New project - Feedback and tips appreciated

[metalstorm]

Hey guys, so this will be the second arcade I made and could use some tips and suggestions. Especially on the control panel.

So the one I am making right now is for a friend, here is a pic of the first one I made for myself.



Now here are some of the pics of the progress on my new one.


Laying out the template




I cut out the first side with a jigsaw and then filed and sanded it down to smooth it out.


I used this as a template as I plan on making another one after this. I clamped the template to fresh wood and then rough cut out the template with a jig saw. Then I clamped it back to the template and used a flush trim bit on my router to trace it out. Then the same thing for the other side.


I then used a ruler along the edges and traced it along each side, This is where I will connect all of the wood so there is an outer edge that sticks out a bit.


Starting to put some of the cross pieces in.








Here is the keyboard drawer I made to go under the control panel


With the drawer in






Cut the back piece




Test fitting the 32" tv, It will be mounted higher, just wanted to make sure it fit fairly snug width wise


Started making the front door. I used inset cabinet hinges, I screwed up a little here. I put in 4 and turns out the bottom one was right over where the wood inside sat so it wouldn't fit. I just took it out and will fill the holes with wood filler later before paining











Here is where I would appreciate some input with the control panel, I just started doing a rough setup. I drilled out the joystick holes and the 8 buttons for each. I have not decided what will be a good setup for the other buttons though. I am thinking a p1 and p2 coin button, p1 and p2 start and then not sure what else is a good idea. exit button for hyperspin will be needed.

[vwalbridge]

Why have a keyboard?

[Malenko]

its too wide with too big of a screen too close to the players faces. Other than that, I cant complain. I was just super happy to not see another aircraft carrier.

[harveybirdman]

8 buttons...

[Malenko]

8 buttons...

well I didnt mention that because its one of those "hey I already did it" kinda things.

[harveybirdman]

yeah just channeling my inner Nep....

[vwalbridge]

Also, why is your marquee a solid piece of wood? Don't want a back-light?

[yotsuya]

Good luck with your project!

[Token]

metalstorm, thanks for sharing pics of your build. It looks like you have figured out how to construct a cab that looks solidly built.

If you have lurked here much, the responses to your pics shouldn't be a surprise. For better or worse (usually for the better) the taste-makers of BYOAC don't like widescreen formats, over-sized screens, eight buttons per player, or keyboard drawers. The dominant meme of this forum is that MAME cabs should look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s. Your plans are different, and so you get the classic yots line:

"Good luck with your project!"

...which is the equivalent of a church lady's "Bless your heart."

Having said all that-- If the purpose of your build is to be able to play 8-button 16:9 fighters, then you are probably going to be happy with the result. If you envision spending hours playing Donkey Kong or even SFII, then you might end up second guessing some of your design decisions.

Here is where I would appreciate some input with the control panel, I just started doing a rough setup. I drilled out the joystick holes and the 8 buttons for each. I have not decided what will be a good setup for the other buttons though. I am thinking a p1 and p2 coin button, p1 and p2 start and then not sure what else is a good idea. exit button for hyperspin will be needed.

You really only need P1 & P2 coin and start buttons. If you want a really clutter-free CP, you can set P1start as Shift, and then make esc, tab, and pause shifted commands. Example - P1+P1left = esc, P1+P1up = tab, P1+P1right = pause

[yotsuya]

Token, you don't need to interpret my comments for me. I wished this gentleman luck on his project, you don't need to read anything more into it for the OP.

[vwalbridge]

The dominant meme of this forum is that MAME cabs should look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s. Your plans are different, and so you get the classic yots line:

"Good luck with your project!"

I don't agree with this.

BYOAC members are not just looking for replica 80's and 90's cabs. I think it's fair to say that the members of this site can easily appreciate any build (original or not). It doesn't make any difference if the cab was copied or totally original. Good decisions are good decisions. And bad decisions are bad decisions.

This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It has to do with making "functional" decisions that could be mistakes or waste of time/money.

[yotsuya]

The dominant meme of this forum is that MAME cabs should look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s. Your plans are different, and so you get the classic yots line:

"Good luck with your project!"

I don't agree with this.

BYOAC members are not just looking for replica 80's and 90's cabs. I think it's fair to say that the members of this site can easily appreciate any build (original or not). It doesn't make any difference if the cab was copied or totally original. Good decisions are good decisions. And bad decisions are bad decisions.

