The REALLY original Star Wars films

[Level42]

OK, I infected my son with the SW virus I guess. So far I've allowed him to see all but part 3 because I find the Anakin burning scenes too much for an 8 year old.

However, I've mentioned a couple times to him that part 4/6 were different when dady first saw them in the theater WAAAAAYYYY back in the 70's/80's. He keeps asking questions about it and I would love to see them in the original form again too.

I know there was a box set released in 2006 that was supposed to have the original films, but I've read that even those are not 100% as they were. I've read that the only REALLY original versions were ever released on Laser Disc.

I would appreciate any help in finding a lead to those movies in 100% original form. Please PM.

[SavannahLion]

There was never really a 100% release of the 1977, 1980, and 1983 screenings. Differences exist, however minor. There are even differences from movie theater to theater depending on which version of the reel they obtained.

See what I mean at Wikipedia. There are fan sites with more comprehensive changes. Wikipedia is a good starting point.

The closest is probably the laserdisc release but IMHO, the fanedit version is the best since it comprises of the best changes from the update, keeps the original stuff and ensures Hans shoots first.

Sorry I didn't PM as my only lead just went AWOL.  

[protokatie]

Savannah put it well. One thing I would consider is that your memory of the original trilogy is prolly more filled with the old vhs tapes you saw in the 80's than from what you saw in the theatre. Well, maybe not you, but most people in our age group. I would suggest trying to find good copies of the original VHS releases of them after the third movie came out. If younfind a copy of ep4 from before 5 and 6 came out, then the opening will not include the preface of "episode 4.  A new hope", which was added later when star wars went from a single complete movie to a trilogy.

Just my 2 cents.

[Hoopz]

OK, I infected my son with the SW virus I guess. So far I've allowed him to see all but part 3 because I find the Anakin burning scenes too much for an 8 year old.

I think it has three pretty "graphic" scenes.  Anakin burning at the end, when he decapitates Dooku, and when Anakin returns to the Jedi Temple and sees the younglings (sp?).  Granted, the last one isn't that graphic but even young kids can figure out what happened.

I'm not complaining.  I didn't let my stepson see that one until he was 9 or 10. 

[Vanguard]

I don't understand this thread.   There were only 3 Star Wars movies ever made (New Hope, Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi) and they were never redone.   It's like I'm in some alternate universe or something.  LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA LA!!!!!

[opt2not]

I bought the new Special Edition set of the original movies, what a   disappointment. IMO, its rightfully called "special", not for being good, but in a "mentally handicapped" kinda way.  After watching them all, I immediately scoured the torrent sites for the original Laserdisc rips. Now when I have a Star Wars craving, I only watch the Laserdisc ones.

Oh, also in my mind, there is no Episode 1,2 or 3...just like the sequels to the Matrix.  

[ahofle]

There was a fan edit a few years ago that was REALLY well done.  Fixed up some of the issues with the re-release, cleaned up some things even the re-release didn't, and was really well done.  Problem was it was in SD only since it used LD footage.  I can't seem to find it now.  Wonder if it was pulled?

[Ond]

Now when I have a Star Wars craving, I only watch the Laserdisc ones.

You mean these ones?    Take note these are still "Special Edition" copies, they just don't have the poxy add ins that the recent DVD release has.  Original, original Star Wars laser disc copies are hard to get, especially in Wide Screen (or complete screen as I prefer to call it), the original VHS copies I had were Pan and Scan (4:3) aspect, which I gave to my brother in law.



I haven't watched these in a while.  I do remember being pretty unhappy with the DVD version I have of the trilogy, with the updated ending of Ep. 6 with Hayden Christensen being digitised in for Anakin in place of the original.   I've nothing against CGI when it's used well, but nothing replaces a great story, dialog, direction, acting,  

[SavannahLion]

I do remember being pretty unhappy with the DVD version I have of the trilogy, with the updated ending of Ep. 6 with Hayden Christensen being digitised in for Anakin in place of the original.

Say what? I honestly thought my opinion couldn't possibly get any lower what with that   Jar Jar and Hans Solo vs Greedo amongst a myriad of other ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- nonsense, but this too? Congratulations you have successfully moved a bar that much lower.

I now can't decide which one is that much more worthless, Jack Thompson or George Lucas.

[opt2not]

Now when I have a Star Wars craving, I only watch the Laserdisc ones.

You mean these ones?    Take note these are still "Special Edition" copies, they just don't have the poxy add ins that the recent DVD release has.  Original, original Star Wars laser disc copies are hard to get, especially in Wide Screen (or complete screen as I prefer to call it), the original VHS copies I had were Pan and Scan (4:3) aspect, which I gave to my brother in law.

