the story, of the worst time in my life

[Sephroth57]

Well, i dont know why im posting this here really. I guess its because im sitting here at work thinking about it, and all my RL friends on my AIM list have all heard it and well i dunno... basicly, the last 3 weeks of my life have been the longest, and most unpleasant days of my exsistance on the earth. Where to start, maybe some backstory, well im 20, 21 in july.. and ive been going out with the same girl, Kristen, for about 3.5 years. we started going out junior year, we broke up in the summer that year after about 5 months. At first i was like whatever just another HS girlfriend. and then after not having her for a while i realized i really missed her, she was dating some loser guy, he was totaly rebound food and she even admitted it to me, so anyway basicly broke them up and she ended up going back out with me in december.

 we were now seniors. it was good times, we graduated high school together. she went to college about 40 min from where we lived and she stayed in the dorms there, all girls school. and i tried doing the college thing at a county college cause i was never into school really, I ended up ditching college after a few months, i kept skippin classes not doing homework, i wasnt into it. so anyway, no big deal. I got a job working for my moms, friends, husband who ran a buisness out of his house, hes contracted by Honeywell and we do all their project management for the products side, which is where i still work now.

Soo fast forward, we just had our 3rd christmas with each other and we never broke up at all during this time, wed have fights now and then over stupid crap but who doesnt. Lately i did notice she was very moody and easy to get mad, i figured probably cause school is stressin her out, shes working at the same time, its tough for her. Well 3 weeks ago, were hanging out and this is the last day of her school break, we had been hanging out all week together. she says she thinks we need a "break" just some time apart so she can think cause shes been unhappy lately. so im pretty upset with this but im like ok whatever, i wasnt thinking this was a huge deal. so we never really set terms i just brought her home i said i would call her at school the next day, i figured we prolly just wouldnt hang out for a week or 2, keep talking on the phone to a minimum.

its kind of all a blur to me right now, but sometime during the week maybe tuesday, were talkin on the phone and shes like i dont think we should go out. im like why wtf, and at this point im not even sure on the whole point of this we were still kind of barely talkin cause shes been busy at school. so im like whoa this is getting way out of hand i need to figure out wtf is goin on. so i go up there that night to talk to her in person cause im like freakin out now. so i went up there and she basicly explained shes been unhappy for a while, and shes been trying to just deal with it and see if maybe it went away but apparently it didnt.

so basicly, shes just been bothered by things i was doing/not doing. over like the past6 months, maybe more. and she just decided not to tell me. like we would have stupid fights over little things like she got out of work early during the week and i could come drive up and see her for like 4 hours but i didnt feel like goin up there just for a little bit when i was gonna see her on saturday all day. just dumb stuff like that i could easily change, and really its not like shes asking me to change all these things its like things normal people do anyway, im just generally a very pessimistic, not really mean but like uncaring person, she was really the only person i truely cared about. i barely talk to anyone in my family.

so she explains all this and im like look just give me a chance i will do whatever you want this is mostly my fault for not doing this stuff in the first place. and shes all confused, what if i change but then it wears off and we go back to the same stuff in 2 months, or what if i change and shes still unhappy or something. and im like i know i can make you happy you just need to give me a chance, but shes really afraid to just give in, shes not sure what she wants shes 21, shes just come to the realization that for the past 3 years all shes known is me, she doesnt know how to take care of herself, etc. she wants to make sure she can be independant first. and all this BS, so theres really nothing i can say to change her mind so im like all ---fouled up beyond all recognition--- up i feel like im going to vomit. she said she still wants to talk to me on the phone everday and still hang out on the weekend she still needs me in her life. she just doesnt want the "title" , she has so much stress and worrying about me is just another thing. and she said shes sorry that sounds really selfish, but shes devoted herself to me for so long she thinks she owes it to herself.

