help with game list for dedicated 4 way joystick only cabinet

[hulkster]

okay, so im building a cab for this girl at work.

[Veinman]

This might help you:

http://fe.donkeyfly.com/controls/gamesbycontrol.php#top

I found it to be very handy.

[BSR]

That is an impressive list she gave you for not being an arcade junkie. It has a whole slew of genre with very recent games and early classics. Plus, it includes unMAMEd prototype "Beavis and Butthead" and Dumping Project: Most Wanted "Noah's Ark".

Of the games on the list which are actually playable within MAME, you shouldn't have too much trouble using a four way joystick and a few buttons.
Going down the list:
Frogger
Pac-Mac
Ms. Pac-Man
Donkey Kong
Galaga
Dig Dug
Qbert
Space Invaders
Galaxian
Congo Bongo
The above all used (2way)/4way joysticks with alternating player controls, so no problem here.

Tron would be unplayable with just a 4way, but the trigger and spinner could be simulated with a few buttons.

Joust and Mario Bros. would be fine as long as you didn't do two player games, or if player2 didn't mind using buttons for left and right.

Centipede and Missile Command could be made playable using a joystick, but really need a trackball.

Jungle Hunt and Vanguard need an 8way for full control, but would still be playable with a 4way (same goes for the rest of the 8way games).

For games like ET, which I'm assuming is the 2600 version and not the unfinished arcade prototype, MESS or some other Atari emulator would be needed.

[Kremmit]

...spinner could be simulated with a few buttons.

Nope.

[BSR]

...spinner could be simulated with a few buttons.

Nope.

I know It it wouldn't be ideal, but if you're dead set on playing Tron with only a 4way and a few buttons it could be made playable.
First button would be rotate left, second would be trigger and third would be rotate right.

[Kremmit]

If you call that playable.   

[BSR]

And by 'playable' I mean retains a level of fun and ability to play somewhat competitively (make the highscore board).
With the above setup I'd be able make Fortran. It's the lightcycles I have the most trouble with and they don't even use a spinner.

[paigeoliver]

Here, this is the list of true 4-way vertical list with 2 buttons or less. This game is edited to remove clones, and pseudo-clones (like Crazy Kong), and non-working games, and a couple things that are just complete defective garbage (40-Love).

If you are doing a 4-way cabinet then you will want a vertical cabinet.

Ali Baba and 40 Thieves
Amidar
Anteater
Armored Car
Astro Blaster
Astro Fighter
Astro Invader
Bagman
Balloon Bomber
Black Hole
Burger Time
Carnival
Cavelon
Checkman
Circus Charlie
Commando
Congo Bongo
Cosmic Guerilla
Cosmos
Crush Roller
Dazzler
Defend the Terra Attack on the Red UFO (bootleg)
Devil Fish
Dig Dug
Dig Dug II
Disco No.1
Donkey Kong
Donkey Kong 3
Donkey Kong Junior
Dream Shopper
Eyes
Faster Harder More Challenging Q*bert (prototype)
Frogger
Galaga
Galaxian
Galaxy Wars
Gals Panic
Guzzler
Heiankyo Alien
Intrepid
Invader's Revenge
Invinco / Head On 2
Joust 2 - Survival of the Fittest
Jr. Pac-Man
Jump Coaster
Jumping Jack
Jungler
Kicker
King & Balloon
Lady Bug
Lasso
Levers
Lock'n'Chase
Loco-Motion
Logger
Lunar Rescue
Mappy
Marvin's Maze
Mikie
Minky Monkey
Monster Bash
Moon Alien Part 2
Moon Quasar
Mr. Do!
Mr. Do's Castle
Mr. F. Lea
Mr. Jong
Mr. TNT
Ms. Pac-Man
Mysterious Stones
Naughty Boy
New Rally-X (Vertical)
Ozma Wars
Pac & Pal
Pac-Man
Pac-Man Plus
Pengo
Pickin'
Pisces
Pleiads
Pooyan
Pop Flamer
Pulsar
Q*bert
Q*bert's Qubes
Qix
Return of the Invaders
Roc'n Rope
Route 16
SWAT
Samurai Nihon-ichi
Satan's Hollow
Scrambled Egg
Sindbad Mystery
Solar Fox
Son of Phoenix
Space Invaders
Space Invaders Part II
Space Laser
Space Panic
Springer
Stratovox
Streaking
Super Bagman
Super Pac-Man
Super Space Invaders '91
Tank Battalion
The Electric Yo-Yo
The End
The Glob
Tomahawk 777
Tower of Druaga
Triple Punch
Van Van Car
Warp & Warp
Wiping
Zzyzzyxx

There are also some decent horizontal games that stretch to vert well. Like Moon Patrol. And then there are some games like Zoo Keeper and Tapper which look bad stretched, but look decent letterboxed.

