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Author Topic: New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review  (Read 17167 times)

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KevSteele

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New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« on: August 07, 2003, 10:36:49 am »
Okay, my review (both written and video) of the Wells-Gardner D9200 arcade monitor is now available on the RetroBlast site.

http://retroblast.com/d9200-1.html


Let me know what you think!

Kevin
Kevin Steele, Former Editor and Publisher of RetroBlast! and GameRoom Magazine

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #1 on: August 07, 2003, 10:38:49 am »
Error 404
Sorry! The page /d9200-1.html cannot be found. Please use the back button on your browser or click to return to the RetroBlast home page.

 ;)

xar256

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #2 on: August 07, 2003, 10:54:57 am »
Error 404
Sorry! The page /d9200-1.html cannot be found. Please use the back button on your browser or click to return to the RetroBlast home page.

 ;)

It worked for me...  <shrug>  -hope that's not trademarked.   :P

Xar256 ;D

Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #3 on: August 07, 2003, 11:09:17 am »
Kevsteele,

By chance were you aware of the "hidden" menu options that has more of the non-standard adjustments on it?  I was having a problem or two with mine out of the box and called WG.  They sent me an e-mail with a .pdf file that showed how to access the "hidden" adjustments menu and what each function did.

Just curious to know if you persued (sp?) that avenue  ;D
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Frostillicus

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #4 on: August 07, 2003, 11:17:53 am »
Kevsteele,

By chance were you aware of the "hidden" menu options that has more of the non-standard adjustments on it?  I was having a problem or two with mine out of the box and called WG.  They sent me an e-mail with a .pdf file that showed how to access the "hidden" adjustments menu and what each function did.

Just curious to know if you persued (sp?) that avenue  ;D


You gonna tell us how to get to the hidden menu? I'm intrigued...

Kev: nice review - I think the D9200 is the best piece of hardware I bought for my cab.  Looking forward to the ArcadeVGA review...
« Last Edit: August 07, 2003, 11:18:33 am by Frostillicus »

Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #5 on: August 07, 2003, 11:23:01 am »
You'll have to wait until I get home from work frost.... :-[  I can't remember off the top of my head.  I will definitely post the info, unless someone else beats me to it.  ;D
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hyiu

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #6 on: August 07, 2003, 12:42:29 pm »
other than the computer monitor plug... what other inputs can the monitor take ??

can it take something like s-video ??....

thx...
Another Brilliant mind ruined by education....  :p

KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #7 on: August 07, 2003, 02:00:04 pm »
Aceldamor,

No, I didn't know about the hidden options! (Probably because they're hidden  ;) ) Let me know once you get home, I'm dying to find out.

Hyiu,

Aside from the VGA plug, it just has an arcade input (6 pins: R, G, B, GND, V, H/V, and Comp).

No S-video or RCA-style composite input connectors, however...

Kevin
Kevin Steele, Former Editor and Publisher of RetroBlast! and GameRoom Magazine

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #8 on: August 07, 2003, 02:12:14 pm »
Good review. When I make a "super cab" I'll have to have one of those...


KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #9 on: August 07, 2003, 02:26:10 pm »
Oh, by the way, bonus points to whoever can identify the opening song. :)

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #10 on: August 07, 2003, 02:31:34 pm »
I don't have speakers here at work...


SNAAAKE

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #11 on: August 07, 2003, 02:36:28 pm »
other than the computer monitor plug... what other inputs can the monitor take ??

can it take something like s-video ??....

thx...

umm..no ;)

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #12 on: August 07, 2003, 04:00:05 pm »
Oh, by the way, bonus points to whoever can identify the opening song. :)

Kevin

I want to play ... but I hear nothing. And I have speakers ....  :o

MM

Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #13 on: August 07, 2003, 04:27:38 pm »
I'll get you that info Kevin,


I thought it was a very nice review...the only thing I would have mentioned though was that the D9200 does have some problems with refresh rates....Especially with some of the newer games (i.e. MK3) and I had a problem with some old vector games as well.  The issue is easily solved by setting Mame to run 1 refresh rate, but I do believe it is worth mentioning. *shrug* (copyright Rampy  ;D)

Great Review as always!  I was waiting for the sledge hammer through the monitor at the end though....(a la the ice joystick thing)  ;D
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KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #14 on: August 07, 2003, 05:03:09 pm »
Aceldamor,

I hadn't run into any problems with refresh rates and games, but I haven't tried to play every game in MAME yet. (give me time...)

