New Rowe Ami help topic

[ami-man]

Hi,

The old topic was getting long in the tooth with many pages to go through. So here is a new topic page.

If you require advice on Rowe Ami jukeboxes with regards to faults, where to get parts etc by all means leave a post.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[ami-man]

Hi
The idear for this new topic was that people would be able to go to this topic rather than the old one.

To help me or any of the other members of this forum giving advice it would be helpful to include details of what country you live in.
This would help in giving information such as where to go for spare parts/engineers etc.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK
alan-hood@datex.co.uk

[Ken Layton]

Right you are Alan. 

Alan is in the UK and I'm right here in the USA.

Don't forget that Rowe-Ami, also now known as AMI Entertainment Network (owners of Merit Games and the Megatouch contertop games) also now owns their competitor jukebox manufacturer, Rock-Ola!

[ami-man]

Hi Ken,

Didn't you say that Rowe Ami have moved its manufacturing to Mexico?
Do you think that they will continue with two lines of product or will they merge it into one.
I have had no dealings with the digital jukeboxes of any kind but I expect one download is as good as another.
Unless it is any different in the USA the operator has got the short end of the stick once more. What would you say that your operating profit per machine is in the USA?
When we went out of operating about ten years ago the UK's average was less than a pound per week per machine!

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[Ken Layton]

The operator must pay for high speed internet access specifically for the downloader jukebox so that's a monthly bill right there.

Depending on the whether the juke is setup with AMI Entertainment Network, Ecast, or Touchtunes hardware/system, the juke manufacturer either takes 10 cents of every dollar taken in or 25% right off the top, whichever is greater. This is supposed to cover copyright & licensing. Of course the purchase price of the machine has to factor in. These jukes cost about $6,500 to buy and are sold to operators only.

Only the best locations can make the operator any money and in some cases the location gets LESS money than if they would have had a CD jukebox in there.

[Kevin Mullins]

Are there any common techniques for dealing with a button panel like on an R-83 that wants to double hit on a couple numbers ?
Sometimes if you press a button just ever so it will register twice.
So instead of 2, you get 22, etc.

I've them apart, not much there to mess with. Two pins and a light spring. I did notice on a couple of them where one or both of the pins weren't quite seated all the way down in the bottom. But other than that all I can think of is maybe trying a slightly heavier spring. (?)

This is in my project pc jukebox, so no original electronics other than the keypad itself in that regards. I'm pretty certain it's a mechanical contact type issue.

[Ken Layton]

Contacts should be clean and both sets should mate at the same time.

[Kevin Mullins]

Thanks Ken..... kinda what I was suspecting.
They're clean, I'm figuring when the button is hit just right that one pin is letting off and the other is making contact right after.
I will continue to fiddle with them then. 

[Ken Layton]

Seeburg's keypad switches were the same way and had the same problems.

[ami-man]

Hi,

I have cleaned the contacts in the past, set the springs but in the end you usually have to replace the switch.


Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man

[Kevin Mullins]

I also kinda figure there's a little rocking action to the buttons due to normal wear. Ever so slight as it may be, but enough to not have a direct contact on both points simultaneously at times if hit just right. I only have one that is really notorious for double striking. I may even just go in and cover/remove one contact point if it becomes too much of a problem.

[ami-man]

Hi Kevin,

I have had defective Selector Logic boards that have also given the fault similar to buttons being double hit!

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[Kevin Mullins]

There is no Selector Logic board in this particular unit anymore.   
It's the PC based one I threw together a few years ago.
I'm pretty certain it's just the button/switches are worn a bit. They are original.

[ami-man]

Hi Kevin,

I think you were converting a R-83 Disco 200 is that correct?

Look out for any key switches from the following jukeboxes to use as spares and remember do not use the switches from 1 or 2 because they are the most used switches.

R-80S, R-81, R-82, R-83, CTI-1SC, RI-2.

At a pinch you may be able to mod a switch assembly (after removing the popular switch) from a R-90 and R-91, have a look what on Ebay at the moment I saw a couple of switch assemblies on there the other day.
Here is a Ebay number for a R-90 keypad (and a short cable from the plug)
110414891395 for sale in the USA.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[Kevin Mullins]

Hi Alan,
Yes, it was a gutted R-83 and you've help me with lots of tidbit information that was key to incorporating what was left of the original components. (output transformer assy, selector display schematics, etc)

I had a thread on here from when I first started it. But my harddrive with all my notes and pictures during the process died, so I never updated the thread.
Maybe I should go back and post an "it's ugly, but it works" post. 

