Control Panel Layout Critique - 2 Player with Dual Spinners

[cmoses]

I wanted to post my layout design and get some feedback on what everyone thought.  I am using a NFL Blitz 4 player control panel and converting it to a 2 player control panel with trackball and dual spinners.  I want to incorporate the dual spinners for racing style games like Super Sprint, Ivan Stewart Off Roar, etc.  I will be using TurboTwist 2 spinners and ideally the 5" Mini-Racer Steering Wheels.   I will be putting them in the standard button holes on the left side of each player in the diagram below.  I have also considered mounting them on the far outsides (left side for player 1 and right side for player 2).  I wanted to get some feedback on the layout and any thoughts or suggestions.  I currently show straight button layouts but am considering a curved ergonomic design as well. 

Thanks for any input.

[gatordad]

Panel looks good.
The spinners might be too close to the joys, if you plan on using wheel atttachments.
Best thing to do is order your parts and do a mock up on cardboard or a scrap piece of wood.
Even after I had finalized my cp layout I did a mockup and made some additional changes cause after seeing how it would really would be, some controls were just not comfortable.

[RandyT]

Since you have the capability of making nice scale drawings, it would be a good idea to show the 5" diameter of the wheel in the drawing, as well as the full diameter of the joystick handle.  Then keep in mind that you will need to get your fingers in-between.  It may be beneficial to move them up higher on the panel to increase the space between them and the sticks.

As an aside, unless you are really sold on the Ultimates, I would consider a different stick.  They aren't generally well reviewed, and I personally didn't like them much when I used them on my first panel so long ago.

RandyT

[cmoses]

I did use a 5" circle to represent the Mini-Racer wheel when laying them out.  I think I have enough room, but not sure how high they actually sit, maybe you could provide that information Randy?

Also I am not sure what the diameter of the joystick range is?  I am actually using Ultimarc U360's in the control panel, but the template did not actually have them, so I went with the 8 way joystick it had.

[RandyT]

I did use a 5" circle to represent the Mini-Racer wheel when laying them out.  I think I have enough room, but not sure how high they actually sit, maybe you could provide that information Randy?

The top of the 5" wheel will sit about 2" above the control panel.  It is not going to be tall enough to miss your joysticks.  A general rule here is to provide as much room around them as your panel will allow.  So rather than taking the "dress right dress" approach (sorry, it's a military reference from my past that just happens to apply here ), I think you'll find that you'll be happier if you place them where they fit the best and have the most clearance.

RandyT

[Turnarcades]

I agree, the way I tried to describe them in my PM was similar to what you have there, but with the spinners moved inwards towards the centre a bit. You will only use one hand to drive the mini-wheels anyway and the angle/height of your control panel surface will determine if your arm will foul on the joysticks, so mount as necessary based on that thesis, If you want a little more height clearance, the 7" wheels are good but will still not clear joysticks.

[cmoses]

I am hoping to begin work on my control panel this week and have been doing a lot of reading and research.  I have updated my control panel layout to reflect the curved button layout that I am going with.  I also realized that I needed to move the trackball up some to allow room for the control panel hinge. 

The big thing I have done is decide to put the spinners on the outsides.  Player 1 (left side) was already there, but I originally had the Player 2 (right side) spinner next to the track ball.  I decided to move it to the outside.  I think this makes it look a little cleaner and more uniform.  The spinners/mini wheels are represented in the picture by the button with the big blue circle around it.  This is the 5" mini wheel that I want to use.  I think there is plenty of clearance now on both sides.  I even have a little more room to move them out further if I need to for clearance.

This layout gives lots of options as far as number of games that I can play.  The normal games with 1 or 2 players with up to 7 buttons each.  Trackball games, spinner games, racing games with the mini wheels and buttons.  I also can play single player 2 joystick games.  As well as some specialty configurations by using a combination of Player 1 and Player 2 joystick and buttons for games like Defender, Stargate, Asteroids, etc.    

Please let me know what you think and if you have any thoughts or suggestions.

P.S. the joysticks show as 8 way, but I will be using U360's for maximum options (2 way, 4 way, 8 way, diagonal, analog, etc.)

[Turnarcades]

Good thinking and well planned out. Unfortunately that layout wouldn't really work for my 4-player panel but having the spinners at the sides of the two players is a nice idea as while playing stick games the unobtrusive spinner top will not be in the way. The only thing I can think of that could be an issue is the 'opposite hand' steering for each player. Inevitably there will be some people who prefer to hold the wheel in their left or right hand and you can't both have the same.

[cmoses]

Turncades,

Yes, having the steering wheel be left handed for Player 1 and right handed for Player 2 was the only issue that I came up with for the new design.  I guess I will always have to volunteer to play the side that the other player doesn't want.  I don't think its a major issue though as I feel like I could drive with either hand, but not sure everyone feels that way.

The big advantage is that you can play spinner games with your right or left hand, just stand on the appropriate side. 

[Turnarcades]

The big advantage is that you can play spinner games with your right or left hand, just stand on the appropriate side.

Guess I'd be happy playing against a Yank then as we drive on the opposite side in the UK! Player 2's control would probably be best for me with the steering in the right hand and the gearing etc. on my left.

[diggso]

Hey man, I posted my cp on the cp database thread but I thought you might be interested because its similar in some ways to your plan. I went with 2 spinners aswell (so worth it for super sprint!) but i decided to use 2 separate heights on the cp, one for the joysticks and one for the spinners etc. This makes things a lot easier to give appropriate space too, because its just the depth of the cp that makes the difference, rather than the width (trying to squeeze everything on at the same height.) Everything feels natural and comfortable to use and I didn't have to make the cp crazy deep or steep in order to make it all fit together.
Its another option for you to consider!
Let us know how ya get on.

[cmoses]

Hey man, I posted my cp on the cp database thread but I thought you might be interested because its similar in some ways to your plan. I went with 2 spinners aswell (so worth it for super sprint!) but i decided to use 2 separate heights on the cp, one for the joysticks and one for the spinners etc. This makes things a lot easier to give appropriate space too, because its just the depth of the cp that makes the difference, rather than the width (trying to squeeze everything on at the same height.) Everything feels natural and comfortable to use and I didn't have to make the cp crazy deep or steep in order to make it all fit together.
Its another option for you to consider!
Let us know how ya get on.

Still trying to figure it out, but need to decide soon as I started some work on the control panel this past weekend.  Questions about your layout.  With the dual spinners are you using the mini racing wheels?  If so how is your clearance with the red buttons.  If you are using the mini racing wheels, do you use the lower buttons?  If you are not using the mini racing wheels, how are the driving games with just the spinnners?

I have given thought to putting the spinners/mini racing wheels above the joystick and buttons, but am not sure how comfortable that will be.  I don't really want to add any more buttons even if they are just duplicates. 

[diggso]

I'm not using the mini-wheels, although I considered them at the start and I still reckon they would be really sweet so I hope you go for them. You're right that the red buttons would be way too close if I was using the wheels, but I don't think you're putting trigger sticks on so I guess you'd have plenty of room to shift the over to the right. The buttons are just duplicates of the 123 buttons, but if you did go for a 2 height design I would add buttons at the same height as the wheels(I had a go at using the spinners with the lower buttons and it's not very comfortable). I find 3 buttons fine for the vast majority of racer/spinner games but some of the ones with complex gearchangers need more. Whichever way you go, I wish you the best of luck! And don't forget to post a picwhen you're done. Maybe I shoulda gone for those wheels...