I'll check out MK3 and some of the other vector games and see if I run into any problems.

Oh, and no sledgehammer! Not on my shiny new D9200!  ::)

I actually couldn't come up with a pointless test...I guess I could have demonstrated what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back.  :o

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #15 on: August 07, 2003, 05:13:00 pm »
I guess I could have demonstrated what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back.  :o

Kevin

Tell Us Kev, what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back?

Frostillicus

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #16 on: August 07, 2003, 06:03:56 pm »
I guess I could have demonstrated what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back.  :o

Hmm...maybe that's how you get to the 'secret' menu? ;)
 

Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #17 on: August 07, 2003, 06:35:35 pm »
I guess I could have demonstrated what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back.  :o

Hmm...maybe that's how you get to the 'secret' menu? ;)
 

I get the point frost, but I'm at work for another hour...... ;)
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KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #18 on: August 07, 2003, 07:21:09 pm »
I guess I could have demonstrated what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back.  :o

Kevin

Tell Us Kev, what happens when you grab the big red wire in the back?

http://www.arcadecontrols.com/arcade_monitors.shtml

In other words.... ZAP!
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #19 on: August 07, 2003, 07:57:17 pm »
Hopefully this isn't an obvious/stupid question, but I honestly don't know anything about the D9200:

If it has a standard 15-pin plug and can display Windows, why would you need an ArcadeVGA card?  Wouldn't any PC video card work?

Also - again because of the fact that it has a VGA plug - is there any use for the standard arcade video hookups?

Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #20 on: August 07, 2003, 09:57:20 pm »
Ok....Here is the basics....the file is actually a word doc and I don't have web space yet so I can't host it.


Hey Saint! Would it be possible to possibly host this file for all users of the D9200 on the main site?

"1.2    Factory Mode

****IMPORTANT NOTE:  WRITE DOWN MENU VALUES BEFORE CHANGING THE VALUES; ADJUSTMENTS IN FACTORY MENU WILL BECOME THE NEW SAVED RECALL VALUES IN THE USER MENU.****

To access FACTORY MENU, press DOWN and SEL simultaneously and hold.
After adjustments are made, to exit out of the FACTORY MENU,
go to RE
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KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #21 on: August 07, 2003, 10:16:54 pm »
Aceldamor,

If you could email the file to info@retroblast.com, I'll be sure and put it up in my files section.

Of course, it'd be good to get it posted here as well!

Kevin
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Aceldamor

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #22 on: August 07, 2003, 10:22:40 pm »
Aceldamor,

If you could email the file to info@retroblast.com, I'll be sure and put it up in my files section.

Of course, it'd be good to get it posted here as well!

Kevin

E-mail sent, I'll pm saint about hosting the file
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #23 on: August 08, 2003, 07:51:58 am »
Thanks for that Aceldamor.  I doubt I'll mess with that (not really any problems now...) and I'm worried about overwriting the factory settings.

 

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #24 on: August 08, 2003, 08:25:38 am »
btw, did you take a look at Oscars monitor comparison?

http://www.oscarcontrols.com/monitors.shtml

The Wells Gardner D9100 have (in my opinion) very bad output.  It was a standard VGA color depth and lost a lot.

Would you look at Spy Hunter and make a comparison?  I'm curios if the 9100 trouble was the tube, or the interface.  

Also if the 9200 looks like the 9100 with a VGA cable.. I wonder what it would look like with an ArcadeVGA (if that would make it look similar to the original)...

Last...

Does anyone have an original Spy Hunter pcb / machine around (or at local arcade)?  I would LOVE to hear which one looks more like the original.

KevSteele

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #25 on: August 08, 2003, 09:08:34 am »
Aceldamor,

Thanks for the file -- it's now up on my site:

http://retroblast.com/files.html

Lilwolf -

I'll try and take some snaps of Spy Hunter this afternoon. I'll post back once they're ready.

