Fursphere's driving cabinet build

[Fursphere]

I started this about a month ago - been posting mostly on the hyperspin forums - but since you guys went ahead and created a driving cabinet specific forum here, I feel I should contribute

Here's a couple of pictures of where I'm at.  That's my nephew playing Dirt 3 (sort of playing..  hehe)

EDIT - Added v1 of the plans I made for the cabinet.   "mycab.zip" below.

[BadMouth]

Nice to see the sega style base done completely from scratch. 
Looking sweet!

[brad808]

I've been following this on the hyperspin forum but rarely post anything there. You've been making really good progress so far and it's turning out pretty sweet, good job.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

[Nuexzz]

is great ! when you finish hope you do not mind sending the measures.

[drventure]

Nice!

Will you be running only PC games, or console drivers as well, or possibly some mame stuff too?

And what kind of seat is that?

[Fursphere]

is great ! when you finish hope you do not mind sending the measures.

I will post them.  I need to clean them up - but I think I've validated the basic plan enough to be satisfied. 

Nice!

Will you be running only PC games, or console drivers as well, or possibly some mame stuff too?

And what kind of seat is that?

PC - I currently plan Dirt 3, NFS Shift2, Blur, and I have a few others I'm trying out. 

Console - I have a Wii and a PS2 - I don't know if I will bother hooking them up.  I do have the Wii emulated on that PC, and it runs well enough to play Mario Kart Wii. 

MAME - Yup, I've got a complete .148 set, and I've been messing with lots of games.  Like Badmouth has mentioned in other threads, getting each game to run and *work* correctly with the Logitech wheel is a unique challenge every time.

Some games like Spy Hunter (the original) just won't work right with that wheel - it just isn't sensitive enough.  Way too much "dead space" in the controls

[gbeef]

 i haven't been on hyperspin in a long time. Your build is looking pretty sweet. Good idea on the speakers also., thats on thing i wish i did was have them down fire. When you work on the dash take your time. and bondo and fiberglass are your friends.

[Fursphere]

My dash got some cracks and dents and uglyness.   I was planning on epoxy on the backside - then bondo later.  I really wanted to use the metal back plate it comes with, but after a lot of thought and test fitting, it just made more sense to leave it out.

[Brian74]

So how do you plan on mounting your wheel? Fyi, Im Xx_Strike_xX on the Hyperspin Forums.

[Fursphere]

So how do you plan on mounting your wheel? Fyi, Im Xx_Strike_xX on the Hyperspin Forums.

The wheel is mounted.  I'll get a better picture of it later for you.  The entire dash section was built as a module, so I can remove the whole thing at once.  Although that's a little tricky with all the wires / connections that the wheel has.  I may end up drilling two holes just big enough for the mounting screws all the way though the cabinet so they can be removed without pulling the "dash section". 

Everything I've built so far has a simple way of taking it apart for maintenance or modifications. 

Logitech is closing their "console gaming" division this year (/cry) - I'm hoping the steering wheel line and PC game controller line doesn't get cut with it.

[gbeef]

For the cracks i used fibre glass tape and epoxy. Also i have 4 bolts inside my cab to secure the wheel your setup looks bang on to mine. On the dash i extended a lip out on it, this way your face inst right in the screen. Keep in mind on the 2 large camps and how that will secure down.
Very nice progress so far.

[Fursphere]

So here is how I mounted the steering wheel....   (and I went ahead and mounted the shifter - its not done by any means).  And an side profile shot from a few weeks ago.

I need to add support to the back of the dashboard, then the gluing, filling, sanding, painting can start on this part. 

[Fursphere]

Finished the construction of the dashboard today. Rebuilt the shifter area, and pushed it out (towards the driver) about 3/4" more. Feels much better, and doesn't have the clearance issues underneath anymore. I used Tee nuts to secure the Daytona dashboard - need to build some spacers in the rear so it doesn't get compressed and crack. All four bolts are in now. I used a 1 1/4" hole saw to bore right through the shifter mounting plate to in between the supports to run the cable through to the rear. I had to notch the dash plate there anywhere for the shifter backside, so it just worked out nicely. Next up will be tearing it apart one last time to glue and pin everything together, then wood filler (or bondo) to smooth it all out then painting it. I'm still a bit amazed at just how long this one section has taken so far - and still isn't complete.

Next up will be figuring out the seat - I'm still not happy with the basic design, but I'm not sure how to do it better either.

First pic shows the clearance problems I was having with the old mount.

[Fursphere]

Started re-drawing the plans in Google Sketchup.  Should take me a couple of days.

[Fursphere]

Added v1 of the plans I made for the cabinet.  I used the plans found in Badmouth's driving thread and a picture of gbeef's cabinet (and a bunch of algebra) to get a rough idea of the design.

I made these plans mostly this evening - based on my cabinet.  Working backwards? 

Anyway, if you have any questions let me know.  The drawing file is Google Sketchup 8.  I'll probably add more to it later.

Oh ya, I got my Pyle 2x120watt (lol) amp today and tested it out with the 2nd set of speakers I have.  I think its going to work pretty good!  (The manual really says its 2x20watt, 120watt peak, hence the 'lol' - I knew this going in though, at the price I paid, it was not a super high quality amp)

[deathrow]

You have some really great wood working skills!

All looking top notch, well done mate 

[Fursphere]

Thanks!

I routed out the speaker panel and "sunk" the speakers - they're almost flush with the panel now (almost because if I went any deeper I'd hit the t-nuts...  the whole time I was routing it I was waiting to see sparks as it was).  I hooked them up to the amp this morning - sound pretty good!  I'm debating on if I should "seal" in the speaker compartment, or let it breath.  There are arguements both ways for speaker cabinet design. 

[Fursphere]

I shouldn't have known better.  I hooked up the high frequency drivers with the filter's and did some testing.  The little tweeters that came with the dash board actually enhanced the sound range of the Polk speakers.  Then I went ahead and hooked up one of the big drives and damn, what a difference. 

So..  I'll be getting out the hole saw and mounting those up behind the dash today.   

[Arturius]

Looks like a great build so far, will be watching with interest

[Fursphere]

So the Pyle 2-channel (2x20w real output) amplifier just wasn't cutting it.  So I returned it.  Remembering I had a 12v 30amp power supply left over from my R/C car days, I started looking at *real* car audio amplifiers.

I ended up buying a 4-Channel (4x50w real output) Sound Ordnance amp.  (that's Crutchfield's "house" brand from what I understand)  The amp has full range and high pass filters for the front channel (I'll be using full), then full/high/low filters for the rear (I only want lows for the rear). 

Those 2 Pyle 8s are mounted directly under where the seat will be mounted.  I haven't boxed anything in yet (mostly due to my "free time" aligning perfectly with the kiddo's "nap times"...  oh well ). 

But just how it sits now with the rear / lower speakers turned up a little the whole lower cabinet vibrates nicely, and inst loud at all - the low pass filter is awesome.  I think when I get the upper and lower speaker boxes finished and sealed there is going to be some significant rumbling going on. 

If I end up not getting enough from the 2x8s, I'll just swap them out for a bass shaker.  The Sound Ordnance amp also has an output for another amp if I want to get REALLY silly.  (I don't think it'll come to that)

I had to buy the amp anyway to drive a bass shaker.

[Fursphere]

So, I got the Y cables to tie the front and rear channels together, and hooked that up last night.  Wasn't getting what I wanted out of it.  The tweeters are still just too damn loud.  I unhooked them this morning. 

I'm still not happy with it.  To get any amount of feedback out of the system, I have to crank it up - and even at like 15% volume its way too loud (I haven't even messed with the +gain on the amp itself - its pushing minimal power). 

I can get the rears jumping really good, but by that point the fronts are making you deaf. 

I'm considering returning the amp, yanking the speakers out, and putting in a nice Logitech 5.1 system with a higher end Sound Blaster sound card.  All the newer games support surround sound, and for the ones that don't - the Sound Blaster cards have software options to correct for that. (CMSS-3D stereo balancing I think).

Maybe I'm just getting old?   

[Howard_Casto]

I don't think I'd waste money on a soundblaster card....  it's not a hi-fi system, just a racing cab.   All sound cards are software driven at this point.... I'd be genuinely shocked if your on board audio didn't support surround sound and have all the correctional sliders you need to fix things.   

I know many people will be surprised to hear this, but typically amps designed for the pc work best for the pc.... shocker I know.    All of my mame cabs used a hacked up pc speaker with a good amp in it (hooked to genuine arcade speakers of course).  It's worked well over the years and typically a decent quad audio rig can be bought for under 50 bucks.  Logitech will do you well, I think that's what I'm using on my home pc actually. 

[Drnick]

I can get the rears jumping really good, but by that point the fronts are making you deaf. 

I'm considering returning the amp, yanking the speakers out, and putting in a nice Logitech 5.1 system with a higher end Sound Blaster sound card.  All the newer games support surround sound, and for the ones that don't - the Sound Blaster cards have software options to correct for that. (CMSS-3D stereo balancing I think).

