CRT look and feel on a LCD

[retrometro]

the debate continues!

http://www.digitallounge.gatech.edu/gaming/index.html?id=2824

[DJ_Izumi]

That actually looks more like a simulated LCD effect if you ask me. o.O  And it LOOKS simulated.  Like if you asked me what that felt like I'd say 'Fake LCD'.

[genesim]

That person is obviously a compete MORON.   I can't believe he even tried.  Just stick to an original TV and throw that LCD in the trash.   What an idiot.

[genesim]

In all seriousness I can tell you right now.   If my memory is not what it ever was on an more obscure game like Turbo I can tell you 150% that this color bleed crap is BULL.

I had a TV and I saw those lines like on the Grand Prix(I believe that is the game) and others like Air Sea Battle going in the sky.

That display that is "fixed" for CRT is 200% WRONG.   This exhibits my point exactly.

If the coders could make a color transcend into the the sky like that pink color they would have.   Why would a crappy television make it better?

I played Atari 2600 on nothing but crappy televisions and I saw those lines originally...absolutely!   Someone like so many others are trying to change history with their pretty pictures.

[genesim]

You know what really galls me...NTSC televisions were capable of much much better and this is the total lie in full bloom.   Let me get this straight...you can show people like in a movie but those blocks have so much color bleed that you don't see the lines???

Get the hell outta here.   A religion plain and simple.

[CheffoJeffo]

Get the hell outta here. 

I'm pretty sure the feeling is mutual.

[genesim]

Why because I am speaking the truth! 

This is exactly what I mean.   This is a bald faced LIE.  The original Atari 2600 on the TV's had those lines.   Are you going to be so blind as to say this isn't true?

Also what is clever but also a bald faced lie is the screenshot.   The ghosts "ghosting" are there on the Stella emulator through the LCD.

If you weren't so busy putting me down you would actually see my point.

This whole pitiful arguement about CRT's being better in this particular capacity has got to be the biggest lie on the internet.

Maybe the only way to settle this is for me to go out and take tons of pictures.   Compare it myself.   I already have with the local place that has Pacman and I compared the differences which do not exist at all.   Most of this is starting to look like the complete lie that it is.

But rest assured, for a fact the Atari 2600 and the "blending" does not exist.   Bud I was there playing with crappy tv's going through crappy ATANNAE connections!   Not RF as the author puts it.    You needed a converter box for the original old TV's.   Remember switching back and forth?

Probably not because you more then likely were not there at the time and you try to speak about knowing so much, but in reality you know far less then me.   Of course if I don't dot an "I" it somehow proves I know NOTHING....    That is why you want me to go away.   You want to keep your fantasy alive and well.

Sell it to someone else, I have exposed this for what it is.  One of the biggest lie's on the internet.  If I ever met these programmers I would grill them on this very subject.   Guess what, in all likelyhood they would agree with me.   They probably laugh at all this splitting hairs crap.   Even your link was funny.   Notice this notice that.       

Oh and for the record refresh rate can be the same as frame rate if programmed correctly.   Hence 24fps on a movie being perfect for 120hz becaust it is an even devisor....same as 15hz signal into 120hz.   It is still a 1:1 scale up...so if the programmers worked with that as the way they intended it to be displayed, then the same could be true for a even divisor scale up.   

Of course many like to overlook this verifiable fact.    The only problem is round pixels vs square...and even that is proved not to be a problem.   Read the Atari article...even the supposed way the programmers wanted it done support my case...but guess what, that is a load of bull too because they programmed because of limitations.   Not purposeful visions.    That crap still cracks me up to where I almost split my side.

This house is clean.

[genesim]

Not RF as the author puts it.

OOOPS I MADE A MISTAKE.   I RECOGNIZED THIS SO DON'T COOK ME CHEFFO.

I was thinking of the RF connection as opposed to the VHF signal.   MY BAD!!!

GET THIS AGAIN, I MADE A MISTAKE SO NO NEED TO POINT IT OUT.

[genesim]

[CheffoJeffo]

Probably not because you more then likely were not there at the time and you try to speak about knowing so much, but in reality you know far less then me.   Of course if I don't dot an "I" it somehow proves I know NOTHING.... Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha!   That is why you want me to go away.   You want to keep your fantasy alive and well.

...

Oh and for the record refresh rate can be the same as frame rate if programmed correctly.   Hence 24fps on a movie being perfect for 120hz becaust it is an even devisor....same as 15hz signal into 120hz.   It is still a 1:1 scale up...so if the programmers worked with that as the way they intended it to be displayed, then the same could be true for a even divisor scale up.   

Once again, you choose the route of the Belligerent Kool Aid Man (I will be eternally grateful to Chad for coining that name for you because it fits so well ... only wish that I had come up with it so I could tag it with a tm).

It isn't so much that you don't dot an i or cross a t ... it is that you genuinely don't understand the fundamentals of the technologies that you are talking about.

For example, once again, you refer to 15hz (sic) as a refresh rate (getting the terminology, meaning and the cardinality of the metric completely wrong). It is the same as your mythical "light beams inside the CRT".

They don't exist anywhere but inside your head.

As a result, the conclusions that are so painfully obvious to you, which make the rest of us appear stupid in your eyes, are based on fallacy.

Most arcade games refresh at 60Hz with standard res games running a 15KHz scan rate. You continue to confuse the two, despite my having slapped you down about it several times.

Learn the math that underlies the relationship between the horizontal scan rate, resolution and vertical refresh rate -- it's a simple multiplicative relation, so you should be able to handle the concepts ... well, maybe not ...

Probably not because you more then likely were not there at the time and you try to speak about knowing so much, but in reality you know far less then me.

That is probably the first time that I have ever been accused of not being old enough ... I'm not sure whether to be pleased or insulted.

One of us has worked on both authentic arcade equipment and modern PC equipment.

And everybody knows that it ain't you.

[Blanka]

Atari 2600 had a resolution of 160x82 pixels. Each line was drawn 4 times on alternate interlace fields and 160 pixels on a "640 pixel wide NTSC image" (it was an analog signal, so no real "horizontal resolution on the TV itself), meant that each pixel of the 2600 was 4x4 "pixels" on the TV. That was blocky all the way, and this "true image" emulation of Atari 2600 sure is nonsense.

[Hoopz]

Once again, you choose the route of the Belligerent Kool Aid Man (I will be eternally grateful to Chad for coining that name for you because it fits so well ... only wish that I had come up with it so I could tag it with a tm).

Like you haven't tried to TM the whole internet already!   

And the 2600 sucked ass then and still does.  Intellivision is and was the best.  Suck it Atari!   

[genesim]

Actually contrary to what you have said I am comparing VERTICAL REFRESH RATE.  

Hence your example 60HZ VERTICAL REFRESH RATE also being an even divisor.

I admitted the LIGHT BEAM instead of Particle how many times are you going to beat that dead horse?  It was a frickin' typo.

Now if you are going to avoid it, how about breaking it down.   Were you or were you not growing up during the Atari 2600 days?   Did you have one as they came out, or were you a johnny come lately that thinks he knows?

