Getting started, first question

[cheesepile]

First day here, and had a quick question to get started... I have 2 cabinets, Astro Blaster and a cocktail cabinet of Defender. Is it typically cheaper to alter an existing cabinet or buy a pre-built or kit? I don't have any parts I could use, and it seems that I would have to make a lot of modifications to get a wide variety of games to work (new screen, joystick, many more buttons, and additional speakers are what first come to mind).

Thanks for any help in advance!

 -Jason

[GregD]

It is usually going to be cheaper to modify an existing cabinet that has a working monitor and controls.  You will need a way to interface your pc to the arcade monitor like an arcade vga card.  A lot really depends on the condition of the cabinet too.  Kits are expensive and usually built of melamime or particle board.  You would need to purchase all controls and monitor for the kit.  There are many factors that go into it though.

[kahlid74]

Welcome!  It really depends on what your end game goal is.  In most cases an empty Arcade cabinet shell is a better buy (cheaper) at $50-75 bucks than the MDF purchased to make said cabinet.  You should be mindful however that trying to make a 4 player cab out of some 1/2 player cabs can be tough/tricky.

I started with an existing cab which I bought for $100 bucks with double working coin doors.  It's a great way to start cause then you can go cheap if you want with a tv and any type of computer/control panel layout.

[CheffoJeffo]

Also bear in mind that killing a working classic for MAME is still frowned upon by some of the old folks ... 

[ark_ader]

Also bear in mind that killing a working classic for MAME is still frowned upon by some of the old folks ... 

I'm older than Jeff - and I say Mame that original with with extreme prejudice. 

[cheesepile]

Astro Blaster has been on its way to the grave for some time... I had the board replaced and it still glitches a lot. Not exactly a classic either

I'll start looking around at the FAQs, the project really sounds exciting... glad I have you guys for advice if I need it in the future!

Someone above mentioned working coin slots... can these be interfaced to work with a pc & MAME? I'd probably just go the TV route since the existing arcade screen is shaped like a sideways LCD and probably wouldn't work good for games that are "fullscreen"

Thanks for all the quick replies! Already loving this community

[CheffoJeffo]

We can just accept that ark is a total idiot and move on from there. There is a reason that he doesn't post anything that has to do with arcade stuff -- it is because he doesn't actually know anything related to arcade stuff.

AstroBlaster is not a widescreen game, but rather a standard 19" CRT mounted vertically. Also, it is pretty collectible, although I don't know much about working on the G-80 boards.

But, the most important thing that you need to decide is what you want to do with your cab. The biggest single mistake that somebody in your position can make is trying to fit a project to the cabinets on hand. Neither cab you mention is a good candidate for anything more than a single player machine.

Check the wiki and projects ... you will achieve superior results if you take a few hours and evaluate things. It is easy enough to trade your glitchy AstroBlaster for a cabinet far superior for your purposes.

[alfonzotan]

Astro Blaster has been on its way to the grave for some time... I had the board replaced and it still glitches a lot. Not exactly a classic either

I'll start looking around at the FAQs, the project really sounds exciting... glad I have you guys for advice if I need it in the future!

Someone above mentioned working coin slots... can these be interfaced to work with a pc & MAME? I'd probably just go the TV route since the existing arcade screen is shaped like a sideways LCD and probably wouldn't work good for games that are "fullscreen"

Thanks for all the quick replies! Already loving this community

If you're anywhere near Atlanta, I'll buy that Astro Blaster and help you build a cab to replace it.  Completely serious... that was one of my favorite games growing up.

[cheesepile]

Unfortunately I'm in California, otherwise I'd give it to you for free in exchange for help making a new cabinet. Let me know if you ever make a road trip!

Defender's screen is horribly small, and was a fav of mine so I'm not too hot on the idea of using that one. I'm totally okay with a one player machine, but would prefer 2p and want to do it right rather than just jumping in and messing up my existing hardware.

I'll keep looking around and if I can find a way to do this from scratch on the cheap I will. Have a computer and a monitor (may do TV with S-Video out, not sure if I need the added resolution of an LCD), just need the cabinet and joystick / buttons I suppose.

