The Complete Noob's First Project Thread - (No Theme/Name yet...)

[walterg74]

Hi!

So, after bothering a lot of people on my briefly infamous "Building Basics" thread (which can be found for your pleasure right here: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=118557.0), I decided to take the plunge and start the attempt at building my very first cabinet (Took ya long enough!).

So being a complete noob,I'm pretty sure that many more questions will keep popping up, but luckily there are a lot of experienced folks around here willing to help a noob out

Also, this thread will be progressed a little as a tutorial and as a made by a noob and for noobs, in the hope that many others that like myself have absolutely no clue of woodworking and building these cabinets in general can maybe find it easier to start (I do admit I now do have one or two clues after starting ).

Like any guy with a new baby, there are lots of pics, so here we go...

First thing I did was get all the tools I needed. No pics of those but I bought:

Circular Saw
Jigsaw
Router (+ some bits)
Drill (already had it)

Like I was told, these are not *all* necessary but are nice to have if you can, so buy them if it's within your means,or rent them, or whatever if possible.

Supplies:

Glue
Screws (1 3/8")
Sandpaper (got several to test out, 60, 100, 150, 220)
Small Drill Bit (3.25mm) to make pilot holes for the screws

Clamps:



This should do it for now...



And of course, safety first boys and girls, so here's a small little starter's kit:



Following the Verticade's plans, and after calculating how much I needed, I ended up buying 1/4 sheet of 12mm MDF, and another 1/4 sheet of 15mm MDF (no 16mm where I live). Also, since here in my country sheets come in 1830mm x 2600mm size, 1/4 was more than enough for this build.

Besides this, I also bought a 2.44m stick of 1"x1" (which was actually 22mm x 22-23mm), for the interior moldings. Would you believe I ran short by about 10-12 inches (that's what she said!) and now I have to go back to the store since I missing the 2 little moldings for the monitor..? 

So anyway, that's it for post #1, take a look at post #2 for starting to actually do something!

[walterg74]

Ok, here we go with post #2... What did I actually do so far? Good question...

Started out on friday night, and the first thing I did was to *try* to copy the plans onto my nice MDF square...

Just as background, the 16mm 1/4 sheet mdf (1830 mm x 650 mm) was cut by the place I bought the wood from (they do straight cuts for free) into two 650mm x 650mm squares, and a remaining piece of 530mm x 650mm.
The 12mm 1/4 sheet I just took as-is since I didnīt know if I would need to make adjustments to it, and also to get some practice with the circular saw (more on that later...).

So anyway, like I said above, first thing was to get the plans onto the wood:




Not surprisingly, this did take some time (hello, noob here remember?), specially for getting the curves done right. And speaking of curves, trying to find out how to do these exactly, I came into a lot of posts that said "well, that's easy enough... just take a nail and a piece of string as long as the radius, moron!", and then I was like: "uhmm... ok, so how do I know where the center should be to actually place that nail??" among many other questions I had like how do you know where the circle is supposed to go through exactly being that many times the points where the curves stem from are *not* tangent to the circle.. but I digress... 

What I ended up doing is simply drawing circles with my handy compass onto a piece of paper, and then cutting them out. With that nice little circle I just played around with it on the wood until it looked right, and like the plans.  Only isue with that approach was when I had to do the big R67cm curve... that screwed me..   For that then, I ended up taking the advice I found on other posts, and simply use my handy flexible 1m steel ruler to place it between the two endpoints, and trace a curve I liked and that looked to me something like the VertiCade one
(Well.. actually, being the anal jerk that I am, I really ended up making a quarter circle -not enough to make anything more- out of cardboard, and attempting a new curve, which surprisingly was very similar to what I had already drawn  )

So.. had to wait until the next day for something called light to come up...  Next day then, took the square outside and readied to cut:



Now I'm really sorry but I seemed to have lost the pictures where I first:

- Used the circular saw to cut of an excess slice to the left, and another one to the top of the square
- Used the jigsaw to trace-cut the shape of the side

Once I had done the above, I simply placed the cutout piece on my second square, traced the shape with a pencil and did the same as above to have the second side cut out. Again I lost that pic (last one I lost, I promise.. ) but just so you know (specially if you'rea noob like me) what I ended up with was two sides that were *pretty* similar but had their differences (one had more wood on some places than the other, etc) but all in all fairly similar.

Before I end post #2, this is what I looked like before actually starting to use the circular saw. Yeah.. before I knew I would be covered up to my ears in sawdust after hitting the trigger for the first time... 



Coming up in a few minutes... post #3

See ya then!

[walterg74]

Ok, moving on...

Last post we were stuck with two *similar* pieces of wood that are supposed to be the sides...

One of my questions on the building basics thread was "how do I get them to be the same"? (or at least pretty darn close). One of the answers I received (and saw in ither places) was sanding. I honestly did not think I was going to be able to get away with that having never done it before. So I asked "what about routing?"  The answer to that was that it could be done and I would be better off leaving the pencil mark when I cut out the second piece, so I would have some extra material for shaving from the second piece.

Now even though that's what I *tried* to do, it was hard enough to try to follow the line with the jigsaw for the noob, so even though there *was* material to shave off, it wasn't exactly what the person that gave me the answer had in mind I bet 

So anyway, I kinda knew what I wanted to do, and that was to use the router, with the flush trim bit (for us noobs, is just does a straight cut on the edge of the wood). Naturally I was *not* going to try out my theories on the freshly cut sides, so I got some scrap wood to do some tests, and voila!:



Here is a closeup of the bit I used:



Noob explanation, here's how I did it: I clamped both pieces of wood together, aligning them by the two common sides that were the same, placing the piece of wood that was "bigger", or with excess material, on top. The "Ring" on the bit "rides" the bottom piece, in a way that the bottom piece os the "guide", and the blades will cut off material from the top piece. Since the blade is not large enough to cut the *whole* width of the top piece, once you do a first pass, you need to adjust the depth of the cut. The "ring" will no ride the lower part of the top piece, but since that's already cut to size and the same as the lower piece, no problem!    You will then have the two sides at the same nice size:

Pics on sides starting, and processed:











Easy right?

Coming up: Some sanding gets done! 

[wol-nz]

Off to a good start - I'm just wondering... steal shutters and iron bars covering that window...you would hope that isn't an exit point in an emergency 

[Ond]

That's some clean router work for a "noob" you might want to reassess that title 

[walterg74]

Off to a good start - I'm just wondering... steal shutters and iron bars covering that window...you would hope that isn't an exit point in an emergency 

Yeah well, sadly every house has them here... better safe than sorry, as we can't have the luxury of not having them as in most of the civilized world... 

[walterg74]

That's some clean router work for a "noob" you might want to reassess that title 

Thanks!   Maybe beginner's luck? I guess after the questions I asked, the time I spent investigating on the net how the bits work, and the tests I made on those rounded pieces you see in the pics, seems it was enough to get it right

[walterg74]

When last we posted, we were left with two pieces of (fairly) identical wood, that are the sides of the cabinet. Now while these were in fact very alike, it still didn't take from the fact that the jigsaw cuts left a bit to be desired in the overall smoothness of the shapes, and specially on some curves.

What I did then was to put some more clamps around them, to keep them together evenly all around, and then I proceeded to do some sanding, not with a sander (which I don't have yet) but with "elbow grease" as Woodshop Flunky had suggested...

Being this was just for some rough sanding/shaving some material off, I decided to make a judgement call and I used some 60 grit sandpaper. I then just sanded all around, just to get a nice evenness to the whole thing, and also to get the top and bottom rounded parts to be really rounded instead of the residual bit of jaggedness that the jigsaw had left behind (and having done the routing meant that while now both pieces were the same, they both had the mild jaggedness   ).

Here are the results after sanding (not too long mind you):









And after that, I decided to call it quits on the side panels. I think I got a pretty decent result for the first time, and I didn't think I could find a way to improve it anway (or even wanted to spend more time on it for this first try).

My next steps were to cut the inside moldings out of the 1"x1" stick...  On one hand, to get the length of them, I simply looked at the plans, and subtracted the width of the wood in the places that had them on the plans, to determine the length of the moldings. That part was easy enough. The difficult part was to determine what angles were used at joining these together, as sadly there are no indications on the plans. The only one I knew was of course the bottom + back, since they make a 90š angle, so 45š on each piece. But the rest, no clue... I simply kept cutting at some angle that *looked* more or less ok to me, and I guess I'll have to see how it turns out and make adjustments later on (hope not too many...).

Here are some pics of how they came out, where they are just placed on top of the side panel to get an idea of how I was going to attach them. As you can see, you can appreciate what I mentioned in the first post happening: I ran out of this type of wood and was left without the piece that holds the monitor panel  









As you can tell from the last pic, it had already started to get dark, so I decided to call it quits for the day, and that my friends, was Saturday!

 

[walterg74]

The arrival of Sunday came with the chance of doing some more work on this...

Instead of continuing with the moldings, I chose to start with the cutting of the other panels (don't know why, free will I guess  )

What I had was one big ass piece of wood that was 1830mm x 65mm x 12mm. All the panels in the VertiCade were exactly 370mm wide, so I started out by tracing this width along the length of the piece of wood:



Now as you can see from the picture, I don't exactly have the Woodmaster's tables/benches there (oh and funny story, if you look at one of the previous pics you'll find traces of my first use of the circular saw, which is why I now owe my wife a new table...  ), so that meant I had to find some workaround to hold the wood relatively firmly and in a way it didnīt fall to the ground, which I did using a couple of extra chairs. I also took the precaution of making sure the line of cut was away from the table, so that it wasn't just that I owed my wife a new table but that I would also be able to keep using this one whole instead of settling for half

Happily the circular saw did it's thing kinda the way I wanted to, with a little un-neatness at the end of the piece which I wasn't using anyway, but good enough:



Next was to cut up all the panels. Since all were the same 370mm wide, it was just a matter of following the measurements to draw those lengths onto the wood, and do all these cuts. Long story short, here are the panels:



Now one thing I will say, and here I make a pause for the experienced folks to tell me why, is that most cuts did not come out good at the end. I know I don't have the best (or even the most basic) way of holding the wood properly to cut it with the circular saw, and all my cuts consisted in placing the long end of the wood on the table and the short end (closest to the cut) onto a chair, and eveytime I would make a cut for each panel I would get something like this:



It's not *that* big of a deal since it's really a very tiny thing that I sanded off, and on the remaining piece it just goes on the inside anyway, so can't be seen (and again it's really small), but why does this happen, and how can I avoud it? (and also what is the best way to cut panels like this with a circular saw? (since I only have one table and don't know what the *right* way to give the wood support is)

Most other cuts did come out fairly ok like so:



Next up, last part of Sunday, and closing for the weekend.

L8r!

[walterg74]

Ok, here we go...

Last post of the weekend covering up Sunday's last things...

As you may recall, I had cut the inside moldings but done only that. Looking at the examples, I saw that the way to attach them was using both glue and screws. The glue part was easy enough (although even now I'm not sure of the right quantities or if you have to apply it/spread it a cretain way, feel free to comment on it if you know), but regarding the screws I had some doubts.

While these are for the insides anyway, and not seen at all, when I bought the screws I luckily chose (by making assumptions) more or less the correct length, since I was using  12mm MDF, and I learned later about the 1/3-2/3 rule, were 1/3 goes into the material where you first drive the screw through. In my case, I wanted to to the whole countersink thing, so I had first calculated for some reason for the 15mm MDF, and since I thought about doing it roughly 5mm in, that left 10mm of material for the screw, and the rest would be driven into the other part, and since the screws I bought are actually 32mm, that seemed extremely close to the rule.
Turns out after looking that the screws actually hold the 12mm pieces onto the moldings, not the 15mm ones, *but* as fate would have it, 5mm is way too big anyway for the countersink part, so it turned out that *aproximately* 2mm was more than enough for the screw's head to get under the wood, so that still leaves about 10mm of material, so we're good to go anyway. I'll put a pic of the screws for you to see later on.

So anyway, all this was nice and dandy, *but* there was one small problem... The isn't a single store here in my country that actually sells countesink bits...    Much less those 1-step coubtersink+drill bits.

What I did was order some from Amazon, that a friend will receive and take over to Europe for me, where I'll be heading to next month for work. So those I'll have for NEXT project, since of course I wasn't going to wait a month to conitnue this, specially since these go on the inside anyway... (and while I was at it, I also ordered those slot cutting bits for the outside t-molding, and some bullnose bits that could work for this maybe later on, to give it that rounded finish Koenings did on it with the milling machine).

I decided to improvise, and got some scrap wood again to do some tests...

First was the screw by itself to see how if worked on MDF, *just* using the screwdriver (they're "auto drilling" screws -or whatever they're called in the US). That worked in the sense that it did go through the material, *but* the wood started splitting as you drove the screw...

Next was the screw by itself but with a pilot hole, to see if the 3.25mm drill bit I bought was good enough (not too big not too small). Drilled a hole through the MDF, and only then I placed a screw on it and drove it through the wood. Results were as expected, with the screw "biting" at the wood (the hole was in fact not too big, so great) and also the wood did not split.

Last step was to simulate the countersink, so adding to the previous step (and before inserting the screw) I used an 8mm drill bit to start a shallow hole at the same place. After that I drove the screw in again. Might not be perfect, and surely takes longer, but I got the desired results (and again, for insides, it will do just fine).

I present you the scrap:



So after that I said "What the hell, let's do this", and went on screwing/gluing the moldings, starting as so:



The glue I got said "Extra strenght" and that it needed only 15 minutes of press. I did leave it longer anyway, just in case, and I managed to do up to this:



before it got too dark and had to call it quits....