Funny you mention the #1 & #2 button, makes sense.... and guess which one gives me the most trouble? (#2)
Allbeit these aren't tooooo terrible yet, but they'll get ya enough times to be a tad annoying.

Sucks because when I was initially building this thing I was missing several actual buttons and switches and couldn't find any. I finally found an old operator who had a whole panel assembly locally......needless to say I paid like $75 AND traded in my old panel to get that one.
 

[ami-man]

Hi Kevin,

Just change the 8 & 9 or the reset for the 1 & 2 buttons, till you get another button bank.

Regards

Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[Kevin Mullins]

Just change the 8 & 9 or the reset for the 1 & 2 buttons, till you get another button bank.

Good point...... may just do that. 

[ami-man]

Hi,

Wishing you all a Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[Kevin Mullins]

Thank you Alan.... and a Happy Holidays to you and yours the same.   

[KingCounty]

Hi,
Looking for help on Rowe CD100B Error Codes.
'Board Error' light is coming on and I am getting error code 05-63-03 which is telling me there is a problem with the CCC.
Is there anyway around this or a way to fix this w/out replacing the CCC?
Thanks.
Regards,
FS

[Ken Layton]

Sounds like communications between the CCC and mech control board were lost 3 times. Bad solder joints on the connector header pins on both the mech control board and CCC board may be the cause.

[ami-man]

Hi FS,

Ken is correct it is a communication fault on the Rowelink between the CCC and the Mechanism Control unit.
More than likely this will be down to dry joints (cold joints in the USA) and will be on the Mech Control/Decoder

Rowe says the probable cause is the CCC harness or the Mech Conrol has failed.

If you need board repairs in the USA then Bruce Wentworth is your best bet.
www.abjukeboxrepair.com

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK
alan-hood@datex.co.uk

[KingCounty]

Thanks to you both for your help, I really do appreciate it.

Now, this may be an extremely dumb question, but how would I go about fixing the 'cold' joints?

I literally just purchased the machine, so I am guessing I need to reach out to the company I bought it from to ensure it will be covered by the warranty.

Thanks again.
-FS

[Kevin Mullins]

Now, this may be an extremely dumb question, but how would I go about fixing the 'cold' joints?

Not dumb at all......

Pull the boards, flip them over, remove the old solder from the pins, then resolder the pins.
"Header Pins" being where the wiring harness plugs into each board.

A "cold joint" is basically a broken solder joint. No/bad continuity between the pin and the solder pad itself.

[richard2010]

hi all i`m new here and having a problem with my jukebox

i have a ami rowe r85 starwood from 1980
this machine has the following problem
when you put the power on the machine ,the lights are working
pull the service switch from off to serv =no problems
pull the service switc from serv to on the wheel with records starts spinning
the display on the front shows recordnr 100 and the light from record playing is blinking and the light from make a selection also blinking
when i pull the switch from the money,the counter starts counting and the displays shows 0
the keypad on the machine does nothing

i have allready ordered a manual,but it did not arrived yet

i know a lot of elektronics
when i pull the serv switch from on to serv the wheel stops spinning en sometimes he picks up a record an starts playing
the playing and te sound are good no problems with that

he doesnt want to work in on position

what i allready did so far(before this machine i own for a several years a rock ola gp160 so i know a little bit of jukeboxes)
clean all contacts
put the eye on the wheel good so it sees the 0 positioning,when the wheel is spinning the eye blinks on the 0 ,but the light opt.switch index on the bord on the record player burns all the time
solder all joints to prevent broken solder
clean all bords
check the nummeric pad ,all contacts working fine
check all wiring of broken cables with a meter

so i`m now so far that for me it leaves 2 options

the eye and light opt.switch
does the eye counts also the teeth on the wheel so it can see in with position it is and when its spinning does the light off opt.switch constantly burning
or does the light flikkering every time the eye sees a tooth ??

i have allready checked the main computer
and i`m thinking of ic nummer 2203cp of this one is ok
this chip sends the signal for the wheel
only thing is is this a programmed chip from the factory or a normal one,couse it has a red dot sticker on it

the normal chip is here in holland very easy to get,the main board is here in holland not availlable

i know it`s a hole story
but beter getting the hole information than the half information to solve the problem

i hope someone can help me

greetz from holland

[ami-man]

Hi Richard,

Wait until you get your manual, check out the adjustments for the opto switch and clean the opto and the gear teeth that passes through the opto.