I truely understand the phrase, hindsight is always 20/20. cause i look back at how i was always happy pretty much, and i just thought hey i got a happy life i never really have any problems. and i realize she was doing so many things for me all the time i was so used to it, i didnt even realise a lot of it was because of her. and really there were lots of times i was not as understanding or caring as i should have been, and its like i didnt notice, but she didnt tell me. maybe she shouldnt have to tell me, but im not a normal person and she knows that. i think its really mutual fault here and she agrees, her not telling me was terrible and mainly the cause of this all happening, and me not knowing in the first place and being how i was was also the cause.

so here i am, 3 weeks ago yesterday was the sunday she said we should have a "break", which turned into breakup. everyday all i can do is think about her, i usually have like mon-thursday to myself, i go to work, go home and then hang out with friends, do whatever. and then friday she comes home and im with her usually all the way until she goes back up to school on sunday. so now theres half of my usual week, gone. we still hang out but she tries not to devote as much time to me, shes been picking up more hours at work so shes more busy and doesnt have to think about this so much and since shes busy theres no way we could hang out so she doesnt have to turn me down if i ask.

but weve been hanging out 2 days a week, sometimes 3. the past 2 weeks ive been showing her how i can change and ive been doing all these sweet things for her, and i know shes not going to respond like OMG youre so great, but she smiles and i know she likes it in a way. but last night we hung out and she said she really doesnt want me to keep doing things like that for her cause it makes her feel bad. and how is she going to miss me if i dont give her a chance, i guess maybe i was coming on too strong. but im used to this girl being my best friend there was no taboo between us we told each other everything and nothing was out of bounds. we still are best friends, i feel like she is my best friend in the world, she knows more about me than anyone, even my closest guy friend ive had since 7th grade. but she wants us to still hang out, but just friends. when we hung out the past couple times we get kind of cuddly like if were watching a movie or something and sometimes we hold hands just out of habit. but she tries not to do that cause she doesnt want to like lead me on. Right now, she doesnt want to go back out, she says she really just needs time. and i understand that. i told her one of my biggest fears and one of the reasons ive been maybe coming on too strong is because im scared shes gonna go meet some other guy or something. and she said its nothing liek that, as cliche as it sounds its not you , its me. she knows i can change for her, and she appreciates that i love her that much to do that. but she needs to like find herself. she doesnt want a relationship, she is still sorting out ours. and she assured me i dont have to worry..  so that made me feel a little bit better. she said if i want i can hang out with other girls do whatever, she wouldnt be offended. she really said she would prefer if i did she wants to see if she would get jealous or not. and at first i was like well are u just saying this so u can do the same, and she said no absolutely not. and i belive her i know her more than anyway, so dont get the wrong idea on that. and shes not a typical girl shes not "testing" me. but really im not into that idea im so in love with her i dont see other women as even the slightest bit appealing.

her plan is we should just keep talking, keep hanging out, she knows that she needs me in her life. and if something happens, it will happen, and we can try starting over. but she just doesnt want to like lead me on or get my hopes up by saying ya know just give me time and i will try again. shes just really confused right now.

so basicly, right now all i can think about is her. i cant even play videogames. i brought my Xbox to a LAN party like 3 weeks ago right before this happened, its still sitting in the bag cause i havent even felt like playing. things that normally occupy me dont do it for me anymore, im so restless and bored all the time, cause all i can think about is her. i wait until the times i can call her i know she gets out of class and she tells me to call when she gets back to the room. during the week shes so busy with school/work we rarely talk for more then 5-10 min but just hearing her voice is worth it. and this week she had to pick up hours cause they fired 2 people so shes working almost all weekend, cept saturday. and shes working monday (vday) but still wants to see me that night after she gets off, she worked on purpose cause she didnt want me to take her out.


i dunon what the point of this is, i prolly left out lots of details and parts may be incoherent but... yeah. if you actually read all this youre either really bored or, i dunno a really nice person or something. im sure you will give me some kind of advice, people like chad tower will be like "dude just go bang some other girl" , im really trying to avoid those comments right now cause im really emotionally unstable so please keep that in mind. and try to remember, you cant explain why when youre in love you do things, or explain why youre even in love with someone else sometimes, its jsut a special feeling. its very illogical really when i sat and thought about it the other day...

