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Author Topic: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power  (Read 9724 times)

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vapuser

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #80 on: February 11, 2020, 09:49:02 am »
Mike, can I safely remove the two connectors (J19 and J20) from the PCB board before sliding the board out? It seems last time I tried removing those connectors, they felt like they were on there pretty tight. I'll take the pics tonight when I get home.  :)

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #81 on: February 11, 2020, 09:59:32 am »
anything that plugs in can be unplugged.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #82 on: February 12, 2020, 07:21:18 am »
Good morning all, Well, last night I took a reading of all the "test point" voltages on the ARII board. Here is the first sign of where the voltages stop. From the board I'm missing the 10.3 VDC. The good news is that the other 5 voltages are good. The 36 VAC, +22VDC (Actual 24.6), -22VDC (Actual -24.5), 12VDC and -5VDC, all good! See pic below "ARII Voltages from board". What's strange, is that I'm missing a lot more voltages from the plug connectors on the board. Does that make any sense? There are no voltages from the P7 connector and no voltages from the P10 connector. The only voltage I'm getting is from connector P9 36VAC (Actual 36.5). See pic below "ARII Voltages from connectors". I'll have to look back on the schematic to see where those connector voltages are coming from. What do you think?

I didn't have a chance to check any test point voltages on the PCB board but I did take a few pics of the board for Mike. I forgot to take a pic of the back of the PCB board for you. I'll do that tonight as well as check all the test point voltages. I did notice that there was a jumper wire soldered across a short length of circuity on the back side. Looks like there may have been problems in the past with the board. If I hold the board up to the light, all looks pretty good except for that one spot they bypassed with the jumper. Check out all the pics below. I'll report back tomorrow morning with additional readings.  :)

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #83 on: February 12, 2020, 07:22:40 am »
This pic shows the voltages from the board.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #84 on: February 12, 2020, 07:24:12 am »
This pic shows the ARII voltages from the connectors.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #85 on: February 12, 2020, 07:26:18 am »
This pic below shows the front view of the ARII board.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #86 on: February 12, 2020, 07:28:03 am »
This pic below shows the back side of the ARII board. Shows a lot of age but all the connectivity appears to be fine.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #87 on: February 12, 2020, 07:29:28 am »
The pic below shows the full view of the PCB board.

vapuser

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #88 on: February 12, 2020, 07:31:08 am »
This pic below shows the pins J19 and J20 of the PCB board.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #89 on: February 12, 2020, 07:32:41 am »
This pic below shows the middle of the PCB board.

vapuser

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #90 on: February 12, 2020, 07:36:27 am »
This pic below shows the bottom of the PCB board. Do you happen to know what that Reset button at the bottom of the board resets? It also look like another connector at the bottom of the board. I wonder if that's used for test connection of some sort. There was no connection to it inside the console. Any ideas?

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #91 on: February 12, 2020, 07:53:04 am »
Well - all your problems (for now) are on the ARII board.
I've been advised to pretty much always replace Q3 - 2N3055.  It runs the hottest, does the most work and is most likely to fail.  If you notice runs all of the +5v circuits that feed the PCB.
There are many youtube videos on transistor testing and I'd target that one to see if it shows bad - then replace it anyway.

After that - the LM305 is the next likely part to be bad causing no +5.
https://www.arcadepartsandrepair.com/store/integrated-circuits/voltage-regulators-integrated-circuits/lm305ah-voltage-regulator/

When I ordered my 2N3055 - I got a LM305 and put it on the shelf (shipping savings).  You should get both from above.  Word has it there are many crappy Chinese ones and you want a good one.  (no personal experience honestly - but I agree with the sentiment).  If you replace that - you will likely be back in business.  Good digging!!

It took me a while to realize there are *many* power supplies inside this machine - not just a power cord in and lots of outputs.
(ex: the -5v comes from a small voltage regulator chip, on the PCB +15V comes from yet another voltage regulator chip)
Getting very close...


My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
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Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #92 on: February 12, 2020, 07:56:27 am »
Now we are getting somewhere.

Get that AR II functioning. If it is too difficult there is a guy on KLOV that fixes them and sells them.

bperkins has done a lot of work on his Centipede. Follow his advice. It will be cheaper and more satisfying if you complete the repairs.

You are doing a good job so far. Keep up the effort.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #93 on: February 12, 2020, 12:55:27 pm »
I dont know about satisfying it could be, I got holes burned in all my dresses, got fried my hair one day, burnt fingers, Late night sleepless stress if something goes wrong if it doesn't work.

Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #94 on: February 12, 2020, 12:56:46 pm »
Is there a sentence somewhere in that mess?

bperkins01

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #95 on: February 12, 2020, 01:05:36 pm »
Nothing better than fixing something that doesn't work - yourself.  Especially if its something you enjoy. 

