Errant pixels on Wii

[SavannahLion]

A few days ago, my GF wanted to move the Wii from the 27" to the 42". "Sure, no problem!" I say. Quick trip to Fry's from some component cables then I spent about two hours diagnosing why the Wii looks like crap.

I don't mean, crap, is in the Wii can't show anything more than 480p and antialiasing is nonexistent. I mean, crap, as in, "WTF are all these flickering pixels doing all over the place?"

Checked everything over and over, even grabbed the old DVD player (which outputs 480p), swapped cables, connectors, etc and the problem is definitely with the Wii itself. A bit of Googling finally reveals the problem as rather common, annoying as hell, and fixable by Nintendo.

Apparently, the WiiConnect24 overheats the Wii (which I already knew) which in turns damages the GPU and/or video RAM (which I just learned) which in turn creates the super annoying errant pixels. They're there with the crappy composite but it's easy to think that they're just interference or crap from the TV.

This is great, I've got a first release Wii so I'm pretty much betting it's way out of warranty. I emailed Nintendo support through their website on Tuesday night to see what they say, but I still haven't received a response. I'm thinking about calling to see what I can get from them. I can't help but wonder how long I had this problem with the smaller screen and thought it was just interference from an older/smaller TV? 

OK, I'm done ranting.

[SavannahLion]

Got off the phone from Nintendo. The support guy has never heard of this problem (no surprise there) and says that to send it in is going to cost me $75+$10S&H to get it done. 

So I have the choice of living with this on the 42" while I decide if it's worth a repair or sell the unit to some place like Gamestop for money towards a 360 or PS3 or move it back to the 27" and pretend it's static/interference again.   

[Blanka]

This one had better luck:

Just call again I would say.

[ViciousXUSMC]

Hmm I had wii connect 24 on for the longest and never noticed the system draw for power going up or any heat buildup.   I just turned it off the other day actually since it never worked right for me (no Mii's in my parade and thats the only reason I had it on)

Sucks what happened, but the Wii is still a good system.

[ChadTower]

...or you can not use WiiConnect24 since it's stupid and useless.  Connect manually when you want to play one of the few games for which online play is worthwhile.  It's not worth the power your Wii sucks 24/7 or the wear on the system itself.

Of course, that's not going to help SavannahLion, but it's a damn shame to damage the system with something as stupid as WiiConnect24.

[patrickl]

...or you can not use WiiConnect24 since it's stupid and useless. 

What's even worse is that for some functions, switching on WiiConnect24 is mandatory.

[ChadTower]

...or you can not use WiiConnect24 since it's stupid and useless. 

What's even worse is that for some functions, switching on WiiConnect24 is mandatory.

Most of them require it.  That's completely stupid since they're all simple request based crap like weather and voting.  From a distributed enterprise software point of view (that's what I do for a living) it makes absolutely no sense unless there is something else going on behind the scenes that the user is not privy to.  They have to be using it for some sort of data/usage collection purpose.  The only even partially justifiable reason I can come up with is forced software updates and they don't even do that.

[patrickl]

...or you can not use WiiConnect24 since it's stupid and useless. 

What's even worse is that for some functions, switching on WiiConnect24 is mandatory.

Most of them require it. 

Really? I forgot which function actually needs it, but I always have it off and then sometimes I have to switch it back and IIRC that was on for only one thing. OS updates or maybe the store? Of course weather and news need it too, but seriously, who uses that?

When I still had WiiConnect24 on, I usually pressed the "power off" switch on the Wii itself for a few seconds so the led goes red. Then there is no Wii connect active either.

[knave]

LOL...you guys are scaring me...I've had wiiconnect on for the past two years and havn't noticed any problems...Now I'm at work and want to run home to check on my Wii. 

I do sometimes use the weather...the news not so much but I have enjoyed the nintendo channel as my daughter downloads demo's onto her DS.  I guess I'm just going to sqwirm today and wait till I get home to feel my Wii to see how warm it is. 

I got mixed results from google...some say it's only a few consoles...some say it's all. Others say adding fans to the outside blocks more air than it flows...so perhaps I'll just add some under wii cooling and hold the power button to force the wii to "off" mode.

One thought I have is to just mount a spair CPU fan into the stand that the Wii comes with...We'll see what I have and what fits...I expect it to last me forever...after all I still use my playstation one and my sega genesis.

[SavannahLion]

Of course, that's not going to help SavannahLion, but it's a damn shame to damage the system with something as stupid as WiiConnect24.