[SirPeale]

I was a jerk to most of my girlfriends growing up, all the way up until I was about 23.  I really just didn't care.

Then I met this one girl, and she was the whole world.  But she ended up treating me like I was treating other women.

I thought it was the end of the world.  But it showed me that I should be more considerate of woman's feelings.

After than I met my wife.  We've been together nine years now.

[Sephroth57]

see like, ive had a revelation. im armed with all this knowledge. i see myself now, i see so many things. its like i have all this new stuff i know and i want to use it, to make her happy. i dont want this to turn into, well it made me learn all this stuff, so the next chick i met i ended up marrying. i want her, i love her...

[Apollo]

Dude I feel for you but you can't "make" anyone love you. It's like a chemical thing almost. I had a friend like yours and I ended up marrying her but only because I left her for 8 years and went to university and the travelled the world for four years. When I got back she had been seeing this guy for nearly 10 years. She dumped his sorry ass I moved in with her we got married 6 months later and our 10 year anniversary is in a couple of months. I'm not saying that this is what you should do but there is a lot of truth in the hackneyed old saying "if you love something let it go......". People want what they think thay can't have. If she thinks she can't have you maybe she will decide she wats you. Best thing you can do is see her less and get a girlfriend. Stop doing all these things for her and just be buds. Believe me it's your best and probably only option.

[shmokes]

Yeah...I come across probably as a bit of a knowitall, but I have some idea of how you feel.  I've been on both ends of similar situations. 

I think that most people do a great deal of changing from teens to twenties.  She is at college and, frankly, one of the best things about college is the opposite sex.  I wouldn't be surprised if she is looking around and saying to herself, "How do I really know if this is the guy I want to be with for the rest of my life when I've never been with anybody else since I was a kid."  This is especially likely, I think, if she has been unhappy lately, as you said.

But, looking at it from the outside, without the emotion that you are surely feeling, it appears that she is definitely trying to break up with you for real and not just "take a break".  When she says, "It's nothing like that," about wanting to date other guys she is saying it because she cares a great deal for you and it's difficult for her to cause you pain.  But she is trying to give herself an out, hoping that you will act on her permission to date other girls, thereby giving her implicit permission to start dating other guys.  She's also likely hoping that you will meet another girl you really like and won't care so much about losing her.

I'm really sorry for you, and expect that you have a great big empty spot inside that she used to fill.  That's how it was with me even when I was trying to get out of a bad, destructive long-term relationship.  I had been with this girl for two years, the first of which was fantastic.  Then she went kind of crazy and all these nutty insecurities came to the surface and our relationship became very unhappy due to jealousies and her being really unstable.  I broke up with her three different times and even though I wasn't happy with her, she had still become my whole life.  Time that used to be devoted to her now was idle.  Whenever I had interesting things on my mind that I would previously have told her, I didn't have anything to tell her.  I had drifted apart from many of my friends due to spending so much time with her (and I didn't have ANY female friends due to her being crazy insecure).  I felt really lonely and empty.  In fact emptiness is probably the best word I can think of to describe how I felt and how I suspect you feel. 

The best advice I can offer is to assume that this is permanent.  Try to feel your days up with activities to keep your mind off it, even if they feel hollow and cheap.  As you start to feel up the gaping whole she's left in the part of your heart that she has occupied for the last few years they will become less and less cheap and at one point you'll meet someone new, albeit with scar tissue that makes the heart permanently a little harder.  I'd suggest trying your hardest not to let the scarring cause you to keep your guard up too much to let someone get that close again.

As they say, better to have loved and lost....etc.

I may be wrong, but from an objective position of not knowing either of you and reading your story (even coming from the vantage point of someone who obviously wants to believe that it's not over), I'd say it's over.

I'm really sorry, and I'm sorry that surely doesn't make you feel one damn bit better.

[Shape D.]

dude your 20, way to young for a serious relationship.
I'd give you more advice but you stated you don't want it in your original post.





