TV out from card slower than VGA out ???

[Panzer]

First off thanks guys. I was able to get my PCI card to work for the most part. It runs on my monitor perfectly. You guys are making this possible for me so thank you!

My new card runs mame slower than dirt if it is set to full screen now. Is this because of the card? Windowed it runs perfect. I am using mame version .109

My computer is a 2.88 ghz 700+ meg of RAM.

The video card is only 4 megs.

But my understanding was that the video card was not all that important. What shoudl I do?

[blueznl]

What brand and model card and slot?

[Panzer]

The card is a 4 meg ati rage 3D II+ Pci card.

[Panzer]

Anybody?

I also noticed that when in dxdiag it says that Direct3D is not available.

Now what?

[WareWolF]

That card is really, really really old.  In that case it DOES matter.  Whoever told you graphics cards dont really matter should have said something like any RADEON or GEFORCE graphcis card should work ok.  anything older than that is a mixed bag.  When that card was made computer games mostly had lousy graphics and no 3d effects (which is why direct 3d is not supported, even if you find a driver that supports it direct 3d ran so slow on early ATI cards it was unusuable, anyone who DID run any decent games had to spring for a $200-300 voodoo 3d card to install in ADDITION to the ati card to get any decent gaming performance.    You might be able to get mame to run OK on that card if you go into the tab menu, then video options, and make sure bezels, artwork, backdrops etc are all turned off, then it still will probably only run "real" classics like pacman, galaga, mappy, donkey kong, space invaders, etc at decent speed.  You might also have better luck using an older mame version with that card something from say 0.69 or less might run better, if you are putting it on a dedicated cab a dos version will probably be faster with the ati card than a windows version as it will be working directly with the video hardware instead of going thru windows drivers to access it.  Really though if I were in your situation with a decent machine with an agp slot and I wanted TV out I would save up for a cheap GEFORCE or RADEON card with TV out something like a RADEON 7000, 9000 series or a GEFORCE 2MX, 4MX or 4000 series should run most games pretty well.  If you are in the US here is one for $29.00 shipped to your door.

http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.asp?Item=N82E16814153029

[freckleface]

There's something else to this.  PCI is too slow of bus speed to run MAME version with the new rendering system very well.  At least 128mb will get you up and running, but any effects and it'll crawl. That's my experience, anyway.

[Panzer]

thanks guys. This computer unfortunatly has no AGP slot. So am I just screwed here for this through the PCI slot for games like Killer Instinct even with 2.88 ghz nad 758 ram?

[torez]

Whoa, Ati rage 3D II+ ... that card is like 10 years old!!!

Try using version of Mame 0.106 or earlier, but getting any video card than the one you have will definitely help.  What is your motherboard or at least what computer model do you have.  It's possible that you have pci-express and you don't even know it?  If you don't have pci-express, you should have an onboard video.  This is one of these rare occasions that the onboard video would be better than your dedicated video card.

If we know your motherboard model/number, then we might be able to help you better.

Mark

[WareWolF]

There are a few high end PCI cards around but they will cost you around $100 or more and will probably be around the same speed as your on board video.   If you are going to spend that much you might as well replace the motherboard.

What computer do you have, a Dell 2400? (about the only common PC I can think of that would come with a 2.8 P4 and no AGP slot)   

If so you can get a standard atx motherboard to replace the one w/out a AGP slot for it, something like this should fit, but you will need to make sure it's a socket 478 processor on the motherboard you have now.   

I think all dell 2400's are socket 478 but I'm not 100% sure you can easily check -- it will should say Socket 478 right on the cpu socket. 

http://www.ewiz.com/detail.php?p=MB-I65GNM&c=pw#

If you replace the motherboard try to get same brand chipset and you most likely wont have to re-install windows.  This motherboard should replace a motherboard in a dell 2400 w/out requiring a re-install.

If you have something else and it's a brand name computer let me know.

[WareWolF]

Torez, he has on board video but no onboard tv-out and wants to run mame on a TV. 

If he has PCI express thats a totally different standard than PCI and much faster, and we can reccommend a decent PCI express card w/TV-Out. 

Unfortunately DELL and some other OEM's used to sell alot of really cheap PC's without AGP or PCI express slots.  Most P4's have AGP slot's (or PCI-Express) nowadays except the Dell 2400 which was very popular in the US as it was advertised on TV for $299.00-$499.00 for YEARS, it usually came with a celeron CPU & 15" monitor at this price, and people who called to order by phone usually got upsold to a P4 and lots of other expensive addons but were never told the motherboard would limit them to never being able to install a decent gaming graphics card in the PC no matter how much money they spent on options, or if they were told they didn't think this important at the time, but the computer was sold of passed on to other family members who want to run games on it and they are disappointed.

PCI express is faster than AGP.
AGP is faster than on board video
On board video is faster than PCI (usually)

just in case we are confusing anyone! 

[fjl]

Upgrade the motherboard. What kind of CPU does it have? That might matter too.

[Panzer]

Computer is a Insignia Personal Computer. Intel(R) Pentium (R) 4 CPU 2.88 GHz, 758 MB of Ram.

Hope that helps. How do I check if I have a PCI express?

the VGA out port I have says I have an Intel(R) 82845G/GL/GE/PE/GV Graphics Controller.

Location PCI bus 0, Device 2, Function 0

[xmenxmen]

Before you do any type of upgrade on the motherboard or whatsoever, just go buy yourself a pci radeon 7/9xxx card off ebay with tv out.  At least for mame, you don't need any of the newer cards.  The problem you have is the poor response from the older ati card's tv out.  Most of the 7000, 9000 and 92xx cards with tv out will be fine for what you need.  Avoid the geforce for tv out as they are not as good. 

Yes, pci express is faster than agp, etc, etc, but until you reach the limit of each standard, they are pretty equal especially when referencing the older cards like the radeon 7/9xxx.

Here's one that should be more than good enough.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ATI-Radeon-9200-256Mb-PCI-Video-Card-Used_W0QQitemZ230094195710QQihZ013QQcategoryZ40158QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

[WareWolF]

That motherboard I suggested will probably work as a drop in.  The Intel 845 is an older chipset that did not support PCI express so you definately do not have a PCI express slot.  That card on ebay for $10 w/free shipping is also worth a try before you do the upgrade if you can get it, at least then you would know where you stand with your current motherboard.  I would not bid more than about $15 max for it.

[Panzer]

Ok, I just bid on it. Thanks for all your help guys!

[Panzer]

.... and i was out bid already

O.K. I am super frustrated and just want a card that works.

http://www.circuitcity.com/ssm/eVGA-GeForce-FX-5200-Video-Card-128P1N309DX/sem/rpsm/oid/105701/catOid/-13011/rpem/ccd/productDetail.do

They have that at Circuit City. Will that work?

[xmenxmen]

Yes, but the consensus on the forum seem to say that s-video on the Geforce are not very good.  I don't have one, so can't really comment.  I have 2 radeon (1 7500 and 1 9200), both work good.   And that's also the reason when I was looking, I choose the radeon base on the comment here.

To get a card on ebay, expect to pay around 20 to 25 bucks total.  But you might want to go a little more for a pci one as there's not that many out there. 

Beside the 9200, I listed previously, the 7500 and 9000 are decent as well.  And if you have a Frys close by, every other week, I seen the 9250 on sale around 30 bucks after rebate.

and to close, BTW, the 5200 is available free after rebate at the Frys near U today only...