As for my 15 KILOHZ error, then I was correct the first time.  Why did you not point out how I had the KILO part right?    The point was not to make fun of me because there was no such thing as a 15hz display...or at least if there is, then it is rare(I don't know this), but to actually understand my point.   60hz is an even devisor hence it being a qualifier for this subject.    Wow, way to make my case even better.   REFRESH...RESCAN...it doesn't matter.  Both of them are the same thing.   The screen is being redrawn 60 times or 120.   If there was a 15hz display then it would be 15 times!   Again, you were so busy saying ha ha ha and trying to skate around and saying...he thinks that 15hz is the way its drawn..but in fact I wasn't wrong about the REFRESH rate, I was just wrong about there being that display or the one that 15 KILO hz was referring to.   That is being a punk.  That is not clever.

One of us has worked on both authentic arcade equipment and modern PC equipment.

And everybody knows that it ain't you.

SO WHAT.   That doesn't mean I don't get a concept.    I have always been quoting what I thought to be vertical refresh rate.   You were just acting like too much of a tool to acknowledge my point because of the non dotted "I's"

Now can you at least aknowledge my point now?   I know what I saw, and I know the hardware that I used.   Instead of being as you usually are, how about adressing my factual information.    

xxxxxxxxx

That was blocky all the way, and this "true image" emulation of Atari 2600 sure is nonsense.

WORD!   As I suspect alot of this is.   Not ALL, but alot of the arcade coders myth.   They encoded it CHEAP, FAST, and EFFICIENT.   They did not program for future displays nor did they MOST of the time program for bleed or flicker or any other such nonsense.  

Frogger is exactly how it should be and it loses NOTHING on a properly scaled LCD.   Matter of fact on the right LCD, it actually improves because of the clearer picture with no reflection.   End of story.

[genesim]

The real question is whether the real Koolaid man will finally admit that alot of this is indeed a LIE.

Hoofprints think horses not zebras.   If it is wrong for Atari then it is wrong for many arcade games that came out around that time.

Later of course things change, and for a scant few where displays were unique, of course there could be SOME programming...but some of this is complete bull and I don't believe it for a second.

Texture always gives a 3D look.  Scanlines provided this.   But some of this looking for the Davinci Code is just plain nutty.

[CheffoJeffo]

Instead of being as you usually are, how about adressing my factual information.    

I think all of us agree that we're still waiting for some ...

[genesim]

Look at the KOOLAID MAN now.

I knew it.  You act like such a coward.

"YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH"

Answer the question bud.   Were you or were you not there when Atari 2600's were going strong?   Did you buy one at that time and play it? 

Hmmm...I will try again.

Little Koolaid Man seems to dodge lots of questions.   

[CheffoJeffo]

I knew it.  You act like such a coward.

"YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH"

As I recall, that didn't work out so well for the last blowhard who said it ...

[genesim]

Really?   I seem to remember him winning an academy award later.   He is a legend in cinema.   

You perhaps are about as uninformed as you are with the current religion.

The name is Jack Nicholson...learn it, love it, respect it.   

[Hoopz]

Really?   I seem to remember him winning an academy award later.   He is a legend in cinema.  

You perhaps are about as uninformed as you are with the current religion.

The name is Jack Nicholson...learn it, love it, respect it.  

You truly are clueless, aren't you?  At least you typed uninformed correctly this time instead of picking on those in uniforms again. 

[genesim]

Yeah, I am not a great typist...but at least I know Jack.   Koolaid man seems to think he is some kind of failure.

Of course you may be just as clueless if you didn't notice the slapdown just like that.

[Hoopz]

CheffoJeffo's point is that the CHARACTER that said those lines ended up being court martialled.  He was not talking about the actor.   

Edit for typo

[genesim]

OH REALLY!!!   

OH MAN I DIDN'T GET THAT.       Gee I am so glad you pointed that out.    Next time I will PM you first so you can hit me with the completely obvious stick.

But getting back, so he is cutting me down with the fates of fantasy characters.   Oh my...now I see...he is being carted off to fantasy jail.    Oh what am I in for next, a fantasy electric chair?   Maybe I might go to fantasy hell!   is it the kind on South Park where Landon and Sadaam are?   

"Its Christmas time...

It was a quote in a movie.  Get over it.   There was nothing clever about the first put down.   Why, because there is nothing going to happen to me because I can handle the truth.   Obviously Cheffo cannot give me that much.    Hence him saying I have no factual information.   There.....I broke it down to two year old explanation.    I figured since you gave me that much...I could smack it back to you.    One of us got it the first time...

[CheffoJeffo]

Answer the question bud.   Were you or were you not there when Atari 2600's were going strong?   Did you buy one at that time and play it? 

I will state what should be perfectly obvious from the custom title bestowed upon my by our supreme chancellor -- I was there before, during and after the success of the 2600.

Hell, I even owned an original Pong home console.

But, of course, Hoopz is right -- Mrs. Cheffo's Intellivision is the one console from the era that I still keep running today.

I have spoken to some of the developers that you would deign to question furiously about their graphic designs. I have read some of the design docs and seen their sketches. At least one person who "was there" in arcade development in the heyday posts actively over at KLOV, but he's probably wrong as well.

None of this is new ... you just seem to refuse to either search through the information that is out there or to believe the information once you find it.

As I have always said, if you like the way games display on your cabinet, then you don't have a problem.

That is why you'll never see me tell Blanka that he is a moron for liking the LCD on his MAME cab. He is happy and, while I think that he is sometimes overexuberant with his opinion, he always backs what he says with *actual* facts. Same applies to folks like Knievel and others who regularly use LCDs.

[Hoopz]

But, of course, Hoopz is right --

QFT

[XeviouS]

       

[genesim]

Oh so what I said about the Atari isn't fact?   Oh you didn't call me a moron for preferring LCD and thinking it looks better?

I don't deserve to EVER be called a MORON.  The fact that you think you are EVER justified is what is very very wrong with you and anyone who supports such behavior.

The difference between you and I is that I never claimed my name calling was right.  

I have never stated the coders are wrong, and I want the facts that they did program for this.   Specifically for Donkey Kong...Pacman...Galaga....Dig Dug...or any other such madness.    I don't believe it for one second.   But hey, I am open to proof and not...this guy posts.  

[CheffoJeffo]

How the ---fudgesicle--- did a simple, humourous reply to a overly-capitalized-yelling-because-nobody-likes-me and poorly-contextually-positioned movie quote warrant 5 follow-up posts ?

Cheffo genesim

Lighten up, Francis!

[genesim]

Uh because you attempted a very bad comeback...and then of course Hoopz attempted a very bad explanation...and then I succeeded in making both of you look pathetic.   

Of course your problem was this.   I had seeds in FACTS because of my post about the Atari screen being flawed...you followed around trying to get me for not crossing t's and Hoopz tries to get me with spelling.

Of course both are symantacs(sp) and not worth it when you get to the meat of what I have always written.   It is splitting hairs...on splitting hairs...on splitting hairs in its origins(being the code).   

Arguing over which hairs should be split is so silly that the over the top way that you say you are supreme over me is just flawed...because the premise is a guess to begin with!


And what happened to the fictional character...yuck yuck..that was a good un! 

[CheffoJeffo]

Oh you didn't call me a moron for preferring LCD and thinking it looks better?

