U360's or etc....why

[pinballwizard79]

I am doing my research, are U360's desirable because of Robotron....does MAME take advantage of analog joys on Robotron & let you hit more angles?

Or is it for the 4 way games?

Why do some of you get the 360's? I ask because if there is a clear reason I want them too 

[drventure]

I've got 2 u360's, one for P1, and one for P2.

For robotron, I just map them appropriately to P1 move and fire and they work great!

[Xiaou2]

Its desired because its multi-usage ability.

 It can be used to play 8 ways as well as 4 ways, and even analog.
This means you can use one controller instead of several.

 However, its drawback is that it does not do most of these functions as good as the original controllers.

 As a 4way stick, the stick wont have any physical restriction, which will result in reduced reaction times, and a quirky feel to it.

 As an Analog, its limited stick travel will result in a lot less accurate control.  Also, a longer handled controller will have more leverage - giving more control. (not to mention will have buttons on top of the analog stick)

 As a Robotron leaf-stick, its longer travel will mean slower reaction times.  There is no gain of angles in the game for using an analog in that game. In Robotron, any loss of time is a Huge disadvantage... as to make the game nearly impossible to play for any length of time.  Real Wico 8way leaf joysticks are the only thing that should be used for this game.

[LeedsFan]

As a Robotron leaf-stick, its longer travel will mean slower reaction times.  There is no gain of angles in the game for using an analog in that game. In Robotron, any loss of time is a Huge disadvantage... as to make the game nearly impossible to play for any length of time.  Real Wico 8way leaf joysticks are the only thing that should be used for this game.

What exactly makes the Robotron Wico's so good for that game? There was a Robotron cab at the Blackpool expo last week but it wasn't working

Do the Wico's have hardly any travel before they engage? I felt the sticks on that cab last week and they did feel kinda good. Of course no clickyness due to being leaf. But the throw didn't seem much different to any other type of stick.


Regarding the U360's I always use the circular gate. It makes 4-way games feel quite good. I simply don't like the overly square gate for 8-ways. The diagonals feel too far to me. But in 4-way mode the square gate seems fine. Just a shame you need to order the circular restrictor separately as you only get the square one as standard.

I also tried the Octagonal one but I just didn't like it at all. It's all personal preference at the end of the day.

[pinballwizard79]

Ok so here is the truth, I am 31 & when I went to arcades it was all about Killer Instinct & Time Traveler.

Now those games are great but over the years thanks to MAME I have acquired a great appreciation for the games "before my time" so to say. Ive never played a real Robotron, heresy I know but ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- man it just didnt exist in the arcades of my day. So I always wondered if Robotron (dedicated) had angles not emulated in MAME, guess not correct?

I like the restriction of a dedicated 4 way & since I have a showcase machine that means control panel real estate is plentiful...looks like I will keep a real 4 way on my new panel.

So these WICO's are the ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- eh? Well do they work on games like Street Fighter too or would that just be total horsefeathers? Where does one even acquire this awesome control device? Am I safe in assuming that those WICO's have like some uber short throw?

[isucamper]

U360s are the most versatile stick out there, able to digitally map to any type of directional stick.  However, as Xiaou said, without the physical restriction, they take some getting used to.

I've got the circular restrictors on mine and Robotron plays great.  As good as the original wico?  No, but plenty good enough if you ask me.  And it's not like you can play Street Fighter with a 4 way wico.  You're not going to find a better all purpose stick.  

[pinballwizard79]

Ok, cool thanks for the info guys.

I will prob just use a dedicated 4 way for my DK/pac fix & then standard 8 ways for all the other games not requiring restriction. I would drop the dough on the U360's if they improved robotron but it sounds like they will fare no better than a regular 8 way Happ so I appreciate the comments.

[Xiaou2]

A few things to note...

 A Wico 8way leaf stick wont be good for games like street fighter.
A square restricted joystick like the Happs Comps are much better for that.

