thorough solution.

This build did not help, it also crashed when launched from the options screen, only opened when clicked from inside the folder.

I finally had a game launch from the your MAME build and it actually looks like my MAME build is the issue. Not to sound like a complete noob, but when launching a game from your build, it brings up a seperate menu (I have seen this style of menu before when I added ROMs to the Gridlee app for Ipad). I have to select the game again to have it launch and exiting game it shows menu again and I have to press esc again. Artwork however, displayed all the time, so at this point, I think I just need to clean up my MAME folder and paths.

Any ideas on how to eliminate this secondary menu and have the game just launch normal?

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2015, 11:25:39 pm »
Oh, it crashed because it was called BigBlueTF.exe, and the config utility looks for BigBlue.exe. It couldn't find it, so it bombed out.

If you're getting MAME's game selection menu, it means that it isn't launching with a valid ROM.

Are you sure you had a rom name specified in the program's args? The behavior you're describing is exactly what would happen if command line parameters was empty.

« Last Edit: March 20, 2015, 11:29:53 pm by bulbousbeard »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #29 on: March 21, 2015, 06:40:58 pm »
Removed "TF" from BigBlue.exe and populated commandline parameters and now we are back in business. Thanks BB  :cheers:. Art is displaying correctly during preview/game play and after exit, so next step for software is hide Win 7, dump BigBlue in start-up folder and start the long process of art collecting.

If I can get a few games squared away with some artwork, I will make a small video.

I was hoping to have test sides cut, maybe tomorrow.

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #30 on: March 21, 2015, 07:52:39 pm »
Thank you again bulbousbeard. Without your program, our cabinets would require even more work and we've already got our hands full as it is.

Don't worry Typefighter01, I'll work on the sides tonight so we can cut those tomorrow.

bulbousbeard

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 522
  • I want to build my own arcade controls!
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #31 on: March 21, 2015, 09:09:35 pm »
I'm glad it works. When you mentioned hiding Windows, you reminded me of a feature I need to add: choosing a program to run when you exit the frontend (optionally).

To completely hide Windows, you probably want to set the frontend as the shell instead of explorer.exe. It's nice to have the ability to run explorer.exe when you exit the frontend to get the normal Windows shell back. Some other frontends do this, so I might as well jump on that bandwagon.

markc74

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 634
  • Definitely my last Cab. Yeah I said that last time
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137295.0.html
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #32 on: March 22, 2015, 05:46:02 pm »
Artwork here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2XxpmZ16vfOX2w3ZWU3T1E4dm8&authuser=0

Fliers - loads of zips of reasonably high res flier artwork
Marquees - a mix of low and hi res marquee files
Artwork - the actual files I use to drive the marquees on the cab. When unzipped it will give a load of folders with a  layout file and a marquee.png file.

Hope they're useful for ya  :)

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #33 on: March 22, 2015, 06:54:42 pm »
To completely hide Windows, you probably want to set the frontend as the shell instead of explorer.exe. It's nice to have the ability to run explorer.exe when you exit the frontend to get the normal Windows shell back. Some other frontends do this, so I might as well jump on that bandwagon.

That makes sense. I will follow your thread in software and watch for an update before I fiddle with hiding Windows.

Artwork here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2XxpmZ16vfOX2w3ZWU3T1E4dm8&authuser=0

Fliers - loads of zips of reasonably high res flier artwork
Marquees - a mix of low and hi res marquee files
Artwork - the actual files I use to drive the marquees on the cab. When unzipped it will give a load of folders with a  layout file and a marquee.png file.

Hope they're useful for ya  :)

Wow...dude, just a big Thank you. This saves Yvan and I scores of time and is greatly appreciated  :cheers:

markc74

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 634
  • Definitely my last Cab. Yeah I said that last time
    • forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,137295.0.html
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #34 on: March 23, 2015, 01:12:18 pm »
Not a problem mate - I've been meaning to upload them all somewhere in the event of a hard disk crash anyway.

Really looking forwards to seeing this thing working as its looking ace so far  :applaud:

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2015, 03:10:02 pm »
Artwork here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B2XxpmZ16vfOX2w3ZWU3T1E4dm8&authuser=0

Fliers - loads of zips of reasonably high res flier artwork
Marquees - a mix of low and hi res marquee files
Artwork - the actual files I use to drive the marquees on the cab. When unzipped it will give a load of folders with a  layout file and a marquee.png file.

Hope they're useful for ya  :)

 :o

Thank you very much one thousand times!  :cheers:

I'll also be using that artwork on MVS-99-6, so that's doubly appreciated!
« Last Edit: March 24, 2015, 03:11:42 pm by Yvan256 »

Typefighter01

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 416
  • Back I guess...
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #36 on: March 29, 2015, 05:13:25 pm »
Thought we would have prototype sides cut by now, but we have been doing some small tests on speaker hole design, cut depths with compression router bit for chip free finish and cutting angles for butting back panels together.

It looks like a lot of bartops (especially CNC'd ones) are built with overlaping panels with T-mold instead of proper angle cut butt joints. I understand why as cutting chamfers and angles on material ends is not an easy thing to do on the CNC bed, it's possible, just not easy.

