Avoiding a Frankenpanel...

[rcub3]

I'm close to getting my cab built.  Next comes the actual CP...which has been the most challenging part in terms of what to and not to include.

I'm trying to make this as versatile as possible, so these I WILL include:
4 controllers
1 spinner
1 trackball
1 'tron-like' controller

Something like


          /-------------\
         /    sp     tron   \
        /                       \
        \3                   4 /
         \ __1__TB__2__/

Now, I realize that that might be a lot.  So I'm looking for ways to trim the fat:
1. player 3 and 4 will only have 4 buttons
2. I'm thinking players 1 and 2 should only have 6 slightly offset pushbuttons, to allow for the 4 button setup for Neogeo games (see below), while allowing me to play the 6 button fighters:

  X  X  X
X  0  0

3. Thinking of not adding any extra buttons for the trackball.  Will likely have a bottom-mounted Utrak between player 1 and 2 (see my ASCII art above), which would then allow me to use their buttons.
4.  Last but not least, I could minimize admin buttons to Esc, pause, 1-4 player start with a shift button that would allow these 4 to become the coin buttons too.  etc..


Any other suggestions/thoughts?  Any other Admin buttons I SHOULD have?  I've seen some cabs with 8 buttons for player 1 and 2... what are all of those for?

thanks!

[leapinlew]

If you could align player 3 and 4, you could play smash TV and Total Carnage. If you made player 3 and 4 top fire joysticks, you could play some of the tank games out there.

So, the tron stick. You really really want that? Trons fun and all, but Tron uses a weird 8wayish style joystick, vertical monitor. I know you can play other games, like Satans Hollow, gorf, etc. I think a frankenpanel is unavoidable with the addition of the tronstick.

[Donkbaca]

If its got a tron stick, its a franken panel.

No need for 8 buttons, unless you are trying to play console games, which you shouldn't do with arcade controls.

There are no other admin buttons you should have.  

I would have separate coin and 1p buttons, I hate shift controls.

My thoughts on trying to minimize franken panel-ness:
Ignore the desire to play everything, and focus on having the ability to play what you want to play.  That being said, are you really a big enough Tron geek to pay 200 or so bucks to get the controls and have a weird looking CP just to play Tron.  If the answer is yes, then do it, if the answer is, well , I enjoy Tron occassionally, and would like to play it once in a while, then the answer is no.

Same with the trackball, there are only like 6 good trackball games: Golden Tee, Crystal Castles, Marble Madness, Missile Command, Centipede and some sort of bowling everybody talks about.  Do you really like these games enough to where you will play them often?  For me the answer was no. I got a trackball, fired up MAME, discovered that I couldn't really play any of these games for more than 5 minutes, so the trackball was axed.

Are you really going to have 4 people playing the cab enough to justify a 4p setup?  Once again, there are only a handful of games that are fun with 4p; the D&D games, Turtles, Captain Commando, Simpsons and Sunset Riders, and X-men are the only ones I can think of off hand.  I didn't build a 4p CP because I don't think I will ever have 4 people over that want to play the same 4p game.  Unless you have a couple of kids that you want to game with, I think 4p CPs are a waste.  They are huge, ugly and add to costs.

I am not shooting you down, hey if you LOVE Tron, go for the stick.  If you love marble madness, get a trackball, if you have 4 buddies who love Turtles, build a 4 player CP.  As a rule, if its on your CP, it should get regular use, if it doesn't, axe it.

[leapinlew]

Same with the trackball, there are only like 6 good trackball games: Golden Tee, Crystal Castles, Marble Madness, Missile Command, Centipede and some sort of bowling everybody talks about.  Do you really like these games enough to where you will play them often?  For me the answer was no. I got a trackball, fired up MAME, discovered that I couldn't really play any of these games for more than 5 minutes, so the trackball was axed.

Donkbaca - did you ever try shuffleshot? We played that one a bit. It was a lot of fun, but for the most part your right. These are high dollar controls and take some time to install and configure.

Are you really going to have 4 people playing the cab enough to justify a 4p setup?  Once again, there are only a handful of games that are fun with 4p; the D&D games, Turtles, Captain Commando, Simpsons and Sunset Riders, and X-men are the only ones I can think of off hand.

