TRON JOYSTICK HANDLES (Recasting) PART 1

[Fozzy The Bear]

OK Guys..  As promised here are a few pictures and Part 1 of the Re-Casting Tutorial for the TRON Joysticks.

The finished sticks will be available soon.... but I'm still working on a price. I'm hopeful that it will come in under around £12 GBP  per set. That's about $19 to $20 USD at the current exchange rate. This will include the two stick halves and the trigger.

Rather than use the commercial process, that we normally use when casting things, I felt it was important to do this using a more domestic approach, that would allow as many people as possible to have a go at casting their own parts if they want to. So! Lets get started.



Materials List:
1 X Original Item. To cast from  (In this case a TRON Stick Handle)
2 X Litres of (18 Shore A) Silicone Rubber Mold Compound
2 X Cans of Silicon Rubber Catalyst (Hardener)
1 X Can of Thixotropic Compound (Thickens the pouring rubber)
1 X Roll of Brown Packing Tape.
1 X Large Sheet of Mounting Cardboard
1 X 5 Kg Bag Of Plaster Of Paris
1 X Kg of Wax Based Plastiscene (Non Setting Modelling Clay, MUST be wax based and NOT Oil Based)
4 X Glass Beads about ½" in diameter.

The above plus some nylon mixing jugs, scales, stirring sticks and a few other bits and bobs comes to a total cost of around $120 USD. (excluding the cost of the item you are casting from).  Silicone Rubber Mold Compound is not cheap stuff!!  But there are a few things we can do to use the minimum amount, and still retain the mold integrity.



This is the rubber we are casting the mold with. It produces extremely fine detail reproduction and hopefully will produce some very nice re-casts when we get to the resin stage.  The detail it can reproduce is as fine as a finger print on the surface of the object.  Silicone Rubber molds however, are not perfect and like a copy of anything, the finished item will never be 100% the same as the original and will have some process induced blemishes!! Pretty close to perfect though and for our purposes, as near as we need to get.



Here's the Joystick half that we're going to cast from. We need to block up any large holes or gaps to stop the rubber flowing into the inside. Otherwise we won't be able to get it out of the mold. Smaller holes like the screw holes can be blocked with a piece of packing tape. Very little, will actually stick to packing tape, including most resins and mold compounds.
Silicone Rubber has some very interesting properties. One of them is that it is self releasing! That means that we don't have to use any release compounds or waxes to get the mold to separate from the original item. The same applies, when we later come to pour the resin into the finished mold, no release compound is needed, thus helping to preserve the detail.



Next we mount the stick half onto a board, which is again covered in packing tape to make separation easier.  You will also see that we have half embedded the glass beads into the surface. These will form a depression in this half of the mold, and allow the second half of the mold to be accurately re-located when we come to cast from it.

Although it's not shown in the photograph, the bottom of the stick has been sealed with some of the Wax Based modelling clay, this is again to prevent the rubber flowing into the inner part of the stick. The clay MUST! be wax based. Oil based versions will react with the rubber as it sets and prevent it curing properly.



Now we form a wall around the original object to retain the silicone and plaster. Again this is covered in packing tape. The object is retained on the board, with a single screw just to keep it from moving.

Once this is completed we mix the Rubber and the Catalyst in the proportions listed by the manufacturer. In this case, the Catalyst is coloured bright red, so it's easy to see when the two are properly mixed.  Stir carefully and slowly!!! This is very important, as we don't want to introduce air bubbles into the mix.  We also added a Thixotropic Agent at this stage, to make the compound slightly thicker and to stop it from flowing straight off the object.



This is the part where Brax (Brad) has a heart attack as we cover his lovely joystick handle with all this rubber goop!! Making sure that all of the surface is well covered.

Sit back! Have a cup of tea and wait two hours for it to set up.



Next we pour a layer of Plaster Of Paris over the top to almost fill up the box. This will act as a mother mold and support the finished rubber mold when we come to cast in it.

Once it has all set, We turn it over and prepare to cast the inner half of the mold. More pics to follow.......... Sometime Soon...

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[leapinlew]

Wow!

Fozzy! I'm impressed. Very good work. Nicely documented.

Beyond my technical skills. I'd gladly buy one if we can figure out how to get it to work with the lightcycles. I'll be watching with great interest!

[CheffoJeffo]

This is the part where Brax (Brad) has a heart attack as we cover his lovely joystick handle with all this rubber goop!! Making sure that all of the surface is well covered.

Sit back! Have a cup of tea and wait two hours for it to set up.

First ... and most crucially ... Brax -- are you local to TO ?  I need to buy you a drink or two. Failing that, where are you and I'll find someone to get you a drink or two!

Second ... but almost as crucial ... HUGE tks to Fozzy (I believe I committed to two trans blue and two trans red, if you choose to do red ... still in)!!!!

Cheers.

