My new project - 'Transformer' Standup/Sit down driver cab

[Cretster]

Just picked up a really cheap nasty "Xenta" 5.1 computer system for £20 which I can set it up initially with.
It functions, and it might be the case that I swap out a couple of components to make it a bit better but anyway - it'll do to start with.
I've got brackets made for both ends of the steering column ram, so am going to attempt to screw those in place in such a way that will allow it to move the wheel to either end position, ie retracted in the cabinet, or extended out in drive position. 

I need something that will lock it securely in place once it's in drive mode though.  Not sure what would be best yet.
One step at a time....

Once the steering ram works, I will move attention to the front panel, and get it build better & figure out how best to include the seat etc.

[Cretster]

Ok, the wheel is motorised now to lift and lower in/out of position.  It needs something to easily clamp once it reaches it's top point though.

Not sure what.  Would be easy to have a strong magnet but that's not good for a controlled or electrical release to lower it again, so I'm not sure.  Some sort of locking bolt maybe on a solenoid or worm drive.

[BadMouth]

words are boring.
video would be entertaining. 

[bfauska]

words are boring.
video would be entertaining. 

+1 real and fun mechanical gizmos are one place where the movie is always better than the book.

[Cretster]

Point taken but it looks deathly unexciting at the moment when stuff moves guys. Trust me.

Specially that it's running on a really weak motorbike battery so stuff takes AGES to move.
Last night I rebuilt the door panel but there's a clearance issue underneath as it opens.
I need raise the rest of the carcass half an inch off the ground and use that the stiffen it all too.  It doesn't help that my shed floor is wooden and flexes, so one moment everything fits perfectly, then next there's a half inch gap somewhere that wasn't there before.  Infuriating. 

[Cretster]

Think I just got a more robust sound system for free actually with proper separate channel inputs and much more oomph.
Teah it's way better suited actually as it'll do an input for each sound card outpuy.  Only problem is there's way of setting the source on it without the remote I think.

Wil try to get the issue with the door ironed out today, and if I can get that done and gas struts fitted then I'  try to do a video of some sort ok?

Don't get excited though.  It looks sh1t at the moment guys....

[Cretster]

Ok no video yet (I lied, but only because the pissant motorbike battery doing the job is so slow, I couldn't bear it).  I've been repair charging/desulphating etc a bigger one for days now ready to see this stuff move a bit quicker only to find it was slower still. 

Anyway, we now have a fold down door panel, which includes a rudimentary seat (quite comfy but no back on it yet), motorised steering wheel positioner (not quite perfect, and thing stiffness in the bracing is an issue here, but mostly it works), and motorised up/down control of the main top half of the cabinet (ie monitor and controls etc).

Up position:


Down position:






Sorry the pics are crap but it's only a carcass of a machine still and surrrounded by other bits of wood that serve only to camouflage the real machine itself.

It's real and it works how I wanted it to though importantly.  But it needs a lot of refinement, and tweaking to make it nice and fluid/co-ordinated etc.  And I hate all that ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- I really do.
The wheel is actually just nice positioning relative to the seat even if you can't see that here.  What I wanted though (and will find tricky) will be side panels on the fold down seat section.  I thing they'd add to the appearance a lot, but might not be as easy to implement as I'd hoped.

[BadMouth]

Looks like solid progress.

[Cretster]

Thanks mate - all this initial getting stuff aligned & smooth etc is an absolute nightmare that I never had to contend with last time round.  So it's taken forever just to get a workable carcass, then once the motor stuff is in I have to suss out how best to fit averything around that.

Another issue I've got is the speed the motors move.  I'm about to post a video once I get it edited & uploaded etc, and no, it's not exciting, but both the wheel and the lift are soooooo slow.  I can live with it but it'd be great to have it go faster.  The problem with the main lift ram is it's 24v rated and I'm putting 12 into it.  Obviously it ain't gonna run well at half its rated voltage.  Not sure about the steering ram but that's real slow to so I may try that on 18 or 24 with a drill battery or something.  If they both work great on 24v then I'll invest in one of those cheap 24v PSUs like you use for 3D printers etc.  Should provide quite a few amps too.....