Maybe I'm just getting old?   

Yeah, I think you are getting too old,  Does the current Amp not allow you to adjust Front/rear balancing? If it does then surely you can set the rears to 90% and the fronts to about 10%. (Tweak the frequency going to the rear speakers as low as the speakers will allow).

If you go down the logitech route I highly recommend you get a soundcard/speaker combination that can use optical connections. I am using a z5400 set in my living room, (Connected to PC/360/BR/SKY/TV/PS3)  I like it for a number of reasons, but mostly because it allows you to independantly decide the level you want pumping to the sub. So you can have the sub right the way down and have the main volume quite loud or have it the other way round.

On my jukebox I am using a set of x560's which doesn't have optical, It just uses 3 x Headphone Jack to Phono.  It doesn't seem to matter what settings I use in the creative software the woofer is much too boomy and over the top even though its only about 20W against the 120W or so of the 5400.   (The only issue I can think about with the 5400's is the size of the sub, It's quite chunky).  I ran the THX Subwoofer test on it the other day at about 10% volume and basically had to quickly turn it off when just about everything in the house started vibrating     I say don't worry about getting old and install a set of Z906's  Or a decent 2.1 set at the front and a Buttkicker under the seat.

[Howard_Casto]

Again, it's a racing cab, not a hi-fi rig.  Enjoy spending way too much money to listen to highly compressed sound files in a video game.  It's like having a thousand dollar stereo system to listen to mp3s. 

I'm not trying to argue, it's just you speaker nerds kill me.  Unless it's a bluray movie or a physical cd with uncompressed wav files there's no point in using really high-end stuff.  You know the old saying, garbage in, garbage out.  And most of the audio coming out of video games or emulators, it's definitely garbage. 

[Fursphere]

My Gigabyte motherboard has Realtek audio on-board.  It does support 2.1/5.1/7.1 connections.  It does NOT support treble / bass control.  So unless your speakers are perfectly tuned to YOUR ears, you can't do anything about it.  I want the aftermarket sound card for this level kind of control.  Realtek audio is just flat sounding garbage. 

The amp has front and rear GAIN control (volume) seperately.  I have the front set to ZERO gain, and if I turn the windows volume up to about 15%, its just too much.  I can't make it any lower. 

I've done stuff like this in the past and never had issues - so I'm a bit confused as to whats going on right now honestly.  I'm going to play with it when I get home (before the kids go to sleep so I can actually make some noise) and see if I can get anything better out of it. 

I think the problem really is that the speakers are too loud and too close to the driver seat.  I used those speakers in large rooms in different cabinets and they always sounded great.  But now that they are about two feet from my face, its just overpowering. 

[drventure]

I'd tend to agree with Howard.

It's a cab, not a home theater system. Drop 20-50$ on a logitec system and use the rest for things that really matter in a driving cab, like the wheel, shifter, seat, screen, or whatever.

[Fursphere]

It's a cab, not a home theater system. Drop 20-50$ on a logitec system and use the rest for things that really matter in a driving cab, like the wheel, shifter, seat, screen, or whatever.

Wheel - done
Shifter - done
Seat - done
Screen - done

What else do I have left to tweak? 

Seriously though, I mentioned the 5.1 one idea (vs what I've already done) to my friend, and he's like "I've got a Logitech 5.1 system you can have - its extra".  So...  I'll take that for a spin. 

[drventure]

Doh!

Well then, you're way ahead of me 

But a free set is way better than a paid set and those logitec don't sound bad.

I used a 2.1 Altec lansing set in my buffet cab and I get comments all the time on how good it sounds (what sucks is I can't tell myself at all, my hearing's gone down the tubes over the last few year.   

[Howard_Casto]

And just for the record, I've got a realtech on board on this pc... sounds fantastic. 

And yes it doesn't have "treble/bass" sliders exactly, but going into the advanced options you can adjust each speaker individually including the sub channel and center.  Also in the "effects" section, there are various filters you can apply, including some "levels" presets and there should be either a "custom" or "user-defined" preset that you can use. 

What I'm saying is the issue isn't the card, it's your speaker hardware.  Could be the positioning, could be the amp, it could be a lot of things.  You could keep playing with it forever to get it right, or just put a rig designed for pcs in there and have it work out of the box. 

Also you have messed with the HD audio manager in the control panel?  Tons more settings there.  If you don't have one then you don't have the software/drivers fully installed for the chipset and are instead using the crappy ones included with windows. 

[BadMouth]

Just an FYI, audio processing on the fly by using the audio manager software makes more work for your processor.
Best not to use it if you're trying to get by with less than a killer processor.

[brad808]

If you are willing to spend the money and you aren't happy with what you have now then go buy what you want. Otherwise you will just end up replacing it again until it's up to your standards.

I have two amps in my cab. A 5.1 surround sound home theatre style receiver and a separate small amp that powers a bass rumbler off the subwoofer line.

I only threw the 5.1 receiver in there as a temporary solution but it works great so I left it in (at least until I find something else I would rather be using) . Total control over each individual speaker volume and eq. Optical inputs. Pretty sure it cost $100, probably 7-10 years ago.

Sent from my Galaxy Nexus

[Fursphere]

What I'm saying is the issue isn't the card, it's your speaker hardware.  Could be the positioning, could be the amp, it could be a lot of things.  You could keep playing with it forever to get it right, or just put a rig designed for pcs in there and have it work out of the box. 

Also you have messed with the HD audio manager in the control panel?  Tons more settings there.  If you don't have one then you don't have the software/drivers fully installed for the chipset and are instead using the crappy ones included with windows.

The speakers sound fine, they're just too damn loud.  Hey - I had an idea and it didn't work out.  Not the first time, and I'm sure it won't be the last.    I only paid for the amp (already had the speakers), and I'm sure I can return the amp.  Not an issue.

Yes, I've played with the AC97 HD manager software - its severely lacking.  Garbage IMO.  I guess I just have higher expectations than most for audio. 

Converting the cabinet over to 5.1 shouldn't be a huge deal.  I'll have to get the table saw out and cut a few new panels. 

With the 8" Pyle's I wanted to use, the downside is I wouldn't know if they'd work or not until after I got them installed and was able to test it.  Now I know. 

[gbeef]

If your looking for something that thumps. I can highly Reccomend butt kicker transducers. The cheaper versions are the Aruras.

[Fursphere]

If your looking for something that thumps. I can highly Reccomend butt kicker transducers. The cheaper versions are the Aruras.

You've got this + a 5.1 computer speaker system on your cab, correct?

[Fursphere]

Update.

1) I was actually able to crank things up yesterday after I got home from work - to around 50% volume.  It was pretty loud (I would say arcade on location loud), but sounded pretty damn good.  And it was *almost* giving me the physical feedback I wanted.  I think the "front" speakers are too big.   Eights are overkill when they're only about 30" from your face.     I have some 4" speakers (I think?  They're at my brothers house, i'm going to go get them tonight or tomorrow) that I want to experiment with.  I really want to idea to work, mostly because its fun messing around with it. 

2) I ordered a Sound Blaster Z (should be here today actually) so I can ditch the crappy onboard sound.  Say what you will, I want a better sound card.

3) My friend gave me his extra 5.1 Logitech system to mess around with.  So I'll be testing that this weekend too. 

4) I ordered a 50w Aura transducer (bass shaker).   The "rear" 2x 8" speakers are coming close, but just not doing it.  For $50, I figured I'd try out a transducer since I already have the amp to drive it (just bridge the two rear channels together). 

More to follow as I tinker more.   

[gbeef]

If your looking for something that thumps. I can highly Reccomend butt kicker transducers. The cheaper versions are the Aruras.

You've got this + a 5.1 computer speaker system on your cab, correct?

Yeah i have a 5.1 and a Buttkicker. the butt kicker uses the low end bass, that makes a transducer shake. Think of a how force feedback in a controller works it almost works the same. A buttkicker is not a speaker, Its a shaker. Its gives you that DAYYYYTOONNNNNAAA Feel...

Also when you play say NFS shift and you go off course and hit the side rails or side shirts you can feel the ground.

[deathrow]

Stunning work on this.
Love the base speaker positions, thats gonna rumble very nicely 

[Fursphere]

So I've been trying to come up with a theme / artwork ideas for the cabinet.  I keep coming back to the Need for Speed series, probably because I'm really enjoying NFS Hot Pursuit at the moment.

I was kind of thinking one of the exotic sports cars on one side of the cabinet, and then one of the exotic police cars on the other.

[deathrow]

So I've been trying to come up with a theme / artwork ideas for the cabinet.  I keep coming back to the Need for Speed series, probably because I'm really enjoying NFS Hot Pursuit at the moment.

I was kind of thinking one of the exotic sports cars on one side of the cabinet, and then one of the exotic police cars on the other.