And that's all for now...

Don't know if I can get any more done during the week, if not, I'll have to continue next Saturday.

See you guys soon, and of course, all your comments, questions and suggestions are more than welcome!

L8r! 

[walterg74]

Not much progress today being a weekday and all, but still I did manage to get to the store to buy the needed 1"x1", which I cut up for the moldings that hold the monitor panel, and those have been installed 

I also bought a couple of those spade round drill bits for cutting holes, and they worked out pretty good, like Koenigs said, wokred better for me than the cup saw (although in all fairness I don't really know if the ones I had were fastened 100% correctly to begin with...

One thing I did see, as I was holding together some panels to see what the thing would look like, is that the measurements are not all that correct... 

Thing is I decided to leave 2mm off the back just o have a little border I liked, and also, my curve at the front was a little "curvier" and so instead of 482 where the bottom starts curving up, I actually have about 469-470. But besides that, I don't know exactly how I should the edges of the bottom and front panels, since the step-by step does not show it 

It would seem he mounts the front panel on top of the bottom panel, but if I do that, there will be an angle between them, unless I cut the bottom panel at the same angle as the front panel goes? would that be enough? For it's top part, if will be flush and on the same plane with the moldings, and so the control panel should fit in nicely (and if I add some routed rounding to the edge, it would make it look even nicer).

Is that the way it should be done, or is there a better way to fit these pieces together? 

[lcmgadgets]

Congrats on an amazing start! & thanks for the extra detail you're putting into your posts. I'll bet this project will become a must-read for all noobs like me. Keep up the great work!

[walterg74]

Congrats on an amazing start! & thanks for the extra detail you're putting into your posts. I'll bet this project will become a must-read for all noobs like me. Keep up the great work!

Thanks for the encouragement!  I'll try to keep up the details, as I know it really helps to have more than a summary of each step when you're not familiar with the things you need to do (at least I know it helped me).

Sadly, I can only progress this through the weekends, since you know, I don't wanna get fired and being winter here means that by the time I get home it already starts to get dark soon so no point in setting up shop outside for a couple of minutes of light.. 

Hope to have more on saturday!

 

[walterg74]

So.. About to continue with the build tomorrow...

Haven't seen any of the woodworking gurus around, if any of you guys hapoen to read this,mgot any advice to my questions on the next steps? ( and/or the panel cuts issues?) 

[jammin0]

The arrival of Sunday came with the chance of doing some more work on this...
Now one thing I will say, and here I make a pause for the experienced folks to tell me why, is that most cuts did not come out good at the end. I know I don't have the best (or even the most basic) way of holding the wood properly to cut it with the circular saw, and all my cuts consisted in placing the long end of the wood on the table and the short end (closest to the cut) onto a chair, and eveytime I would make a cut for each panel I would get something

No super expert here but my guess is that your wood pieces have some flex and the weig of your circular saw/ the force you're using downward on your saw is causing a break at the end.  I don't have a very good workspace so I usually end up cutting on the floor.  If you place enough scrap under both sides then you should breeze through it.  Try and envision when the cut is finished what will happen to it.  Is it supported enough that it will remain in place?  If either side is able to tip off your work surface (I'm guessing your chair side) then that's why you're getting too much flex and tear out at the end.

[GIZMOGAMES]

theres no real way to counter the tear at the end unless both pieces sides are clamped to a surface if you use 2x2 blocks to support left and right side of yr cut that helps other than that use the jigsaw and cut a few inches from the oposite side first then cut from the correct side altho again gravity will still try to tear the 2 apart either way with support both sides of the cut neither tears
hope that helps the angle cuts are also more proffesional can be achived with chopsaw and setting the angle you require also remember the thickness of the cutting blade so cut outside the line
apart from that your doing great :and at worst you can work the angle out with a protractor  ..

[walterg74]

@jammin0 / @gizmogames

Thanks for the tips! sounds logical, and kinda what I had figured. I guess I need to find at least a small workbench to hold these better for next time!

As far as the angling goes, I sort of figured it out and managed to fit the pieces pretty well... Been working yesterday and will get some more things done today and then post the results tonight.

L8r! 

[walterg74]

Ok, back to the show!!

Here's what I managed to do during the weekend + some today:

Ok, so last advance post, I had managed to get most of the interior moldings, but quite a few were missing (plus I had ran out of wood!). Got the final pieces cut,  and installed, same method as the previous ones, and this is what came out:



And as far as the angling of the pieces, I went ahead and tried to copy the same angle that the moldings that support the front had, and cutit like that for the botton plate and the front plate as well:





I did have a problem here, since to start my bottom panel having copied the plans exactly, was too long, and had to be cut down. When I did, to follow the way the VertiCade had assembled the pieces, I made the mistake of measuring up the point where the front piece started, but not to add it's width, andso my piece was now too short 

I had two options: make a new bottom panel, or make a "higher" front panel, and change the assembly from the plans, in a way that the front piece is the only piece seen from the front, instead of following the original plans where that piece is mounted on top of the bottom piece.

I decided to pick the latter, since it was easier to make the smaller piece and also because I saw no reason or sense for having the two pieces seen from the front, as having just the one seems cleaner.

So anyway, here's how the pieces looked and the assembly part:







And adding the other side panel...





And rise frank err.. cabinet!



Wasn't perfect, but nothing that can't be perfected and made prettier with filler.. here is some details with the front only presented to check it out:









Next up.. Going off to the back... 

[walterg74]

Ok, so back to the err.. back I guess...

One more comment, on the above pictures, the front piece seems like it has a lot of space to the moldings, and it did, but some sanding was done later to make it fit better.

Anyway, for the back, I presented the pieces to see what it would look like, and while they fit more or less ok:





I wasn't too happy with it, or with the amount of filler Koenigs *seems* to have used there.  I decided to go ahead and try to angle the borders to see what I could get...
something like so:



Angling bot the top piece and the angled top piece,  and presenting showed this:





That was all I could do for the day, so I called it quits, but then got an urge to do something more, whatever I could, inside. So I decided to do some of the top. Played around with the top and angled top pieces, to see the correct placing for the top moldings which I hadn't yet installed. After a while, I ended up attaching them like so:





Once that was dry, I said "what the hell", and decided to continue with the top piece and the "under marquee" piece, and here it is:





Of course my noobines made that the whoe thing was definitely not straight, and so, I only got 3 out of the 4 corners to align, and so opted for the best choice (in my nooby judgement) and chose the 3 I thought were the best, and so, at the front left one, where there was space left, I filled it up with some wood putty/filler I had bought. The results were not pretty, but dried up perfectly and will be sanded exactly as needed for priming/painintg later on (and it won't even be seen, so not a problem. this is the "raw" or "just applied shot:



And that, was Sunday!

Ah... but luckily, today I managed to do some more work... So there's a BONUS post! Say tuned

[Vidiot]

Looks like you're really making some progress! I really like the shape of this one. Looks kinda like my little bartop. I love all the pics. Thanks for sharing 'em. I look forward to your progress.   

[walterg74]

Allright, Monday bonus post!  

Back angled top was cut and angled, but was missing the ventilation holes. I decided to follow Koening's advice and use the flat spade bit, that I had practiced with on some scrap last week. followed a similar design, with 7 25mm holes, with 6 22mm spaces between them, leaving roughly 22mm (the moldings) + 10mm on each side.
The result was pretty decent:







Ok... if you look closely you'll see that the first hole is slightly off from the rest... you spotted that, didn't you..?  

All in all it's not that bad, specially for a first time, and while you can see it if you look close enough straight on:



It-s not that bad from an angle:



Here without the back panel:



And who's really gonna be looking at the back, right..?  

Anyway, I then sanded the front a bit, and went ahead to attach that. As you can see, it is the only piece seen from the front, and attached with glue plus one screw per side:







The last thing I did was for the monitor panel. Now for this, I saw a lot of lines drawn on the the VertiCade page, for what I assume is getting the right size for the VESA mounting, otherwise you're screwed...
I thought I would take a different approach: I simply held a sheet of paper on the back of the monitor, held it tight, and pierced it with a pencil to get the 4 holes at the right spots...





I then drew a line at what I thought was the half of the monitor support and used the paper (after trimming it a bit to make it easier) and poked the pencil through the holes to mark them on the wood:



Now that's as far as I got...

Unfortunately, I have a slight problem with the monitor.... I bought one for this (a used one) not too long ago, and when I went to measure the mount thing today, I realized something I had not seen before, and that is that the stand on this model is *not* removable   so that is a huge problem, since of course the cabinet is not wide enough to accomodate the monitor AND the stand (well maybe just barely, but that would mean the monitor is not centered and way to a side).
So now I either have to find a way to cut/modify the stand part (carefuly because the controls are on the part closest to the screen) or worst case scenario, get a new monitor...

Also, sadly to continue I need some advise guidance, regarding 2 things:

1) Since my cabinet is all wood, and not acrylic CP, I need to have that done now too before starting the priming/painting phase. For that I have two doubts/questions:

- Where can I find a decent layout plan for it? This will be a 1 Player (well one set of controls) panel, with 6 (could be 7) buttons, plus the joystick, and a player 1 and player 2 start, all of these I want on the top surface, and then the coin 1,coin2, pause, exit (which I guess I could just put a coin ubtton and have it double as coin 2 with the shift key and maybe another button for pause and doubling as exit with the shift as well?)

- Most importantly, how the heck do ?I install the joystick?? The buttons as stupidly simple, just cut a hole and stick it in... But the joystick? considering there will be nothing on top of the wood as well, and it will be just the paint and maybe some art on it if I can get thehang of doing that part. It seems if I just screw the joystick from the bottom, that not enough of the stick gets through, so what's the best way to do this?

2 - The bezel part... I see the size in theplans, etc, but how the hell is this thing supported???   One picture seems to be like it just rests on the monitor, but that can't be right.. There is no indication of any support on theplans for it, and yet there has to be *something* keeping nice and straight, right?


so ok.. once I get the design for the CP, and hopefully get some tips here about mounting the joystick, I'll be cutting that up, and then I guess I can start sanding/priming/painting the whole thing and see what happens... Oh, and I also have to do the ventilation/cutouts for the back panel, but that's ok, no questions there except deciding what to cut (like I don't think I want USB connectors, etc).

So, until next time, and hopefully some of the nice folks that passed through my basics thread will also see this one and chime in.  

See you soon!!  

[walterg74]

Looks like you're really making some progress! I really like the shape of this one. Looks kinda like my little bartop. I love all the pics. Thanks for sharing 'em. I look forward to your progress.   

Thanks for the encouragement!  That's the idea, to record the progress of this and share with others some stuff I would have liked to have

[Mikeosoft]

loving what i see so far. keep it up man! i'll be watching this because after i finish my gremlin conversion, I'm building one of these small bartops like yours.

[Le Chuck]

Dude, first off you are making outstanding progress.  Your practice with the tools before hand is paying off.  Some of the gaping issues you have had are frustrating now but easily fixed with a generous application of filler and some light sanding so no worries.

A few things I've seen that you may want to adjust and also my take on your questions (since you asked )

The marquee panel mounts look to be flush with the edge of the marquee opening.  This can cause you to get 4 blacked out squares in the corners of your marquee once lit.  If you have a good sharp chisel you can take about a cm off each bracket and that should allow the light to bleed across the back of the marquee art and fill those corner areas. 

What're you hinging the back panel with?  I recommend piano hinges, just make sure whatever you use you anticipate the raise you'll get as you may need to shave your panel down some in height. 

For your monitor I recommend decasing.  Post some more pictures of it please so we can give better advice.  Likely the plastic outer shell is separate from a metal from that houses the boards and the LCD panel.  You will have a much easier time if you lose that plastic shell, but again if you don't feel comfortable with what you're doing pics help tell the story. 

Bezel art can be applied directly to the monitor glass (or plexi) or sandwiched between two thin pieces.  There are a variety of ways to do this.  For a build like yours I recommend routing a thin notch into the back of your cp for it to slike down into.  On either side of the monitor install thin strips for the bezel glass to rest against.  For other ideas you can checkout what I did with Darkade (see my sig).  That used a piece of angle stock to support the bezel and the monitor. 

For the CP most are made out of wood and then just covered with a sheet of plexi either cut off clean or bent to fit.  Buttons are just drilled through like you said.  Joys are either top mount or bottom mount.  I top mounted on my build but lots of other builds bottom mount.  Either way you'll want to get friendly with that router again to make some depressions for everything to fit.  As far a layout goes I recommend you take a shoe box and make the holes in that to template out your ideas to see how they feel under you hands.  The CP is where the user interfaces with the machine, it is paramount that you take your time and find a setup that works for yours.  You can check mine for ideas but Darkade is a bit esoteric.  Better examples of good classic CP layouts would be Unstupid's, Badmouths, Santoro's... any CP you see in the Hall of Fame thread, really there are tons of great examples out there.  As far as making one you should post the size of your CP and then post a link to one you think you might like and we can help you get it laid out. 

Sorry for the long ass post bro.  Keep it up, you'll get there man.   

