First Cab shopping list - advice wanted

[zero_koop]

Hello everyone, I'm getting ready to build my first cabinet.  I've been gathering information about what to buy over the past year and I even bought a few parts already as a trial to see if I could get it to work and if I liked the parts.  I want to share my proposed shopping list for my control panel parts and get any feedback you have.

What I have already:
- I-PAC2 from Ultimarc
- Mag-Stik Plus from Ultimarc
- 2x classic pushbuttons from Ultimarc
- 2x goldleaf pushbuttons from Ultimarc

I'm building a 2 player cabinet so I only needed the IPAC2 and so far I think it works great.  The Mag-Stick Plus was chosen because of its easy 4-8 way switchable from the top (I like the physical restriction).  I've used the joystick a little bit and I think I like it.  I know the general opinion is that there are better options, but honestly I don't have anything to compare it to myself.  So that's why I bought 1 and I think it's fine.  But opinions on this are welcome.  I thought I might like the leaf switch pushbuttons, but in the end I think I like the microswitch ones better.

Here is my shopping list for the remaining parts.  So far I've had a good experience with Ultimarc and they seem to have everything I want and there prices are reasonable so I'm just planning on ordering everything from them.  Other suggestions welcome.
- 30x classic pushbuttons (I need to figure out the exact number, plus I plan to have some extras for backup)
- 2x Start logo buttons for 1-2 players
- 2x SpinTrack Rotary Control (spinner)
- 2x Knob for SpinTrack (black/silver)
- 2x Flyweight for spinner (small)
- Mag-Stik Plus (I already have 1)
- Opti-PAC Interface with USB Cable
- U-TRAK FlushMount Arcade Trackball
- Trackball Adaptor Harness for Opti-PAC

So any advice or feedback on these particular items is greatly appreciated.  I do have a few questions myself:
- I can use the spinners to act as steering wheels, correct?
- Anyone used a spinner without a flywheel?  I don't have much experience with spinners so I really don't know what I like.
- Anyone have 2 spinners on their cabinet?  I think I'd like this but I'm actually having trouble finding a good list of 2 player spinner games.
- The trackball is a 3" ball.  Ultimarc also sells a 2 1/4" trackball.  Any advice on the size you prefer?

I plan to make this purchase in the next couple of weeks.  That way I can start building trial control panel layouts and practice mounting the parts before I do it on the final version.

Thanks for the help!  If you want more info from me just let me know.

[Paul Olson]

If the magstick plus feels good to you, then it will be great. I didn't like the short throw, but otherwise it is a really good joystick. I think that spinner is probably too light to use without a flywheel, but I haven't used it to know for sure.

Steering wheels are basically just big spinners, so it will work for games that used optical steering wheels (like Pole Position, Super Sprint, Offroad), but it wouldn't be a whole lot of fun. the wheel adds a lot to the games.

I would definitely stick with the 3" trackball. I have a 2.25", but I never use it. The 3" was a good upgrade, so I wouldn't go backwards. I really didn't like the wico 2.25" trackball that Ultimarc sells. It just never felt right compared to the Atari/Happ versions. I have never tried their U-Trak, so I don't have an opinion on that one.

I don't think there are enough 2 player spinner games to justify the cost - unless you and your friends find that you like driving games with a spinner. I can only think of Pong and Warlords.

[GregD]

I think the rule of thumb for the spinner is that if you do not get the flywheel then you should get a heavy knob for it.

[yaksplat]

I'm a fan of the leaf buttons from ultimarc.   They work great, no clicking and just the right amount of spring tension.

Go with a 3" trackball, you won't regret it.

I have 2 spinners for use as steering wheels.  Get the flywheel on the spinner, it's a cheap option that you wont want to have to purchase later and pay shipping again.  The spinners from GGG are great, and there's a steering wheel option that works well.

[Rando]

- The trackball is a 3" ball.  Ultimarc also sells a 2 1/4" trackball.  Any advice on the size you prefer?