I haven't watched these in a while.  I do remember being pretty unhappy with the DVD version I have of the trilogy, with the updated ending of Ep. 6 with Hayden Christensen being digitised in for Anakin in place of the original.   I've nothing against CGI when it's used well, but nothing replaces a great story, dialog, direction, acting,  

Jealous!
Yeah, I meant to say the --Digitally Re-mastered-- Special Edition...

[Ond]

Say what? I honestly thought my opinion couldn't possibly get any lower what with that   Jar Jar and Hans Solo vs Greedo amongst a myriad of other ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- nonsense, but this too? Congratulations you have successfully moved a bar that much lower.

I now can't decide which one is that much more worthless, Jack Thompson or George Lucas.

Huh?  wait...   can someone please translate this for a simpleton like me?

ta.

(I think what your'e saying is you think less of me because I prefer the original Star Wars to newer updated or SE versions???) Ok then.    What are you on? (and I bet you didn't even leave any for me either).

[danny_galaga]

I have that boxed set you mention level42, and i would have to say it's an easy way to get the original feel, even if the experts say there are differences. I almost cheered when i saw the title scrolling and it DIDNT say 'episode IV' 

[thatitalian]

Huh?   wait...   can someone please translate this for a simpleton like me?

ta.

(I think what your'e saying is you think less of me because I prefer the original Star Wars to newer updated or SE versions???) Ok then.    What are you on? (and I bet you didn't even leave any for me either).

I think he is directing at Lucas, not you...

It seems like he is saying that GL has changed several parts of the films (which he has, annoyingly) but is surprised he has also changed the Ep 6 final scene too (because he did not know it had been changed, and neither did I!). Now he is even more disappointed with GL saying he has lowered the bar even further. Is that correct?

[Loafmeister]

I know there was a box set released in 2006 that was supposed to have the original films, but I've read that even those are not 100% as they were. I've read that the only REALLY original versions were ever released on Laser Disc.

AFAIK, the "theatrical" dvd version IS transferred from the laserdisc version. The big brouhaha about 'em is the fact they are not anamorphic transfers, but content wise, they're supposed to be identical to the infamous laserdisc/theatrical versions.  If that's not the case, I'd be curious what the differences are that would cause one to be concerned.

Now, as a home theatre fan, not having the original trilogy in an anamorphic transfer sucks, pure and simply. However, neither is the laserdisc version (which I used to own btw...).

[Ond]

Huh?  wait...   can someone please translate this for a simpleton like me?

ta.

(I think what your'e saying is you think less of me because I prefer the original Star Wars to newer updated or SE versions???) Ok then.    What are you on? (and I bet you didn't even leave any for me either).

I think he is directing at Lucas, not you...

It seems like he is saying that GL has changed several parts of the films (which he has, annoyingly) but is surprised he has also changed the Ep 6 final scene too (because he did not know it had been changed, and neither did I!). Now he is even more disappointed with GL saying he has lowered the bar even further. Is that correct?

Ahhh, well if that’s the case I couldn’t agree more, I was furious and disappointed when I watched my DVD Ep 6 through.  The picture quality etc is pristine and tops my Laser Disc copy by a large degree BUT that scene nearly had me throwing stuff at my screen.  It’s just a damn shame.

[Cakemeister]

I have the "Adywan" fan edit, I like it. But that's just episode 4, dunno about the other two.

[Level42]

I know there was a box set released in 2006 that was supposed to have the original films, but I've read that even those are not 100% as they were. I've read that the only REALLY original versions were ever released on Laser Disc.

AFAIK, the "theatrical" dvd version IS transferred from the laserdisc version. The big brouhaha about 'em is the fact they are not anamorphic transfers, but content wise, they're supposed to be identical to the infamous laserdisc/theatrical versions.  If that's not the case, I'd be curious what the differences are that would cause one to be concerned.

Now, as a home theatre fan, not having the original trilogy in an anamorphic transfer sucks, pure and simply. However, neither is the laserdisc version (which I used to own btw...).

With not being anamorphic you mean it's 4:3 ? Honestly, I couldn't bear to see a 4:3 version really. It wasn't like that in the theaters and what I do remember is those versions. I probably did see VHS copies rented from the videotheque years ago, but then there only were 4:3 TV's....

So....to sum it up.....I need the widescreen laser disc copy ?
Good thread discussion but no PM's yet......

[HaRuMaN]

So....to sum it up.....I need the widescreen laser disc copy ?

Yes.  + Eleventy!

[javeryh]

I was debating showing Eps 4-6 to my daughter this summer (she's 5.5).  I really want to watch them with her but I don't want to scare her.  I definitely think episode 3 is too scary.

