What Arcade Era Do You Identify With The Most?

[DashRendar]

What era of arcade games do you tend to play, because you have great memories of them? 

Which era were you busy popping quarters (or dollars) into arcade machines to get your fix?

[Ginsu Victim]

Metroid is not an arcade game.

Golden Age for me.

[milkit]

simpsons, battle toads, mortal kombat, and nfl blitz is all i need

[Thenasty]

Pacman, Ms.Pac, Asteroids, Berzerk, Scramble, Donkey Kong, Vanguard, Missile Command, Centipede, Space Invaders, Astro Blaster, Gorf, Scramble, Galaxian, Galaga, KISS PINBALL, BLACKHOLE PINBALL etc... get the picture ? Can you now quess how old I am ? 

Now the question is, why did it have to end dammit  






I still have a Quarter with a hole with a string attach. Sometime I use in my cab  
I use to get 99 credits on pac on a single quarter  

[quarterstringer]

I still have a Quarter with a hole with a string attach. Sometime I use in my cab 

I used tape and thread   Worked great on Asteroids.

I grew up playing almost all of the most popular games in the Golden Age. My parents bought a bowling alley in 1980. The previous owner didn't know anything about video games, he had games like Circus that was already 3 years old. So my Dad let me decide which games to request from the vendor. I remember he was shocked when Pole Position was bringing in $400 a week.

[nickynooch]

No game defines "arcade" to me more than mortal kombat.

I wasted thousands of quarters in Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3.  Still the greatest game of all time in my book.

[Ginsu Victim]

No game defines "arcade" to me more than mortal kombat.

I wasted thousands of quarters in Ultimate Mortal Kombat 3.  Still the greatest game of all time in my book.

Really? I liked MK II more and I don't really like MK games. I thought UMK3 was terrible.

And no game defines "arcade" more than Defender.  

[nickynooch]

Really? I liked MK II more and I don't really like MK games. I thought UMK3 was terrible.

And no game defines "arcade" more than Defender.  

Blasphemy!  To each his own though.  MK2 was great, but UMK3 was perfect, IMO.

[Thenasty]

And no game defines "arcade" more than Defender.  

Add Defender to my LIST above 

[DashRendar]

Metroid is not an arcade game.

Golden Age for me.

Ah, that's a bad example.

It was available as a Playchoice game (so, grey area between console and arcade cab).

http://www.arcade-history.com/?n=metroid&page=detail&id=1810

Good catch though.

Edit: Swapped out Metroid for Gauntlet in the poll examples. 

[Benevolance]

[quote[I still have a Quarter with a hole with a string attach.[/quote]

That seriously worked? I always figured it was an urban myth.

[Malenko]

the quarter trick worked (and works)

umm I remember playing pacman and bad dudes during saturday morning bowling. But I wasnt really an arcade nut until Street Fighter II and Mortal Kombat. I owned a SF2 machine, a converted track and feild. I gave it to my buddy josh, and his mom put it out in the rain when she kicked him out of his house.

I still own an MKII cab with both MKII and UMK3 in it.

[manman]

Lol- blasphemy for thinking mkII is better than umk3?!  Sorry, but I think it's the other way around... I agree that it's all opinion and to each his own, but I think with most fans of the arcade resurgence/2nd golden age (yes I know there was only 1 real golden age...haha), MKII is the star of the series.

I personally think there's a weird division there in the middle though... the Street Fighter era was not the mid to late 80s... sure sfI came out in 87, but the "street fighter era" pretty clearly started wth SFII.  MK, and most other fighting games that were popular in the next era you listed are all pretty much part of the "street fighter era"...they were there because of SF

[Ginsu Victim]

Yeah, instead of Street Fighter, stuff like Shinobi, Rastan, Strider, Outrun, or Rygar would've been good to say.

[Thenasty]

That seriously worked? I always figured it was an urban myth.

It worked until they installed the Anti-Stringing Device (a blade to cut the string) 

Always loved the PENNY trick to get Credits 

[Ginsu Victim]

There used to be a Rolling Thunder machine at a grocery store near my house that I could lightly hit with my knee for credit.

[RayB]

I can't answer the poll as my hardcore addiction ran from '81 through to early 90's.

[SammyWI]

Golden Age here.  Although I do spill over a bit before and after.   

[DeLuSioNal29]

I grew up in the golden age, but was too small to afford them, so I never really played them much.  But in college they had an MKII, X-men and Terminator 2 in the cafeteria where I played them non-stop since I had a job (at last) to support my arcade habit.

Which is probably why I play the classics much more.  I trying to make up for lost time.   

DeLuSioNaL29

[TheShanMan]

For me it's roughly '79-'86 when I was pretty hardcore about arcade games. Consequently most of the games in my game room fall in that range. Only exceptions I think are cyberball and sf rush.

[manman]

I guess I am one of the youngin's around here... kind of nice actually since I'm a first generation fighting games guy so on a lot of other forums I frequent I'm in the upper age bracket     So if that doesn't give it away- yeah, i'm a SF era 90's guy as far as my best/strongest arcade memories.  All about the various incarnations of SFII, MK 1-3, KI etc...real life started to take over a little while after MvC2 so I didn't get into those as much back then.  I was also a big fan of the side scroller beat-em-ups like TMNT, Simpsons etc, and NBA jam of course.  Too young to be able to claim golden era status...

[Epyx]

I can't answer the poll as my hardcore addiction ran from '81 through to early 90's.

+1

Although back a year for me to 80 and Battlezone..the game that had me curious what the amazing noises were coming from inside the Three Bears Drive In and then mesmerized when I peered in the viewscope and saw a 3d world.  Then the early 80s with DK/MS Pac Man/Defender etc...the mid to late 80s with Elevator action/Black Tiger etc.  

The addiction has never really ended but was at its most fervent through to at least the early 90s as well.

[helpmebuild]

For me it is definitely the early to mid 90's. I think that fighters like SFII and MKII really helped push the market back up out of it's slump. I still personally feel that fighters are the best "feeling" game on a joystick.

Here's another question to tie in though - what age(s) were you during this heyday and identification of an era?

For me I was about 12 when I fell in love with arcades and their sounds and appearance. What about you guys?

[drventure]

I started gaming in junior high, early 80's or so, but I didn't really get into games until right after high school. I was working in a comic shop in the mall, and there just happened to be an arcade there as well 

Not sure whether they were "current" games at that point or already old, but I remember spending way too much on Defender, Targ, Spectar, Red Baron, and Star wars.

[Mauzy]

Sadly, I had no chance. On a technicality I have to say mid to late 90s and early 00s (Damn that DDR....), but I tend to play games from the 80s through very early 90s.

I maintain that I was born about 20 years too late....

[manman]

I played arcade games randomly through out the years (star wars, mario bros etc), but I was about 10/11 when SFII came out, and that's when I fell in love and actually became an arcade rat.. probably spent the better part of age 11-18 in the arcades, and when I wasn't there it was snes at home

[TPA5]

I accidentally his early to mid 70's. I mean 70's - 80's. I only had a few arcade games at my local pizza shop to play, but I had an Atari 800 computer in my room (Yeah, I felt like a total badass. My dad gave it to me when I was 5.) and a lot of the popular arcade games of that era were available for my Atari 800. Except Zaxxon, I believe. That one was at my local pizza shop, and me and my dad played the hell out of that thing. When I build my cab, I'm definitely having a joystick for some Zaxxon action in it.

Sadly, I'm not old enough to truly enjoy the golden age of arcade games. Born in '91 you see. But like I said, I got a classic gaming fix through my Atari 800, which is sadly no longer with me.

[Gorotsuki]

Having been around 5 by 1980 I was fortunate to experience most of what arcades had
to offer at all points in this time line.
Mom would take me to the mall on Saturdays and buy a $5 bag of
tokens and I would wear myself out on Ring King.
Would play Shinobi, Xenophobe, Mario Bros. and Mat Mania at the bowling alley.
Donkey Kong Jr. at the Pizza Hut.
I would play any game at any place I could.
Then when the fighting games hit I was a teen.
I loved that scene, it was so much fun.
Would ride miles on my bike to whatever had
an arcade machine in town. All the other kids were
doing the high school thing...suckers.

[ahofle]

I can't answer the poll as my hardcore addiction ran from '81 through to early 90's.

+1

+2
I wanted to select 3 of the categories, but settled with golden age.  
I would say I pretty much played the entire time that most games were 25 cents. 

[Vulgar Soul]

Since I was unfortunately born in 89, I missed out on the golden age of arcade gaming; and by the time I was really coming of age, arcades were all but dead. But the few arcades still around in the 90s were great. Street Fighter II, MK, NBA JAM, Raiden series, Aero Fighters, Virtua Fighter, KoF, and all the Capcom/Marvel mashups. Damn good era in gaming. The arcade may be gone, but they went out with a bang.

[StephenH]

I like early 80s to today.  I was raised up in the Showbiz Pizza Place, Peter Piper Pizza era.  Even today I commonly play arcade games at Dave & Busters, Nickel City, and Tilt arcades.

BTW, to user Ginsu Victim, Metroid WAS an arcade game!   There was a version of it available for the Nintendo Playchoice-10 system.   If you go to this URL, and search for "Metroid", you will see a screenshot of it.  http://maws.mameworld.info/maws/

[manman]

come on, playchoice was just a glorified NES, that doesn't count

[Edwards80]

I was born 20 years too late too. I voted for the 90's as I was growing up then. The Simpsons etc. do hold their special appeal to me but I much prefer the gameplay of the golden era games. Smash TV was probably my favourite game until I discovered Robotron 2084

Seems that my mates are the same. First thing they say when they hear I have an arcade cab build in progress is "Will it play Teenage Mutant Hero(Ninja) Turtles 4 player"  . . . the second is to ask about NBA Jam

I was at the right age for pinball though. Love the early 90s machines.

[Blanka]

Me too. I really like the golden games, but I have much better memories about the 90's. Guess a mixture would be nice. 90's music with 80-ies games. 80's music sucks beyond sucking (except a few MJ songs, as they sport a Quincy Jones 70's baseline).

[TOK]

Like some others, I actually identify with games over a long span of time. My current favorite game is my Golden Tee Fore, and that is only a few years old.

The games that got me into MAME, and therefore the ones I really identify with are all Golden Age though. Donkey Kong, Defender, Robotron, Moon Patrol, Time Pilot and Xevious.

[HanoiBoi]

I can't answer the poll as my hardcore addiction ran from '81 through to early 90's.

+1

+2
I wanted to select 3 of the categories, but settled with golden age.  
I would say I pretty much played the entire time that most games were 25 cents.  

+3 or +4, I lost count...

Dash, perhaps you could add a new category "Early to Mid 80's".  I'll come back and click that one!

My latest kick has been Gravitar.  I keep saying to myself..." I remember being good at this!?!"

(I love my 5 button 'Asteroids' setup!)

[HanoiBoi]

Pacman, Ms.Pac, Asteroids, Berzerk, Scramble, Donkey Kong, Vanguard, Missile Command, Centipede, Space Invaders, Astro Blaster, Gorf, Scramble, Galaxian, Galaga, KISS PINBALL, BLACKHOLE PINBALL etc... get the picture ? Can you now quess how old I am ? 

Sad how I never see Zaxxon getting much love in this community.  We all played it...

[Blanka]

I never manage to survive 10 seconds of Zaxxon. It has the most Ridicule controls and weird 3D imaging of all arcadegames. Unplayable IMO.