No, I called you a moron because you kept saying stupidly incorrect things and telling everybody who disagreed that they were wrong.

I don't deserve to EVER be called a MORON.

I acknowledge that and have, as a result, been trying to use Belligerent Kool Aid Man instead.  

The fact that you think you are EVER justified is what is very very wrong with you

And here I thought it was that I was a Crybaby turd tosser egotistical self righteous miserable coward stink hole ... I am so confused.  

The difference between you and I is that I never claimed my name calling was right.

Actually, you denied your name calling completely. 

[ChadTower]

Once again, you choose the route of the Belligerent Kool Aid Man (I will be eternally grateful to Chad for coining that name for you because it fits so well ... only wish that I had come up with it so I could tag it with a tm).

 

The 2600 is a terrible example for this debate, guys.  It's the only one that doesn't actually have the refresh rate handled in hardware like everything else on the planet.  It was done in software making it a unique beast.  Having done a good amoung of 2600 coding has given me a healthy fear of the sync routines necessary to keep it drawing in sync with the TV's scan guns.

No, I haven't read the whole thread, as most of it is fighting... but I did see that pic and the 2600 DID look blurry on many TVs.  That wasn't a function of the 2600 itself, thogh, that was a function of crappy TV/GAME switchboxes that heavily degraded the signal.  Those got old FAST and had a heavy effect on graphics quality.  The simple switch to a female RCA->coax video adapter does wonders towards cleaning up what a lot of people remember as "color bleed" on the 2600.

[Malenko]

Oh so what I said about the Atari isn't fact?   Oh you didn't call me a moron for preferring LCD and thinking it looks better?

I don't deserve to EVER be called a MORON.  The fact that you think you are EVER justified is what is very very wrong with you and anyone who supports such behavior.

The difference between you and I is that I never claimed my name calling was right.  

I have never stated the coders are wrong, and I want the facts that they did program for this.   Specifically for Donkey Kong...Pacman...Galaga....Dig Dug...or any other such madness.    I don't believe it for one second.   But hey, I am open to proof and not...this guy posts.  

posted like a true moron.

Seriously, you still cannot grasp the concept of the EDIT BUTTON and continue to double and triple post. How can we take you seriously when you cant even edit a post?

[ChadTower]

Hasn't his edit function been revoked by saint?

[genesim]

Cheffo,

Uh, no I said it wasn't my style to call names.    I never denied uttering a name call.   Shall I get out the quote book and smack you silly?   You either don't read or don't comprehend.
 
I don't merely say people are wrong, I try to show how I have came to my conclusions.   Calling "everyone" wrong is as stupid as your assessment that I hate all CRT's.  

And here I thought it was that I was a Crybaby turd tosser egotistical self righteous miserable coward stink hole

Wah wah wah wah wah.   There I translated your post for others to enjoy.

been trying to use Belligerent Kool Aid Man instead.

Hmmm and people are supposed to get this how?   Shouldn't you have a black pot as your avatar instead?

Malenko,

I CANNOT EDIT.   I only have MODIFY and that is only available after a short interval.   GET THIS THROUGH YOUR HEAD.   No wait let me try it again.   I DO NOT HAVE EDIT.    One more time....I DO NOT HAVE EDIT.   You got it now?  

Oh wait...is this you Pot?

XXXXX

Chad Tower,

Uh no.   Those lines existed on the original display and they didn't "blend" and they weren't programmed for.   Its all just plain fantasy and that blog was a waste of good bandwidth.   Not to mention it was an outright lie in regards to Stella emulator on whatever display.

....update.

Hasn't his edit function been revoked by saint?

At least you got it the first couple of times I said it.   Maybe your echo will bounce through Malenko's skull.   Here's to hope!

[CheffoJeffo]

Shall I get out the quote book and smack you silly?  

No need, I specifically asked for the last PHd thread to be brought back, specifically because I think that the readers can choose for themselves which of the two of us is more credible.

saint may well have been bringing it back of his own accord, but I did ask.

When I'm wrong I admit to being wrong

When I'm an excessive ---uvula--- I admit to being an excessive ---uvula---.

I'm not afraid of my post history.

And besides, we can all agree that I'm silly anough as I am!

 

[Malenko]

I didnt follow the drama that close, sorry, I was wrong. And the other thread was put in post hell before I got to see it.
I admitted I was wrong, can you?

instead of an Edit maybe could then maybe, come to a complete thought before posting, also....

I had a TV and I saw those lines like on the Grand Prix(I believe that is the game) and others like Air Sea Battle going in the sky.

you could read the caption that says the game is Enduro.

[severdhed]

such hostility....

why does everyone Hate LCDs so much?  my cabinet has an LCD monitor and it looks great.....is that the problem?  do you guys want your games to look blurry and crappy?  why would anyone try to emulate the look of a CRT on an LCD? that just makes no sense...and whatever that guy was doing doesn't look like any CRT monitor that i have seen.

the LCD monitors have such a nice clean picture to them...why anyone would want anything less than that makes no sense to me.

[ChadTower]

Chad Tower,

Uh no.   Those lines existed on the original display and they didn't "blend" and they weren't programmed for.  

You didn't seem to notice that is pretty much what I said... yet on the original display they were present because of poor transmission lines from the 2600 to the TV.  The blending did exist on a lot of old TVs running 2600s as a function of crappy switchboxes.  It wasn't intended, it wasn't on all of them, but any 2600 running with a crappy TV/GAME switchbox had a blurry picture as described above.  You have to separate the display from the console here because they are separate devices not built as part of an enclosed system.

What we end up with here is that both are right to a degree - there was no color blend or blur in the software or as drawn by the hardware.  On the other hand a lot of TVs were displaying a degraded signal that was blurry.  Both happened.


EDIT:  fixed my bbcode

[CheffoJeffo]

why does everyone Hate LCDs so much?  my cabinet has an LCD monitor and it looks great.....is that the problem?  do you guys want your games to look blurry and crappy?  why would anyone try to emulate the look of a CRT on an LCD? that just makes no sense...and whatever that guy was doing doesn't look like any CRT monitor that i have seen.

Don't mistake the reaction to genesim for a reaction to LCDs -- at least one of the people who has reacted most strongly to genesim is planning to use an LCD in their MAME cab.

For me, I strongly prefer arcade CRTs in my MAME boxes. Partly because that is what I use in all of my original cabinets and they should all look the same. Partly because it is part of a more authentic experience for me.

We have already seen that LCDs don't look like CRTs. Some people can't stand how the games look on LCDs. Some people don't care. Some people can't stand CRTs.

If you are happy with the way that things look on your LCD, then I think that is great. 

[Ginsu Victim]

Boy am I glad I'm avoiding this place today.

[Hoopz]

Boy am I glad I'm avoiding this place today.

You killed the last thread. We were just wondering if it would make it through today.  You're just like Oliver in the Brady Bunch...a jinx!

 

[genesim]

Malenko and Cheffo,

Thats the spirit.   I mean this entirely.   KEEP IT FRIENDLY and I will do the same.    This bickering crap is going nowhere.

We can play the game of who can put who down the most and in the end, we all think we are more clever then the next guy.   But guess what, anyone surfing will think we ALL are a bunch of tools.