I placed a similar order to Ultimarc and was very happy with my experience.  Regarding the trackball, I went back and forth, finally decided on the 2 1/4", and am very happy with it.  Plays great, looks to be a perfect size, and I haven't had anyone tell me they wish my ball was bigger. 

Luck on the Spinners, I haven't installed one yet and have some of the same questions you do.

[zero_koop]

Thanks for the advice.

I think I would be okay with using a spinner for a steering wheel replacement.  I like driving games, but not enough to try and work a steering wheel into my control panel.  What I'm unsure of is, how can you tell if a game uses an optical steering wheel or if it simply uses left/right arrows?  I played a few games (especially top-down driving games like Super Sprint) that seem like they have decent control using the joystick, but would be much better if played with an analog steering device.  But really I don't know if the game actually supports that or not.  I'm assuming that games that DO support a real wheel (like Cruisin' USA) can be played with the joystick as a last resort, because they all seem to work when I try using just my keyboard.  I really like a few of the simple 2 player games that are easy to pick up and play.  The names of them aren't coming to mind right now, but I'll try to list a few of them when I get back to my arcade computer.  I remember one was a top-down 2 person hockey game.  Another was a sort of 2 player breakout.  I think there are enough of those types of games to justify the second spinner and the option to use as a steering wheel is an added bonus.  It is a risk because they're so expensive, but right now I think I'm gonna go for it.  I do have one more question though, I don't have to have a gas pedal/break for driving games do I?  I realize I might not get the best control without it (the pedals might be analog) but I'm okay as long as it works.  Maybe I'll update someday but like I said, not a huge driving sim fan, but I do like them sometimes.  Mostly I just like the arcade-y top-down driving games.

I think I would like the larger 3" trackball too.  It's probably heavier and better for more precise control (like the flywheel on the spinner).

I will get the flywheel on the spinner, I think I'll just go for the "small" size as opposed to the "large" size.  Middle ground is probably safe for someone without too much of an opinion.

@yaksplat I will use my 2 leaf switch buttons for the "flipper" buttons on the side of the cabinet, just like the real pinball machines!  That will be a nice touch.  Also, by GGG did you mean GroovyGameGear (I hadn't heard of it before)?  If so, I'm searching their site and so far not seeing anything to use spinners as steering wheels.  Link?  I do think I know what you're talking about though.  I saw a pic of someone's CP and I think they had a mini steering wheel mounted on top of the spinner.

[Le Chuck]

@yaksplat I will use my 2 leaf switch buttons for the "flipper" buttons on the side of the cabinet, just like the real pinball machines!  That will be a nice touch.  Also, by GGG did you mean GroovyGameGear (I hadn't heard of it before)?  If so, I'm searching their site and so far not seeing anything to use spinners as steering wheels.  Link?  I do think I know what you're talking about though.  I saw a pic of someone's CP and I think they had a mini steering wheel mounted on top of the spinner.

About halfway down the turbo twist 2 vend page you'll see them.  Different sizes available.  All awesome.  Click me dood.

[zero_koop]

@yaksplat I will use my 2 leaf switch buttons for the "flipper" buttons on the side of the cabinet, just like the real pinball machines!  That will be a nice touch.  Also, by GGG did you mean GroovyGameGear (I hadn't heard of it before)?  If so, I'm searching their site and so far not seeing anything to use spinners as steering wheels.  Link?  I do think I know what you're talking about though.  I saw a pic of someone's CP and I think they had a mini steering wheel mounted on top of the spinner.

About halfway down the turbo twist 2 vend page you'll see them.  Different sizes available.  All awesome.  Click me dood.

ah yes thank you.  And woah! Expensive.  Maybe as an upgrade some day.  Will just have to make sure I leave room.

[thebyter]

Saint's wiki includes a page on spinners at http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Spinners_and_Dials.  That lists a bunch of games that use spinners, including a special section on dual-spinner games.  All of these should work with analog (optical) controls, but, as you've found, MAME'll generally let you use traditional joystick or button presses to increment or decrement the spinner "position", though it won't necessarily feel right.  To that end, you can also get by without dedicated gas/brake pedals at the loss of some control feeling.