« Last Edit: February 12, 2020, 01:29:19 pm by bperkins01 »
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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #96 on: February 12, 2020, 07:01:52 pm »
Guess I really dont see it as a satisfaction thing, It is a job that needs to be done, or the alternative is sit and look at it and just dream about doing it someday...Either way not really a top shelf ego boost.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #97 on: February 13, 2020, 07:13:19 am »
Good morning all once again. I feel we're getting close. As I posted yesterday, I would take pics of the backside of the PCB for Mike. Mike please see below. Also here are the test point voltages of the PCB:

Required Actual
voltage   voltage
+5v        0v
+22v      +24.3
-22v       -24.4
-15v       -14.9
_15v      +15.4
-30v       -27.6
-5v         -5.1

Yesterday I ordered the (Q3) 2N3055 Transistor and  the (Q1) 5v Linear Voltage Regulator. bperkins01, did the transistor come with the heat sink compound or a gasket? Or did you have to order those parts separately? I will definitely be installing these parts myself. I agree! Nothing better than fixing it yourself. It must be a guy thing. I watched a couple video's on the installation. One guy used a GS Silicon heat sink compound on a formica type gasket. The only kind of heat sink compound I've used was applying a CPU chip in a motherboard. I don't think the compounds are the same. Not sure. I heard that some compounds can cause a capacitance. See: https://bestthermalpaste.com/thermal-paste-vs-thermal-grease/ Any knowledge on the subject? Are the above voltages what you were expecting to see? I'll report back tomorrow. Have a good day.

vapuser

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #98 on: February 13, 2020, 07:16:15 am »
PCB Backside top of board.

bperkins01

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #99 on: February 13, 2020, 07:27:43 am »
Mine came with a gasket.  Just a little thermal paste - don't worry beyond that - its just to help the heat dissipate.  I even think there was a little packed of paste..  (Can't remember now) but it takes slightly  more than a smudge of goo.

No +5V explains a lot..  since the PCB board does all the thinking and the CPU needs the +5v to think.

Mine had no -5v, no +15v and no -30v

-5v is on the ARII  (replaced power regulator)
+15v is on the PCB (replaced power regulator)
-30v is on the PCB - which I thought was not there because of the +15v - BUT - it turned out that I needed to replace the 555 timer chip..  which somehow takes the -15 and +15 and makes +30v..   which then feeds the high score retention chip  (which my pcb did not retain high scores)

I just did the 555 last night - but haven't tested the high score yet - monitor was apart on the bench..  but I'm 99% sure it will work.

You look to be in good shape - until the next item down stream is broke - but good digging!!
Now the hard part... waiting
 :applaud:

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #100 on: February 13, 2020, 07:29:39 am »
The +5 0v is why your PCB is not responsive. You and bperkins need to get the ARII functioning correctly. That should get us power to the PCB.

Hopefully the PCB is fine and just not getting the power it needs right now.

If you have down time waiting for parts, you could check any fuses on your monitor chassis. With power to the plug that monitor should be firing up.

bperkins01

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #101 on: February 13, 2020, 07:31:38 am »
The +5 0v is why your PCB is not responsive. You and bperkins need to get the ARII functioning correctly. That should get us power to the PCB.

Hopefully the PCB is fine and just not getting the power it needs right now.

If you have down time waiting for parts, you could check any fuses on your monitor chassis. With power to the plug that monitor should be firing up.

Agreed  - the monitor stands alone.  You should hear it start..
My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
https://bperkins.wordpress.com/

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #102 on: February 13, 2020, 07:31:54 am »
Also, your edge connector contacts look okay in the pics. You might want to take a good look at them and make sure they are clean.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #103 on: February 13, 2020, 07:38:37 am »
While we're spending all your money...
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B079YVJHG3/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_image?ie=UTF8&psc=1

This thing is excellent - I wish I knew about them years ago..  use it like a pencil eraser to clean contacts.  I've needed this for 30 years..
Just used it last week because the TV remote wouldn't charge right...  cleaned the contacts
My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
https://bperkins.wordpress.com/

Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #104 on: February 13, 2020, 07:42:17 am »
Yeah. Those work surprisingly well for arcade PCBs.

It is easier than chemicals and a stiff toothbrush.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #105 on: February 13, 2020, 12:20:00 pm »
Mike, Like you said, I think while I'm waiting for parts to come in, I'll look at the monitor again. I believe that the 3 pin connector was supplying 126.6 VAC. The 6 pin monitor plug had no voltage at all. Does the connector supply voltage to the monitor or do the components on the monitor supply voltages to the plug? I did notice a fuse way up underneath the monitor. I'll try to remove it and test it for continuity. Do you think I should remove the whole monitor from the chassis or should I try testing from underneath? I'm not really sure what I'm looking for. Other than that fuse which visually looks good,  :dunno I don't know. You mentioned that this monitor circuitry was totally separate from the rest of the boards. So then replacing the components on the ARII won't supply voltage to that 6 pin monitor plug? Just a thought. What are your suggestions?

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #106 on: February 13, 2020, 12:21:31 pm »
That yellow lettering says "No power at all". Sorry about that.

Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #107 on: February 13, 2020, 12:37:34 pm »
The six pin connector provides the video signal from the PCB to the monitor. That is not a concern at this moment. the 3 pin plug supplies power to the monitor. When there is power there the CRT should do something. I would suggest looking up CRT repair and safety on youtube. You need to learn where the high voltage is hiding and how to properly deal with it. You need to learn the basics before you dive in.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #108 on: February 13, 2020, 12:39:04 pm »
There is a 6 pin connector with thin wires..  that is your RGB connector.  It has no power because of no +5V and isn't relevant at the moment.

there should be a 2 or 3 wire connector off the harness that is very similar is size to an everyday extension cord.  It will have 120V - which we know works directly off the power brick  (its not off the ARII)

There is a fuse on the CRT itself right where the power connects..  its likely a 3A - 250V fuse.
Focus on that power line into the CRT..  if it has power (and it does) then I'd pull the CRT to check the fuse..  I'm guessing you can't see anything while its in the cabinet.

My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
https://bperkins.wordpress.com/

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #109 on: February 13, 2020, 12:39:47 pm »
The six pin connector provides the video signal from the PCB to the monitor. That is not a concern at this moment. the 3 pin plug supplies power to the monitor. When there is power there the CRT should do something. I would suggest looking up CRT repair and safety on youtube. You need to learn where the high voltage is hiding and how to properly deal with it. You need to learn the basics before you dive in.
Great minds  :)
My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
https://bperkins.wordpress.com/

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #110 on: February 13, 2020, 09:30:50 pm »
Sitting around waiting for the mail man will just make you old...Grab a switcher, or a benchtop P/S and continue troubleshooting.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #111 on: February 14, 2020, 07:02:36 am »
Good morning all, just a quick update before the weekend. My fuses came in as well as the miniature bulbs for the coin receptor. I put all the new parts in and took a few pics of the monitor. I probably won't remove it from the chassis until after I replace the transistor and the regulator in the ARII. As you can see from one of the monitor pics below, a zoomed in view of the fuse looks like it might be ok. Won't know until I actually test it. There is another pic that is showing what looks like a bad electrical component. I'll have to look that number up in the parts list. I was reading an article yesterday on how to switch out an old CRT with a modern LCD. Has anyone tried that? Any pros and cons? Well, have a good weekend, I'll check back on Monday.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #112 on: February 14, 2020, 07:05:37 am »
This pic below shows the fuse.

vapuser

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #113 on: February 14, 2020, 07:11:01 am »
This pic is showing what appears to be a bad part.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #114 on: February 14, 2020, 07:39:43 am »
Do not put an LCD in that cab. Please God no.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #115 on: February 14, 2020, 08:18:09 am »
LCD,  All new, and minty! (Jennifer amused at the prospect) ...Yes that is a bad part all right, the way it is weld spattered My guess that flyback is bad and melted it with a voltage arc (pretty much what I said way back at the beginning of this thread)...You are going to have a big pile of DIY satifaction into this by the time you also do trans/caps...Carefull messing around with that width coil they can be hard to find and or replace...America's sweetheart has left the building.👸
« Last Edit: February 14, 2020, 08:31:07 am by jennifer »

Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #116 on: February 14, 2020, 08:29:54 am »
If it comes to the nuclear option you can have the chassis fixed or replaced.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #117 on: February 14, 2020, 09:26:22 am »
If it comes to the nuclear option you can have the chassis fixed or replaced.
That's the "DIY job well done satifaction" I am missing out on? Just pay a guy?...Omg, I laughed so hard, I may have pee"d a little...Drink a Creme flavored soda throw it on the workbench, and just fix it like a girl...Omg, so funny.

Mike A

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #118 on: February 14, 2020, 09:28:29 am »
That is why it is the nuclear option you turd. If he is overwhelmed and considering an LCD than I am offering a better alternative.

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Re: Atari Centipede Cocktail table game has no power
« Reply #119 on: February 14, 2020, 09:41:29 am »
Fixing PCB's and replacing low power chips is one thing - I can certainly understand not wanting to poke around inside of a CRT (I am - but that's because I want to learn how to fix them)

Vapuser - Please don't put in an LCD..  just because...
if you are liking fixing the primary machine (and it seems like you are)
then figuring out what that chip is (and I'm going to guess its a voltage regulator...  It seems like its always a voltage regulator...)  then maybe look into replacing it.

Here is what I've learned on CRT's  - If you are nervous - discharge the tube (while not plugged in) and you will be fine..  that's it. Lots of videos on this.

There are plenty of guys that can fix them too...

My Analogy:  I can fix pretty much anything on a car..  I've even rebuilt a couple engines..  But if there is an issue in the automatic transmission - that goes to an expert..  Experience counts on those..  to much can go wrong.

My Arcade Cabinet Build and other projects here:
Centipede, Joust, Joust Cocktail, Asteroids, Galaga, Ms. Pacman Cabaret, Defender, Space Invaders Cocktail
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