[Cretster]

Ok, here's the first video - as explained in the comments, it's real slow as it's running on 12v instead of the 24v it should be using.  Also, I stopped it about an inch below the top so just under full height.
Sorry it's not filmed from further back for better perspective:

[Cretster]

Warning - this could kill you of sheer boredom, but people wanted to see videos of this motorised wheel in action moving in & out of place. As you can see it is VERY slow because the motor is running I think half the correct voltage. 



I think one of these is what I need but no idea how much current these motors (either of them) are trying to pull when in use and can't find out much about them.
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/DC-12V-24V-5V-Universal-Regulated-Switching-Power-Supply-for-LED-Strip-CCTV-UK-/291087849273?pt=UK_BOI_Electrical_Test_Measurement_Equipment_ET&var=&hash=item43c6301739

Also be point where it joins the control panel is very stiff/jerky because there are some bits that are slightly in the way, and need adjusting.  But it's there, and it all kinda works:

[Cretster]

This is the temporary seat when folded down.  It's not very attractive  The curve at the front is to accommodate fitting against the steering wheel.



You can see where the pedals sit.  I need them to be able to move closer for the kids, so like a rail system but with stop points.  Not sure what is best for that.  Could just use some rails and a peg I guess, but something better would be nice. 

I need at least some form of low seat back, or if nothing else, some sturdy mount points where an external piece can slot in.  I May be able to have something that folds down flat, and would include the rear speakers and a hearest.  That would be idea but I just don't know yet what will fit.

But here it is all folded up, wheel moved back, monitor up, and front seat panel closed.  Ready for normal upright mode (sans control panel of course).


So yeah, it's miles from finished or even usable yet, but I'm pretty pleased to have got the motor sections working well enough, and so everything fits.

The next issue I have is to prevent the front door panel from being dropped when opened.  It needs to lower down slow and smooth, and I'm not sure best how. 
I have some tailgate struts from a car but because they work on compression, it'd need to have them go to a separate piece on the floor or something. 

Really, I want like the opposite of a tailgate strut, where it's normally compressed, and needs tension to smoothly extend it out.  I know you can buy them but I think they're big $$$.

Any suggestions?!

[Cretster]

Somehow in the door panel I want it to include upright panels (running front to back as you're sitting in it), and to be able to conceal or at least house flight controls too, for flight sims, or Elite etc.

Plus, I haven't even thought yet where a slide out keyboard will fit in with this entire design.  All suggestions welcome!!!

[Cretster]

Also, in the last 10 minutes I just solved (again at a very crude level) the seat back problem.

Here you can see a makeshift back/shoulder rest (which can also house rear speakers when made properly) folded flat against the back of the cabinet door:


Now folded up Into position.  Yeah ok it looks a bit like granny's rocking chair but just wanted to check something along these lines would be feasible.





Pleased with how this is coming together now guys.

Setting aside the appalling current visuals/aesthetics, I'd appreciate useful constructive criticism or ideas on how to do certain bits better etc?

[Cretster]

Honestly, I put videos up and no-ones interested now!!

Told you they'd be boring.  Lol!!

Working on the seat back arrangement today and then I MIGHT consider bring it into the house.  Might be a bit premature but needs to be moved before the weight gets too much.  But ideally while there's not still tons of sawing & drilling to be done....  Difficult balance.  Goddam cold out there today though, but I'm back at work tomorrow so it'd be nice to get something useful done.

My friend says he thinks he has a 2 foot long actuator at work that's damaged (12v) that I can have.  If he has then that would open & close the front door, meaning almost full automation, which is more than I intended.  Would be cool though!!

