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Author Topic: Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table  (Read 44757 times)

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griffindodd

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Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table
« on: February 26, 2013, 11:27:53 pm »
Alchemy: Video Pinball Shmup Table

Build Plan
A Wide body VPin cabinet and vertical MAME monster with video projection side art, full color DMD, Marquees and App Based 'Smart' Backglass >:D

Concept Art


Different Game Looks


Walk Through of 4-Screen Setup



Specs

- Custom base and backbox
- Original Space Invaders Wide Body hardware, legs, coin doors, rails etc.
- 51" 1080p 600mhz Plasma Sunken Play Field for pinball and ridonkulous Mame Vertical Screen
- 32" LED Smart Backglass & Streaming Video Screen
- 29" Ultrawide 2.85:1 LCD for Color DMD & Mame Marquees
- Internal playfield RGB LED Light Strip with Strobe blocks
- External Backbox RGB LED Light Strip
- Illuminated topper with strobes
- Projected video side art
- Pinball Knocker
- 8 contactors for flipper, bumper and toy force feedback
- Shaker Vibration
- Gear motor
- Bob & mercury tilt switching
- 2.1 Sound
- Built-in 4/8 top switchable MagStik Plus
- RGB Player buttons
- Other stuff from uncontrollable feature creep

Here we go again folks :)




More to come as we go.

Parts List

Cabinet
Junkyard 1980 Wide Body Space Invaders base with legs, coin door and rails.
Custom built backboard
Rear projection screen sides with first surface mirrors for projection
Rigid force feedback platform for contactors, kickers, shakers & gear drive
Tinted tempered glass for play field and backbox
2x 200mm Red Cooler Master MegaFlow 200 Case fans
1x 120mm Custom Messaging Fan
1x 120mm Blue LED Fan

Screens.
1x Samsung 51'' 1080p 600Hz Slim Plasma HDTV
1x Vizio Web Enabled 60hz 32" LED TV @ 1280x720
1x LG Ultrawide 29" 2.85:1 LCD Commercial Display @ 1366x480
2x Epson 2000 Lumen W410 LCD Projectors @ 1280x800

Computer
Intel Pentium G2020 Ivy Bridge 2.9GHz 55W Dual-Core
ASRock B75M-DGS LGA1155/ Intel B75 DDR3 SATA3 & USB3.0 PCI-E
G.SKILL Sniper Series 8GB (2 x 4GB) DDR3 1866
CORSAIR Builder Series CX430 430W ATX12V v2.3 PSU
Nvidia GTX 650 OC Kepler based Video Card
Iomega USB to VGA Display Adapter

VPin Lights & Mechanical.
Zebulon's flasher board  including resistors (16 output)
Zebulon's button/motor/contactor control board (16 output)
Zebulon's speed control board
Zebulon's laser cut acrylic mounting plate & assembly hardware and cables to connect an Ledwiz
Zebulon's Shaker & Gear motor board assembly
4x White 22 LED Emergency Strobe Panels
10x 3W RGB LEDs with aluminum heat sinks and prism lenses
Pinball knocker assembly
430W ATX power supply
8x 24V 12 ft/lb contactors
LEDWiz

Sound
Eagle Arion 2.1 Soundstage Speakers with Dual Subwoofers

Buttons & Sticks
4x Flipper leaf buttons
Magstik Plus Top Switchable 4/8 way stick
3x Ultimarc RGB Buttons for Shmups
ZD USB encoder
White Illuminated Start, Back & Screen Change Buttons
Big old Launch Button

Software
HyperSpin FE
HyperPin FE
Mame for Vertical Arcade Games
Visual Pinball
Future Pinball
« Last Edit: April 04, 2013, 06:00:33 pm by griffindodd »

Nephasth

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #1 on: February 26, 2013, 11:29:38 pm »
RIP SI

griffindodd

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #2 on: February 26, 2013, 11:34:29 pm »
RIP SI

Aye I pulled this corpse from under a tarp by the dumpster of an amusements shop. $100 for the case, door, mechs and legs

yotsuya

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #3 on: February 26, 2013, 11:36:04 pm »
No backbox? That shouldn't be hard to make, though.

