*&#&*%$^(&#%!!!!! Collection Agencies

[SirPeale]

I need some advice from our legally-savvy folk.

About 15 years ago I lived in NY state.  Had phone service, yadda yadda yadda.

At one point I moved down the state a bit, lived in this house for about six months.

During that time I had MCI as my long distance carrier.  But for some strange reason I kept getting bills from AT & T for calls I didn't make.  Stuff to Daytona Beach, FL and some place in Delaware, and some others.

For a while I'd call the phone company, explain that these weren't our calls, and they'd reverse the charges.  We had a couple repair guys out to see if they could sort out what the problem was, but they couldn't find any problems.  But the calls kept going on our bill.  Finally, they refused to reverse the charges, stating "well, *someone* is making those calls, and from what we see, it's coming from your line."

So we bent over and took it, because we knew we were moving shortly.

We moved to Vermont.  And today in the mail, I received a collection notice from "afnicollections.com" that we owed $21.96 to them for an outstanding debt to our former phone company, during a period of time we didn't live there.

I called, and told them this story.  They said "Oh, you might as well just pay this, it'll cost you more money to fight it than the bill is for."

They told me I could dispute it on their site.  What a joke...I plugged in the account info, it came up with the same info on the notice.  There was a section to explain the dispute.  I typed in "did not live in area at time of dispute" and it told me it was too long!

I think I got it all...what now?

[Cakemeister]

They will set up something that calls you every day at the same time, every day, for the rest of your life.

I have two of them calling me.

You might be better off changing your phone number, or even eliminating your home phone and going cellular-only.

[SirPeale]

They asked for my phone number, and I told them 'no way.'  Of course they probably got it from called ID.

[ChadTower]

That is too long.  All you're supposed to put is ---fudgesicle--- you.

[ahofle]

 

[shmokes]

The statue of limitations in NY for collecting an old debt is 6 years.  The statute of limitations starts tolling on debt from the moment of the last activity, so if they even talk you into making a $5 payment it will start over again, even if it had already run previously.  But if there has been no activity on that phone line in 15 years they can't collect. 

Send them a cease and desist letter.  Here's a great one.  You can just fill in the blanks.

[saint]

I believe they have to stop calling you if you tell them to. Fight it, or pay it, but don't ignore it. If you fight it, get and put *everything* in writing. Don't rely on anything being verbal.

[shmokes]

Oh yeah, and keep an eye on your credit report.  Collection agencies are scum bags.  They break the law on a regular basis (they are probably breaking the law by calling you).  One common tactic is to sell the debt and "re-age" it, as though the sale of the debt counts as account activity.  It doesn't, and it's illegal, and if called on it by a court they will claim that it was an error.  If you see that the debt has be re-aged on your credit report you need to call them on that right away.  Also, if you do get a letter that they are taking you to court (which I can't imagine over $25), DON'T IGNORE IT.  It doesn't matter that the statute of limitations has run if you don't show up.  Nothing matters.  The court will not look at a single fact in the case.  If you don't show up, the agency will get a default judgment, and the judgment will be put on your credit report.

[SavannahLion]

Report to the BBB, that's what I did.

I used to subscribe to SAT/SUN delivery for a newspaper. I paid for and received the newspaper for about six months when it gradually petered out. I never received any renewal notice, any request for continued payment. Nothing. I called a few times when I calculated that they owed me for at least another six months of newspapers. The newspaper would start up sporadically then peter out again within the month. Finally I just said ---fudgesicle--- it. I didn't care enough about the $20 some odd dollars they owed me or the newspaper. Finally at the end of the year, I suddenly got about a months worth of newspapers. Not just weekend, but for the entire month, MON-SUN. I figured they were trying to "consume" what they owed me. I made one phone query and they assured me they would look into the matter. Nothing more came of it for at least six months until I received a PAST DUE, SECOND NOTICE bill for something like $40!! Where the ---fudgesicle--- was my first one??

After multiple phone calls spanning several weeks with me calling at every imaginable hour I got nowhere. Whenever I got a promising supervisor who would rescind the bill, I would get another past due notice in the mail. When I call back, no one would know who the ---fudgesicle--- I talked to last time (yes even with a name). When I received threats it wold go to a collection agency I lodged a complaint to the BBB.

Within the week, I received a paper letter of apology and the bill was rescinded .

[SirPeale]

The statue of limitations in NY for collecting an old debt is 6 years.  The statute of limitations starts tolling on debt from the moment of the last activity, so if they even talk you into making a $5 payment it will start over again, even if it had already run previously.  But if there has been no activity on that phone line in 15 years they can't collect. 

Send them a cease and desist letter.  Here's a great one.  You can just fill in the blanks.

This is great info, thanks!

They haven't called (I don't think they have our number, I hope) just the one notice in the mail. 

I admit, I know my credit isn't the best, but I know what I've done - and what I haven't.  I'll get a copy of my credit report soon and check it out.  I've never done so.

[FrizzleFried]

If the bill truly is from 15 years ago tell the collection agency to go screw themselves.  If an account has no activity on it for 7 years maximum it's written off.  These --bags of cream-filled twinkies-- have bought a bunch of worthless paper (that is what the collection agencies call "old bills") and are trying to scare --bags of cream-filled twinkies-- in to paying.  I'd simply tell them "I don't owe the bill,  don't call here any more,  you are on notice.  If you continue to harass me I will sue." and then hang up.

[DrewKaree]

The statue of limitations in NY for collecting an old debt is 6 years.  The statute of limitations starts tolling on debt from the moment of the last activity, so if they even talk you into making a $5 payment it will start over again, even if it had already run previously.  But if there has been no activity on that phone line in 15 years they can't collect. 

