Steve, you complained many years ago that no-one would start producing leaf switch based controls. At first I resisted, but when finances allowed (well over $15k in investments) I did it for the community to fill the void.
While I appreciate the risk and investment... You cant try to guilt-trip me because I do not agree with your idea of what constitutes a classic leafswitch 'upgrade'. Ive had years of abuse from a mother whom used that guilt-trip half-truth BS on me... and what Id finally came away from it... was that I have no need to feel anything from such an abusive attack... except anger, and the decision not to bother talking to, nor responding to the attackers low-ball tactics.
If you can't get the same performance from the CLASSX buttons as you do from the original leaf buttons, then you are either unwilling, or physically unable to make any small adjustments in your playing style to make it happen.
This is straight up BULL, and you know it. Your assembly is mechanically different, and without half the travel.. its incapable of replicating the original feel and reactions of a classic leaf button. Similar? Partially so.. but not the same... and not close enough, as stated.
Others whom dont know the mechanical qualities of what you suggest, wont understand fully, and may accept your butt-covering maneuver. But many whom are mechanics, know the real deal... and are face palming and chuckling at the "SPIN" thats being applied here.
Many a year ago... I tried to produce a Discs of Tron spinner with some 2 part plastic mix. The results were less than adequate.. but heck, it was an interesting experience. Anyways... when I found out there were certain parts I couldnt make... I was going to alter the original design in a certain way. I was given the full on angered "nose-up" business, by several.. whom made it very clear they were not interested in such a different approach. Even if that meant there were No other alternatives... but to hopefully score a real assembly one day.. via miracle + wallet drain.
Similarly, I once thought Id build a Wooden Dummy.. but found I didnt know how to cut the square holes through a 12" diameter log. So I improvised.. and just made the arms stationary. I even went one step further... to angle the lower arm, as if it were coming from a different vector. I thought I was making a very clever improovement on a +300 yr old design. However, after all of the work invested... I finally hung the thing and tried to use it. I found out immediately, that it was pretty much useless... as the form did not work due to my non moving arms.. as well as the incorrect angle of the bottom arm. Each design element had long been tested and perfected.. but I didnt know the insides and outs about what and why... until that very moment. Egg on face, I no longer jump into the belief that I can improve something thats been out there for ages... often made by designers far more capable, and has been proven and tested.
At this point, I probably could tweak some things to make some changes... but only because Ive the experience and in-depth usage knowledge. Where as I see others constantly making devices that are far inferior... partly because they have little to no understanding of the form, and how and what is trying to be accomplished with the original device. As such, they THINK their designs are great... and even Better... but the experienced people in the actual art.. are rolling their eyes.. and wouldnt pay a nickel for their laughable contraptions.
While you may have meant well.. you have come up short.. on a major feature of a real leaf button. I and others, may have tried and failed the same way... also not understanding the reasons. Heck, I didnt know what made leafs so special until I was in my 30s... which in many ways.. is embarrassing. (Though, maybe not as embarrassing as my thought that I was being a pioneer as the first to make a so called "ergonomic" curved button layout... and then quickly realizing that it sucked when It was made real -vs- just placing your fingers on circles drawn on paper... ...and then having to scrap and re-work the control panel)
If folks don't mind dealing with the numerous shortcomings of the originals, which the industry long ago turned it's back on, then by all means, those are what they should seek out while the remnants can still be found. But honestly, Steve, the way you carry on is just detrimental overall. Anyone who might make the sacrifices necessary in the form of any kind of investment, to entertain your ramblings, are likely to discard such notions, as nothing seems to be good enough for you if it's not an exact replica of 30 year old designs, shortcomings be damned.
As you stated... leafs had their shortcommings.. and they were replaced with Micros. But at the same time... what happened? The game designers no longer made rapidfire games. Why? Because nobody could withstand the fatigue with micros. They then reduced the games difficulty level as a result.. and or made auto-fire games.