[BadMouth]

Honestly, I put videos up and no-ones interested now!!

Told you they'd be boring.  Lol!!

I enjoyed them, just don't spend as much time on BYOAC over the weekend. 
It's like watching a space craft slowly move into position for a launch.
Not exciting in itself, but exciting in showing what's to come.
Automated stuff rules. 

[lolomc2]

Hello Cretster

Impressive job ! I would like to see more

I though about a pinball mecanisum (not sure of the word) which could be use to loack the wheel in place. You just need to power the coil and than, the lock will be opened.
I will post a picture in order to help my English You can install one on each side and get an easy automatism


Regarding the breake and up pedals, I have used this cheap component which is used normally in bed actuator The lengh you can get is about 5''. I have used a set of two. One to move it horizontally and one to move it to the top, for kids also

Never heard about 24VDC (with high amperage) cheap power supply but I know that you can chain two "classic" AT(X) power supply easily. The only thing to take care is about external boxes that should not be connected together.

Good luck for the rest

[Cretster]

Thanks for the comments and suggestions!

I now got the 24v PSU for the rams and they move TONS better now.  Major improvement.  It's in the house now, and tonight I'm collecting a 3 foot long ram to use for opening/closing the front door panel.

Getting close now but I have to re-design the seat to make it more comfy, look better, and look less like granny's rocking chair.  Plus to incorporate the rear speakers etc.

[Cretster]

Ok - really need to redesign the seat somehow for more comfort.  Will have to figure that out.  Maybe it can slide forwards or something, with different lock points.

Think I've got the bits I need now for making the screen tilt down a little too.

Have picked up the big ram for the door/seat but not had a chance to see if it will actually fit in there yet!!!

[BadMouth]

Maybe move the pedals to the back of the cab?
I see you might have to cut them in half to straddle the ram though.

[Cretster]

Not sure why you mean about moving the pedals sorry bud?  To what end?  Do you mean for this new lift ram?  It was going to just go on one side of the door, but to be honest, it's too big and I can't see any way I can actually use the damn thing.  
It's about 3foot closed, and extends 24"- just can't find any angle where it can possibly fit inside the cabinet and do what's needed sadly.  Shame since it was free. 
It's feasible it could fit eternally on the side of the cabinet that's more or less against the wall (so mainly not seen) but I wanted to keep everything hidden ideally.

Will run me another £50 ore so to buy a suitable smaller one at least and budget is tight.

For now anyway, I want to try to make the seat more comfy and look better.  I've got the monitor to pivot so it can tilt forward as required now at least.

[BadMouth]

Not sure why you mean about moving the pedals sorry bud?  To what end? 

You mentioned wanting to make the seat slide, so I thought you didn't have enough leg room.

[Cretster]

Ahh I see.  No the leg room is mostly ok really for me (I'm 5'10") but it'd be nice to be able to adjust both the seat and pedal positions as required for other people.
Ideally, a subframe from a car seat would do as it has the adjustment handle and rails combined to allow it to easily move and lock in any position.
Not sure if there's a (cheap) readily available alternative though as that'd seem a bit overkill to fit under the pedals if nothing else.

Seriously considering putting that big ram on the outside of the cabinet now just to be done with it.  Mostly it'll be hidden anyway behind the cabinet, and easy to replace at a later date with a smaller internal one if funds permit I guess.

[Cretster]

Been a major seat redesign today so some pics later hopefully, and progress.

[Cretster]

Ok, it's not really pretty right now, nor physically finished but still, you probably get the idea.  Here's 'normal' arcade mode (screen obviously missing!):



Then Driving mode.  Front folds down, & seat folds up, Steering wheel motors itself out into place, screen & controls drop down 13" lower to suit being sat down.  Pedals fold into place:



Front panel folded down ready for the seat to be positioned and the 'spoiler' raised:



This bit has to stay folded out of the way while the door is up, then folds into position to make the front half of the seat like this:

[Cretster]

I realise how horrible and crude the construction all looks currently but I need to make sure everything all can function how I want it to before I spend any effort at all in making it look nice.