[1hookedspacecadet]

holy crap this is beyond kick ass - http://retroblast.com/newsitem.php?cid=1340

[rdagger]

Great tutorial, definitely want to see more.  I've had failure after failure trying to make silicone molds.  I just opened a HSIII mold tonight that has been sitting on my desk for a week and it is a complete failure.  I guess I need a good scale to better measure the ratios.  The HSIII is $30/lb. U.S. at my local hobby store.  Too bad their isn't a cheaper substitute or a recipe for home brew silicone.  Thanks for the tip on the Thixotropic compound.  I think you are going to be flooded with orders.

[quarterback]

Looks awesome!  Put me down for at least one!

[yyttu]

This is on MAKE, btw.

http://www.makezine.com/blog/archive/2006/05/homeade_tron_arcade_joysticks.html?CMP=OTC-0D6B48984890

Good work, Julian 

[Alcathiax]

Stupid question...you just casting the sticks or are you working on something that will resolve the Lightcycle jaggies issue also?

[Havok]

Is it done yet?

 

[Hurray Banana]

This is looking good, I'd definitely be up for some of these.

Keep the pics coming.

[Quarters]

Great work. Thanks for posting!

I have some experience molding war game miniatures in both lead and Alumilite plastic. I am very curious about the resins You will use for the final product.

Warning for the novice:
wearing latex gloves while working with RTV/silicon rubber seems like a good idea and is recommended in some places. Beware, Some RTV/silicon rubber products will not cure after being exposed to latex. This will leave you with a sticky mess covering your original piece. I found this one out the hard way

Looking forward to PART II

[Fozzy The Bear]

Thanks Guys! I'll keep the pictures coming whenever I can find the time.....

Thanks also To "Retroblast" and "Make Magazine" for the articles.... Very nice guys!!

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[MinerAl]

 

Thanks for the tutorial, and the potential to seriously improve the state of many of our CPs.

Excellent work.

[ahofle]

Pretty amazing stuff -- excellent work.  I hope this turns out!   

[Santoro]

 

[Fozzy The Bear]

Thanks for the further comments guys!

Just a quick note.... Please don't PM me asking to be put on the list or asking me how to order them. I'm really snowed under with work right now and just don't have the time to answer 30 PM's...

There is actually no list, I'm not running one. They will only go on sale once they are complete, out of the mold and ready to ship. Please note that the suggested price is provisional and subject to the deal I have managed to arrange on the bulk resin!! It may go up or down at the time it gets ordered. I'm doing my best to keep the price as low as I can.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[ahofle]

Heh, I was betting you'd regret mentioning the $20 figure, since it's now quoted in two publications. 

[Fozzy The Bear]

Heh, I was betting you'd regret mentioning the $20 figure, since it's now quoted in two publications. 

LOL  Not regretting it at all..... It's very probably the correct figure! and it's not likely to move by more than a dollar or so anywany.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Brax]

This is the part where Brax (Brad) has a heart attack as we cover his lovely joystick handle with all this rubber goop!! Making sure that all of the surface is well covered.

Not quite a heart attack but my pulse has quickened a bit. I'm looking forward to the pics of my handle OUT of the mold!  Ha!

Seriously though, great work Fozzy. I think it's beyond cool that we're getting some reproductions of one of the coolest arcade sticks ever created. Good on ya!

[crashwg]

Fozzy, I don't see mention anywhere on the quality of the materials...  Care to comment on that?  Would these be suitable for replacement on a cab that is in the field?

[Jabba]

Very nice work. I would be interested in one as well if it ever works out.

Thanks Foz!

[joe35car]

just awesome. I'll be getting one of those.   

[RayB]

That is just too phallic!

[Fozzy The Bear]

Fozzy, I don't see mention anywhere on the quality of the materials...  Care to comment on that?  Would these be suitable for replacement on a cab that is in the field?

The finished items will actually be stronger than an original. The originals are injection molded in Polystyrene, and therefore slightly brittle. Even more so with age. So yes the copies should be perfect for restoration because the resin we will be using is stronger and very slightly flexible.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Brax]

I'm trying to follow the process here.... So this will give you the outside details of one half; what about the inside details? Will there be 4 casts taken in total? I feel like I'm missing the obvious but I can't quite envision how it'll work out.

[Fozzy The Bear]

I'm trying to follow the process here.... So this will give you the outside details of one half; what about the inside details? Will there be 4 casts taken in total? I feel like I'm missing the obvious but I can't quite envision how it'll work out.

Yes Brad.... Exactly that... We'll be making the inner half of this side when we turn it over.

That's why we embedded the glass beads. So that we end up with a depression in this half of the mold. When we turn it over and pour the second half of this mold, those depresions will fill with rubber and ensure that we can accurately align the two parts of the mold when we come to pour the resin.

I'll be posting the pictures of that in the next couple of weeks.  The complete mold set for the two sides of the stick is in four pieces.

Plus of course another two piece mold for the trigger.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Teebor]

Fantastic work Fozzy, Its bringing a tear to my eye to see such work and the resurrection of such a great stick.

