Help a beginner start his setup

[project86]

I know this has been posted probably a million times, but I'm new to the scene and looking for help. I have a budget of around $1,000 although less is better. I have zero woodworking skills, hardly any tools, no dedicated space for a long term project.... so building my own cab is not really an option. I do have computer hardware and software skills, and have used mame on my regular PC.

1) What cab would be the best way to go, keeping in mind I can't build my own?
a) UAII pre-built kit for $585 shipped. I'd just have to screw it together, which I can handle.
b) Locate a local seller who will sell me a cheap used cab, price=unknown. This could be good if it came with a useable monitor.
c) Find someone around here to build it for me, price=unknown.

2) What to use for the "guts" of the system?
a) Just use a PC, which I can easily build.
b) Use a modded Xbox. I know this works, but not sure how well.
c) Use one of those multicart Jamma boards. If it has hundreds of good games, and easily plugs in to a used cab, then that would simplify things. Again, I don't know the story about how well these work.

3) Controls. So many options!
a) HotRod stick for $100
b) Xarcade stick, not sure which one would be best
c) Slikstik: several options, but the only one in my price range is the fighter at $279. The other option is to get one of their blanks and add my own buttons/etc. This would still be expensive.
d) have someone around here make it for me. price=unknown

As for the monitor, I was thinking of using my 27" CRT which currently lives in my living room but is being replaced this year by a large flatscreen. If that's too big then I'm sure I can find another cheap TV, or even use my 19" CRT from my bedroom.

I welcome any comments, suggestions, etc. Keep in mind what I said about not being able to make my own cab... I'm pretty firm on that. Someday when my son is older it's something we can do together, but right now he is just turning 2.

[fjl]

1. A
If you really don't want to build then go for a pre-built cab. But from what I have seen from the pre-built arcades, they're pretty much crappy in the point of quality and customization. This is why I chose to build my own cab instead of vying for getting a store built or an existing arcade. I was going to get a used MK cabinet and alter it. Not anymore. My cab will be exactly how "I" want it. 

2. A
Multicart Jamma boards will have alot of games but I doubt it will have all the games "I" want. Again, this is about my preference. X-Box? I'd leave the X-Box for whats its for, a home console system. Not an arcade. Although, I would like to connect my Dreamcast to my arcade seeing as how its the only current way I can get Marvel Vs Capcom 2 working on it.

3. I thought the X-arcade was pretty cool but people here have ben putting it down. Or at least that is the view I saw. I'm going with Happs controls. As they are considered as superior to mostly everything else. Expensive to buy directly from them though. I'm going to buy from the re-sellers on this site for a discount. For Joysticks I'm getting the Supers.
http://happcontrols.com/joysticks/super_joy.htm

And a four way.
http://happcontrols.com/joysticks/5060841125r.htm

One of their trackballs
http://happcontrols.com/trackballs/565600xx2.htm

And their competition pushbuttons.
http://happcontrols.com/pushbuttons/5896xxl.htm

As for the monitor, you have to worry if it will even fit the cabinet.

[clockwork]

There are some posts in the Project Announcements section of people who've used the UAII kit. You might want to check those. I think a PC is probably easier to setup. You really don't need that powerful a system for MAME. Anything P4+ should do (even a PIII could work), or a decent Athlon may be better. The UAII and most cab designs I believe will hold a 27" CRT, so there should be no worries there. And in my opinion, bigger is better, so use all the TV you can.

As far as lack of woodworking skills, I have none myself. Saint's Project Arcade book lays it out very simply for a newb like me, though. Tools and workspace you could perhaps borrow or use at a friends or relatives. If not, you could get some cheap starter tools. In fact, for the ~$600 for the UAII you could probably get your tools and materials. I spent a total of about $500 on my tools and I didn't even go for the cheapest.

[project86]

I agree that the sensible thing to do is spend the money on tools, which I would then be able to use on my cab as well as for many other things. However.... I don't really have any space for storing them, and I certainly don't have space to work on a messy project, since nothing can be left sitting around or my son will try to use it himself! Plus if I buy them, I still have to work through the process of building, which is tough for me. I work 50+ hours a week most of the time, and I want to spend my free time playing video games rather than trying to figure out how to build it.

[fjl]

I'm building it cause I have the time and I am really looking forward to doing this as a project since I love working with my hands. Plus I love tools and this gives me an excuse to buy them. Like the router for one. Who knows, after this I might get into furniture building. 

Of course the main reason is my love for video games. I loved arcades but grew up poor so rarely got to play them. I could only wish to have an arcade of my own like Street Fighter II. I once even tried building an arcade Control Panel with a used Nintendo joystick. I had bad luck and just ended up breaking it. 

But now that I see where I can get all the parts and help from lots of other people, its time I started on my dream.

[leapinlew]

The Xbox is a decent solution really.

Depends on a few things:
1. The kind of games you want to play
If your just wanting classics, don't want to play too many demanding games and only want to play joystick games - you'd probably be content with an xbox.

