New Product: 49-Way USB Interface - The GP-Wiz49 with DRS Technology (TM)

[Kremmit]

Have you tried 720 degrees with the 49-way?

That could be interesting.  I know they put code in mame to convert analog stick to spinner.   Someone will have to try.

See, Randy, another thing I predicted.  You should hire me!

Quote from email from myself to RandyT, for those interested in 49way to 720 stick conversion:

> >  Also, I've
> > got a crazy idea I've been working on to make a
> > Williams 49-way into a 720 joystick, but it would
> > require a custom grid mapping.  I was planning to
> > contact Dave about this, but...
>
> Tell me what you are after.  Maybe I can hook you up
> ;-)

Well, the real 720 uses a stick that's really a
spinner on the bottom.  Older versions of MAME used a
spinner for the 720 controller, but since 0.85, it's
mapped to the joystick instead.  In the game, the
skater can skate in 16 discreet directions, and the
MAME code allows all 16 if you're playing with an
analog stick.  While a true analog 255x256 grid gives
you a better mapping for the 16 directions, a fair one
can be made from the outside ring of boxes on the
49-way grid.  Maybe some from the middle ring of boxes
in the corners, as well.  That would get 720 playing
pretty well for anyone using a Happ or Williams 49
way.  Might be worth checking out during your testing,
as it adds one more function to your product. (hint,
hint)

People using a Williams stick can take it further: If
you remove the spider from a Williams 49-way, there's
no resistance on the stick, so it would "spin" around
the outside of it's circular restrictor freely.  And
if you want to go even further, the skinny part of the
shaft at the bottom where the spider attaches could be
fit to a lower restrictor assembly that forces the
stick to stay to the outside.  There might be ways to
implement these with a Midway 49, I dunno, as I don't
have one of those.

Of course, it may prove a total failure, too.  It's
just an idea I've been toying with for a while now.

[NoOne=NBA=]

It's a possiblility with the William's stick, but the Happ is probably a no-go.
It uses a grommet like the original Pac-sticks, and you'd be fighting it the whole time, trying to keep it to the outside.

I've played 720 with a stock Saitek stick, and then removed the handle and centering spring on it.
Once the centering spring is gone, it works pretty well.
That lets the stick just kind of flop to the side, and stay at the perimeter while you use it.

I haven't used a Williams stick without the spider, but if it flops like that, no other modifications would probably be necessary to make it work well.

[RandyT]

Sounds like a cool idea, but I'm not sure the 49-way has the whatfor to pull it off.

There are 24 blocks on the outside ring so 16 won't go into it very well, and no real way to weight it one way or the other if it was necessary.

Sounds like job for analog 

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

72/24=3  So it might work well.  72 is the number of teeth the 720 disc had.

[RandyT]

72/24=3  So it might work well.  72 is the number of teeth the 720 disc had.

But wasn't that a geared spinner of sorts?  Not sure how that translates to stick positions.

Worth a look though.


BTW, The best I could get was 5 shifted buttons. How the heck does a shifted joystick button work you ask?

Well, in this case, buttons 9, 10, 11, 12 and 13 become buttons 24, 25, 26, 27 and 28 when the JoyMode Button is pressed.  This will let an individual set up special functions assigned to those upper button numbers without needing extra buttons on the panel for them (pause, config, exit, whathaveyou)

Everything is in final testing phase, but my Win2K box decided to drop dead on me this evening.  Dual processor boards are rough on power supplies 

RandyT

[Popcorrin]

I just wanted to throw in another vote for adding software mode shifting capability.  I for one would be willing to pay the extra money for it.

[RandyT]

I just wanted to throw in another vote for adding software mode shifting capability.  I for one would be willing to pay the extra money for it.

It will be considered/researched for a future version.