That's what really rubs my   about this whole thing. I understand wear and tear items, such as the disc drive going out. Even on older systems, I can accept that there were design issues like the front loader NES that increased physical wear and decreased the MTBF (which is easily fixed and was). But this is caused by an actual design oversight. One engineer probably decided to have three power levels (I didn't even know about the "red light" mode more than four months into owning the Wii) and another engineer probably decided to let the WiiConnect24 function while in standby, not realizing the fan (or heat sensor) is disabled in that mode. Even worse, this is probably patchable in a firmware update. Automatically shutdown WiiConnect24 in all but the "ON" state or enable the fan in the standby mode.

This is probably the first console I've owned to have a breakdown within five years. It makes the total cost of owning a Wii much less pleasant. It probably would've been cheaper to pay upfront the higher cost for the PS3

[knave]

I feel you Savanna...For overheating of anything to be an issue is a gross oversight.  There's just no excuse.

It makes me wonder thought why this isn't bigger news...like the Xbox RROD. Perhaps it will be? Or is it only a few consoles.

[ChadTower]

This is probably the first console I've owned to have a breakdown within five years. It makes the total cost of owning a Wii much less pleasant. It probably would've been cheaper to pay upfront the higher cost for the PS3

Not that the manufacturers will tell you this but it's unreasonable to expect any compled consumer level electronics product to run 24/7 for years without some sort of failure.  Consumer electronics simply aren't built to that standard.  Even "always on" stuff like Tivos only last a couple years before some component fails.  That's the difference between commercial hardware and consumer hardware.  Would anyone buy a console that cost $1000 but was guaranteed to last 8 years of continuous duty?

[patrickl]

True, which makes it all the more strange why do they force you to leave the Wii on 24/7.

[ChadTower]

True, which makes it all the more strange why do they force you to leave the Wii on 24/7.

I haven't even plugged the LAN cable into mine in months.  You don't need to leave WiiConnect on unless you care about the stupid things like Weather or voting on which is more important - peanut butter or jelly.

[knave]

Not that the manufacturers will tell you this but it's unreasonable to expect any compled consumer level electronics product to run 24/7 for years without some sort of failure.  Consumer electronics simply aren't built to that standard. 

I know some TV's that still work pretty well after 20+ years, also some stereos, and even  PC's. 

[MrMojoZ]

It makes me wonder thought why this isn't bigger news...like the Xbox RROD. Perhaps it will be? Or is it only a few consoles.

Same reasons flaws in Apple products aren't talked about. Only Micrsoft makes things that break. 

[patrickl]

True, which makes it all the more strange why do they force you to leave the Wii on 24/7.

I haven't even plugged the LAN cable into mine in months.  You don't need to leave WiiConnect on unless you care about the stupid things like Weather or voting on which is more important - peanut butter or jelly.

I didn't even know the Wii has a LAN port. I thought it was Wifi only.

True you don't really need WiiConnect for playing games (IIRC), but for Wii updates, the store or indeed using some of the online info features you need WiiConnect. When you first get the Wii you want to use those things and so you have to switch on WiiConnect. For no good reason. It should be able to download weather info on the fly like any website can. Chances are people don't mess with the settings after the first few weeks and thus loads of Wii's are left on all the time.

[ChadTower]

Not that the manufacturers will tell you this but it's unreasonable to expect any compled consumer level electronics product to run 24/7 for years without some sort of failure.  Consumer electronics simply aren't built to that standard. 

I know some TV's that still work pretty well after 20+ years, also some stereos, and even  PC's. 

Some.  Figure on the percentage of the TVs that were actually sold, though.  And how many of those PCs are working without any physical changes?  How many PCs get thrown out because one component failed?

And how many of any of those run continuous duty?  Some old PCs did but how many people have you known that had their TV or stereo on 24/7?

I didn't even know the Wii has a LAN port. I thought it was Wifi only.

USB LAN adapter.  The Wii does have USB ports on the back.  I don't have wireless at my house.

[patrickl]

Don't forget that running 24/7 adds usage dramatically faster than normal use. If the example TV was used for an average of 4 hours a day for 20 years, it would get the same amount of usage in just over 3 years of running it 24/7. So it would most likely break in 3 years.

[knave]

Don't forget that running 24/7 adds usage dramatically faster than normal use. If the example TV was used for an average of 4 hours a day for 20 years, it would get the same amount of usage in just over 3 years of running it 24/7. So it would most likely break in 3 years.

I agree. I just wish I could expect my electronics to last at least as long as my old TV and fridge. My alarmclock/clockradio is an anomaly...it has been on 24/7 for over 20 years.

[ChadTower]

That's why I specified complex consumer electronics.  The alarm clock doesn't count as it's pretty much a chip/display and a radio which isn't much more, likely on separate circuits.  Even the TV is a pretty simple device so long as you aren't looking at something like crappy Chinese caps or inferior soldering on the PCBs.