Lambo police car on one side and lambo non police on other would look great

[Fursphere]

That's the idea.   When the time comes, I should just hire somebody with talent to do it.  Graphic artwork has never been one of my strong points.


On the sound front - I hooked up the Logitech x-530 speakers last night, placed them loosely in the proper place and I'll admit hands down that they sound much better than what I tried to do (Howard - for the record you were right on the speaker issues ).  Oh well, it was fun building.  So now I'm looking for a way to cleanly integrate them into the cabinet.   

I still have the Aura bass shaker on order, so next will be getting that working when it arrives - which means I'll probably end up swapping amps, as I won't need the big four channel one anymore.

[Howard_Casto]

Well I usually am, but it's far more important that YOU are satisfied with the setup then whatever I suggest. 

In regards to paint... it might look good to just do it up like a car.  Get that really high-gloss metallic look and maybe some stripes and what not.  You could certainly do what SEGA did with their initial D cabs though and put sideart in the front portion of the cab.  Just personal opinion, but I've always thought the games that try to make the cockpit look like a real car (even if they do a pitiful job of it) have been the coolest. 

Do you have a profile shot of the cab?  Maybe one of the guys can come up with something.

[Fursphere]

In the first post there is a google sketchup 3d model of the cab (zip).

And here is a (not so great) profile shot from awhile back.

[Howard_Casto]

Hmm.... it's kind of narrow isn't it?  Let me see if I can find some pics that might inspire you. 

[Howard_Casto]

Outrun is always a go-to design.  It kind of walks the line between actual sideart and car pinstriping. 

http://www.arcade-museum.com/game_detail.php?game_id=8938

Here's Outrun 2, which has a similarly sized cab as yours.  Notice that there really isn't much art to speak of due to lack of real-estate.


Here are some NFS lcd cabs.... kind of the idea I was getting at.  I particularly like these, but I'm sort of partial to anything with a dragon on it. 

http://www.bmigaming.com/needforspeed-carbon-racing-arcade-game.htm

[Fursphere]

My cabinet is (roughly) based on the Sega Classic Racing cabinet.  (and was inspired by gbeef's build)

I never noticed the dragon artwork on the NFS cabinets.  Guess I'm blind. 

[Howard_Casto]

If you look at it there's barely enough room for the "SR2" even with it angled at a 45.  You've got a little more room, but not much.  It would be tricky to do anything as complex as a lambo image unless you do it on the bottom. 

[gbeef]

I went half and half on my cabinet.... If you like the NFS i would pick a single car and roll with that.
Just remember the artwork makes the cab. I dont get why people drop 1K into a Cabinet internals and then cheap out on the the artwork. to have a living room eyesore.

Thats like building sport car and then painting the finish paint with a roller brush.

[Fursphere]

I actually rolled the paint on my MAME cabinet.      I want to sand it down and spray it though - I might when / if I rebuild it (wider for bigger monitor)

I think Howard is right (again) and just a nice smooth paint job may be the way to go.

What do you guys think about mounting the front side speakers on the outside of the cabinet?  I'd build a box to enclose them, then have it angel forward (towards the wall I guess?) so they'd sort of look like side mirrors in placement.  (and a lot of putty work to make them smooth into the side of the cabinet...  not a ghetto bolt on look)

[BadMouth]

What do you guys think about mounting the front side speakers on the outside of the cabinet?  I'd build a box to enclose them, then have it angel forward (towards the wall I guess?) so they'd sort of look like side mirrors in placement.  (and a lot of putty work to make them smooth into the side of the cabinet...  not a ghetto bolt on look)

That's what I intend to do on my next build.  Speakers just sound better at ear level and aimed at my head. 
On my current cab, they are at ear level, but inside the edges of the cab.  It would be a bit more immersive if they were on the outside.

[Howard_Casto]

I agree.  They might look nicer tucked away in the cab, but unless you've got them pointed right at you, they are going to sound terrible. 

You know You could probably get some silvered plastic film and make them actually look like rearview mirrors.  So long as you don't use something thin (think cling wrap) and not full on plexi it shouldn't effect the sound.

[Fursphere]

So this is roughly what I'm thinking...   thoughts?   (cardboard mockup ftw)

Also it might stick out a little more so I can rotate the speaker inward to face the drive seat.  I think i need like 1/2" more.

[Howard_Casto]

It's starting to look like a air duct.... I think you could use that to your advantage design-wise. 

[Brian74]

I used the stock speaker location on my cab. I removed the old speakers front and back. Replaced them and installed the center speakers in the dash with a logitech 5.1 system.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

[BadMouth]

That's about the look I wanted to go for. 
Consider an insert with black grill cloth so they don't look like computer speakers plopped in there (as they do on my cab).

Personally, I don't like the cabs that try too much to look like a car.
Looking like mirrors would be cheesy IMO.

Most of the new driving cabs have the speakers sank into rings on the sides.
Not sure if it supposed to look like drag race lights or stop lights.

[Fursphere]

I used the stock speaker location on my cab. I removed the old speakers front and back. Replaced them and installed the center speakers in the dash with a logitech 5.1 system.

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

I want to install the center channel into the dash as well, but I'm wondering if the distance between the two speakers in the dash will mess up the surround sound "positioning/" a little (or whatever you'd call it).  Its basically the difference between the center channel coming from a 3" area to a 12" area.  (i'm probably just overthinking things again)

The good news is x-530 "extra" speakers are readily available on ebay - so I can buy an extra and just hack it up for about $10.

[Howard_Casto]

Just out of curiosity have you tried the speakers in the position where you had the old ones mounted?  You might get lucky and it sound ok.  No use re-inventing the wheel afterall. 

[Fursphere]

I've been cleaning the garage all morning and I just finished removing the lower speakers and building out the base of the seat mount.  I'm going to pull the upper speakers in a few minutes (took at break to make the kids lunch), and I may try to ghetto mount them up there to see how they sound just for fun. 

[Brian74]

Im using the Logitech speakers, but I am powering them with a  Panasonic 5.1 receiver.  That way I can control the channels better. I can put more or less power to each speakers.

[Fursphere]

Im using the Logitech speakers, but I am powering them with a  Panasonic 5.1 receiver.  That way I can control the channels better. I can put more or less power to each speakers.

The Soundblaster Z sound card provides similar functionality, as well as speaker distance control for each individual speaker (I think this basically sets a delay so the sound reaches your ear at the same time from each speaker)

I just cut a new top / speaker plate.  Goodbye 8s! 

[Xiaou2]

Well, to chime in, I cant stand on-board Audio quality.

  The sound output is missing a lot of spectrum, and the spectrum thats there, is horribly uneven.
Even with the Realtek EQ software on my Laptop... I cant get it to dial in good sound.

 On my home PC, Ive got an old Soundblaster Audigy.   Kicks any onboard's sound quality to hell and back again.

 Say what you will, but even Arcade machines had some great Synth sounds.  Not just compressed Audio.
But even IF your hearing something playing compressed audio... its still going to sound that much better with
a decent sound card.

 Ive heard tiny cd radios that sounded better than the output I get out of the Onboards.

 But hey, if your hearing is Crap in certain frequency ranges, then you probably wont be able to tell the difference.

 All I know, is that a guy who claimed that his hearing was bad due to damages over the years... I gave him
a taste of my Audiophile Sennheiser HD590 headphones connected to an MP3 player with mild quality mp3s,
but pretty good sound quality hardware.   His Jaw dropped to the floor in amazement.  Couldnt believe the
level of 3d spatial effect, and crystal clear, distortion free audio.

 One thing you should note... is how important good Audio is to an Experience.  In fact, you could have a great
looking modern race game.. or movie,  but with a bad sound track... it can completely ruin the entire experience.
Likewise, you can take a primitive Black and White silent film, or video game.. put an incredible orchestral track
& sound effects to it... and it can make the person accept the primitive visuals.

 Think Star Wars, or Indiana Jones.  These sound tracks make these movies stand out.  They give emotion to the
scenes that visually are not there.  Watch them without sound... and you will immediately feel whats missing.

 My point being, that good quality Audio is pretty important, Imo.

[Warborg]

Well, to chime in, I cant stand on-board Audio quality.

  The sound output is missing a lot of spectrum, and the spectrum thats there, is horribly uneven.
Even with the Realtek EQ software on my Laptop... I cant get it to dial in good sound.

 On my home PC, Ive got an old Soundblaster Audigy.   Kicks any onboard's sound quality to hell and back again.

 Say what you will, but even Arcade machines had some great Synth sounds.  Not just compressed Audio.
But even IF your hearing something playing compressed audio... its still going to sound that much better with
a decent sound card.

 Ive heard tiny cd radios that sounded better than the output I get out of the Onboards.

 But hey, if your hearing is Crap in certain frequency ranges, then you probably wont be able to tell the difference.

 All I know, is that a guy who claimed that his hearing was bad due to damages over the years... I gave him
a taste of my Audiophile Sennheiser HD590 headphones connected to an MP3 player with mild quality mp3s,
but pretty good sound quality hardware.   His Jaw dropped to the floor in amazement.  Couldnt believe the
level of 3d spatial effect, and crystal clear, distortion free audio.

