BYOAC Discounts With Vendors?

[DashRendar]

I am working on a new project, and was wondering if any of the regular vendors in this trade provide discounts/coupon codes for BYOAC members?

I'm pretty sure I've seen this before, but I wasn't sure if we had a list somewhere.  That would be helpful!

[Hoopz]

Here's a link to the Master list of vendors.  I don't think it shows who gives us discounts though.  I'm sure everyone will support you taking on that project.   

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=54812.0

[Ginsu Victim]

I know in the past that Mamemarquees offered 10% off at checkout if you enter "BYOAC"

Worked last time I used it (but that was a year and a half ago).

[syph007]

I remember when I ordered router bits from holbren there was a discount code, it wasnt a BYOAC specific one but it gave you 10% off.   woodnet10

[DashRendar]

Here's a link to the Master list of vendors.  I don't think it shows who gives us discounts though.  I'm sure everyone will support you taking on that project.   

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=54812.0

Vendors! There is a lot of potential business here at BYOAC!  If you can offer a discount to the members of this community, please reply to this thread!

 

[SirPeale]

I used to offer a 5% discount with code BYOAC in my store.  No one took advantage of it.   

[DashRendar]

Maybe we should just have a stickied thread, where the vendors can post a link to their site, and the code for the discount they are offering.

It would increase business for the vendors, and make it easier for BYOAC members to take advantage of.   

[Ginsu Victim]

Nah, they're going to get our business anyway. I don't see an advantage for them.

[DashRendar]

Not necessarily.

I know someone who picked up a countertop from Home Depot to use as his control panel, because while he spent money on it, it wasn't as expensive as a professional control panel from Mameroom.com.

Someone might buy a Happ 8-way joystick instead of an Ultimarc 360, because again, it's a bit cheaper.

You may know someone who decided to spray paint their cabinet sides black, instead of spending some money to buy side art.

We almost always have choices for what we buy- and it does come down to cost for a lot of people in this hobby.

[Ginsu Victim]

5 - 10 percent really wouldn't do much to convince most people to buy one of the items you mentioned, though. That's not a lot of savings at all. You can't compare a Happ Comp/Super to a U360 in price no matter what the savings are. Even at 50% off, the U360 is still too expensive for some buyers.

You may know someone who decided to spray paint their cabinet sides black, instead of spending some money to buy side art.

I saved 50% on my mamemarquees art and my wife still felt it was high. 

[RayB]

I think most of us would order from the main known arcade/mame vendors regardless of a discount.

[Ginsu Victim]

I think most of us would order from the main known arcade/mame vendors regardless of a discount.

Exactly my point. They are getting our business no matter what.

[CheffoJeffo]

As the resident grumpy old man ... you're going to order from the main vendors.

And, let's remember that the reason that you have many of these vendors is because of BYOAC. Absent the cornerstone that saint has created here, I'm not sure that this cottage industry would exist.

Anybody who thinks that a Super is a "bit cheaper" than a U360 needs to revisit comparative mathematics -- the price comparison isn't even remotely close and no reasonable discount is going to change that. The same applies even more vehemently for those who spray paint over choosing side art.

No realistic discount is ever going to convince someone to buy a U360 over a Super -- they need to understand the difference in functionality (or be a lemming who posts asking "What is the best joystick ?" and then does what they are told).

FWIW, I applaud (and, wherever possible, support) vendors who offer BYOAC members discounts (off the top of my head, GameRoom Magazine has for a long time), but I think it is naive to expect niche vendors to provide discounts to what, in essence, is 99% of their market.

Perhaps if more folks supported those who do offer discounts ... but, as a rule, we don't because we, as a rule, are a bunch of cheap ---smurfs--- looking for someone to give us a break.

 

[Ginsu Victim]

Thank you for that excellent post, Cheffo.

I bought Happ Universals because I was on a budget, but I turned around and bought U360s because I wanted the best sticks money can buy. Not everyone will do that, though.