Thanks,
RandyT

[Kremmit]

Here's how I see the 16 directions being implemented.  Yup, the corners are heavy, but it's the best you can do with the limited resolution.  Besides, as Randy has been pointing out, the way it looks on a square grid is NOT likely to be the way it actually plays- maybe the corner situation will work itself out.   Anyway, it's something to look at.

[RandyT]

Here's how I see the 16 directions being implemented.  Yup, the corners are heavy, but it's the best you can do with the limited resolution.  Besides, as Randy has been pointing out, the way it looks on a square grid is NOT likely to be the way it actually plays- maybe the corner situation will work itself out.   Anyway, it's something to look at.

You might be on to something there....I think I can see a possibility with a little more massaging....

RandyT

[Xiaou2]

 While you might be able to do it  (49 to 720)...  think about the play mechanics...

  In 720,  you have to spin the controller arround very fast to do the tricks in the air before you land.   To do that with a 49 way would be nearly impossible at speed.   Esp with the added resistence and long throw that the stick has.
 
  In addition, I think the new-er 49ways are square restricted.  So... making circles fast with square limits will also be akward, clumbsy, and tiake more time to rotate.  (as well as possibly wearing the thing out really fast) (IE: play robotron seriously with a happs competition -vs- a true 8way leaf or a happs super.  The square vs round makes a tremendous difference)

 Finally.. your not going to want to try to remove the spider for 720.. then add it back to play a different game.   Actually, the new 49ers dont have a spider - so youd have to remove the spring.  Im not even sure this encoder work on the williams 49way spider sticks... as I recall something about them not being tested yet?  Maybe I misread..

 I realize that people want to save money and try to make things work... but... some of these ideas just wont pan out well mechanically.

btw - While my posts may be interpreted as randy bashing... its not like that.   I presonally think randys electrical knowlegde is genious. 

 I just do not agree with the control methods chosen.  These things can be realized by true testing - by a person that is good at a game, or has the desire to be good at the game and plays it till they are good. 

 IE:  One person may think robotron plays fine with dual competitions.  However.. that person may never have used true 8way wico leafs.

 Upon trying a wico leaf... still might not realize the differnces without something to compare with right away.   Because not good at the game.... nor the interest to invest the time needed to be decent at it... may never really see a need or true difference to justify buying a leaf joy or changing thier opinion. 

 However...In a side by side comparison... he may more easily realize the great differnces in feel, control, and playability... because they are
so close, thus not having to rely on memmory.. but rather instant comparable feedback.

  There are some that may never get into robotron to get good at it.  Maybe play to level 5, and then turn it off and play newer games... so dont really care.   Its sad, because with just a little more effort into it... and they would find a new level of addication.   

 However... without the propper sticks... many will not have the desire to play it for long... because they will die too easily with the impropper sticks.    Again... very sad indeed.

 Which is again, all based on mechanics.

  Which is why thiose controller were designed and choosen to be used for those games specifically.

  A comment was made about the durrability of a wico leaf and its poor design to use a rubber gromet that wasnt designed to handle the stressed....

  Firstly, when I was talking about well designed controls... I should have stated something like Atari.   Esp "race drivin" (sitdown)  Also, look at 720, starwars, tempest...and  many other awesome control designs.

 Next - wico - which wasnt an arcade manufactureer... but like happs, was a distributer. 

 Next... while some controls had flaws... such as the wicos cracking... that dosnt mean that they are inferior to some of the new sticks.   As some of the new sticks are so radically differnt as to not control as well.   

 Control or wear... id gladly take control, and replace wear when it happens.

 I think theres always room for improovments in the older designs... however, this rarely happens.   Its not easy to design a mechanical device that is long lasting and provides great control.  Its a true artform.

 

[Hoagie_one]

im really surprized no one has done a 720 stick repro yet

[NoOne=NBA=]

I have not.


And the Happs/Midway 49-ways are rubber grommet, and round restrictor.