 One thing you should note... is how important good Audio is to an Experience.  In fact, you could have a great
looking modern race game.. or movie,  but with a bad sound track... it can completely ruin the entire experience.
Likewise, you can take a primitive Black and White silent film, or video game.. put an incredible orchestral track
& sound effects to it... and it can make the person accept the primitive visuals.

 Think Star Wars, or Indiana Jones.  These sound tracks make these movies stand out.  They give emotion to the
scenes that visually are not there.  Watch them without sound... and you will immediately feel whats missing.

 My point being, that good quality Audio is pretty important, Imo.

I would agree to an extent...  My GF for instance, she just doesn't seem to notice the quality difference in anything, so it doesn't seem to matter.  I can show her an old VHS recording vs. a 1080P video and the only thing she notices is the black bars at the side, otherrwise it's all the same (I don't get it either)...  There was a point where I was playing games on my PC using an X-Fi gamer and a crappy set of stereo speakers on a pretty low volume and the quality didn't matter much.  Circumstances changed to where I'm using my Sigma Tactic headphones mostly now, and I switched to a Xonar DG sound card and it certainly has made some of my games come to life, and watching HD movies is SO much nicer this way.

[Brian74]

Well, to chime in, I cant stand on-board Audio quality.

  The sound output is missing a lot of spectrum, and the spectrum thats there, is horribly uneven.
Even with the Realtek EQ software on my Laptop... I cant get it to dial in good sound.

 On my home PC, Ive got an old Soundblaster Audigy.   Kicks any onboard's sound quality to hell and back again.

 Say what you will, but even Arcade machines had some great Synth sounds.  Not just compressed Audio.
But even IF your hearing something playing compressed audio... its still going to sound that much better with
a decent sound card.

 Ive heard tiny cd radios that sounded better than the output I get out of the Onboards.

 But hey, if your hearing is Crap in certain frequency ranges, then you probably wont be able to tell the difference.

 All I know, is that a guy who claimed that his hearing was bad due to damages over the years... I gave him
a taste of my Audiophile Sennheiser HD590 headphones connected to an MP3 player with mild quality mp3s,
but pretty good sound quality hardware.   His Jaw dropped to the floor in amazement.  Couldnt believe the
level of 3d spatial effect, and crystal clear, distortion free audio.

 One thing you should note... is how important good Audio is to an Experience.  In fact, you could have a great
looking modern race game.. or movie,  but with a bad sound track... it can completely ruin the entire experience.
Likewise, you can take a primitive Black and White silent film, or video game.. put an incredible orchestral track
& sound effects to it... and it can make the person accept the primitive visuals.

 Think Star Wars, or Indiana Jones.  These sound tracks make these movies stand out.  They give emotion to the
scenes that visually are not there.  Watch them without sound... and you will immediately feel whats missing.

 My point being, that good quality Audio is pretty important, Imo.

+1

Sent from my SGH-T989 using Tapatalk 2

[Fursphere]

So I want to mount the rear speakers on the seat like this:



But the harness holes in my seat don't have a center pillar like that seat does, so I'm trying to figure out how to build a bracket that'll work with this style seat (that's almost the exact same seat I have- the backrest lever is different, that's it):



So that's what I'm tweaking on right now.  I still don't know how I'm going to mount the front speakers.  I like the simple / clean look of mounting them "inside" the cabinet above the monitor, but I honestly think they'll give a lot better left / right sound bias mounted outside the cabinet - somewhere around bottom - to middle of the screen.   So many decisions.

I did see a Z06 Corvette today while I was out - the Air Duct comment made a lot more sense after seeing it. 

[Drnick]

If you need to extend the output on the x530's (The 15 Pin connection) do not use a vga extension. You must use a 15 pin straight through. Yes a VGA extension will fix but is most likely not a straight through. Seemingly most vga extensions have a pair of pins connected together and that does not go down well with the speakers.

[Fursphere]

I thought it was a 9 pin?  Well thanks for the information anyway, good to know! 

EDIT:  I actually took that speaker apart to see what the volume control module looked like.  I could get a project box from Fry's for like $5 and re-mount the entire volume control circuit into that.  The front right speaker that the control is wired into - the speakers are just wired to that board directly.  Super easy to reconfigure. 

I honestly don't know why Logitech choose to mount the controls into that speaker in the first place.  Their newer 2.1 stuff has remote volume controls.  And my el-cheapo Creative Labs 7.1 set (that was hacked into my MAME cabinet as 2.1 audio..  hehe) has a wired remote control as well.

[Drnick]

I only found it out as I wanted my sub about 8 foot away from my speakers If you can keep the controls near the sub it won't be an issue for you. As for me I was about 2 seconds away from powering it all up with a vga extension when something in the back of my mind went "You had better check that its compatible" 

[Howard_Casto]

I honestly don't know why Logitech choose to mount the controls into that speaker in the first place.  Their newer 2.1 stuff has remote volume controls.  And my el-cheapo Creative Labs 7.1 set (that was hacked into my MAME cabinet as 2.1 audio..  hehe) has a wired remote control as well.

Well if used for their intended purpose (a desktop pc) controls mounted in the front speaker make a whole lot of sense.  Not sure which variant you are talking about though... if it's one of those where the controls are mounted in the sub, I'll agree... that's stupid. 

[Fursphere]

The volume and on/off switch is mounted in the front right speaker.   The sub control is mounted on the sub itself.    My Creative Labs system had everything mounted on a wired remote.

Its a not a big deal.

[Fursphere]

Rear speaker mount test.  The line up a little below ear level for me, but serve their intended purpose. 

1/2" EMT conduit.  My brother did the bending, as he's much better at it than I am.  They're positioned the way they are so the seat can still move forward and back freely.  I looked into mounting the poles to the seat - so they'd slide with the seat, but that seemed like a hell of a lot more work, if its even possible.  I may end up converting it to that style later, we'll see.  The pipe cost me a whole $2.

[BadMouth]

I like it.  An overlooked option is to have them mounted to the ceiling behind the cab. 

[Fursphere]

thanks!

I actually considered using longer sections of pipe, and mounting it to the top of the cabinet, and in a long arc bring them back behind the driver.  Or just building a sudo rollcage. 

I got the Aura bass shaker installed under the seat too.   Thing is pretty big.  The amp will be here Tuesday to hook that up and try it out.

[Fursphere]

So I go the new amplifier today, and spent about 20 minutes messing with it.  (all I had time for)

Initial reaction is: Cool

It doesn't "THUMP" by any means - but it provides enough vibration so you know its there.  It compliments the Logitech sub nicely - as you really can't "feel" the sub by itself.  I didn't turn the amp up very high - as I didn't want to blow up the bass shaker.  I'll have to figure out how to protect against that.  I did accidentally  turn it up for a second and its very cable of "shaking" things up quite nicely.  I may end up adding a second under the pedal area. 

There is also a side effect of my cabinet design.  The bass shaker is supposed to be silent - vibration output only.  There are two large cavities under the seat, and the 8" holes are still there from Pyle speakers I tried.  The result is the vibrations cause an acoustic effect and reproduce the sound being played with a very low bass sound.  At first I thought it was just the Logitech sub making the sound - but then I realized the speaker system was off - then I unplugged it just to be sure. 

I need more time tweaking the amp to get the desired feedback - but I'm pretty sure its here to stay. 

And a side note - Crutchfield has some awesome customer service.  They don't mess around.

[Fursphere]

So I'm not sure what changed, but the bass shaker is REALLY moving now.  So much that I re-wired it to a single channel (had it bridged before), and I still have it down pretty low. 

I'm debating on adding a second up under the pedal area. 

[ant2]

Try and isolate the movement to the chair.
I put big rubber washers inbetween the mounts from the seat to my wooden chassis.
And placed the whole racing unit on rubber stops.
This will keep the shake in the chair where you want it. And also makes sure it doesnt get wasted on the floor.

I bought two because i blew my first one And i was worried about over powering one again as its such a pain to get to. And they are cheap anyway.

Now i have one right under your backside and one where your thighs are under the seat.

[Fursphere]

So you have two under your seat?   basically inline front to back?

[ant2]

Yep.
I need to take a picture next week as ive been meaning too for a while

[gbeef]

my base has a square under the seat. I mount the bass shaker right to the seat. ZAP STRAP the transducer to the springs on the bottom of the seat and your set!

So I go the new amplifier today, and spent about 20 minutes messing with it.  (all I had time for)

Initial reaction is: Cool

It doesn't "THUMP" by any means - but it provides enough vibration so you know its there.  It compliments the Logitech sub nicely - as you really can't "feel" the sub by itself.  I didn't turn the amp up very high - as I didn't want to blow up the bass shaker.  I'll have to figure out how to protect against that.  I did accidentally  turn it up for a second and its very cable of "shaking" things up quite nicely.  I may end up adding a second under the pedal area. 