(Oh, and all the screenshots in the review were done with an ArcadeVGA card. I'll make a point of adding that to the review.)

Kevin
Kevin Steele, Former Editor and Publisher of RetroBlast! and GameRoom Magazine

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #26 on: August 08, 2003, 09:34:57 am »
Kevin,

Can you tell us a little about your SW/HW setup you used to test the monitor?  I know you said you used an ArcadeVGA card, but what SW did you use to test?  What version of MAME, etc...

I'm running XP here and I've considered going to an ArcadeVGA caard, but just about everything looks great running AdvanceMame.  The problem I have is sound on some games.

Anyway, curious minds want to know :)

Paul

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #27 on: August 08, 2003, 09:41:29 am »
For the review, I was using a Celeron 850@1.13ghz system (my son's - since the MAMEframe was sold, and I didn't have a second gaming computer yet!)

It was running Windows 98SE, and all of the tests were done with MAME32.

I'm in the process of assembling my new MAMEframe II computer (P4 2.66Ghz, Asus P4PE mobo, Windows XP), but I haven't gotten all the parts delivered yet (today, I hope!)

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #28 on: August 08, 2003, 11:15:24 am »
Aceldamor,

Thanks for the file -- it's now up on my site:

http://retroblast.com/files.html

Lilwolf -

I'll try and take some snaps of Spy Hunter this afternoon. I'll post back once they're ready.

(Oh, and all the screenshots in the review were done with an ArcadeVGA card. I'll make a point of adding that to the review.)

Kevin

Thanks for that Aceldamor.  I doubt I'll mess with that (not really any problems now...) and I'm worried about overwriting the factory settings.

No problem guys, I actually glad I could provide a little something back to this board since I've taken so much knoweledge away.   ;D
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #29 on: August 08, 2003, 01:19:04 pm »
Just curious how you handle this beast of monitor without, you know, getting electrocuted and dying :)
Can you safely grab the frame?

Does WG have any sort of suggested timeframe in which an arcade monitor might need service?

I'm stll "too damn chicken" to deal with a real arcade monitor........
But it would be nice....
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2003, 01:24:11 pm »
Oh, and as an aside, I'm starting to really look forward to Kev's video reviews :)

Seeing that monitor in action is very cool indeed...
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #31 on: August 08, 2003, 01:30:45 pm »
Hopefully this isn't an obvious/stupid question, but I honestly don't know anything about the D9200:

If it has a standard 15-pin plug and can display Windows, why would you need an ArcadeVGA card?  Wouldn't any PC video card work?

Also - again because of the fact that it has a VGA plug - is there any use for the standard arcade video hookups?

Umm..you don't 'need' an ArcadeVGA.
Any video card will do.
You need an ArcadeVGA to run 15khz(standard) so games look authentic(spelling?).
JUST like how it is in the arcades.

The monitor is muliti sync.
CGA,EGA,VGA.

cga=15khz standard resolution
ega=24khz medium resolution(nfl bliz runs medium resolution)
vga=31khz 640x480.
 ;)
« Last Edit: August 08, 2003, 01:37:34 pm by SNAAAKE »

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #32 on: August 08, 2003, 01:51:11 pm »
Just curious how you handle this beast of monitor without, you know, getting electrocuted and dying :)
Can you safely grab the frame?

Yes, you can safely grab the frame (and the tube) -- the big red wire is the anode, and that's the part with 20-30,000 volts. You definitely do not want to grab the wire and the frame at the same time!

Once you've got the monitor installed in a cab it's no longer a threat.

Does WG have any sort of suggested timeframe in which an arcade monitor might need service?

I'm stll "too damn chicken" to deal with a real arcade monitor........
But it would be nice....

The D9200 is pretty painless (well, until you try to lift it  :o) as far as arcade monitors go -- no custom wiring, just plug in the power cable and VGA cable and you're ready to play.

WG doesn't have any service timeframe, but they do include a complete parts list (down to the diodes) and a full schematic of the circuit boards. I suspect almost any electronics tech could repair one given this information.