[GGKoul]

im really surprized no one has done a 720 stick repro yet

I know someone that will sell you an NOS 720 joystick for $300+

[Hoagie_one]

ha, i never even liked the game that much

Here's a complete one on ebay, minus the monitor

[RandyT]

And the Happs/Midway 49-ways are rubber grommet, and round restrictor.

Right.  And if you mount them below a 3/4" panel with only a 1.125" hole, they are panel restricted.

If you want to mount a 49-way in 3/4" material, you'll need 1 3/8" to 1 1/2" hole diameter or the corners will be cropped.  Hitting the extreme corners isn't completely necessary for most things, but the 4-way DRS mode works especially well with certain games that focus on 4-way operation, with a little 8-way thrown in.   

BTW, when I started hearing people talk about removing the spider on a Williams stick to play 720, I got this really funny mental image of Xiaou2 in place of the American Indian in the anti-littering campaign commercials of the 70's

RandyT

[SirPoonga]

72/24=3

[Xiaou2]

BTW, when I started hearing people talk about removing the spider on a Williams stick to play 720, I got this really funny mental image of Xiaou2 in place of the American Indian in the anti-littering campaign commercials of the 70's

RandyT

   The more I think about such a comment... the more I feel offended.   Not so much as the pot shot to offer you personal satisfaction at my expense... 
(tho this shows how low a character you have)

 but rather,   First, to make fun of the indians is just the poorest tasting thing to do.   Esp for what had been done to them.

 to take that further... it could also appear to be a disregaurd for our enviornment.  And that is the very kind of thing that sets me off to no end.

  People have been knowingly destroying our enviornment for years... and no end is in sight.  In fact...  scientists words are finally starting to be heard.. but by now, it may be too late.   The evidence is there, that the global warming is changing our planet for the worst.   Soon, there will be disasterous consequences for all the permanent damages done.   And will there be people laughing then?!   

 Maybe you should take a second or two - to really 'Think' about the things you want to say and the true meanings behind them before they so effortlessly pop from your enter key.

 

[NoOne=NBA=]

It was a JOKE--and a pretty funny one at that.
Yes, it was at your expense; but it wasn't hurtful or demeaning.
If you can't laugh at yourself, who can you laugh at?
You are the most vocal person on this topic; and so, were the one he thought of when this came up.

He also wasn't advocating environmental destruction, nor making ANY comment whatsoever on the original content of the ad in question.
He was making a comparison.

He merely pointed out that you are (self-admittedly) frustrated by the current trend toward using improper controls on games, and were probably beside yourself at the suggestion that a joystick, in ANY form, could even be CONSIDERED as a possible replacement for the engineering marvel that is the 720 controller.

Given your reactions to earlier posts in this thread, that conclusion is probably not far off the mark, correct?
He was using a light-hearted jab at you to point this out because he found it personally amusing, and thought others might too.

[RandyT]

BTW, when I started hearing people talk about removing the spider on a Williams stick to play 720, I got this really funny mental image of Xiaou2 in place of the American Indian in the anti-littering campaign commercials of the 70's

RandyT

   The more I think about such a comment... the more I feel offended.   Not so much as the pot shot to offer you personal satisfaction at my expense... 
(tho this shows how low a character you have)

Oh, lighten up a bit.  NoOne=NBA= has it right.  It wasn't mean spirited "I wuz just pokin ya in the ribs a little with da elbow." 

but rather,   First, to make fun of the indians is just the poorest tasting thing to do.   Esp for what had been done to them.

 

Here's a fun personal fact for you:  My grandmother's middle name (rest her soul) was  "Silverbell".  Her mother was full-blooded American Indian and we often heard the story of the fiery, raven-haired woman she was, one time even going after great-grandfather with a hatchet (I wish I was making this up. )  From what I have been told, I am (just barely) by "blood content" permitted to live on a reservation.

And I remember feeling so sorry for that old guy when the stupid people threw trash at him.  Made me want to cry too (of course I was just a kid the first time I saw it)  It had to be one of the most effective ad campaigns ever, and it was pure genius in that, even to this day, people can make an obscure reference to it and others remember it.

to take that further... it could also appear to be a disregaurd for our enviornment.  And that is the very kind of thing that sets me off to no end.