The same thing happened when they introduced those WRETCHED mini-analog thumb sticks. They are nearly unusable due to the poor leverage point, short length, spring type, and the least deleterious digit.. to control them. You cant be precise with them at all. What happened? The game companies had to Reduce the games needed precision as a result... and or highly reduce the difficulty levels as well. All because some bonehead made the worst possible decision in gaming History.
So what is detrimental? People passionate about Quality and Control? Or people whom are too egotistical to admit they were wrong... and that they didnt really know what they were doing when they made their disastrous design... ?
Ya know what? They COULD fix those mini analogs with a que from Sinistar's controller. In which theres a multiplicative resistance setup. Making it harder to move the stick.. the further it goes from center... and keeping the center from being pulled out of whack.. due to odd spring forces. For those whom are lost .. think about that little analog track-stick nub that is on a lot of the laptops. It takes more pressure to move it.. and its a lot more precise than a slippery mini analog. However.. even these are not quite on par with the Sinistar centering device: a four post rubber "X" shape... often called a centering-spider. Fighting one leg, means that each of the other legs are also involved... so the further you go from center... you multiply the force exponentially. This gives Sinistar its trademark ability to control the ship in very slow speed.. with incredible precision and accuracy... yet all the sudden, can burst to hyper fast warp speeds... whenever you choose. A typical analog thumbstick cant play this game well at all in mame. Even a large handle analog stick isnt as good... even with its enhanced leverage and thus greater precision. The spring is too tight in the middle.. and once overcome... too lose to keep you from going too fast too easily, in game. Therefore.. again, programmers are stuck reducing game difficulty / challenge / intensity... because of CRAPPY controller designs.
The Detriment to the arcade hobby.. is parts that make classics play Worse than they are meant to be played and enjoyed.
The Detriment to Classic Gaming, is for too many 'Know-it-alls' to ruin the whole picture of gaming history, and Tarnish it with false and half-truths, to protect their investments and or egos.
I've said this before, and I will unfortunately say it once more: If you really think you can offer the community something which is a major improvement over what is available, take some personal risk, as the dedicated others have done, and do the work it takes to bring it to fruition. Either you will be right and actually do something which improves the lives of others, or you won't and have to live with the ramifications of your decisions. Otherwise, you are just pining for the past, without really helping anyone. As you seem to be fond of analogies, you seem to me to be akin to a movie critic who pathologically feels they must criticize any film which is not in black and white.
Its funny that you, and a lot of the others THINK that Im a guy stuck in the ancient past. This is typical of shallow minded people.
Im happy playing some of the old Mechanical PCB-Less games, black and white games discrete games, vector games, the classic 80s games.. as I am playing the later Street fighers, Tekken III's, 90s Racers, and even some modern games. Ive been into games since I was 7, and Im in my 40s now. Ive owned almost all the consoles, as well as grew up on the old PCs: Vic20, C-64 & 128, Amiga 500, and a little dabble on some old IBM PC's in the times when Sim City & Wolfenstein 3D were the rage.
Ive worked in a busy arcade as a manager / repair tech... learning the ins and outs of mechanical design and failure points.. as well as learning about material qualities, stress factors, spring types, and far more. (Not to mention I used to take apart everything as a kid)
Since then, Ive got into collecting and restoration work, on both Pinball machines and Vids.
I own probably 80% of all of the unique specialty arcade controllers that were made. As well as many unique console controllers. (Epyx 500xj singe hand ergonimic controller stick - which used microswitches in a consumer stick.. which was unheard of at that time)
Yet somehow... Im clueless when it comes to Leaf buttons ? And somehow.. this collector and preservationist... is bad for the hobby and cause... because he wont accept inferior / incorrectly functioning controllers. A M A Z I N G.
Dont you worry Randy... I wont bother bashing your bologna further.
However, If Im fortunate in my luck somehow, I may be an up and rising competitor.
Home
Help
Search
Login
Register
Send this topic
Print
Topic: Leaf style Pushbuttons and their differences (Read 25401 times)