 Wico leafs have a round edge.. and in Rortron, you tend to walk continuously from one direction to the next... so this helps very much.  If they joy has a squared edge, your stick gets kinda stuck in the corners... and prevents smooth fast transitional movements.

 The wico leafs are very touchy... so they can be bad for fighters... where you must for example jump diagonally all the sudden.  Or stop moving then start again.  They also require cleaning and adjustments on occasion.


 The 4ways have a diamond shaped restrictor edge.  So, in Pacman, when you are going to turn a corner, your stick may go from Down to Left in a straight diagonal path.  On an 8way stick, your stick might go from Down to DownLeft to Left.  And.. the path wouldnt be a smooth guided shortcut regardless.  The diamond shape really changes the feel of the game.  Makes it easier to control on games like Pacman... and much more pleasant and fun experience.

 A u360 with a circular restriction may play better than a standard 8way... but still wont compare to a real wico leaf set.  Not sure if you have to keep the circular restriction on or take it off to play other games.  I know if would make streetfighter games a lot more difficult to find diagonals, with it on.

So I always wondered if Robotron (dedicated) had angles not emulated in MAME, guess not correct?

 The original game is replicated correctly in mame.  There are no additional angles.  This adds to the challenge greatly... which makes it one of the most kick butt games of all time.
 
 FYI, Robotron uses wico 8way leaf joysticks, not 4ways.  Wico made both, as well as microswitch balltops.

 You can usually find a few on ebay here and there.  You might find a decent one on a used control panel of a different game.  They are getting harder and harder to come by.  Also, you have to be carful not to buy the knock-offs.  Supposedly a chinese company made a replica... but messed some things up, and they dont play the same as a real wico.

[Encryptor]

In The B/S/T Forum

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=107154.0

Encryptor

[cmoses]

In The B/S/T Forum

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=107154.0

Encryptor

Thanks for the plug Encryptor, that is my For Sale post.  Let me know if anyone is interested.

Thanks

[ragnar]

In my opinion, u360s are the most versatile sitck out there.  As a first stick, I think it is the only way to go.  As you add more cabs to your colelction (if you do that), doing dedicated 4 way and 8 way cabs would be the way to go.

But if you have one cab and expect to not add a second, u360s allow you to do the most.  I only wish there were larger restrictors available for it.

[nitz]

Ok, cool thanks for the info guys.

I will prob just use a dedicated 4 way for my DK/pac fix & then standard 8 ways for all the other games not requiring restriction. I would drop the dough on the U360's if they improved robotron but it sounds like they will fare no better than a regular 8 way Happ so I appreciate the comments.

Won't comment on U360s since I've never tried them, but I'll say that I'm into classics and fighters as well, and I went with a dedicated 4-way (Tornado Terry Ms. Pacman replica) and 2 Happ Comp 8-ways and I'm pretty happy with that combo. The 4 way has a bit of a long throw as others have mentioned in other threads (thinking I might try to fix that by wrapping some tape/paper up in there when I get my CP and cab back together), but the 8-ways are great for fighters IMO. As for general 8-way usage, they're fine as far as I'm concerned. I'm not that picky about having the exact right sticks for Robotron or any other game as long as the sticks make it reasonably playable. I know I ain't settin any records either way.

[wweumina]

U360's are the jack of all trades but master of few.  Very useful and almost indispensible if you only have 1 panel and want to stick to 2 joysticks (unless you are only ever going to play 8-way games).  4-way is acceptable, 8-way is better depending of course on the restrictor you use.

My impressions:
Circle restrictor - probably the most versatile, you get analog somewhat, 4-way acceptable and 8-way reasonable (unless you really need the precission diagonals)
Square restrictor set at square: pretty good for fighters etc, 4-way is difficult but playable
Square restrictor set at diamond: very good for 4-way but will be playable at best for 8-way games and will require expanding the diagonal map if you want to hit them at all
Octagonal restrictor: I really want to like it but it still feels a bit weird.