  People have been knowingly destroying our enviornment for years... and no end is in sight.  In fact...  scientists words are finally starting to be heard.. but by now, it may be too late.   The evidence is there, that the global warming is changing our planet for the worst.   Soon, there will be disasterous consequences for all the permanent damages done.   And will there be people laughing then?!   

 Maybe you should take a second or two - to really 'Think' about the things you want to say and the true meanings behind them before they so effortlessly pop from your enter key.

And oddly enough, you made some pretty good assumptions about who was making those statements and the motivations behind them.  "Thinking" is something that's important for everyone to do, not just people you have a problem with.

I never made a single commentary on the validity of the sentiment of those commercials.  It was a pervasive cultural symbol that most of us saw a million times (maybe literally)  and it seemed somewhat apt given how strongly you feel about the subject at hand.

I mean, I like trees.  Without them, the little fuzzy animals would die off before I had a chance to eat them.....

(IT"S A JOKE!!!)

Anyway, any other topics we can cover in this thread?  Maybe Saint can set up a sub-board for it

RandyT

[Hoagie_one]

id like to talk more about tasty fuzzy animals

[u_rebelscum]

Just out of curiousity, what do you call the raw, err, data direct from the joystick, before it goes through your controller?  Maybe I could just use that and forget this whole raw/not raw part. 

I believe it is called an electronic "signal", which, btw, needs to be translated before it can become data

"raw signal" vs "Raw49^tm", fine I'll go with that, and stop pushing my opinion.  This is turning out to be one of those "it's emulated" vs "it's simulated" disagreements that matter little, but never end anyway.


Now to the real stuff:

So the translation still happens.  It's the translation I'm worried about, not who does it.

There's really nothing much to worry about.  Either it works, or it doesn't. In this case it does.

First you say the Wiz49 takes out this step, then you say wiz49 does the step for the computer, then you say it doesn't matter.  Actually, you've been saying it doesn't matter from the begining.   [cut-n-paste]The translation still happens.[/cut-n-paste] 

And since the computer has never done this step (not in official mame nor in mameAnalog+), your product is not removing it.  You even say below the computer can't understand this raw, err, original unmodified data.  Heck, the whole reason for your product is to do this step (unless in a different mode of course).

Well, yes and no.  The computer has been doing the analog stuff for quite some time. 

"doing the analog stuff"   Not the "stuff" I'm talking about (translate from 49-way's signal to analog).  I'll say it again: the computer has never, ever translated the 49-way output to an analog one, never; not on a sound card, not on the motherboard, not in a device driver, not in windows, not in mame, not in analog+.  (edit: sheeze, sam I am)  Otherwise we would not need your wiz49 or dave's SJC. 

Hmm, are you talking about normal gameport analog joysticks (which the computer does do "analog stuff"), instead of the specific 49-way joystick I'm talking about?  Well, yes, the computer did it for gameport joysticks, while USB joysticks do this step themselves, but the 49-way joystick is not a gameport joystick.

The interface steps along the analog range in the same manner the joystick actuates the sensors.  I have a hard time believing anyone responsible for writing the Analog to 49-way driver code in a game is going to screw it up so badly that it bears little semblance to the original hardware.

Of all the areas that mame make compromises, the most (IMO) is in the inputs.  (I'm bias about this, though) 

The analog to 49-way code was designed so (most of the) normal analog joysticks on most operating systems seem to work like (aka simulate) the original 49-way joysticks.  Much like with the new-ish analog to 720 input code, or dial to rotary codes.  (Note all of these are game specific, & part of the game drivers.) 

The analog to 49 codes work okay with most, but not all, analog joysticks: so no, mame did not screw up royally.  The question is "Is the wiz49 one that works, or not?" . . . .