If this does not sort out your problem then you need to send the following boards to a Rowe Ami specialist:-

Central Control Computer
Mechanism Control Mechanism.
Pricing board.

I am in the UK.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK
alan-hood@datex.co.uk

[richard2010]

hoi alan

thank for the reply

today i received the manual of the jukebox
what i see in the troubleshooting says also the opto it tells even how to set the opto right
this opto shoud let the light opt.switch blinking when the wheel is spinning
this light is burning all the time,so he doesnt see the wheel tooth at all
so what i`m thinking already,that this opto is gone
the tooth on the wheel is clean

the guy where i bought this machine tells me that he has bought it and the machine was working fine
after transport it to his home,the machine wont work only the wheel is spinning
so it must be something simple

for the rest in the manual the schematics of this machine is for myself very simple
the chipset for the ccc is very simple i have seen on this manual
so i will find it out now with this manual and let the machine running in no time
what i allready find out here in holland is that spare parts for this machine is hard to get here
but elektronic spare parts are easy to get at the local elektronic supplier
so restoring boards will be very easy here

greetz from holland

[richard2010]

hello

with the manual i find out that the control board for the motor has a problem

the chip on this board is gone
the signal from the optic eye is good it sees the 0 position and the tooth signal is going to the board
only thing is that the opt.switch index light is the whole time burning and not blinking as the book says

in the troubleshooting they also talking about spinning wheel without stopping

after some measurment i find out that the chip lm3302n is gone ans gives a continu signal to the light and no signal to ccc

so the computer sees the 0 and can not count so its never reaches his startpostioning

it keeps spinning until it reaches his counting signal

i think when i repaired that
the machine will work again

what i find strange how is this chip gone??
high voltage??

greetz from holland

[ami-man]

Hello Richard,

The seller will always say that a fault will be an easy fix, if they said that it would cost you a pot of money to put right, then you would not buy.

Spare electronic parts are not cheap if they are working.
The mechanical parts are not that much other than the opto switch which you would have to pay £40 plus for a second hand (used) part or up to £70 new from Rowe Ami if they still have any.

Please let this forum know how you get on with your repair.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[richard2010]

hai alan

today i went to the elektronic shop and buy a ic for the motor mechanism board and a special foot for easy changing the ic(ic is 3 euro here in holland)
replaced the old with the new one,put the board back
and the system works!!
the light of the opt,system blinks and is counting the wheel

but....now the next problem occures
the keypad doesnt work,the switches of the keypad are good
so checking the system from ccc to keypad
from ccc to pricing board everything is ok
but now is comes

in my manual the leading points  positive signal from ccc what is going trough the pricing board to keypad what is leading to reset and most played,and the one going to 1,2,3,4,5 and 6,7,8,9,0 are diverent on the board than in the manual
also the cable from pricing board to keypad is different
the cable numbers on pricing board are correct
but the cables on the keypad are on other places than the manual says

do you know of there different manuals of the r85
of is there different cables and keypads for this machine

what you told me about the guy who sold me this machine is true i think
i think he tryed to fix it himself,but doesnt know what he was doing,i know what i`m doing so the machine will work
i think the keypas issue is the last thing that occures,the display works also fine

i hope for your answer

greetz from holland

[fredster]

I just wanted to thank Ken and Ami Man for helping me fix my R-84.

It's still working just fine.

I'm glad to have a resouce like you guys!

[richard2010]

hello

i found it out a little bit today

there are 2 different schedules of the r85 from the ccc

with the right shedule i find out that the chip what send the strobe signal is gone,so replaced it...find there`s another chip gone

so monday i will change all normal ic`s
the ones that comes from the factory,who are programmed are good

i think the machine has occured a power overload or something,cause till now there are two normal ic`s blown
those are the cheap ic`s here in holland

so i`m gonna protect the machine intern with a unit to protect the machine against power peaks

the record system is now good,only the ccc not...but it will comes

till so far my update

greetz from holland

[richard2010]

hai alan

is it possible to order a ccc somewhere
i found out after a evening measuring that the normal ic`s are gone,but also the programmed ic`s

so the eletronics of this machine has had a power peak or something like that and destroyed the ccc

i hope somebody can help me with a new ccc its number 6-08870-04

greetz from holland

[ami-man]

Hello Richard,

If you require a replacement CCC then the only place you will be able to sourse one is by looking on Ebay. More than likely a working CCC could be found by a USA seller, but check with the seller that it has been tested. You may have to pay more than £100 to get one.