Maybe I'll try the buy/sell section of the forum. I'd gladly trade both games for something that would kickstart my project.

[SavannahLion]

I'm in CA. Whereabouts are you?

[cheesepile]

About 10mins outside of Stockton. My wife just flipped out when I told her Defender might be up for grabs too, so I now can't include that   She likes it as a coffee table   ugh

[Le Chuck]

About 10mins outside of Stockton. My wife just flipped out when I told her Defender might be up for grabs too, so I now can't include that   She likes it as a coffee table   ugh

Cheese, never evaarr complain about a wife who wants to hold onto a cabinet... for whatever reason.  These are a rare breed and should be handled with kid gloves or else the faulty wiring in her brain might correct and then you'll come home from work and find that she just thrown those horrid things away since you wanted to get rid of them anyway.

You can totally wire your coin doors to your computer so when you drop a coin you get a credit in MAME.  It's pretty easy to do once you start getting things you'll need like encoders and whatnot.  I recommend surfing the Project Announce page for ideas, find a cab you like and build from scratch , it's really gratifying.  My first cabinet was a conversion and that's nice to learn on but it's a better experience IMO create than repurpose.  Either way, welcome and look forward to see what you come up with.

[cheesepile]

Lol... I showed her this post and she wants to frame it and hang it up

Cheese, never evaarr complain about a wife who wants to hold onto a cabinet... for whatever reason.  These are a rare breed and should be handled with kid gloves or else the faulty wiring in her brain might correct and then you'll come home from work and find that she just thrown those horrid things away since you wanted to get rid of them anyway.

[drventure]

Cheese, never evaarr complain about a wife who wants to hold onto a cabinet... for whatever reason.

Amen, brother 

[ark_ader]

We can just accept that ark is a total idiot and move on from there. There is a reason that he doesn't post anything that has to do with arcade stuff -- it is because he doesn't actually know anything related to arcade stuff.

I have had four cabinets since 2000.  All of them were original, and were not Mamed.  All of them I sold at a loss.  Two of my own custom builds (submini) sold at a profit.  Granted I might know little about electronics, but I do know that originality means squat to someone who just wants to play 60+ games.  Sell the boards and art by all means and convert the cabinet to whatever you want it to be, and leave the purists to their loss making pursuits.

[kahlid74]

Cheese, never evaarr complain about a wife who wants to hold onto a cabinet... for whatever reason. 

This, seriously.  I've got one cab right now and I'm in the process of starting to build a new one and the woman goes bonkers when I tell her this.  "The whole basement is going to be filled with those things!"  My response is usually "Not the whole basement, just part of it. . . "

Either way, the key about that cab is it's versatility in 1 player MAME builds.  If you really want 2 player that cab may not be the best.  Like everyone is saying, take the time to understand what you want, 2player or 4 player, and what controls and what style and then go about it.  But do understand what you want may not be totally feasible in that cab.

[Dawgz Rule]

Research is everything....the more you do the better off you will be.  I will say that there is an immense amount of satisfaction in building a cabinet.  With me, it was just as much fun building as playing (which worries my wife).  The best part of the build is when somebody comes over and asks, "Where did you purchase that?".  The next best part is when they say, "That is exactly how I remember it....."  What a great hobby.

[CheffoJeffo]

We can just accept that ark is a total idiot and move on from there. There is a reason that he doesn't post anything that has to do with arcade stuff -- it is because he doesn't actually know anything related to arcade stuff.

I have had four cabinets since 2000.  All of them were original, and were not Mamed.  All of them I sold at a loss.  Two of my own custom builds (submini) sold at a profit.  Granted I might know little about electronics, but I do know that originality means squat to someone who just wants to play 60+ games.  Sell the boards and art by all means and convert the cabinet to whatever you want it to be, and leave the purists to their loss making pursuits.

So, your argument to my claim that you don't have a clue what you are doing is that you don't actually have a clue what you are doing?

The mere fact that you haven't been able to succeed without killing something doesn't mean that we should all become murderers.

You have no vision and no passion.

Be somewhere else.