Agreed and to add on, one of the downsides of Mame is unlimited quarters. This had a big impact on how I played these games. There are 2 player versions of these games that allow you to select your player. Nearly all of them had a 2 player option.

[TopJimmyCooks]

You could make it expandable. 

[Malenko]

If its got a tron stick, its a franken panel.

FRANKENPANEL! lol

 Once again, there are only a handful of games that are fun with 4p; the D&D games, Turtles, Captain Commando, Simpsons and Sunset Riders, and X-men are the only ones I can think of off hand.  I didn't build a 4p CP because I don't think I will ever have 4 people over that want to play the same 4p game.  Unless you have a couple of kids that you want to game with, I think 4p CPs are a waste.  They are huge, ugly and add to costs.

For the most part, I agree with this. Though NBA Jam and NHL Open Ice are both fantastic 4 player with friends too. Im actually making a swappable 4player NBA Jam panel to go on my MAMED KI1 cab, nothing fancy, just a 4 player factory NBA Jam panel, for when I have 4 players around ( for Open Ice)

But I dont think Id want my MAME cab full time 4 players with just me sitting there playing Galaga, alone, in the dark.

[rcub3]

You could make it expandable. 

I couldn't agree more that the Tron stick makes it a Franken.    That's exactly why I was trying to find ways to compensate, mainly by minimizing buttons on the panel.  

4 player vs 2 player:  I realize that most games will be 1-2 player, but man those 4 player games are just fun.  

I may have to go with a separate CP just for the trackball + pushbuttons (maybe 3?) and tron/spinner (yes, unfortunately I'm that big of a DoT fan....even paid extra for the push/pull spinner).  I would have to figure out how to get the wiring right to make it easily swappable.  

[alfonzotan]

I say embrace the Frankenpanel.  Look at it this way:  I personally would not (and did not) bother with controls for Players 3 and 4, because I'm not terribly interested in 4-player games.  But that's me; obviously you value that option, so why shouldn't you include them?

Panel design, in my mind, comes down to what you want to play, and how to do that comfortably.  If you want to play games that need a Tron/flightstick, by Crom, include one (I did).  If you're dedicated to fighting games or maze games or whatever and don't need a trigger stick, leave it out.  

In my mind, the ability to play damn-near everything is what makes MAME and DIY arcading so much fun in the first place, so don't be put off by 'control panel snobs.'  Build for what you want to play, period.  If what you want to play is limited to a joystick and three buttons, great for you.  If not, build the rest; the controls you're most likely to regret are going to be the ones you don't have.

Your layout looks perfectly reasonable to me.

[rcub3]

If you could align player 3 and 4, you could play smash TV and Total Carnage. If you made player 3 and 4 top fire joysticks, you could play some of the tank games out there.

Woa... I didn't know that for games like Smash TV you needed 1-2 adjacent and 3-4 adjacent to each other.  Would you then have to play Robotron off to the side (using 1+2)?  I thought this could all be mapped in MAMEUI or something per game.  It seems that all the researching doesn't end with completing the building of the cab.   

Thanks alfonzotan.  I do want to include everything, but maybe having a second CP for the extras (TB, tron stick, spinner) is not a bad idea, except for the extra woodworking.  I still have more stuff to figure out like speaker arrangement, monitor-selection, etc before I get to the CP. 

EDIT:  I've even considered using minimalistic art for the CP to avoid the adding to the frankenness.

[Donkbaca]

edit: If its got a Tron stick, and any other joystick, its a franken panel.

Malenko is in a bust the Donks balls kind of mood today...

I am very, VERY anti-FP, but my reasoning for it is that people put a ton of crap on their panels that never gets used and just confuses guests.  That's why I say, if you enjoy and use it, add it, but don't add for the sake of adding.

If you like Tron that much, why not do a dedicated Tron Bartop?  The tron sticks just always look funky, uncomfortable and in the way.

4 player games are fun, that's why I have 4 wii controllers and 4 xbox controllers.  But how often have I played 4 player games on those systems?  Very few.  I agree 4p NBA Jam and NHL are very fun 4p, but if you read around here I think there are more people in the "I built a 4p and wish I had built a 2P" panel than the "I built a 2p and wish I had built a 4p" panel

As for the trackball, nope, don't like shuffleshot enough to put a trackball on my cab. THough, I do have one of those plug in x-arcade trackball controllers, so if a guest REALLY wants to play golden tee or something, I can pull it out and set it on my CP, there is enough room between P1 and P2 to have it sit there.  Don't use it much though, and if I had to do it all over, I wouldn't have bought one

[alfonzotan]

If you could align player 3 and 4, you could play smash TV and Total Carnage. If you made player 3 and 4 top fire joysticks, you could play some of the tank games out there.