These guys aren't really making huge profits to begin with (especially the Happ resellers).

[CheffoJeffo]

I bought Happ Universals because I was on a budget, but I turned around and bought U360s because I wanted the best sticks money can buy. Not everyone will do that, though.

For my first project, I bought Happ Ultimates ... and, FWIW, they are still in that cocktail and nobody, other than me, realizes that they are total crap ...

 

[DashRendar]

I suppose it comes down to budgets.

If I have $75 available for my project, the cost of the items I need will determine how that budget is allocated.

I agree, a 5% or 10% discount doesn't change much if it's a $30 joystick we're talking about.  But if it's a $500 arcade monitor, or a $150 control panel, it can help.

It gets down to business models I guess.  Some people raise the price of their items, understanding they'll sell fewer but will make up for it by getting more off each sale.  Others lower the price of their items, understanding they'll sell more, and will thus make profits from volume.

It's an interesting discussion though.  I've only been around for 7 months or so.  I can only imagine what it was like when this hobby first began.  We are starting to see some competition now (encoders, side art, cabinets, etc).

[CheffoJeffo]

I totally applaud small-budget projects ... I can build a MAME box that would satisfy 95% of the population for the cost of a JPac, ArcadeVGA and an audio amplifier. There is at least one forum master around that I respect, but who I believe lacks an understanding of building within a small budget.

 

If you can find me a discount on a $500 arcade monitor ... wait ... $500 is too much to spend on an arcade monitor in the first place ... I told you that we were a bunch of cheap ---smurfs--- !

And, yes, it is an interesting discussion.

I'm all for discounts, but how many ever support those who offer them ?

Did you subscribe to GRM because they offer a discount ?

No ?

Didn't think so.

 

[Epyx]

Im just happy there are people out there supporting our hobby period. Rather than worry about a 5% to 10% discount, my main concern is to spread my arcade $$ between as many of them as I can. I will buy from a vendor like Ultimarc and then purposely buy something else I need from a vendor like GroovyGameGear just to give them all a bit of my $$ pie.

I appreciate what they do and realize the niche market they are catering to, for some of the items/services these guys offer 5 to 10% can make the difference between making money and breaking even. 

[Ginsu Victim]

Yep. I respect Ultimarc's products enough that I bought the Aimtrak before anyone had one. I was just happy to have a vendor to buy from that supported this hobby the way Andy does. A discount is always nice, I won't disagree with that, but it's not going to stop me from buying from one vendor over another.

[Turnarcades]

Speaking as a hobbyist, I feel it's good to get stuff at a consistently good price an quality, rather than be priced as such that they have to run discounts just to get sales. However, obviously not everyone shares this idea as a recent thread I started about researching parts for new fabrication and aiming to bringing them out to customers at a consistently cheaper price than is currently available was mostly met with " oh I'm just happy to get them from the same source everyone else does, even though they're pricey...".

So it seems to me most hobbyists here either have money to burn or just can't be bothered to shop around, feeling a kinship if going with the masses.

As a vendor it's difficult to judge the benefits of the type of discounts the original poster has in mind, as we are not currently a parts supplier - supplying full machines obviously means our business model is very different as it does not depend on high-selling, low-profit margin goods. Indeed, most arcade builders have gone to the other extreme:

It gets down to business models I guess.  Some people raise the price of their items, understanding they'll sell fewer but will make up for it by getting more off each sale.  Others lower the price of their items, understanding they'll sell more, and will thus make profits from volume.

This point is true for most large parts suppliers or cabinet builders, who have low-selling goods so just try to slap on massive profit margins to compensate for this. We've always tried to stay at the other end of this though which is why we continue to thrive - we are possibly the cheapest 'hand-built cabinet' builders in Europe and although the cut isn't massive, we've found the right balance to be cheaper than the rest and encorage more sales, but still take a decent cut for the service without having to 'up prices' or run huge specials.