If you wish to send the board to me for testing/repair please contact me off line.

Regards
Alan Hood
ami-man
UK
alan-hood@datex.co.uk

[richard2010]

hai alan

found indeed a seller in america for the board

i can ship it to them for repair or change for another one
so i send a mail to them and the answert with the following thing...we dont send out the usa

so here i am with a juke that can not select

i find out on the board that the microprosessor is gone,the 8v reaches the chip,but no signal out to the keypad

i,m looking now to somebody who has this type of chip

maybe you somebody

because there 3 chips on it they are programmed,and i want to change them

in europe nobody has something for this machine

in holland and belgium there are some people who are repairs ami
and they all say that this type of machine from rowe and all closed jukes from them are trash
cause they have al lot of problems and difficult to repair

they give me one advice,do spent to much and if it not working sell it in spare parts

now i have been searching around for a couple of days for chips for the board
i`m beginning to thinking those guys are right

i also found an old rockola where the outer case is cracked,but the juke is working fine
when i`m not capable to find the stuff for the rowe,i trow out of all the stuff of rowe and built in the rock ola system

i like the case of this model from rowe and i want to change it to something special

i hope you know something for the chips

greetz from holland

[ami-man]

Hi Richard,

From what you say I am your best hope to get this repaired in Europe.
I will email you with our full details and estimated prices etc.

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK
alan-hood@datex.co.uk

[richard2010]

hello

here the last update for the juke
i`m done with it,i know what it is and spare parts are very difficult to find in europe
so the juke is going away,as one piece or scrap(anybody needs something)

i bought today a rock ola 404 for very cheap,also with problems but i know now allready what the problems are and how to fix

so i will have more fun with this machine than with the ami---no more ami for me

greetz from holland

[ami-man]

Hello Richard,

Sorry that you have given up on the Rowe Ami, I hope you have better luck with the Rock Ola 404 Capri (1963).

Regards
Alan

Alan Hood
ami-man
UK

[richard2010]

hello alan

thank you for your last message

i put the ami in the basement,maybe i will find a computer later somewhere otherwise it will be spareparts for other machines here in europe

i`m still busy with the rock ola
it is very easy to find materials for replacement
i`m done the chromework,amplifier,stepper and playing mechanism
i`m now waiting for the last little pieces for the machine

went last week to belgium(mechelen)there was show with jukes and gaming machines and also spare parts
found myself a wallbox matching with the machine i have now

so the rock ola is getting a great machine

i maybe getting an ami back in here,i`m busy with a guy who has a ami lyric for sale with work
i did him an offer...who knows

greetz from holland

p.s if there`s people from europe or else who needs spare parts from an ami/rowe r85 contact me
machine is good,computer is bad(having it`s own live)

[JayhawkJones]

Hello! I'm a new owner of a Rowe CD100E, and I've already got a problem -- hopefully you can help me out.

I listened to it play a CD at the store, it played fine. Got it home, it still is playing fine. Listened to a few odd CDs in it on Saturday and Sunday, no problems.

Sunday night I decide to go for it and load it up with 100 CDs. I initialize it and it initializes 85 of the 100 CDs. I went ahead and played a few of the 85 working CDs... but two songs in, the juke starts putting down and picking up CDs without playing them.

So I replaced the 15 bad CDs and went to re-initialize. Now it's not initializing ANY CDs -- it tells me 0 are initialized. I cleared the earlier initialization, turned it off, unplugged it for the evening and started over the next day. Once again, it tells me zero CDs are initialized.

I watched the CD player on the initialization that worked -- it took a good 30 seconds or so with each CD. Now, it only takes maybe 3 seconds with each CD, and barely spins it but a few times before putting it back.

Any ideas? I've got the manual but didn't really see anything like this in the troubleshooting section.

Thanks a bunch!