I may be the minority here(surprise suprise) but I am also on a nostalgia board.   It is the same as if I brought a gangsta rap artist to classic rock board...but of course if you flip it.   Who is right...it don't matter.

The instant people lose their tempers, the point is lost.

Hell I didn't read the caption.  Shoot me dead.   WHOOPEE.    I didn't really play alot of racing games because I didn't have the racing controls or I didn't care.   I liked Kaboom and Demon Attack anway....in other words..either I shoot or I hit back(hence me liking Slot Racers as rare exception).    Driving didn't kick in till much later.   But I knew what they looked like on a myriad of TV's and you ALL have to admit this theory is CRAP.

As for a complete thought before posting...uh I try...I really do, but then I walk away, and it is back there again.   I want to keep it fresh, and I do.   Sorry if it annoys you, but I do try.

Malenko what was I wrong about?

Cheffo what was I wrong about?  If there is something I didn't adress let me know now.   But you should read what I wrote instead of assuming.  

Geez I could be right on alot of this.    It could be that it wasn't that frickin' serious.    I have never came up with a definitive on arcade games.    But I do know about Atari and TV's were not blending.   Like Blanka said, it would have to be alot worse then that!   If the programmers didn't know this, then they were idiots and did it very very bad.

If you are happy with the way that things look on your LCD, then I think that is great.

And I am free to defend my view too.   Of course others feel they are justified to call me MORON and the like...but of course they are no more right then I.    Until you have the EXACT hardware...i.e. exact monitor that was in the original arcade(and even that is a compromise because you don't have the EXACT monitor the programmers used to put the original code on), then you have no superiority in what should or shouldn't be.

You believe CRT's look the best, that is fine.   But so what.   The glass can be half empty or half full.   It is all about perception.

By the way, just because blending did happen, doesn't mean it was programmed for it.  PERIOD.   How it was presented on 99 percent of the TV's is compelling evidence.    Blanka had a absolute spot on comment.   The blending I never saw exist and I bet if taken to a real vote, most would agree with me.   Most people saw those lines.    I actually asked other about this and the ones that cared to remember agreed with me.    Not just my friends..but all.    Atari fans were plenty.    But this picture that is posted here is pure fiction.

[Hoopz]

We have already seen that LCDs don't look like CRTs. Some people can't stand how the games look on LCDs. Some people don't care. Some people can't stand CRTs.

If you are happy with the way that things look on your LCD, then I think that is great. 

I say use what works best for you.  Some use PC monitors, while others use various types of arcade/presentation monitors, televisions (LCDs, tubes, B&W) etc.   What's best for me shouldn't affect anyone else.

There's only one person in these threads who can't get past the fact that people should be able to choose what they want without being labeled as Nazis, fascists, or saying it's a religion.  Arguing how the technology works is a separate argument from what's best for people to use.

[CheffoJeffo]

You believe CRT's look the best, that is fine.   But so what.   The glass can be half empty or half full.   It is all about perception.

Actually, I'm worried about what's in the glass ...

[genesim]

There's only one person in these threads who can't get past the fact that people should be able to choose what they want without being labeled as Nazis, fascists, or saying it's a religion.

Why are you lying?  That is not what I said.   You going to apologize before I prove you wrong?  I am giving you a chance.

Arguing how the technology works is a separate argument from what's best for people to use.

Some people can't seem to get this...hence people personal attacking me on my choice rather then discuss my points.

XXXXXXX

Actually, I'm worried about what's in the glass ...

Actually I worry about all of it.

[Hoopz]

You need to get the sand out of your vagina, Genesim.  Seriously.

[CheffoJeffo]

 Until you have the EXACT hardware...i.e. exact monitor that was in the original arcade(and even that is a compromise because you don't have the EXACT monitor the programmers used to put the original code on), then you have no superiority in what should or shouldn't be.

Um, I'm not sure which part of my prior postings confused you, but I *do*, in many cases, have the *exact* (read as precise, same, identical whatever) *physical* monitor used in my cabinets.

[Ginsu Victim]

You need to get the sand out of your vagina, Genesim.  Seriously.

 

[genesim]

Un no you don't because the EXACT would be the ones the developers used.

What do you not understand about the fact that no two CRT's are built the same?    What do you not understand about the fact that I am referring to ALL games and not just one(hence you saying...in many cases).   I am looking for authenticity spread across new..old...very new games.

An LCD is the least compromise IMHO.

xxxxxxxxx

Hoopz,

If I have a vagina then you have the ability to get a quote right.   Both of them are not likely.   Now is your ability to admit your mistake as plausible?   Stay tuned...

[Ginsu Victim]

I can't believe both sides of the argument have allowed another thread to continue like this.

Shame on both sides.

[ChadTower]

I can't believe both sides of the argument have allowed another thread to continue like this.

Shame on both sides.

[CheffoJeffo]

Un no you don't because the EXACT would be the ones the developers used.

But, still, it puts me at least a dozen steps closer than someone who, say, doesn't have that particularly monitor (someone, say, like *you*).

FWIW, I am starting to understand you now ... you don't seems to know that these guys didn't have actual cabinets in their offices and that some of them were coding on mainframes, then looking at the mockups and adjusting the artwork, controls and code.

Please, read a couple of articles about how these games were developed.

If I get a chance today, I'll see what is available online to present to you as proof, as opposed to things I have in print, seen in exhibits or gleaned from live conversations.

[Ginsu Victim]

I can't believe both sides of the argument have allowed another thread to continue like this.

Shame on both sides.

Dude, I'm trying not to be around today. So don't make this guy explode if I can't be around to witness it!

[Hoopz]

Oh, I'm sure that he'll do this again another time.  I think this is the 5th thread that he's done it in already.   

[genesim]

Alright, I quit.   I really really quit.

It isn't serving any purpose.   I did like exposing the Atari 2600 myth and I do liken it to some arcade beliefs.

But convincing some is next to impossible.

I don't want this thread or other deleted and I wish some would not take my fever/passion for the material so personally.

Starting off with Beligerant Koolaid Man is not constructive and misquoting things and implying that I distinctly called anyone a Nazi or KKK member is more damaging.

But hey saying I have a Vagina is not as bad.   I love them and wish I had one on my body.   Then I would waste my time playing video games so much...I certaintly wouldn't be arguing dippy things like this where I accuse others of being pocket protectors and then proceed to act like the biggest nerd of all.

Aren't we all here for the same reason?   I know I get accused of being a troll but seriously I just like to debate.   But firstly I just get intrigued by the subject matter.  

Arcade games have become a huge part of my life and most of my CRT debating is because it just isn't practical for my use.

With that, I will tell you what makes me madder then anything on this board.   I don't care who likes it...WINDOWS VISTA can censored by saint.   I am currently getting all my roms off the harddrive and as soon as I get everything in order, it goes bye bye.

Now for those that want to call me names after this post...cool.  I am like Godzilla with little tank bullets and missles...I will eat them and let them bounce off of me.   My real foe is that Ghidra that I like to call Vista!  Glitchy mo fo..I don't have the patience, and I am not ashamed.

As for me "doing it again"...takes two to tango...wait in my case I got alot of partners...but hey I made this happen right?  I was all alone.   yeah right.  

xxxx

FWIW, I am starting to understand you now ... you don't seems to know that these guys didn't have actual cabinets in their offices and that some of them were coding on mainframes, then looking at the mockups and adjusting the artwork, controls and code.