[GIZMOGAMES]

For the CP most are made out of wood and then just covered with a sheet of plexi either cut off clean or bent to fit.  Buttons are just drilled through like you said.  Joys are either top mount or bottom mount.  I top mounted on my build but lots of other builds bottom mount.  Either way you'll want to get friendly with that router again to make some depressions for everything to fit.  As far a layout goes I recommend you take a shoe box and make the holes in that to template out your ideas to see how they feel under you hands.  The CP is where the user interfaces with the machine, it is paramount that you take your time and find a setup that works for yours.  You can check mine for ideas but Darkade is a bit esoteric.  Better examples of good classic CP layouts would be Unstupid's, Badmouths, Santoro's... any CP you see in the Hall of Fame thread, really there are tons of great examples out there.  As far as making one you should post the size of your CP and then post a link to one you think you might like and we can help you get it laid out. 

Sorry for the long ass post bro.  Keep it up, you'll get there man.   

LMAO long assed post thats what hongkong post said when i waited 40 days for my lvds controlboard for my 19"touchscreen lol
it arrived and now im just waiting again for decent weather :S
Apart from that sidetrack awsome work you are certainly doing things the RIGHT way check slagcoin for various button/joy layouts just print to scale to get a feel for layouts also im sure theres guides to top and bottom mounted joysticks too "more practice routter work bud but nothing you cant handle
and utilise the shoebox/spare wood choice for a feel of the control layout as said above you could always post yr dimensions for a cp and others would be willing to help no problems
Apart from that keep doing what yr doing its GREAT work     
GIZMO

[walterg74]

Wow! Lot's of good stuff/tips/etc. from everyone! Thanks @Mikeosoft, @Le Chuck and @GIZMOGAMES !!!

I'll try to add more info and reply to your follow up questions without quoting as to not make this too large/confusing:

First @Le Chuck:

Marquee panel...

Yes, you're right and I see what you mean. would this be important if it's gonna be black in that part anyway?If so, then yeah, I would probably have to do what you say, either with the chisel, or maybe with a small dremel-like tool? Don't know how Koenigs did it, since I followed his pics and they seem to be flush too... In anycase, for the lighting, I went ahead and bought several (about 10 so I have fo future builds ) of those white led strips on UK ebay. Sent them to a colleague in the UK and I'll hopefully be meeting him in Switzerland in about two weeks for work, so great

Back panel.....

There is a slight space already, but honestly, I wasn't planning on putting hinges on it. I kinda agree with Koening's logic that I won't really be opening that up too often, so I was just planning on using 4 screws, although I don't want to just use standard screws but rather some of those metal shafts, etc, so that screwing/unscrewing (even if not often) doesn't wear out the wood and then you're screwed.. (no pun intended...  )

Monitor issue...

Ok, took some pics, as follows...













So options...
1) Get a new monitor
2) Cut off that plastic (carefullly as to not destroy the controls)
3) Decasing like you say

Only problem for 3 is I don't know how.. Don't see any other screws besides those in the part that is "in the way"


Bezel...

Yeah, what you say about the ridge and support sounds good/more or less what I thought. I will look at your build for ideas, bu I guess you have to find the balance between support angle and to try that you can't see inside the cab and just the screen, right? I remember arcades being totally dark as what you saw if you looked inside/around the screen.

Control Panel...

Yes, so this will be made out of wood. I will try the shoebox idea, and also since this is small, I can print up to A3 size at work, I will try to print some layouts and see. I'm not too sure on mounting the plexiglass on it, wouldn't that make the buttons and joystick be raised even more? (opposite of what I need?)
I'll try to post a pic later of the joystick I have just in case. I guess for top mounting I would cut a big ass hole for the whole mechanism to pass through, and then I have to deal with covering up the plate.

I'll try to do one and post like you mentioned, to see what you guys think. The main difference is this is just a 1 player cab, and most of the ones I have sen are full size and two players.
Just so you know, the size of this one would be 370mm wide, and the depth, well the plans say 170mm, but I can make it a bit deeper if needed
And as buttons, as I commented, I want a joystick and 6 or 7 buttons, and then P1 start, P2 start, P1 coin, P2 coin, exit, pause. don't really know if it's worth adding a shift key for such a small build and so little funtions needed... Oh and I have a mini pac (with wiring harness).

Wheeeew...
Exhausting, but thanks for your long ass post!! Really appreciated!! 
 

Now @GIZMOGAMES:

More thanks for the encouragement!! So, I will google and probably find it, but just in case... what the hell is a "slagcoin"

Ok, so will try the spare wood/shoebox thing, and as written above, dimensions are 37cm wide, and 17cm deep (can make it more if needed for the depth).


Thanks guys!! Looking forward to your replies, and will print some layouts tomorrow at work hopefully, so I can try to make progress on the weekend

 

[walterg74]

Two minor comments to add to the above...

1) for the CP, I have at my disposal either 12mm or 15mm MDF. Which would be best for this case? (Koenigs for some reason says 16mm, but I think for this small you could get away with 12mm?)

2) While I did say P1 coin + P2 coin, are there really many games that actually need you to insert the coin there for P2?? Off the top of my head I can only think of some like the multiplayers like x-Men, The simpsons, etc).

 

[Le Chuck]

http://slagcoin.com/joystick/layout.html

See the above link.  Pick out ones that remind you of your childhood or something.  Actually try a few and see what you like.  That should get you rocking on CP layout.  I would go with the 15mm MDF for added stability since that is where the rubber meets the road.  Almost all games use a P2 coin, even games with turn based play action.  Since yours is single player it is your call, you can just shift the P2 coin since it wont be used that much.     

On your monitor I would wager that silver bezel should pop off the front revealing the screws that are keeping the black plastic connected.  I think that decasing is the way to go to get you down to a workable shape and you'll have a better result than trying to hack away at the thing with a saw or something.  Use a small flat head screw driver and start prying around the outside edges. 

On the marquee it depends, if you are doing a foil appliqué to the opaque areas (masking) to prevent light transmission then no but if you aren't you'll be able to see darker squares. 

Back panel, sounds good. 

With a weecade type design the monitor angle is a big deal so you need to play around and find your sweet spots first before you glue anyting down since you don't have that deadspace that you have behind the glass in some larger units.

[walterg74]

http://slagcoin.com/joystick/layout.html

See the above link.  Pick out ones that remind you of your childhood or something.  Actually try a few and see what you like.  That should get you rocking on CP layout.  I would go with the 15mm MDF for added stability since that is where the rubber meets the road.  Almost all games use a P2 coin, even games with turn based play action.  Since yours is single player it is your call, you can just shift the P2 coin since it wont be used that much.     

On your monitor I would wager that silver bezel should pop off the front revealing the screws that are keeping the black plastic connected.  I think that decasing is the way to go to get you down to a workable shape and you'll have a better result than trying to hack away at the thing with a saw or something.  Use a small flat head screw driver and start prying around the outside edges. 

On the marquee it depends, if you are doing a foil appliqué to the opaque areas (masking) to prevent light transmission then no but if you aren't you'll be able to see darker squares. 

Back panel, sounds good. 

With a weecade type design the monitor angle is a big deal so you need to play around and find your sweet spots first before you glue anyting down since you don't have that deadspace that you have behind the glass in some larger units.

Ok, so I went ahead and did the decasing...

Two issues...

1) while I was able to remove everything, that plastic "extension" or whatever, does not come off.. It's just part of the back casing...

2) While I could just simply not use it, how the heck am I supposed to hold this to themonitor playe?? The VESA screws actually fasten to the casing, so I don't see any way to attach this to the monitor wood panel (in an easy way).

Pics below. Maybe it would be best after all to just use a small hand saw and cut that part off? It would fit fine without that...









Regarding the marquee, not quite sure what you mean... I though I just had to print my design on opaque vynil, stick it on one of the acrylic plaques, put the other one on top and fasten... Am I missing something..?



One last thing, since besides the monitor issue I have to start sanding and painting... What is best to use? Brush? Roller? Both? (and use the same method for prime than for paint?). From what I read I should start sanding at something like 150 before priming, and then sand off the coats with 220 or something like that?

Thanks!! 

[GIZMOGAMES]

http://slagcoin.com/joystick/layout.html

See the above link.  Pick out ones that remind you of your childhood or something.  Actually try a few and see what you like.  That should get you rocking on CP layout.  I would go with the 15mm MDF for added stability since that is where the rubber meets the road.  Almost all games use a P2 coin, even games with turn based play action.  Since yours is single player it is your call, you can just shift the P2 coin since it wont be used that much.     

On your monitor I would wager that silver bezel should pop off the front revealing the screws that are keeping the black plastic connected.  I think that decasing is the way to go to get you down to a workable shape and you'll have a better result than trying to hack away at the thing with a saw or something.  Use a small flat head screw driver and start prying around the outside edges. 

On the marquee it depends, if you are doing a foil appliqué to the opaque areas (masking) to prevent light transmission then no but if you aren't you'll be able to see darker squares. 

Back panel, sounds good. 

With a weecade type design the monitor angle is a big deal so you need to play around and find your sweet spots first before you glue anyting down since you don't have that deadspace that you have behind the glass in some larger units.

lol what He said
Painting go with foam roller and a small hard sponge possibly small brush for edges and such
Remember when painting that its better to do many thin coats than few thick coats thinner coats are easier to maintain inbetween for sanding and evening out and take a lot less time between coats to dry
ide suggest 10 coats minimum
1 primer/ 2 undercoat /5 main coats sanding between coats/ and im sure 2 finnish coats so maybe 10 total to have a very resistent paintjob
take a look at bellas arcade for paint top tips
and great work bud keep it up

[walterg74]

lol what He said
Painting go with foam roller and a small hard sponge possibly small brush for edges and such
Remember when painting that its better to do many thin coats than few thick coats thinner coats are easier to maintain inbetween for sanding and evening out and take a lot less time between coats to dry
ide suggest 10 coats minimum
1 primer/ 2 undercoat /5 main coats sanding between coats/ and im sure 2 finnish coats so maybe 10 total to have a very resistent paintjob
take a look at bellas arcade for paint top tips
and great work bud keep it up

Wow...  TEN coats???  you sure about that? Saint's book mentions 2, possibly 3 but you say TEN?? Isn't that a bit like overkill for this..?

Besides that, are the grits I mentioned ok?

[walterg74]

Allright, so while I wait to be lucky enough to get more answers let's continue...

Got one of those design just to try a mockup. I found this:



So I said to myself, "Ok, Just DO IT..."  

Pierced the center holes of the mold, drew some circles with the compass and cut out the holes:



An installed the buttons and placed the controls:



Ok, so what do we do from here..?  On one hand, looks a bit barren (and actualy size will be even like 2/3 cm wider than this still).

On the other, have room to rest hands/palms (that joystick has to go a bit more to the right anyway, since I don't have enough space for my hand, being a lefty...).

Maybe the layout is ok and will look better once it also has some nive artwork?

The other buttons I was thinking of putting on the front ar the coin button which would also be coin 2 with the shift key and the pause button which would also be the exit/esc button with the shift key (and this last thin would also avoid accidentally exiting a game).

Any other buttons you may think I need or would be nice to have..?

One last think I just thought of... I first said to myself "6 buttons is more than enough, don't need more", but now I'm thinking... "Ok, so I'm making this a Vertical cab... how many vertical games actually use six buttons..?"

I actually made a list a few days ago of all the vertical games I liked, and all the horizontal games I liked (yes, I scanned the entire game list..  ) so I think I'm gonna go back to the list and check what is exactly the maximum number of buttons my vertical games on the list use... (Might even think of redesiging to have only 3 buttons on the CP, who knows...)

 

[walterg74]

One more, since I think it was @Le Chuck that asked about the controls to know how to best mount them...

They're these:





 

[jammin0]

The tip you got to decase the monitor meant to take off the back plastic case as well.  Without the front LCD bezel in place the back plastic isn't doing much.  Route out a rabbet or rebate or whatever it's called into the back of a piece of mdf to create your bezel.  Then is clips or straps from the backside to hold the monitor securely to the wood.

[walterg74]

The tip you got to decase the monitor meant to take off the back plastic case as well.  Without the front LCD bezel in place the back plastic isn't doing much.  Route out a rabbet or rebate or whatever it's called into the back of a piece of mdf to create your bezel.  Then is clips or straps from the backside to hold the monitor securely to the wood.

Hi jammin0, thanks for helping out!!

Sorry but I don't follow... I actually did take the front and back of the casing (doesn't it show in the pics?).

So what you're saying is to get a piece of mdf and to cut a hole in it that is just big enough for the back part of the monitor to go through and then fasten it with straps? Or is there something I didn't understand?

Thanks!!!

 

[jammin0]

Sorry, I'm probably not explaining it very well.  I did notice that took off the whole case, it must have misread that you were going to try and cutoff that extension that was there for the stand in order to keep the casing on it still.  A pictures worth 1000 words so this is what I'm saying.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=118927.0

I did something similar with a 23" LCD and it came out super sturdy.  Sometimes the control board and powersupply are kind of loose without the case, I JB Welded that part to the back of the panel and then secured.  If you have a tight recess that it fits into you really just have to secure it from falling out of the bezel.  Vertical weight is supported by the wood.

[Ond]

10 coats of paint is probably overkill  .  I've copied over some notes from my project thread on my painting method which got me to here:



"    Surface preparation – my goal is to prep any surface regardless of what the material is, MDF, plywood, aluminium, plastic etc to the same pre-prepared state.  That means all pits, grain, bumps GONE.  For this I use Bondo & automotive single pack putty & primer.  Several coats with sanding in between are needed to achieve the prepared  surface finish.  There are various primers available, cheaper household primers will not get the same finish.  I know, I’ve tried.  Where a mirror finish is concerned, automotive products in general (which are more expensive) are what I recommend.  Now I’m not saying you can’t get good results with cheaper household type products but the quality of products you use does make a difference including how hard it dries and how fine and evenly it sprays from the rattle can or spray gun.