I did consider running a BYOAC member discount but our target demographic is mostly novices just getting into the hobby or casual gamers, not experienced builders as we all are here. The only offer we consistently run is really a 'word of mouth' encouragement, where previous customers or new buyers recommending a friend, the recommending customer gets up to a £50 reward/discount whilst the recommended friend gets up to the same as a discount off their order. It encourages joint orders and repeat business.

[RandyT]

I guess I'll chime in here with my thoughts.  

First, CheffoJeffo knows what he's talking about.

In a lot of ways, discounts equate to pricing shenanigans by the retailer.  A retailer needs to make a certain amount on a sale, or they get hurt and when they get hurt enough, they don't exist anymore.  Needless to say, they (smart ones) don't want this to happen, so any discounts that are offered are either due to a special deal from a manufacturer, or they know that they have normally high margins and a small discount won't hurt them.  Large retailers often sell some items at a small loss to encourage traffic to the store in hopes of establishing new clientele, or in hopes that shoppers will purchase other items with their normally high margins, while they are there for the "deal".  Some will even boost prices shortly before a big sale just to make it appear something costs less, when it really doesn't.

This is a different situation than the one for niche vendors who sell the parts you are looking for.  There is a limited consumer base for these types of items.  The vendors for these types of parts really only exist because this community exists, and the "home base" for this community is BYOAC.  I realize this fact and therefore don't offer BYOAC members a discount, rather I attempt to price my goods at the very minimum I need to be able to keep the business, myself and the other member of the team afloat.  If anything is left over, it gets dumped into new things which frankly, cost a fortune to have produced because of that "limited market" thing I mentioned earlier.  

While our approach causes some difficulties for us in the way of not leaving room for a reseller to handle our products, we feel keeping prices as low as they can be and direct sales to be the best solution for our customers and the community as a whole.  The bang for buck our products offer, demonstrates this.  But we do sacrifice some profit when the orders are large enough to compensate for it.  Commercial cabinet and panel builders who place large orders at regular intervals are given small discounts (which are frankly the most we can bear) because the volume of the sale(s) makes up for it.

But enough about that.  You have a dilemma with a small budget, and you probably should look at swapping elbow grease for cash outlay.  Ebay is a good source for used parts, that often times just need to be taken apart and cleaned to be fully functional again.  If you don't mind soldering, and a bit of loss in performance/convenience, you can pick up inexpensive gamepad controllers to hack for your interfaces.  There was a recent thread where this was discussed at length.  We offer these as well, if you can't get them elsewhere.  

Even if you got some kind of a discount through sellers here, you won't be able to make that $75 go very far.  So it's probably going to require you to be resourceful to get what you want, and you'll probably have to settle for getting what you need.

Good Luck,
RandyT

[syph007]

75 only? oh man, i've been spending that much per day for the last month on average.  I'm way over budget and at this point it doesnt even matter.  I bought more than I needed ya.. but I wanted products from Randy, Andy and I also ordered some Sanwa parts and fancy colored tops from LizardLick.  Half the fun in the build has been the rapid part aquisition since I had set money aside knowing it would be going like crazy during the build process.

[DashRendar]

Heh, the "$75 budget" thing was just an example.

On my current project, I'm noticing I'm kind of doing it in waves.  IE, this month I have $150 to spend.  Last month I had $100 to spend, etc etc.  So I need to determine how to break down that money to get which components.

I realize I could stretch this out over a VERY LONG TIME and get high-end everything, but what's the point in that?  Need to balance saving up for purchases with a timeframe so you can get to a finished project at some point.   

Also- my intention was not to knock the vendors in our hobby.  Far from it, they enable us to do so much more with these arcades than if we had to haggle for used parts on eBay.

I'm a consumer, but I also have a good mind for business.  Some vendors may run their business with the intention of making a living off it, and others may do it because they love the hobby and want to help others with it.   Regardless, the goal is to be sustainable in everything you do.