I imagine you have more orders than you can shake a stick at already

Can't wait for them to be finished and I myself would love to have at least one. 

one final note

 

[Luckydevil]

I didn't see it mentioned... will the handles be translucent blue like the originals?

[Brax]

One more general casting question.

Is there a theshold for how much Thixotropic Agent you can use depending on the complexity of the part? Could it ever impede it from running into all the fine detailed bits or is this unlikely?

[MinerAl]

...Thixotropic...

You can't just make up words. 

[RandyT]

...Thixotropic...

You can't just make up words. 

No, but you are allowed to use them after someone else does.  It's in the rule book.

Nice job, Julian.  Just a heads up on a couple of issues one might run into.  De-airing of the mold compound, and most likely the resin, is usually recommended.  The silicone I have is supposed to be subjected to a vacuum at a high enough level to cause the silicone to double in size and collapse before it is poured over the master.  Stirring slowly and carefully is very good advice, but even so, there could still be a lot of air in the mix.  If there is, it probably won't be much of an issue unless the bubbles are right next to the interior surface of the mold.

The real test will be the ability to get the resin into all those small and intricate areas of the mold without using a vacuum.  You may already have this planned, but I thought I would bring it up just in case.

RandyT

[PoDunkMoFo]

...Thixotropic...

You can't just make up words. 

Silly rabbit Tixotropics are for Kids.

[Kremmit]

I didn't see it mentioned... will the handles be translucent blue like the originals?

UV reactive blue?

[Fozzy The Bear]

I didn't see it mentioned... will the handles be translucent blue like the originals?

UV reactive blue?

Translucent Blue... and possibly Red as well......  UV Reactive, ermmm don't know yet! I'll take a look at that.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Fozzy The Bear]

Nice job, Julian.  Just a heads up on a couple of issues one might run into.  De-airing of the mold compound, and most likely the resin, is usually recommended.  The silicone I have is supposed to be subjected to a vacuum at a high enough level to cause the silicone to double in size and collapse before it is poured over the master.

Thanks Randy..... This particular silicone is actually very good at achieving a result without de-gassing.  Although I would normally do that. it will certainly be done with the resin. The reason for not doing it here is that I wanted to show the route 99% of people could follow to actually achieve a result at home, without using the commercial methods that we usually use.

It actually works pretty well!

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[Fozzy The Bear]

Is there a theshold for how much Thixotropic Agent you can use depending on the complexity of the part? Could it ever impede it from running into all the fine detailed bits or is this unlikely?

Yes there is.... In this case it's 5% but that only applies to this particular brand (check with your supplier for other brands and ask them to provide data sheets).  If you do add 5% you end up with something that is about the consistency of butter, and you can then apply it with a palette knife.  So you would still be able to get it into all of the details, if you did that.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[rdagger]

For people who want to try it themselves, I just had some luck casting some volcano lens.  I used Alumilite which is kind of expensive, but I found another casting resin by Environmental Tech that is much cheaper.  I haven't tried it, but it looks good.  It comes in clear and there are dyes including translucent blue.  They also have a translucent pearl that would be cool or maybe you could make a red, white & blue stick.  To eliminate the bubbles, I've been curing the resin in a paint tank pressurized to 45 PSI.  I should have taken some pictures of the process, but I have had so many failures that I stopped filming.

[Brax]

Julian,
Since "very little sticks to silicon rubber" won't you have trouble with the plaster of paris mother mold sticking to the silicone rubber mold? Do you have to laminate or tape them together or do you just let gravity do its bit?

I'm also interested in seeing how you get the resin into the two piece mold.

This is better than tv. 

[Fozzy The Bear]

Julian,
Since "very little sticks to silicon rubber" won't you have trouble with the plaster of paris mother mold sticking to the silicone rubber mold? Do you have to laminate or tape them together or do you just let gravity do its bit?

I'm also interested in seeing how you get the resin into the two piece mold.

This is better than tv. 

Usually you just put a couple of rubber bands around the whole mold set.... that's the two outer mother molds and the two inner rubber ones.  You don't want to squeeze it too tightly otherwise the rubber will get distorted and the finished object will get a bit squashed in shape.

There are a couple of methods for getting the resin in there. I'll try and illustrate all of them when we come to do the casts.

There is one thing about "resin in and air out" that I just noticed I forgot to document in Part 1.... I'll make sure there's a note on that in Part 2

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

[ErikRuud]

Translucent Blue... and possibly Red as well......  UV Reactive, ermmm don't know yet! I'll take a look at that.

Best Regards,
Julian (Fozzy The Bear)

Possible leads on UV Pigments.

http://www.dayglo.com/products_nightglo.asp  (Untested)

http://www.specialtycoatingschem.com/pg-3.htm#k-color  (Reccomended by http://www.lumicast.com/)

http://eagerplastics.com/7702.htm

I got these links from a discussion on the Yahoo Casting group.  The first one had not been tested by anyone on the group.  The other two were reccomended by peopl that had actually used them.