P.S. time may not heal all wounds, but the scars are at least harder to see.

[Grasshopper]

This is possibly the saddest post I've read on the BYOAC board. It struck a chord with me because I've been in a slightly similar situation before so I think I know a little about what you're going through. But of course it's different for everyone.

I think the others are right. It sounds like she is trying to break up with you without upsetting you. If you try to get too heavy with her at this point you risk losing her friendship. At least if you remain friends there is a chance that the flame may be rekindled at some point in the future. Maybe this is false hope, but I can't think of a better option.

Hope it works out in the end.

[Sephroth57]

i guess my post was a bit misleading, at first she said a "break". but then when i went up to talk to her she said we should "break up".  so were officially not going out, but were still very close friends. she said she needs time to calm down, and possibly she can trust me and try again but shes not saying i should wait for her. she just knows that im that stubborn and i will wait, so shes not trying ot get my hopes up or lead me on but she said if we stay friends for a little bit and i let her sort things out we might be able to start over again.

one of the reasons she didnt tell me, cause we would have dumb fights about like a specific incident or something and as a guy i argue my point and im like well thats why that happened blah blah, and try to make it like im right and youre upset over nothing. so she figured i would just blow it off like that, and i see her point i did do that too much..

maybe it seems desparate, or hopeless to some people. but unless youve been there you dont understand. im not trying to get over her yet, cause to me this whole thing isnt over. 3.5 years of time cant just end like that. i feel like this isnt how its supposed to go down,and maybe im just hanging on to a thread of hope but thats all i have right now. and i refuse to believe anything else right now

[Shape D.]

Ok heres the way women work. (I am generalizing I understand not all women are like this but most I have delt with are?

1) the more you want to spend time with them the less they care, stop haning out with her and don't answer her phone calls for a week. I bet she'll act differently.

2) women want something they cant have. become unavailable to her much like number 1.

3) never give in, its a sign of weakness. and they'll remember it forever.

4) dont be rude about avoiding her, If she somehow gets ahold of you just tell her youv'e been busy. (and dont elaborate on that)


I know some people will tell me this is full of crap, but don't knock it till you try it.

P.S.   chicks dig skulls

[Sephroth57]

i was thinking about that strategy... but its very risky =\

[shmokes]

There's a lot of truth to that stuff, I think.  Becoming unavailable is probably both your both the best way of getting her back (if that's possible) AND probably the best way of getting over her if ya'll just aren't meant to be.  I think you should take his advice.

edit:  except the part about the skulls.  chicks don't dig them, and in fact wonder why in hell guys dig them so much.   

[GGKoul]

Hey,

[Sephroth57]

yeah sitting around all day is really killing me it just gives me more time to mill over everything and feel like crap. tomorrow me and my friend are getting a gym membership im gonna start working out.. and i think im goign to start playing piano soon and take lessons..

[Apollo]

Chicks dig scars not skulls.

Don't call her.
 
When she calls you and wants to do something, at least once a week tell you're busy ( make up something that you have to do instead of seeing her ).

Don't do so much for her

Start a rumour that you are seeing someone really hot from the next town over from yours ( you met via email but have met in person and had great sex ).

Start a rumour that anyone she dates has a sexual disease or used to be a woman or listens to Ashley Spears ( anything will do )

Make sure she never finds out any of this stuff and if by some miracle you end up with her don't think sharing this stuff will bring you closer. She's more likely to dump your conniving game playing ass.
Basically if you carry on the way you are she is history dude, seriously. You have to have a major change in tactics.

[DrewKaree]

I've heard you speak about this before.

Ask anyone who's been married for a while - you each make sacrifices if you're going to be married for a while. 

The difference between that, and what you're speaking of is this (and again, ask...you'll see I'm right):  You're TRYING to change things and DO something to endear her to you.  If you guys are compatible, you don't have to TRY changing for that person, it happens unconsciously, and isn't something you have to DO, it's something that BECOMES part of you.