This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It has to do with making "functional" decisions that could be mistakes or waste of time/money.

Well said. Glad someone gets it.

[Token]

Token, you don't need to interpret my comments for me. I wished this gentleman luck on his project, you don't need to read anything more into it for the OP.

Of course. My apologies.

I think it's fair to say that the members of this site can easily appreciate any build (original or not). It doesn't make any difference if the cab was copied or totally original. Good decisions are good decisions. And bad decisions are bad decisions.

I agree. Chance's Flynn shows that you can break the cardinal "rules" of BYOAC and still receive acclaim. His attention to detail and obsessive planning made up for that control panel. Maybe I shouldn't have said that BYOAC likes cabs that "look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s." It is probably more accurate to say, "BYOAC likes cabs that do not deviate from the design principles of classic cabinets."

This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It has to do with making "functional" decisions that could be mistakes or waste of time/money.

But notice that none of the posts above asked about the intended function of the cabinet. There are legitimate functional purposes for 8 buttons per player, a widescreen that isn't masked into a 4:3, and even (God forbid) a keyboard drawer. They probably aren't purposes that you or I would agree with, but OP might have a different idea of how he will use this cab. The dominant meme here is that cabinets should look a certain way, and this cab doesn't.

I'm not trying to be critical of the BYOAC bias towards classic design/controls. I think the collective wisdom here is spot on.

[Malenko]

Chance's Flynn shows that you can break the cardinal "rules" of BYOAC and still receive acclaim. His attention to detail and obsessive planning made up for that control panel. Maybe I shouldn't have said that BYOAC likes cabs that "look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s." It is probably more accurate to say, "BYOAC likes cabs that do not deviate from the design principles of classic cabinets."

There are no cardinal rules of BYOAC. Giant widescreens really close to your face aren't functional. A giant wide screen a few feet in front of a pedestal cab works just fine. Chance's Flynn cab is alright at best, and was certainly better before spawning lesser clones. His control panel is still terrible.

If you're going to speak on behalf of the whole community (something you've been a part of for 2 years with an AMAZING 34 posts) you should try to be slightly more accurate.

I personally feel that BYOAC likes cabs that don't deviate from the design principals of common sense. In a thread asking for feedback, I find it crass to throw peoples honest feedback in their faces because YOU dont agree with what is said.

[metalstorm]

Why have a keyboard?

It will be used as more than just an arcade. Media player, pc games (not so much but the option will be available although the front of the drawer would be in the way for your wrists). I wanted the keyboard to be there hidden if needed for anything.

[metalstorm]

its too wide with too big of a screen too close to the players faces. Other than that, I cant complain. I was just super happy to not see another aircraft carrier.

I have a similar size and distance setup on mine, it actually works quite well. The emulators themselves have a bezel setup in hyperspin so the actual gameplay screen is smaller and similar to around the size of a 24" screen so it does not feel so close up (I know its wasted screen space but for the price of the monitor no complaints and this way when using it to play music or have videos playing you still have the large widescreen).

[metalstorm]

8 buttons...

That is what of the things I am thinking about changing but not sure yet, the control panel is just a test to mess around with right now. I have lots of pieces of wood that size sitting around so I just drilled some out to test and copied the layout of the X-arcade tank stick that I have on to it for button placement.

I have the same setup on my arcade and use the bottom 2 buttons usually as select and start like on the old controllers but for the most part they seem to never be used so I don't know if I want to keep them but at the same time as I hear some of the fighting games use 8 buttons.

[metalstorm]

8 buttons...

well I didnt mention that because its one of those "hey I already did it" kinda things.

That's not set in stone, that's just a piece of wood I was using to test some placements and I can easily make another.

What are the pros and cons of 8 buttons? I don't know why a lot of people are griping about it.

[metalstorm]

Also, why is your marquee a solid piece of wood? Don't want a back-light?

This one I am not going to bother with a backlight marquee, I will just get some vinyl artwork made to go over it.

[metalstorm]

Good luck with your project!

Thanks, learning a lot from this place about arcades and woodworking.

[metalstorm]

metalstorm, thanks for sharing pics of your build. It looks like you have figured out how to construct a cab that looks solidly built.