[Ginsu Victim]

BTW, to user Ginsu Victim, Metroid WAS an arcade game!   There was a version of it available for the Nintendo Playchoice-10 system.   If you go to this URL, and search for "Metroid", you will see a screenshot of it.  http://maws.mameworld.info/maws/

I know about Playchoice. It doesn't count.

[Thenasty]

Pacman, Ms.Pac, Asteroids, Berzerk, Scramble, Donkey Kong, Vanguard, Missile Command, Centipede, Space Invaders, Astro Blaster, Gorf, Scramble, Galaxian, Galaga, KISS PINBALL, BLACKHOLE PINBALL etc... get the picture ? Can you now quess how old I am ?  

Sad how I never see Zaxxon getting much love in this community.  We all played it...

thats what happened when you get older. You forget things. 
Oh yea! add Zaxxon to my list and Robotron, Q-Bert, Omega Race, Mr.Do and the Infamous Commodroe 64  

[Ginsu Victim]

I always felt like Zaxxon didn't age well. I loved it when it came out, but now I can't get into it.

[Vanguard]

When you think about the history of arcades (coin op electronic type), it's amazing how short lived it really was.

I'm not talking about the existence of the games but rather the arcade itself as a business model.   It probably really only lasted less than 10 years before declining into an unsustainable model.   Sure there were always arcade games in 7-eleven, etc... but I'm talking about the full on arcades with the neon lights and nothing but a huge room full of machines.

For me, it was as much the arcade as the games in it that made it fun.   I was at the age where I was too young to drive myself to the arcade but old enough that my mom would drop me there.   It was a place to hang out with friends all day and have a sense of independence.  It really was as much of a social experience as it was a place to play games.

By the time arcades were starting to close up and disappear, I'd discovered girls and had new interests to waste my money on.   I feel fortunate that I was at the right place and the right time in history to have seen and enjoyed the rise of the arcade.  

[DashRendar]

Sad how I never see Zaxxon getting much love in this community.  We all played it...

Yeah, I LOVED Zaxxon when I was about 9 or 10.  I play it now on MAME, and it *is* tricky with the point of view.

But to a 9 year old kid, it wasn't a big deal. 

[DashRendar]

When you think about the history of arcades (coin op electronic type), it's amazing how short lived it really was.

It was interesting looking year-by-year at arcade game releases at arcade-history.com.  You could definitely see when the peaks were and when the declines happened.

[jtslade]

"Mortal Kombat, on Sega Genesis, is the best video game ever.
" I disagree, while it's a very good game, I think Donkey Kong is the best game ever."
"Donkey Kong sucks."
"You know something? YOU SUCK!"

[Frigo]

Late 80's/Early 90's for me.

I was born in 80, so I missed out on quite a few trends in the arcade scene. There was this place, Peter Piper's Pizza, a Chuck E. Cheese rip-off that had a HUGE arcade section in the back. There were games like Rolling Thunder, Altered Beast, Outrun, Space Harrier, Centipede, etc. all over the place, and while I had a blast playing them, I was too young to fully appreciate some of the classics I wouldn't see again until they were converted to the home systems (poorly converted, at that). It wasn't until I first laid eyes on Street Fighter II that I was completely hooked to the arcades. I can still remember placing quarters on the bezel to secure my place in line, and, although I got beat a lot my first few tries, I learned the basics quick and soon I was the one taking quarters from some young upstart, LOL. Ever since then, I've been a dedicated fighting fan. You just can't beat the experience.

[TheGameFan]

I really identify with two eras for different reasons.

I remember being a kid in the 80's playing mostly Pac-Man, Moon Patrol,  and Rally-X.

During my college years in the nineties, I remember going to the arcade with friends to play Tekken, Virtua Fighter 2, and Daytona.

[manman]

When you think about the history of arcades (coin op electronic type), it's amazing how short lived it really was.

I'm not talking about the existence of the games but rather the arcade itself as a business model.  

It's an interesting topic to think about... when I first read this I thought the exact opposite.  As fast as technology moves and it becomes easier to pack more powerful machines into a smaller footprint, it was inevitable for consoles to catch up to arcade quality machines so you get the same or better technology by only paying once and you get to own it.  I guess if arcades had always stayed a step ahead it might not have happened that way, but I think consoles caught up too fast and the money just wasn't there for many people to want to continue to invest much in that business model.

But then I thought about Japan, where arcade culture still thrives today.  It HAS finally started to decline, but not nearly to the point they have here... I don't know if it's just a cultural thing or what.  I read that part of the way they design large cities in Japan is mean to encourage people to come/stay out more- and that probably works since living spaces are smaller and more cramped together in general vs American housing.

I don't know, but I agree with you that most of the great part about the experience was not the technical quality of the games, but actually being there, meeting people, competing against people, and just sharing that arcade culture with other like-minded people.  It's really too bad that had to die out...

[Vanguard]

I remember going to the arcade with friends to play Tekken, Virtua Fighter 2, and Daytona.

I worked on the development of SEGA graphics hardware (model 3) for Virtua Fighter 2 and Daytona 500.   Sega gave us both and we stuck them in our break room.   It's amazing how good you can get at a game when its free and at work. 

[Havok]

Ahhh the Golden Age. I stopped going to the arcade regularly when the fighter drivel came out. That was the beginning of the end...

[Thenasty]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end 

[TPA5]

Pacman, Ms.Pac, Asteroids, Berzerk, Scramble, Donkey Kong, Vanguard, Missile Command, Centipede, Space Invaders, Astro Blaster, Gorf, Scramble, Galaxian, Galaga, KISS PINBALL, BLACKHOLE PINBALL etc... get the picture ? Can you now quess how old I am ? 

Sad how I never see Zaxxon getting much love in this community.  We all played it...

My dad has major love for Zaxxon. I promised him I would put a joystick in my cab so he could play it again. I really like it too, it just makes me slightly dizzy if I play it too much

[manman]

Ahhh the Golden Age. I stopped going to the arcade regularly when the fighter drivel came out. That was the beginning of the end...

lol, I can't hate on the golden age, but I think you are crazy before the fighting game boom, arcades had already been seeing the end for a while, they were totally dying.  Fighting games weren't the beginning of the end, they were the new beginning that brought arcade culture back!  I know that what people like is mostly just naustalgia but for my money it doesn't get better than fighting games for real 2 player competition.  Fast paced strategy where you have to be able to read the other person and react on a dime... plus the games had depth where you had to learn specific matchups, and character play could be innovated for years...  3rd strike came out in like 1999 or something and 10 years later people were still discovering things...

[Ginsu Victim]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end 

Sounds like you want to insert coin to continue the 80s.

[manman]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end  

Sounds like you want to insert coin to continue the 80s.

hahaha

Arcade games have always been quarter sucking machines...how many quarters get sucked just depends on how much skill you have!  That has never changed... I don't see how TMNT is any less of a "see how far you can get on one quarter" experience.  It's just that when you finally lose you don't have to start from the beginning, you still get to experience some new parts of the game.  I can understand the debate on whether that's good or bad- I've often thought that while games were more basic in the past, they were more difficult/challenging for that reason... but whether people agree or disagree I think the fact is they still both present the challenge of how far you can get on a quarter.  Getting killed right away can happen on any game if you suck at it, haha.

[opt2not]

I picked Golden Age, because that's where I started this gaming addiction. "you never forget your first" -- Asteriods and Galaga were my entry drugs, I progressed onto other game addictions throughout most of the arcade era's -- shoot, practically all the arcade era's except the current one (DDR games blow - thank god for SF4). But galaga and asteroids were the catalysts.
Though, home consoles soaked up a lot of my time in the mid-to-late 80's. During that time, the arcade games out there weren't doing it for me, there were a few that got me hooked, but and you could get a lot of ports on your Atari or NES. late-80's arcade and console games were getting closer in gaming quality at that time...though I've been eating my words lately with mame. Been finding a lot of games from that time I actually enjoy! Perhaps I'm in a different state of mind now.

Ahhh the Golden Age. I stopped going to the arcade regularly when the fighter drivel came out. That was the beginning of the end...

lol, I can't hate on the golden age, but I think you are crazy before the fighting game boom, arcades had already been seeing the end for a while, they were totally dying.  Fighting games weren't the beginning of the end, they were the new beginning that brought arcade culture back!  I know that what people like is mostly just naustalgia but for my money it doesn't get better than fighting games for real 2 player competition.  Fast paced strategy where you have to be able to read the other person and react on a dime... plus the games had depth where you had to learn specific matchups, and character play could be innovated for years...  3rd strike came out in like 1999 or something and 10 years later people were still discovering things...

I wouldn't say it brought it back... well at least, not the same culture.
I was really happy when SFII came out, and pseudo revived the arcade fever. I put in a lot of time playing/fighting in a "king in the court" style play at our local arcade, it was a lot of fun! The learning new combos, the strats, the match-ups...but it wasn't the same as the golden age era of games. Fighting games only bought a different type of gamer to the arcade, it didn't bring the masses back. It didn't bring back the people that played Golden era games, the gamers that were used to cpu-pattern-based difficulty, rather than 1v1 "mind-game" difficulty. It didn't bring back the people that were looking for amusement entertainment rather than competitive fighting. It didn't bring back the family and the girlfriends, fighting games turned out to be a boy's-club thing - men only...

Don't get me wrong, I love fighting games and I'm a pretty formidable competitor at most of them, but I don't equate it the same as the golden era of arcade culture. There was something less aggressive, less "me vs. you" and more "me vs. it (the game)" in those days.

[manman]

I don't know what terminology you want to use, but arcades were definitely dying out, and fighting games brought in a resurgence that led to another 'boom' in arcade going.  Not just for fighting games, but side scrollers, shooters, etc.

I can't argue with you about the culture though- I wasn't really there in the "golden age".  There might have well been a change in culture, I didn't mean to say it brought everybody that used to play back.  I don't know that you'd even expect that... Just like with the 90's resurgence, eventually the players from that era get older and life takes over....  Like I said though, what people like is going to be mostly based on their own nostalgia.  For me, 'cpu pattern based difficulty' is not nearly as stimulating or fun as challenging another human mind, and I really liked that 'me vs. you' as opposed to me vs. the cpu mentality.  But you're right, it was a pretty narrow demographic, and mainly only brought in that audience.  I didn't know the 'golden age' had such a varied audience, I figured it was mainly the same...teenage dudes, haha.

[Ginsu Victim]

I didn't know the 'golden age' had such a varied audience, I figured it was mainly the same...teenage dudes, haha.

My mom was big into Centipede, Ms Pac-man, and pinball, so at least if we went to the arcade, she had games she could play. I mean, looking back, she was only in her late-twenties then anyway.

[Havok]

I don't know what terminology you want to use, but arcades were definitely dying out, and fighting games brought in a resurgence that led to another 'boom' in arcade going.  Not just for fighting games, but side scrollers, shooters, etc.

You can always tell the guys that weren't around for the golden age. Back then, you walked into any public establishment and there were some arcade games. Always at least one, usually more. You just didn't see that in the fighter days. Yes, there were a lot of people playing the fighter games, but there were less people playing arcade games by that time, and the ones that did were clumped into actual arcades, not spread out everywhere.  Opt2not nailed it; you had an entirely different culture at that point - it wasn't everyone playing, just the same type of teenage boys. Not a resurgence, just a bunch of dudes.

[VespaGuy]

Golden Age for me. Born in '71.