Making a conscious effort to change yourself to suit someone else's idea of what they want in a significant other is only a guarantee that one of you will become unhappy, either that you resent the changes forced upon you eventually, or that the other person finds other things you need to change in order for them to be happy, or else you do some of the things that they dislike (NO MATTER HOW SLIGHT THEY SEEM TO BE, OR IF YOU DON'T NOTICE/REALIZE IT), and they hold it against you.

Her wishing to "hang out, be friends, whatever" is simply trying to let you down easy, because she wants to alleviate the guilt of breaking up with you by offering you mythical things that will slowly subside over time.

For some reason, you're willing to do things and accept things that she does in an effort to obtain from her feelings she simply doesn't share or wish to reciprocate.

The harsh reality is - you've been dumped.

The harsher reality is - you are only serving to drive her further away, respect you less, and solidify her belief that breaking up with you is the right thing to do by continuing to hold out hope that you two will be able to work it out and get back together.

Continuing to fester on this is a recipe for disaster.  You've GOT to get out and DO something, make your life busy like she's trying to do.  In time, you'll look back and realize you've gotten over her.  You're the only person who can make yourself get up off the couch, though.

Buck up little camper 

[danny_galaga]

cheer up. i didnt even HAVE a girlfriend until i was 23! never even been kissed let alone f****d until then!! been making up for lost time since  and while you would get sick of hearing it, there are plenty more fish in the sea. as the led zeppelin song goes-

 'livin, lovin, she's just a woman...'

[APFelon]

No offense, but some of this advice is pretty lousy. Whether any of these "magic tricks" works all depends on the girl. I have had most of these tactics backfire on me and I was back in the hunt for a new girl soon afterwards.

There is no magic bullet aside from finding a way to comfort yourself and make this as least a painful process as possible.  Just remember that 50% of what happens to you is in your head, and when you are under emotional stress (like now) it is even more.

If I were in your position (and I am glad I am not; I got REAAAAALY sick of dating in my early 20s) I would just let her know that I'd be there for her and if I had a new girl when she is "ready" for me again, I'd be there for her as a friend. In the meanwhile, I'd get stinky drunk every night... wait, no. Just kidding.

Seriously, in the meanwhile use the time that you'd otherwise be spending with her to do some social stuff you otherwise would have put off. Call an old friend, get the buddies together for a poker night or just find something to do by yourself to get your mind off of it for a while. Go bowling or something by yourself and simply enjoy what you are doing.

From my experience, I'd say that it is almost impossible to manually heal a relationship by nagging, manipulating and whatnot. Let the familiar places, previous gifts and familiar songs do the work for you and hope for the best. If it doesn't work out, be prepared for that, too.

Good luck. I wouldn't take 100,000 dollars to be in your position again.

APf

[Bones]

Sh*t happens.

You now have two choices.

1) Learn from it, get over it, and don't make the same mistake again.
2) Dwell on it, let it consume you, become more depressed, let the situation beat you.

Ultimately the choice is yours. Both involve pain. This may sounds harsh but it is the cold truth. Stay away from the booze and green for a couple of weeks to clear your head. Alcohol is your enemy when you are not thinking straight and will most likely make the situation worse.

Suck it in dude. If it was meant to be it would have happened by now. Time to move on.

[danny_galaga]

No offense, but some of this advice is pretty lousy. Whether any of these "magic tricks" works all depends on the girl. I have had most of these tactics backfire on me and I was back in the hunt for a new girl soon afterwards.

There is no magic bullet aside from finding a way to comfort yourself and make this as least a painful process as possible.

[maraxle]

I've been in a situation like that before.  I was the same age, same amount of time with the girl.  I know how much it sucks. 

The best advice I can give you is this - stop torturing yourself.  Seriously.  Stop hanging out with her.  Stop trying to win her back.  Stop calling her.  Pack up all the pictures and love notes and whatnot in a box and stick them in the back of the closet.  You are just torturning yourself by being around her so much.  It's so not worth it. 