If you have lurked here much, the responses to your pics shouldn't be a surprise. For better or worse (usually for the better) the taste-makers of BYOAC don't like widescreen formats, over-sized screens, eight buttons per player, or keyboard drawers. The dominant meme of this forum is that MAME cabs should look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s. Your plans are different, and so you get the classic yots line:

"Good luck with your project!"

...which is the equivalent of a church lady's "Bless your heart."

Having said all that-- If the purpose of your build is to be able to play 8-button 16:9 fighters, then you are probably going to be happy with the result. If you envision spending hours playing Donkey Kong or even SFII, then you might end up second guessing some of your design decisions.

Here is where I would appreciate some input with the control panel, I just started doing a rough setup. I drilled out the joystick holes and the 8 buttons for each. I have not decided what will be a good setup for the other buttons though. I am thinking a p1 and p2 coin button, p1 and p2 start and then not sure what else is a good idea. exit button for hyperspin will be needed.

You really only need P1 & P2 coin and start buttons. If you want a really clutter-free CP, you can set P1start as Shift, and then make esc, tab, and pause shifted commands. Example - P1+P1left = esc, P1+P1up = tab, P1+P1right = pause

Thanks, yeah I have lurked here for quite some time since I built my first cabinet so I knew what to expect but I get it. Everyone has their own idea of what they want. Mine function a lot of the time as media players in my sunroom/gameroom so its more than just an arcade cabinet to me.

What design decisions would be second guessed for the older games? mainly the screen size? if so I do actually setup bezels and run the emulators in a much smaller window so its around the size of a 24" screen or sometimes even smaller.

[Malenko]

Thanks, learning a lot from this place about arcades and woodworking.

Well I for one love how you are inflating your post count, you'll pass Chaddles in no time at this rate. Sorry this post broke your 8 in a row streak.

[metalstorm]

The dominant meme of this forum is that MAME cabs should look as close as possible to old-school arcade cabinets from the 80s and 90s. Your plans are different, and so you get the classic yots line:

"Good luck with your project!"

I don't agree with this.

BYOAC members are not just looking for replica 80's and 90's cabs. I think it's fair to say that the members of this site can easily appreciate any build (original or not). It doesn't make any difference if the cab was copied or totally original. Good decisions are good decisions. And bad decisions are bad decisions.

This has nothing to do with being a "purist". It has to do with making "functional" decisions that could be mistakes or waste of time/money.

That's exactly the type of info I am looking for with this post. I know that my use for this cabinet will be a lot different than most peoples but I don't want to do something that is going to piss me off down the road that cant be fixed. I get why most people don't like the large screen close up, I use bezels and smaller emulator windows to make it feel more comfortable on the eyes but then I still have the large widescreen available for other things like movies and music videos, youtube, etc.

[metalstorm]

Thanks, learning a lot from this place about arcades and woodworking.

Well I for one love how you are inflating your post count, you'll pass Chaddles in no time at this rate.

Damn I should have posted each pic as a separate post, lesson learned

The main thing I am concerned with though is the control panel, I have searched around on here but I cant find people specifically saying why this type of layout sucks. I copied it from the x-arcade tank stick and just assumed that would be a well thought out layout.

I do really like this guys layout and might try something similar if the straight 8 button one sucks
http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,130690.160.html

[Vigo]

The main thing I am concerned with though is the control panel, I have searched around on here but I cant find people specifically saying why this type of layout sucks. I copied it from the x-arcade tank stick and just assumed that would be a well thought out layout.

The big thing is that too many buttons over-complicates things. You won't find arcade games that use over 6 buttons, and the seven button layout is just so people can have four-in-a-row for 4 button games like neo geo.

The 8 button layout came about with console gaming. If your goal is to play console games on an arcade machine, then you might want an 8 button layout. Most people come to find out that console games that require a full 8 buttons to play are rarely worth having on an arcade machine setting.

[opt2not]

But notice that none of the posts above asked about the intended function of the cabinet. There are legitimate functional purposes for 8 buttons per player, a widescreen that isn't masked into a 4:3, and even (God forbid) a keyboard drawer. They probably aren't purposes that you or I would agree with, but OP might have a different idea of how he will use this cab. The dominant meme here is that cabinets should look a certain way, and this cab doesn't.

I'm not trying to be critical of the BYOAC bias towards classic design/controls. I think the collective wisdom here is spot on.

Please, just stop. You have no idea what you're talking about.