Your fridge is not electronic unless it is computer controlled.  Until recent years they were all raw AC appliances and many of them still are.

[SavannahLion]

I feel you Savanna...For overheating of anything to be an issue is a gross oversight.  There's just no excuse.

It makes me wonder thought why this isn't bigger news...like the Xbox RROD. Perhaps it will be? Or is it only a few consoles.

I think the difference is it’s really tough to miss an RROD. An RROD isn’t really something you can just ignore and keep on playing.

It's possible that most people won't notice the errant pixels on the Wii for the same reason I didn't notice for so long. I had the Wii plugged into a 27" SD CRT for the last three years or so. A lot of TV channels (yes, on cable,  you Comcast) tend to look pretty crappy to begin with. So you get used to seeing a little bit of random static. With the Wii plugged into the 27" on Composite cables, this is exactly what the errant pixels look like, random static. Feed that image into a 42" TV, swap in some component cables, and that errant static "pops" and becomes very very noticeable. Going back to the composite, you then realize what you thought was random "static" from a crap TV is actually random pixels from a crapped Wii.

Not that the manufacturers will tell you this but it's unreasonable to expect any compled consumer level electronics product to run 24/7 for years without some sort of failure.  Consumer electronics simply aren't built to that standard.  Even "always on" stuff like Tivos only last a couple years before some component fails.  That's the difference between commercial hardware and consumer hardware.  Would anyone buy a console that cost $1000 but was guaranteed to last 8 years of continuous duty?

That’s true to a degree. Most consumer electronics are operated in a reasonable and expected way and, more importantly, designed that way. Figure the average weekly usage of your TV (in an American household) to be about 30 to 40 hours a week as reasonable vs the same TV used as a menu screen in a restaurant at 12/7 to 24/7 as excessive.

With the Wii, that really isn’t the case. Nintendo specifically designed the Wii to default to the Standby state, both through the WiiMote function and panel face. You have to force the Wii into a lower “off” state through the panel. Even though it’s not exactly encouraged by Nintendo to place the Wii in standby mode, Nintendo really does very little to encourage users to power down the Wii. It’s not the default option. There is no way to make it the default option. You can’t power down to off with the WiiMote and you have to know to hold down the Wii power button on the panel to bring it to this state.

In any case, I expect wear and tear on physical moving parts such as disc drives, fans, slot connectors, etc. I also expect cap failure and even the occasional hit & miss on MTBF for the solid state components.

What I don't expect are design deficiencies causing a product to fail or behave outside of spec well before anyone expects it to fail.

In all fairness, the Wii shouldn't have this problem because it should never have been designed in that way, period. Given that there are several possible (and easy) ways to prevent this from Nintendo’s side, it makes the failure all the more annoying.

[johnnya]

I had this same exact problem with my Wii. In 480p, there were weird pixels, but it wasn't always obvious. It was really obvious in the dark areas of the lanes in Wii bowling and also in Zelda TP. I don't recall how I contacted Nintendo, either by phone or their web site, but they sent me a box, and I sent it back. Came back like a week later. Said they "couldn't find anything wrong with it." They sent me a replacement though. What do you know, the replacement didn't have the problem that they couldn't identify. Just a warning, they transfer over all of your content, but you won't be able to edit your Miis anymore. It will tell you that you have to be the creator of the Mii in order to edit them. It must work off the console ID or something. In other words, just use their web site form, and send it back.

[SavannahLion]

On my Wii, it's more noticeable on solid color areas. eg, close ups of the bowling lane on Wii Sports or the white areas of the Wii menu. It's better the darker the area. The errant pixels virtually disappear on black areas such as the Wii sub menus. Interestingly, it's really difficult to find the errant pixels on the empty channels on the Wii menu. They're there, but you have to know where to look and what to look for.

I have checked the Nintendo site and the site insists on a $75 repair fee because my serial number is out of warranty. Did the phone call thing and the same thing (+$10 for S&H). So either way, it looks like I have to pay $75 and then some. 

I'm not entirely keen on getting a "replacement" Wii. If Nintendo operates anything like some manufacturers I worked at, they simply send out someone else's Wii in place of mine in order to buy time to do the repair or recycle. My Wii shell is still baby butt smooth and it grosses me out to see some of these polished consoles (PS3 included) with scratch swirls, dirt grind and general grossness.

Our TV also has this annoying polished look and I give it shy of four months before it starts looking like those dumb ---Cleveland steamer--- cars with the bad wax jobs.

[TOK]

I didn't even know the Wii has a LAN port. I thought it was Wifi only.
 

It doesn't have an ethernet port, but they make a USB to ethernet adapter for it.
Mine has been on Wii connect 24 since I got it. I guess it's almost 2 years. I don't use any of the mii crap or voting, but I do occasionally use it to look at stuff on the internet.
It'll probably crap out now that they've finally made 2 games I like... House of the Dead:Overkill and the Williams Pinball Hall of Fame.