Two things I have to figure out also:
Where to have a keyboard hidden that can ideally come out from somewhere and stay in front of me (say I'm sitting playing a key intensive game like Elite - needs to be in easy reach), and flight controls.
I can either have a stick that recesses beneath the seat and comes out centrally on a rail, or each side of a hotas system installed on fold up side arms from the rear 'spoiler' so they sit nicely in front perhaps?

All suggestions welcome!!

[Cretster]

On another note, I found that the subwoofer and integral amp etc was no way going to fit in the based of the cabinet due to moving stuff (motor, folding pedals etc).

So I've made a new sub box a bit smaller to house the components but it's still gonna be a huge squeeze.   Sure the acoustics of the sub won't be ideal, but let's face it, it's for video games.  If it goes thud thud boom, it'll do!!  Gonna try to fit that now and wire in speakers for a quick test of some sort, then call it a night.

[Cretster]

Ok, I got a new subwoofer enclosure built that JUST fits in!!

Annoyingly as I don't have the remote for this system I have no control other than volume, and bass is too weak considering it's a potent sub & amp. 
I think because the satellite speakers are not the matching ones for the system they are too sensitive so are louder than the sub comparitively, and I've no means of balancing that out.  Can buy a remote for about £16 so it might have to be done so I can mess with the settings.

Good to have working 5.1 setup, although I'm not sure how I choose this for instance when listening to music or watching a video.  Is mostly just using the front speakers, even though the realtek software correctly has a 5.1 install setup with all the test tones working right etc.

Tomorrow, I will attempt to wire up switches for the cabinet and steering motors, and add limit switches where needed.   Then I can get on and play.

Pleased though - it's got convoluted making things fit  but I now have a(n ugly) transforming upright to sitdown race cab, where the kids can reach the controls, once it's in use, I'll have to think about an arduino to control the transformation from one mode to the other, because things MUST be done in a certain order to avoid broken-ness.....

[Le Chuck]

That's the best stand-up two player to sit-down driver I've ever seen!  Lol, it's also the only one but I'm really impressed that you're getting it together and I like your detailed posts.  Sure it's a little rough right now but that's all the fun.  Keep at it.  I'll keep watching. 

[Cretster]

I love that comment, thanks mate.

Kids aren't here today so I can concentrate on trying to figure out a wiring diagram for getting it all moving correctly and in the right order to avoid collisions etc!!

[Cretster]

Need to use wiring like this for the motor controls I think:
http://www.instructables.com/id/HOW-TO%3a-Wire-a-DPDT-rocker-switch-for-reversing-po/?ALLSTEPS

[Cretster]

Video time!



Three switches added to the transformer cabinet (for now - more will follow).
The first is an 'arming' switch which provides 24v power to both of the other switches, one for each lift motor.

The left rocker switch then can be used to either raise or lower the steering wheel/column inside the cabinet or into racing position.

The right one is for raising or lowering the top half of the cabinet itself, ie mainly the monitor, so it is lowered for racing games. 

Yes it all looks horrible & scruffy sorry!

The main lift motor has end switches integral but I don't think the ram for the steering column does, so I need to fit some.  I also need to fit additional switches to ensure that things are in their correct respective positions before they will be able to move for safety and for the longevity of the machine (ie not ripping itself apart!!!).

But it works at this level now, so once the electronics (PC and buttons/controls) are up and running we can test this out!

[BadMouth]

It's ALIVE!

[Cretster]

Lots of wiring tidying to be done next.  Most stuff is working though.

I just tried running a race on Dirt 3 and it keeps freezing up for some reason.  Now I remember why I hate PC games!
The Nvidia Experience thing has automatically selected all the video options according to my hardware, but every 5-10 seconds the game freezes for a second or so.  Infuriating.  Presume something is set too high but I've no idea of the kind of order of weeding out graphics/performance related issues in games.