There is also a side effect of my cabinet design.  The bass shaker is supposed to be silent - vibration output only.  There are two large cavities under the seat, and the 8" holes are still there from Pyle speakers I tried.  The result is the vibrations cause an acoustic effect and reproduce the sound being played with a very low bass sound.  At first I thought it was just the Logitech sub making the sound - but then I realized the speaker system was off - then I unplugged it just to be sure. 

I need more time tweaking the amp to get the desired feedback - but I'm pretty sure its here to stay. 

And a side note - Crutchfield has some awesome customer service.  They don't mess around.

[Fursphere]

Progress has been slow lately.  Bondo - sand - bondo - sand..  lather, rinse, repeat.

That's the problem working with 2x4s and 2x6s - not exactly precision cut. 

[Fursphere]

Little paint to start the weekend...

[Howard_Casto]

That's looking good man.  I like the pac-man yellow. 

The window sweeps came in for the Camaro, so I'm working on my real car again, but I should be able to churn out my basic shell sometime this week. 

[Fursphere]

I need to do a little finish sanding, and I might spray it with a coat of varathane to give it a little shine, but overall I'm happy with it. 

I wanted to go a lot more pre-sanding work, but I realized that I just don't have the time.   I'd rather get it back together and actually play games then keep ignoring it because I don't to work on it. 

The whole passion vs. bandwidth thing. 

[Fursphere]

My original plan was to paint it up like a police car and put a working lightbar on it, in the spirit of Need For Speed: Hot Pursuit

After chasing down light bars for about two months, I found that they are outrageously expensive.  ($800+).  Way too much for a cosmetic feature, no matter how cool it would have been. 

[Howard_Casto]

Well as long as you don't want a real police light bar dx.com sells a bunch of "police style" kits.  It's China so it isn't illegal for them to sell red/blue lights for cars. 

Here's the first one that popped up... they have more:

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-12v-12-led-red-blue-stroboscopic-light-with-3-mode-controller-15729

[Fursphere]

Never seen that site.  Interesting.

I was looking for a more traditional "police" style bar.  Not sure how I would incorporate those into the cabinet to make it "feel" right.

[Howard_Casto]

It's a great site, they carry everything, even arcade parts. 

What that kit contains are the mini light arrays that make up the light bar.  You'd have to find/build an aluminum bar to put them in.  They are about 3/4 sized I think, but that might actually be a good thing for your purposes. 

[Howard_Casto]

They have a variety  on there... for the budget conscience get a couple of these.

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-dc-12v-12-led-red-blue-white-waterproof-stroboscopic-light-pair-25921

here's a middle of the road

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-dc-12v-36-led-red-blue-stroboscopic-light-with-3-mode-controller-15751

and if you are willing to pay for it, these are official strobes for audi police cars

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-dc-12v-16-led-red-blue-stroboscopic-light-with-controller-for-audi-a6l-15983

here's another budget model with a bit more of an enclosure. 

http://dx.com/p/1w-multi-purpose-vehicle-decoration-lights-2-lights-5992

Here is what modern, American plice cars use to build their light bars

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-dc-12v-96-led-red-blue-stroboscopic-light-with-3-mode-controller-15985

And if you like the old fashioned, 80's style ones, you can pick up a couple of these

http://dx.com/p/police-style-car-dc-12v-red-blue-high-intensity-stroboscopic-light-with-speed-controller-15984

They also have the removable dome lights that you'd see on Starsky and Hutch. 

[Fursphere]

too.many.options

head.exploded

[Howard_Casto]

Heh... I was just letting you know, while you can't find a ready-made light bar for a reasonable price, you can make one (one of the modern ones anyway) for well under 100 bucks. 

[Minwah]

What about the 'retro' beacon style light? Like the magnetic ones used by cops who drive their own car? You could get or make one of those pretty cheap...and the car wouldn't necessarily need to be painted like a cop car.

[BadMouth]

What about the 'retro' beacon style light? Like the magnetic ones used by cops who drive their own car? You could get or make one of those pretty cheap...and the car wouldn't necessarily need to be painted like a cop car.

They make small versions of those that are USB powered.  I bought a pair for my driving cab with the intention of using MAMEhooker to interface them, but then I dropped and broke one.     Wasn't sure how the flashing would translate to the rotating reflector of them anyway.

[Howard_Casto]

They've got some of those on the site as well, I just got sick of linking everything. 

You know, in the 70's city cop cars uses the beacons to make their bars.  They just had a simple steel frame in the shape of a V with 4 blue on one side and 4 red on another. 

[Fursphere]

Was able to get get back to this thing last weekend.  Between work, wife, and kids - I've had zero time to even look at the cabinet lately.    But as of last night its actually operational again.  Played Outrun 2006 for about an hour with my 3 year old son - I think he thinks the point of the game is bumper cars.  hehe

So I think I mentioned it before - but I was given a set of Logitech x530 speakers and told to do whatever I want with them - so I did. 

I gutted the front and center speakers, then grafted them into the plate above the monitor.  Then took what was left of the front right speaker "control" area and made and under-dash volume control out of it, as well as re-wiring the front right speaker output. 

I'm still working on the rear speakers, but I think I came up with a plan last night that you can see in the pictures - just need to finish it.

And lastly - I debated a long time about mounting things to the rear of the cabinet - specifically the power supply and amplifier for the bass shaker under the seat.  After exploring many "inside" mounting options, I hated them all because I couldn't tweak the settings on the amp.  (I still think I need to turn it up a little more)

Logitech needs to get kicked in the head for making all the G27 connections underneath the steering wheel - so you have to unclamp (unbolt!) it to unplug it.  Stupid!  I did get the pedals bolted down as well - so they're nice and secure now.

The dash still needs to be finished, and t-molding needs to be installed - and lots of other little things. 

[BadMouth]

What are your impressions of that seat?

I need to order a pair of seats soon and the price on those is attractive, but I was a bit disappointed in the last cheap seat I bought.
(I won't get the exact same one)

[Fursphere]

Mixed.  The seat is comfortable and adjustable.  So far it's holding up just fine.  I can sit in it for at least an hour of two without wanting to get out because its bothering me.

The material though. Felt.  Never ever get felt.  EVERYTHING sticks to it.  My son dumped saw dust on it and I'm sure I'll never get it all out.  The Velcro on my shorts rear pocket sticks to it too.  Very annoying. 

Leather.  Pleather.  Vinyl.   Anything but felt. 

[BadMouth]

Mixed.  The seat is comfortable and adjustable.  So far it's holding up just fine.  I can sit in it for at least an hour of two without wanting to get out because its bothering me.

The material though. Felt.  Never ever get felt.  EVERYTHING sticks to it.  My son dumped saw dust on it and I'm sure I'll never get it all out.  The Velcro on my shorts rear pocket sticks to it too.  Very annoying. 

Leather.  Pleather.  Vinyl.   Anything but felt.

Yeah, that's how the one I have is and I was a little disappointed when I received it. 
I was expecting something like the automotive upholstery that I'm accustomed to.
I'd never go for pleather though! 

I'd still use the one I have if I could find a matching one, but it's been discontinued.
I have a red one and can only find the same model in blue.  I really don't want a red vs blue driving setup.

[gpasko]

Was able to get get back to this thing last weekend.  Between work, wife, and kids - I've had zero time to even look at the cabinet lately.    But as of last night its actually operational again.  Played Outrun 2006 for about an hour with my 3 year old son - I think he thinks the point of the game is bumper cars.  hehe

So I think I mentioned it before - but I was given a set of Logitech x530 speakers and told to do whatever I want with them - so I did. 

I gutted the front and center speakers, then grafted them into the plate above the monitor.  Then took what was left of the front right speaker "control" area and made and under-dash volume control out of it, as well as re-wiring the front right speaker output. 

I'm still working on the rear speakers, but I think I came up with a plan last night that you can see in the pictures - just need to finish it.

And lastly - I debated a long time about mounting things to the rear of the cabinet - specifically the power supply and amplifier for the bass shaker under the seat.  After exploring many "inside" mounting options, I hated them all because I couldn't tweak the settings on the amp.  (I still think I need to turn it up a little more)

Logitech needs to get kicked in the head for making all the G27 connections underneath the steering wheel - so you have to unclamp (unbolt!) it to unplug it.  Stupid!  I did get the pedals bolted down as well - so they're nice and secure now.

The dash still needs to be finished, and t-molding needs to be installed - and lots of other little things. 

The front speakers look awesome.  I bet it sounds great too!  I'm new here and I have started to build a replica Sega "Grid" or "Classic" cabinet too.  It's nice to know others are struggling to find time between work and family life too.  I'm watching with great enthusiasm!  I'm especially watching to see how the dashboard works out w/ the G27 and Sega's dash as I'm getting close to the point of where I'd have to figure that out too.  I'm hoping I can have an extended shaft made to go through the dashboard and hide the Logitech shell.