Go hang out with your real friends.  Go meet some new people.  Drink some beer with the boys.  Say "hi" to that pretty girl you've been passing at the grocery store.  Look into that college you were considering, but didn't go to because it was too far away from the girlfriend.  There's so much out there, and you've just been given your freedom to go explore it all.

[APFelon]

and what you've just said ISN'T some sort of magic bullet?

Did you trouble yourself to read what I wrote? I basically told him to comfort himself somehow while all of the stuff goes down. Is that a magic bullet like "play hard to get" or "treat her bad so she wants you back?"

Yeesh.

APf

[ChadTower]

Nyeh, I know Seph some, and there's some backstory to this.  He's a friend, but I'll be honest here.  She's in that point in her life where she's getting out of school soon, moving on with life for the career, etc.  Seph has shown no interest in getting an education, a career... he's not going anywhere.  Chicks don't want that guy who is too lazy to even go to community college because that guy's never going to progress any further.

It's lame sometimes, but that's just how it is.  I wouldn't want a chick who never developed some type of career or true independence after high school.  The way she sees it, Seph is one layoff away from being a Walmart employee and is doing nothing to change that.  I'm not saying he should go to MIT and study Astrophysics, but showing some type of ambition in life would have helped his case with her.

Refusing to drive 40 minutes to see her is a pretty serious message about how important she is to him and how lazy he can be.  40 minutes is nothing, some people spend that much time on the toilet.

Worst of all, now that she's trying to 'find herself' or whatever she calls it, she's using him.  She doesn't want him but won't break clean so he can do what's best for him.  He has the worst of it all, no commitment, no relationship, and yet she wants to have him around all the time to make her feel secure.  F%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%%CK THAT.

This is the kick in the ass Seph needs anyway.  Dude needs to get off his ass and go to school, or learn a real trade, or something that isn't one specific decent job with no hope of advancement/income improvement.  If he does those things, he will really help himself, and if she loves him she'll come back.  If he does those things, and she doesn't come back, she should be gone anyway.  Either way, he should do them because the distance between 20 years old and 30 is about 15 minutes long compared to 10 and 20.

Oh, and Seph, consider this.  If this is the worst thing that has ever happened to you, the worst time of your life, you've had a pretty charmed life to this point.

[ChadTower]

I was a jerk to most of my girlfriends growing up, all the way up until I was about 23.  I really just didn't care.

I hate that, specifically this whole concept.  I was the NICEST guy in high school.  I mean, I went out of my way to help people when it wasn't necessary.  When dating, I treated my dates like queens.  I was a total gentleman, raised by folks of the WWII generation and had manners noone in my age group had.

People constantly took advantage of me and screwed me over.  Girls especially, I would go out with a girl and treat her royally and it was always just a matter of time before they cheated on me with the A-hole.  Any a-hole.  They would then leave me for said A-hole, who would cheat on them, beat them, treat them like subhumans.  And this happened EVERY TIME.  I can't tell you how many times I heard you're hot but you're such a nice guy you're more valuable as a friend right before a girl would leave for a date with a guy who treated them like garbage.

So, to sum it up, by being an A-hole, you got all the girls I couldn't have by being an attractive, friendly, respectful gentleman.  You tell me who won.

[danny_galaga]

and what you've just said ISN'T some sort of magic bullet?

Did you trouble yourself to read what I wrote? I basically told him to comfort himself somehow while all of the stuff goes down. Is that a magic bullet like "play hard to get" or "treat her bad so she wants you back?"

Yeesh.

APf

yep. all of it cliches. yours, theirs, mine. although i must admit the worst cliche is the 'play hard to get' type. not something i would suggest either

[CCM]

Well,  I don't know Seph at all, but I have to lean towards ChadTower's assessment.  I don't think I would have put it so bluntly, but the basic idea is there.  She is away at school experiencing things that Seph has no idea about or that Seph doesn't fit into.  Seph seems to be in the same place he was when they met all those years ago.  She is moving on with school, and eventually a career of some sort.   