I have fond memories of being dropped off at the mall with freinds. My faves were Ms. Pacman, Frogger, Congo Bongo, and Star Wars.  My local skating rink had Donkey Kong Jr, Bagman, and a few pinball machines.

What I loved about the golden age was that the whole idea of video games was so new (and the technology was so limited) that there were tons of original games. There were no genres - developers just had to make the games fun and addictive or people wouldn't play them.

[manman]

I don't know what terminology you want to use, but arcades were definitely dying out, and fighting games brought in a resurgence that led to another 'boom' in arcade going.  Not just for fighting games, but side scrollers, shooters, etc.

You can always tell the guys that weren't around for the golden age. Back then, you walked into any public establishment and there were some arcade games. Always at least one, usually more. You just didn't see that in the fighter days. Yes, there were a lot of people playing the fighter games, but there were less people playing arcade games by that time, and the ones that did were clumped into actual arcades, not spread out everywhere.  Opt2not nailed it; you had an entirely different culture at that point - it wasn't everyone playing, just the same type of teenage boys. Not a resurgence, just a bunch of dudes.

haha, you can also tell them by the fact that they flat out said "I wasn't there for the golden age".

Again it's terminology... I'm not looking to disparage the golden age or it's games by making broad dismissive statements like that.  The fact is, it was a resurgence by pretty much any definition of the word.  Were there fewer people playing arcade games at it's peak?  Sure, you are probably absolutely right...but there were a HELL of a lot less playing /before/ that time, between the end of the golden age, and that period.  Arcades were all but dead before that, so... I don't know how you avoid calling it a resurgence, regardless of how much much you personally value it.  To be honest, the only people I ever hear pining about the golden age are men who would have been in the same age bracket at the time...the same "bunch of dudes" similar to the ones in the 90's.  But whatever, if it takes being dismissive about another era to enjoy your own, more power to you  Same, close, or completely different I had a blast with the arcade culture of that time and I think it was great.

[saint]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end 

+1, my sentiments exactly.

[crip102468]

MsPacman Pacman Digdug MoonPatrol the 70s, and 80,s here I use to do the quarter hole string trick i also use to do a penny trick were u break the square plastic on the bottom of digdug coinbox return or any game that had that type of coindoor and fingerpop a penny upwards. and Bam you got a credit. Man i missed the golden days   

[DashRendar]

As of right now, 85 votes have been cast, and not a single one for the games from the past decade (2000s).

You would think that the most technologically-advanced games would be the best, but I guess the simple games of the Golden Age proved that wrong.

[dgame]

I actually play from early 80s to late 90s games the most. From Pac Man to the Street Fighter II series. The closest option in the poll is mid to late 80s. By then I had wheels [bicycle] and lunch money [quarters/tokens].


1985:
Commando, Exciting Hour/Mat Mania, Gauntlet, Gradius, Green Beret/Rush'n Attack, Nintendo

Vs. System, Ring King, Yie Ar KungFu

1986:
720 Degrees, Arkanoid, Bobble Bobble, Break Thru, Darius, Gauntlet II, Ikari Warriors, Out

Run, Rampage, Rolling Thunder, Rygar - Legendary Warrior, Side

Arms - Hyper Dyne, Slap Fight, Super Sprint

1987:
1943, After Burner/After Burner II, Arkanoid - Revenge Of Doh, Bionic Commando, Black

Tiger, Contra, Double Dragon, Guerrilla War, Operation Wolf, Rastan/Rastan Saga,

RType, Street Fighter

1988:
Altered Beast, Assault, Bad Dudes Vs. Dragon Ninja, Cyberball, Galaxy Force, Gradius II,

NARC, Ninja Gaiden, Operation Thunderbolt, P.O.W. Prisoners Of War, RoboCop, Silk Worm,

Superman, Tetris, Toobin', Vigilante, Vindicators/Vindicators II

1989:
Arch Rivals, Darius II, Final Fight, Golden Axe, Ironman Ivan Stewart's Super Off Road,

S.T.U.N. Runner, Shadow Dancer, Strider, Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles, Willow, Wrestle War,

WWF Superstars

[manman]

As of right now, 85 votes have been cast, and not a single one for the games from the past decade (2000s).

You would think that the most technologically-advanced games would be the best, but I guess the simple games of the Golden Age proved that wrong.

I'm not sure the poll would really reflect that... More like it reflects the demographic of the audience of this site, as well as (interestingly) seeming to give a pretty accurate reflection of the amount of people playing arcade games during these times.  Seems to support havok's point (as well as mine) about the largest number of people playing in the golden age, things dying down and then coming back (but not as big) in the 90's then dying out again.  You have to factor in things like consoles, online gaming, peoples ages etc.  Anyone who went into an arcade post 2000 was probably there in the 90's era and had there best memories at that time, otherwise they were younger and their best memories would come around their own teenage years which would be well into xbox live time... nobody is gonna have their best memories of an arcade post 2000, there was just nothing in arcades and too much in the home.

[DrFrag]

Australia must have been running a few years behind with arcade games.  Around 1980 it was hard to even find places with arcade games.  Pinball seemed to be the main game.

It wasn't until the mid to late 80s that I observed places doubling up on popular cabs to handle the queues.  Dedicated arcades were set up and ran packed weekly lock-ins.  I'd call that more of a Golden Age than late 70s to early 80s.

[HanoiBoi]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end 

+1, my sentiments exactly.

+2  The fighting games were just like playing a cartoon.  They really required no skill and you basically paid for time.  Plus, it encouraged the wangs that always reached into their pocket for another quarter after you 'put yours up'.  Learn arcade etiquette!

The good news about that era was that there were some decent pins out.  After that, arcades were pretty much dead to me.

Oh, and I never liked the fact that Chexx/Super Chexx and air hockey started chewing up valuable arcade space.

[manman]

fighting games require no skill?!  lol that's a joke if I've ever heard one...

[opt2not]

They really required no skill and you basically paid for time. 

Gasp!   

You fail with this comment.
There is a tremendous amount of skill involved in fighting games...perhaps you didn't understand it then. Like I said, it attracted a different set of gamers...you might not be in that demographic.

Fighting game skill (aka against another human) is different than skill against the cpu. To say there is no skill in fighting games, is just plain wrong.

Oh, and I never liked the fact that Chexx/Super Chexx and air hockey started chewing up valuable arcade space.

Double Gasp! There was nothing wrong with Chexx machines!
...nor did they ever were a threat of encroaching on video game profit. From what I remember, they were "just there".

[Edwards80]

They really required no skill and you basically paid for time.  Plus, it encouraged the wangs that always reached into their pocket for another quarter after you 'put yours up'.  Learn arcade etiquette!

I don't think its fair to say they require no skill, but I can agree with your comment on the type of people it attracted sometimes.

I was waiting to play SF2 at a 10 pin bowling complex for about 10mins and put my money down to claim the next go after waiting politely. The chap then put it into the machine and carried on playing. He said he thought I wanted to watch him play  He did bugger off after that and left a credit to make up for it at least

[HanoiBoi]

Sure, head to head games are different.  Maybe I don't know what 'fighting' games are.

The games that I say require no skill are the ones where everyone's fighting for the same goal.  Maybe I shouldn't say they require no skill.  But, the thinking behind my comments are something like this....I've seen 5-8 year old's finish games like TMNT and the Simpsons by simply adding credits, jumping and attacking.  Dodging and keeping the hits down is not really a necessity in the game.  The only risk in sucking is adding more credits.

One quarter games require more skill.

[manman]

yeah, you're thinking about a different type of game.  The "fighting game" genre refers to games like those in the street fighter series, MK, etc where 2 people go against eachother.  Of course you can play the cpu, but that I would agree doesn't take much skill, haha.

I messed around with my share of those TMNT style games, and while fun I would mostly agree that it doesn't take that much skill to get through them or anything.  That said, the one thing I think is kind of funny about that argument that those games just suck quarters while older games let you "see how far you can get on one quarter" is...  nobody is forcing you to continue.  I mean, you can just wait the 10 seconds and presto- there's your start from the beginning after you lose game.  You have the option to do what you like. 
I gotta believe the earlier 'one game is all you get' games sucked quarters just as hard as these kinds of games though... I mean if you're playing to see how far you can get and/or beat your/someone else's high score didn't you end up pumping those quarters in to keep trying and keep getting better? Trying to improve and beat/set a record seems like the more fun/fulfilling pursuit, that's for sure- but I can't imagine that a tmnt style game ate quarters any faster.

[Edwards80]

Stick someone who hasn't played many arcade games on Defender, then on TMNT and see which sucks credits quicker

I grew up playing the early nineties stuff and it did annoy me then that you could just complete games by paying to play all the way through. I find trying to play through on limited credits makes the games more fun. Setting a limit of 10 continues in Metal slug etc.

[kagaden]

My father was big on the early retro stuff and introduced me to arcades when I was a toddler... I still have a love/fascination with Dragon's Lair.

For me though, Street Fighter II is the greatest arcade game ever made. Those years of going to random places or malls and finding a street fighter machine with a crowd of people around it all waiting to throw down made for an incredibly unique way of meeting people with common interests... then pitting skill against skill, sharing moves/secrets, urban legends, etc.

Too awesome, SFII wins it for me.

[kagaden]

I don't know what terminology you want to use, but arcades were definitely dying out, and fighting games brought in a resurgence that led to another 'boom' in arcade going.  Not just for fighting games, but side scrollers, shooters, etc.

You can always tell the guys that weren't around for the golden age. Back then, you walked into any public establishment and there were some arcade games. Always at least one, usually more. You just didn't see that in the fighter days. Yes, there were a lot of people playing the fighter games, but there were less people playing arcade games by that time, and the ones that did were clumped into actual arcades, not spread out everywhere.  Opt2not nailed it; you had an entirely different culture at that point - it wasn't everyone playing, just the same type of teenage boys. Not a resurgence, just a bunch of dudes.

haha, you can also tell them by the fact that they flat out said "I wasn't there for the golden age".

Again it's terminology... I'm not looking to disparage the golden age or it's games by making broad dismissive statements like that.  The fact is, it was a resurgence by pretty much any definition of the word.  Were there fewer people playing arcade games at it's peak?  Sure, you are probably absolutely right...but there were a HELL of a lot less playing /before/ that time, between the end of the golden age, and that period.  Arcades were all but dead before that, so... I don't know how you avoid calling it a resurgence, regardless of how much much you personally value it.  To be honest, the only people I ever hear pining about the golden age are men who would have been in the same age bracket at the time...the same "bunch of dudes" similar to the ones in the 90's.  But whatever, if it takes being dismissive about another era to enjoy your own, more power to you  Same, close, or completely different I had a blast with the arcade culture of that time and I think it was great.

+1

Havok, besides the fact that you're a scrub who's clearly trolling... (then again I expect that from someone with DBZ in their avatar...)

The arcade scene was completely... COMPLETELY dead before SFII hit. SFII's existence easily kept the development of arcades going another 12 years, and now they're dying again... but would have been dead a lot earlier if it wasn't for that. Chess against another person is a hellova lot more fun than chess against a CPU. It may not be for you, but give it the respect it deserves.

-K

[Patent Doc]

so true. When Arcade became quarter sucking machine with those continues.

You get killed right away, so you put another .25c/.50c to continue (AKA Simpsons, TMNT, Fighting Games).

I like the chalenge on how far you get only on one quarter. If game is over, starts over again (AKA Pacman, Asteroids, Berzerk etc..)