Yes I get it very much....the problem...the end result is still stair stepping graphics that were intentionally made boxy because its all they had.   HOOFPRINTS not ZEBRAS.   WORD

but yeah give me a link.  I always like interesting articles...

[Hoopz]

Alright, I quit.   I really really quit.

If someone's making book, I got the under on this one.

Starting off with Beligerant Koolaid Man is not constructive and misquoting things and implying that I distinctly called anyone a Nazi or KKK member is more damaging.

Oddly enough, I didn't mention your Klan reference.  You did it the first time and brought it up again.  Guilty conscience?

Aren't we all here for the same reason?   I know I get accused of being a troll but seriously I just like to debate.  

That sounds like someone you claim that you aren't....  And please reference the difference between arguing and debating.  You aren't debating.

[CheffoJeffo]

What do you not understand about the fact that no two CRT's are built the same?    What do you not understand about the fact that I am referring to ALL games and not just one(hence you saying...in many cases).   I am looking for authenticity spread across new..old...very new games.

Before I consider breaking two tubes to count the stripes of phosphor, what you mean when you say this ? Obviously, there are manufacturing differences built into everything.

For monitors, however, to make sure that things look the same (or "similar enough"), there are standard protocols for tuning the monitor to match. Things like convergence to be adjusted. For my part, I had always assumed that was we had all of those cool controls.

Now, what does come out of your statement that *is* interesting is that you are looking for *one* display technology to play all of the games that *you* want to play. 

You will not get authenticity over that spread, at least not by any reasonable definition, but you can get an acceptable experience across that range.

Based on the majority of your posts, this has never been your argument here. Blanka has made the argument (IIRC) that LCD was better for what he wanted and nobody faulted him. Other folks who have wanted to watch DVDs in their cabs have chosen "non-authentic" displays and people don't argue because their intentions were different. You have always claimed that CRTs are not authentic (hell, you even just told me that my arcade CRTs, as originally shipped with the games aren't authentic enough for me to have a valid opinion).

If I wanted to play Major Havoc and Doom 3 on the same cabinet, then, yeah, I might well go for an LCD.

Of course, if I was running Doom 3 in a Major Havoc cab, I would have to shoot myself in the head.

 

EDIT: for typos due to poor C&P ... gotta love being able to edit 

EDIT AGAIN: Because I can! 

[RayB]

I don't get why there's such long diatribes being posted regarding such a simple issue ... 

Um, has anyone bothered to check the emulator and see if there's an interpolation option that can be turned off or set to various settings? Maybe it's just blending it too much compared to the effect a TV does.

[CheffoJeffo]

As for me "doing it again"...takes two to tango...wait in my case I got alot of partners...but hey I made this happen right?  I was all alone.   yeah right.   

C'mon, let's be very clear and give credit where credit is due.

I at least helped push you into totally spazzing out

Works everytime !

 

And you never fail to disappoint.

 

You can't be bothered to understand the specifics enough to do research or post coherently (which is why people have to continually ask WTF you mean), then you get so painfully upset by getting caught in obvious factual inaccuracies that you freak out and tell people that they are the ones who don't understand and then continue to make the same mistakes and tell people to get over it.

Totally awesome to watch.

 

[Malenko]

Also what is clever but also a bald faced lie is the screenshot.   

Its BOLD faced lie, not BALD

This whole pitiful arguement about CRT's being better in this particular capacity has got to be the biggest lie on the internet.

better is a matter of preference. so there is no right or wrong. This whole debacle started because you keep saying LCDs show the code better or some other ---That which is odiferous and causeth plants to grow--- like that

Maybe the only way to settle this is for me to go out and take tons of pictures.   Compare it myself.   I already have with the local place that has Pacman and I compared the differences which do not exist at all.   Most of this is starting to look like the complete lie that it is.

I cant honestly see you doing any sort of research other then maybe a quick google to pretend you know what you're talking about. Take pictures , just dont use a 1 megapixel camera phone

But rest assured, for a fact the Atari 2600 and the "blending" does not exist.   Bud I was there playing with crappy tv's going through crappy ATANNAE connections!   Not RF as the author puts it.    You needed a converter box for the original old TV's.   Remember switching back and forth?

I used RF on my 2600 and while the blending isnt as good as in the LCD "simulator" it was there. I dunno what an atannae is, unless you meant antennae. My RF converter screwed into a little tube and the little tube had 2 forks on it. I cant remember what it was called, this was over 25 years ago for me

I digress, just wanted to get another post in before the lock/move to post hell

such hostility....

why does everyone Hate LCDs so much?  my cabinet has an LCD monitor and it looks great.....is that the problem?  do you guys want your games to look blurry and crappy?  why would anyone try to emulate the look of a CRT on an LCD? that just makes no sense...and whatever that guy was doing doesn't look like any CRT monitor that i have seen.

the LCD monitors have such a nice clean picture to them...why anyone would want anything less than that makes no sense to me.

Whaaaaaa? I LOVE my 61" Samsung LCD HDTV and I LOVE my 22"Samsung LCD PC monitor, beautiful picture on both an the HD looks flat out amazing. However, I PREFER my arcade montior in my MAME rig as opposed to a LCD with any sort  of filter.

By the way, just because blending did happen, doesn't mean it was programmed for it.  PERIOD.   

just be cause it wasnt programmed into the code doesnt mean it wasnt accounted for, thats another thing you cant seem to grasp. Who programs for a display and doesnt find out what the end product will look like on 99% of the displays?

Actually, I'm worried about what's in the glass ...

We are followers of jimmy jones, standing in the kool aid line.....

excellent double reference cheffo!

There's only one person in these threads who can't get past the fact that people should be able to choose what they want without being labeled as Nazis, fascists, or saying it's a religion.

Why are you lying?  That is not what I said.   You going to apologize before I prove you wrong?  I am giving you a chance.

Arguing how the technology works is a separate argument from what's best for people to use.

Some people can't seem to get this...hence people personal attacking me on my choice rather then discuss my points.

XXXXXXX

Actually, I'm worried about what's in the glass ...

Actually I worry about all of it.

-3 to your QuoteFu gensism

sweet I think this is my longest post ever. And unlike you Genesism, I actually do take the time to read everything BEFORE posting *and I tend to use spell check too!*

I don't get why there's such long diatribes being posted regarding such a simple issue ... 

Um, has anyone bothered to check the emulator and see if there's an interpolation option that can be turned off or set to various settings? Maybe it's just blending it too much compared to the effect a TV does.

there is no room for logic in this thread, get out

HOOFPRINTS not ZEBRAS.   WORD

Man thats still the most retarded saying Ive read on these boards.......

You ever think it MIGHT be an Okapi? Wait, you prolly say they dont exist and when they evolved your god of choice wanted round stripes.

[Cakemeister]

Also what is clever but also a bald faced lie is the screenshot.   

Its BOLD faced lie, not BALD

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_the_correct_term_'bold_face_lie'_or_'bald_faced_lie'_or_another_variation

 

[Malenko]

Also what is clever but also a bald faced lie is the screenshot.   

