Author Topic: Act-Lab's TV gun to support 2 players? (Read 12155 times)

OSCAR · « **on:** March 03, 2003, 10:13:46 pm »

Unverified, but this seems to have been written by someone who's been in contact with Act-Labs. Two player support and auto-fire on the TV guns? I figured somebody may be interested...

http://www.lightgun.tk/

See the news posted March 1, 2003.

Sasquatch! · « **Reply #1 on:** March 03, 2003, 11:09:58 pm »

Bill_S · « **Reply #2 on:** March 04, 2003, 02:29:18 pm »

Oh how I want that to be true, but I'm not too optimistic since that is contradictory to what the actlabs web site says today.

BASSOFeeSH · « **Reply #3 on:** March 04, 2003, 03:01:26 pm »

If this is true then I wish they'd annouce it.

I'm sure they suddenly be *way* over the pre-order limit from people ordering a 2nd unit.

Brax · « **Reply #4 on:** March 04, 2003, 03:25:18 pm »

That was their first attempt at a gun system and frankly.... it blew dead bears.

Siris · « **Reply #5 on:** March 04, 2003, 03:57:45 pm »

Actually, it's new!

http://www.act-labs.com/ubbcgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=13&t=000145

Btw: Hello All, I used to frequent here a lot way back when can't seem to remember what nick I used though. heh
Anyway I am just starting a new MAME cab so may be posting occasionally again.

anthony691 · « **Reply #6 on:** March 04, 2003, 04:09:18 pm »

That is my site and indeed it is true ( I should have included a link to Jimmy's post ) This is WAY cool! It seems like they fixed most of the big probs w/ the gun. Well, if any of you folks buy one, I would like to hear about it (as I don't plan on shelling out the cash)

anthony691 · « **Reply #7 on:** March 04, 2003, 04:17:43 pm »

One other thing, if you are going to buy a Light Gun if you buy it from he link at my site I get a kickback from Act-Labs and it would be GREATLY apreciated. Thanks a lot.

anthony691 · « **Reply #8 on:** March 04, 2003, 04:24:22 pm »

Oh, and Brax, it wasn't thier first attempt. They had a few before it; they remained rather ubscure for some reason or another.

Brax · « **Reply #9 on:** March 04, 2003, 05:59:34 pm »

Quote from: anthony691 on March 04, 2003, 04:24:22 pm

Oh, and Brax, it wasn't thier first attempt. They had a few before it; they remained rather ubscure for some reason or another.

Hmm, I'm pretty sure they originally had a two gun game port version that didn't work on much more than the supplied demos.

brandon · « **Reply #10 on:** March 04, 2003, 06:02:43 pm »

I wonder if they are going to add 2-player support for their next run of PC USB Lightguns.. The ideal setup would be a 2 player setup on an arcade or computer monitor.. I dont know if I want to deal with fuzzy TV quality just to play 2 player gun games... If its just a driver change then maybe it will work with the existing PC USB guns and that would absolutely rule!

Sasquatch! · « **Reply #11 on:** March 04, 2003, 08:28:28 pm »

Allright, who's the IMPOSTER registered as "Sasquatch" already over at the Act-Labs forums??

anthony691 · « **Reply #12 on:** March 04, 2003, 09:42:02 pm »

The USB PC Light Gun will *NOT* be able to be made 2 player. The hardware isn't really capable of it. (there have been a few decent results w/ analoge MAME) Besides that, don' t expect them to realease a "driver update" that could fix the problem. I know it isn't a good situation! And Brax you gave a acuurate description of the Light Gun GS (now discontinued) I am gonna buy Lik Sangs gun instead of the TV USB Light gun I think...

dwyzane · « **Reply #13 on:** March 04, 2003, 10:36:45 pm »

Which of Lik Sang's Guns are you opting to buy? And PLZ give a review for us.

anthony691 · « **Reply #14 on:** March 04, 2003, 10:49:12 pm »