Send them a cease and desist letter.  Here's a great one.  You can just fill in the blanks.

This is great info, thanks!

They haven't called (I don't think they have our number, I hope) just the one notice in the mail. 

I admit, I know my credit isn't the best, but I know what I've done - and what I haven't.  I'll get a copy of my credit report soon and check it out.  I've never done so.

Peale, go to www.clarkhoward.com  Do some searching around.  You'll find the REAL site where you can get your government-mandated FREE credit report from all 3 credit reporting agencies.  You should also find some information on how to deal with these jerks.  As shmokes said too, you CANNOT ignore their "we're taking you to court" letters.  One thing I've learned as well is this:  When they told you to "go to their site", that's the BS they feed people to make them think they're "on your side" and that they want to help you fix this.  It's not.  You NEED to send them actual letters stating what the problem is, the account they're trying to stick you with, and what you want the response to be (since you're in the right).  You also send it with whatever manner of postal method you need to insure that not only did they RECEIVE IT, but that SOMEONE physically accepted it.  Usually that means certified mail, but it's been a while since I had to dick around with something like this, and www.clarkhoward.com was where I went for info.  IIRC, they've got an entire section dedicated to this, and REAMS of information on it.

[SirPeale]

All the while I was on the phone with them, she kept saying "if you just pay this, it'll be done, otherwise we're going to report this on your credit report."  I said "This is hysterical, you guys coming at me with a 15 year old bill that never happened." She said "You think us reporting you to the credit agency is hysterical?  This isn't going to go away, sir."

Scare tactics.  Love it.

[SirPeale]

Thanks for the link, Drew.  Some interesting reading there.

http://clarkhoward.com/shownotes/category/12/103/358/

[FrizzleFried]

Feb 15, 2008 -- Fight back against zombie debt collectors
RIP-OFF ALERT: Zombie debt is a lucrative and illegal part of the debt-collection world that Clark wants to warn you about. Scavenger collectors buy up expired debts that can be up to 30 years old for as little as 1 penny on the dollar. Then they unleash vicious collectors to try to collect, and frequently violate the Fair Debt Collection Practices Act in the process. They may be going after debts set aside in bankruptcy; stemming from ID theft; or that have passed the statute of limitations, which is typically 4 years on credit card debt. There is no legal way they can collect these debts, but that doesn't stop the scavengers from trying to intimidate you.

This is not a discussion about whether or not you should pay your bills; this is about what your rights are on old debts. The scavengers are so good that they typically collect about 13 cents on every dollar. Many of them also engage in illegal activities by wrongfully putting old debts back on your credit report; harassing you over the phone; or secretly taking money out of your account. If you're being harassed by a zombie debt collector, send them a certified letter stating the debt is invalid and instructing them to stop contacting you. But beware that scavengers don't care if the debt is valid. They've declared war on your wallet and will use any tactics. Be tough and know your rights.

Good stuff right there...

[RayB]

She's paid commissions on accounts collected. It's in her interest to do whatever it takes to get money.

[Jdurg]

I had something like this come up against me a few months ago.  An ambulance service company suddenly started sending me threatening letters about how they were taking me to court because I hadn't paid my bill.  I called up the billing department and got nothing.  (The ambulance company used an outside service for their billing collections).  I had many letters from insurance showing how the company used the wrong claim number on my account and proof that the delay in payment was their fault and not mine.  Eventually, the proper bill was sent out and I paid it.  They claimed they never received it.

Finally, I sent them a VERY angry certified letter with the payment in there and told them to stop bugging me.  They didn't stop.  They still sent out bills and suddenly stopped answering the phone.  Fed up, I called the ambulance company themselves and talked to them.  They were VERY nice and told me that I'm not the first one to complain about the billing company and that this would probably be the last straw for them.  The ambulance company was very nice and worked with me to get their funds and then also said "We never take anybody to court.  In nearly all cases, unpaid bills are caused by the elderly people that we typiclaly serve and it's just not worth it to take them to court.  Based upon our agreement with the billing company, they can't send collections after anyone or take them to court unless we agree to it.  If they do, they are breaking the law".  

So that was nice to hear and eventually the bill was paid off.  Still, I FULLY understand the frustration and outrage.

[JackTucky]

They will not take you to court.  They want to scare you.  And when they hold your credit report as hostage, tell them you have arrest for rape on your credit report so you don't care.  Seriously, 15 year old debts don't mean ---steaming pile of meadow muffin---.

Last time I bought a car they brought out my credit report.  The finance manager says, "what's this $94.98 charge off?"  I said, I paid for cable at a beach house with my buddies and some dude threw up on the cable box.  I didn't want to pay.

We laughed and I bought the car.  Tell them to eff off.

=J

[saint]

Timely article on this on CNN.COM

http://www.cnn.com/2008/LIVING/personal/02/29/rogue.debt.collectors/index.html

[JimmyU]

Go here Peale.  They have a ton of useful info on how to deal with debt collectors.

[shmokes]

They will not take you to court.  They want to scare you. 

Do not count on this.  If you seem to ignore everything they send at you, they will often take you to court counting on you not showing up.  It doesn't matter whether the SOL has run or how weak their case is.  If you don't show up, they get a default judgment.  It is BY FAR the most common way credit card companies collect unpaid debts.

[quarterback]

Send them a cease and desist letter.  Here's a great one.  You can just fill in the blanks.

Great link.  Thanks

[SirPeale]

Good news!  I received a letter from them yesterday.  State they were closing the account, and I owed nothing.  It even apologized for the inconvenience.  Said that the letter was proof of this, and to hold on to it "just in case".