(Oh, and thanks for the compliments!)

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #33 on: August 08, 2003, 02:20:47 pm »
..now lets see it smash the hell outta some ice ;)
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #34 on: August 08, 2003, 02:22:31 pm »
..now lets see it smash the hell outta some ice ;)


Actually, I just got a set of the new SlikStik ball-top stainless steel joysticks today. They look good for smashing...well, just about anything.  ;)

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #35 on: August 08, 2003, 03:59:02 pm »
Hey Kevin,

The only thing I saw that seemed a little off is that you said something along the lines of "the unit I received had some convergence problems", or something like that.

I think that what you see is actually the "norm" for an arcade class monitor.  Measured against a PC monitor (which often has up to 3 large circuit boards for convergence and other nitpicky stuff) it's going to come up short every time.  I think you may have mentioned this, but it probably has more in common with an RGB capable TV set than a PC monitor, outside of the ability to multi-sync.

Still well done though ;)

RandyT

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #36 on: August 08, 2003, 04:33:14 pm »
Well, I do mention that as a PC monitor it's only mediocre, but that it excels as an arcade monitor. The PC display is worse than a real PC monitor, but better than a "TV out" solution.

The convergence problem on my unit is noticeable, especially with PC display modes. White lines near the top middle of the screen "break apart" into two separate colored lines, as does text.

You don't notice it in an arcade game as much, although if there's white text at the top (a score, perhaps) you do notice the color ghosting.

Monitors have a lot of variation in them, and I've seen worse convergence in some cheaper PC monitors, especially those that had no convergence controls, ironically.

The more expensive monitors, the ones that had convergence adjustments, didn't actually need them.  ;)

I've also had monitors that "fixed" their convergence problems miraculously, and I suspect that it may be related to the whole degaussing/color purity issue. I won't know for certain until I get the monitor into it's final home and give it a good degaussing.

I'm being nit-picky, I know, but in the end the display is one of the most-used parts of a computer system. It helps to go into a big purchase like the D9200 knowing what level of display quality to expect.

I'm not returning it, that's for sure.  ;D

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #37 on: August 08, 2003, 05:23:55 pm »
Hopefully this isn't an obvious/stupid question, but I honestly don't know anything about the D9200:

If it has a standard 15-pin plug and can display Windows, why would you need an ArcadeVGA card?  Wouldn't any PC video card work?

You can use a PC card, but you'll be outputting at 640x480.  Since arcade games run at a variety of resolutions you may need to stretch the image to fill the screen, which usually means a somewhat distorted image.

What ArcadeVGA does is output at resolutions other than 640x480, in fact it tries to output at the exact resolutions of the games you're playing, thus no stretching of the image, thus an arcade perfect image.

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #38 on: August 08, 2003, 06:15:21 pm »
 
 Actually... my older ATI Radion 7000ve pumps out 800*600 to my 27" panasonic tv w/ svideo.   And with the latest drivers... it does 1024*768.  

  Also...theres a nice adjustment for either  More Clarity (more flicker) or Less Flicker (slight loss of clarity).  I believe at resolutions greater than 800*600 it uses interlacing technology.

  I think people mis-read into the whole "authentic' thing... as most older arcade games will never look correct on a 9200.  The reason being a much smaller dot pitch... (and Im sure there are other factors as well with the older display technology they use)

  Look at the differences in colors for instance in my turbo machine on an older monitor:

 

 
 Heres a shot from my Older ati card that didnt support the higher resolutions and capability that my radion does now.  Ill try to take some new pics of the radions capability.

 Spyhunter closup on Panasonic 27" + old 8meg ati card w/ svideo out:





 
 

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #39 on: August 08, 2003, 06:45:57 pm »
 Actually... my older ATI Radion 7000ve pumps out 800*600 to my 27" panasonic tv w/ svideo.   And with the latest drivers... it does 1024*768.  

  Also...theres a nice adjustment for either  More Clarity (more flicker) or Less Flicker (slight loss of clarity).  I believe at resolutions greater than 800*600 it uses interlacing technology.

Display modes output to TV's from PC video cards are always interlaced.  At 800x600 and above it must use scaling to display a picture.  The highest res an NTSC video monitor can show without scaling (but still interlaced) is about 720x486.

