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Author Topic: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]  (Read 1083 times)

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jimmyj1979

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Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]
« on: January 11, 2019, 04:40:09 am »
Ok I thought I was going a bit crazy regarding image sharpness so I decided to do some A/B tests with my Pi2Jamma (Raspberry Pi Jamma Interface) which runs super resolutions 2560x240 and test it against my Groovyarcade Rig (ATI 4550 & vga cable to JPAC)

The results are quite obvious.

The Pi2Jamma looks sharp, you can almost count individual pixels.



With the Jpac the image looks soft, almost like it has anti-aliasing on.


and this should prove my GA machine is in 384x240


Have i done something wrong?
https://imgur.com/gallery/87j9lTB


As you can see in the final pic of that album i took a mame screen grab

« Last Edit: January 19, 2019, 06:08:51 pm by jimmyj1979 »

jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2019, 04:53:21 am »
my guess is that the loss of sharpness is signal degrading over the analogue VGA cable, the pi2jamma plugs directly to the Jamma harness. which could be why its sharper and not as lossy.

I may try a ferrite ring around the VGA cable to try and passively filter noise on that signal. Will report back

Calamity

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2019, 05:12:45 am »
Get a log just in case, and make sure you have no software filter in mame.ini.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2019, 08:04:24 am »
Gl_glsl_filter is enabled, should I disable this?

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #4 on: January 11, 2019, 08:58:34 am »
Gl_glsl_filter is enabled, should I disable this?

Definitely, those filters are generally used to simulate a CRT on another display by introducing scanlines, phosphor glow, screen curvature, etc. to make a non-CRT display look more like a CRT.  Those filters will introduce blurriness and other undesirables.

jimmyj1979

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Does this look right? Apparently 384x224
« Reply #5 on: January 15, 2019, 11:53:41 pm »


I'm still trying to track down what is causing the blurry output to my CRT.

I have a feeling the vid card thinks its outputting 384x224 but it isnt, i can see some horizontal aliasing or distortion on some of those lines....

are there any ways to test what is going on?

Also... What does dotclockmin actually do? Both my cards apparently support low or 0 dot clocks... but I havent experimented

Calamity

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #6 on: January 16, 2019, 04:15:37 am »
I'm still waiting for your log.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #7 on: January 16, 2019, 05:07:41 pm »
Will generate a log tonight, as i am running GroovyArcade, is there any tricks i need to know to create a log under linux?

jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2019, 06:08:26 pm »
I'm still waiting for your log.

Hi Calamity, I had some troubles generating a log from the terminal, turns out i had to do it via KDE desktop, Log attached


jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]
« Reply #9 on: January 20, 2019, 07:15:35 pm »
also found this thread, this sounds like someone had an issue with a Jpac thinking it was software introducing noise but ended up being jpac/vga

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php/topic,158700.0.html


jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]
« Reply #10 on: January 21, 2019, 02:07:42 am »
Ive also noticed noise around some text (once again this doesnt happen on my Pi2Jamma


It's quite severe in the image below around the word credit. There is definitely some blue/purple ghosting going on. I would usually agree and say that its an issue with the CRT but it doesnt happen on the Pi2Jamma :|



Calamity

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma
« Reply #11 on: January 21, 2019, 05:33:22 am »
I'm still waiting for your log.

Hi Calamity, I had some troubles generating a log from the terminal, turns out i had to do it via KDE desktop, Log attached

Hi jimmyj1979,

The log looks perfect, I don't think it's a software issue cause by GLSL filters or incorrect scaling. The video mode is correctly set. The fact that you see artifacts on text rendering in MAME menus is normal, that part of MAME is not designed to work on low resolutions any more. However, regarding the game itself should look crisp.

If you want my opinion, the pictures you posted don't look too bad. I'd say most users would find them good enough. It's only that you have something else to compare. As you say, it looks like the analog chain is causing some signal quality loss.
Important note: posts reporting GM issues without a log will be IGNORED.
Steps to create a log:
 - From command line, run: groovymame.exe -v romname >romname.txt
 - Attach resulting romname.txt file to your post, instead or pasting it.

CRT Emudriver, VMMaker & Arcade OSD downloads, documentation and discussion:  Eiusdemmodi

cools

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]
« Reply #12 on: January 21, 2019, 06:11:19 am »
How does it look with super resolutions in GroovyArcade ?
Please don't PM me with support questions. Ask in public so everyone can learn!

jimmyj1979

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Re: Image sharpness with J-Pac vs Pi2Jamma [Log attached]
« Reply #13 on: January 21, 2019, 06:28:49 am »
Iím not sure how to enable super resolutions in groovy arcade? Any ideas on how I could try?