Again, not only does it work, but my testing shows that it works properly in both 49-way modes.

Great to hear.  We agree that this is the most important part. 
The rest are details I'm interested in, think are mis-understood, or feel strongly about.

[u_rebelscum]

72/24=3  So it might work well.  72 is the number of teeth the 720 disc had.

But wasn't that a geared spinner of sorts?  Not sure how that translates to stick positions.

No.  There was a tension chain so the stick wasn't as free moving as a normal spinner.  The disc rotation was still 1:1.

Yes, the gears were just for resistance.  But the 72/24=3 fact can't be used unless mame is using the old dial input type.

[Kremmit]

Right.

[1UP]

All of this is totally meaningless until one of us can actually try it.  We're waiting, RandyT... 

[Flinkly]

yeah, what 1up said.  we've typed 7 pages of posts arguing for and against your product, trying to make it better, yada, yada, yada...

but when can we have this product you speak of?  for all we know, it doesn't even exist, and we've been arguing about nothin.

now i know that isn't the case, cause you wouldn't be that mean, but lets have it already. alright?  or the least you could do was to test quicker, or assure us it's commin soon at the least.

[RandyT]

yeah, what 1up said.  we've typed 7 pages of posts arguing for and against your product, trying to make it better, yada, yada, yada...

but when can we have this product you speak of?  for all we know, it doesn't even exist, and we've been arguing about nothin.

Now that would be classic.

But not even I am that diabolical.


In any case, here's an update.

You already know about the 5 shifted buttons, but that has been tested and seems to be ok so far.

A variation of Kremmit's 16-way mode has been implemented for a total of 8-modes now. (nuts, now I gotta make another icon.....)  There's only one way to implement this one, so testing with it is somewhat irrelevant.  It is what it is (could be great, could be so-so)  It's a freebie.

I received the Williams 49-way from Kremmit (thanks again) and am looking through the parts bin for a connector.  The pins and spacing are different than the Midway stick, so the floppy connector trick won't work with this one.  I don't know whether this has been brought up in the past, but it looks like a good source for connectors for this beast would be a dead AT power supply.  Think motherboard power connectors......

I have a couple of comments about this control.  The first is that it is the first joystick I have seen that looks like it was a major cost contributor to a machine.  The second is the odd behavior of the "spider" when in action.  It does something that I have a difficult time believing was intentional and tends to confirm the notion that the spider was created out of a need to avoid patent issues as much as to lend the particular feel to the joystick.

Strangely, it "pops" when you move the stick.  If you think of the spider as a rigid, but bendable member, you can imagine that something weird has to happen to the leg opposite the one being stretched.  The leg compresses as much as it can, but then "pops" to one side or the other as the bushing at the end allows it to spin.  Looking at what happens from the bottom of the stick, especially when pushed into the diagonal positions, tends to give one a little concern regarding accuracy as it actualy creates resistance in a random direction until the spider leg(s) "pop" out of the way.  The "physicists" must have missed that one, as even I can envision a spider shape where A) this wouldn't occur, and B) would eliminate the need for free-spinning bushings at the end of the legs.

So, it should be an interesting test.  I'll keep everyone updated on the progress.

RandyT

[NoOne=NBA=]

The "physicists" must have missed that one

I wonder if that isn't due to the age of the joystick.

What I'm thinking is that the spider, as manufactured 20+ years ago, was probably stretched in all four directions; and has since permanently stretched, and taken a bit of a set.
As manufactured, my guess is that it wasn't NECESSARY for those legs to spin around like that, they probably just contracted.

This is all conjecture because I haven't seen the workings of an aged Williams stick, much less a brand new one 20 years ago.

[Flinkly]

huh...i've got a williams, and i can see what your talkin about.  i'm an engineer, so we talk about this kinda stuff alot, like presstressed concrete.

so in fact, with the spider off, it would be alot smaller, than when placed on the stick, so one would have to stretch it out already to put it on.  the only problem i see with this, is that you'd already have to stretch it to put it on, but then you'd have to stretch the leg even more by going in the opposing direction.  might be too much stretch.  all that aside, i've never seen a new one either, so i have no idea.  but it does sound like a good idea.