80's why did you have to end  

+3 for that sentiment

I think what killed the arcade experience for me was the fighting games...no not because it was putting money in to continue ...it was that the learning curve to play the game even competently was so high.  So you kept feeding quarters into the machine just to learn to play.  Golden age games had a minimal learning curve Take pac man, you move up, down, left, right ..eat the pellets...avoid teh ghosts.  The person doing this is just as equipped to finish the game as the person who had done it before.  By contrast with the MK SF games ...there were all these pecial moves that required you to simultaneously press up and left press three buttons, stick out your tongue and put your left big toe in your right ear...you need these moves to survive even a short time and there is no instruction on unlocking those moves.  Yes, to be really good at a golden age game, you needed to learn a pattern or gain experience, but there was no requireement to learn anything to play the game.  Heck you can get really far on pac man or DK without knowing any patterns..you're just not going to break the record.

[DashRendar]

My friends and I always called the Street Fighter/Mortal Kombat/etc games button mashers.

I did have friends who knew the combos, but the rest of my buddies just mashed all the buttons and went crazy moving the joystick.

Must've been hell on the controls.  But it worked for getting your guy to do his super-secret-combo-move-that-involved-launching-flaming-cows at your opponent! 

[CheffoJeffo]

I don't know what terminology you want to use, but arcades were definitely dying out, and fighting games brought in a resurgence that led to another 'boom' in arcade going.  Not just for fighting games, but side scrollers, shooters, etc.

You can always tell the guys that weren't around for the golden age. Back then, you walked into any public establishment and there were some arcade games. Always at least one, usually more. You just didn't see that in the fighter days. Yes, there were a lot of people playing the fighter games, but there were less people playing arcade games by that time, and the ones that did were clumped into actual arcades, not spread out everywhere.  Opt2not nailed it; you had an entirely different culture at that point - it wasn't everyone playing, just the same type of teenage boys. Not a resurgence, just a bunch of dudes.

haha, you can also tell them by the fact that they flat out said "I wasn't there for the golden age".

Again it's terminology... I'm not looking to disparage the golden age or it's games by making broad dismissive statements like that.  The fact is, it was a resurgence by pretty much any definition of the word.  Were there fewer people playing arcade games at it's peak?  Sure, you are probably absolutely right...but there were a HELL of a lot less playing /before/ that time, between the end of the golden age, and that period.  Arcades were all but dead before that, so... I don't know how you avoid calling it a resurgence, regardless of how much much you personally value it.  To be honest, the only people I ever hear pining about the golden age are men who would have been in the same age bracket at the time...the same "bunch of dudes" similar to the ones in the 90's.  But whatever, if it takes being dismissive about another era to enjoy your own, more power to you  Same, close, or completely different I had a blast with the arcade culture of that time and I think it was great.

+1

Havok, besides the fact that you're a scrub who's clearly trolling... (then again I expect that from someone with DBZ in their avatar...)

The arcade scene was completely... COMPLETELY dead before SFII hit. SFII's existence easily kept the development of arcades going another 12 years, and now they're dying again... but would have been dead a lot earlier if it wasn't for that. Chess against another person is a hellova lot more fun than chess against a CPU. It may not be for you, but give it the respect it deserves.

You seem to be missing the point that what happened after SF2 was not a resurgence of the the past glory, but something new (i.e. the "culture" shifted ... dramatically ... with players, developers, ops), and to the minds of many, actually brought about the death of the video arcade. I seem to remember reading an article in GameRoom recently about how SF2 killed the arcade, as told by someone who actually operated. I can't remember off the top of my head which issue it is, but maybe I'll have a look later. Other people have said similar things even before that article ... and they liked SF2.

SF2 resulted in exactly the opposite situation as what made the Golden Era golden -- the success of SF2 created a tunnel-vision amongst developers so that the vast majority of new titles were slightly sharpened versions of their predecessors. And every op felt like they had to buy every iteration, even though most of them wouldn't make enough to pay off the machine, because they could miss the first few profitable weeks of the latest fad fighter. Same thing has happened with drivers and gun games.

You can argue that the arcade died before SF2 and I wouldn't particularly argue, but let's not pretend that SF2 was the second coming, or even something good ... maybe the video arcade should have been allowed to die with dignity. (and I say this when there are a number of post-90 games that I would classify amongst my favourites).

[Havok]

I love the comparison of a fighting game with chess. Not even close - you're elevating a tired, worn out game genre to a level it will never be at. My main problem with the fighters is the fact they're all basically the same. Plus the deluge of titles with a small amount of difference; maybe add a few moves, a few different characters. After a while just give it up. Try having a little originality. That was lost with the golden age unfortunately. They just kept pumping out the same crap over and over and over with very little variation. Here's just a sample:

Hyper Street Fighter 2
Street Fighter
Street Fighter Alpha
Street fighter Alpha 2
Street Fighter Alpha 3
Street Fighter Alpha: Warriors' Dreams
Street Fighter EX
Street Fighter EX 2
Street Fighter EX 2 Plus
Street Fighter II - The World Warrior
Street Fighter II - Champion Edition
Street Fighter II' Turbo - Hyper Fighting
Street Fighter III 2nd Impact: Giant Attack
Street Fighter III 3rd Strike: Fight for the Future
Street Fighter III: New Generation
Street Fighter Zero
Street Fighter Zero 2
Street Fighter Zero 2 Alpha
Street Fighter Zero 3
Street Fighter Zero 3 Upper
Street Fighter: The Movie
Super Street Fighter II Turbo
Super Street Fighter II X: Grand Master Challenge
Super Street Fighter II: The New Challengers
Super Street Fighter II: The Tournament Battle

OK, we get it - how about a new kind of game? Not to mention King of Fighters, which they apparently thought they were a car company who needed to release a new version every freaking year.

This is the crap that finally killed arcades and paved the way for redemption. Yes, it brought the rowdy little punks in to play against each other, but it was the beginning of the end...

[manman]

lol.  the funny thing about you is that you are trying to argue something you seem to know nothing about, other than what you can copy/paste from another site.  That list of games was what finally killed the arcades and paved the way for redemption?  I think you might want to do a little date checking there, the beginning of that list there correlates to the point where arcades were pretty much dead and then were brought back to life again.  I know that you know little to nothing about fighting games, and or just want to be willfully dismissive- so it's probably pointless to point this out, but I'll give it a shot...
One of the most important aspects in fighting games is character balance.  the tiniest change to the recovery time, start up, etc for various moves can dramatically change the effectiveness of that character, and shifts the matchup with all the other characters.  Now...aside from the fact that some of the games you listed are completely different seires of the overall franchise and play totally different, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt here and just address variations in a specific series.  Some of these variations were brought out for less valuable reasons like just trying to combat the gameplay tweaked bootlegs that were coming out, but many of these revisions were made in response to player feedback, because these games were (and some still are) being played at a competitive level.  A game company being responsive to it's fans and making the games more like what they want?  yeeeah, that's a TERRIBLE thing, lol.  People hate updates to their favorite games, that's for sure.  Some of the stuff you listed are also the exact same game but the japanese version vs. the american version... you are really talking out of your ass here haha.

As for it being like chess- It's not really possible to make a comparison like that, but the point he's making is that to be good at these games it does take similar skills like strategy, being able to read your oponent, bait your opponent, etc.  I think it's much closer to what he is trying to say than the way you seem to see it.  It would be just as easy to bash on the games you enjoyed with the same words like "tired" and "worn out" that you use, but I'm not that stupid. I realize that while it might not be my thing, games that may look outwardly simple and basic probably take a hell of a lot of skill to be the guy setting records, or even just do really well in.  It would be stupid of me to sit here and bash that stuff or the audience that enjoyed it  just because I'm not interested in it.  

[CheffoJeffo]

lol.  the funny thing about you is that you are trying to argue something you seem to know nothing about, other than what you can copy/paste from another site.  That list of games was what finally killed the arcades and paved the way for redemption?  I think you might want to do a little date checking there, the beginning of that list there correlates to the point where arcades were pretty much dead and then were brought back to life again.  I know that you know little to nothing about fighting games, and or just want to be willfully dismissive- so it's probably pointless to point this out, but I'll give it a shot...

Huh ?

It seems to me that you are the one who doesn't know what they are talking about. You are the one who has made it abundantly clear that he doesn't "get" how the Golden Age was golden and what it was like. Hell, I managed an arcade when SFII came out and you're going to tell me that I know nothing about what was happening around then ?

Like the title says ... 

[manman]

Uh... were you reading what I wrote?  That was a response to havok not you...   Also, for about the 5th time I already said I wasn't around during the golden era, and have never once said a bad thing about it.  I have no doubt that the golden age was as great as people say it was for those that experienced it, I never said one word to deny that... and  I did say were that I'm sure it took a lot of skill to be good at many of the games that were out during that time, but if that shows I don't "get" it, then ok.

The funny thing is that the poll is only meant to find out what eras you IDENTIFY with most- pretty much meaning "when were your formative arcade days".  It has nothing to do with arguing which era had the best games, or putting down other games to validate your enjoyment of the ones you played, yet somehow people are finding a way to make it into that.  If anything I would have expected the younger "less mature" players to be the ones twisting it into something like that but I guess that's my fault for trying to correlate age and maturity...

[CheffoJeffo]

Did you read what I wrote ?

Havok's list was an example of precisely what I wrote.

So far, you have come across like a kid who discovered video arcades when he found a game he really liked in 1990. That's good, but walking in for the last 20 minutes doesn't qualify you as an expert over those of us who have seen all of the movie.

There are many examples of knowledgeable people who say that SF2 killed the arcade ... there was an article in a magazine for arcade enthusiasts! Like I said, many of them even liked SF2 (I've had one in my game room), but that doesn't change what happened as a result of SF2.

It was great for you, but it wasn't great for the video arcade.

[CheffoJeffo]

The funny thing is that the poll is only meant to find out what eras you IDENTIFY with most- pretty much meaning "when were your formative arcade days".  It has nothing to do with arguing which era had the best games, or putting down other games to validate your enjoyment of the ones you played, yet somehow people are finding a way to make it into that.  If anything I would have expected the younger "less mature" players to be the ones twisting it into something like that but I guess that's my fault for trying to correlate age and maturity...

Maybe I missed some posts, but there is nothing in this thread that hasn't been said before and EVERY time somebody points out SF2, someone who hasn't read the previous eleventy discussions on the topic jumps on the bait, freaks out, says a bunch of things that are often wrong when all they need to say is -- "you know what, I really like SF2 and appreciate the subtle differences between versions".

But no, you guys have got to go all genesim on it.

 

[manman]

I'm struggling to find the the post were I wrote "listen up chumps- I am an expert of arcades and street fighter is the only good game to ever come out!"

if you want to say sfII killed the arcade, more power to you I guess.  I've made my point, and there are many references that back up what I've said.  If someone wants to make an argument that if SF had never come out (and something else were to have revived the arcade scene?) that it would have lasted much longer- I guess that could be argued.  And I'd love to have that argument, but it probably doesn't belong in this thread.  But I don't think theres really any way to argue at the very least that arcades weren't almost dead before it's arrival, and that it and other fighting games didn't create a new wave of success for the arcades.  I think you have to be pretty delusional to refute that, but hey whatever.