Woa... I didn't know that for games like Smash TV you needed 1-2 adjacent and 3-4 adjacent to each other.  Would you then have to play Robotron off to the side (using 1+2)?  I thought this could all be mapped in MAMEUI or something per game.  It seems that all the researching doesn't end with completing the building of the cab.   

Thanks alfonzotan.  I do want to include everything, but maybe having a second CP for the extras (TB, tron stick, spinner) is not a bad idea, except for the extra woodworking.  I still have more stuff to figure out like speaker arrangement, monitor-selection, etc before I get to the CP. 

EDIT:  I've even considered using minimalistic art for the CP to avoid the adding to the frankenness.

No prob.  Here's a link to a couple of shots of my (F)CP... only regret I have is that there's just no good way to include a Star Wars yoke without building a rotating or interchangeable panel.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=59359.msg1103736#msg1103736

[Firebat138]

Trackball...YES!!!   Spinner...  I didn't and wish I had...  Tron Flight Yoke....  Again...  I did not and wish I had every time I want to play Tron, which is rare, but it is still cool....  But again...  I rarely want to play....

I always tell people that want me to build them one.... Think of how many times you had four friends over that wanted to play the arcade at the same time and then think of what game it was...

I agree with alfonz.... do it for you... no one else...

[Malenko]

edit: If its got a Tron stick, and any other joystick, its a franken panel.

Malenko is in a bust the Donks balls kind of mood today...

Just razzin ya, Mr. Contra and Tetris arent classics =)

Just make sure you wrap your 4 player panel in black marble contact paper

[VanillaGorilla]

Just make sure you wrap your 4 player panel in black marble contact paper

DONT FORGET TO ADD LOTS OF BLUE LIGHTNING GRAPHICS EVERYWHERE!! NOT TO MENTION CUPHOLDERS!

[Firebat138]

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOL

 

edit: If its got a Tron stick, and any other joystick, its a franken panel.

Malenko is in a bust the Donks balls kind of mood today...

Just razzin ya, Mr. Contra and Tetris arent classics =)

Just make sure you wrap your 4 player panel in black marble contact paper

[nitz]

If its got a tron stick, its a franken panel.

No need for 8 buttons, unless you are trying to play console games, which you shouldn't do with arcade controls.

There are no other admin buttons you should have.  

I would have separate coin and 1p buttons, I hate shift controls.

My thoughts on trying to minimize franken panel-ness:
Ignore the desire to play everything, and focus on having the ability to play what you want to play.  That being said, are you really a big enough Tron geek to pay 200 or so bucks to get the controls and have a weird looking CP just to play Tron.  If the answer is yes, then do it, if the answer is, well , I enjoy Tron occassionally, and would like to play it once in a while, then the answer is no.

Same with the trackball, there are only like 6 good trackball games: Golden Tee, Crystal Castles, Marble Madness, Missile Command, Centipede and some sort of bowling everybody talks about.  Do you really like these games enough to where you will play them often?  For me the answer was no. I got a trackball, fired up MAME, discovered that I couldn't really play any of these games for more than 5 minutes, so the trackball was axed.

Are you really going to have 4 people playing the cab enough to justify a 4p setup?  Once again, there are only a handful of games that are fun with 4p; the D&D games, Turtles, Captain Commando, Simpsons and Sunset Riders, and X-men are the only ones I can think of off hand.  I didn't build a 4p CP because I don't think I will ever have 4 people over that want to play the same 4p game.  Unless you have a couple of kids that you want to game with, I think 4p CPs are a waste.  They are huge, ugly and add to costs.

I am not shooting you down, hey if you LOVE Tron, go for the stick.  If you love marble madness, get a trackball, if you have 4 buddies who love Turtles, build a 4 player CP.  As a rule, if its on your CP, it should get regular use, if it doesn't, axe it.

