Questions regarding Electric ICE2 & LED Wiz

[T3quila]

Hi Guys,

my cab is coming along and I'm at a point where I only have the art missing and redoing the CP and CP-Box.
I made the CP slope too steep for my height so I can play comfortably with a bar stool but standing is a nightmare for me as I have to bend my wrists too much (ironically everybody else is smaller and doesn't have a problem).
Regardless, I can play and get that out of my system in the meanwhile and therefore take my time to figure out what/how the final CP is going to be as I'm going to start from scratch on that one.

I really like RandyT's microswitches (GroovyGameGear) and thinking about going with LED lit buttons. I tried his switches in Happ buttons and like the overall feel very much, so I have a few questions about the EI2 buttons he offers:
1. Are the Electric ICE 2 the same size as the Happ buttons? (I don't mean that the plungers are interchangeable with Happ plungers, but is the diameter of the plunger roughly the same?)
2. Are Electric ICE 2 build identical with CLASSX buttons, meaning all parts would be interchangeable between the two? (The reason why I'm asking is if I would like to later use the LEDs with a Clear CLASSX that Randy sells on request, can I move the LEDs over without modding? I might be going alternatively with CLASSX Clear Button with CLASSX Black plunger.)
3. Would you suggest RGB-Drive II or Helios LEDs? I'm leaning currently towards RGB Drive for the following reasons: they sit lower in the button so I would assume they would work better with the alternative Clear/Black setup mentioned in 2, and only 1/3 of the power required so I wouldn't need an extra power supply.
4. I have already some Ultralux single color buttons for admin functions and Start and Coin and want to keep them. Will the LED-Wiz work with them right out of the box or do I have to do something e.g. resistors to prevent them from being fried?
5. If I understood correctly, if I put different voltages on the bank select I could run NovaMatrix LINX 2 chains from one bank via 12V and then LED 5V from the other banks, correct? (That way I might get away with 2 LED-Wiz instead of 3.)
6. Can I run each 5 LED segment of the NovaMatrix LINX 2 kit via the LED-Wiz separately or do they have to be connected together?

I realize that probably Randy is the best person to answer all this, but I don't want to bug him with PMs as this is not urgent (I'm going to buy everything in 100$-150$ batches over time, as that sounds a lot better than spending one time 800 bucks on all controls and hardware, and I don't have to figure all components out at once and can see how things look and work in the old CP before I do the final one.)
Anybody is welcome to chime in 

As always, thanks four help guys!

[Mr_Numbers]

I can answer with what I believe is correct, if I'm wrong others will correct me asap.

1.)   Happs makes 1 1/8" and I'm 99% certain the Electric ICE buttons are this same diameter.

2.)   The Electric ICE buttons should be interchangeable with the CLASSX buttons as they use the same overall design.  Again I'm at the 99% certainty range.

Part 3 is highly subjective and I can't seem to find the forum post showing the comparison between different buttons with different LED's at this moment   

4.) The LED-Wiz will more than likely work but I would try and research the LEDs you have in your current buttons to see if they have a resistor built in to be certain.  I don't have an LED-Wiz and am just getting to the point of trying and wire up some LEDs myself so 

[T3quila]

Hi Mr_numbers,

Thanks for your help!

Yes I know 3 is subjective and I have seen the thread that compares the buttons but it didn't have the setup with the clear/black combo in it and the other threads that I have seen with that setup use the IL lighting module from Paradise Arcade.

I looked at their products and while I like them, their store page quoted me with 45$ to ship 20 buttons and lights  to the mid west US. That seems hefty to me. For that price I can buy the mix and match setup from Randy and know that I'll have my order 2-3 days from when I submit it delivered.

Regarding 4: That is aa good idea, could have thought about it  myself.  Worst case scenario is I'll ask Andy from Ultimarc.

Thanks again! 