But what Havok said clearly shows he doesn't have much more than a superficial knowledge of fighting games.  Unless he's just fudging the list to make it longer for his point, even with a mediocre knowledge he'd know that games like the zero and alpha series, turbo/x etc are  the same game from different regions.  A little more than that and he'd know how different a game that seems the same from cursory inspection or play actually are when played at a higher level.  But I don't expect him to know or even care about any of that, because he has no interest in it.  that makes complete sense.  What doesn't make sense is bashing on it WITHOUT that knowledge,  because your reasoning ends up being flat out wrong.   If you read my posts, I've never said anything about me being an expert on arcades, games from one era being any better than another's or any of that.  All I've basically said is 1)  Whether or not you personally like/value a game it shouldn't stop you from understanding the value other see in it, or realizing that it takes skill just like the games you enjoy, and 2) similarly I don't see the need to bash on one era just to validate your own enjoyment of the era you liked.

Maybe I missed some posts, but there is nothing in this thread that hasn't been said before and EVERY time somebody points out SF2, someone who hasn't read the previous eleventy discussions on the topic jumps on the bait, freaks out, says a bunch of things that are often wrong when all they need to say is -- "you know what, I really like SF2 and appreciate the subtle differences between versions".

But no, you guys have got to go all genesim on it.

 

I don't know, maybe the reason there is such a disparity is because those that play the games realize in most cases the differences aren't subtle (or the gameplay they result in isn't), and those that don't don't.  Instead what probably should be said is "hey, I don't play the game or know it that well, so I can't really speak on it".  Same reason you don't hear me commenting on golden era games, because I know that just because I've played them or been in arcades where people have played them- doesn't mean I really know them.

I get it though- enjoying or defending a genre/players that weren't part of the golden age from being bashed with broad generalizations rooted in ignorance is not welcome around here.  Sorry for breaking your cardinal rule.

what I mean to say was "the golden era is the only actual era that ever existed in the history of arace gaming.  Any other game that ever came out after never caused more people to enter an arcade, and in fact caused the death of the arcades that were already dead- and also required absolutely no skill to play."

There you go

[Havok]

My point of the list was just an example - it wasn't meant to be definitive.  The point is, even if you cut it in half, it's too much. Fighter game after fighter game after fighter game was released. That's what I was trying to say, and you apparently missed it. You can pretty it up all you want with your "nuances" of each game, but let's face it - they're damn similar. Too similar. Done to death. If I really wanted to list by region I would be listing over 169 Street Fighter Titles. (Europe, Asia, USA, etc.) That's just Street Fighter!

I was around for all of it - and did play SF, MK, KOF, etc. You seem to think I don't have any experience there. As far as knowing the games, actually I do. I was the local champion in Street Fighter 2 back in the day for my arcade, and my brother in law (who at the time was my girlfriend's brother) was a regional champion. In fact, he still loves the fighters to this day and I would hazard a guess that he could probably wax you in a game - he's really that freaking good.

[CheffoJeffo]

I'm struggling to find the the post were I wrote "listen up chumps- I am an expert of arcades and street fighter is the only good game to ever come out!"

There are a few instances, but this one was pretty close ...

lol.  the funny thing about you is that you are trying to argue something you seem to know nothing about, other than what you can copy/paste from another site.

 

if you want to say sfII killed the arcade, more power to you I guess.  I've made my point, and there are many references that back up what I've said.  If someone wants to make an argument that if SF had never come out (and something else were to have revived the arcade scene?) that it would have lasted much longer- I guess that could be argued.  And I'd love to have that argument, but it probably doesn't belong in this thread.  But I don't think theres really any way to argue at the very least that arcades weren't almost dead before it's arrival, and that it and other fighting games didn't create a new wave of success for the arcades.  I think you have to be pretty delusional to refute that, but hey whatever.

Yes, but you fail to recognize that people like me have already seen all of that documentation. You seem to think that everybody else is ignorant on the subject. I'm going to go out on a limb and say that I have seen pretty much every single piece of documentary footage ever made about arcades (including a number who cite the same resurgence that you do) and that I read more on the subject than most people.

Arcades were dying and the changes to the industry that came about from the tunnelvisioned attempts to capture the quarters of teenaged boys with fighter games killed the business model and remaining culture to the point that there was absolutely no way back.

Would arcades have died anyway ? Yep, probably ... but we might have gotten a few more years of creativity out of it first.

I get it though- enjoying or defending a genre/players that weren't part of the golden age from being bashed with broad generalizations rooted in ignorance is not welcome around here.  Sorry for breaking your cardinal rule.

And there is another genesimism -- take a comment about the effect of a game series on the industry and twist it into being bashed to defend something else. Do you even know how I voted in the poll ? I can disagree with you about the effect that SF2 had on arcades and still not be an SF hater. I'll even bet that I have owned more SF variants than you have.

Take a deep breath and understand the points that are being made. Understand that they are about a game and not about you personally.

Otherwise you are going to flame out.

 

[manman]

well, to start out that first comparison you tried to make... what?  How does saying he knows nothing about fighting games equal to saying "I am an expert of arcades and street fighter is the only good game to ever come out!"  Not even close, haha.  I gave several examples to back up how he's showed he has a superficial knowledge of arcade games, and he hasn't yet responded to any of that (nor have you) to show any different.  But even if he had, those are still two wildly different statements.


I think you are misreading what I'm talking about when I say bashing on a game or players.  I'm not talking about having a different opinion on when arcades started dying out, or whether or not the game brought people back- its' more things like trying to stay the games take no skill or are all exactly the same, etc.  Basically just overall finding reasons to discount the games even without having much knowledge on them or the culture of players.

And arguing that you've owned more variations than I have... well.. i'd be willing to bet it's untrue, but I don't see how that even proves anything, haha.  You seem to equate owning something with knowing something about it.  You could own every street fighter game ever created but if you had never played them on more than a casual level you'd probably know a lot less than someone who put the time in on a few of them to get very good at them.  Still... totally unrelated to what has actually been said in the thread...

I don't really take any of this personally, I guess it's just kind of funny and hard to believe that people can so adamantly dismiss something they don't know anything about and refuse to admit it.  You're right, though I should give up and just realize that there's nothing you can do in that case since it's a willful decision.  Trust me, I've been in plenty of forums where having a different opinion than the majority or 'senior' members means you're opinion is automatically wrong/flaming/ or otherwise invalid regardless of any kind of logic or fact, so i'm not that worried about it, haha.

[CheffoJeffo]

And arguing that you've owned more variations than I have... well.. i'd be willing to bet it's untrue, but I don't see how that even proves anything, haha.  You seem to equate owning something with knowing something about it.  You could own every street fighter game ever created but if you had never played them on more than a casual level you'd probably know a lot less than someone who put the time in on a few of them to get very good at them.  Still... totally unrelated to what has actually been said in the thread...

The point there was that *you* are claiming that havok and I are hating on SF ... why the hell would I have SF cabinets in my home if I hated the game ?

I have NO problem saying that I know less about the different flavours of SF than you do. You could kick ---my bottom--- at SF.

Where I think I have the advantage in making my argument is more experience with the arcade phenomenon. I know what happened during the different eras. I know what the arcades were like.

Nothing about being good at Street Fighter Eleventy Purple Teletubby Edition  gives you any credibility when it comes to your contention that SF was the second coming of Jesus for the arcade world.

[CheffoJeffo]

I'm struggling to find the the post were I wrote "listen up chumps- I am an expert of arcades and street fighter is the only good game to ever come out!"

Let's try again ...

 I gave several examples to back up how he's showed he has a superficial knowledge of arcade games, and he hasn't yet responded to any of that (nor have you) to show any different.

I think that qualifies at least for the "listen up chumps" portion.

 

[manman]

The point there was that *you* are claiming that havok and I are hating on SF ... why the hell would I have SF cabinets in my home if I hated the game ?

I have NO problem saying that I know less about the different flavours of SF than you do. You could kick ---my bottom--- at SF.

Where I think I have the advantage in making my argument is more experience with the arcade phenomenon. I know what happened during the different eras. I know what the arcades were like.

Nothing about being good at Street Fighter Eleventy Purple Teletubby Edition  gives you any credibility when it comes to your contention that SF was the second coming of Jesus for the arcade world.

You're right.  Luckily, I never made that claim... You are ascribing some sort of intention to my posts that I don't think I ever implied.  This is about sheer numbers, not a value which is totally subjective.  I don't claim to have read as much documentation as you have, and never claimed to have any sort of knowledge on the complete history of arcades- but that doesn't mean I haven't read some documentation or that I wasn't there for part of it as well.  I was there before street fighter (but long after the golden age) when arcades were all but dead.  I wasn't there, but KNOW that there was a golden age when arcade caming was much more 'alive' and going strong /before/ that.  So... when fighting games came out, and I saw with my own eyes more arcades spring up all over the place, and a lot more people in arcades and playing arcade games than I had before, AND I read information out there that reflects that, I find it hard not to draw the conclusion that there was a resurgence in arcade gaming or a 'boom' or whatever you want to call it.  You taking that numbers based statement along with my own affinity for the fighting game genre has somehow let you to extract that I am saying that it was the second coming of jesus, and better or equal to arcade going in the golden age, or SOMETHING...I have no idea, but I never said any of that.  I can't compare it to the golden age, because as I said a million times I wasn't there.  I would never claim for the crowd of people that enjoyed the 90's era to be better than those who were around during the golden age, because I didn't know those people...all I really said was that I myself enjoyed that era whether it was different or not.

When I said all of that stuff, apparently it became necessary to counter with claims that these games take no skill or were all the same or whatever- and all I did was try to counter some of that, due to the fact (which I guess you are admitting), that I DO happen to know those games fairly well- that's pretty much it.

If the numbers of more people going to the arcade post SFII than immediately pre, or the opinions on what that did to arcade culture in general differ from mine, I'm more than happy to debate and discuss that as it's own topic.  I just don't see how dismissing the amount of skill it takes without having the knowledge to say that is valid or even related to that arguement...

[manman]

I'm struggling to find the the post were I wrote "listen up chumps- I am an expert of arcades and street fighter is the only good game to ever come out!"

Let's try again ...

I gave several examples to back up how he's showed he has a superficial knowledge of arcade games, and he hasn't yet responded to any of that (nor have you) to show any different.

I think that qualifies at least for the "listen up chumps" portion.

 

Hahaha, you'd actually have me there, but that was a typo... I meant to say fighting games not arcade games, which I do think is true.  If you still think those are the same things, then ok.  But the second part of that is still that you some how think i'm comparing these fighting games to other games (or the era to other eras) and trying to say they are somehow better which I've also never done.

[CheffoJeffo]

But the second part of that is still that you some how think i'm comparing these fighting games to other games (or the era to other eras) and trying to say they are somehow better which I've also never done.

I'm pretty sure that I would have written that if that is what I think ... I'm not known for keeping my thoughts bottled up ... but I can't recall any statement of mine in this thread to that effect.

 

EDIT: And upon rereading this thread I can't see that Havok said that either.

[manman]

Well then, perhaps I am also misreading you, but when say things like

"So far, you have come across like a kid who discovered video arcades when he found a game he really liked in 1990. That's good, but walking in for the last 20 minutes doesn't qualify you as an expert over those of us who have seen all of the movie."

or saying I think the resurgence of arcade going was the second coming of jesus, etc it sounds to me like you are trying to say I somehow claimed I was an expert on arcades or I attach some supreme value over other eras to that era.  For the post part I was never even referring to you when I was talking about bashing a game without knowing about it, that was only havok.  Although the one comment you made that I would disagree with or ascribe that kind of sentiment to was you saying something like "but let's not pretend that SF2 was the second coming, or even something good "-  that second part, I mean come on.  That's why I was making the point that whether or not someone personally likes something I don't see a reason to devalue it overall.  Clearly there was quite a large audience that thought the game was good.  It clearly lead to a lage increase in people going to arcades for a while.  There's still a large competitive scene here, in Europe, in Japan where people still even play games from back then (just as I assume there is still a scene or hard core players of some games from the golden age).  I mean- I don't see why some people can't see that and realize that for a game to have that kind of effect on people there must be some good value to it.  I never played the games of the golden age, but I can still tell that if people put so much value in it and still like the games after all this time, they must be good!   I don't get things like inferring that without games like the fighting games, the arcade could have died "with dignity".  To me that's bashing something without having experienced it in the way that people who enjoy it did.