Note that I am not sure, but I am stuck between his Virtual and Bio guns; right now I am flat broke from my new cab.

u_rebelscum · « **Reply #15 on:** March 04, 2003, 10:51:03 pm »

Quote from: anthony691 on March 04, 2003, 09:42:02 pm

The USB PC Light Gun will *NOT* be able to be made 2 player. The hardware isn't really capable of it. (there have been a few decent results w/ analoge MAME) Besides that, don' t expect them to realease a "driver update" that could fix the problem. I know it isn't a good situation! And Brax you gave a acuurate description of the Light Gun GS (now discontinued) I am gonna buy Lik Sangs gun instead of the TV USB Light gun I think...

Any idea on how the TV gun is going to do 2 players?

Also, I don't see any hardware problems with two PC monitor lightguns. Almost all problems are on the OS & software end.
All explanations I've read (can't serial because second one will block first one's flash, both share same memory location, serialing them messes up the timing) is either false, due to software, or will happen after a lot of use (quicker break down). Of course, I just got my second lightgun, so that last one is the biggest possibility.

Howard_Casto · « **Reply #16 on:** March 04, 2003, 11:02:01 pm »

Quote from: anthony691 on March 04, 2003, 10:49:12 pm

Note that I am not sure, but I am stuck between his Virtual and Bio guns; right now I am flat broke from my new cab.

I don't want to go into details, but the bio guns and the other guns at liksang and crappy repackaging of older guns that never quite worked right (similar to act labs first generation of gameport guns). The safe money would be to stay with the act-labs guns, which do in fact work well, contrary to your belief.

anthony691 · « **Reply #17 on:** March 04, 2003, 11:15:27 pm »

Contrary to MY BELIEF??? You probably should have read a few more of my posts (or checked out my site www.lightgun.tk) And you would then relize I am an Act-Labs associate, and would CERTAINLY NOT endorse a product I don't like! Thank you for warning me about the Lik-Sang guns. Just don't be so presumptous. And if anyone was wondering I don't think that their Associate Program is worth while.

Dr. J · « **Reply #18 on:** March 05, 2003, 12:15:02 am »

I have to call BS when I see it.
FIRST: If you are even considering getting a pc virtual light gun then you haven't read a single post at this board regarding light guns before. Everyone who owns one has said they're junk. Mine is sitting in the closet collecting dust, and not after trying to get it to work.

SECOND: As U_rebelscum stated, it doesn't matter if you're shooting a tv screen or a computer screen. It's not a hardware issue. I can play with two USB lightguns on my computer screen. The problem is OS and software. Currently the two guns fight over the same cursor, so if both are fired at the same time, it will only recognize one of the guns. I've tested this myself. I suggest you give it a try and see for yourself. So why doesn't this work with analogmame+? If you'd read older posts here you'd know. u_rebelscum did it with dx and AL didn't. That's what U_rebel's working on now.

THIRD: The older AL guns weren't meant to be run in mame, and were crap. I have those in my closet collecting dust as well. In fact, if someone's willing to pay shipping and handling I'll send them my PC virtual light gun, AND my actlabs GS guns. However, the new usb guns work very well in mame currently. There just isn't 2 player support yet. I completed a game of virtual cop using the AL guns without problem, and I consider that a pretty challenging test to the guns accuracy.

Quote from: anthony691 on March 04, 2003, 04:17:43 pm

One other thing, if you are going to buy a Light Gun if you buy it from he link at my site I get a kickback from Act-Labs and it would be GREATLY apreciated. Thanks a lot.

FOURTH: If they're not even announcing it at their official site, then I'm not necessarily going to believe this from someone who could make whatever statement they want to get "kickbacks."

FIFTH: I hope they do get two player support, but as it stands right now, it will happen because of a software change. Even the new guns plug in with the usb cable. The only difference is the monitor/tv pass thru, and as I've already stated, that's not the problem.