[patrickl]

Geez you people are a tough crowd. I watched the DVD releases with my kid and he loved them.

Still, if you want the unaltered versions then get the 2006 DVD set. That has to look better than a laserdisc rip.

:edit: I was looking for a screenshot of the laserdisc version and then I find that a guy who was preserving the laserdisc version has in fact switched to the 2006 DVD releases. Seeing that comparison, the laserdic version looks more like a blur of something resembling a star wars movie. Not really how I remember seeing it in the cinema. But then, that was 30 years ago, so I might not actually remember how it looked.

[Level42]

That says absolutely nothing.

He is talking about capturing the material. What did he use to capture the analogue video of the LaserDisc ? If he hooked it up to a crappy video input on a crappy video card, of course you get retarded quality compared to the DVD, that he can rip digitally (without any quality loss). You will need a decent quality analogue to digital video converter (like f.i. Canopus hardware) to get some decent results.

Of course, this is also true for all the other transfers that have been done from LD to digital.

The last time I watched LaserDisc was at the time that DVD was still for the "in" crowd and I was amazed by the picture quality.

However, it's still not so much the quality but the versions of the films that matter more to me.

[Ond]

I was debating showing Eps 4-6 to my daughter this summer (she's 5.5).  I really want to watch them with her but I don't want to scare her.  I definitely think episode 3 is too scary.

I didn't show my son Ep 4 till he was 6, (he's seven now and has seen 4,5,6 & 1 - in that order) that said you could cover her eyes just at the scene where Luke finds his Uncle and Aunty after stormtroopers have visited, that's what I did  .  It was great watching with him, but I didn't want his first Star Wars experience to be the new episodes.  I'm one of those dudes who saw Star Wars at it's premier in 77, a really wondrous experience.  You know, I share the disappointment of fans in the new episodes, but there is much technically that can be credited to Lucas that we enjoy today in both home cinema and cinema.  From Star Wars came (essentially) much improved multi channel sound systems, the technology eventually found it's way into our homes.  The flips side of the coin is that the great era of creative control by directors (70's) ended with Star Wars and Jaws, with the blockbuster came the "who cares what it's about as long as the kids go" ruling mentality in Hollywood at least.
The irony is that Lucas exerts total 'creative' control over his films now and turns out empty dross as a result.  For anyone interested  a great read about the topic (including) Lucas's and others story is the book "Easy Riders Raging Bulls by Peter Biskind".

[Epyx]

Secret history of Star Wars

Is a bloody fantastic read on the subject of Star Wars and Lucas

[patrickl]

That says absolutely nothing.

He is talking about capturing the material. What did he use to capture the analogue video of the LaserDisc ? If he hooked it up to a crappy video input on a crappy video card, of course you get retarded quality compared to the DVD, that he can rip digitally (without any quality loss). You will need a decent quality analogue to digital video converter (like f.i. Canopus hardware) to get some decent results.

and your downloaded laserdisc rip is going to look better?

However, it's still not so much the quality but the versions of the films that matter more to me.

They used the originals for the 2006/2008 "original" DVDs as were used for the 1993 laserdisc. Which is why it's still the same crappy 4:3 letterbox version and still not a real widescreen DVD.

They did make one change for the DVD though. They set the film to the original speed for the DVD version as opposed to speeding it up by 3% for the lasedisc to get the 1:25 film to fit in the maximum 1:21 minutes of a laserdisc. So, if anything, the DVD version is more authentic.

[Level42]

78106#msg1078106 date=1271109240]
They used the originals for the 2006/2008 "original" DVDs as were used for the 1993 laserdisc. Which is why it's still the same crappy 4:3 letterbox version and still not a real widescreen DVD.

And which is why I don't want that ---smurfy--- DVD release....4:3 sucks !

[O wait I missed the Letterbox there....I think I can live with that]

[patrickl]

78106#msg1078106 date=1271109240]
They used the originals for the 2006/2008 "original" DVDs as were used for the 1993 laserdisc. Which is why it's still the same crappy 4:3 letterbox version and still not a real widescreen DVD.

And which is why I don't want that ---smurfy--- DVD release....4:3 sucks !

[O wait I missed the Letterbox there....I think I can live with that]

They are both based on the same source material. There are plenty comparisons on the web.

[Ond]

So....the Laser Disc copies I have of the Trilogy are no good to you?  They are the best quality Wide Screen release of Star Wars available on LD (Original cost ~$480 for the box set).  They predate the DVD versions by many years.  They are the SE version with the CGI enhancements Lucas first made when the technology became available.  I can try to copy them to AVI or other format..my laser player doesn't get much use these days. it would be nice to have them for myself in this format,  hmm I'll have to experiment to see what's possible.  BTW Anamorphic doesnt necessarily mean Wide Screen, anamorphic compression is a picture technology which allows greater detail within the image through vertical compression of the picture.  Plenty of early DVD's were not anamorphic but were WS, Blade Runner comes to mind, the first DVD of that sucked quality wise.