[Ond]

Loved the Golden Age, such awesome creativity in the games..ok..back to the big SF debate (where's HarumaN's humor when it's needed?)

[DillonFoulds]

I maintain that I was born about 20 years too late....

I'd be okay with 10 years earlier (1987 -> 1977)

[CheffoJeffo]

Although the one comment you made that I would disagree with or ascribe that kind of sentiment to was you saying something like "but let's not pretend that SF2 was the second coming, or even something good "-  that second part, I mean come on.

You do understand that I was referring to the effect that SF2 had on the arcade industry, not to the game itself, right ?


EDIT:

I don't get things like inferring that without games like the fighting games, the arcade could have died "with dignity".  To me that's bashing something without having experienced it in the way that people who enjoy it did.

The point of that post was that the tunnelvision that resulted from the popularity of SF2 resulted in a death of creativity in new game development. Developers just wanted to create, and ops wanted to buy, the next big fighting game. That represents a tremendous loss from the prior years (even the lean years) when there was a much wider assortment of games being developed that had broad appeal beyond a specific, flighty, demographic.

The result was that the industry lost the general appeal, then, predictably, lost the fighter fanboys. At the end of the day, we ended up with entertainment centres overloaded with redemption games designed specifically to cheat children by offering $1 prizes for $10 of play. It became something completely devoid of dignity.

[opt2not]

Loved the Golden Age, such awesome creativity in the games..ok..back to the big SF debate (where's HarumaN's humor when it's needed?)

This isn't a debate. It's a pointless old-school vs. new-school c ck measuring argument, which I've been trying to nail down the actual topic of. Mostly, I'm just amused by the defensiveness of this whole thing...
People getting worked up over some pretty pointless things.

Arcade games forever IMO!

[manman]

Sure, but I think to say that it had a negative effect or that having it there somehow stopped the arcade industry from dying with dignity is a comment on the game itself.  Although I assume you probably weren't referring to one version of the game but the narrow genre.  I would even be inclined to agree with you on a lot of points such as it causing tunnel vision with a lot of developers (although there WERE other genres doing fairly well once arcades started to become popular again), and that in and of itself being a bad thing.  Honestly, there were few times until this last back and forth we just had were my comments about disparaging the genre were directed to something you specifically said.  A lot of what you've said are things I would actually agree with or are pretty good points of debate at least.  The only things I can't agree with are taking down the value of a game/genre or it's players without having a pretty good knowledge of that game.  I guess as far as the players go, if you owned an arcade you'd definitely have your own opinion on that, I personally have seen both good and bad people in that scene (both in those days and now) and I have to imagine any era had it's share of jerks and good people.

I can honestly say that if it were turned around and I thought someone who identified more with the era I did was bashing on the golden era games etc, I would be making pretty much the same case.  Not that I could defend the games specifically without a strong knowledge of them, but I'd still be making the case that it doesn't make sense to claim something takes no skill or otherwise dismiss it if you don't know as much about it as the people who enjoy it.  If you think I took some things out of context and there was honestly /none/ of that happening, then maybe I'm mistaken, but I don't think I've totally misread some of the comments made toward the game/genre...

This isn't a debate. It's a pointless old-school vs. new-school c ck measuring argument, which I've been trying to nail down the actual topic of.

haha, but it's not!  That's the whole thing I'm trying to say I'm against... I think the era I idnetify with most was awesome, and I think the golden age was probably awesome too! I have nothing at all bad to say about it, and never tried to compare the two in terms of quality...



EDIT:  and with regard to the edit you made CheffoJeffo , I totally agree.  I guess I personally tend to think of it more as the genre kind of eating itself alive rather than killing arcades, because without having revived it first, there never would have been that dynamic.  It's more like that era became a victim of it's own success- instead of developers branching out and being more creative many of them kept trying to capitalize on the success of one thing.  I think that for the leaders/Pioneers in the space, much of the time they were making good games that people valued but for all the copy cats or game companies that didn't want to find/create their own thing it was definitely to the detriment of the overeall culture. 

[CheffoJeffo]

The only things I can't agree with are taking down the value of a game/genre or it's players without having a pretty good knowledge of that game.  I guess as far as the players go, if you owned an arcade you'd definitely have your own opinion on that, I personally have seen both good and bad people in that scene (both in those days and now) and I have to imagine any era had it's share of jerks and good people.

I never said that fighting games suck and the only thing I have said about the players is that they were a flighty niche market.

[kagaden]

The only things I can't agree with are taking down the value of a game/genre or it's players without having a pretty good knowledge of that game.  I guess as far as the players go, if you owned an arcade you'd definitely have your own opinion on that, I personally have seen both good and bad people in that scene (both in those days and now) and I have to imagine any era had it's share of jerks and good people.

I never said that fighting games suck and the only thing I have said about the players is that they were a flighty niche market.

A "flighty niche market" that's been around for longer than the golden age ever lasted... SFII is almost 20 years old.
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3172939

Guess what gentlemen... while you cling bitterly onto your fond nostalgia for the lost "golden age"... We're still alive, kickin, hosting tournaments, and putting out arcade games.

You and havok are clearly trolling by not understanding what makes the genre successful and pitting it as a reason it "killed arcades". Let me reiterate, SFII had nothing to do with the decline of the "golden age", that was far before due to dev's at the time pumping out "golden age" shovelware/cloneware. See Atari crash. Don't worry though, it happens with everything that's successful and shows profit.

What killed arcades was console architecture and power catching up to and overtaking the market for arcades.

For old men who claim to have "seen the movie", you have a pretty poor grasp on gaming history. Sounds like a classic case of built up resentment and inability to evolve with the times to me.

I've stated my opinion and I'm done with this thread. Manman, you have my respect for trying to talk sense into these guys sensibly. Haters gonna hate tho. /shrug

[manman]

well, like I said- I don't support dumping on any era or gamers that enjoy it even if we have differing opinions.  SF has been around for a long time, and yeah the fighting game scene is very active, but those golden era games have been around for a LOT longer with their own dedicated following still living strong so if you're talking about longevity I don't think SF holds a candle to that haha.  That I can definitely admit,  & fighting games (or really arcades in general during later eras) owe their existence to that era so you gotta respect that. Ultimately I'm with Opt2Not- arcade games forever!

[CheffoJeffo]

I never said that fighting games suck and the only thing I have said about the players is that they were a flighty niche market.

A "flighty niche market" that's been around for longer than the golden age ever lasted... SFII is almost 20 years old.
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3172939

They were a flighty niche market as far as the video arcade went (and, hence, a dangerous thing upon which to base a business model that required their absolute loyalty) -- they migrated to other platforms quickly, particularly as they aged and those platforms outstripped the arcade. NOTE: I don't blame the players for that business model -- they had nothing to do with that -- I blame the operators.

You and havok are clearly trolling by not understanding what makes the genre successful and pitting it as a reason it "killed arcades". Let me reiterate, SFII had nothing to do with the decline of the "golden age", that was far before due to dev's at the time pumping out "golden age" shovelware/cloneware. See Atari crash. Don't worry though, it happens with everything that's successful and shows profit.

Obviously SFII had nothing to do with the decline of the Golden Age and nobody has said that ... the Golden Age ended 7 years before SFII ever came out. 

You guys are attributing things to me, and to havok, that neither of us have said in this thread.

I'm sorry that I can't seem to get across that I don't hate the game at all, but that I believe that the business success of SFII had negative effects on the arcade industry.

I'll leave this thread with a link to one of the prior discussion involving SFII and the death of arcades, in which I didn't post at all -- perhaps they can make the same point without generating the confusion that I have:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=43124.0

 

[Smeghead]

Good to see option one is winning the vote

Its those that remember seeing Space Invaders for the first time and being completely blown away that were able to experience the birth of ALL these games.
Its the memory of those feelings as kids that urges us to spend so much damn time and money trying to recreate them today I spose   

[manman]

well, when you say "you guys", please don't lump me in with things like claiming you said fighting games killed the golden era, or saying you guys were clinging to the era and couldn't evolve.  I knew exactly how you'd respond when I read that because obviously you never said that, and I don't agree.  And like I said before a lot of what I was saying until you responded to me was never directed at you.  When you were making the argument about whether or not SFII caused a resurgence or how it was for the game industry I disagreed, but still thought it was fine to have that argument.  That was never where I got the "bashing" on sf thing.  If I DID take some of havok's posts out of context or misread them then I'm sorry, but when someone says something like "a tired, worn out game genre", i mean...that's not arguing a point, that's just trying to disparage something.  So I appologize for anything I did misread, but like I said- I don't think I COMPLETELY fabricated some of the points I thought were being made against the game/genre itself.  Anyway I'll check out the thread you posted, but I think we've all made our points... I'm not going to jump into that thread too, haha.

[Havok]

well, when you say "you guys", please don't lump me in with things like claiming you said fighting games killed the golden era, or saying you guys were clinging to the era and couldn't evolve.  I knew exactly how you'd respond when I read that because obviously you never said that, and I don't agree.  And like I said before a lot of what I was saying until you responded to me was never directed at you.  When you were making the argument about whether or not SFII caused a resurgence or how it was for the game industry I disagreed, but still thought it was fine to have that argument.  That was never where I got the "bashing" on sf thing.  If I DID take some of havok's posts out of context or misread them then I'm sorry, but when someone says something like "a tired, worn out game genre", i mean...that's not arguing a point, that's just trying to disparage something.  So I appologize for anything I did misread, but like I said- I don't think I COMPLETELY fabricated some of the points I thought were being made against the game/genre itself.  Anyway I'll check out the thread you posted, but I think we've all made our points... I'm not going to jump into that thread too, haha.

Let's get another thing straight - I do like fighter games too, however let's also be honest; there is little to none in the innovation department when it comes to the eleventy bazzilionth version that gets released. That's the thing you guys are missing, and it's what Smeghead just posted. Back then you'd walk into the arcade, and blam! something entirely new and amazing. Some totally cool game concept never seen before. You just don't get that with Street Fighter Alpha X, Part 17 Turbo Grand Master Tournament Hyper Warrior's Dream Edition.

And Cheffo is right - it is a flighty niche market. How many of kagaden's tournaments play the original Street Fighter? I'm thinking zero. Fighter fanboys are always looking for a new fix. And that's where the console really kicks the crap out of the arcade, especially today. Operators will never get back back what a new machine costs before the customers tire of the game.

[manman]

Actually quite a few of those tournaments still feature games from that era.  Super turbo, marvel vs capcom 2, cvs2, third strike etc.  There is where I'm talking about speaking on something without knowing about it.  Casual players of any game have always been fickle, but the tournament scene is the wrong place to look when you're trying to prove flighty, haha.