Quote
 I think people mis-read into the whole "authentic' thing... as most older arcade games will never look correct on a 9200.  The reason being a much smaller dot pitch... (and Im sure there are other factors as well with the older display technology they use)

Not quite true.  The 9200, according to WG, has a dot-pitch of about .83mm, which is pretty much right on par with those old monitors.  The lack of perfect convergence, something inherent to both TV's and arcade monitors also seems to be pretty faithfully reproduced :).

All that is really left after that is possibly pixel shape, which may or may not be the same (hard to see anyway) and scan rates.  If the scan lines are where they are supposed to be with the same amount of graphics data as the original riding on them in the proper proportions, you really can't get any closer.


RandyT

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #40 on: August 08, 2003, 11:41:01 pm »

 Are you shure about that?  Maybe this tv has higher resolution than older models?   Theres definitely tv monitor hybrids that do - so this may be the case.  

 Weather or not the Ati knows this - and or auto interlaces is another story.    All I can say is that even at 1024*768 with flicker off - its a rock solid picture.  No jitter, flicker, dot crawl, jumpiness...ect.

 As for display technology... I believe that most older arcade monitors have been replaced with newer versions that preform differently.  

 Also... I find it hard to belive that monitors havnt changed in dot pitch much from say Pacman to the present..IE:  9200s.   Maybe we are taking the difference betweem Low res monitors and med to high-res.    In such a case... using a med res monitor instead of a low-res monitor would definitly change the look of the game.

 Id like to see someone pop a picture of turbo out of a 9200 that looks anywhere close to the cololrs and look of the one in the pic I posted.    The pic will most likely be too clean and wont blend the pixels and colors correctly.


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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #41 on: August 09, 2003, 08:02:04 am »
Sorry I didn't get the Turbo or Spy Hunter shots with the  D9200/ArcadeVGA done yesterday (family matters), and I'm afraid I won't be able to get them done today as well (that darn family thing again ;-)

I'll try and get some pics up tomorrow morning. Sorry!

Kevin "Yes, I have a life, darnit!" Steele
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #42 on: August 09, 2003, 12:25:34 pm »
I would be surprised if you could call up a convergence grid but NOT have any way to adjust it.

Those of us who own bigscreen or widescreen Rear Projectors know all about the fun that is the 64 point convergence, and even better are the service-modes (the 'special modes' referred to above) where you have to calibrate each Gun directly..Ahhh the joys of owning technology!

For what its worth, on a curved-survace display convergence to me would almost be an afterthought....as would be geometry issues.   its an arcade monitor, you're not watching movies on it....unless there are major geometry issues (scrolling seems warped in one spot all the time, etc) I'd just ignore it.

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #43 on: August 09, 2003, 12:30:15 pm »
Just curious how you handle this beast of monitor without, you know, getting electrocuted and dying :)
Can you safely grab the frame?

Yes, you can safely grab the frame (and the tube) -- the big red wire is the anode, and that's the part with 20-30,000 volts. You definitely do not want to grab the wire and the frame at the same time!

Once you've got the monitor installed in a cab it's no longer a threat.


I thought the D9200 had a self-discharge feature?  Not that you would ever want to test that to see how well it is working.   :P

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #44 on: August 09, 2003, 04:27:13 pm »
I would be surprised if you could call up a convergence grid but NOT have any way to adjust it.

The convergence grid is generated  by a program called NTEST, not the monitor itself.

Like I mentioned, it's not major problem but it is noticable, at least if you know where to look. Of course, I'm notoriously picky when it comes to monitors. It's not a major problem -- especially during gameplay.

I'm just coming at the whole thing from the perspective of a computer monitor owner, not an arcade monitor owner, which means I am perhaps unfairly pointing out things that cannot be overcome or avoided in an arcade monitor.

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #45 on: August 09, 2003, 06:44:46 pm »
Are you shure about that?  Maybe this tv has higher resolution than older models?   Theres definitely tv monitor hybrids that do - so this may be the case.  