A lot of times in this situation, the two people just grow apart, or one of them grows, and the other doesn't.  It's a bad situation, and I feel bad for you Seph, but it seems like she wants to move on to something else.  I think the best thing would be to end it all together.  Stop calling each other, stop seeing each other, and see what happens.  You never know, you may end up back together, or you may never speak to each other again.  Ultimately, you're both young and will get over this.  You're only 20!  I didn't have a serious relationship until I met my wife when I was 27, and I didn't get married until I was 31.

[SirPeale]

Okay, I worded that badly.  It was just supposed to be a quick-quick response.

Like you, any girl that I treated well ended up treating me like crap.  And almost any girl that actually showed interest in me, I almost always wasn't interested in, and would end up treating HER like crap.

Case in point: there was this girl, Ann White, in my chemistry class.  One day I was kidding around, and I asked her out.  To my suprise, she said yes.

She was actually very nice, kind of cute, but I'd never even thought of her in those terms.  So what did little old mature me do?  Completely ignore her.  I'd see her coming, I'd go the other way.  I was a real dick.  She moved away later in high school, and I have no idea where she want.  If I saw her again, I'd apologize.

Then there's every other woman *I've* been interested in.  99.9% of them treated *me* like crap.

I guess you really have to be interested in someone, and have that person actually interested in you, for this to work.

[GGKoul]

Then there's every other woman *I've* been interested in.

[ChadTower]

What comes around goes around...

If that explained it, I'd have never been cheated on, lied to, or treated like I was disposable until after high school.

What it comes down to, I think, is that women want to be wanted more than they want to be had.  Men too, for the most part, but it's less emotional for them and more physical.

[Shape D.]

What it comes down to, I think, is that women want to be wanted more than they want to be had.

Women want what they cant have, you were there when they needed "someone to talk to".  Part of the problem is when a girl starts thinking of you as a friend, when that heppens you have no chance. If a girl says "I just want to be friends" its over. game over man.

[GGKoul]

What comes around goes around...

If that explained it, I'd have never been cheated on, lied to, or treated like I was disposable until after high school.

The people who did this to you will get there's hundred times more.

[ChadTower]

The people who did this to you will get there's hundred times more.

Oh, they did, and they did it to themselves by dumping me for the A-hole.  But the fact remains that the only way to get the girl was to be the A-hole, and that's not who I wanted to be.

[GGKoul]

What it comes down to, I think, is that women want to be wanted more than they want to be had.

Women want what they cant have, you were there when they needed "someone to talk to".

[Shape D.]

There's ways to move a relationship from "friend-mood" to the next step.

yeah, start being a jerk.

[GGKoul]

There's ways to move a relationship from "friend-mood" to the next step.

yeah, start being a jerk.

No. 

[ChadTower]

No. 

He's right.  If you're not REALLY a jerk, you can't fake it well enough to convince them.

[GGKoul]

No.

[Shape D.]

Found this on:
http://www.seductioninsider.com/articles/want_to_bang_your_female_friends.html

or to paraphrase,   Start being a jerk.

[ChadTower]

Or, buy a BMW.  Works every time.

Or, let it slip that you live down the street from Tedy Bruschi and that Tom Brady is often seen around where you live.  That makes the women ALL want to come over, regardless of age/marital status.

Sucks for Seph.  He's the emergency dick, the dick in a glass case you only break in case of fire.  He needs to get back to being the top priority dick.

[GGKoul]

Found this on:
http://www.seductioninsider.com/articles/want_to_bang_your_female_friends.html

or to paraphrase,

[zaphod]

As I read down through this thread, even before I hit Chad's reply, the main thought was "College".  College is likely 90% of the 'problem'.  People change when they go off to school, horizons are broadened, their peer groups change.  You are an outsider to that now.  Of the great many married couples I know, 'generally' either both have attended college (attended, not necessarily graduated) or both have not.

I feel for you.  Been there a few times in my life.  Start finding plenty of activities to keep you busy.  Hang out with friends.  Your worst enemy right now is you and too much time to think.  Build a (or another) cabinet.