Multiple coats – I’ve found you need at least 3 coats of primer and 3 of paint (preferably 4) to get the desired results including colour depth etc.
 
Eliminate orange peel - not just minimize it, eliminate it completely.  With quality paint, each sanded coat becomes finer and finer as far as the peel effect goes, this is also helped by spray technique.  When spraying, the rule is, spray several light coats as many folk advise (with a short break between each) – except your final pass, make that a little heavier, good paint will settle to a very smooth finish if a slightly heavier final pass is applied.

Allow plenty of drying time - why doesn’t Ond post an update?? – cos I’m sitting around waiting for paint to dry properly!  OK lame excuse (there’s always something you can progress on your cab given you have the time).  Give the paint at least 3 days preferably 5 to dry.   It makes a difference in the next steps.

Sanding -whether you are working on either the primer refining stages or paint refining stages wet sanding is the way to go.  The mechanical action of wet sanding with regular dips in the water with the paper and surface wipe with damp cloth give the best results.  I spend about an hour on any single surface working through grades of paper but I never go beyond 600 grit between coats of paint.  600 grit produces the right surface for paint to adhere to.

Final Finish - this is where the magic happens assuming the proper preparation has gone before it.  So you’ve got your final paint coat to a fine finish using 600 grit wet sanding.  The surface now has a dull kind of plastic look but is entirely peel free.  I work through the next grades perhaps 30 mins on each of 800 then 1200 (you can skip straight to 1200 if you want) and then 2000 grit wet sand.  Now the surface is shiny, it’s nice but under good light swirl scratches are evident.  Medium grade cut and polish compound applied with a soft rag ( I like to use old towels )is next.  Spend about 20 mins doing that and wipe it all away with another clean rag.  Now you have an impressive shiny surface with only the finest swirl marks visible under good light.  If there’s any peel visible YOURE OUTTA THERE, go back to sanding with 600 until it’s gone.
 
Now it’s time for auto finish swirl remover, apply the liquid with a soft cloth – spend about 30 mins on this at least.  Buff clean.  The Grail is in sight, are we there yet?  No.  Finally take a lamb’s wool buffer on a mechanical buffer and buff lightly all over.  Lightly because too much pressure and you can cut through the paint and cause a burn mark which in my case ends up in a screaming fit which sets the neighbourhood dogs barking and startles the neighbours. Did you buff lightly? Then you are there, you’ve reached paint gloss finish nirvana, congratulations! "

There are also some discussion between javeryh (the guy that did Bella's Arcade) and myself about my surface prep and painting here.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=88912.msg1252162#msg1252162

 

Ond

[walterg74]

Sorry, I'm probably not explaining it very well.  I did notice that took off the whole case, it must have misread that you were going to try and cutoff that extension that was there for the stand in order to keep the casing on it still.  A pictures worth 1000 words so this is what I'm saying.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=118927.0

I did something similar with a 23" LCD and it came out super sturdy.  Sometimes the control board and powersupply are kind of loose without the case, I JB Welded that part to the back of the panel and then secured.  If you have a tight recess that it fits into you really just have to secure it from falling out of the bezel.  Vertical weight is supported by the wood.

Ahh gotcha...  This actually was what I was thinking from your previous post, with the exception of how you prevent it from falling back. So the wood bezel itself keeps it from going forward, and those strips you screw on from going back.... Yes, this would be an alternative, and I guess if I do this, I can also make it the right size to get a nice dark surrounding...
You did not get it wrong though, my intentio WAS to cut off that extra piece that is for the stand and keep the casing. That way, I could just follow the original design and secure the monitor to the mdf board with the 4 screws for the VESA mount...

[Le Chuck]

I see what you're saying about the back panel.  Now that you can move the control board out of the way I'd just chop off the stand that hangs off the bottom then reassemble since you were doing a vesa mount.  You won't see the cut piece and it won't do any damage to the fuction and installation of the monitor. 

If you're feeling froggy make an MDF bezel but it isn't necessary, I say chop it. 

CP layout looks good, I recommend playing with it on a variety of games and I also recommend having more space round the joystick than around the last buttons so if you have the room shift right some.  Also putting P1 and P2 side by side along the top will allow you to center a bit better.  You have plenty of room tho so find something comfortable. 

I would bottom mount those joys.  You can drill your center hole then take the mounting plate off and use that to template the area to round in a bit, tho with only 15mm MDF you probably wouldn't need to route in much to get good standoff for your bat height. 

Most I've ever done is 5 coats with primer (I can't bring my self to triple coat primer) and I've had some pretty good success with my paint finishes but too each their own.  Follow OND's advice is the best advice I can give. 

[AlienInferno]

Just found this thread.  Good build so far.  It makes me want to start building a cab all over again, and I'm not even finished with my first.  I found the most enjoyment from building the major components of the cab.  It's just cool seeing it take shape and know that you are the one that built it.

[walterg74]

 this definitely goes into my notes book

10 coats of paint is probably overkill  .  I've copied over some notes from my project thread on my painting method which got me to here:



"    Surface preparation – my goal is to prep any surface regardless of what the material is, MDF, plywood, aluminium, plastic etc to the same pre-prepared state.  That means all pits, grain, bumps GONE.  For this I use Bondo & automotive single pack putty & primer.  Several coats with sanding in between are needed to achieve the prepared  surface finish.  There are various primers available, cheaper household primers will not get the same finish.  I know, I’ve tried.  Where a mirror finish is concerned, automotive products in general (which are more expensive) are what I recommend.  Now I’m not saying you can’t get good results with cheaper household type products but the quality of products you use does make a difference including how hard it dries and how fine and evenly it sprays from the rattle can or spray gun.

Multiple coats – I’ve found you need at least 3 coats of primer and 3 of paint (preferably 4) to get the desired results including colour depth etc.
 
Eliminate orange peel - not just minimize it, eliminate it completely.  With quality paint, each sanded coat becomes finer and finer as far as the peel effect goes, this is also helped by spray technique.  When spraying, the rule is, spray several light coats as many folk advise (with a short break between each) – except your final pass, make that a little heavier, good paint will settle to a very smooth finish if a slightly heavier final pass is applied.

Allow plenty of drying time - why doesn’t Ond post an update?? – cos I’m sitting around waiting for paint to dry properly!  OK lame excuse (there’s always something you can progress on your cab given you have the time).  Give the paint at least 3 days preferably 5 to dry.   It makes a difference in the next steps.

Sanding -whether you are working on either the primer refining stages or paint refining stages wet sanding is the way to go.  The mechanical action of wet sanding with regular dips in the water with the paper and surface wipe with damp cloth give the best results.  I spend about an hour on any single surface working through grades of paper but I never go beyond 600 grit between coats of paint.  600 grit produces the right surface for paint to adhere to.

Final Finish - this is where the magic happens assuming the proper preparation has gone before it.  So you’ve got your final paint coat to a fine finish using 600 grit wet sanding.  The surface now has a dull kind of plastic look but is entirely peel free.  I work through the next grades perhaps 30 mins on each of 800 then 1200 (you can skip straight to 1200 if you want) and then 2000 grit wet sand.  Now the surface is shiny, it’s nice but under good light swirl scratches are evident.  Medium grade cut and polish compound applied with a soft rag ( I like to use old towels )is next.  Spend about 20 mins doing that and wipe it all away with another clean rag.  Now you have an impressive shiny surface with only the finest swirl marks visible under good light.  If there’s any peel visible YOURE OUTTA THERE, go back to sanding with 600 until it’s gone.
 
Now it’s time for auto finish swirl remover, apply the liquid with a soft cloth – spend about 30 mins on this at least.  Buff clean.  The Grail is in sight, are we there yet?  No.  Finally take a lamb’s wool buffer on a mechanical buffer and buff lightly all over.  Lightly because too much pressure and you can cut through the paint and cause a burn mark which in my case ends up in a screaming fit which sets the neighbourhood dogs barking and startles the neighbours. Did you buff lightly? Then you are there, you’ve reached paint gloss finish nirvana, congratulations! "

There are also some discussion between javeryh (the guy that did Bella's Arcade) and myself about my surface prep and painting here.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=88912.msg1252162#msg1252162

 

Ond

Ok.. come on... Admit it man... you're pullin my leg.... THAT on the picture sir, is a piece of plastic!!! 

Seriously though, VERY good tips, and this DEFINITELY will go into my notes book...!

For this particular project though, I'm not aiming for such a finish, and I in fact want a nice matte finish, or semi-gloss, not really glossy and shiny. But I wil definitely consider this for a following project (yeah.. I 've been warned this gets addictive..  ) So thanks again for pointing this out to me, these steps are priceless

 

[walterg74]

I see what you're saying about the back panel.  Now that you can move the control board out of the way I'd just chop off the stand that hangs off the bottom then reassemble since you were doing a vesa mount.  You won't see the cut piece and it won't do any damage to the fuction and installation of the monitor. 

If you're feeling froggy make an MDF bezel but it isn't necessary, I say chop it. 

CP layout looks good, I recommend playing with it on a variety of games and I also recommend having more space round the joystick than around the last buttons so if you have the room shift right some.  Also putting P1 and P2 side by side along the top will allow you to center a bit better.  You have plenty of room tho so find something comfortable. 

I would bottom mount those joys.  You can drill your center hole then take the mounting plate off and use that to template the area to round in a bit, tho with only 15mm MDF you probably wouldn't need to route in much to get good standoff for your bat height. 

Most I've ever done is 5 coats with primer (I can't bring my self to triple coat primer) and I've had some pretty good success with my paint finishes but too each their own.  Follow OND's advice is the best advice I can give. 

Yeah.. I'l think about it and decide... The only con of chopping it off, is that later this monitor is only good for either another cab or something, as I can't re-assemble it.  cons of the bezel is the work of course... So, we'l see...
For the CP, definitely need a bit more space around thejoystick (on the left since I'm a lefty) but also like I said since the cardboard was even a few cm shorter, I have some space to play around with. I kinda didn't like the P1 P2 along the to in the designs I've seen specially cause a) it would take vertical space I might be more confortable with for my palms, and b)looked kinda of for my little not-too-many-elements CP... but we'll see, it's just a question of playing around with it a bit more during this week that I have to do the filling, sanding, etc. anyway
also good idea about taking of the mounting plate as a template, hadn't thought of that! Bottom mounting is what I had though of first, so good all I have to do now is see how exatcly to route that (what bit, method, etc.)

For paining, so you say you've never done more than 5 coats, and can't bring yourself to triple prime, so that means your standard is 2 primer coats and 3 paint coats, correct?

Ok, lots of good info!! I guess now it's decide on the CP, cut it, prepare prime paint, so let's see how all this goes... 

thanks for the continous support!!!

 

[walterg74]

Just found this thread.  Good build so far.  It makes me want to start building a cab all over again, and I'm not even finished with my first.  I found the most enjoyment from building the major components of the cab.  It's just cool seeing it take shape and know that you are the one that built it.

Thanks!

Yeah, definitely cool watching it take shape like you say 

[walterg74]

Ok, so here's another news flash while I wait for the putty to dry (and which I'll probably have to redo as I didn't know exactly how to apply and went about doing willy nilly...  )

Just looked at my list of favourite vertical games, but not only that, I also looked at the entire list on KLOV, and it seems that you can count the vertical games with 4 or more buttons with your fingers only... Really few and most are obscure ones! In fact the only ones I liked were Toobin' with 5 buttons (and no joy) and Vanguard with 4 buttons...

So I'm starting to re-think this and wonder why do I want to waste 3 buttons that will never get used... I might as well just use a 3 button design, right?

Eeven 3 buttons are few, but several I like at least, and most are just 2 and 1 button...

Would you guys agree?

 

[MaxVolume]

So I'm starting to re-think this and wonder why do I want to waste 3 buttons that will never get used... I might as well just use a 3 button design, right?

Well, yes and no... mostly yes, though.  As the guy who runs the CrapMAME page says repeatedly, MAME is so configurable there's no real need to include a multitude of buttons.  Of course he's mostly talking about admin buttons, but it's a good point in general.  I'll go ahead and say what others are probably thinking and may end up posting before I even finish typing... buttons are dirt cheap, and it's easier to include enough buttons in the first place than it'll be to add them later.  With that said, if you're absolutely sure all the games you want to play don't use more than 3 buttons, you can definitely limit yourself to that.  However, there's always the possibility that a new game will be upgraded to "working" status in MAME that you had forgot about and it really needs more buttons, or you might simply change your mind about certain games.

Personally, I've played a lot more console games than arcade games, but as I've learned more about the actual machines ("Asteroids only used buttons?") I've started to see how the consoles "cheat" in order to use one single controller and a limited number of buttons to play games that originally had more than that.  Obviously now there are gamepads with over a dozen buttons each, but back in the day developers had to contend with having only two or three, and sometimes even just ONE button (ATARI 2600, anyone?).  Given your example of Toobin', you can duplicate the functions of those buttons with the joystick and your existing buttons.  One of them is just START, so that can be your normal 1P/2P start buttons.  Unfortunately the other four aren't as simple as up/down/left/right, but again MAME can be configured to give you the same result with the joystick.  I'd advise against making up/left be the upper-left paddle button, etc. since you might develop carpal tunnel syndrome going back and forth so many times.  What I would do is to make LEFT+button1 be "paddle up/left", RIGHT+button2 can be "paddle down/right", etc.  That way all you have to do is retrain yourself to play by moving the joystick in the direction you want to go (should be natural anyway), and hit either button 1 or button 2 depending on whether you want to go up or down.  This is very similar to some early fighters, where you move the stick to indicate a high or low punch/kick and then push the punch or kick button rather than having a dedicated button for each punch/kick type, which became the standard later.  Yes, it's going to seem a bit weird if you played the game in arcades for years and have perfected your button-mashing technique, but no MAME cabinet's control panel is going to be arcade-perfect for every game, and the ones that are intended to be end up littered with controls that are rarely used and largely redundant.