[harveybirdman]

That is what of the things I am thinking about changing but not sure yet, the control panel is just a test to mess around with right now. I have lots of pieces of wood that size sitting around so I just drilled some out to test and copied the layout of the X-arcade tank stick that I have on to it for button placement.

I have the same setup on my arcade and use the bottom 2 buttons usually as select and start like on the old controllers but for the most part they seem to never be used so I don't know if I want to keep them but at the same time as I hear some of the fighting games use 8 buttons.

So one of the first rules of building is to know what the purpose of the cabinet is.  For example, I'm building a SHMUP cabinet.  I don't care that it won't play horizontal games, I don't care if it won't play 6 button games, and I CERTAINLY don't care that it won't play modern console or PC games.  But it will play arcade SHMUPS perfectly because that's what it was designed to do.

It seems like you have the 8 buttons because you think you MIGHT want support for a cool game of SOME kind at SOME point in the FUTURE.  I went through a period when I began planning my first build with designs on playing every arcade, console, or anything else I could emulate on one machine.  Because who WOULDN'T want to play Tenchu on an arcade cabinet    But what I realize now is that thinking is freaking moronic.  With few exceptions (such as true Arcade Ports), console games are meant to be played on the couch with native controllers and they have no business whatsoever on an arcade machine, yet the idea of an all in one game box is so intoxicating to people in this hobby that it often leads to poor aesthetic choices and wasted efforts for games that will never get played.

I realize this may not be your cab, but you have one.  Ask yourself this, what do you play on your cabinet MOST of the time.  could you play those games with just 6 buttons? 4? maybe even 3 or 2?  Then why do you want you palms resting on useless buttons during most of your playtime?

Heck even people that do good cabs are even questioning why they did 8 buttons, look at RxBrad's Averngerless Avenger build....

At the end of the day it's your cab, build what YOU want.  My only other advice is to take the comments in stride, even the biggest jerks on here have nuggets of wisdom, and when you hang out long enough to actually get some of the references above and know that pbj's gotta pbj  you might find this is a pretty cool place to be.

[Malenko]

8 buttons are for emulating consoles. Most people do a SF layout or SFNeo layout, similar to the one you linked to.
Tanksticks aren't exactly loved around here.

[metalstorm]

The main thing I am concerned with though is the control panel, I have searched around on here but I cant find people specifically saying why this type of layout sucks. I copied it from the x-arcade tank stick and just assumed that would be a well thought out layout.

The big thing is that too many buttons over-complicates things. You won't find arcade games that use over 6 buttons, and the seven button layout is just so people can have four-in-a-row for 4 button games like neo geo.

The 8 button layout came about with console gaming. If your goal is to play console games on an arcade machine, then you might want an 8 button layout. Most people come to find out that console games that require a full 8 buttons to play are rarely worth having on an arcade machine setting.

That about sums it up for me then to get rid of the 2 buttons. I do actually play a lot of consoles on my arcade BUT I buy the actual controllers for the consoles as playing them on arcade buttons blows.

[metalstorm]

That is what of the things I am thinking about changing but not sure yet, the control panel is just a test to mess around with right now. I have lots of pieces of wood that size sitting around so I just drilled some out to test and copied the layout of the X-arcade tank stick that I have on to it for button placement.

I have the same setup on my arcade and use the bottom 2 buttons usually as select and start like on the old controllers but for the most part they seem to never be used so I don't know if I want to keep them but at the same time as I hear some of the fighting games use 8 buttons.

So one of the first rules of building is to know what the purpose of the cabinet is.  For example, I'm building a SHMUP cabinet.  I don't care that it won't play horizontal games, I don't care if it won't play 6 button games, and I CERTAINLY don't care that it won't play modern console or PC games.  But it will play arcade SHMUPS perfectly because that's what it was designed to do.

It seems like you have the 8 buttons because you think you MIGHT want support for a cool game of SOME kind at SOME point in the FUTURE.  I went through a period when I began planning my first build with designs on playing every arcade, console, or anything else I could emulate on one machine.  Because who WOULDN'T want to play Tenchu on an arcade cabinet    But what I realize now is that thinking is freaking moronic.  With few exceptions (such as true Arcade Ports), console games are meant to be played on the couch with native controllers and they have no business whatsoever on an arcade machine, yet the idea of an all in one game box is so intoxicating to people in this hobby that it often leads to poor aesthetic choices and wasted efforts for games that will never get played.