Any theme ideas?
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

griffindodd

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #4 on: February 26, 2013, 11:39:57 pm »
I'm hoping to come up with something generic enough that it compliments whatever pin is running. Let the game take the lead and have the cabinet hopefully just compliment. Either that or goes balls out TAF

PL1

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #5 on: February 27, 2013, 02:28:07 am »
The automated feature we discussed earlier would also work with a generic theme by changing the shape of the lid, but either way the coin mechs would probably be in the way.   :badmood:

Even if you remove the supports for the old backbox and hang the new one off the back of the main box, the 50" is probably going to be too long (~44" + bezel) to move the playfield far enough back for the joystick and buttons.

Another design consideration is providing air flow over the playfield to avoid heat buildup under the glass.

If you do use the Mot-Ion controller, keep in mind that it is rather succeptible to heat-related problems IIRC.


Scott

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #6 on: February 27, 2013, 09:30:10 am »
Yeah not too sure about that automated thingy, I don't think I have a problem with the control panel being a fixed part of the overall aesthetic.

The interior dimensions of the cab are 26 5/8" wide by 50" length if you take the backbox support out of the equation, my screen is 26"x45" cased. If I'm really pushed for space then I will extend the cab itself forward 6-8 inches to accommodate the new addition, that will probably give me more latitude design-wise too, like all the best Hot-Rods we'll chop and stretch the chassis  :laugh:
« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 09:43:21 am by griffindodd »

yotsuya

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #7 on: February 27, 2013, 09:42:33 am »
I guess I didn't read this correctly the first time. I thought it was just going to be a pin. Be interested to see your plans/production.
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

griffindodd

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #8 on: February 27, 2013, 09:44:32 am »
I guess I didn't read this correctly the first time. I thought it was just going to be a pin. Be interested to see your plans/production.

Yeah me too, this is definitely in the 'erm....it..SHOULD..work  :dunno ' kinda stage right now

PL1

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #9 on: February 27, 2013, 04:39:11 pm »
If I'm really pushed for space then I will extend the cab itself forward 6-8 inches to accommodate the new addition

I figured you'd extend the back like a z-back profile cab.

That would give you room for the MAME panel (yellow) because the playfield (blue) -- set too high in this diagram -- is slid to the back of the box and maybe a notch in the back wall to let the playfield pass through.

The DMD display (green), backglass (red), and flashers (white dots under DMD) are built into the backbox.

The 250mm and 120mm cooling fans and air deflector (orange) draw cool air up and pass it across the top/bottom playfield and out the sides.

How far back do the coin mechs extend?


Scott

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #10 on: February 27, 2013, 04:59:39 pm »
The coin mechs are big for sure, one of the bigger coin doors I have seen. thanks for the diagram, that could definitely work out too, there's a few ways to attack this.

But before I get into that I'm going after something WAYYYYYYY more ambitious with the side panels.

I want to use a technique that I have talked about in the past and experimented with and had good success, but now really bring it into play as a serious feature on this cabinet. I want to back project video onto the base cabinet sides, it will probably end up being more static images like marquees and side art, but I want the whole of the cabinet to visually change based on the game that is being played.

The base cabinet is 50" horizontal front to back. I have a short throw 16:10 projector that will throw a 51" wide (60" diag) image in focus from 24" away. the plan is to mount the projector under the base cabinet and project up to a 'V' made of two mirrors set at 45 degrees bouncing each half of the image onto the interior sides of the cabinet, essentially showing each half of the image on each side of the cab. The projected image would be the cabinet side art or marquee for the game being played (Maybe even the DMD if I can pull it off). Obviously each half of the projected image would have it's own art rotated and mirrored to show correctly through the rear projection side panels on the cabinet.

Hard to explain but something like....


« Last Edit: March 04, 2013, 03:28:21 pm by griffindodd »

thatpurplestuff

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #11 on: February 27, 2013, 05:22:11 pm »
If you can pull off that mirror concept, you'll be a God amongst men.  Sounds very cool!

So once again, we find that evil of the past seeps into the present like salad dressing through cheap wax paper, mixing memory and desire.

Gamester

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #12 on: February 27, 2013, 07:23:35 pm »
Interesting concept.  What type of material do you plan to rear project the image on?
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griffindodd

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Re: Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #13 on: February 27, 2013, 07:40:31 pm »
Interesting concept.  What type of material do you plan to rear project the image on?

Gray spandex behind acrylic

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Re: Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #14 on: February 27, 2013, 07:51:14 pm »
Gray spandex behind acrylic

Intriguing.  Definitely looking forward to seeing this in action.
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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #15 on: February 27, 2013, 07:53:32 pm »
If you can pull off that mirror concept, you'll be a God amongst men.  Sounds very cool!