If anyone ever asked me why I don't have a 4-way joystick on my current project, I'd tell them the same thing.  First of all, the vast majority of games like PAC-MAN, Donkey Kong, TRON, etc. that really need a 4-way are covered by my cocktail table, which does have 4-way sticks.  Also, games like Wizard of Wor, etc. that will be on the current one have been played on consoles for years with 8-way joysticks.  I'll concede that "I can't go left" was a common complaint among casual gamers back in the day because they were actually moving up/left, but if you're precise enough in your movement of the stick, you'll be pressing LEFT most of the time, and if you slip into up/left for a millisecond or two, it shouldn't make much of a difference.  I also only have three buttons on my cocktail, because it had two when I bought it and I uncovered a third smaller hole upon removing the CPOs into which I installed a Sanwa button (actually, maybe a Seimitsu now that I think about it).  Anyway, as it turns out, that third button is almost never used because the vertical 4-way games I have on that cab generally max out at 2 buttons.  I actually use it to switch between game lists, so it doesn't go to waste at all.

The point of all this is that you do have to make sure you have an adequate number of buttons, but as long as you've carefully researched your needs, you can certainly stop when you think you have enough.  I don't know if you've got far enough to be considering admin buttons, but I'll leave you with one piece of advice that I don't think a lot of builders realize:  the game is NOT running when you see your front-end.  That means that all those buttons that are normally assigned to punch/kick, etc. are FREE to use when the menu is showing.  Now of course you don't want to make "high kick" your pause button as well, but with some careful planning, you can assign a combination that won't be pressed accidentally during gameplay.  I have discrete START and EXIT buttons on my cocktail cabinet simply because the panels had holes available for them and I felt there was no point in putting both start buttons on each panel.  With the current project (a mini-upright), I basically rushed the control panel design because it ended up being done by someone else and I needed to get them a set of plans to work from.  That turned out to be a GREAT idea, but I didn't have time to add any extra buttons, and now that it's built I don't think I would have had room for any.  I saw that a lot of people used 1P START + 2P START as pause, but I'm using that as exit since there's no separate button... pause will be some other combo.  Also, I never like putting a "coin" button on any of my cabinets.  It's just so easy to assign a combo in MAME that I can simply tell people about when they come over to play my cabinets instead of advertising it on the control panel or instruction card.  I get that things like "TAB" can't really be assigned to a gameplay button, but again you can create some sort of combo if necessary.  Since it's not a frequently-used key, it's usually better to just have a wireless keyboard handy, but it doesn't necessarily have to be stored inside the cabinet (and don't even get me started on keyboard drawers ).  I was lucky enough to find a wireless keypad that actually had TAB on it (surprisingly, most of them don't) for my cocktail table, but for some reason a lot of the other keys aren't recognized properly by MAME.

Anyway, I hope you got something out of all my ramblings.

[the_gamer]

I really appreciate this thread. Thanks walterg74. I want to build a cab soon and i got a lot of useful tips out of this!

(and don't even get me started on keyboard drawers )

Please do. I don't know what speaks against them and i really would like to know

[walterg74]

Well, yes and no... mostly yes, though.  As the guy who runs the CrapMAME page says repeatedly, MAME is so configurable there's no real need to include a multitude of buttons.  Of course he's mostly talking about admin buttons, but it's a good point in general.  I'll go ahead and say what others are probably thinking and may end up posting before I even finish typing... buttons are dirt cheap, and it's easier to include enough buttons in the first place than it'll be to add them later.  With that said, if you're absolutely sure all the games you want to play don't use more than 3 buttons, you can definitely limit yourself to that.  However, there's always the possibility that a new game will be upgraded to "working" status in MAME that you had forgot about and it really needs more buttons, or you might simply change your mind about certain games.
.
.
.
.

wow... you won the longest post!!!  

Seriously though, yeah, those are all the things I'm considering...

As this is my first cab, and will just remain like that, as a vertical one, and Like I said, all the games I want don't use more than 3 buttons (except the 2 I mentioned which are not really favourites anyway), I might just leave 3.

I later plan on doing a full size one, and yes, that one will have more buttons.

Regarding the admin functions, while I do know about the shift buttons and the like, I believe that for a cabinet as simple as this, I first thought the difference between having FOUR buttons (P1 coin, P2 coin, P1 start, P2 start) and having THREE (since I don't have two but need one for the shift button) didn't justify using it, and it looked cleaner that wat.
But I guess I prefer having that to avoid hitting exit by accident and my prefernece up to now is to have a "coin" button and a "pause" button, which will be P! coin and pause as-is, and P2 coin and exit with the shift. (I still like having both P1 and P2 start buttons though.

So yeah, it's all preference, and I guess I can do a mockup and see how it looks and then decide, but maybe 3 buttons with nice artwork is more than enough.

I'll post some stuff as I can create it.

don't have a single clue as to how I'll design the artwork for this (don't want any characters or the like on this CP, just abstract/colors/shapes surrounding the control/buttons.

 

Edit: little note, it's not just the games I liek that don't use that many buttons. If you go to KLOV, and do a search, you'll find less than a dozen vertical games with more than 3 buttons (and most of them are obscure titles)

[walterg74]

I really appreciate this thread. Thanks walterg74. I want to build a cab soon and i got a lot of useful tips out of this!

(and don't even get me started on keyboard drawers )

Please do. I don't know what speaks against them and i really would like to know

No problem, I think it helps noobs like myself, and to record my progress while collecting lots os usefull tips from the experts at the same time!

I'd like to know about the drawers too... I personally don't care for them. I think they take additional work for no benefit, as to me, they take away from the arcade experience, no matter how well hidden they are. I preffer a back panel/door to service the system from, and just leave the front/sides/whatever intact. 

but that's just my personal taste. 

[Vidiot]

I really appreciate this thread. Thanks walterg74. I want to build a cab soon and i got a lot of useful tips out of this!

(and don't even get me started on keyboard drawers )

Please do. I don't know what speaks against them and i really would like to know

No problem, I think it helps noobs like myself, and to record my progress while collecting lots os usefull tips from the experts at the same time!

I'd like to know about the drawers too... I personally don't care for them. I think they take additional work for no benefit, as to me, they take away from the arcade experience, no matter how well hidden they are. I preffer a back panel/door to service the system from, and just leave the front/sides/whatever intact. 

but that's just my personal taste. 

I have to agree with this as well. I dunno why but those keyboard drawers just seem wrong somehow. lol

[jammin0]

you can get a mini bluetooth keyboard w/trackpad for $20-30.  There are also a bazillion VNC type apps where you can use your smartphone or iPad as a keyboard and mouse if you need to do admin type things.

I understand using a keyboard tray 5-10 years ago but doesn't seem necessary anymore.

[MaxVolume]

wow... you won the longest post!!!  

Edit: little note, it's not just the games I liek that don't use that many buttons. If you go to KLOV, and do a search, you'll find less than a dozen vertical games with more than 3 buttons (and most of them are obscure titles)

Dude, next time I'll just answer "Yes and no... mostly yes, though" and leave you to figure out what I meant.

As for the number of buttons vertical games have, a lot of "bullet hell" shooters are vertical, and not having access to KLOV at work, I didn't know whether some of them might have more than three.  Didn't seem likely, so it's not surprising that it is in fact the case.

I'm a little confused when you talk about "obscure titles".  I sort of thought that one of the chief reasons we build MAME cabs was because some little gem we found through MAME wasn't available on "1001 Greatest Arcade Hits Ever" for the PC/PS2/PS3/360/Wii/etc. or on those 60-in-1 boards that claim to have every game "anybody would really want to play".  Granted, I didn't play a lot of arcade games as a kid, but there are a lot of games that I never would have known about if it weren't for MAME, and I don't think I'm alone in that.

I'm not really sure you got my point about MAME's configurability, though.  You don't need a dedicated "SHIFT" button... it doesn't need to be mapped to the "SHIFT" key to generate a different keypress, and it doesn't have to be the button wired as your I-PAC shift button.  I actually need to download the MiniPAC programming utility to turn off the shifting function on my cocktail cab anyway.  You can assign any button to cause P1 start to pause and P2 start to exit, and it will work flawlessly until you hold it down and press one of the start buttons.  All you have to do is make PAUSE = button x AND P1 start and EXIT = button x AND P2 start in your MAME settings.  As much experience as gamers have with combos, it seems really odd that they don't understand that you don't need a single dedicated button for every function.

I'll address keyboard drawers in another post... this one is probably too long already. 

[MaxVolume]

I really appreciate this thread. Thanks walterg74. I want to build a cab soon and i got a lot of useful tips out of this!

(and don't even get me started on keyboard drawers )

Please do. I don't know what speaks against them and i really would like to know

Since it's not as obvious as I thought... it's just like Walter says, they detract from the arcade experience, which is the whole reason behind building a MAME machine to begin with.  Maybe at one time they were necessary, but wireless keyboards have become so cheap and compact, I don't see any reason why someone needs a mouse and keyboard hiding inside their MAME cabinet.  I've already said that my first attempt at SUPER GAMES MUSEUM was thwarted by my internet computer dying so I had to pull the mobo, but prices have come down so much that nobody should need (or even want) to surf the 'net on their MAME cabinet.  Not very ergonomic, just for starters.

Anyway, there wasn't any great dark secret behind my loathing of keyboard drawers on MAME cabs, just that they fly in the face of the very motivation to build such a thing.  I feel the same way about spending time, money and energy building a huge cabinet and then the computer's still in its case sitting next to the thing in plain view.  Again, I am being a bit lazy and using a complete PC in the case (including floppy and DVD-ROM drives that I don't need) in the FLYNN'S cab, but it's a mini-desktop that not only fits the footprint of the cab perfectly, it's also a heavy-as-all-hell IBM ThinkCentre case that adds some nice authentic-feeling weight to the bottom of the cab, and it's at least going inside the cabinet.

I'll step off the soap box now.   I'll pre-emptively state that I'm not the guy who runs the CrapMAME site, but I swear that guy must be my "brain twin" when I read some of the things he says about those cabs. 

[walterg74]

Dude, next time I'll just answer "Yes and no... mostly yes, though" and leave you to figure out what I meant.

Nahh it was just a joke (hence the laughing guy...) so chill...

I'm a little confused when you talk about "obscure titles".  I sort of thought that one of the chief reasons we build MAME cabs was because some little gem we found through MAME wasn't available on "1001 Greatest Arcade Hits Ever" for the PC/PS2/PS3/360/Wii/etc. or on those 60-in-1 boards that claim to have every game "anybody would really want to play".  Granted, I didn't play a lot of arcade games as a kid, but there are a lot of games that I never would have known about if it weren't for MAME, and I don't think I'm alone in that.

Hmm maybe "obscure" isn't the word, I'll be more literal and say they're mostly unknown piece of crap games, those that are listed and use more than 3-4 buttons... Now is it clear?  

And btw, no, that's not the reason we build MAME cabinets... that may be the reason for the MAME project, but IMHO, the person that buildsa cab does so to actually play their favourite games, and not just accumulate crappy ones (although there are of course exceptions...)

I'm not really sure you got my point about MAME's configurability, though.  You don't need a dedicated "SHIFT" button... it doesn't need to be mapped to the "SHIFT" key to generate a different keypress, and it doesn't have to be the button wired as your I-PAC shift button.  I actually need to download the MiniPAC programming utility to turn off the shifting function on my cocktail cab anyway.  You can assign any button to cause P1 start to pause and P2 start to exit, and it will work flawlessly until you hold it down and press one of the start buttons.  All you have to do is make PAUSE = button x AND P1 start and EXIT = button x AND P2 start in your MAME settings.  As much experience as gamers have with combos, it seems really odd that they don't understand that you don't need a single dedicated button for every function.

Ah.. gotcha... yeah for some reason I kept thinking you need a dedicated shift button/key... In that case, even better, I don;t need that extra clumsy button... We'll see...

 

[walterg74]

Ok, so no updates for a while due to a combo of bad weather, social stuff, etc...

I did manage to learn something: don't go spreading putty/filler willy-nilly for no reason...

Did that this past weekend, (don't know why) and found myself with a lot of filler in places that didn't need it at all...

So I spent the time sanding it all away practically, leaving only in the screw holes area, and in the part where the top panel joins the angled top panel, like so:









So as you can see, besides putting excess filler (gone in the pics above), seems in the places it DID have to go it was not applied 100% correctly, since I was left with tiny holes still...

so I have just applied more filler (more discretely this time.. ) and left it like this now...







So now I guess I have to wait for it to dry, sand off the excess and see if this time it's ok

After that, I need to finalize the choice for bezel vs mount, and cut the ctrol panel already!

Speaking of that.. for someone who did it already, do you use the router for the joystick? (if you want to bottom mount it)

And then.. sand and finally start painting please!!!

Sadly I will be delayed about 1 month, since I'm leaving for Europe for work for 2 weeks this saturday, and then I'm taking vacation for another 2 weeks, so mixed bag of joy for vacation time (woo hoo!  ) and sad to have to make a pause in finishing the cab...

Hopefully I'll still be able to come around and read posts and post back!