[knave]

I found out this weekend that you can turn the standby mode off so the Wii powers down fully and still have Wiiconnect24 on for any internet use. It should have been the default. Now if I hit the power button on the wiimote my wii powers down fully to a red light. Hopefully no damage was done in two years of "leaving it on". 

[ChadTower]

If you have Wiiconnect24 off it always powers down to red.  Mine has always been like that.  Didn't see any point in sucking current 24 hours a day for the weather and voting features.

[knave]

If you have Wiiconnect24 off it always powers down to red.  Mine has always been like that.  Didn't see any point in sucking current 24 hours a day for the weather and voting features.

Same if you turn standby to off.

[patrickl]

If you have Wiiconnect24 off it always powers down to red.  Mine has always been like that.  Didn't see any point in sucking current 24 hours a day for the weather and voting features.

Same if you turn standby to off.

Ah I better look for that setting too then. That's better then switching on/off WiiConnect24 every time I do need it, or to press the on/off switch for 5 seconds every time.

[knave]

From memory...

"wii options"
->next page...
->Wiiconnect24...
->standby mode. (turn to "off")
->"comfirm"

[SavannahLion]

From memory...

"wii options"
->next page...
->Wiiconnect24...
->standby mode. (turn to "off")
->"comfirm"

I'll be damned, I'll have to check that when I get home.

Too little too late for me though. It should be the default behavior.

[northerngames]

 I had read awhile back it is the GPU itself that is faulty sometimes and if you want to see if your GPU is faulty or not run resident evil 4 for the gamecube on it for awhile.

if it makes it with no display errors then it should be alright if it burns it up and cause's display problems then you had a faulty GPU from the get go.

 I had read that problem in multiple forums awhile back and RE4 was suggested to test and see if it had a good one or a bad one before the warrenty went out.

that way they did not get stuck down the road with a fualty one and no warrenty.

 I am not sure if that was truth or internet myth but I had read it in different forums and they all suggested that game RE4 becuase it makes the wii gpu work harder then any other game supposedly.

[ViciousXUSMC]

I do not see how wii-connect can hurt the gpu from a technical standpoint I have had mine on forever until just recently and it seems to work much like how a computers sleep mode works.

It only keeps certian parts of the system in a very low power state mode.  In this case the network chips and the memory.  The GPU should not be in any use because there is no display being powered nor any video signal being sent out.

I feel no heat from my wii when it was on, and could not sense any of the major internal functions being on.

I feel the guess just posted about some gpu's being defect from the start is more logical, that or just bad luck had it break. I mean my playstation has to play games with the system upside down! its not like they do not make consoles with defects.

The last defending factor is that GPU's are rated in incredibly high zones of tempature to be running safe, your aveage gpu wont reach thermal throttle until over 110c! and thats just the throttle point, not the shut down point and thats where it will turn itself off to prevent damage.

Its almost impossible for the gpu to be under load if there is not something be actively rendered by it.  So I have to conclude that this Wii-Connect rumor is false.

[ChadTower]

Be glad you didn't put it into one of tommy's glass coffins.   

[Level42]

Actually never thought about it. In the beginning I didn't have the Wii connected to the internet. I changed internet provider and got WiFi so then I figured I'd try it and it's fun for games like Mario Kart.

I didn't even think about the 24/7 connection, although I did realise the power led not going to red (only if I held it down manually).

Switched it off now in the settings as I simply never use any of those channels and stuff. And I don't like stuff eating power for nothing.

However, my Wii's still fine. There was a disc inside I ejected it ant it was very mildly warm, nothing serious. My room is "room temperature", 21 degr. Celsius, so normal conditions.

By the way, I just ordered the Flatmod for my Wii. No soldering !
And an R4 for my son's DS

[ChadTower]

Flatmod... is that what it looks like?  A disc swapper?

Dude, the Wii Clip works fine, and only involves soldering big pads on the clip itself.  You can do that blindfolded.

[Level42]

Disc swapper ?

I don't get it.


It's just a mod like a Wasabi or any of the others but no need for soldering. And even if I wanted to solder on my Wii, I probably can't because I most likely have the model with the epoxy layer all over.

Cheers

[ChadTower]

Ah, the video demo I found made it look like a disc swapper (put in original, stop disc, eject, put in copy).  All of the info on this one seems pretty vague from what I can tell... even worse than usual for mods.

[knave]

Level42, You'll have to post a review when you get it. It looks interesting.

[patrickl]

Level42,

Any specific reason why you went for Flatmod and not Drivekey or Wasabi DX?