As for variations in the different series- again, unless you played at anything more than surface level it's a pointless argument.  guys who didn't will continue to say they are the same, guys who did will continue to say not by a long shot. but I DO agree that it made an environment where OTHER developers weren't innovating with different types of games than those.  I think there are a lot of other factors in addition to the popularity of fighting games, but that's a different conversation

[Havok]

Actually quite a few of those tournaments still feature games from that era.  Super turbo, marvel vs capcom 2, cvs2, third strike etc.  There is where I'm talking about speaking on something without knowing about it.  Casual players of any game have always been fickle, but the tournament scene is the wrong place to look when you're trying to prove flighty, haha

Why do you think I chose the original Street Fighter in my statement? I do know what I'm talking about - I would never have said 2, or Turbo as I know there are many diehards with those. Normally the first original game with the golden age is good forever. The later versions are many times shunned. You don't see that with the fighter crowd, hence the flighty aspect.

It's a shame you guys haven't experienced the older eras, then you'd have a better perspective...

[Smeghead]

Lets face it you've got to be what...... 35 years old or more to have been alive and old enough to have played those really early games when they first came out.
Its not a competition, but im glad I was around to experience the thrill as each new 'ground breaking' game hit the arcades

[manman]

I realize you said the original, but the reason I answered with what I did was because it's not about secific's it's about the point you are making.  To say it's a 'flighty' audience always looking for the new thing, but then to look at the crowd and see that they are playing games from over 10 years ago in the tournaments...  that doesn't really fit together, even if it's not EXACTLY the original sf or sfII they aren't playing...  It's like just nit picking for no reason.  I know this will be pointless to say, but I'll try one last time... The reasons for many of these variations were due to player feedback, or improvements /within/ a specific series.   Of course the players are gonig to pick the more refined games from each series or the ones that work better in tournament to include.  After going through the early SFII revisions, ST happened to be the one that matched what that crowd wnated best.  Same with 3S when it comes to SFIII.   You can choose to look at it as a bad thing that revisions on certain series of the franchise were made, but I choose to see it as being responsive to your audience and continuing to give the players improvements in the days before things like downloadable content and patches etc.

I FULLY understand and believe you about what you're saying that having the variety of different games that held up over the years for players from that era was one of the great things about it that you didn't see nearly as much of in the fighting game times.  I'm not debating that, I'm just saying that if you didn't play these games at a more competitive level it's easy to gloss over the differences or make judgements on the audience without any solid basis for it.

[Havok]

I agree with you about the tournament point - you're right. I was combining two different points to make and perhaps could have said it better. The vast majority of fighter fans are flighty, tournament guys pick their favorite. Let's also be realistic - the developers did respond to requests, however it was just to make more money, and they just kept pushing out the same stuff - which is my main complaint with the genre, and the reason for my earlier statement about it being a worn out genre.

I also used to play tournaments back in the day and went to many events where my brother-in-law kicked some serious ass. So, for you to say I don't understand the nuances and versions is to speak about something you don't know about. It's just that I've been around for the whole deal and can compare appropriately, rather than rely on brief glimpses of the other periods in arcade history.

Anyways, enough about the finer points - let's give someone else a chance to voice their opinions on the era they most identify with!

 

[(+_+)]

I believe we all identify with the Arcade Era that made our own experience tops. For me it was the Golden Age only because I grew up in that era. Because of this I am biased. All 5 senses we're heightened whenever I entered the arcade. It was an amazing and magical time for me as I am sure it was for everybody else who loved going to the arcade as a kid, teenager or adult.

It's funny the way we compare our time slotted experience with one another and expect mutual agreement. Some could argue games were more original back in my day and others could argue the games these days are much cooler. But it's the era that did it for each and every one of us that counts. That microcosm of infinite fun that we refuse to let go of because it defined our childhood and continues to bless us with fond memories.

I know I miss them.

[syph007]

I missed out on the golden age since I didn't grow up with access to an arcade.  So my fav games are pretty random.  My top picks right now are dig dug, arkanoid, Green Beret, Street Fighter 2, and Golden Tee.  So... not really one category.  

The first time I ever had access to an actual arcade machine was in my university dorm in 1992, which was a Street Fighter 2.  So that games brings back memories of beer fueled late night competitions.   And its pretty much only that game that I find fun for that reason.  I totally dont see the point in the spin off fighters, since this was the only one I learned to play, and the others were just copies with random other special moves.

[manman]

agreed- I know any game companies are in it to make money.   I would have to be in denial to not think capcom and other companies weren't doing a lot of that to keep the money flowing in too .  That's why I also think consoles had a lot to do with the tunnel vision as well...as games became bigger and bigger corporate business, everyone was looking to capitalize off of as little work as possible and repackage existing games.  It was bound to happen as gaming just becamea more of a behemoth industry in general, both arcade and console.  There are times when it leads valid improvements that add to the community, and other times where it just ends up being crappy shovelware, and I would totally agree that the amount of that increased by far from the golden age up until the present.

[opt2not]

I love fighting games. I've been really into them ever since the 90's. My two franchises are Street Fighter II and Soul Edge/Calibur. I've played every Street Fighter since SF1 (fricken hard vs. the cpu!), played all the releases since, and play SSF4 about 3 times a week now. I've played a few tourneys in the last 2 years, not EVO though, can't afford the trip.

I'm not going to make some boneheaded statement of what era is better, because that's just pointless and immature. I picked Golden only because it came first in my gaming addiction. It was also the era that began it all and paved the way for every game-play design there is out there. You can't pick up a game now-a-days and not see the rampant influence of the golden age. For that, I had to vote for Golden Age.

Funny enough, I've been working in the game industry for over 10 years now, and most guys I worked with that are 30+ years old can tell of stories on what got them into the industry. A lot of them are from the arcade era of the early to mid-80's and attribute their career path because of playing a game from that time.
Most of the young guys call out SF2 as their major influence (some even siting N64 games,  gasp!) ...which makes sense given that was when their childhood was...we all cling to childhood memories.

A "flighty niche market" that's been around for longer than the golden age ever lasted... SFII is almost 20 years old.
http://www.1up.com/do/newsStory?cId=3172939

Well, if you want to get all defensive and into a pissing contest, then one can argue the golden era has indeed lasted longer. They've released retro games on new tech all throughout the history of SF2, even now! How many versions of Tetris is out there, how many times has it been re-released? Not to mention remake-2.5D-versions of retro games that have quite a following. So technically, the golden era has lasted longer...you can probably thank cell phones and home consoles for keeping it alive.

Guess what gentlemen... while you cling bitterly onto your fond nostalgia for the lost "golden age"... We're still alive, kickin, hosting tournaments, and putting out arcade games.

You're doing the same by "bitterly clinging to your fond nostalgia for the SF2 era" as well. Golden Age, or Retro, is still alive as well given the fact that people still religiously play retro games today, there are retro-game-tourneys that still happen, even world record attempts are still being made 30 years later. Heck, even a lot of new "indie" games based on old-school game-play are still being developed today.

This statement is also fictitious, aside from a handful of fighting tourneys a year, unless you're living in Akihabara Japan, you're not actually experiencing the same fighty arcade craze that we had in the 90's. Most arcades today definitely carry more DDR/beat-timing games over SF4..

I've stated my opinion and I'm done with this thread. Manman, you have my respect for trying to talk sense into these guys sensibly. Haters gonna hate tho. /shrug

Haters gonna hate for sure. Visa-versa.
There is no way of arguing a person's preference, let people like/think whatever they want. In the end, what matters is what makes yourself happy.
The only thing you should have got your panties in a bunch from was HanoiBoi's "no skill" comment, which me and manman was fast to refute.

I believe we all identify with the Arcade Era that made our own experience tops. For me it was the Golden Age only because I grew up in that era. Because of this I am biased. All 5 senses we're heightened whenever I entered the arcade. It was an amazing and magical time for me as I am sure it was for everybody else who loved going to the arcade as a kid, teenager or adult.

It's funny the way we compare our time slotted experience with one another and expect mutual agreement. Some could argue games were more original back in my day and others could argue the games these days are much cooler. But it's the era that did it for each and every one of us that counts. That microcosm of infinite fun that we refuse to let go of because it defined our childhood and continues to bless us with fond memories.

I know I miss them.

Best, most sense made in this silly thread right here.

[DashRendar]

I think there was also a bit of laziness by game developers that lowered the quality of the games.

As was mentioned, there were around 32 variations of Street Fighter (and around 8 variations of Pac-Man, to be fair).

It's similar to what Hollywood has been doing in recent years.  They are remaking old movies or TV shows into movies rather than churning out new material.

The Golden Age was near the beginning of the arcade experience, so most of the games were brand new.  

A lot of the ideas seem silly, but they played great (like Dig Dug, a little astronaut guy digging around pumping air into dragons).

I think game companies started losing their innovation, and instead went with what they considered safe ("well we made a ton of money off Street Fighter, so lets keep milking that cash cow!").

Add the home console market into the equation, and it was a death sentence.  That's not to say there weren't great games, but they spent too much time regurgigating old material.  

The excitement to play "that cool new game" disappeared.

[BadMouth]

A lot of the ideas seem silly, but they played great (like Dig Dug, a little astronaut guy digging around pumping air into dragons).

It's been posted before, but here is where the golden age game ideas came from and why they are great:
http://www.cracked.com/video_16019_video-game-pitch-meeting-1979.html

Perhaps if game developers did more drugs nowadays, they'd come up with new crazy ideas nobody in the right state of mind would.

[BadMouth]

This debate reminds me of people who think the music released druing their youth must be the absolute best music ever made.

I swore I'd always listen to the newest, cutting edge rock music......unless it became really really whiney.    DOH! 

[manman]

I'm not sure where people are getting the idea that either side was ever arguing "my era was better than yours".  I pretty much said the whole time that I thought both eras were great for those who identified most with them, and that one shoudln't need to disparage another game/era to enjoy their own.  I also mentioned how the original thread topic was even 'what do you identify with most' not 'which era is the best'.  And while I did think there was some cutting down of the fighting game genre (mistakenly or not), I don't think they were trying to argue that point either.  It was more about how people percieve the genre/the effect it had on arcade culture.

[opt2not]

Perhaps if game developers did more drugs nowadays, they'd come up with new crazy ideas nobody in the right state of mind would.

Who says they still don't?

In all seriousness though, it's not the lack of devs not putting out crazy ideas, it's the abundance of publishers and share-holders squashing those creative expressions mostly because of sales - basically what sells the most, what markets best mentality.
That was the beauty of the old school gaming era, you could put out any wacked out idea and it would be in the hands of the audience without any problem - the industry was still fresh. The amount of red-tape you need to go through to get a game through the regulated channels now-a-days is ridiculous. It's extremely hard to get a new original IP game published today...unless of course you've got the money for marketing and publishing yourself.  

[TOK]

I'm not sure where people are getting the idea that either side was ever arguing "my era was better than yours".  I pretty much said the whole time that I thought both eras were great for those who identified most with them, and that one shoudln't need to disparage another game/era to enjoy their own.  I also mentioned how the original thread topic was even 'what do you identify with most' not 'which era is the best'.  And while I did think there was some cutting down of the fighting game genre (mistakenly or not), I don't think they were trying to argue that point either.  It was more about how people percieve the genre/the effect it had on arcade culture.

I'd like to just take a moment to say how fantastic all this discussion is and how much I've learned from it.


I'd like to, but unfortunately I can't since its actually horrible.

[Epyx]

In all seriousness though, it's not the lack of devs not putting out crazy ideas, it's the abundance of publishers and share-holders squashing those creative expressions mostly because of sales - basically what sells the most, what markets best mentality.