I suppose the point of the OP was to give vendors a place to offer discounts to members of this community (and a caveat there- we are not the only community that does this.  You have KLOV and several gamer websites that get into this).  The hope would be that while the consumers could get a price break, the vendors could get increased sales and publicity.  Which is a good thing for everybody!   

[Level42]

David from RAM controls has been offering VERY good discounts to members of both the BYOAC forum and the KLOV forum.

[Malenko]

Did you subscribe to GRM because they offer a discount ?

No ?

Didn't think so.

 

I did, but I don't think I got a discount, but I'll continue to support him (and renew my sub in a few months before it expires). The ongoing 3 articles about the arcade closing were fantastic.

[RandyT]

...and others may do it because they love the hobby and want to help others with it.

The IRS will put up with that for about 2 years before they classify you as a hobby business and refuse to recognize you or any deductions associated with the venture.  I don't recommend anyone do this unless they are hoping to become an arcade charity

I suppose the point of the OP was to give vendors a place to offer discounts to members of this community (and a caveat there- we are not the only community that does this.  You have KLOV and several gamer websites that get into this).  The hope would be that while the consumers could get a price break, the vendors could get increased sales and publicity.  Which is a good thing for everybody!   

The dedicated vendors here usually give much more than what you are asking.  Some of us produce specialty items at great personal expense, simply because the community wants them.  Usually, they are items you can't get elsewhere (or not at the same quality / fitness for our purposes), and often times cost thousands of dollars in tooling and part minimums.  Sometimes, it takes years to recoup the investment due to the limited audience.  Therefore, they tend to rely on the small profits made on other not so specialized items to offset that investment.  And if those costs aren't offset, then there is no more capital for anything new, and the offerings to the community stagnate.  I can give you several examples totaling about $15,000 in the current GGG catalog. 

KLOV is a different bird.  I'm not sure who you are referring to on that side if things, but a fair number folks who supply that crowd are machine strippers and part hoarders who often will charge many times the cost of that same part when it was new, simply because it is rare.  Example: It was not uncommon to see Tron and Satan's Hollow Joystick shells for selling well above the $150 mark as they had been off the market for over 20 years.  We have over 10k invested in putting these parts back into the hands of collectors and new panel builders, and we could have charged much more than the $24.95 we sell them for.  But we didn't.  A comparison to console gaming communities isn't even worth going into, as they are using mass market items.

So while I can understand an individuals desire to save some money, around here it usually happens at the personal expense of the vendor, or to the community as a whole when one looks at the "big picture".  Drumming up sales would be the only reason to do it, and even then, the value isn't high because the vast majority of customers build one cabinet / panel and never build another.

RandyT

[saint]

...and others may do it because they love the hobby and want to help others with it.

The IRS will put up with that for about 2 years before they classify you as a hobby business and refuse to recognize you or any deductions associated with the venture.  I don't recommend anyone do this unless they are hoping to become an arcade charity

I suppose the point of the OP was to give vendors a place to offer discounts to members of this community (and a caveat there- we are not the only community that does this.  You have KLOV and several gamer websites that get into this).  The hope would be that while the consumers could get a price break, the vendors could get increased sales and publicity.  Which is a good thing for everybody!   

The dedicated vendors here usually give much more than what you are asking.  Some of us produce specialty items at great personal expense, simply because the community wants them.  Usually, they are items you can't get elsewhere (or not at the same quality / fitness for our purposes), and often times cost thousands of dollars in tooling and part minimums.  Sometimes, it takes years to recoup the investment due to the limited audience.  Therefore, they tend to rely on the small profits made on other not so specialized items to offset that investment.  And if those costs aren't offset, then there is no more capital for anything new, and the offerings to the community stagnate.  I can give you several examples totaling about $15,000 in the current GGG catalog. 