[Ginsu Victim]

So....the Laser Disc copies I have of the Trilogy are no good to you?

They are the SE version with the CGI enhancements Lucas first made when the technology became available.

You answered your own question.

SE = Poo.

[wp34]

OK, I infected my son with the SW virus I guess. So far I've allowed him to see all but part 3 because I find the Anakin burning scenes too much for an 8 year old.

However, I've mentioned a couple times to him that part 4/6 were different when dady first saw them in the theater WAAAAAYYYY back in the 70's/80's. He keeps asking questions about it and I would love to see them in the original form again too.

I know there was a box set released in 2006 that was supposed to have the original films, but I've read that even those are not 100% as they were. I've read that the only REALLY original versions were ever released on Laser Disc.

I would appreciate any help in finding a lead to those movies in 100% original form. Please PM.

We watched Wizard of Oz a few weeks ago with the family.  My kids (especially the 12 year-old) made fun of how fake and old it looked and really never got into the spirit of the thing.  I was not expecting that response and it got me thinking about Star Wars.  When I watch the "original" EP4 (I have the 2006 DVD and the Letterbox VHS) it looks like a 30 year-old movie and it sounds like I'm watching it at a drive-in. I can honestly imagine my future grandkids having the same response someday when I show them the "original" Star Wars.

I still love the "original" so don't get me wrong.  But the SE looks much better and the added scenes don't really bother me in the big scheme of things.  I even think the HD version they show on Spike looks like a modern movie (haircuts aside).   I'd have preferred it if Lucas would have just restored EP4 without adding anything but he didn't.  There is an entire generation of kids that have never seen the "original" and still love Star Wars.

[SavannahLion]

Say what? I honestly thought my opinion couldn't possibly get any lower what with that   Jar Jar and Hans Solo vs Greedo amongst a myriad of other ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- nonsense, but this too? Congratulations you have successfully moved a bar that much lower.

I now can't decide which one is that much more worthless, Jack Thompson or George Lucas.

Huh?  wait...   can someone please translate this for a simpleton like me?

ta.

(I think what your'e saying is you think less of me because I prefer the original Star Wars to newer updated or SE versions???) Ok then.    What are you on? (and I bet you didn't even leave any for me either).

My opinion of George Lucas has lowered thanks to your previously quoted comment.

[SavannahLion]

We watched Wizard of Oz a few weeks ago with the family.  My kids (especially the 12 year-old) made fun of how fake and old it looked and really never got into the spirit of the thing. 

My nine year old is like that. I showed her Ghostbusters for the first time and she kept complaining it looked, "fake." I eventually got so annoyed that I just told her she could spend the rest of the afternoon in her room or keep her mouth shut and watch the movie.

What rubs me about the whole thing is that she thinks movies with intense CGI looks more realistic than the matte or stop motion animation of the old movies. In other words, Spy Kids is more convincing to her than Ghostbusters. 

But then again, the same kid watches Tremors and freaks out at night. 

[Ginsu Victim]

Show her Day of the Dead. That'll learn 'er!

[patrickl]

My nine year old is like that. I showed her Ghostbusters for the first time and she kept complaining it looked, "fake." I eventually got so annoyed that I just told her she could spend the rest of the afternoon in her room or keep her mouth shut and watch the movie.

Lol, yeah I watched Ghostbusters with my 7 year old and he noticed some fake ghosts too.

In retrospect I'm even more glad that I watched the 2004 digitally remastered versions of Star Wars with him. Indeed the (by today's standards) lame effects in the original version would sure have ticked him off too. It probably made more sense for him to see Hayden Christensen pop up in there instead of some unkown other actor who looked nothing like "Anakin". He doesn't have some sentimental attachment to the original version either. Neither do I for that matter. Although I had preferred not to see "Jar Jar Binks" walk through a scene.

[ark_ader]

If you live in the Uk I have all three (South Korean versions (in english) going into a skip or the oxfam shop.  You can have them if interested, and yes they are the original original ones.  Return of the Jedi is still shrink wrapped.

[danny_galaga]

If you live in the Uk I have all three (South Korean versions (in english) going into a skip or the oxfam shop.  You can have them if interested, and yes they are the original original ones.  Return of the Jedi is still shrink wrapped.

Wait, it has south korean actors in them? I'll give you a dollar for em