I pretty much agree with all of this. I'll throw in my 2 cents based on an eye-opening experience I had recently.

I'm mostly a vertical classics fan, but had planned on doing a rotating monitor because I also like a lot of fighters and beat'em ups. I clumsily broke one of the switches on my 4-way stick when installing my CP. No big deal as I was going to replace that stick anyway, but it did mean no vertical games for awhile since most of the ones I play need the 4-way. So I just put the monitor in horizontally for now and played for a few days. Guess what. I found I'm not all that crazy about playing the horizontal games all the time. Once I play through a beat'em up, I don't really want to play through it again for probably at least a year, and fighters get old fast for me vs. the cpu because once I get to the 4th or 5th match the cpu just cheats until I give up. So I'm just gonna mount vertically as I was having a ---smurfette--- of a time getting the rotating to work the way I wanted anyway, and it's hard to get a rotating monitor to look nice with a bezel. I'm gonna leave myself the option of disassembling things a bit and mounting horizontally on ocassion, but that probably won't be often. I can live with the horizontal games at a small size most of the time.

Here's my point: It sounds cool to be able to play everything, but you may not like it as much as you think. The idea is sometimes cooler than the reality. It's kinda like how we all want 5000 songs on our ipods, but how many of us really listen to more than 40-50 of them on a regular basis?

My advice: Play these games for awhile with your keyboard or a gamepad and then decide if you still think you'll want to play them enough to justify the extra controls. It sounds like you're a big Tron fan (but if by chance you haven't played in awhile, I would play it for a bit and decide if you really need that Tron stick), but you may want to play some trackball games for awhile and decide if you really need that.

As for the 4 player thing, if you have kids, I'd say go for it. Kids can likely have fun playing the same beat'em ups over and over, and there might be some fun multi-player console games they'd play too. But if it's so you and your friends can play through Turtles, etc. just think about it a bit. Are your friends really into those games as much as you are? Maybe they are, but if not, you and your buddies are probably gonna play through a 4 player game a grand total of once, MAYBE twice if you're lucky. Having said that, if they're really into the 4 player sports games, it could still be worth it because these games are more fun to play repeadetly than a beat'em up.

If you still think you need all the extras, then you should go for it and don't let anyone here talk you out of it! But a swappable panel may be the way to go then if you don't mind the extra work and having to switch panels sometimes.

[Xiaou2]

1. player 3 and 4 will only have 4 buttons

Good, cause I dont think there are many 4player games with more then 4buttons.

2. I'm thinking players 1 and 2 should only have 6 slightly offset pushbuttons,

I dont think this is a good option, IMOP.  Ive tried alternate button layouts such as
the so called Ergo "curved' layouts.  In play, I ended up mashing the side edges of
buttons instead of the center.. which resulted in extreme annoyance.  Try a test
panel and play against someone whos excellent at a 6button fighter for an hour, and
see if you have issues or not... before committing to that to a full CP.

3. Thinking of not adding any extra buttons for the trackball.

Good. But just remember, that you should leave at minimal, about 1ft diameter circle
around the ball.  Buttons are ok, but if you put a joystick too close, players will often
smash their hands into it when rolling the ball furiously in gameplay.  This usually
means offsetting the player 1 & 2s symmetry on the CP. It may not look as nice
visually, but you will be far better off playability wise.

4.  Last but not least, I could minimize admin buttons to Esc, pause, 1-4
player start with a shift button that would allow these 4 to become the coin buttons
too.  etc..

Admin buttons are a convenience. But they do add cost, and may not look as nice.
Its really up to you. They usually are at the very top of the cp, so they dont really get
in the way.  You could do something like a pop-up panel, or slide out keyboard.

Any other suggestions/thoughts?

Dont put the other controls too deep into the panel.  If you do, it makes it a strain to
use them for long periods of time.  Also, when possible, try not to make a players
arms rest on top of other controls.  Think about arm angles and placements.