Its BOLD faced lie, not BALD

http://wiki.answers.com/Q/Is_the_correct_term_'bold_face_lie'_or_'bald_faced_lie'_or_another_variation

 

how odd google has that as a first result, lol
I was told in my youth it was bare faced, then I practically accosted by my English teacher in like 7th grade and he told me it was bold. Ive never seen Bald faced, because well, heads are bald not faces...they're clean shaved
I digress, the rest of what I quoted was the important stuff =)

[CheffoJeffo]

Ive never seen Bald faced, because well, heads are bald not faces...they're clean shaved

Not mine ... which may have been genesim's point about me the whole time !

EDIT: Oh, darn, hoist by my own petard about accuracy ... my head *is* bald but my face is neither bald nor clean-shaven. 

[genesim]

And unlike you Genesism, I actually do take the time to read everything BEFORE posting  *and I tend to use spell check too!*

That would be antenna which is what the "forks" were originally made for.

Evidently you do have stunning attention to detail though.  You and Cheffo make a great team.

Oops...I am not here.  But seriously guys, thank you for being civilized.   It shows real class.

[CheffoJeffo]

You and Cheffo make a great team.

Hey, I think that you and I make a great team ... how else could your incorrect elitist drivel become entertainment gold ?

[genesim]

So in other words you want this to continue?  I was trying to end it, but I won't sit around and have you crap talking like you actually won something. 

I call it a stalemate to stop the problem.   

[CheffoJeffo]

I call it a stalemate to stop the problem.   

The only thing that is stale is your argument ...

You've run out of things that haven't been refuted yet.

 

[Hoopz]

Let's post a poll to see who won. 

[CheffoJeffo]

WTF is texasmame ?

[Malenko]

That would be antenna which is what the "forks" were originally made for.

Evidently you do have stunning attention to detail though.  You and Cheffo make a great team.

Oops...I am not here.  But seriously guys, thank you for being civilized.   It shows real class.

The twin leads (I called them forks the first time, but I just remembered what they were called) weren't on the TV, the screws were/are. Thanks for the compliment, I think you and Tommy would make a great team and could be our rivals, cool?

And you cant hook up the Atari through (notice I said THROUGH and not IN TANDEM) the antenna unless you somehow hooked up a broadcast then tuned the TV into the broadcast.....instead of that I used a Female Balum Adapter, to which the Atari had a box screwed into it.

The twin leads were made to screw into the TV where the antenna used to go in order to replace it and make the TV "cable ready"

do you know the difference between this:


and this:


and I say we all win when you stop posting, kk thnx bai!

[CheffoJeffo]

I called them forks the first time

Don't forget that Cheffo knows about cutlery ... just saying ... 

[RandyT]

I don't care what anyone says.  I used to really get ticked at those printed representations of games on the backs of the Activision boxes.  When I was shopping for a game, I wanted to see what it was really going to look like, not an "artist's rendition".  The actual games always looked better than that on the screen.  A lot of companies knew this, and showed photos.  But for some reason, Activision never did and it was always a crapshoot as to what you would see when you got it home.  At least that's how I recall it today.....

RandyT

[genesim]

Little Cheffo...ok I tried.

First of all Hoopz, the problem is we have the M.O.B. so the poll is obviously tilted.   We have a religion, and there is no getting away from it.

Cheffo,

Stale.    The problem is that you cannot even refute anything I have said.  You are a walking talking vs of an empty head.    You run around claiming your victory when you haven't even tackled my points.

But hey, I got a challenge...name one..name ten, and as usual I will shoot you down completely.   Don't just say it...give examples.

But here is one for starters.  The only thing you THINK you got me on was refresh rates, and I told you how it was done.   Answer...you ignored it like the coward you are from the first time I called it.

Still...lets keep going.   This is going to be fun.   You learned who Jack is yet..or are you going give me those fantastical consequences.    


Malenko,

I am going to help you ok.  ANTENNA INPUT Einstein.   What you have pictured doesn't have a switch box does it.  BZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZzz  wrong again.     Go back and READ.   

Ooooh you got me there.    GEE I DIDN'T know the screws were on the TV??? UH HUH  WOW.   We sure got some kind of people around here.  First Hoopz comes up with his nice explanation to me on the character in a Few Good Men(gotta love that one) then you with your nice bald correction and misquote...now this.   Cheffo being a clown all the way around who came up with the brilliant comeback to begin with.

You guys gotta stop throwing these softballs.   You might cause me to laugh to death.   

[genesim]

I don't care what anyone says.  I used to really get ticked at those printed representations of games on the backs of the Activision boxes.  When I was shopping for a game, I wanted to see what it was really going to look like, not an "artist's rendition".  The actual games always looked better than that on the screen.  A lot of companies knew this, and showed photos.  But for some reason, Activision never did and it was always a crapshoot as to what you would see when you got it home.  At least that's how I recall it today.....

RandyT

Dude you must have been going through an LCD.   Do you know how much was put into that code!!   It was all there...I saw it.   Through my andtanny that I had going directly to my Atari...why cause I was told it was so....   What a bunch of Malenko.

[RandyT]

Dude you must have been going through an LCD.   Do you know how much was put into that code!!   It was all there...I saw it.   Through my andtanny that I had going directly to my Atari...why cause I was told it was so....   What a bunch of Malenko.

You know, genesim, attention always feels better when it's given by those who actually care about you.....

[Namco]

They were called 75-300 ohm matching transformers. If you had rabbit ears with the "forks" on them and a newer TV, you needed one to push it onto the coaxial input of your TV. The crappy video game switches (and commodore 64 switch) had the "forks" on them usually. I used to end up with a drawer full of these things.



Apparently Genesim had gold-plated connectors or HDMI back then, because I remember looking at a blurry-ass screen as a kid playing C64 and Odyssey 2 games. 

[genesim]

RandyT,

You mean you don't care?   You sure have given me every sign....  Was it the LCD?   Or the idea that you could be wrong??   Please tell me how to get even more of your approval.   You have to admit that I have given every indication that I need it.  

Namco,

You seem to be sincere.   I was merely being sarcastic with these guys...an unending war devoid of sensible discussion.   My point with switch box was that it originally was to go into the antenna posts and that is how I remember it.   

And I can tell you right now that I absolutely saw the lines.   And I played at friends houses that way for years.  Obviously me and Blanka are liars I guess.   Blurry is one thing, but totally blending, the evidence does not support it at all.   Odyssey is not Atari.   C64 is a POOR example because there was nothing like that on its screen!

[CheffoJeffo]

But here is one for starters.  The only thing you THINK you got me on was refresh rates, and I told you how it was done.   Answer...you ignored it like the coward you are from the first time I called it.

This is EXACTLY why I love that saint kept the old thread -- the last several times that you unleashed, there was no evidence left.

Displays were more then likely made in relationship to the LIMITATIONS of the original code, and not the other way around.

Wrong.

Xiaou2,

By the way are you ever going to answer my direct question about pixel distortion from center to the outside?

The only thing that is noticed is the reflections from the curved surface, and a
slight depth perception.   A 19"  CRT viewed at 2ft away with only a slight
round face leads very little to no Illusion related distortions.

 

Oops.