[BSR]

I had been going through the lists of 4way and 8way games and have noticed some discrepancies.
For instance, the control.dat project has a Bagman and Super Bagman listed as 4way.
I recompiled Mame, restricting the game to 4way control with PORT_4WAY. At first the game seemed fine, but then I noticed it became nearly impossible to make the turns to the point of being unplayable.

Can anyone confirm that Bagman does indeed use a four way joystick?

[paigeoliver]

Bagman uses a Wico 4-way allright. A wico 4-way can hit the diagonals in a tiny zone.

The problem is the idiot 8-way to 4-way predictor code in Mame. I would love to see that stripped out completely so you can just play the game with the proper controls.

After all, I thought Mame was about documentation, if it is about documentation then why does it have built in hacks to make the games the Mamedevs THINK are 4-way more playable with an 8-way stick.

As for your particular issue, are YOU indeed using a 4-way joystick?

Also, if you have a real 4-way then there is no reason to custom compile all the mame mistakes to the proper 4-way sticks (as all that does, iirc, is activate improper blocking code).

[BSR]

I only have an 8-way Wico, so I can't test. From what you're saying a 4-way Wico will still hit the corners partially.
MAME's PORT_4WAY simply makes it impossible to hit corners, which in some cases it is a good thing.

I was going over the manual for Nibbler. It clearly states that the game uses a four way joystick. It cautions that "no two switches should make [contact] at the same time as this will interfere with the direction 'Nibbler' travels". It also suggests bending them back to ensure this is so.

Nibbler is currently set to 8-way in MAME. I recompiled Mame with the PORT_4WAY and my high scores instantly doubled.

It seems there are two classifications of 4-way games. The ones were hitting a diagonal is benign and the others where it will temporarily lock up the controls.

[Kremmit]

MAME's PORT_4WAY simply makes it impossible to hit corners, which in some cases it is a good thing.

But that's not all it does.  When your stick hits a corner, Mame's software 4-way restriction tries to guess which direction you meant to hit, and goes there, which in some cases is a bad thing.

[BSR]

I'm not sure why it seems everyone is sour about MAME's 4-way restriction. If you are using a joystick with a 4-way restricter, then it shouldn't be an issue (should it?).

If I remember correctly, one of the main reasons it was added was because with Kung-fu Master it was difficult to execute a flying jump kick with 8-way controls. It might have also had something to do with the steadykey command (another hack).

Are there any games currently set to PORT_4WAY in MAME which don't perform well with 4-way joysticks?

Any PORT_4WAY games that will perform better with 8-way controls and set to PORT_8WAY?

[Kremmit]

I'm not sure why it seems everyone is sour about MAME's 4-way restriction. If you are using a joystick with a 4-way restricter, then it shouldn't be an issue (should it?).

If you are using a physically restricted 4-way stick, then it won't matter, no. 

The problem comes in when you are using an 8-way.  Then, MAME's software restriction will "guess wrong", and PacMan dies.  I'm not saying it's a totally bad thing, it may work better than it would without the restriction code, just that it isn't a CURE for the problem.

[Tiger-Heli]

I'm not sure why it seems everyone is sour about MAME's 4-way restriction. If you are using a joystick with a 4-way restricter, then it shouldn't be an issue (should it?).

If you are using a physically restricted 4-way stick, then it won't matter, no. 

The problem comes in when you are using an 8-way.  Then, MAME's software restriction will "guess wrong", and PacMan dies.  I'm not saying it's a totally bad thing, it may work better than it would without the restriction code, just that it isn't a CURE for the problem.

I replied to this in this new thread: http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,36396.0.html , so we can move 4-way restriction code discussion there.