Surround sound works well when the game plays, there's something not quite right about the seating position but not sure what...  More playtime will figure it out I'm sure.

And I'm getting some terrible evil thoughts on buying a Hotas Warthog or Rhino flight system for playing Elite.

Seat all needs padding etc too, but this of course will affect how far it can all fold up etc.

So it's sort of up and running but still TONS to do.  No idea where I'll fit the Xbox in it either.  Might even have to be up near the top of the cabinet perhaps.  Who knows....

[Cretster]

Aaargh!  Since I spent half of yesterday neatening things a bit and routing wires away where they should be etc I find I mysteriously have a fault with the rear left channel on the amp unit somehow horrible loud crackling & hissing coming from it regardless of any input signal to the amp on that channel.  Think something just died, so after all that hassle building a new sub box to fit inside and house the amp it's gone bad.

[Cretster]

Ongoing audio problems with it today alas, but on the plus side, the boy has just enjoyed some Outrun, Turbo Outrun, and Chase HQ - so we can call it a success.





I've managed to add in a slide out keyboard that rests on the lap when extended (perfect for flight sims I guess), and also get the 360 installed and get a quick lap of Forza in, using the built in wheel & pedals.

Not a lot more to be done really other than the audio fixing, then onto ergonomics and cosmetics.......

[BadMouth]

I'm impressed.  Even without the automation...if you had to fold everything up by hand, I'd be impressed.

[Cretster]

Thanks mate.  Few things to refine before I start cosmetics, changing the sound system is one.  Putting padding on the seat is priority though - realise how sore my arse is after days of just sitting on a bare piece of wood while working on it!!!  Need something that's thin but fairly firm to then cover over with vinyl or something.  Also, would love to automate the door as the whole sequence could then be programmable effectively.

[Cretster]

Ok, I've added some basic seat padding and lumbar support and BOY what a difference it makes to comfort!!!
Ordered a Logitech Z506 sound system for it too, which should be a huge improvement.

Now I'm still fighting with what set of flight controls to buy (like a used X45 for £50 or something, or a rhino for £220!!!) - this will continue but in the meantime I have more issues f ergonomics to address.

I've found that when playing racers that the wheel is in the wrong position for me.  I.e. if I sit back against the seat properly for comfort, my legs are fine for the pedals, but the wheel is almost out of reach, so I can't get suitable comfort.

What I'm considering as a solution is to change 2 things.
1) The existing lift actuator moves 13" vertically.  I can get an 18" actuator for about £50, which would enable more variance on upper & lower height limits, which would be better for neck angle to the screen, but what I'm planning is for the 18" actuator to move the monitor/control panel/wheel section DIAGONALLY down & forwards.  It'd give extra travel downwards where needed for the kids, but also if it's moving at an angle would bring the wheel closer, most importantly.
2) Secondly, this would free up the existing 13" actuator which can then be used to open & close the main front panel, meaning the whole process (beside the seat folding up) is then powered.

Will be a ballache when I just got it all working nicely, but it has to be comfortable or I won't want to play it for more than 10 minutes at a time, so doesn't seem much worse to do.  I have to figure out if it would cause problems for other areas of the build. 

Might not be so easy to rebuild so it moves at an angle or it might be easy - not sure yet....

Thoughts?

Or other means of extending the wheel I'm not sure about but it basically needs doing.

[Cretster]

Here's a vague idea what I mean, so instead of the top half moving vertically it would come down at an angle.

The only thing I'm not 100% sure about would be the stability of the top half without some sort of additional guides or rails beside the actuator itself and the drawer sliders on each side....
Could try it and see I guess.....



I suppose you'd want the actuator more toward the front of the cab (central ish) to balance the weight load and make it smoother on the drawer rails instead of them twisting.  But this could cause issues with the door closing etc....