So 'til next time!!

[MaxVolume]

Dude, next time I'll just answer "Yes and no... mostly yes, though" and leave you to figure out what I meant.

Nahh it was just a joke (hence the laughing guy...) so chill...

No biggie... didn't wanna come off as too harsh there, it just bugs me when people complain about long posts, e-mails, etc. but when someone is "concise" the message doesn't get across.

I know there are a LOT of truly crappy games in MAME (500 flavors of nudie mahjong, anyone?), but there are some real gems that most people would probably consider "crap" just because they've never heard of them.  Don't know specifically which ones you were talking about, but I just had to make the point that even with the ever-expanding catalog of games that have been released on compilations, Xbox Live or Virtual Console, there are still some very obscure but very good games you'll only be able to play via MAME.  Even prototypes like Freeze are often particularly entertaining.  Just like there's more to '80s music than the #1 hits, if you're gonna go so far as to build a MAME cabinet, it doesn't really make sense to only include games that have already been released for every home computer, console and cellphone known to man.

As for the shift button, nope, you don't need that.

[walterg74]

Iiiiiiiii'm back!!!   


Ok, so not abandonded or anything but rather a combo between my trip to Europe taking a month in total, plus the fact that when I got back we have had the longest month with rains ever, meaning I couldn't work on this on weekends because of course it was raining...

But anyway, got some progres and some tools/pics to share with my fellow noobs, so coming right up! Hang on....

[walterg74]

Great... I just type in a big ass post and something got screwed up, login dissapeared and I got a "not authorized" error and LOST my text, damnit 

Don't feel like re-writing everything right now, so I'll be back in a while later today. Sorry

[walterg74]

Ok, here we go again... trying to remember wtf I wrote.... 

Starting off with a post for the noobs like myself, who may not have seen some of these (as I myself hadn't).

Last we left off, I had gone off to Europe which, in what concerns the cab project, was also good since I was able to get my hands on some tools which I had bought in the US and that a colleague of mine brought over for me 

One thing I was lacking, as you may recall, were the countersink bits or the all in one drill+countersink, since they don't sell them in my country. For my fellow noobs, these are the ones:



These look really cool and much nice than just screwing around  Still, you only wanna use them where applicable and looks nice, no point in just using them willy nilly....

Next items I got which I was lacking (and that is also not available in this pos country I live in) were the slot cutting bits for t-molding. Granted, this small cabinet will not use t-molding, but hey, I gotta be prepared for when I start building the big ass cab, right? Might as well get it now.. 

These are the ones:





I got the "standard" 1/16" regularly used, and also one size bigger (I believe it's 3/32" or something like that) in case it's useful for any other project I might get into...

Lastly,  I also got a couple of more bits, that are called "roundnose" bits, and the idea was to get the type of rounded finish on the wood that Koenig had gotten with his milling machine. These are the ones:



In reality, I have already assembled mine, and I'm not gonna go around screwing with it just to try this, but I'll definitely be trying out how these work on some pieces of scrap wood (and also how they're limited since they don't have bearings and the like and don't know how exactly you avoid cutting up your precious piece of wood all over the place...

Ok, so that concludes my little woodworking/tools basics noob-2-noobs, hope you all got a glimpse of some of these tools and get familiar with them now.

I'll continue this with a new post resuming the actual WORK now

Later! 

[walterg74]

Ok, back to work....

Last I left off, I was in the middle of the dilema of making a harness for the monitor, or chopping off the extra plastic....

After thinking about it some, I decided I wasn't gonna use the monitor in anything else but a cab, and so chose the "chop off" option. Here is what
I was left with:



The panel for holding this I had already made, and I went ahead and used the newly acquired drill bits for the vesa mounting. Here it is front and back:





Oh yeah.. one post pack I said don't use if not needed didn't I....? Well I had to try it... 

Anyway, here it is fastened to the monitor through the 4 vesa mounting screws:





Vertical is what I was going for so....



So everything perfect right? Well, not quite... seems when I went to fit it into the cab, the two side strips that this plaque rests on were not 100% lined up....



Nothing major, but still needed fixing... Took a little from the bottom left and top right of the monitor-supporting plaque, and voila!





That'll do...

Coming up next, control panel time! See ya then! 

[walterg74]

Ok, control panel...

One thing that worried me, was that the edge of the control panel facing the player, and the front little panel of the cab that also faced the player, both had straight cuts.... Ugly, dangerous, you name it...

I decided to try out a little rounding bit on some scrap wood, until I got something I like, then risked it on the control panel piece...   Here's what I got:





Not bad... now the edge won't cut into my wrist/forearm, which is no small thing... 

Oh, btw, that "difference"/ridge you see on the side totally dissapeared with some light/really quick 30 seconds of sanding.

Next thing that puzzled me, looking at Koenig's design was: "how the hell does the plexiglass get support?"  There's no tabs, nothing I can see, etc... So wtf???

I decided what I was gonna do is have it wrest on the control panel itself. Plexi's supposed to be 3mm thick, so I used yet another router bit (getting to love these...) to have a little cut along the edge that is 3mm thick for the plexi to rest on, and that from the edge was about the same (don't remember now if 3mm or 4mm, something like that) with the idea that the plexi rests there. Enough for it not to fall through but not that much that it will be ugly...
Hope you can see it on the picture:



No?

How about now?





Better? Good 

Here's a loose placement on the cab to show how it goes:



Next up, part II of what I have so far of the CP! 

[walterg74]

Let's not lose momentum or the next post will be in another month... 

Continuing with the CP, decided to continue with the same printout I had used for the shoebox mockup.... Just went for it and marked the centers with a pencil, got this:



But of course there's always a problem... 

For the holes, I was using those spade bits or whatever they're called that Koening had used, but for the buttons, you need either 28mm or 30mm, and I only had 20mm and 25mm, and the next size up available in stores was 32mm (button goes right through).

I did have a 30mm *cupsaw* bit, but it was crap! don't know exactly how people use these, but it was all wobbly and the results would have been disastrous, and I certainly didn't wanna mess up my CP piece that I had worked so hard at so far...

What to do?  Oh wait... didn't I just buy a Dremel 4000???  Hell yeah!!!! 

So... did all the holes in 25mm, like so:



Of course, buttons don't fit....





So with my trusty Dremel, and a little sanding drum (Grit 60 I think it is), it was just a matter of sticking the thing in the hole (that's what she said!  ) and just going round and round until the needed size was reached:





Awesome... 

Last thing I did was place the control loosely to trace the metal plaque on the bottom or "inside" of the CP like so:



And that's all I have done so far for the CP, which was this past weekend.

Pending:

- Make the holes on the corners for attaching the CP (with countersink of course )

- Route the control part so that the metal plaque is "lifted" upwards and enough of the actual control peeps through the hole. For this, I bought a routing bit for the dremel, and since I also have the depth cutting guide I ought to be able to do a nice even leveling in.

***** Question for the experts ****: By the way, how much can I "eat off" the wood to allow the control to be raised as much as possible and yet leave enough for the screws to have something to hold on to and be sturdy??? The panel is 15 mm mdf.  *********

Next post, something on the back panel.... brb... 

[walterg74]

Ok, here we go... last project post for today (of actual work...).

Back panel...

I'm going to screw it like Koening did, but I really like the countersink thing, so I went for that in the corners like so:



The idea of ventilation he did I also liked, so I did the same in about the same place, only with 20mm holes instead of his I think it was 24mm. Looked good as far as I see:





Lastly, I also did another button sized hole at thetop left for power on:



Pending:

- Another hole for the female power plug. For this, I go an old PC power supply I will take that part off of (sadly I don't have anyplace I can just buy it separately...).

One thing I *didn't* do, was the big holes for the speakers....   It's not that I don't like how it looks (although for even considering that I'd have to think I'd actually be looking at the BACK of the cab instead of the front playing...  ), but I admit I've been back and forth on it. But the real reason is that he mentions that "a lot of tvs,lcds come with the speakers that way anyway"... I'm sorry but no... just no... That just goes against every sound design guideline I can think of...  Sound's supposed to be directed towards you, not away from you....

I even did a couple of tests with a laptop and a pair of speaker I bought for the cab, trying facing away from me, towards me but covered by the laptop screen, and a little to the side so the sound comes fully towards me, and without a shadow of a doubt, this last one was the best, and the sound seemed to come directly from the screen/game. Really great!

Only problem is I can't pull that off in this cab, just too small.... From behind the monitor but still facing towards the player it was still pretty good and sound seemed to be coming from the screen/game as well, so I think that's what I'm going to try to fit somehow...

These are the speakers by the way:





Nothing fancy but they sound real good and I don't need hundred dollar speakers to play 80's games...  I'll swear by these since the sound they bring out of my childhood favourites had excellent quality and really put me "in the game".

Buttons are blue, speakers were blue (though with my new placement they won't show), that was the idea, and maybe painting the cab black with some blue details and some nice artwork... and by the way, welcome to suggestions as to what you think a nice color or color/combo would be for this... Keep in mind I have those blue buttons, plus the white P1/P2 ones, and the controls are bat tops in black (although I can try to change the tops wich I think I might be able to get here).

Allright, next post regarding advance will be on the weekend I guess, hope to finish up these pending details so I can move on to the paint phase!!!

and speaking of that, I need some advice from the woodwork expertas again if possible, but that's in a small little post by itself coming up so as to not mix it!! 

L8r

[walterg74]

Ok... here's my question for the experts...

Since I hope to take care of the pending details this weekend (including those that you had suggested to "chop off" a little of the front squares so light can bleed through evenly to the marquee), I would (with luck) pass on to the paint phase...

So I know we talked about coats, and sanding, etc. but I just can't grasp how to start...

So can you complete my little mini-step-by-step of how I'd have to do it?

I start with my cab of MDF, so I would:

1) Sand first (?) with xx(?) grit until when? Till it looks smooth and even to me??

2) Put on a coat of primer (any particular color helps for coverage of paint later?) with? (brush/roller)?

3) Repeat one and two above? With a different grit? (which one)

4) Repeat again but instead of primer with the actual paint now? and again, recommended grit and brush or roller for the paint?

Wether brush or roller, any particular type I should ask for so I don't get a cheap-o that'll ruin the finish?

One last question, out of curiosity since I'm just beginning and probably won't try it for now, but it was mentioned that wet sanding was a good (if not the better) option for sanding.... the questions are:

1) You can't do that with an electric sander right? Just manually?

2) Does that apply to MDF too? I though water was a no-no for MDF making it swell up.. (I know wet sanding is not soaking wet, but still...)

Thanks for your help!!! 

Til next week or next replies whatever comes first! (hope it's the replies!!  )

L8r. 

[PL1]

First, start by reading and heeding the wiki and posts by Ond here and here and many others where he shares his wisdom and experience.   

Wether brush or roller, any particular type I should ask for so I don't get a cheap-o that'll ruin the finish?

A foam roller should give you the desired finish, unless you are trying for high gloss.

2) Does that apply to MDF too? I though water was a no-no for MDF making it swell up.. (I know wet sanding is not soaking wet, but still...)

Water directly on bare MDF = bad.

Water on primer = OK.

Don't sand through the primer to bare MDF and you'll be OK.


Scott

[Hockeyboy]

I love how you are going through and explaining and asking at the same time. Gives some of us some hints for potential "gotcha" moments.

Looking very nice so far - keep it up! 

[Le Chuck]

No need to sand the MDF beforehand but since you've filled some screw holes you need to sand those areas with a 200 grit or so to even them out to the same texture as the bare MDF. 

I like rattle can primer, just a preference.  Nice even no-drip coat.  Let dry, sand with 200 to knock the fuzz off, prime again, sand again.  Pick a color.  Rattle can is great, so is brush.  Nice even no-drip coats, let dry and sand with 300, repeat paint, switch to wet sanding and use a higher grit paper.  Lather rinse repeat until you're satisfied or polishing a quarter inch thick layer of paint that looks like glass.  Then, if you really want to get froggy you can start clear coating but again, I never do this on MDF.  I usually stop at 5 coats including 2 of primer. 

[PL1]

No need to sand the MDF beforehand

One very minor quibble with the above.

I agree that there's no need to sand the already smooth MDF (assuming no scratches), but if there is an exposed cut edge that won't get t-molding or a routed/rounded edge there are probably imperfections to sand.

[/nitpicking]


Scott

[walterg74]

First, start by reading and heeding the wiki and posts by Ond here and here and many others where he shares his wisdom and experience.   

Wether brush or roller, any particular type I should ask for so I don't get a cheap-o that'll ruin the finish?

A foam roller should give you the desired finish, unless you are trying for high gloss.

2) Does that apply to MDF too? I though water was a no-no for MDF making it swell up.. (I know wet sanding is not soaking wet, but still...)

Water directly on bare MDF = bad.

Water on primer = OK.

Don't sand through the primer to bare MDF and you'll be OK.


Scott

Wow.. looks like a lot of reading to do! I'd better get on it 

Thanks for the pointers!!

 

[walterg74]

I love how you are going through and explaining and asking at the same time. Gives some of us some hints for potential "gotcha" moments.

Looking very nice so far - keep it up! 

Thanks for the encouragement, I'll try to keep it up!

 

[walterg74]

No need to sand the MDF beforehand but since you've filled some screw holes you need to sand those areas with a 200 grit or so to even them out to the same texture as the bare MDF. 