[SpatzST]

I don't know the specifics of the button sizes, but if it means anything, I had CLASSX buttons and swapped them out for the EI2 and they seem to be exactly the same size.  Also, I use the Helio LED's and they are really awesome.  insanely bright.  I would say depending on the room you are playing in would dictate the lights you want.  If the room is bright, you will need brighter led's so they are more visible.  If you are in a dark basement, you will probably be fine with the others.  Personally, I play in a dark basement, but I love bright lights

[lamprey]

I have both the RGB Drive and Helios LEDS and if it were me I'd get the RGB Drive.

1. Serviceability - The RGB Drive attach to the bottom of the button and don't go inside like the Helios (they poke through the hole on the bottom). So, if you need to service/replace the button, you don't have to disconnect the wires. That may not been that big of a deal to most people.
2. Brightness - The Helios are brighter. But, when I was messing with them, in my application (solid housing with clear plunger) the brightness wasn't very significant.
3. Price. Well you already know.

They are both solid choices and you should be happy either way.

[RandyT]

I have both the RGB Drive and Helios LEDS and if it were me I'd get the RGB Drive.

2. Brightness - The Helios are brighter. But, when I was messing with them, in my application (solid housing with clear plunger) the brightness wasn't very significant.

The Helio9 units should be at least 3x brighter, but only if used with an LED-Wiz.  One of the other major benefits is the evenness of the lighting.  In the OP's desired configuration (black plunger with illuminated bezel) the standard RGBDriveII units would be a poor choice, as the lighting with those units would be concentrated primarily on an area which is opaque.  Better to use Helio9's in this application.

[T3quila]

Thanks Randy,
that was exactly the info I was looking for, Helios it is then 

Since you are here right now you might be able to answer point 4, 5 and 6 from my original questions above 

4. I have already some Ultralux single color buttons for admin functions and Start and Coin and want to keep them. Will the LED-Wiz work with them right out of the box or do I have to do something e.g. resistors to prevent them from being fried? (I know it is a competitors product but you might have come across it since it is a relatively small community)
5. If I understood correctly, if I put different voltages on the bank select I could run NovaMatrix LINX 2 chains from one bank via 12V and then LED 5V from the other banks, correct? (That way I might get away with 2 LED-Wiz instead of 3.)
6. Can I run each 5 LED segment of the NovaMatrix LINX 2 kit via the LED-Wiz separately or do they have to be all directly connected together?

And I have 2 more questions for you:
7. How would I go to order the Translucent and black buttons? Do I order twice as many black and put in the comment that half of them should be translucent or do I coordinate this with you ahead of time vie email/PM?
8. I would like to get your opinion on something: My PC power supply has a 20A +5V rail and so far I have 4 fans hanging on those (silent fans using 5V instead of 12V). The extra 3-4A the Helios would be drawing on that rail should be fine I assume especially since the LINX would be 12V. Additionally I have 2 HDDs, I don't know what else would be drawing from the +5V rail in a PC. Do you think I can just splice those in or do I have to get a dedicated 5V power supply. The only thing that essentially worries me is the rush in currents. If I understand this correctly, case fans are pretty much a short circuits until they start spinning, and have a high rush in current.

Thanks for your help Randy.

P.S.:  For right now I would only get 1 LED-Wiz and one of each of the button setups I'm interested in and different switches to try to figure out what I actually want and then get the main order later after I have decided.

[lamprey]

The Helio9 units should be at least 3x brighter, but only if used with an LED-Wiz. 

Mathematically, I agree with you. However, in reality, they are not 3x as bright.

[RandyT]

Mathematically, I agree with you. However, in reality, they are not 3x as bright.

If that's the case, I get the feeling they were not driven with an LED-Wiz, rather one of those constant current devices, which will hobble them severely.  I just did a side-by-side comparison, in a normally lit room, and the large difference in brightness and color intensity over an entire EI2 button (bezel included) is very obvious.  Keep in mind that ambient lighting, and the human eye's natural function to restrict bright light entering the pupil comes into play.  In the latter, especially in dark environments.

Also, the math doesn't lie, when it comes to LED's.  Light output is directly related to the current they consume, minus inefficiencies.  Modern LED's are all very efficient, so that's almost not worth mentioning.