Bang on...that is the main reason companies like EA bring out the same dredge season after season (sports games using only slight variations from the late 90s core game engines) or year after year.

EA has abandoned the original spirit that Trip Hawkins envisioned in the early 80s...that EA would be a community of electronic artists and art is always subjective and that is what makes so many of those early games so unique:

M.U.L.E
Archon
Seven Cities of Gold
Bard's Tale

That is the EA I remember...the one I worked at in the late 90s went to hell in a handbasket for exactly the reasons Opt2not pointed out.  Their first hint at a creative downfall was the plundering of Origin Systems (System Shock/Ultima Underworld).

Thankfully their are still creative companies...its just a matter of finding them through the dredge...Stardock (Galciv2 etc), From Software, Firaxis, Rockstar etc

[Gorotsuki]

Then came along 90's EA....
SWORD OF SODAN on Sega Genesis.
I've not looked at their games since.
I actually beat that piece of crap,
I was a really bored kid.

[manman]

I'd like to just take a moment to say how fantastic all this discussion is and how much I've learned from it.


I'd like to, but unfortunately I can't since its actually horrible.

and yet somehow the world keeps spinning.  Imagine that...

not sure how that even relates to or changes anything you quoted, but ok... I'll try harder to drop a wisdom filled jewel like you just did next time

[Havok]

Don't mind TOK - he just likes to post so he can have a higher post count...

[RayB]

It used to be, me and a couple (or few) friends would go "arcade hopping" (sometimes combining it with bar-hopping, for a better experience  ). We'd walk into an arcade... there'd be a good variety of games, some old, some new... we play a few oldies, but mainly try to get at the new ones.... then.... came fighting games. It was cool at first, but then the arcade-hopping experience became: Go into arcade; See all the new games are fighting variants; Yawn really loudly and then leave after spending a lot less time and money than we used to.

A lot of people, A LOT, reacted like this. Especially chicks. (bye bye 49% of your potential customer base).

[saint]

It used to be, me and a couple (or few) friends would go "arcade hopping" (sometimes combining it with bar-hopping, for a better experience  ). We'd walk into an arcade... there'd be a good variety of games, some old, some new... we play a few oldies, but mainly try to get at the new ones.... then.... came fighting games. It was cool at first, but then the arcade-hopping experience became: Go into arcade; See all the new games are fighting variants; Yawn really loudly and then leave after spending a lot less time and money than we used to.

A lot of people, A LOT, reacted like this. Especially chicks. (bye bye 49% of your potential customer base).

+1!

I don't mind fighting games for other folks, but they're not my cup of tea. When they crowded out the older games is when the arcades died for me. I don't have a basis to say if they helped or hindered arcades in general, but that's when arcades stopped getting my money.

[manman]

someone before said that virtually every public venue had arcade games back in the golden era- how many different kinds of places did you actually find a lot of games?  I probably started playing arcade games around 86 or so where I mostly found them in pizza places and movie theaters until I actually found arcades.  I never saw many girls though, wish we could have kept THAT trend around  

[opt2not]

someone before said that virtually every public venue had arcade games back in the golden era- how many different kinds of places did you actually find a lot of games?  I probably started playing arcade games around 86 or so where I mostly found them in pizza places and movie theaters until I actually found arcades.  I never saw many girls though, wish we could have kept THAT trend around  

I remember convenience stores, and malls had them scattered around the common areas.  I also remember restaurants (mostly family ones) putting them in the lobby/foyer areas, those were mostly cabarets though.

Roller rinks too...though I didn't hang out there much because they were ridden with drug dealers that my folks warned me about. Funny enough, the actual arcade & billiards I went to when I was young was pretty good at keeping it clean of dealers and the like.
 

[Havok]

someone before said that virtually every public venue had arcade games back in the golden era- how many different kinds of places did you actually find a lot of games?  I probably started playing arcade games around 86 or so where I mostly found them in pizza places and movie theaters until I actually found arcades.  I never saw many girls though, wish we could have kept THAT trend around  

That was me - and yes, they were everywhere! Every hotel would have them, in addition to the places already mentioned, and of course every bar. In fact back in the late 70's and early 80's I used to go on Saturday with my Dad to his work (he owned his own business) and I would go across the street and play the arcade games at the bar. They had four plus a pin. They always chuckled when I came in at around noon and asked for quarters to play the games. My Dad would give me money to spend some time there. That's where I played Space Invaders when it was first released and me and my Dad also played Missile Command together when he was done for the day. I got to the point where a five would last me a few hours.

[RayB]

*EVERY WHERE*
Every convenience store, even the small dingy ones had 1 or 2 machines in them. Restaurants, bowling alleys, ice rinks, hockey arenas, movie theatres, malls, department stores (usually by an entrance), gas stations, ... basically anywhere that today you might find either a vending machine or "Stacker" prize machine, back in the day there'd be a video game or two.  This was especially true when PacMan was big as everybody who owned a business heard these machines could "print money".

[ahofle]

I think what killed the arcade experience for me was the fighting games...no not because it was putting money in to continue ...it was that the learning curve to play the game even competently was so high.  So you kept feeding quarters into the machine just to learn to play.  Golden age games had a minimal learning curve Take pac man, you move up, down, left, right ..eat the pellets...avoid teh ghosts.  The person doing this is just as equipped to finish the game as the person who had done it before.  By contrast with the MK SF games ...there were all these pecial moves that required you to simultaneously press up and left press three buttons, stick out your tongue and put your left big toe in your right ear...you need these moves to survive even a short time and there is no instruction on unlocking those moves.  Yes, to be really good at a golden age game, you needed to learn a pattern or gain experience, but there was no requireement to learn anything to play the game.  Heck you can get really far on pac man or DK without knowing any patterns..you're just not going to break the record.

This is a very astute observation.  I always disliked that about fighters as well.  You basically had to put in your time to learn the special moves/combos.  Before the innerwebs and search engines, that equated to lots of quarters.  To me, that was the element of those games that was completely skill-lacking.  And without them, you would be ripped to shreds in 1v1 play.  It's similar to why I don't care for MORPGs.  The people who spend 12 hours a day get better 'stuff' than you, making it more of a test of patience than skill.

On a side note, I find it interesting that the mid to late eighties has such a large number of (silent) followers, almost as many as the 90s!  I always thought the games of that era were heavily underrated simply because of the 'crash'.   I don't recall enjoy those games any less than during the golden age.  Some of my favorite arcade games are from that era, particularly the Atari System 1 and 2 games.  Marble Madness, 720, APB, Paperboy, etc -- such creativity and originality in some of those games.

[TOK]

Don't mind TOK - he just likes to post so he can have a higher post count...

Uh, I've been here longer than you and have 900 less posts. Just sayin'.

The back and forth over this just wore me down. Should have just ignored it. Sorry.

[Havok]

Don't mind TOK - he just likes to post so he can have a higher post count...

Uh, I've been here longer than you and have 900 less posts. Just sayin'.

You've been here a whopping 6 days longer than me. Is that really enough to brag on how you've been here longer than me?

Anyways, I was just kidding around with you - don't read into it.

Post whore.

[Smeghead]

[DeLuSioNal29]

Do you know what really got ruined?  Not the golden arcades by fighters, but the original topic that was posted... by all this arguing crap.

The back and forth over this just wore me down. Should have just ignored it. Sorry.

+1 on this last comment.  It was one of the best things said here.

Can't we all just get along and appreciate each other's stories?  Sheesh.

DeLuSioNaL29

[RayB]

One time, at band camp... I ...

You know what else related to fighters killed it for "us regular folk"? You'd find a free machine, try to play, and some punk comes up sticks his quarter in and then "challenges" you. Then kicks your ass (usually using the "cheapest" character available). I couldn't stand that. I wasn't there to play some kid who spends every day in the arcade.

[Havok]

That's true - I never did like that. Ask me first if you want to challenge me, don't just jump in and ruin my game...

[manman]

Oh yeah, I do remember seeing them in some of the places you mentioned still during the mid-late 80's and early 90's- bowling alleys, convenient stores, etc, and some restaurants, but probably a lot fewer.  Never saw them in department stores though.

It's interesting the things that some people dislike about the 90's era are the same things that some specifically liked about it.  Things like the more involved inputs/learning curve before internet was as widespread were fun for me because it got people talking to eachother etc.  It was fun (for me at least) to learn from people and share information, and build a community of friends who were interested in the same thing as me.  Of course, some people were jerks and wouldn't want to help anyone else etc, but that's just the way it goes I guess.  It is a lot to have to go through to play a game competently though, I can see how if you don't care about all that and just want to drop in a quarter and have fun for a while it would be a turn off..
I also welcomed any punks that wanted to drop in a quarter during my game (partly because I don't think playing the cpu in fighting games is all that interesting), but also because it just gave me a chance to test my skills and see if I was improving.  One point of pride I hear from people who played during the golden age is "I could put in one quarter and last x amount of time".  That was a similar point of pride for a lot of people who played fighting games I think. To see how long you could hold your spot on a machine with just one quarter.

[shateredsoul]

I remember in 3rd.. grade everyone would go to the local convenience store to play street fighter II.  I don't remember girls being at arcades, other than chuckee cheese.  I also remember the huge arcade in the mall where I would get to play teenage mutant ninja turtles II.  After street fighter II king of the fighters, puzzle bobble, and other games came around.  I remember World Heroes.. but mostly console.

I actually remember playing arcade games more often when my family would go visit Mexico.  I experienced Snow Bros. Jr., Street fighter 1, Outrun, many snk fighters, and capcom fighters here.  All the kids played arcades over there.

I also remember The local donut shop was another good place in LA and the local pizza place had a Bubble Bobble machine which I loved but my parents never let me play for too long.  They still have a Ms. pacman speed hack machine at the donut shop to this day (not sure if it's the same one).

Most games since then I've seen at amuzement parks. I was more of a console kid (and have owned one or more from every generation).

[RayB]

VIDEO FOOTAGE!!

Games at a 7-11:


Central Park arcade in Mountain View California:

Look how many duplicates they have! (anyone else think pedobear shot this??  )

And there's a Teeter Torture by Exidy in the background (no side-art):

[RayB]

Spaceport arcade chain training videos!

[Benevolance]

Man, that kid in the green shirt sucks at Defender. I hope he brought lots of quarters.

[Darren01274]

The Golden Age upwards for me lol. I remember most of them. I also loved Kung Fu Master when it came out first played it in good old Blackpool haha great times. 

[leapinlew]

I love playing the classics: Galaga, Pengo, Donkey Kong and Ms. Pacman are my standbys but I also enjoy the quirkier titles of the day such as Marble Madness, Crystal Castles, and Crazy Climber. These are all solo games. My fondest memories come from the golden era, but I had a blast playing 2 player games such as SmashTV, Total Carnage, Street Fighter 2 and Mortal Kombat 2. The learning curve was too drastic to try and keep up with all the revisions of both franchises.

We'd play fighting games until someone got mad. We would travel around to different arcades to challenge new players. As soon as SFII was on the super nintendo, we didn't visit an arcade again.

[I/O]

Central Park Arcade video:

That first kid, classic Defender first-timer syndrome.

I was sort of wondering whether the Asian teen was going to whup some kung fu on the camera person.

What was that shoe shot of the Asian girl and her mom? Perhaps a 'yeah, this is what kind of shoes they used to wear' sort of archival moment??

And what were the game in the back they kept showing, and the game at the end?