I like rattle can primer, just a preference.  Nice even no-drip coat.  Let dry, sand with 200 to knock the fuzz off, prime again, sand again.  Pick a color.  Rattle can is great, so is brush.  Nice even no-drip coats, let dry and sand with 300, repeat paint, switch to wet sanding and use a higher grit paper.  Lather rinse repeat until you're satisfied or polishing a quarter inch thick layer of paint that looks like glass.  Then, if you really want to get froggy you can start clear coating but again, I never do this on MDF.  I usually stop at 5 coats including 2 of primer.

Thanks for the great advice! I actually did get a couple more sheets of sandpaper, some for wetsanding, so we'll see how that goes...

I like the idea of the spraycan, but just in case, this is what I can get here, is it ok? (I know one of the pics was for plastics so it's not for this...):







All the same brand, first pic seems to be multisurface, comes in matte or gloss white, and gloss black, second pic sems to be the ones for plastic, and the third *seemed* to be specifically for wood (same brand, different origin, probably brazil), and came in grey and white.

What do you think?  (and how much would I need for this small cab? Is one can enough for the primer?

Thanks!! 

[walterg74]

No need to sand the MDF beforehand

One very minor quibble with the above.

I agree that there's no need to sand the already smooth MDF (assuming no scratches), but if there is an exposed cut edge that won't get t-molding or a routed/rounded edge there are probably imperfections to sand.

[/nitpicking]

Yep, understood... trying to leave those parts (if any) smooth

Thanks!



Scott

[PL1]

FIFY. Those nested quotes can be tricky.

No need to sand the MDF beforehand

One very minor quibble with the above.

I agree that there's no need to sand the already smooth MDF (assuming no scratches), but if there is an exposed cut edge that won't get t-molding or a routed/rounded edge there are probably imperfections to sand.

[/nitpicking]


Scott

Yep, understood... trying to leave those parts (if any) smooth

Thanks!

[walterg74]

FIFY. Those nested quotes can be tricky.

No need to sand the MDF beforehand

One very minor quibble with the above.

I agree that there's no need to sand the already smooth MDF (assuming no scratches), but if there is an exposed cut edge that won't get t-molding or a routed/rounded edge there are probably imperfections to sand.

[/nitpicking]


Scott

Yep, understood... trying to leave those parts (if any) smooth

Thanks!

Tell me about it! 

Fixed

Now about those cans...   

[Le Chuck]

FIFY. Those nested quotes can be tricky.  Especially when they're nested in a quote-like quoting manner in which they are nested in a series of quotes.

No need to sand the MDF beforehand because nested quotes are tricky

One very minor quibble with the above about nested quotes.

I agree that there's no need to sand the already smooth MDF (assuming no scratches), but if there is an exposed cut edge that won't get t-molding or a routed/rounded edge there are probably imperfections to sand and nested quotes.

[/nitpicking] [/nesting] [/quoting in a nesting manner]


Scott

Yep, understood... trying to leave those parts (if any) smooth because they are so totally nested

Thanks!

Tell me about it!      creepy?  I think so, here's a few more   

Fixed

Now about those cans...  and quotes... that are nested.  In a nestedly manner. 

[walterg74]

Especially when they're nested in a quote-like quoting manner in which they are nested in a series of quotes.

because nested quotes are tricky

with the above about nested quotes.

[/quoting in a nesting manner]

because they are so totally nested

   creepy?  I think so, here's a few more   

 and quotes... that are nested.  In a nestedly manner. 

Ok, we got the message... 

Now about those cans...   

[walterg74]

Allright... weekend's here again, and time to do a little work...

Today I did the final tidbits I had pending, basically a hole in the back panel for the power supply connector, the four corner holes to fasten the control panel, reducing a little bit the 4 pieces of wood in the marquee area so that light goes through and I don't get the 4 dark spots (as it had been pointed out to me in a previous post, and the hole to raise the control a little... So I guess most of it was just basic stuff, except the routing for the control, so here are some pics.

Initial "carving", caveman style, with the dremel and a routing bit, pics show progressive butchering  :





Then here is the finished part, where I managed to clean it up a bit (not a lot, definitely not perfect, but it'll do for my first go at this (and you can't see the bottom anyway):





Finally, here I'm trying out how the control fits into it:



That seems to be more than enough.  The control sticks out far enough, and I can't carve out more anyway or there will be too little material left (already it's kinda thin...). I'm left with 6mm MDF, plus the 2mm of the control plate, for a total of 8mm.  Now it's off to the hardware store to get some adequate screws that are just the right length for this... (maybe I'll add some washers, idk... 

So anyway, I guess as far as the building goes, I'm done... I will now move on to the priming/painting phase. Being that I haven't gotten any replies yet to my paint / cans question, I guess I'll give it till tomorrow morning since it's late here anyway, and if I don't get any replies I'll just ask at the store about which of those cans will suit my needs... 

I also cleaned up the cab with some rags, etc. to make sure there's no dust left on it. Here's the "finished" cab ready for priming:







Meanwhile, hoping to get an answer to the paint thing, I leave you with another question...

Since this cabinet will be used for vertical games, most of which are old anyway, and they shouldn't require a "powerhouse" of a machine to run, I will be probably be sticking a relatively old computer in here (if the components fit, which seems a bit complicated but *maybe* doable...), can you recommend a software setup for the computer?  I have this 75MB "tiny xp" version, would that work? And what would you suggets for mame version + frontend?

Hope you enjoy my post, see you all later!

 

[walterg74]

No need to sand the MDF beforehand but since you've filled some screw holes you need to sand those areas with a 200 grit or so to even them out to the same texture as the bare MDF. 

I like rattle can primer, just a preference.  Nice even no-drip coat.  Let dry, sand with 200 to knock the fuzz off, prime again, sand again.  Pick a color.  Rattle can is great, so is brush.  Nice even no-drip coats, let dry and sand with 300, repeat paint, switch to wet sanding and use a higher grit paper.  Lather rinse repeat until you're satisfied or polishing a quarter inch thick layer of paint that looks like glass.  Then, if you really want to get froggy you can start clear coating but again, I never do this on MDF.  I usually stop at 5 coats including 2 of primer.

Ok then, going with your "5 coat standard", and since I have the cab ready, does this sound good?:

1) Apply coat 1 of primer, let it dry
2) Sand with 200 "normal" (orange/red regular sand paper for wood). I assume it's a light sanding, and not a "furious" one, right?
3) Apply coat 2 of primer, let it dry
4) Sand again, once more with 200 in the same fashion
5) Apply coat 1 of paint, and let it dry
6) Sand the first paint coat with 300 "normal" sand paper (so same as the previous paper, just a bit higher grit)
7) Apply coat 2 of paint, let it dry
Sand again but this time wetsanding, with higer grit  (I currently have 400 and 600 for wetsanding)
9) Apply coat 4 of paint
Done? Or something else...?  (except the clear coating which you said you don't do on mdf anyway).

I guess I could either finish at the 3rd coat of paint, or wetsand coat 2 with 400, apply coat 3, wetsand with 600, and apply coat 4... (And still the question would be, after you apply the last coat, do you do something else to it, or that's it?)

Thanks LeChuck!!

[Le Chuck]

If you're going to sand the final coat it'll be like 1200 grit wet sanding but I doubt it will be necessary since the last coat should be pretty light to just even everything out.  That's my experience at least, your mileage may very.  Also, light sanding throughout, you don't want to eat through the layer you just laid.

[walterg74]

If you're going to sand the final coat it'll be like 1200 grit wet sanding but I doubt it will be necessary since the last coat should be pretty light to just even everything out.  That's my experience at least, your mileage may very.  Also, light sanding throughout, you don't want to eat through the layer you just laid.

Ok, cool. Thanks for the quick reply!

I went to the store to get some screws & stuff, and picked up some more sandpaper, 300 & 400 which I was lacking.

Also since nobody commented on the primer I went ahead and bought the gray one shown in the 3d picture. The store guy said they were all pretty much the same, although he didn't seem very knowledgeable...   

Guess weather permitting I'll try to prime tomorrow 

Later! 

[Steven kurylec]

Hi im new to the forum and am really enjoying your project so far! Do it for that noobs haha, i started my forst project a couple of weeks ago so all the questions your asking are really helping me out! (y)

[walterg74]

Hi im new to the forum and am really enjoying your project so far! Do it for that noobs haha, i started my forst project a couple of weeks ago so all the questions your asking are really helping me out! (y)

Thanks, I am glad you enjoy it and hope it's useful for when you do yours!

[walterg74]

Ok, so I just finished the forst coat of primer and letting it dry as I write this...

Didn't go as nice as I wished though, seems I need more experience with the can...

Can't seem to get a nice even coverage without etting some drips, and also if I spray too close of course it drips, and if I go too far it seems that I'm just wasting the whole thing to the air 

Any tips?

[Ond]

Ok, so I just finished the forst coat of primer and letting it dry as I write this...

Didn't go as nice as I wished though, seems I need more experience with the can...

Can't seem to get a nice even coverage without etting some drips, and also if I spray too close of course it drips, and if I go too far it seems that I'm just wasting the whole thing to the air 

Any tips?

Just a few things, to start with, make sure the surface you’re spraying is horizontal if possible, less drips due to gravity.
When starting out with a spray can, controlled bursts with fairly broad sweeping action works well.  Try to stay at about 20cm from the surface.  Hold the can at about a 45 degree angle to the work and sweep in about 30 cm arcs. 

Spray in controlled on-off again spraying sweeps to build up the primer/paint (same rules apply to paint) to a smooth wet surface.  Don't just hold the button down and spray and hope for the best.  Control the paint and watch it build up.  You should spray a few passes, wait a minute, and then repeat.  A regular wipe of the spray nozzle with a rag between passes minimises splattering.

It's better to just cover the work with a few layers, let dry sand lightly and repeat, than go in really thick on a single coat which takes much longer to dry properly.

A lumpy first coat is no big deal, when dry, just sand it back ( I covered all this in the steps previously posted BTW) to a smooth finish.  On flat surfaces use a sanding block to get a really flat finish or a mechanical sander.

200 Grit is a bit coarse, 350 would be better and give you more control over how much you strip back off.  Like I've said before, I work with 600 between layers of primer, that’s regardless of the final finish matt/satin/gloss you are trying to achieve.

With experience with the particular brand of spray can you are using, (they all vary with flow rate and spray quality) you can spray with longer controlled bursts and get a nice even result.  In general cheaper paints tend to apply more coarsely and splattery than quality paints which cost a bit more.  My point being, starting out with quality spray paint at least gives you more predictable, quality consistent results, which helps when learning.

[walterg74]

Just a few things, to start with, make sure the surface you’re spraying is horizontal if possible, less drips due to gravity.
When starting out with a spray can, controlled bursts with fairly broad sweeping action works well.  Try to stay at about 20cm from the surface.  Hold the can at about a 45 degree angle to the work and sweep in about 30 cm arcs. 

Spray in controlled on-off again spraying sweeps to build up the primer/paint (same rules apply to paint) to a smooth wet surface.  Don't just hold the button down and spray and hope for the best.  Control the paint and watch it build up.  You should spray a few passes, wait a minute, and then repeat.  A regular wipe of the spray nozzle with a rag between passes minimises splattering.

It's better to just cover the work with a few layers, let dry sand lightly and repeat, than go in really thick on a single coat which takes much longer to dry properly.

A lumpy first coat is no big deal, when dry, just sand it back ( I covered all this in the steps previously posted BTW) to a smooth finish.  On flat surfaces use a sanding block to get a really flat finish or a mechanical sander.

200 Grit is a bit coarse, 350 would be better and give you more control over how much you strip back off.  Like I've said before, I work with 600 between layers of primer, that’s regardless of the final finish matt/satin/gloss you are trying to achieve.

With experience with the particular brand of spray can you are using, (they all vary with flow rate and spray quality) you can spray with longer controlled bursts and get a nice even result.  In general cheaper paints tend to apply more coarsely and splattery than quality paints which cost a bit more.  My point being, starting out with quality spray paint at least gives you more predictable, quality consistent results, which helps when learning.

Ok, so I started sanding that coat, using a 400 then, and left it pretty smooth.

I then started to put on the second coat, and I wanted to follow your advice on horizontal surfaces, so I just did the CP, the back panel, and one of the sides and the opposite inside of the cabinet laying it on the side.

This is more time consuming as I now have to wait for it to dry (although it's fast drying paint) and then turn it to do the other side, to finally in a third step do the top and other miscellaneous... 

But I guess that will give me a better finish, do you agree? Do you do something like that, or do you use a different method for getting your paint evenly spread and with no dripping or the least possible?

One thing though I of course ran out of paint...  One can is not enough.... So I have to go in a little while to get another to complete the priming.

Now this is not so bad, but it's a small cab... When I do the big one, there's no way I can use spray cans or I'll go broke.... So roller or brush? Pros/cons? Won't the brush leave traces of the bristles?

Ok, I'll write later today when I finish priming and with a few pics if possible.

L8r!! 

[walterg74]

Ok, posting back... 

So went to buy the second can of primer, and just applied it.

This is what the cab looked like after applying the 1st primer coat:



After that I sanded with a 600 grit paper, and then today I just applied the second coat.

This is the cab just primed for the second time and drying:





Here are some pics of the CP also primed twice (lighting's not very good):





This is the first time I do this, so of course it's not perfect, and a drip-drip here, a drip-drip there, but nothing that can't be polished up as we go along with coats I guess, plus the fact I know it won't turn out perfect for my first time, so I'm just trying to do it the best I can, hoping to improve each time.

Regarding the paint, I decided to go along and buy spray cans for this small cab too.