2-1/4" trackballs are cheaper and obviously smaller, so depending on your monetary and/or space budget you might consider them.  I've heard they're easier for kids, too, with smaller hands.  Finally, pool balls are also 2-1/4", so it's easier to customize your trackball's solid color if you like (you can put in an 8-ball or a skull / marbled / whatever ball).  That being said, unless one of those points is particularly important to you, I agree that the 3-inch trackballs are going to feel and play better.

Finally, yeah, spend the (small amount) extra on a flywheel or at least a big heavy knob.  The extra "oomph" and spinning inertia will make it feel more like an arcade control than, say, a combination padlock.  Plus, the nice thing about the SpinTrak--and the TurboTwist 2 from GroovyGameGear--is that you can add or remove (or replace) the flywheel component if you don't like the feel.

[zero_koop]

Saint's wiki includes a page on spinners at http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Spinners_and_Dials.  That lists a bunch of games that use spinners, including a special section on dual-spinner games.  All of these should work with analog (optical) controls, but, as you've found, MAME'll generally let you use traditional joystick or button presses to increment or decrement the spinner "position", though it won't necessarily feel right.  To that end, you can also get by without dedicated gas/brake pedals at the loss of some control feeling.

2-1/4" trackballs are cheaper and obviously smaller, so depending on your monetary and/or space budget you might consider them.  I've heard they're easier for kids, too, with smaller hands.  Finally, pool balls are also 2-1/4", so it's easier to customize your trackball's solid color if you like (you can put in an 8-ball or a skull / marbled / whatever ball).  That being said, unless one of those points is particularly important to you, I agree that the 3-inch trackballs are going to feel and play better.

Finally, yeah, spend the (small amount) extra on a flywheel or at least a big heavy knob.  The extra "oomph" and spinning inertia will make it feel more like an arcade control than, say, a combination padlock.  Plus, the nice thing about the SpinTrak--and the TurboTwist 2 from GroovyGameGear--is that you can add or remove (or replace) the flywheel component if you don't like the feel.

awesome info, thanks!  Yeah, I didn't find that wiki until last night and I realized I probably could have answered most of my questions from that.  Thanks again for clarifying the use of pedals or not.  The link you posted didn't work because the period became a part of the link.  I'll try re-posting the correct link:
http://wiki.arcadecontrols.com/wiki/Spinners_and_Dials

[thebyter]

The link you posted didn't work

You're right, thanks!  Updated.

[zero_koop]

I just noticed an item on Ultimarc and I am wondering if anyone thinks these things are necessary.  They are Joystick "Blind Hole" Mounting kits.
http://www.ultimarc.com/controls.html#mountingkits
It seems like I could just mount the joystick fairly easily without these, but maybe I'm being naive.

[yaksplat]

i wrote a couple of posts on this:


http://yaksplat.wordpress.com/2011/12/14/joystick-mounting-with-inserts/
http://yaksplat.wordpress.com/2011/10/26/easy-and-cheap-joystick-mounting/

They are extremely nice to use.

[zero_koop]

i wrote a couple of posts on this:


http://yaksplat.wordpress.com/2011/12/14/joystick-mounting-with-inserts/
http://yaksplat.wordpress.com/2011/10/26/easy-and-cheap-joystick-mounting/

They are extremely nice to use.

darnit, I literally just clicked submit on my order.  Oh well, if I make another order in the future I can get them.  I have already mounted 1 joystick using some screws and it seems quite fine and stable.  But I'll read your review.  Maybe I can find some of these in a regular hardware store anyway.  They seemed overpriced on Ultimarc.

[zero_koop]

Just wanted to comment that Ultimarc has lightning fast delivery (DHL).  I ordered it right before my last post which was on a Friday evening and I got my package in the mail today (Tuesday).  Even with a US Federal Holiday on Monday.

[Le Chuck]

Yeah, those Deutchers can move some mail