[RandyT]

The "physicists" must have missed that one

I wonder if that isn't due to the age of the joystick.

What I'm thinking is that the spider, as manufactured 20+ years ago, was probably stretched in all four directions; and has since permanently stretched, and taken a bit of a set.
As manufactured, my guess is that it wasn't NECESSARY for those legs to spin around like that, they probably just contracted.

This is all conjecture because I haven't seen the workings of an aged Williams stick, much less a brand new one 20 years ago.

I was curious about the effects of age on the stick as well.  However, this one is in very nice condition.  Not a crack, tear or sign of wear on the spider.  If it was stretched to the degree where it would make a difference, there should be some small sign of visble wear.

I could be wrong, but I don't believe the spider was stretched to the point where the throw of the stick wouldn't necessitate it's bending out of the way.  Once it compresses (it doesn't take much) it has no choice but flex out.  And it's not just a little.  That leg has to become a full .500" shorter at the full distance of the throw.

The fact that the engineers intentionally made the ends of the spider free-spinning, speaks volumes about the design.  They knew this happened and tried their best to account for it.  It would have been cheaper to use fasteners that immobilized the ends, but they put in machined pins with tiny e-clips so it could move.

Now, a good possibility is that this spider is actually in too good condition.  Perhaps after a couple weeks of abuse, it would find a bend direction that it "preferred" and the "pop" would be reduced or maybe even eliminated. 

As it is, I'm a little less than impressed with the way it functions.  I now have the code working for auto-detect of stick type and proper operation of both.  I'm really happy I was able to work with an actual Williams stick to do this as the "information" that is out there describing the differences in the signals between the two 49-way varieties is, well...flat out wrong.

Flinkly, you are dead on.  With that kind of static stress, the life of the spider, especially given the materials of the age, would have been much shorter.  Nowadays, with some of the cool silicones available, you could actually do something like this and it would probably hold up.  But not 25 years ago.


Current status....Finishing up.  Not happy with the effect the "pop" of the spider has on some of the modes. There is nothing that can be done to the mappings to account for this, so the project is getting wrapped up.  I think Williams stick users will still benefit a great deal from the way this interface operates, but they will need to consider the less than optimal centering mechanism when evaluating the overall performance of the combination.

RandyT

[Flinkly]

just a quick question randy cause i've got a williams, as i've stated numerous times, and i only got it to play sinistar and maybe arch rivals, but does the stick work like it's supposed to in the 49-way modes?  this is really all i'm worried about with the williams.  i'll probably end up getting to happs 49-ways to use in another panel for the 49-way modes as well as the others.

and when you say it auto detects, does that mean i can turn on my machine with the happs plugged in, and then after a bit i want to play sinistar, and plug in my williams (without restarting the whole system), will the interface detect the change on the fly?  or just on startup?

well randy, thanks again for such a cool product, and i'm sure it's gonna hold up to all the hype.  now i''m just waiting to see what people say when they get them loaded up and working...

[Xiaou2]

 Just a quick note...   

   The many sinistar sticks out there most likely have the Repo'd rubber centering x.

 I know for sure that they are a different material... however,  theres no telling if they are the right lengh  (maybe he molded an already stretched out one),  or the right flexibility and tention.    Which may lead to inaccuracy.

 
 

[Hoagie_one]

while we are adding features, why not add a 12 way mode so we can play guerilla war\ikari\etc etc

[Daniel270]

I'm not sure where I remember reading it, but wouldn't rubber bands possibly work as replacement "spiders"?

[mahuti]

12 Way would require spinning functionality not inherent in the mechanics of a 49 way stick.


*edit; typo correction

[Kremmit]

I'm not sure where I remember reading it, but wouldn't rubber bands possibly work as replacement "spiders"?