If it's NTSC or PAL video standard, which it is when using composite or Svideo inputs, then it is interlaced.  It's part of the standard.

Quote
Weather or not the Ati knows this - and or auto interlaces is another story.    All I can say is that even at 1024*768 with flicker off - its a rock solid picture.  No jitter, flicker, dot crawl, jumpiness...ect.

It's still interlaced and scaled at 1024x768.  Some of the newer graphics cards can do some tricks to reduce flicker and make text more readable, but they trade off other desireable attributes like sharpness and color accuracy to do so.

Quote
As for display technology... I believe that most older arcade monitors have been replaced with newer versions that preform differently.  

 Also... I find it hard to belive that monitors havnt changed in dot pitch much from say Pacman to the present..IE:  9200s.   Maybe we are taking the difference betweem Low res monitors and med to high-res.    In such a case... using a med res monitor instead of a low-res monitor would definitly change the look of the game.

As I stated, the shape of the pixels may be a bit different, but the size and amount of space between them has remained fairly consistent.  A .83 dot pitch is mucho coarse compared to the standard .25 (or better) of a PC monitor.  Also keep in mind that these numbers usually go up relative to overall screen size.

Quote
Id like to see someone pop a picture of turbo out of a 9200 that looks anywhere close to the cololrs and look of the one in the pic I posted.    The pic will most likely be too clean and wont blend the pixels and colors correctly.

No offense, but that monitor looks to be a "hurting unit".  If that thing is as old as I think it is, it's not really a fair comparison with a fresh out of the box unit.  I spent a ton of cash on Turbo in my youth and never remembered it looking like that :).  Also, keep in mind that you are looking at a vertically oriented game.  Showing this one horizontally and trying to compare the two isn't going to cut it.

RandyT

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #46 on: August 11, 2003, 05:52:30 pm »
Okay, I know I promised some pics of Spy Hunter on the D9200, but I got busy, and the god of delayed promises has smote me down:

My D9200 monitor has died. It looks to be a bad board, and I'll do my best to get those pics up once I've got the new board set installed, but it won't be for a week or so.

You know you're got too much emotionally invested in your hobby when an equipment failure ruins your day...  :'(

(Sigh...)

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #47 on: August 11, 2003, 06:45:06 pm »
Okay, I know I promised some pics of Spy Hunter on the D9200, but I got busy, and the god of delayed promises has smote me down:

My D9200 monitor has died. It looks to be a bad board, and I'll do my best to get those pics up once I've got the new board set installed, but it won't be for a week or so.

You know you're got too much emotionally invested in your hobby when an equipment failure ruins your day...  :'(

(Sigh...)

Kevin


Does this affect your opinion/review?
« Last Edit: August 11, 2003, 06:45:29 pm by CitznFish »
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #48 on: August 11, 2003, 07:59:10 pm »
There is a snap shot of spyhunter on a D9200 on my website.

Quote
I think people mis-read into the whole "authentic' thing... as most older arcade games will never look correct on a 9200.  The reason being a much smaller dot pitch... (and Im sure there are other factors as well with the older display technology they use)

The scanline of the D9200 changes when going from 15kHz to 25kHz.  At 15kHz, the pixel size is identical to traditional 15kHz arcade monitors.  At 25kHz, the pixel size is identical to traditional 25kHz arcade monitors.


The pixel size of MAME games on a TV (480 interlaced) is identical to the pixel size of MAME on a D9200 at 31.5 kHz.  The only difference between the two displays is the refresh rate, otherwise they are identical.

The pixel size of MAME on a TV at 15kHz (not interlaced) is identical to the pixel size of MAME on a D9200 at 15kHz.
 
« Last Edit: August 11, 2003, 08:04:54 pm by desmatic »

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #49 on: August 11, 2003, 09:17:06 pm »
Does this affect your opinion/review?

Yup, at least a little. I'm going to wait until I get the replacement boards and see how it goes.

Bad: Monitor board went bad.
Good: No wait for tech support, very helpful, and (hopefully) quick turnaround.

I'll update the monitor review once the matter's all settled.