Example: You can nearly put 2 joysticks on top of each other, with just a slight
diagonal, and thats far better than to put the 2nd joystick/controller deep into the
CP, where a player has to rest his arms on a set of buttons just to use it. (along with
stretching uncomfortably)

This:
**************************
*                                                *
*    (o)                                       *
*        (o)   ooo                          *
*                                                *
**************************

Not this:
**************************
*                (o)                           *
*                                                *
*        (o)   ooo                          *
*                                                *
**************************

 Finally, theres very little space saved from angling player 3&4s edges.  Its usually
better just to align the sticks so they can be used for something like smash tv.
 However, if you stick with the angles, at least made sure that All sticks are mounted
the same way.  Dont angle the actual stick itself, as it will just confuse players when
they are playing.  IE: They press up towards the screen, and end up walking a
diagonal instead.

************
*                     *
*    (o)            *
*                     *
*         oo        *
*                     *
************

 Heres another thing you can do:  Place buttons lower on the cp for the 3&4 player
setups. This can make them a little closer, saving some space.  Mostly because the
players elbows will be closer to his body, due to the angles his arms rest at. Wide
elbows leave little room for the other players.

[bkenobi]

If p1 and p2 sticks are analog (U360's for instance), you can map their output to whatever you want.  Meaning, if you want to play a tank game with p1+p3, you could align p1 diagonally so it plays (and feels) correct for that orientation.  If you then want to play something with p1+p2, you could use a different angle and it would still feel and work correctly.  Of course, you will pay a lot extra for that stick, but you can get rid of the Tron..err, Frankenstick.   

[SammyWI]

Donk: Awesome post.  Hall of fame worthy.

I'm planning on making a two player CP using wireless gamepads for the occasional 3 and 4 player games.  CP will have trackball and spinner. 

I'm thinking of modifying a wireless PC flightstick to use as a removable Tron / analog stick.  The wireless stick I have has a base that has three contact points on the base.  I want to add some small extensions to each contact point so that it will sit on the CP, over the top of the P2 buttons.  Then add some magnets to each contact point and place some pieces of steel under the CP, where I want the stick to mount.  If I use rare earth magnets and countersink the steel pieces from underneath the CP, I think the stick could be very secure yet easily removable.

As always: do what you want on your CP.   

[drventure]

Der Frankenpanel. Das Gud!

 

[rcub3]

LOL. WTF... I step away for a few hours, and this is what happens??   

Thanks to everyone who actually posted some useful info (like the combo of U360's and a regular stick on 3 and 4, etc).   

 

[pinballwizard79]

Respect the frankenpanel & tame the admin buttons

[Malenko]

donk, I might bust your balls but at least Im not a Xiaou2 about it.


Op, you should do what makes you happy. We are all just giving you feedback based on our experiences, but everyones preference is going to differ. Sift though whats posted that applies to you and go from there. Personally speaking, Im not fond of the frankenpanel because while its great to be able to play every game under the sun, the odds are you probably wont.

Look at it this way, if you build it and you dont like it, you get to take the experience and make it even better the next time.

[Donkbaca]

Everyone needs to get their balls busted once in a while. I like Malenko, the man knows his stuff (except for r-type and life force)

The facts are it will be a frankenstein panel. Embrace it or do something different.

[Xiaou2]

Of course, you will pay a lot extra for that stick, but you can get rid of the Tron..err, Frankenstick

 If he wants to play Tron or Discs of Tron, he will have a hard time using a u360, considering that theres no buttons on a U360.  Which would mean need for 3 hands, or a set of foot switches.

 Furthermore, the u360 is an expensive and lackluster option.  Its not a very good analog controller due to limited swing (and no buttons).. and its got too much swing for a typical joystick, making it nearly unplayable unless you mount restrictor plates on it. (which reduces the analog resolution to an even worse state)

 And if you want to play a 4way game... theres no physical restriction, so you either have to have a 4way restrictor plate..  or you will have troubles playing these games the same way they play with a real 4way stick.  If you do mount the 4way plate, either you have to use the ugly top mount changer, or, have to stick to a certain plate.

 
 Finally, you may wish to consider adding at least one Leafswitch button for 1&2 player.  They will allow you to fire much faster and easier on many of the classics,
with less hand fatigue.

[Xiaou2]

One more thing...

 A Tron stick might look out of place on a typical panel, merely because its not considered as part of the theme.

 For example, a Glowing tron stick works just fine on a Tron control panel, because the artwork is based on it being there.  Use of blacklight and UV painted lines... so match the glow of the stick.

 If we had a MFG that sold several colors of clear-translucent UV reactive buttons, spinner knobs..etc... then you could easily make an amazing panel in which the stick looks perfect for the panel.