[GregD]

^  Wow....is there some history here or what?  ^

[Dawgz Rule]

^  Wow....is there some history here or what?  ^

Ditto.   Just what every new person wants to see.  This type of stuff is what made me almost bail out on this forum shortly after building my first cabinet. Welcome aboard!!!

[SavannahLion]

I'm just outside of Sacramento. Opposite of Stockton unfortunately.

Just make sure you don't let your wife read my posts.

Just ignore the bickering between ark and Cheffo, you'll discover what's what soon enough.

[Le Chuck]

^  Wow....is there some history here or what?  ^

Ditto.   Just what every new person wants to see.  This type of stuff is what made me almost bail out on this forum shortly after building my first cabinet. Welcome aboard!!!

The back and forth between some members (myself occasionally included) is like scenery on a long trip.  Sure you want to get to your destination but sometimes the view out the window is just as interesting.  If it puts you off I'm sorry but it isn't meant to, it's just the roll and ebb of the beautiful green hills of the BYOAC.  Come, frolic in the verdant pastures of Cheffo and the bubbling brook of Ark.  

[CheffoJeffo]

The back and forth between some members (myself occasionally included) is like scenery on a long trip.  Sure you want to get to your destination but sometimes the view out the window is just as interesting.  If it puts you off I'm sorry but it isn't meant to, it's just the roll and ebb of the beautiful green hills of the BYOAC.  Come, frolic in the verdant pastures of Cheffo and the bubbling brook of Ark.  

 

Although I would use a different term than bubbling.

As for the back and forth over contentious topics like killing existing machines (which is actually dealt with in the FAQ), you will find that you have folks who have different opinions and that they care in differing degrees.

It can be hard to tell if both parties are just being idiots or if either has an actual point. It can take a while to recognize the difference, if there is one. I like to think that I contribute and, other than smacking ark for being ark, I think my advice in this thread has been solid.

If the passion of the discourse made Dawgz want to bail, then I feel somewhat bad for my role in that. Not terrible, but somewhat bad ... this hobby exists because many people have cared enough not to destroy, but to preserve. If everybody felt like ark does, then none of us would be here.

At the end of the day, however, this is saint's BBQ and he wouldn't want people to feel excluded due to the heat of the same old arguments, so please accept my apologies for any off-putting to the new folks.

In that spirit, let me quote the FAQ,

Please do be mindful that we don't destroy what we're trying to re-create.  Many classic arcade machines are rare and worth a heck of a lot more intact than altered.  Ideal candidates for this type of project are machines that have already been abused by previous owners - artwork destroyed, poorly converted, etc...  If you have a classic cabinet in good shape, you can probably sell it to a collector and get a trashed but usable cabinet in the bargain.

 

[ChrisK]

If the passion of the discourse made Dawgz want to bail, then I feel somewhat bad for my role in that. Not terrible, but somewhat bad ... this hobby exists because many people have cared enough not to destroy, but to preserve. If everybody felt like ark does, then none of us would be here.

The belief that someone who holds different values is somehow lesser instead of just different is illustrative of the general problem with public discourse today.  It's lack of respect that damages communities, not a difference of opinion.

You may dislike seeing a classic cabinet recycled into a MAME cabinet.  That's fine, you like classic cabinets.  You may even advocate for the preservation of classic cabinets.  That's fine, you're an archaeologist of sorts.  But to say that someone else is an idiot because he does something you don't like is self-centered and counter-productive.  you won't convince anyone by being combative, you'll just make them retrench on their positions.

Besides, not everyone is here to restore old cabinets.  For example, I'm here to learn about building a custom cabinet.

Wrong way: The guy who told you to rip it apart is an idiot.
Right way: I'll buy it off you!
Also right: You should sell it to someone who wants this game and build your own, so you aren't destroying a classic game.

[CheffoJeffo]

Besides, not everyone is here to restore old cabinets.  For example, I'm here to learn about building a custom cabinet.

Wrong way: The guy who told you to rip it apart is an idiot.
Right way: I'll buy it off you!
Also right: You should sell it to someone who wants this game and build your own, so you aren't destroying a classic game.

But, the most important thing that you need to decide is what you want to do with your cab. The biggest single mistake that somebody in your position can make is trying to fit a project to the cabinets on hand. Neither cab you mention is a good candidate for anything more than a single player machine.