Howard_Casto · « **Reply #19 on:** March 05, 2003, 01:21:15 am »

Quote from: anthony691 on March 04, 2003, 11:15:27 pm

Contrary to MY BELIEF??? You probably should have read a few more of my posts (or checked out my site www.lightgun.tk) And you would then relize I am an Act-Labs associate, and would CERTAINLY NOT endorse a product I don't like! Thank you for warning me about the Lik-Sang guns. Just don't be so presumptous. And if anyone was wondering I don't think that their Associate Program is worth while.

Sorry about that but see it from my perspective:

So your telling me you will "support" a product if they give you money for re-directed sales and yet when it comes time for you to buy a gun you won't buy it from them?? How sleazy, dirty and under handed is that?

I would suggest you only put endorsments to products you've actually used on your site. It would be much more honest of you.

Btw everybody and their momma is an act-labs associate. I was asked to put a act-labs banner on the lazarus site for commission but couldn't do it in good conscience as I hadn't bought one yet. (waiting for the tv version, which I have on pre-order) My point is, being an "associate" doesn't mean anything.

I legitimately support act-labs as I've owned many of the guns from the competiton and seen the superior act-labs guns in action first hand.

brandon · « **Reply #20 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:38:12 am »

are the act labs guns in anyways modular? ie. could you take a PC Usb gun and plug it into the Pass thru dongle on the TV gun and make it work? If not I dont understand why they dont make it that way so that people would know it could be upgraded later.... I know I would buy one if I knew that later down they road I could add a second gun or connect my PC gun to a TV with a different module or whatever... just seems like it would make more sense to do it that way even for their own production cost. I'm guessing that if someone took the PC gun and TV gun apart the only real difference would be in the pass through circuitry and not in the gun itself.. so in that sense the old actlabs guns might be worth having just for spare parts....

Dak-ak · « **Reply #21 on:** March 05, 2003, 06:38:19 am »

*crosses legs to hid bulge* 2 players huh? *has dirty thoughts of 1 player double-fisted area51*

i was wondering if anyone (perhaps one of the actlab guys) know if the tv gun will work with arcade monitors (being fairly similiar). Im going to hook up a arcadevga one of these days...

last part, how do the guns actually plug in? ive been looking for diagrams, but havn't had any luck. They have a dongle that plugs into the video card, and some usb plug somewhere, but im curious how the plugs are arranged and how long hte cables are (tryuing to plan a outlay for my cab)

~Dak~

anthony691 · « **Reply #22 on:** March 05, 2003, 07:20:12 am »

Wow... everyone needs to calm down! Dr. J, talk to Jimmy at Act-Labs (It is true)! I do own 2 lightguns, but have recieved unplayable results (like at which point having no mouse in Win98 (Which is because of Win98) I haven't done too much with dual guns, because right now i only have one on my cab, and I actully own a CRT monitor that does NOT work with the gun (obviosly because it is Sun, but it has a standard 15 pin plug). And I LOVE my light gun! I just wish everyone here would be a LITTLE less doubting. Someone linked to Jimmy's post earlier in this thread. And if we all know anything it is that Act-Labs NEVER updates thier site (they still have 33 games on thier list) So I meant that thier current PC USB Light Gun could not be very good for 2 player (and that I like it best in analoge MAME for some reason). Come on people I was only trying to be helpful by digging up the game info garbage, and talking to Jimmy about this stuff; I wish this would be slightly better recieved. If I angered you I am sorry.

anthony691 · « **Reply #23 on:** March 05, 2003, 07:26:14 am »

Oh, and as for the aradevga question check out act-labs Pc lightgun forum (I think there is a post that will be very helpful on this topic) There have been pretty good results using the plain old PC USB Light Gun!

rampy · « **Reply #24 on:** March 05, 2003, 08:57:45 am »

Hey Ant691,

I think part of the problem is that you are using blanket statements and backing them up with your "credibility" (i.e. I have a lightgun dedicated website (which is cool, BTW) and am an actlabs associate... I'm an amazon.com associate does that make me a book expert?)