 If your stick is only a black handle version, you might be able to paint it with like colors and or pinstripe it to match the artwork.  Even if for example, your Happs were comps with blue bat handles.. you could possibly find paint to match that color, and paint the stick to match the happ bats.  Clearcoat would probably be needed as well, to protect the paint.

 Point being, its mostly poor Artwork, controller color mismatching, and similar related things that really makes a panel look like an old movie prop.  It has far less to do with the number of controls.

 Then again, not everyone cares about Artwork and their panels 'looking' pretty.  They would just rather be able to play more of the games as accurately as possible.  As you can see, most of the people who strongly suggest simple layouts,
are those who dont play non-generic controller games.

[Nephasth]

If your stick is only a black handle version, you might be able to paint it with like colors and or pinstripe it to match the artwork.

ONLY a black handle version!?! No love for GORF...

[RandyT]

I just wanted to bring a little support for the offset (ergonomic?) button pattern.  If you are a big fighter enthusiast, it may tick you off.  But if not, and you play other emulators, you can get a lot closer to the feel of a diamond pattern with your buttons when they are offset.

Do what is right for you.  Doing otherwise is like buying your friend's favorite beer, instead of yours, because you know he'll bum one when he comes over.  It might be a nice thing to do, but it means that you get to drink nasty beer whether he's there or not .

[CheffoJeffo]

Do what is right for you.  Doing otherwise is like buying your friend's favorite beer, instead of yours, because you know he'll bum one when he comes over.  It might be a nice thing to do, but it means that you get to drink nasty beer whether he's there or not .

QFT

 

[HanoiBoi]

The guy Specifically says he Loves Tron.  Yet you try to talk him out of liking Tron, because YOU dont like the look of a Tron stick on HIS panel.  Is that not Insanity?

 If it isnt, then I dont know what is.

I don't always agree with Xiaou2, but when I do....I have to post.

What's confusing about this thread, and perhaps missed by many, is the title; 'Avoiding a Frankenpanel...'.  That could be almost impossible when you want to add everything.

[Malenko]

ONLY a black handle version!?! No love for GORF...

Ok, I dont know how to say that in my head. Spewing firey hatred with the word "only", but just say "gorf" really loudly? Then sob like a 12 yr old school girl with a skinned knee? Just kiddin, Xiaou2 has never let the facts slow him down, why should he start now?

Do what is right for you.  Doing otherwise is like buying your friend's favorite beer, instead of yours, because you know he'll bum one when he comes over.  It might be a nice thing to do, but it means that you get to drink nasty beer whether he's there or not .

Also, insanity is staying true to the code.

+2

Hey OP, where is the link to your build thread?

[matsadona]

The only thing that might motivate a 4 player panel is Gauntlet (imho) or maybe a 3 player for Rampage

With that said I am also a bit allergic to frankenpanels... "multi" something is always a compromise giving a less good result with a machine/tool/game able to do several things, but not being good in any. Separate/dedicated solutions is of course often better from many perspectives. And not to forget ergonomic and the esthetic part. There are a few quality builds with multiple controllers, but honestly, most of them just looks silly or worse...
But in the end, beauty is in the eye of the beholder isn't it?

The best thing is of course to have dedicated cabinets for each type of game.
If you can't do that (it is more expensive and consumes a lot of space) why not try with changeable panels?
With this considered in the design phase it can be very convenient with quick connections for easy replacement etc. That isn't much more expensive, if you keep all the interfaces etc inside the cabinet. Just some more metal or wood.

There are so many things I would have done different today, if I will ever build a new MAME cabinet. Probably I would make two - one with horizontal and one with vertical monitor. And then build a couple different control panels that could be swapped between the two cabinets.

[Donkbaca]

^^^ said perfectly.

The OP. A few extra admin buttons does not a frankenpanel make.

My main point about MAME is that a can is all about compromise, you can't have it all, you either sacrifice the playability of a few games for the sake of aesthetics and ergonomics, or you try to play everything and have a unwieldy bulky ugly cab.

The decision is for you to make, just realize it's one or the other

[Hoopz]

Do a mock up in cardboard and see how it feels.  Nothing compares to actually trying it out.  If you have children, that adds another mix into game play.