That isn't even close to an answer.   I am talking about the mechanics of the Electron beam and the physics of time and space.   He gives me an answer on the curved surface of the screen...

It was argued that because the beams were shot at angles.. it would cause distortions.
The isnt really all that true... because its not the beam you are seeing.  You are seeing
a Glowing Phosphor Dot light up.   The angle of the beam that Hits the Phosphor
matters very little.  In fact, the Shadowmask is Designed for just that purpose.
The mask isnt simply a mesh.  Its a 3d structure.  The rear of the mask has little
cups routed out on the rear, which catches the beams overspill on both the left
and right  angled gun beams.

And, while Xiaou2 and I agree with less frequency than you and I do, he's right.

Darn.

And for the last time THE BEAM OF LIGHT is what I am speaking about.

And I say "there is no beam of light", because there isn't.  

Slip of that legendary tongue ...

Quote from: genesim on April 26, 2009, 09:03:40 PM
But do I know the difference, are you frickin' kidding me?

Quote from: genesim on April 27, 2009, 05:57:21 AM
Ooops I meant to say draws the screen 15 times per second.

You were saying ?

Hmmm ...

And that's just from the past few days ... shall we reach back and see how you think that there is no evidence that Tron Light Cycles is meant to be played with a 4-way digital joystick ?

Use your ---smurfing--- head man, people are ignoring you left and right, and anytime you post something as a fact, it gets thrown back in your face.

And, still, nobody knows what the hell you are arguing about.

But I am happy to keep kicking your ass.

EDIT: For grammar ... nice to be able to fix those little glitches!

EDIT AGAIN: Missed an 's' in 'nobody knows what the hell you are talking about'

[genesim]

Cheffo,

Yet again another shining example of how you are masking what actually happened.

No RIGHT..on occasion.   Every example is different.    Monitors were beyond the original code.   This much you cannot deny..and you didn't.

next..

Uh Xiaou2 still didn't answer my question and you seem to continue to be DIM to this.   You don't even know what I am talking about.   Here is a grasp of it.   The original monitors have a curve.   Pixel distortion.   The code is uniform.

Am I getting through here??  This is one example.  You are impossible to explain to.    So ignorant, that you wouldn't have even posted if you knew what I was saying.

next...

The electron beam does cause a distortion of color because even with a mask it is not perfect.    That and the issues with color bleeding.   Greatly reduced...always there.   Why...now listen hard.   BECAUSE THE PIXELS ARE NOT INDEPENDENT OF EACH OTHER.    Again a concept that you cannot and will not understand.

next..

What a tool...so you post that stupid beam of light thing again.   Wow even after I warned you.  What good is that if I admitted my mistake?  You obviously have still not learned how to read.

next..

IF THERE WAS A 15hz monitor.   I wasn't wrong was I.   Another "kicking your ass" dillusion.

next..

The Tron light cycle was meant to be played 4 way hence the restrictor.   And you think it wasn't?   The "give" was for the spider level and cone.   HMMMMMM   the Koolaid man strikes again.   This was really too easy.

[genesim]

Yeah it must be nice to change your story.   Don't worry, that is what quotes will be for in the future and you can try to edit all you want.

Oh and for sure all that throwing in my face...it was just blinding. 

[genesim]

*chirp* *chirp*

[CheffoJeffo]

No RIGHT..on occasion.   Every example is different.    Monitors were beyond the original code.   This much you cannot deny..and you didn't.

but that wasn't what you said, so why would I bother denying it ?

Uh Xiaou2 still didn't answer my question and you seem to continue to be DIM to this.   You don't even know what I am talking about.   Here is a grasp of it.   The original monitors have a curve.   Pixel distortion. 

The only thing that is noticed is the reflections from the curved surface, and a slight depth perception.   A 19"  CRT viewed at 2ft away with only a slight round face leads very little to no Illusion related distortions.

Seems to me that he has it nailed. And he isn't part of my little cult.

Am I getting through here??  This is one example.  You are impossible to explain to.    So ignorant, that you wouldn't have even posted if you knew what I was saying.

Uh huh ...

What a tool...so you post that stupid beam of light thing again.   Wow even after I warned you.  What good is that if I admitted my mistake?  You obviously have still not learned how to read.

No, you said that I had only caught you in a single inaccuracy and then challenged me to provide examples. If thinking that there are beams of light inside a CRT isn't an example of an inaccuracy, then I'm not sure what is. It is perhaps the single most obvious mistake that you have made. It is 100% incorrect. I don't really give a crap if you *warned* me ... there are facts and there are errors. One is your friend and one is mine.

next..

IF THERE WAS A 15hz monitor.   I wasn't wrong was I.   Another "kicking your ass" dillusion.

My mistake ... I was thinking that we were talking about REALITY. I was entirely my DELUSION.

next..

The Tron light cycle was meant to be played 4 way hence the restrictor.   And you think it wasn't?   The "give" was for the spider level and cone.   HMMMMMM   the Koolaid man strikes again.   This was really too easy.

Wait, what, that wasn't what you said before when you railed against both Lew and myself for indicating that you needed 4-way restriction. (Hell, you questionned my statement that there was a special restrictor).

I know that saint doesn't have the time to dig out the thread, but please push this soem more if you are willing and maybe he will.

As I say, I'm not afraid of my post history.

EDIT: For misattribution of a quote to Xiaou2.

[RayB]

this Debate of Great Importance^TM has now been Slashdotted!

http://games.slashdot.org/article.pl?sid=09/04/30/163228

PS: Do you guys understand that you're both right and it all depended on the quality of the TV you had? Say the tv had poor focus, it would blur/blend everything.

[CheffoJeffo]

Yeah it must be nice to change your story.   Don't worry, that is what quotes will be for in the future and you can try to edit all you want.

Oh and for sure all that throwing in my face...it was just blinding. 

One of us (i.e. not you) still has full editing priviledges because we make notes about what we edit so that it is clear that we are not changing the story after the fact. I will always admit to my mistakes, whether they be factual or attitudinal, so I am still allowed to EDIT my posts.

Why is it that you can't EDIT again ?  

[shardian]

I can't possibly bring myself to read this thread All those screaming caps make my head hurt), but I have one question:

Why/how would a person get this ridiculously worked up over a subject like this? Seriously??

[ChadTower]

I can't possibly bring myself to read this thread All those screaming caps make my head hurt), but I have one question:

Why/how would a person get this ridiculously worked up over a subject like this? Seriously??

[CheffoJeffo]

C'mon wimp is that all you got?  SMASHED.    You are pathetic.

Works everytime !

 

This one seems to be PH bound ... hard feelings it seems.

[CheffoJeffo]

You have to admit ... some DAMNED (sorry for the caps) fine entertainment.

 

[ChadTower]

[genesim]

Cheffo,

You just quoted me.  That is what I said..just READ.   They were made to the limitation...translation MONITORS WERE BEYOND THE CODE.   So obviously they were not the limiting factor.   I can't explain it any better then that.   Again COMPREHEND.

next..

Wow you even highlighted it in bold and you don't get it still.   Here let me break it down Barney style...  Do you agree that curve in the screen causes percieved pixel distortion.  If yes...then the next step is that the code is uniform...meaning unchanged when moving pacman from right to left.