KLOV is a different bird.  I'm not sure who you are referring to on that side if things, but a fair number folks who supply that crowd are machine strippers and part hoarders who often will charge many times the cost of that same part when it was new, simply because it is rare.  Example: It was not uncommon to see Tron and Satan's Hollow Joystick shells for selling well above the $150 mark as they had been off the market for over 20 years.  We have over 10k invested in putting these parts back into the hands of collectors and new panel builders, and we could have charged much more than the $24.95 we sell them for.  But we didn't.  A comparison to console gaming communities isn't even worth going into, as they are using mass market items.

So while I can understand an individuals desire to save some money, around here it usually happens at the personal expense of the vendor, or to the community as a whole when one looks at the "big picture".  Drumming up sales would be the only reason to do it, and even then, the value isn't high because the vast majority of customers build one cabinet / panel and never build another.

RandyT

I was told I had to make a profit in the last 5 years to be able to continue to claim deductions when I wrote my book.

[syph007]

I have a hobby business here in Canada, and used to make a decent side income, but it's dwindled to maybe a few tens of dollars a month... which mostly went to Randy or Andy btw ... anyway, I dont know how it works in the US, but I dont HAVE to turn a profit to claim my operating expenses etc, but what happens is the business deductions only come off the business taxes, so If i make 1000 in the whole year, and have 2000 dollars of business credits, there is no carry over to help my personal taxes.   Does it work different with the IRS?

[RandyT]

I have a hobby business here in Canada,... <snip>  Does it work different with the IRS?

I recommend anyone considering anything get help from a competent tax attorney, but my experience is that a "hobby business" is NOT something you want the IRS to classify you as.  In the US, there are a number of different ways to structure a business, and a number of them are very closely attached to the principals.  Losses and gains can be closely tied to individuals, so the Canadian type of separation is not common here, nor is it very desirable, for a small business, IMHO.  

And while the IRS may have changed their expectations over the last few years (it wouldn't surprise me, given that small business is one of the few hopes we have left for our economy), after a few years of losses, especially if you are talking about large ones, the red flags will probably start popping up all over the place.

Anyway, it wasn't my intention to turn the discussion into banal tax debate .  It was simply to illustrate that a business can't survive very long in "charity mode".  It just makes them ineffective, short-lived and of no great benefit to the community in the long term.

RandyT

[opt2not]

I don't really care for the discounts, because the prices of these parts aren't that bad really.  The thing that kills me the most is the shipping and duty (to Canada) that seem to hike the overall cost extremely. But I can't get away from that anyways, so there's no point in complaining.

Anyways, I just wanted to throw a shout-out to the vendors here that are keeping this arcade legacy going. Without them, and us supporting it, arcade love would go the way of the Dodo. It's really a joint effort on both sides to have this service available, and for that I'm thankful.

 

[ammitz]

I don't really care for the discounts, because the prices of these parts aren't that bad really.  The thing that kills me the most is the shipping and duty (to Canada) that seem to hike the overall cost extremely. But I can't get away from that anyways, so there's no point in complaining.

Anyways, I just wanted to throw a shout-out to the vendors here that are keeping this arcade legacy going. Without them, and us supporting it, arcade love would go the way of the Dodo. It's really a joint effort on both sides to have this service available, and for that I'm thankful.

 

Same for me in Europe

[ryantheleach]

Same here in australia, but at least its only $0.90 us to the australian dollar now.

[channelmaniac]

Here's a link to the Master list of vendors.  I don't think it shows who gives us discounts though.  I'm sure everyone will support you taking on that project.   

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=54812.0

Thanks!

I asked to be included on the list, but am already listed on the wiki.

I've set up discounts in the past but the never had been used so I removed them.

Raymond

[CheffoJeffo]

Here's a link to the Master list of vendors.  I don't think it shows who gives us discounts though.  I'm sure everyone will support you taking on that project.   

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=54812.0

Thanks!

I asked to be included on the list, but am already listed on the wiki.

I've set up discounts in the past but the never had been used so I removed them.

If only I had known before that last order ...