I'll also throw out there that Super Mario War is perfect on a cabinet and is a blast with 4 players.

[Bootay]

The only thing that might motivate a 4 player panel is Gauntlet (imho) or maybe a 3 player for Rampage

With that said I am also a bit allergic to frankenpanels... "multi" something is always a compromise giving a less good result with a machine/tool/game able to do several things, but not being good in any. Separate/dedicated solutions is of course often better from many perspectives. And not to forget ergonomic and the esthetic part. There are a few quality builds with multiple controllers, but honestly, most of them just looks silly or worse...
But in the end, beauty is in the eye of the beholder isn't it?

The best thing is of course to have dedicated cabinets for each type of game.
If you can't do that (it is more expensive and consumes a lot of space) why not try with changeable panels?
With this considered in the design phase it can be very convenient with quick connections for easy replacement etc. That isn't much more expensive, if you keep all the interfaces etc inside the cabinet. Just some more metal or wood.

There are so many things I would have done different today, if I will ever build a new MAME cabinet. Probably I would make two - one with horizontal and one with vertical monitor. And then build a couple different control panels that could be swapped between the two cabinets.

I have a couple dedicated cabs but eventually want to build a Mame cab. When I do, I am going the switchable control panel route since there were a lot of different games that used similar control panels i was going to build a few different control panels for the types of games I will be playing. I also have thought about going modular. Not sure how I will handle it, but it is something to consider if you want to avoid a frankenpanel. I personally hate frankenpanels.

[Xiaou2]

ONLY a black handle version!?! No love for GORF... Cry

 I dont know what your talking about, considering every Gorf Ive ever seen Has a black handle stick.  Additionally, I believe the originals are OPTICAL, thus not easy for anyone to convert.

 The only other color Handle Ive seen, besides the discussed blue tron stick, is Red, for Satans Hollow.

 And yes, I do Luv Gorf, but no, Im not going to marry him.

But if not, and you play other emulators, you can get a lot closer to the feel of a diamond pattern with your buttons when they are offset.

 While I like that your opinion is not a forceful one, such as been seen by the beat-down crew here..  I have to disagree a bit with this point.  While gamepads on consoles have a staggered arrangement, its mainly because the thumb can more easily slide from one to the other, as well as hold nearly any two buttons down with the single thumb.

 When it comes to arcade buttons, its a different story.  You dont use your thumb, and even if you used a single finger, you wouldnt use it like a gamepad... so the layout makes no real sense, and give no real advantage.  In fact, because you would use them as arcade buttons, you will more than likely end up hitting the edges of buttons on accident, even in console emulated games.

 Sega started out with a 3 button layout, which still allowed 2 buttons to be pressed with one thumb.  When fighters came out, even they went with a traditional arcade 6button layout.   Nintendo started out with the 4 button layout, and just decided to let users suffer with having to adjust to the top shoulder buttons for the high power attacks.  It worked ok, but not as good as the traditional layout.

(and hey, how are we going to emulate the shoulder buttons?  heh, j/k)

 Neo Geo arcade?  I have no idea why they chose to alter the position of the 1st button.  I think it was merely for looks.

 Btw, look at your keyboard. Even your keys are not a perfectly centered stagger. Most of the key is directly above the key your finger is resting on.  The key are also fairly flat, (unlike a traditional concave button) so even if you hit them on the edge, it doesnt feel bad.  Not so with a Happ concave button.

but when I do....I have to post.

Thanks HanoiBoi.    

 Its almost like a guy getting a gift for his friend, but instead of really getting something his friend would want...  the guy gets something HE really wants instead, figuring that his friend will like it anyway.

 People here get way too wrapped up in their own opinions and viewpoints, egos, etc.. and completely ignore what the other person is asking for / desires.  And then gets all offended when the advice isnt taken or accepted.

 While they put the obligatory 'if your wants' in there... its kind of a joke, considering the 1hr long sales pitch, then the 2 second 'but if you Really Really REALLY want to.. do whatever you want.  (But make sure you REALLY think about it, cause your wrong if you do it your way)'.

it can be very convenient with quick connections for easy replacement etc.

 Its not exactly very quick, not convenient to have to swap a panel. Not only do you have to find a place to store the beast, but then its going to take 5 minutes to bring out, swap over, and set the other panel away.  Its major buzzkill, similar to the original Laser Discs which had to be flipped over mid-way into the movie.