Great job!

[Fursphere]

Mixed.  The seat is comfortable and adjustable.  So far it's holding up just fine.  I can sit in it for at least an hour of two without wanting to get out because its bothering me.

The material though. Felt.  Never ever get felt.  EVERYTHING sticks to it.  My son dumped saw dust on it and I'm sure I'll never get it all out.  The Velcro on my shorts rear pocket sticks to it too.  Very annoying. 

Leather.  Pleather.  Vinyl.   Anything but felt.

Yeah, that's how the one I have is and I was a little disappointed when I received it. 
I was expecting something like the automotive upholstery that I'm accustomed to.
I'd never go for pleather though! 

I'd still use the one I have if I could find a matching one, but it's been discontinued.
I have a red one and can only find the same model in blue.  I really don't want a red vs blue driving setup.

Bummer. 

The way I see it - at $125 its really not the end of the world if I end up not using it / junking it for something else in the future. 

I mean - I don't like the idea of buying ANOTHER seat, but its not such a huge expensive that it would break me.

[Fursphere]

Was able to get get back to this thing last weekend.  Between work, wife, and kids - I've had zero time to even look at the cabinet lately.    But as of last night its actually operational again.  Played Outrun 2006 for about an hour with my 3 year old son - I think he thinks the point of the game is bumper cars.  hehe

So I think I mentioned it before - but I was given a set of Logitech x530 speakers and told to do whatever I want with them - so I did. 

I gutted the front and center speakers, then grafted them into the plate above the monitor.  Then took what was left of the front right speaker "control" area and made and under-dash volume control out of it, as well as re-wiring the front right speaker output. 

I'm still working on the rear speakers, but I think I came up with a plan last night that you can see in the pictures - just need to finish it.

And lastly - I debated a long time about mounting things to the rear of the cabinet - specifically the power supply and amplifier for the bass shaker under the seat.  After exploring many "inside" mounting options, I hated them all because I couldn't tweak the settings on the amp.  (I still think I need to turn it up a little more)

Logitech needs to get kicked in the head for making all the G27 connections underneath the steering wheel - so you have to unclamp (unbolt!) it to unplug it.  Stupid!  I did get the pedals bolted down as well - so they're nice and secure now.

The dash still needs to be finished, and t-molding needs to be installed - and lots of other little things. 

The front speakers look awesome.  I bet it sounds great too!  I'm new here and I have started to build a replica Sega "Grid" or "Classic" cabinet too.  It's nice to know others are struggling to find time between work and family life too.  I'm watching with great enthusiasm!  I'm especially watching to see how the dashboard works out w/ the G27 and Sega's dash as I'm getting close to the point of where I'd have to figure that out too.  I'm hoping I can have an extended shaft made to go through the dashboard and hide the Logitech shell.

Great job!

thanks.

There is a another member here that did the steering shaft extension on a G25 I think.  Worked out pretty well.   I may go down that route in the future - I dunno. 

Speakers sounds good, even with only the fronts hooked up right now.  Having the bass speaker under the dash..  in the pedal "cavity" makes it resoate really well through the entire cabinet.  Sounds great.   And the bass shaker under the seat adds the physical feedback that the bass speaker sounds like it *should* be providing. 

[Fursphere]

Got the rear speakers hooked up today and was promptly underwhelmed with the results. 

I've been using my Core2Duo machine with onboard audio, and while it sounded "good" it didn't have the "power" or "presence" that I was looking for.  So I went and stole the Sound Blaster Z out of my i5 (which has recently become the "office" computer...) and swapped it into the Core2Duo.

Much better!   At half volume (sound card volume) it's putting out more power than the onboard ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- at full power. And the bass shaker is rumbling again. 

I know a lot of folks in this threat earlier said that aftermarket sound cards were a waste of money and to not bother with them.  Well, I dare you to try one.  The results are not short of amazing in comparison to the onboard Audio on both my systems.   

[Brian74]

Was able to get get back to this thing last weekend.  Between work, wife, and kids - I've had zero time to even look at the cabinet lately.    But as of last night its actually operational again.  Played Outrun 2006 for about an hour with my 3 year old son - I think he thinks the point of the game is bumper cars.  hehe

So I think I mentioned it before - but I was given a set of Logitech x530 speakers and told to do whatever I want with them - so I did. 

I gutted the front and center speakers, then grafted them into the plate above the monitor.  Then took what was left of the front right speaker "control" area and made and under-dash volume control out of it, as well as re-wiring the front right speaker output. 

I'm still working on the rear speakers, but I think I came up with a plan last night that you can see in the pictures - just need to finish it.

And lastly - I debated a long time about mounting things to the rear of the cabinet - specifically the power supply and amplifier for the bass shaker under the seat.  After exploring many "inside" mounting options, I hated them all because I couldn't tweak the settings on the amp.  (I still think I need to turn it up a little more)

Logitech needs to get kicked in the head for making all the G27 connections underneath the steering wheel - so you have to unclamp (unbolt!) it to unplug it.  Stupid!  I did get the pedals bolted down as well - so they're nice and secure now.

The dash still needs to be finished, and t-molding needs to be installed - and lots of other little things. 

The front speakers look awesome.  I bet it sounds great too!  I'm new here and I have started to build a replica Sega "Grid" or "Classic" cabinet too.  It's nice to know others are struggling to find time between work and family life too.  I'm watching with great enthusiasm!  I'm especially watching to see how the dashboard works out w/ the G27 and Sega's dash as I'm getting close to the point of where I'd have to figure that out too.  I'm hoping I can have an extended shaft made to go through the dashboard and hide the Logitech shell.

Great job!

thanks.

There is a another member here that did the steering shaft extension on a G25 I think.  Worked out pretty well.   I may go down that route in the future - I dunno. 

Speakers sounds good, even with only the fronts hooked up right now.  Having the bass speaker under the dash..  in the pedal "cavity" makes it resoate really well through the entire cabinet.  Sounds great.   And the bass shaker under the seat adds the physical feedback that the bass speaker sounds like it *should* be providing. 

Im the guy that extended the shaft on my g25.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 2

[gpasko]

Im the guy that extended the shaft on my g25.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 2

Do you have a link to your build?  Has anyone successfully extended the shaft on a G27?  I'm guessing it has more problems w/ the added wires or is it basically the same?  I have yet to take my wheel apart.  Do you have to do anything for the wire rotation & wire breakage or is that not a concern?

Thanks!

[Brian74]

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,130821.msg1344963.html#msg1344963

Im the guy that extended the shaft on my g25.

Sent from my SGH-M919 using Tapatalk 2

Do you have a link to your build?  Has anyone successfully extended the shaft on a G27?  I'm guessing it has more problems w/ the added wires or is it basically the same?  I have yet to take my wheel apart.  Do you have to do anything for the wire rotation & wire breakage or is that not a concern?

Thanks!

[Xiaou2]

I know a lot of folks in this threat earlier said that aftermarket sound cards were a waste of money and to not bother with them.  Well, I dare you to try one.  The results are not short of amazing in comparison to the onboard Audio on both my systems.   

 I Agree.

  I believe the problem is that a lot of peoples ears are not very sensitive.. and so what sounds great to them... is a disaster to the rest.

 Similar to how many people here, whom took a color match test, came back with a score of like 15 to 40%    They are not color blind.. but, their eyes were unable to make out the variances in subtle shades.

 Still, Ive had others whom thought their hearing was bad... and I had them try my Sennheiser HD500 headphones... and they were blown away by how much better they sounded compared to anything they had heard before.   These were the bottom of their Audiophile headphone lineup, probably 13+ yrs ago.  Still sound fantastic to this day.  So good in fact, and so comfortable, that I rarely use my house speakers anymore.  (My first experience with them via a DVD, and they fooled me to think that I accidentally left my entire surround sound system on!  Incredible)

 As for external speakers... Ive started getting into vintage speakers.  EPI speakers have a unique tweeter, thats inverted. (cone rather than dome)  The 3d sound stage is insane.  As is the clarity and accuracy of the woofer.  The tweeters also have a high frequency range, and play the midranges, with that clarity and precision.  Ive never heard anything like it, especially for the low price I paid for them.  Definitely beats the hell out of overpriced PC audio speakers.

 
 One think to note... is that the car based  Aura Bass shakers..  I believe they are 4ohm.  If you run them with an 8ohm amp.. it can eventually kill the amp.   To run them with 8ohms... run two of them, and wire them appropriately.   I cant recall off the top of my head, whether its parallel of series, to create 8ohm.  If you get it wrong, it will drop it to 2ohm.. making it even worse for the amp.

[BadMouth]

I added a $30 Xonar card to my upright cab and can hear the difference. 
It's even running at a lower sample rate than I was running the onboard sound.
The music is just more detailed and the high end sounds spacious instead of capped.