I realize this may not be your cab, but you have one.  Ask yourself this, what do you play on your cabinet MOST of the time.  could you play those games with just 6 buttons? 4? maybe even 3 or 2?  Then why do you want you palms resting on useless buttons during most of your playtime?

Heck even people that do good cabs are even questioning why they did 8 buttons, look at RxBrad's Averngerless Avenger build....

At the end of the day it's your cab, build what YOU want.  My only other advice is to take the comments in stride, even the biggest jerks on here have nuggets of wisdom, and when you hang out long enough to actually get some of the references above and know that pbj's gotta pbj  you might find this is a pretty cool place to be.

You guys have already answered a lot of the questions I couldn't find an answer too. If the 8 button thing is mainly for consoles then its pretty pointless for me since I use controllers for the console games I play.

Does using the 4 buttons in a row on neo geo feel a lot better then a 3 button by 2 row setup?

[yotsuya]

The main thing I am concerned with though is the control panel, I have searched around on here but I cant find people specifically saying why this type of layout sucks. I copied it from the x-arcade tank stick and just assumed that would be a well thought out layout.

The big thing is that too many buttons over-complicates things. You won't find arcade games that use over 6 buttons, and the seven button layout is just so people can have four-in-a-row for 4 button games like neo geo.

The 8 button layout came about with console gaming. If your goal is to play console games on an arcade machine, then you might want an 8 button layout. Most people come to find out that console games that require a full 8 buttons to play are rarely worth having on an arcade machine setting.

That about sums it up for me then to get rid of the 2 buttons. I do actually play a lot of consoles on my arcade BUT I buy the actual controllers for the consoles as playing them on arcade buttons blows.

Kudos to you for taking this all in stride. You're alright, brother.

Your build is nice and clean.

[Token]

I wasn't trying to stir it up here folks. Just trying to encourage OP and explain why the feedback so far wasn't real positive. I have nothing but respect for the cumulative wisdom of BYOAC. If not for all the knowledge here I would probably be building a frankenpanel covered with dozens of stickers of console characters.

And I see that people are now leaving constructive feedback for OP, so I'll shut up now.


EDIT: removed my final snarky comment.

[Malenko]

There are no cardinal rules of BYOAC. Giant widescreens really close to your face aren't functional. A giant wide screen a few feet in front of a pedestal cab works just fine.

Am I supposed to believe the first sentence or the two that follow it?   

Both, because the first is a statement about the lack of rules, the latter two are examples of common sense and functionality. I was illustrating that a wide screen is perfectly acceptable if used in a functional manner.

[Token]

Does using the 4 buttons in a row on neo geo feel a lot better then a 3 button by 2 row setup?

Yes, but you might want to consider how often Neo Geo games will be played and if it is worth it to add the extra button just for those instances.

Do you have a list of "must have" games that you want to play on this cabinet? I'd start there and see if any of them use four-in-a-row buttons.

[Malenko]

Yes, but you might want to consider how often Neo Geo games will be played and if it is worth it to add the extra button just for those instances.

I feel like Im picking on you now

I use the first 3 buttons of the neogeo portion of the layout for almost all of the 3 button games on my MAME cab. Just feels more natural. I do agree with your "make a list of games you want to play the most" though.

[metalstorm]

Would something like this layout be a pretty good all around one (minus the 4th button on the right I will leave out)?

[harveybirdman]

It's done often, but mock it up in cardboard first and see how it feels to you.  I prefer the Astro City Player 2 layout, which is very similar to what you posted.

[metalstorm]

It's done often, but mock it up in cardboard first and see how it feels to you.  I prefer the Astro City Player 2 layout, which is very similar to what you posted.

That would be this one?



I think I will make a template of both to test out

[harveybirdman]

Pretty sure that is Player 1, Player 2 has buttons 2 and 3 on the same plane.

But try that one two to see which you like best.

Also try just the regular Street Fighter layout, some people don't like the Japanese layouts.

[metalstorm]

Pretty sure that is Player 1, Player 2 has buttons 2 and 3 on the same plane.

But try that one two to see which you like best.

Also try just the regular Street Fighter layout, some people don't like the Japanese layouts.

The player 2 does look pretty awesome. So are you supposed to actually slant the joystick with the angle of the box? as in pressing up will be at a bit of an angle instead of directly up towards the screen?

I am going to print a few out to test this week.