First thing Yvan and I did to make life simple was to design all our butt joints around commonly available chamfer bits. They are usually sold in 15/22.5/30/ and 45 degree angles and are normally used to make multi sided boxes. So we are at the stage where we need to find a simple way of running them through a router. Yvan designed an awesome dowel drilling jig (see it here http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,131934.msg1469586.html#msg1469586) so we decided creating a jig to cut angles was a good direction to take.

Below is a picture of one of the lower back panels. The panel is just a rectangle, but it needs angles on two sides (the long sides). The extra little squares you see on the outside, with the holes, are part of the angle routing jig (they are cut into waste material on either side of finished part). I have asked Yvan to post a Sketchup of jig to help describe the process better. But basically, the jig is layed across panel (it has multiple holes along its length) and dowels are tapped into the holes so jig can provide a spot for bearing of chamfer bit to ride on. The extra little squares are just held on with thick tabs and once angle is routed, they are cut off and panel ends are routed with flush trim bit.



Once we get this jig built, then we can move forward with cab sides...and...NO, cutting angles on the table saw is not an option. The cuts will inevitably look like ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- (chipping) and I would rather just plop them in a jig and have angles perfect ever time than screw around moving table fence for every cut and have panels end up too short or too long.

Here are the bits just so everyone knows what we are talking about.


Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Chamfering
« Reply #37 on: March 29, 2015, 05:16:12 pm »
Our cabinet has the profile of a Neo-Geo MVS so we have to chamfer some of the panels we cut.

Typefighter01 bought a kit of four chamfering bits. Those are easy to use, but there's one detail: the bearing has to ride on the edge of the panel so you can't chamfer the full height of the material. That's fine for real wood but not so much for laminated chipboard or plywood.

And since we don't have access to an Five axis Thermwood industrial CNC router (wink wink), we had to figure out a way to chamfer the panels right up to the edge using regular chamfering bits and a regular router table.

But we do have a kick-ass CNC to make very precise jigs, so this we came up with yet another CNC-cut guide.

The idea is that each panel that needs chamfering (which can only be done on one side or two parallel sides) has extra blocks attached to it with holes for indexing the position of a guide. This guide is used by the bearing of the chamfering bit so we can chamfer right to the very edge of our panels.

This is the guide in question:



Here's the CAD image of the part seen in Typefighter01's post above. The cuts in green are bridges (material not cut through).


The longer bridges look weird because I added an extra 1/8" of margin between the indexing blocks and the part itself to make sure the router bit wouldn't damage the sides of the panel while cutting the indexing blocks. Laminate can chip rather easily so we're playing it safe.

After the CNC is done, we cut the short bridges to free the panel from the sheet. After flush trimming the small bridges on the long sides, we use the chamfering guide and do the following:



Here's a description of each frame of the animation.

1. Take the part as cut by the CNC
2. Put the chamfering guide on top with the help of the indexed holes and dowels.
3. Chamfer the side which was cut 0.125" longer to allow for a clean cut on all the thickness of the material.
4. Remove the chamfering guide.
5. Cut the bridges of the extra parts on the sides and flush trim for a clean finish.
6. Using the drilling guide we built earlier, drill holes for the dowels.
7. Insert dowels.

(there is indexing holes to chamfer the two sides of the panel but the animation only shows the process for one side in order to keep it simple)

Complicated? Yes. But as Typefighter01 said, it beats messing around with a table saw and wasting a lot of material and a lot of hours for non-repeatable and bad-looking results. We've got computerized tools, we let them do all the work.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2015, 06:34:23 pm by Yvan256 »

RetroArcadePro

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 74
  • Here for everything and anything arcades.
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #38 on: March 29, 2015, 05:30:03 pm »
Why don't you just cut the chamfers on a router?

Yvan256

  • Trade Count: (0)
  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Posts: 1039
    • Yvan256
Re: Dainamikade-Fully dynamic artwork Bartop (prototype stage)
« Reply #39 on: March 29, 2015, 05:40:49 pm »
Why don't you just cut the chamfers on a router?

That's exactly what we're doing, on a router table. The whole idea is that you can not chamfer the total thickness of a material, you need to leave something for the bearing to ride on. On the chamfering bits there's a gap of about 1/16" of an inch between the blade and the bearing so we must leave an edge of at least 1/8" on the sheet (that means you're only using 1/16" of material to ride the bearing on while chamfering).

In our cabinet, taking the lower back panels as an example, if it were cut the usual way with a 1/8" edge:


It wouldn't matter if the chipboard edge was exposed on the angle inside the cabinet, but it would look bad for the outside angle. You would see laminate, chipboard edge, chipboard edge, laminate. Not to mention the gap in the joint.

Here's a rendering if we had an edge of 1/8":


And here's a rendering with our method:


Our method allows us to chamfer the whole thickness of the material and let us control exactly where the cut ends, no measurements needed so the lengths are as precise as the CNC allows us.
« Last Edit: March 29, 2015, 06:24:22 pm by Yvan256 »

  
 

Sitemap 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29 30 31