2. 1st gen xbox's can be had for a decent price.

3. Ease of setup - if your already familiar with how to setup the xbox. It's probably easier/quicker to do than messing around with a computer.

As for building your own cab or buying a pre-built one. Your call - the UAII seems like a solid unit and you'd probably be happy with it. My first cabinet was a refurb of a Nintendo cabinet. The cabinet itself was free, and I had to work within the constraints of that particular cabinet. I ended up buying quite a few tools. Total cost for my 1st cabinet was probably around 1k. So, I don't think the UAII units are that bad of a deal.

The controls.... ask 100 people - get 100 opinions. Check out the Ultimarc 360's if you go with a computer - it has the ability to map on the fly. It acts like a 4 way when it needs to and an 8 way when needed. Good stuff.

[project86]

Here's a rough list I came up with by browsing some of the vendors here as well as some other places. All prices are rough and usually rounded up a bit to account for tax, shipping,  and small items I might be forgetting. Better to think too high than too low while planning...

UAII cab: $600
ArcadeVGA video card: $100
Keywiz Max: $40
Wiring Kit: $20
Ultimarc Estick X3 (standard 2 player config plus another 1 kept in 4way mode): $50
Happ Buttons X30: $40
SlikStik Fighter Stick blank: $150
decent PC speakers: $50


That brings the total to just over by budget of $1000. All I'd need then is the PC, which I could build for under $200. Am I missing anything or making any bad choices?

[CheffoJeffo]

1) What cab would be the best way to go, keeping in mind I can't build my own?
a) UAII pre-built kit for $585 shipped. I'd just have to screw it together, which I can handle.
b) Locate a local seller who will sell me a cheap used cab, price=unknown. This could be good if it came with a useable monitor.
c) Find someone around here to build it for me, price=unknown.

While it depends HEAVILY on what you want to play on your machine (which you really need to answer first), I will almost always say B from a cost/benefit perspective.

2) What to use for the "guts" of the system?
a) Just use a PC, which I can easily build.
b) Use a modded Xbox. I know this works, but not sure how well.
c) Use one of those multicart Jamma boards. If it has hundreds of good games, and easily plugs in to a used cab, then that would simplify things. Again, I don't know the story about how well these work.

Any of those are reasonable options ... if you choose C, then definitely go with B above (just make sure the cab is wired JAMMA)

3) Controls. So many options!
a) HotRod stick for $100
b) Xarcade stick, not sure which one would be best
c) Slikstik: several options, but the only one in my price range is the fighter at $279. The other option is to get one of their blanks and add my own buttons/etc. This would still be expensive.
d) have someone around here make it for me. price=unknown

I would say neither of A or B. But it really depends on what controls you want, what games you want to play, and how you end up answering the previous two questions.

You REALLY need to decide what you want to play and have a look at the controls involved, monitor orientation, etc. Remember that vector games will not look as good on a normal raster arcade monitor (so you may want to use an SVGA montor) Do not feel that you need to support 1000s of games ... pick what you want (this will be key when it comes to controlling price)

As far as costs go, my first MAME box ran about $450 total ($150 for working cabinet, $150 for ArcadeVGA and IPac, $75 for joysticks and buttons and $75 for misc wiring, paint, etc.).

Cheers

[project86]

I'm sorry I didn't give enough info about what I wanted. I'd like a horizontal monitor. I'm not too concerned with the very very old games. I was born in 1980, so the prime of my gaming days was around 1989-1995ish. Lots of NeoGeo, Street Fighter types is what I played mostly. I do have an appreciation for the older games as well, but not enough to buy a $100+ track ball (for example).

[CheffoJeffo]

Your choice of controls is appropriate then. If you are going to use your TV, then you don't need the ArcadeVGA and can save yourself some $$$.

With that configuration, I would have a look for a cabinet locally ... around here, I would expect to get a suitable cabinet, with monitor (in which case you would need the ArcadeVGA), for less than $150. (In fact, you may just want to buy a NeoGeo ... they go for $150-300 here with 25" monitor and my NG gets more play than any of my MAME cabs).

Having said that, I don't see a problem with buying the cab kit ... it is a reasonable solution.

Good luck and let us know how it goes!

Cheers.

[project86]

Thanks. You are correct about the ArcadeVGA not helping if I use my TV, I don't know what I was thinking. I would love to find a NeoGeo cab, those are kind of rare around here (at least from my limited searching). Once I had one, what all would I have to do to convert it? Add more buttons, and what else?

[leapinlew]

I do have an appreciation for the older games as well, but not enough to buy a $100+ track ball (for example).

I don't even use my trackball for older games. I play the newer games - Shuffleshot, World Class Bowling and Golden Tee. What I've learned about the trackball is that you can get people who don't normally play video games to play video games (read: girls).

My folks will play a game of bowling, and me and a few guys will gather around and play some shuffleshot. If you feel you'll be entertaining with your cabinet - check out a trackball. Highly recommended.

[clockwork]

What I've learned about the trackball is that you can get people who don't normally play video games to play video games (read: girls).