I was about to buy a Krylon can that said "for mdf/melamine", but the store guy said they're the same paint just branded different, so saving 3 bucks (same brand though), and I got this:



The sticker means "semi-gloss". I decided for this since I thought matte was too dull, and glossy was just to bright for my taste, proner to fingerprints, etc...
We'll see how it turns out...

I also learned that hear I'm better off not buying at our local "home depot", since the paint that was $50 (almost $10 us dollars) was $35 (about $7 us dollars) at my friendly neighbourhood paint shop.... Don't know if it's the same in the US regarding stores, but I-d say a 30% difference is worth considering...

Anyway, appreciate any feedback/input, and I guess my next pics will be of the first coat of paint...
 

[walterg74]

Ok, need some help from the pros.... 

While this did not appear when I primed (since it looked amazingly smooth), after I applied the first coat of paint I look at the results, and I clearly see not a smooth surface but some marks below are clearly seen...

No doubt this is due to my poor hand sanding, yes? And I'm looking at the sanding marks?

If so, can you give me some tips to fix this?  should I start with the wet sanding now to make it easier to correct, or is it the same?

Would it help if I just went ahead and used an orbital sander? 

[Ond]

I'm posting a series of video tutorials (3 altogether)  that cover these very questions.  The first one is up in my my project thread now, the next will be later today, in them I'm going from raw plywood to ultra gloss finish, check em out.

[walterg74]

I'm posting a series of video tutorials (3 altogether)  that cover these very questions.  The first one is up in my my project thread now, the next will be later today, in them I'm going from raw plywood to ultra gloss finish, check em out.

And Ond for the save! (as usual...  )

Thanks, I'll check it out before continuing with the rest of the coats!!

[steveh]

Walter, its been great reading your progress.  im about to go read your post on building basics.  I have a cab im working on, and im going to start my own thread soon.  I find this thread extremely helpful helps fill the gaps.  I cant wait to see how this turns out.

As for your question about brush vs rollers.  a high quality roller is the way to go. 

[walterg74]

Walter, its been great reading your progress.  im about to go read your post on building basics.  I have a cab im working on, and im going to start my own thread soon.  I find this thread extremely helpful helps fill the gaps.  I cant wait to see how this turns out.

As for your question about brush vs rollers.  a high quality roller is the way to go.

Thanks Steve! That was the whole point, not only to get tips (which I could asking in any thread) but also to document what I did for others that are new to this like me.

Thanks for the rolle/brush tip, which I will use when I finish this and jump into buildon the "real" normal sized one

Hope to see your thread soon!

 

[Bengaz]

Hi, great progress and good photos.

Im about to start my control panel but have a question.

How are you going to fix/secure the joystick. Thought you would have routered the top of the CP not the bottom, then applied th 2mm cover over that. Your only left with 6mm of MDF to screw to doing it your way which I would have thought would be very inadequate or am I getting it wrong?

Also, how are you going to physically switch the 4/8 way joystick?

[walterg74]

Hi, great progress and good photos.

Im about to start my control panel but have a question.

How are you going to fix/secure the joystick. Thought you would have routered the top of the CP not the bottom, then applied th 2mm cover over that. Your only left with 6mm of MDF to screw to doing it your way which I would have thought would be very inadequate or am I getting it wrong?

Also, how are you going to physically switch the 4/8 way joystick?

Thanks!

Well, there's basically 2 ways, top mount or bottom mount, which is what I was doing, but funny you should mention it because it seems you're rught and I didn't do it correctly, since I am finding that even though I bought short screws, they don't have any "grip" to get a tight hold on this, so now I don't know what to do!!!!

Can someone help/comment on how I could fix this? The only thing I can think of so far is to just encase the damn thin in bondo/putty if that's any good 

Regarding the joystick switch, I don-t plan on switching very often for this cab, so I don't mind if I eventually want to to just open the back cover. For when I build the larger one, I'll propbably get one of those controls that can be switched from the outside, using the control itself.


HELPPPPPP!!!!! 

[PL1]

HELPPPPPP!!!!! 

Ok, first step - What type of joystick are you using?  If it is an LS-32/Zippyy short shaft,  you'll have a lot more trouble trying to undermount than if you have a long shaft version or any of the other sticks designed for use in a wood panel.

To tell which LS-32/Zippyy shaft version you have, measure this way.  The distance from the bottom of the threads to the shoulder of the pivot is ~30mm on the short shaft and ~45mm on the long shaft.  Remove dust washer and balltop to measure.


Scott

[walterg74]

HELPPPPPP!!!!! 

Ok, first step - What type of joystick are you using?  If it is an LS-32/Zippyy short shaft,  you'll have a lot more trouble trying to undermount than if you have a long shaft version or any of the other sticks designed for use in a wood panel.

To tell which LS-32/Zippyy shaft version you have, measure this way.  The distance from the bottom of the threads to the shoulder of the pivot is ~30mm on the short shaft and ~45mm on the long shaft.  Remove dust washer and balltop to measure.


Scott

I scott, thanks for your reply!

I actually posted a pic on page 1, pot 32 I believe, does that help?  Also as you can see on a previous post where i placed a pick of the CP, I already routed outfr om the bottom and thats my problem.  Are those pics enought for younto recommend?

Thanks!! 

[PL1]

I actually posted a pic on page 1, pot 32 I believe, does that help?  Also as you can see on a previous post where i placed a pick of the CP, I already routed outfr om the bottom and thats my problem.

Found them!  Missed them earlier in the pic-alanche.     

Joystick


Routed CP


Looks like the joystick has about 1" from the plate to the battop.

The routed CP looks like you have less than 3/8", which isn't deep enough for the inserts, but there is a way around that.

The attached diagram --not drawn to scale-- shows how you can make a metal support bar(green)and wood block(blue) for under the joystick/mounting plate(gray) and attach it to the underside of the CP(tan) using threaded inserts. (red)  Leave a path for the wires coming out of the microswitch (yellow) as shown unless you can mount the support bar (green) closer to the CP top than the microswitch like in the second attachment.  Can't quite tell how much clearance you have. 

You'll need two of these support bars -- one across the lower right and one across the upper left of this picture.


Scott

[walterg74]

Ok, sorry for the abscence but had a lot of stuff going on, still did several things on the cab, but before that...

@PL1: Scott, thanks a lot for the above! Now let me see if I understand, since this is the last major item I need to fix that's really important...

From the plate, to where the battop starts what you said is about right, it's about 30mm of shaft approximately.

Regarding the metal "bars" tohold everything, do you mean something like this?



That's what I understand the "green" would be.

Now what I don't get is what exactly the threaded inserts are or why I need them...

What I planned to do (if I got your green bar idea correctly), is to get 2 pieces of wood of the size I "ate away" from the control pannel (about 9mm), rectangular shape, and place them over the sides of the metal plate as if filling the hole.
Then get the two metal strips and drill 2 holes on each side, from the control square outwards (the red things in my lame picture touch-up right above), and tighten it to the CP, holding everything in place.

Wouldn't that do? From the top of the CP piece, up to where the microswitch contacs are, I have about a good 15mm, so lots of space to cable it.

Can you share your thoughts or elaborate??

Thanks!! 

[walterg74]

Ok, while I wait for the solution to the Joystick dilemma.... let's continue with some progres...

Last we saw was the priming and about to paint.

So I went on and painted/sanded/painted/sanded, etc... for a total of 3 coats. Results were not the best but for a first time I decided it was acceptable for me and called it a day. The pics are not very good, and it actually looks nicer in person, but here are some anyway without anything added:



For the artwork, at least for now, I just decied to use a multi/character sideart found at the library, and the classic MAME logo.  Had it done at a local place, and this is how it looks so far:





And the marquee...





Then came the monitor, which was silver bezeled but not anymore after removing it and painting it a little black...



And in the cab...



I then tried to see if it was working and all after all my messing around... 



Next, testing MAME just for kicks....

 

[walterg74]

Ok, continuing with the testing, rotating on the laptop to see how the display showed games...



And some side shots...





Ok, so cool But my machine's empty inside... 

So... since this will be running old games, no need for much power, I wanted to use a spare mother/cpu/mem combo I had lying around, but there was a problem... it wouldnot fit! (standard ATX size) so... had to go hunting for one, buy one...

Long story short, I ended up buying this old ITX Pentium 4 combo.  ITX, Pentium 4 2.8Ghz, 1GB RAM.  Not a power house, but for running Ms. Pac-Man and Donkey Kong? No sweat...



With this small size factor PSU to go....




Ok what else...? Ah! I needed something to hold the marquee... Long story short again, I bought a long strip of black angle PVC, which for this short length and the small marquee size is more than enough! Already painted, easy to work and it won't lose the colour... Plus, one side is smaller than the other as to take less away from the marquee showing...






Here's a pic fitting the components:



I Put feet on the Mobo, but still, didn't know how to get it to not move around, so here's a little rudimentary holding, just for now....



Ok, that's all I got so far! I am currently installing XP on this, and while I am at it, can you recommend a nice frontend for this?? Nice looking but not too powerfull in terms of needed resources, and remember I'm only going to run old arcade games here....

Also, how do you guys set your machines up? Change the XP boot screen? Tweak things for faster bootup? Tips? Tricks?

Almost there...

Thanks!!!   

[walterg74]

Hey Scott! Just quoting you to draw attention so you can answer my question on your previous comment 

Also, anyone have suggestions for the frontend?? I started experimenting with hyperspin until I realized it doesn't support vertical setups

I'm toying around with mamewah and Mala, but don't like them 100%... anything I'm missing or any better options for a vertical cab 

[PL1]

Hey Scott! Just quoting you to draw attention so you can answer my question on your previous comment 

D'Oh!  Sorry, got wrapped up in finishing another project at that time and I must not have scrolled up far enough to see this earlier question:

Regarding the metal "bars" tohold everything, do you mean something like this?



That's what I understand the "green" would be.

You've got the right location(directly over the hole in the joystick mounting plate), but you'll want the metal braces to be about an inch longer so you are solidly into the MDF like on my diagram.

Now what I don't get is what exactly the threaded inserts are or why I need them...

Two reasons for the inserts;

1. Regular wood screw threads don't have enough surface area to hold solidly in MDF and will work loose over time as you push and pull on the joystick.

2. Removing and reinstalling wood screws in MDF to work on your panel will chew up the fibers and strip out the screw hole.

The inserts have a wider, flatter area on the outer threads and you can remove and reinstall the machine screws hundreds of times without damaging or stripping the surrounding MDF fibers.

Also, I like to design/build things that I can field strip and reassemble whenever needed.

What I planned to do (if I got your green bar idea correctly), is to get 2 pieces of wood of the size I "ate away" from the control pannel (about 9mm), rectangular shape, and place them over the sides of the metal plate as if filling the hole.
Then get the two metal strips and drill 2 holes on each side, from the control square outwards (the red things in my lame picture touch-up right above), and tighten it to the CP, holding everything in place.

Wouldn't that do? From the top of the CP piece, up to where the microswitch contacs are, I have about a good 15mm, so lots of space to cable it.

Sounds like you've got it.  I only used 3 inserts per side because I figured that the two screws between the lower inserts would only have to be tightened once.

Once you have your filler piece (blue) cut to the proper thickness, attach it to the metal piece (green), then mark/drill/insert/attach that to the joystick mounting plate(gray) and mark/drill the holes for the lower two inserts (red).

Hope this helps.


Scott

[walterg74]

Yep, helps lots, thanks! 

I think I got it niw, I'll try to finish this in the weekend. The only question is if they sell inserts in this pos country I live in... 

Guess I'll find out tomorrow....

[PL1]

Yep, helps lots, thanks! 

I think I got it niw, I'll try to finish this in the weekend. The only question is if they sell inserts in this pos country I live in... 

Guess I'll find out tomorrow....

Here are some pictures from GGG and Ultimarc.  You may want to print them to show the people at the hardware store exactly what you're looking for.






Scott

[walterg74]

Yep, helps lots, thanks! 

I think I got it niw, I'll try to finish this in the weekend. The only question is if they sell inserts in this pos country I live in... 

Guess I'll find out tomorrow....

Here are some pictures from GGG and Ultimarc.  You may want to print them to show the people at the hardware store exactly what you're looking for.






Scott

Wow... Is that service or is that service? 

One last question... The screws I use are the "auto screwin" ones that start etting into the wood as you screw them. For these inserts how do you get them into the wood and to stay in it nice and ight? Is there a pre-hole or something I don't see/understand?

[PL1]

One last question... The screws I use are the "auto screwin" ones that start etting into the wood as you screw them. For these inserts how do you get them into the wood and to stay in it nice and ight? Is there a pre-hole or something I don't see/understand?

Installation directions from GGG:

Can be used in Plywood, MDF and other wood panels of at least 10mm (.400") in thickness. Kit comes with 4 inserts and mated screws per joystick and one installation tool per hardware kit.

Not Included, but required:

Drill Bits - 1/8" (pilot) and 5/16"
Drill (Hand or Press)
Marker or tape to gauge drill depth
Philips Head Screwdriver
Joysticks

Installation is simple. Mark your holes, using the joystick base as a template. Then drill a pilot hole to keep the large bit from wandering. Control the depth by marking the desired depth on the drill bit with a marker, or by creating a "stop" by wrapping the bit tightly with tape at the desired distance from the end of the bit. Care should be taken to drill the holes as straight and true as possible. Align the insert with the hole and screw it straight into the hole. Do not overtighten! When all inserts are installed, just attach the joystick base to the panel using the supplied screws.

*** Make sure that you select the right size drill bit for the inserts that you get.  ***


Scott