In specific where is the backup on the current PC USB (VGA varient) guns hypothetically not being upgradeable to 2 guns, and where does it state that its a "hardware" issue. I'd just like clarification. I'd settle for a link to a "Jimmy" post on the actlabs board that stated as such. (Don't Jimmy, me jules!)

In this forum, we are all (or a good portion) very excited about Act Labs PC light guns and have spent time in money with many crappy light guns (including act labs usb one=P) trying to get 2 guns to work simultaneously... So you have an eager audience here for this type of news... but that doesn't mean we're naive or don't believe everything we read on the internet.

What you say may be true (and most of us hope it is - except for the existing usb gun not being "upgradable" to 2 gun action) but you didn't pass what you said off credibly... because of the way in which you said it... *shrug* I'm sorry if you got a shite storm outa this, but I can see how that happened.

Good luck

rampy

Siris · « **Reply #25 on:** March 05, 2003, 12:00:14 pm »

Hello Dak-ak,

You can see a pic of the USB version of the gun and VGA pass-thru box here:

http://www.geocities.com/ld_mame/gun.html

The exact measurements are as follows:

VGA cable is 15"
USB cable is 28"
Gun cable is 78"

In my opinion the VGA cable should be a little longer.
I also am under the impression that there is no reason that they can't make a 2 player VGA model if they can do it on the TV version.
If they do plan on one and haven't mentioned it I will be a little upset since I just bought this one. :/

Anyway, I do have more clearer closeup pics of all the wiring that I can put up if there is any interest.

Dr. J · « **Reply #26 on:** March 05, 2003, 02:38:05 pm »

Siris was the "first come, first served" about my offer to send my guns for shipping (yes, I was serious). So, everyone can ask him in a week or so what he thinks of the pc virtual gun, and the older actlabs gs gun system.

I didn't intend to be accusatory or insulting in my earlier post. Everyone knows how expensive this hobby can become. I've spent a lot more than expected. The only time I become really disappointed and even mad is when a product doesn't deliver. This board is about keeping others from making mistakes I've made.

I really will be excited if the 2 player support is coming, but I'm going to be doubtful until they either post it on their site or send me an email. I've received several emails from them concerning their upcoming guns, as I am probably one of their worst nagging customers when it comes to this. I've been pushing them for duel gun support and trying to get them to look at U_rebelscum's work for quite a while now.

Also, I am sorry if I was rude. I just started a forensic pathology rotation on Tuesday and witnessed some extremely disturbing stuff involving children, and I may have used this thread as a whipping boy. My apologies for any insult.

Lilwolf · « **Reply #27 on:** March 05, 2003, 03:00:15 pm »

hehe, Howard, I think that was the nices slam I've ever seen from you... Not even a hint of namecalling, just a logical response..

I think you need to change back to the shining icon... you seem to nice with the new one

lightspeed · « **Reply #28 on:** March 05, 2003, 03:22:57 pm »

Can someone please clarify this thread?

Has AL suggested that 2-player guns are coming, or not? That seems to be only heresy based on a discussion in a forum. I can't see where on their actual site they actually mention it.

anthony691 · « **Reply #29 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:30:09 pm »

Jimmy (an Act-Labs emplyee) has said in thier forum that it will be 2 player. You can check it out, there is a link earlier in this thread. As for saying I was an assciate that was only to show that with any honesty I like the gun. IN FACT IF YOU WANT TO KNOW, JUST SEE FOR YOURSELF! Just jump into thier forum, it is one of their only posts. And frankly I think I larger userbase there would be nice. So go check it out! It is not hearsay; just go take a look

Oh, and I have no beef w/ anyone here, and can see how hard it would be to believe this.

Lilwolf · « **Reply #30 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:35:52 pm »

btw, they COULD EASILY create a 2 player version of the PC without software changes....

make hardware ones!