+1 to that. You might also consider a partial/full mirror arrangement. That way you could use the entire image. Google partial mirror to see examples.

But it might get $$$.

Le Chuck

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #16 on: February 27, 2013, 07:55:48 pm »
Did somebody say spandex?  I was told there would be spandex. 

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #17 on: February 27, 2013, 08:02:40 pm »
Did somebody say spandex?  I was told there would be spandex.



There's a theme idea for the pin, as well!
***Build what you dig, bro. Build what you dig.***

rablack97

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #18 on: February 27, 2013, 09:19:01 pm »
Did somebody say spandex?  I was told there would be spandex. 

 :stupid

 >:D

In the words of that weird Jennifer person, that speaks in 3rd, 1st person, Rablack97 has left the thread.....

Moments later.......

Wait I take that back, damn chuck you got some skills, just saw your trainer thread......... :notworthy: :notworthy: :notworthy:

You get immunity today only.....24 hours, and back to normal.....

Oh yeah.....Griff pinball marquee trash bin thingy project....keep up the good work.....see if you can find a Sports Illustrated Pinball game and flash hot models on the sides of this thing....how bout that.....

« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 09:27:29 pm by rablack97 »
   

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PL1

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #19 on: February 27, 2013, 11:25:33 pm »
I know everybody's getting excited about projectors, mirrors, and spandex, but here's another thought for you.

Sides covered with large sheets of Graylite 31.

2x2 video wall split so the top two are on one side and the bottom two are on the other.   >:D

Alternate method less likely to land Griff in the poor house or divorce court -- 2nd computer with a 2-monitor setup and video splitters feeding the monitors on the other side.   ;D


Scott
« Last Edit: February 27, 2013, 11:29:21 pm by PL1 »

griffindodd

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #20 on: February 27, 2013, 11:52:59 pm »
Lol. Actually this is looking quite cheap so far. The projector is a refurb from Epson for $199 with free shipping and the spandex is actually moleskin spandex at a whopping $12 for 60"x1yard.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #21 on: February 28, 2013, 12:01:55 am »
Whata all this talk about money, you just built a full arcade,bought a house, built a mini arcade, restoring a paperboy, now this...

You and broke are not related.....spare no expense.....cheap sucks ass..... :cheers:
   

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griffindodd

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #22 on: February 28, 2013, 12:03:56 am »
Whata all this talk about money, you just built a full arcade,bought a house, built a mini arcade, restoring a paperboy, now this...

*Didn't buy a house - fell through
*Sold my mini arcade to pay for this one
*Sold everything in my closet to pay for this one
*Sell my body for power tools

PL1

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #23 on: February 28, 2013, 12:12:19 am »
Lol. Actually this is looking quite cheap so far.

The poor house/divorce court comment was related to the video wall link.

I linked the "inexpensive" one.  :o


Scott

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #24 on: February 28, 2013, 12:20:48 am »
Ok so I asked Howard about this over on the Mame Hooker thread but lend me your brains for this issue.

I'm going to need a new function to display artwork files based on the following criteria...

- The game is being viewed in the menu in Hyperpin
- The game is being played in either Visual Pinball or Future Pinball

How do I go about calling my art file to get it displayed on my 4th monitor (USB to VGA) which is the projector.

Example art layout....


griffindodd

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Re: Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #25 on: February 28, 2013, 11:03:26 am »
Did somebody say spandex?  I was told there would be spandex.

Scary thing is I had to register for an account at 'Spandex World' to order :-\

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #26 on: February 28, 2013, 11:40:23 am »

You're going to need a gap between the images.  That gap will end up being something like 2x(width of mirror + gap between mirrors).  The only way to avoid that will be perfectly cut angled edges on the mirror and seeing as how we're talking glass here that ain't happening on a budget.

Interesting concept and I'm looking forward to seeing how well it works.  I have some concerns about the throw distance between that projector and the near side of the mirrors.  Even with the short throw projector you're still only talking about a couple inches between the lens and those mirrors.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #27 on: February 28, 2013, 12:46:43 pm »
Hi Chad,

All valid points, I've also been considering these issues. The projector will live in a housing that exists below the base of the cabinet, so it will protrude quite far down to give extra throw, combine that with the distance between the mirrors and the sides of the cabinet so hopefully that will give me what I need for minimum focal length.

For the mirrors I plan on using first surface mirrored acrylic which will hopefully be easier to work with.