I knew how I wanted the cab to sound and just couldn't get it there with the onboard audio no matter what adjustments I made outside the PC.
It's pretty close now, but the cheap mylar tweeters in it are too directional and could be slightly smoother. 
(the highs are brighter when seated on a stool vs standing)
I might replace them with silk domes if some that will fit turn up cheap on parts express.

Oddly enough, I'm not as picky with the driving cabs since they don't have as many orchestrated soundtracks as newer shmups. (Outrun 2006, but that's about it)
I do still like my speakers at ear level, but not sure I can make that happen with the design I'm heading towards.

One think to note... is that the car based  Aura Bass shakers..  I believe they are 4ohm.  If you run them with an 8ohm amp.. it can eventually kill the amp.   To run them with 8ohms... run two of them, and wire them appropriately.   I cant recall off the top of my head, whether its parallel of series, to create 8ohm.  If you get it wrong, it will drop it to 2ohm.. making it even worse for the amp.

Running them in series (+ from amp to + of first speaker, then - of that speaker to the + of the next speaker, then - of that terminal back to the - on the amp) will result in an 8 ohm load, at least with two 4 ohm speakers.

Running them in parallel, from + of amp to + of both speakers and from - of amp to - of both speakers will drop it to two ohm.

Basically, the amp can only handle so much current coming back into it.
If you give it two channels to flow through instead of one, a lot more is flowing back in.

The lower the resistance, the closer to a dead short (0 ohm) you are getting.

[Fursphere]

I've found that I need to install some plexi or glass in front of the monitor.  My kids just won't stop trying to touch the screen (especially my 1 year old - its amazing how fast he climbs into the seat and grabs the wheel).

Any recommendations for glass mounting on a monitor with a negative pitch to it?

[BadMouth]

I've found that I need to install some plexi or glass in front of the monitor.  My kids just won't stop trying to touch the screen (especially my 1 year old - its amazing how fast he climbs into the seat and grabs the wheel).

Any recommendations for glass mounting on a monitor with a negative pitch to it?

I still have the framework that held the glass in the Initial D cab that I disassembled.  I can take a look at how it worked.
Pretty sure it was just four pieces of channel.  You might be able to do something with J-channel used to hang mirrors that will result in no bolts showing from the front.

[gpasko]

I've found that I need to install some plexi or glass in front of the monitor.  My kids just won't stop trying to touch the screen (especially my 1 year old - its amazing how fast he climbs into the seat and grabs the wheel).

Any recommendations for glass mounting on a monitor with a negative pitch to it?

My two children think everything is touch screen (1yr & 4yr old).   Lucky for them that they've experienced joysticks, buttons, and trackballs.  It seams everything is going touch screen, for no good reason.  The other weekend we shopped at  JCPenny's and they remodeled the store.  We were in the furnishing area and they had a touch screen grafted into the holding table instead of a cash register.  It took so d#$@ long it was comical!  I understand learning a new system, no problem, but under the table was a cash register drawer and a regular keyboard.  Hmmm!  Not everything works better as a touch screen.   

[Fursphere]

I've found that I need to install some plexi or glass in front of the monitor.  My kids just won't stop trying to touch the screen (especially my 1 year old - its amazing how fast he climbs into the seat and grabs the wheel).

Any recommendations for glass mounting on a monitor with a negative pitch to it?

I still have the framework that held the glass in the Initial D cab that I disassembled.  I can take a look at how it worked.
Pretty sure it was just four pieces of channel.  You might be able to do something with J-channel used to hang mirrors that will result in no bolts showing from the front.

That would probably be best - although I have to think about how to remove the glass/plexi too.  Which might be a challenge with the way I built the cabinet.   

[Xiaou2]

Most arcade machines use a very simple system for front glass / plexi.

 A few blocks of wood, or, in some cases, a few metal strips.   

 1) Just grab a few aluminum metal L-strips. 
 2) Cut strips for top and bottom, then drill holes for mounting.  Countersink them if you want to get fancy, and they are thick enough for it.

*The most important part, is the length needed for the screw holes... so, if one side is too high and impacts monitor visibility too much, then simply cut it down a bit.


 3) Paint them a few coats of flat black spray paint, then let them dry and cure for a few days.

 4) Glue a few internal wood strips internal glass back-stops.

 4a) Optionally, you can also route a groove into the wood where the glass will rest.  Make sure to also route a grove up top, so that you can still lift and pull the glass out, if you choose this method.  You will still need the side strips.

 5) Place the well cleaned glass into place, then simply screw the top and bottom L-strips in place.

 Make sure that you do NOT use plate glass.  If plate glass gets broken, it will shatter into razor sharp shards, and could slice someone seriously bad.. possibly even causing a fatal injury.    Tempered glass is very hard to break.. and even if it does break.. it does so into fairly dull squarish shaped pieces.  Usually it only breaks if someone nicks a corner or edge.  People have been known to try to break it head on in the center.. with a sledgehammer... and were unsuccessful.

 If you cant get tempered glass... use Plexiglass.   Not lexan.   Lexan can flex more... but its softer, and will scratch much easier than plexi.

[BadMouth]

Hinged J-channel on the bottom that tilts out and J-channel on the top with a strip of magnets or Velcro on the back?
...or even lightweight plexi with magnets glued to the corners?
Use suction cups to remove. 

[Fursphere]

Hinged J-channel on the bottom that tilts out and J-channel on the top with a strip of magnets or Velcro on the back?
...or even lightweight plexi with magnets glued to the corners?
Use suction cups to remove. 

Ya....  its going to be a challenge all right.     Since there is a gap between the monitor and the dashboard, I might be able to drop in "down" in there (into a channel), then lean it forward into something that secures it up top near the speakers.   I could tweak the entire dash / wheel mount to make it come out faily easy too, but its a lot of work. 

[Fursphere]

Has it been a year already? 

I'm still (xtrememly slowly) working on the cab.  Since I got it working, the kids don't let me actually work on it much - just play.   

Has anyone added a joystick / throttle (HOTAS) setup to their driving rigs?   I bought a Saitek x55 to get back into flying sims, and I'm playing with mounting the setup to the driving cabinet somehow.  Here is a quick snap of playing with the layout yesterday.  Only problem is getting in and out of the thing with the throttle hard mounted.   It would be right in the way...

Any ideas?

SpaceHedgehog's shift pod system might be the answer?   http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,138146.0.html   

[SegaOutrun]

nice addition. How are the towers for the flight stick attached to the base? I would think putting the throttle tower on a rail to slide it back to get in and out.

btw i had been meaning to buy a flight stick. i just ordered on amazon after seeing your post. The star wars trilogy is not as fun using my gun as a joystick. Also Naomi (Demul) has a fun but simple flight simulator called airline pilots if you dont have in your cab.

[Fursphere]

Those two "stands" you see in the picture are actually old generic ATX rack mount computer cases.   I was just using them to get a feel for the whole thing.

I really wanted to buy the Thrustmaster HOTAS Warthog setup, but at $250 - $300 US MORE than the Saitek x55, I just couldn't do it.  It feels like its going to be a really good stick so far.  I compared it to a Saitek x52 in the store, and the x52 felt too "toyish" for me.  I borrowed an older x45 from a friend, and the x45 is a lot better feeling than the x52 was.  Anyway...  lol

I was thinking of using either a threaded rod that goes all the way through the base at the rear, then each "pod" could rotate up and back to make room to get in the cabinet.  But I have concerns about strength around the pivot point. 

Also I'd like to move the gearshit off the dash board and onto the pod so its more natural - but I'd have to make it coexist with the joystick. 

And lastly, I'd like to be able to move the joystick / gearshift and throttle out of the way to put down a Logitech G13 gamepad and a mouse on the other side if I wanted to use them.  But that just might be too complicated. 

[Fursphere]

One think to note... is that the car based  Aura Bass shakers..  I believe they are 4ohm.  If you run them with an 8ohm amp.. it can eventually kill the amp.   To run them with 8ohms... run two of them, and wire them appropriately.   I cant recall off the top of my head, whether its parallel of series, to create 8ohm.  If you get it wrong, it will drop it to 2ohm.. making it even worse for the amp.

I missed this first time around.

I'm actually running a car audio based amp, with a 12v 50amp PSU for source power.   The amp is the Crutchfield house brand. 

When I mounted the bass shaker, I mounted it under the wooden platform that the seat rails bolt too.  It worked, but I think the wood absorbed a lot and basically lessened the effect.  I'm in the process of redoing all of that, and I'm going to try and put a metal plate on top of the seat rails and mount the shaker to that.  Get it as close to the driver as possible.    Which requires some re-engineering of things...       (which I had to do anyway to get the joystick and throttle mounted)

Pics later today.

[Fursphere]

So here's what I've been working on lately.  I built two "pods" to mount the joystick and throttle on.  The actual mounting points will flip 180 degrees to hide the joystick and throttle setup when I'm not using it.  I'm playing with the idea of mounting a Logitech M570 trackball and G13 gaming keyboard on the flip side of those mounting surfaces - so when not in flight sim mode the mouse and keypad will be accessible. 