If they sold another PC USB lightgun that worked along with the other one (like the current one, but it doesn't store the mouse click location in teh same place) it would be GREAT!

anthony691 · « **Reply #31 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:36:31 pm »

In fact, the link is in reply #5

anthony691 · « **Reply #32 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:39:03 pm »

There is a new post by another AL admin, they have gone into production!

rampy · « **Reply #33 on:** March 05, 2003, 04:56:37 pm »

Quote from: anthony691 on March 05, 2003, 04:36:31 pm

In fact, the link is in reply #5

You might want to try the "reply with quote" function as I have no idea who you are replying to.

I've seen that link... I've browsed the actlab forum... and no where did I see anything about "hardware" and limitations on the original usb pc vga guns.

I am glad to see (thanks for pointing it out) that the TV usb guns will be going into production... (although I don't need one). Kudos for them promising simultaneous gun action for tv version.

I'm still skeptical though:

here's what jimmy said

Quote

The first new feature is a two-player mode which will allow two PC TV Light Guns to be used in two-player supported games. We are trying hard to get two-player support on MAME. The second feature is auto-fire. Only games such as Terminator 2 and Operation Wolf (for MAME), which support auto-fire, will work with this new feature.

which makes me wonder about their approach to getting 2 person support. i.e. the bad old days of having very specific drivers only put in to certain games (which may be a reason it's not easily incorporated/added into mame)... *shrug* but what do I know.

I'm looking forward to dualie gun action (whenever/however it comes) but i'm not going to become a fanboy and just swallow whatever actlabs says without quesitoning it...

in fact - I'm going to bop over and question it =P

rampy

Dr. J · « **Reply #34 on:** March 05, 2003, 05:17:12 pm »

As much as I have my hopes up, notice the phrasing: "We are trying hard to get 2-player support on MAME." Read as: "We don't have it yet, but we're trying."

anthony691 · « **Reply #35 on:** March 05, 2003, 05:22:17 pm »

Yeah Dr. J, but I don't think they would get our hopes up all for not. They are pretty honest! A new post says that they went into production and if you want to up your pre-order to 2 gun they can do it. This gives me the impression they mean sooner rather then later, and that they 2 player would be official so there would be support ect.

Howard_Casto · « **Reply #36 on:** March 05, 2003, 07:23:51 pm »

just to clarify u_rebelscum has already gotten the guns to work in two player mode in windows 98 (via analog mame of course).

This proves to me that it's a software problem. However the "software" that's at fault is the windows operating system itself so xp and 2000 support is still gonna be tough if not impossible.

rampy · « **Reply #37 on:** March 05, 2003, 07:53:41 pm »

Quote from: Howard_Casto on March 05, 2003, 07:23:51 pm

just to clarify u_rebelscum has already gotten the guns to work in two player mode in windows 98 (via analog mame of course).

wa-wa-wa-what!? Did I miss a thread?

I know its been made to "sorta" work before, is there something new I missed?

Rampy

anthony691 · « **Reply #38 on:** March 05, 2003, 07:57:23 pm »

I know about U_rebelscums good work (keep it up

)! ACT-LABS HAS LAUNCHED THIER NEW SITE! How much is going to happen all the while we discuss this? They have STILL not made my corrections to thier gamelist (one of them being Hit 'n Miss 2 dosn't exist there is only a revision; and the rest being updates) They repeatedly said that when they updated the site that they would fix this. Also note that thier forum was down as of 6:48 when i worte this post

anthony691 · « **Reply #39 on:** March 05, 2003, 08:05:54 pm »

And I qoute thier new Gun Systems page's description "TV USB LIGHT GUN
This one is for all our loyal MAME supporters out there. PC USB Light Gun with TV output and two-player support. Enjoy!" That seems like a pretty official statement! Note that the in-depth description made no mention of this. I sorta liked thier site better before...


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