I've seen where somebody did that- but it's not necessary, since Spidermonky posted this 3 pages back:
Replacement Spiders For Sale!

BTW, I don't believe the spiders on the stick I sent Randy are repros.  I got two from an Arch Rivals kit that looks like it was never installed before the operator put it in storage.  Anybody want an Arch Rivals Boardset & stuff?

Randy- thanks for adding the 16-way setup, hope it works well!

[Kremmit]

I received the Williams 49-way from Kremmit (thanks again) and am looking through the parts bin for a connector.  The pins and spacing are different than the Midway stick, so the floppy connector trick won't work with this one.  I don't know whether this has been brought up in the past, but it looks like a good source for connectors for this beast would be a dead AT power supply.  Think motherboard power connectors......

Looks like Lilwolf beat you to the AT power connector trick:

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,20716.0.html

[paigeoliver]

The Williams' sticks do the actual 49-way action perfectly with the SJC, so I assume they will also do this perfectly with the new encoder as well.

[SirPoonga]

while we are adding features, why not add a 12 way mode so we can play guerilla war\ikari\etc etc

What mahuti said.

People get confused by this terminology.

2way, 4way, 8way means the directions the joystick can only have 4 or 8 directions.  up/down/left/right for 4way, include diagonals for 8way.

12 position rotory josystick is a mechanical rotory joy that has 12 "clicks" in order to rotate the joystick 360 degrees.  They are 8way joysticks that can rotate.  There'd 12 rotated positions.  In fact, optical rotories are just a 8way joystick ontop of a spinner.
It's actually 12 position, not 12 way.  Most people will call the 12 position rotory a mechanical rotory, and the optical verion optical rotory.

49way joys are just as described here, there's a grid of optics that detects where the joystick was.  It was a cheap simple way to have psuedo low resolution analog type joystick.  For games like Arch Rivals you trigger the first optics while pushing left your character will walk, the next optic your character will jog, the 3rd optic your character will run.

[Grasshopper]

Getting back to the issue of mode switching through software, I've been thinking about this a bit more and I don't think it would be essential to upload data to the device.

If I understand correctly Raw49 mode simply takes the X/Y values of the joystick and scales them up to the number of bits that HID devices use to represent analogue values (I might be simplifying a bit).

It should be possible to write a simple driver that would reverse this process to get back to the original grid position and then convert that position through software to one of the seven modes available. If writing a Windows (or Linux?) driver is too much work (I'm assuming DOS is out of the question as this is a USB device) then I'm sure someone here could come up with a hacked version of MAME that did the same thing.

I apologise if someone else here has already come up with this idea, but this thread is getting too long to read!

One further thing, someone suggested earlier in the thread that the 49 way sticks have a square restrictor plate. Can someone confirm whether this is true? This bothers me a bit because I think this idea will only work if the 49 way joysticks have circular restrictor plates.

[NoOne=NBA=]

Getting back to the issue of mode switching through software, I've been thinking about this a bit more and I don't think it would be essential to upload data to the device.

You're not really uploading data.
You are changing the way the device operates.

It should be possible to write a simple driver that would reverse this process to get back to the original grid position and then convert that position through software to one of the seven modes available.

Yes, but in doing so, the device itself is no longer doing the conversions externally.
This means that the computer now has to interpret EVERY command it is given.
The nice thing about this device is that it is capable of outputting DIGITAL signals.
Having a program that would do a post input D-A conversion, would completely bypass this system.

I think that any time spent on a "driver" for this would be better spent rigging external programming software, that would trigger the device to switch modes.
This would require only ONE input from the software, and wouldn't require the computer to perform any conversions DURING the game.

One further thing, someone suggested earlier in the thread that the 49 way sticks have a square restrictor plate. Can someone confirm whether this is true?

The Happ's sticks are rubber grommet/round restrictor.