I had to remove the chair and chair mounting platform to mount the rails for the "pods", so that's why its just a mess right now.     Each pod will have flip up hatches to fill in the space behind the sticks when I'm not rotating things.  The random color wood panels are because I was recycling left over panels from rebuilding my MAME cabinet.   

The real challenge I have right now is getting in and out of the thing.  Adding the pods - where they need to be (they're not bolted down yet) makes is to you basically have to climb over the left side one to get in and out (easy to get in, hard to get out).  I tried mounting it on a big hinge (gate hinge) but there was still too much flex in the hinge for that to work.  I'll figure something out.

[Fursphere]

Quick follow up from the last post...

Here are pics of the G13 and M570 in place.  These would be on the "other side" of the rotating joystick platforms (probably adhesive velcro).  They're a little low, so I'm not sure if I'll be doing this or not.   

The second pic shows one option for getting in and out of the cab.  I should be able to make the "pod" slide back and forth (I'll have to re-engineer the rear speaker mounts though), giving enough room to step in and out of the cab.  Its a bit awkward, but it should work.  Might have to add some grab bars or something to assist.

[Fursphere]

Quick update on the cabinet. 

I wanted to remount the bass transducer closer to the actual seat, so that required me to rebuild the seat mounts.  And I picked up a second transducer for fun. 

The having two transducers on the seat is much better.  I can run the amp (gain) lower and the feedback is great.  But I had this problem with fine tuning the amp while sitting in the seat.  So I remounted the amp and power supply (and everything else) inside the cabinet.  Much cleaner.  Now I have an access port to the amp adjustments behind the daytona dash's button panel.

Someday I'll actually finish the cosmetics of the cabinet...  someday.... :p  Here are some pics of what I did...

[Fursphere]

Some updates:

1) FlightSim stuff (Saitek x55) didn't work out at all.  Just too clunky.  I removed all of it.

2) I added SimVibe to my rig with one bass shaker under the seat, and one under the pedals.  Running in "Extensions" mode.  Really awesome stuff for the games that support it.  $90 for the software is a bit pricey, but in the end it was worth it.  I'd recommend it if you play games that support it.

3) I start playing Dirt Rally and Project CARS a lot.  These games are awesome.  I can't stress that enough. 

4) And just recently (last weekend) I upgraded to a Thrustmaster T300 RS wheel, T3PA-Pro pedals, and TH8A shifter.  I purchased the T300 RS (not cheap) to see what all the belt drive force feedback fuss was all about.  It came with a 30 day return policy, so if it didn't thrill me, I'd return it. 

Well, I'm keeping it.  Its just better it almost every way than the G27.  Hard to describe, but I'm not looking back.  Unfortunately the pedals it comes with are GARBAGE.  They're really a joke.  So I bought the T3PA Pro pedals.  And it didn't have a shifter (I play Dirt Rally with an H pattern shifter - really fun), so I just picked up the TH8A shifter.  Which is also amazing. 

The only thing the G27 has going for it is the price.  Its crazy cheap compared to everything else.  (the G29 didn't improve things, and increased the price.....  so no thanks)

If you don't mind the price tag (its steep - I debated for weeks), the Thrustmaster line is very nice.

The downside is I had to tear my entire dashboard area apart to fit the new wheel base - its a lot bigger than the G27.   And it doesn't work at all with the Daytona plastic dash.  (anybody need a Daytona dash?)

[Brian74]

I need a dash!!

[Fursphere]

I can get some pics up later when I get home.

[Howard_Casto]

I would be interested to know why the flight sim stuff failed and ect....

[Fursphere]

I would be interested to know why the flight sim stuff failed and ect....

Climbing over / around the 'pods' to get in and out of the thing was just not pleasant.  My young boys climbing all over them didn't help either. 

I'm planning on building a simple Ricomotech style cabinet for my G27 and PS3.  Kids can have at it then.    (ref: http://www.ricmotech.com/category_s/1630.htm)

[Howard_Casto]

Yeah I looked at those when I was designing mine.  I really think they are efficient, but I dunno, I just didn't like the look of them.  I probably would be racing now if I had just went with something like that though. 

I can't really say anything either because in it's current state at least, mine is pretty rough aesthetically. 

I'm going to make my wheel detach from the base and I'm going to add a star wars yoke and a flight stick.  I was thinking of having the flight stick latch onto the underside of the control panel.  I don't know how sturdy it'll be, but then again I don't have kids to worry about, so it should be fine. 

[Fursphere]

Added a smartphone to the 'dash' of my cabinet.  I've been slowly framing up a new dash since the T300 RS made me remove the Daytona plastic dash.  I have a nice sheet of aluminum to cover the whole dash once I finally figure out what I'm doing with it. 

I've been debating on adding a button box from Derek Speare Designs, but not sure if I really need one or not.

Link to button boxes... http://www.derekspearedesigns.com/p1p2.html

The HTC One smartphone is running DashMeterPro ( http://www.sensadigit.com/ ) - and if nothing else makes a great shift light.  But the data is semi-useful.  The phone cost me nothing, since it was bound for the recycle bin.  You can see in the photo the charge cable comes out the side of the phone, so I drilled a hole at an angel to run the charge cable out, so its also powered. 

And lastly, I've been working on a hydraulic hand brake.  I bought the assembly off eBay (see pic), and i'm slowly building it into basically what Derek Spears came up with (for a much lower price). 

http://www.derekspearedesigns.com/handbrake.html

[Howard_Casto]

I looked on the site but I couldn't really find an answer.  Is there a dll or api or some sort of interface to DashMeterPro?  I just figured I would go ahead and add it to mamehooker. 

How much did the handbrake set you back?

[Fursphere]

I looked on the site but I couldn't really find an answer.  Is there a dll or api or some sort of interface to DashMeterPro?  I just figured I would go ahead and add it to mamehooker. 

When configured to, the the sim games put out telemetry data (local host, UDP) about what the game is going.   There is a small application you download and run on the PC side that listens for this data, then forwards it to the IP of the phone. 

For Dirt Rally - this is buried in the config files, you have to enable it.  All CodeMasters games are similar in this config.

<udp enabled="true" extradata="3" ip="127.0.0.1" port="20777" />

In my specific setup, I changed the port to 30500 (I think?) which is the port that Sim Commander listens on (SimVibe), and then SimVibe forwards the data back to 20777 (I think?) which is what the DashMeterPro program is listening on.  I had to update the config of the DashMeterPro to the IP of the phone I'm using.  It looks like it supports up to three IP addresses, so it could do three devices at once?

Project Cars does something similar, but I think its on a different port.

How much did the handbrake set you back?

I think it was about $60 US.   $40 for the hand brake, and $20 for the fluid tank.    There are still a lot of pieces I need to buy to make it functional - I picked up this part first to see if I could even mount it on my cabinet.  So far I haven't figured out anything I've been happy with. 

[Howard_Casto]

Hmmmm.... UDP isn't terribly hard to implement, but I probably need some sort of documentation. 

The handbrake thing is tricky.  In real sports cars it is typically mounted beside the shifter but something with that much pressure would have to be mounted pretty securely. 

[Fursphere]

Time for an update (with pics!).  This seems to be the build that never ends, mostly due to my limited time to actually work on it.   

Last weekend I was able to get the Saitek X55 joystick / throttle mounted in a way that didn't make me crazy, and can easily be removed and stored in the back of the cabinet (I don't have picks of the storage system, as its not done yet..  hopefully later today).  The mounts are rough and unfinished, but the basic concept is there.  You can see the black hand knob / screws that clamp it together. 

The audio amplifier that runs the transducers was also getting really hot during extended gameplay, so I built a active cool box for the amp and power supply.  I went a little crazy...  lol   The handbrake is also mounted now, and almost complete.  I just need to order the pressure sensor and some fittings / hoses.  And you can see the TH8A shifter mount too - its 1.5" steel tubing mounted to the side of the base.  Very sturdy. 

Around the T300RS wheel you can see the frame of a dashboard.  I keep thinking I want some sort of button box / switches mounted there (the controller I bought for the handbrake supports 32 buttons in a matrix), so that's why its still just an open frame.  And down below the T3PA pedals can be seen.  They BARELY fit.  In all honesty, the Logitech G27 pedals are on par with the Thurstmaster T3PAs.  I could have bought a $25 adapter and used them with the T300RS wheel - but I have other plans for the G27 setup...     

For those who don't know - The T3PA pedals plug into the T300RS wheel base, but the TH8A shifter does not.  It is a separate USB device.  So the game has to support multiple USB devices (not a problem with almost all newer games), but has made me put Spintires back in automatic tranny mode (the DEV says he's working on fix this soon).    Just something to consider.   You can plug the shifter into the wheel, but it only works in sequential mode - not the H pattern.

Anyway, on with the pics....   (sorry about the rotations - I blame Apple and Microsoft for not figuring this crap out.  They're right on the phone and right on my desktop, but when I upload them they rotate.  )