Check the wiki and projects ... you will achieve superior results if you take a few hours and evaluate things. It is easy enough to trade your glitchy AstroBlaster for a cabinet far superior for your purposes.

I did rip into ark pretty strongly, but I know him better than you do. Do the research -- he actually is an idiot.

I specifically didn't rip into the OP for suggesting that he kill his classics, but pointed him in some useful directions to gather ideas and figure out what he wanted instead of having him shoehorn a solution based on the advice of somebody who doesn't really know what they are talking about.

Feel free to listen to me or to ignore me or you can just randomly judge me ... for judging someone else.

 

[ark_ader]

Besides, not everyone is here to restore old cabinets.  For example, I'm here to learn about building a custom cabinet.

Wrong way: The guy who told you to rip it apart is an idiot.
Right way: I'll buy it off you!
Also right: You should sell it to someone who wants this game and build your own, so you aren't destroying a classic game.

But, the most important thing that you need to decide is what you want to do with your cab. The biggest single mistake that somebody in your position can make is trying to fit a project to the cabinets on hand. Neither cab you mention is a good candidate for anything more than a single player machine.

Check the wiki and projects ... you will achieve superior results if you take a few hours and evaluate things. It is easy enough to trade your glitchy AstroBlaster for a cabinet far superior for your purposes.

I did rip into ark pretty strongly, but I know him better than you do. Do the research -- he actually is an idiot.

I specifically didn't rip into the OP for suggesting that he kill his classics, but pointed him in some useful directions to gather ideas and figure out what he wanted instead of having him shoehorn a solution based on the advice of somebody who doesn't really know what they are talking about.

Feel free to listen to me or to ignore me or you can just randomly judge me ... for judging someone else.

 

The is always a danger of shaking Jeff's tree every so often, it is not his fault that he is a purist.  To give him credit, I do like to see the original cab presented in all its glory, I just don't care if it has a PC running it. By all means keep the Astro Blaster aesthetic, but if you want to play dig dug on it, it is your cab.  If you want to sell it you can always restore the original boards.

I'm not angry about Jeff's comments.  I just like him the way he is.  You get used to him.  He is a real character.  He knows this hobby pretty well, and again to his credit, is a great asshat asset to this community.

Just don't let him derail your thread.   

[Ond]

When you spend enough time on this forum you'll realise most people here have respect for each other and the forum community, even when some of them have each other in the verbal equivalent of a headlock.

Welcome to the forum and to a great hobby.  While you're researching the wealth of information here for your project take a stroll through said pastures and brooks  over to my "Build and OND designed cab".  I encourage you to roll your own.

 

Ond

[Dawgz Rule]

I'm not bailing but yes, the first few times I posted something I ran into the select few who say things like, "never", "always", "wrong", etc.  Sometimes you can see it is all in jest but other times you can see that it steps a little beyond that.  Admittedly, I do get a kick out of the passion that some people have whereas I am more of a "do whatever works for you" kind of guy. 

None the less, there are some great people who post up here regularly which makes me come back throughout the day.  Lots of good tips for the next cab.....just don't tell the wife.

[boardjunkie]

I think his best option is to find either a generic 2 plyr cabinet like a Dynamo, or something thats been converted already and is beyond restoring.  Really.....there's no shortage of older cabs that have been thru the ringer. And...they're cheap, sometimes free if you know where to look.  Larger 4 player cabs a'la Konami Turtles, Simpsons, etc are gettin' a bit scarce since the MAME cab craze started really catching on. Those 25" large panel jobs are ideal for this kind of thing....they get scooped up fast. So building a copy of that style would be the only thing I'd bother with. Hell....there was an operator local to me who had a woodshop and built copies of those cabs to put kits in. This was when Simpsons was fairly new.

I used a Grand Products kit cab for mine:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/1980s-90s-GRAND-PRODUCTS-VIDEO-GAME-CABINET-FLYER-MINT-/400082945822#ht_2340wt_754

I think the dark blue with red molding looks nice. And...no collectable cabinets were harmed in the making of the MAME cab.