So therefore....TADA the coders did not account for this.    Same with other non-uniform flaws.   Are you getting it yet?  Xiaou2 never adressed this FACT.

next..

I challenged you to find 10 errors that I didn't adress.  It was a TYPO in that I was writing one thing out of habit and meaning another.  I explained this fully, so this is not an error.   This is the only thing you can come up with, and it is pitiful.    That would be like being so stupid as to keep bringing up something that you admitted being in error.   That isn't a gotcha, I explained what happened.   

The challenge was to find something that I didn't adress.   So far you have found nothing.  NADA ZILCH.   DIM

next...

Kicking ---my bottom---....again more dellusions.    Do you know how bad you sound?   You keep repeating and you have shown no evidence that you even understand my point.    I suggest you read closer, because it just keeps getting lost on you.

next..

I never said there wasn't a 4 way restrictor.   I said that it played best that way and there is no proof...just like with now that it wasn't meant to be restricted in that part.    Hence me saying that for the PART and the game for my accounts, it could be fine.   HMMMM

By the way, as usual you failed to grasp that I admitted my question was answered...not ERROR because I never said definitively I like now just questioned it.    When I saw the mold made and the obvious problems I submitted.   If I didn't, why would I make my mod?   Again another stupid example.   

You take being inquisitive as insisting that something is stone cold the way I see it.    No...get this through your skull, I want evidence before I make a defininite decision.    Noone is always right, and accepting blind answers without even questioning make you a sheep like you...sorry, I will never work that way.   

Wow.....that was really good...

Me worked up?  No warmed up is more like it.   I like hitting these softballs.   But oh no I can't edit...oh no...Cheffo is so much cooler.      Dude you should edit your posts more to not sound so tard.  It just isn't working for you.

[ChadTower]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3YElLVMjEs[/youtube]

 

[genesim]

Hey I tried to end it.   I said it plainly.  And I am the bad guy for defending myself? 

Oh ok.   GOOD, then I guess I am "bad".   

Meanwhile back at the ranch Cheffo insists everyone is ignoring me...but is he?   It is sad when someone puts out a hand and they are refused.   "he wants it...well he gets it...I don't enjoy it any more then you do"

[ChadTower]

And I am the bad guy for defending myself? 

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-tWik4kTVLI[/youtube]

[genesim]

 

Thats Cheffo...I swear it.   He haunts me in my dreams.   I know it is him!!!

[ChadTower]

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Exn1usf4z2k[/youtube]

 

[CheffoJeffo]

Meanwhile back at the ranch Cheffo insists everyone is ignoring me...but is he? 

Actually, back at CasaCheffo, I was picking up the kids from school and,since they know more about arcade games than you do, I figure that they deserve more attention.

But that's me.  

[genesim]

Cheffo,

You can quit at any time...all you gotta do is *GASP* show me some respect and just leave it be.   You aren't proving a thing.   You are no better then I as much as you like to think that you are.

Admirable that you pick up your kids..but mine actually don't need to be driven and they actually collect a paycheck...hmmm that age sure is showing isn't it.

Though it is troubling that it is the measure of how you give attention.

Spend time with your kids..by all means....

And just remember, I didn't say you were a chicken and you weren't beat.   You have shown good sense.

[CheffoJeffo]

Cheffo is so much cooler. 

And it only took a week for you to say something that makes sense.

 

[genesim]

Oops..maybe not.   Guess them kids are going to get ignored again.   And that is what is cooler right?

Sarcasm...learn it...love it...oh nevermind.

Notice them edits??

[CheffoJeffo]

Admirable that you pick up your kids..but mine actually don't need to be driven and they actually collect a paycheck...hmmm that age sure is showing isn't it.

Though it is troubling that it is the measure of how you give attention.

Well, my oldest are 9 and the youngest is 6. Again, I'm reasonably certain that you don't want to say *anything* about my kids and not only because it is in poor taste.

You want to come after me, that is fine. Hell, I encourage it.

If you mention Mrs. Cheffo or the little Cheffos, then you should be prepared for me to show up on your doorstep and hold you to account for what you say.

If you are older than I am, then cool ... I'll get off of your lawn, relinquish my title of the grumpy old man and continue to call you out.

[genesim]

What.  Now you are going to threaten me?

Dude you got issues..big ones.

I am encouraging you to spend time with your kids and telling you to be smart and don't waste your time on a useless debate with me..and what do you do..threaten me?

PSYCHO...I repeat PSYCHO.

First of all, I can tell you right now, if you even THINK of showing up on my doorstep it will be the last mistake you ever make.  The absolute last.   Don't threaten me again punk.   That is your first warning.   As far as your family don't bring them up cause I couldn't care less.   This is the second time you have tried this tactic with me.

This is the sign of someone that doesn't know how to take what they get.   You are unstable and need to hit the doc quick.

For the record calling you Rainman is not calling your kids that.   I apologized out of caring how you felt in being sensitive.   BUT that has nothing to do with your situation.  If you had all blind kids and I said that you needed a seeing eye dog because you are being a blind man...that has still no bearing on your offspring.   

LEARN THIS FACT.

[CheffoJeffo]

I'm out.

EDIT: I hate posting from PMs and have never done so here except for today. Xiaou and I have had some colourful (!)n exchanges via PM, but each of us at least made an effort for the other to hear our side, even though we don't agree, so those exchanges stay private.

genesim, on the other hand, only want to fight ... and crossed the line that I won't.

C'mon wimp post some more.

To everyone else..yep he is still going hence him posting this quote.

[Malenko]

Oops..maybe not.   Guess them kids are going to get ignored again.   And that is what is cooler right?

Sarcasm...learn it...love it...oh nevermind.

Notice them edits??

sweet now you'll stop ---smurfing--- triple posting.

 As for my silence, I was at work , and had to get some done, then drive. now I don't feel like being in here anymore. Genesism, you are too pig-headed to have a discussion with, you cant differentiate FACT from OPINION so its more effective to  talk to a wall. And before you say I'm name calling, pig-headed is an adjective to describe someone who is stupidity obstinate; perverse; and or stubborn. Also its quite annoying to see randomly capitalized words like I did back there with fact and opinion, and its a habit I cant ever see you breaking.

As for being ignored, click on my name....0 members ignoring me. click on cheffo's name, 0 members ignoring him....click on your name. One of these things is not like the other two.

Do the world a favor, shut the ---fudgesicle--- up, READ about CRTs from sources other then here, get a clue, then post more threads like this one, last part optional. Actually, look at the slashdot article, see the comments ? they explain a lot of stuff that you get wrong and maybe you'll believe it since its not from here or cheffo's posse/clan/kliq/group/etc


EDIT:grammar and spacing

[saint]

*chirp* *chirp*

I'm going out of town for the weekend and frankly don't want you on my forums while I'm not here.

Gene will not be able to post for 3 days.

--- saint

[Namco]

Don't you guys have something better to do during the day than to hang out on these forums?

* Namco contemplates the irony as he's been on this forum all day. 

[Ginsu Victim]

*chirp* *chirp*

I'm going out of town for the weekend and frankly don't want you on my forums while I'm not here.

Gene will not be able to post for 3 days.

--- saint

Why not lock this while you're at it? I've avoided this place today for a reason.