Lots of questions and hurdles ahead to deal with, but this is the part I love the most.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2013, 12:49:37 pm by griffindodd »

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #28 on: February 28, 2013, 12:49:38 pm »
I'm in.  Watching with pregnant anticipation.

AJ

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #29 on: February 28, 2013, 02:58:56 pm »
It's a shame there isn't a work around for the dingle-dangle (the projector body below the main body).  It'd be pretty tight to have that all under the playfield but inside the main housing.  I'm sure you'll come up with something. 

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #30 on: February 28, 2013, 02:59:59 pm »
It's a shame there isn't a work around for the dingle-dangle (the projector body below the main body).  It'd be pretty tight to have that all under the playfield but inside the main housing.  I'm sure you'll come up with something.

Yeah it's all in the angle of my dangle.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #31 on: February 28, 2013, 03:19:55 pm »
How big are the mirrors going to be?  How much real-estate will have to be empty/unubstructed for the projection?  Wondering if you could get away with some convex mirrors...

AJ

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #32 on: February 28, 2013, 03:28:55 pm »
How big are the mirrors going to be?  How much real-estate will have to be empty/unubstructed for the projection?  Wondering if you could get away with some convex mirrors...

AJ

it depends how close to the source they are - closer to the PJ = smaller but I have to watch for heat and also make sure my throw distance adds up to at least 24".

Once the projector arrives I can play with it properly and see just how close I can get it to the screen without losing focus. If I can get it closer than 24" then that will help a lot, but we'll just have to see.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #33 on: February 28, 2013, 04:12:47 pm »
An alternate approach that would involve adding a second projector but would simplify a lot of things, is to just stagger two PJ's along the bottom of the cab, bring the side down closer to the floor to create a super deep sided cabinet with 60" projected 16:10 images. This way I just mirror the screens with hardware and dont have to do all kinds of gymnastics with the images, it would also allow for some pretty insane use of video.



Looks like the only thing I may end up using off this cab is the legs and the coin door lol.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #34 on: February 28, 2013, 04:51:11 pm »
What kind of lumens does your projector put out?  I'm wondering if this thing is going to be bright enough to not look totally washed out with ambient light in the room, or if this is going to end up being a night time only affair...
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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #35 on: February 28, 2013, 04:58:37 pm »
What kind of lumens does your projector put out?  I'm wondering if this thing is going to be bright enough to not look totally washed out with ambient light in the room, or if this is going to end up being a night time only affair...

Its 2000 'Epson' lumens. Epson are known for under-quoting the light output of their projectors. Also because it's rear projection the screen quality in ambient light is much higher as long as the area behind the screen is quite dark - ie the inside of a closed cabinet.

A 48"x 30" image (16:10) = 10 sq/ft of image for 2000 lumens, so output is 200 footlambert. 200 footlambert is equal to 648 NIT. Most LCD/Plasma TV's are rated at way below that, typically commercial and daylight readable displays are rated above 600 NIT.

So, on paper, this will be bright enough to look more like a plasma/LCD screen even in considerable ambient light when using rear projection.
« Last Edit: February 28, 2013, 05:15:01 pm by griffindodd »

Gamester

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #36 on: February 28, 2013, 05:34:38 pm »
Gotcha.  Sounds like plenty.  Wasn't sure if this was one of those little LED jobs which are pretty weak. 

What's your plan for ventilation?  That a front venting projector?  Maybe you can just post the model number so I stop annoying you with questions.  ;)
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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #37 on: February 28, 2013, 05:36:52 pm »
Maybe you can just post the model number so I stop annoying you with questions.  ;)

here you go bud...

http://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/consumer/consDetail.jsp?BV_UseBVCookie=yes&infoType=Overview&oid=63088266&category=Products

Don't worry about the questions, I'll have plenty for you as I continue down this VPin route as you're already knee deep in yours   :P

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #38 on: March 01, 2013, 10:02:59 am »
Ordered all my gear from Zebulon this morning and updated the parts list in the OP.

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Re: Widebody Retrofit: Project Something Something
« Reply #39 on: March 01, 2013, 10:56:51 am »

I'm thinking if the projector were actually inside the cabinet he would have to do some serious heat venting.  Those things get HOT and are not designed to be used in an enclosure.  You can damage a projector like that just by unplugging it right after turning it off because the fan needs to run for another minute or two while the thing cools down.

Even if the projector were a cheapo LCD job it's working inside a small enclosed dark cabinet.  A real projector like this Epson is going to have to be turned way down to minimum brightness or it's going to totally wash that material out.