You da man, lew! I've just decided to add three more trackballs to my console design. Can't wait to get the ladies over to play with my balls. 

[project86]

yes a trackball would be nice, but I'd rather do 4 regular joystick before doing a trackball, to get some 4 player simpsons/TMNT/sunset riders type of action going. But I just don't think I have the budget for that. That would mean upgrading to the 4 player slikstik blank unit, doubling my buttons, and getting 2 more sticks. Actually that might not be so bad, maybe I'll think about that....

[project86]

Well, I've done a bit of looking around, and it seems a good fit for my room might be a candy cab. The smaller size, the lighter weight, built in wheels, etc. I've even found someone willing to sell me a New Astro City model for $600 + shipping, which seems like a good deal considering it has a nice arcade monitor and controls already there.

How difficult will it be to work with a candy cab like that? Could I just get an Xbox or Dreamcast and use that instead of a PC? I think I'm going for the "simpler is better" concept at this point.

[_) (V) (-)]

Should be interesting to see you put a 4 player setup onto a candy cab.

You could save a lot of time and maybe some $$$ if you find a pre-existing (used) cabnet.

[project86]

That WOULD be interesting, I don't think I have the skills for it at this point though. I think in the interest of saving time and money, I will initially try to get a candy cab (2 player) and maybe someday I can get some 4 player action somehow... but I'd be willing to make due with only 2 players to get all the features that I like about the candy cabs.

I agree that it is much cheaper to find someone local to buy from, which is what I will try to find. I have already contacted Matsu, who has a New Astro City cab for around $850 shipped. That seems good buy I'd like to find something even cheaper. Any ideas?

[sphetr2]

Although you are going for the "easier" approach, you may want to get a *slighty* worn used cab. It may require some fixing up (this may be from replacing the marquee glass to just rewiring something the owner couldn't). But if you find someone who has nearly no knowledge of arcade machines (like the person I bought from, they moved there and the machines were there already), there is probably an easy solution and you will get it for less because they think it doesn't work.

If it's a beauty/exterior problem, and if you really care about how your cab looks, and if you don't feel like fixing it up, then I guess I'd go with your approach

I got my used cab for $75. IIRC, 850 > 75. It was local too, so no shipping.

Also, where are you? Maybe some of us members can "hook you up."   

[leapinlew]

But if you find someone who has nearly no knowledge of arcade machines (like the person I bought from, they moved there and the machines were there already), there is probably an easy solution and you will get it for less because they think it doesn't work.

Sphetr2 is giving you some good information. My first cab was a nintendo cabinet and in 1 evening I gutted it, cleaned it, patched it and I was ready to start putting it together. The only thing I disagree with is the idea that the person your buying it from has no knowledge. These cabinets are a couple hundred pounds and take up a good amount of space in a home. Some people just want to get rid of them and don't care about making money. In other words - while the cabinet had value to me - the person I got it from didn't think it had any. Both sides won and I had no reason to feel like I pulled something over.

[sphetr2]

Some people just want to get rid of them and don't care about making money. In other words - while the cabinet had value to me - the person I got it from didn't think it had any. Both sides won and I had no reason to feel like I pulled something over.

This is what I meant to say - they had 5 of these beasts! There were actually no technical problems, and I didn't feel like I was "scammin' them neither. "

[Thurman]

Take a look at SuperAuctions and see if there is one coming to a city near you.  I got a non-working TMNT cab for $1.  The auction was a great way to spend an afternoon and I left with a well-build 4 player cab!

[fixedpigs]

Some people just want to get rid of them and don't care about making money. In other words - while the cabinet had value to me - the person I got it from didn't think it had any. Both sides won and I had no reason to feel like I pulled something over.

This is what I meant to say - they had 5 of these beasts! There were actually no technical problems, and I didn't feel like I was "scammin' them neither. "

and...some people just want somethings to go to good homes...where they know they'll get another life...instead of going to the dump or reduced to kibble with a sledgehammer...

[project86]

Thanks again for the replies.

I go back and forth between wanting to go all out with a UAII kit and a nice 4 player controll panel with spinner, trackball, seperate 4 way sticks, etc... to wanting a candy cab (because of the smaller size and good looks), to wanting to find a used cab like people have suggested.

I live in Santa Rosa, CA which is about an hour north of San Francisco (traffic permitting). I really haven't investigated much other than Craigslist and Ebay... but it would be great to get a used cab for $100 or so. I honestly wouldn't care about the looks at that point. My problem with that situation is that I would want something with a Street Fighter type control layout, since I don't really have much time or skill for modding it. Other than that, finding a cheap used cab seems to be the best option. Any suggestions for finding one in my area? Anybody have one they can just drop off at my house?

[amerish]

I have a 4 player UAII with 4 - 8 ways, 1 - 4 way, track ball and spinner.

If size is a consideration, keep in mind that the UAII for my 27 inch montior is quite large and with the big control panel, fairly wide. It takes up a good amount of space.