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #50 on: August 11, 2003, 09:39:49 pm »
I noticed something curious in your review.  It looks like you were running your monitor at 37.5 kHz.  If so, that's a very dangerous frequency to run a d9200 at.  Maybe that's why it died prematurely.

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #51 on: August 11, 2003, 10:27:35 pm »
I didn't notice that, but that's the output I was getting from the ArcadeVGA card. I'm surprised.

Things that make you go hmmm....

Thanks for pointing that out, it's one more thing I'll have to look into!

Kevin
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #52 on: August 11, 2003, 11:24:52 pm »
I noticed something curious in your review.  It looks like you were running your monitor at 37.5 kHz.  If so, that's a very dangerous frequency to run a d9200 at.  Maybe that's why it died prematurely.

Ummm......isn't that the 800x600 mode that everyone seems to run unofficially?

RandyT

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #53 on: August 12, 2003, 01:20:02 am »
It hurts my brain.  In fact, I need a beer just to think about it.  Why so many insist on running 800x600 is truly beyond me.  Aside from the fact that it is clearly overclocking the monitor to a very dangerous level, the D9200 only has 640 triads, so at 800x600 1 pixel = .8 triads.  This means that what would normally be a beautifully clear image, is simply blurry and goofed.  I just don't get it.  Maybe someone can explain it to me, I'm struggling with the allure of it.  I'm under the impression that many are doing it, though, and that the premature deaths of many precious D9200s are inevitable.
« Last Edit: August 12, 2003, 01:27:13 am by desmatic »

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #54 on: August 12, 2003, 07:23:29 am »
You may be on to something -- I was running at 640x480, with only occasional trips to 800x600 for testing (which was when those pics were taken).

However, in setting up my new computer, XP insisted on bumping things up to 800x600, with no way to get back to 640x480 (at least, until I installed Multires). Unfortunately, this meant that the monitor was running at 800x600 for a long stretch.

The other thing that happened, however, is that I moved the monitor. Only about 10 feet into the gameroom, but it was movement, and that may have jarred something loose.

Basically, the monitor was working perfectly, then I unplugged it and moved it and then it was dead (well, not dead, but on life support.)

I'm curious about how long any D9200 owner has run this monitor at 800x600? Could that have been the cause?

Kevin
« Last Edit: August 13, 2003, 10:16:15 am by kevsteele »
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #55 on: August 12, 2003, 07:35:01 am »


However, in setting up my new computer, XP insisted on bumping things up to 800x600, with no way to get back to 640x480 (at least, until I installed Multires). Unfortunately, this meant that the monitor was running at 800x600 for a long stretch.

Kevin

You can still get 640x480 on XP without any special software, it is in the standard video area, look for a button that says "List All Modes", I believe it is under "Advanced" and on the adaptor tab. I am not in front of an XP comp at the moment, otherwise I could say for sure, but I use 640x480 under XP fairly frequently.
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #56 on: August 13, 2003, 09:59:59 am »
My D9200 failed in the same manner as Kevin's after only about 10 hours.  I had never used 800x600 at that point.

However, I use 800x600 occasionally now (for vector games and for Windows when getting a new rom), so if this really will damage the D9200, I definitely want to know about it. :)

Wade

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #57 on: August 13, 2003, 11:44:52 am »
My D9200 failed in the same manner as Kevin's after only about 10 hours.  I had never used 800x600 at that point.

However, I use 800x600 occasionally now (for vector games and for Windows when getting a new rom), so if this really will damage the D9200, I definitely want to know about it. :)

Wade

It could quite easily destroy your monitor.  It's well over the recommended operating frequencies which means you are deffinitely taking a gamble.

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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #58 on: August 19, 2003, 08:08:06 pm »
Finally, as promised, a pic of Spy Hunter on the D9200:



The D9200 is working like a charm now, btw.  ;D
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Re:New Wells-Gardner D9200 Monitor Review
« Reply #59 on: August 21, 2003, 10:40:48 am »
REVIEW UPDATE

I've updated my written review of the D9200 to add in the experiences I had with the board failure and in dealing with WG tech support.

http://retroblast.com/reviews.html

All's well that ends well, I suppose, but it's never a good feeling when a product goes belly-up after only two weeks...

Kevin
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