 Its a decent option, but its not for everyone, and its not always the best option.

one with horizontal and one with vertical monitor.

Or you could make a rotating monitor... ?  Or use a larger monitor that looks fine in either orientation ?

The decision is for you to make, just realize it's one or the other

See what I mean?  Its the typical black and white statement.  Why cant there be shades in-between?  In their world, its one or the other.  There exist no middle-ground.

I also have thought about going modular

Modulars often look worse than many other options. Theres parts lying all over the place, and the CP has lines running through it. Theres almost no way to make artwork for them that works well.  Changing the panels around is even more of a pain in the butt than an entire separate control panel.  They are much more a pain to build, and, expensive parts can be lost, broken more easily, and more easily stolen.

[rcub3]

Too many things to copy/paste/quote to reply to... Great!  Thanks for all the feedback

Re: Build Thread
I'll try to start one over the weekend.  Seeing the response here, it sounds like a good idea to get some feedback, ideas, etc before starting to make cuts, etc.

Re: multiple cabs vs multiple CP's
Yes, storing a second CP would be a pain, but building a whole new cab will ttake more time and even more space.  I'm leaning towards 2 Cp's at the moment... Aesthetics are definitively important.  Time is at a premium for me.  I'm in my 30's with a busy career and a 9mo old daughter (my first).  Maybe once I actually have a working cab to get my fix, I  may reconsider building another cab. 

Re: rotating monitor...
Yeah, I think I'm just going with a large CRT/arcade monitor to again maximize playability. 

Re: offsetting the 6 buttons
Imight not do it just for the "NeoGeo feel".  I may just leave them Street fighter style.  I do enjoy fighters quite a bit. 

[TopJimmyCooks]

and the CP has lines running through it.

True.

Theres almost no way to make artwork for them that works well. 

False.  I'm working on a mad magazine type fold up deal for my modular that is going to blow minds.   

They are much more a pain to build, and, expensive parts can be lost, broken more easily, and more easily stolen.

If building causes someone pain, why come here?  I look for the challenges as part of the hobby.  In all fairness, I can build whatever I feel like, but I can't get past the first level of Donkey Kong.  Protecting your parts is part of the design and part of the challenge.  And, theft is not such a big problem inside most people's houses.  Certainly not mine.    

A well considered modular panel is a wonderful thing and keeps the bolts off the neck.

[Vigo]

Everyone needs to get their balls busted once in a while. I like Malenko, the man knows his stuff (except for r-type and life force)

its just so funny that I agree with DoDonBaka so much but hes so hostile, its hilarious

  I love how Donkbaca and Malenko have been some kind of lovers quarrel and then go through the makeup phase. What a cute couple...do I smell a BYOAC wedding coming up?   

[Donkbaca]

Modulars often look worse than many other options. Theres parts lying all over the place, and the CP has lines running through it. Theres almost no way to make artwork for them that works well.  Changing the panels around is even more of a pain in the butt than an entire separate control panel.  They are much more a pain to build, and, expensive parts can be lost, broken more easily, and more easily stolen

.

I agree with a lot of this... except for this part:

and more easily stolen

 WTF?  

I think swappable CPs is a better solution than modular, but the problem with that is that a 4p CP is so big, you will have a lot of wasted space if you swap in a 2p CP, plus there is the hassle of storing the non-used CPs.

If you do go this route, I suggest you make one CP black, and one white.  In my oppressive world, there is no room for gray CPs

I too am a busy 30ish person, got a 22 month old and another on the way so I feel you  Aesthetics are probably important for the Wife Acceptance Factor.  That's why I ended up going with a slim build.

Good luck on the build.  Realize it will probably take you 3 times as long as you expected.  THere are so many cool things on here, it almost makes me want to build ten cabs!  Keep us posted.  

The biggest issue I have had was trying to stick to a plan.  My original idea was a simple cab with a 30 inch TV and transplanted x-arcade controls.  Now I am almost done with my cab, its completely different, its a slim, with a 21.5 inch LCD.  Browsed on here, decided to add lit buttons, lit sticks....I have my own franken-machine, not because I have so many controls, but because I am incorporating an x-box 360 into the build.

Good luck!