Daphne problems - error with DaphneLoader

[Anubis_au]

Hi all

As part of the setting up and configuring of my MAME pc, I've been looking at various other emulators, one of which is Daphne.

I downloaded the various files needed for Daphne, installed it according to UncleT's guide (thank again, UncleT). I got Dragon's Lair to test out Daphne with, but something is not right.

The Dragon's Lair movie is a single .m2v file, and the framefile has only one frame reference point, to frame 151.

When I launch Dragon's Lair, the following sequence of images / videos are seen on screen:

1. A whole bunch of white 'static' pictures with black writing flash by quickly on screen (looks like system setup / initiation information)
2. A whole bunch of coloured 'static' pictures with writing flash by quickly (looks like info on inserting coincs for 1,2 player games, congratulations you've reached this section / finished the game etc - I read flashes of it, and it seems this part of the video is all the game on-screen messages).
3. The Dragon's Lair title comes on, and then the intro video (you play Dirk the Daring etc) plays, for only ten seconds or so
4. The video resets to the Dragon's Lair title screen, and then plays the intro video properly and all the way through.
5. I insert coins, and it brings up a screen telling me to insert coins for 1,2 player game
6. I press Start Game, and it goes through various scenes of the game, not allowing me to make any moves, and so Dirk dies / regens / dies / regens etc

Has anyone experienced this sort of thing with their Daphne setup? Any advice where / what I'm going / doing doing?

If it helps, I'm running Daphne via MaLa via batch file call, exactly as UncleT's guide has it (ie with nohwaccel turned on).

[ahofle]

FWIW, my installation of Daphne does exactly what you describe in steps 1-5.  But of course I am able to move once the game starts.   

[Anubis_au]

From memory, the 'game' sequence, once started, goes something like this:

Dirk runs through a gate
Dirk faces a wall being bricked, and tries to jump through
Dirk gets brocked up and dies
Dirk regens
Dirk jumps on a flying horse
Dirk crashes into a pylon and dies

etc

At no point do I get to make any moves to save Dirk. What should be happening at this point in the game?

[ahofle]

Do you know what version of DL rom you have?  There is an 'enhanced' version which has the 'correct' sequencing (Dirk goes over moat, over drawbridge, into castle, etc).  The original game's sequencing was incorrect apparently.

Original sequence:
http://www.dragons-lair-project.com/games/related/sequence.asp

Correct 'intended' sequence (enhanced romset):
http://www.dragons-lair-project.com/tech/enhancements/dle21.asp

At any rate, if you are seeing the wall being bricked scene first, try pressing up on the joystick.  That should advance you to the next scene.  Here is the complete walkthrough:
http://www.dragons-lair-project.com/games/related/walkthru/lair/easy.asp

[Dmod]

Sounds like the game is running properly...  and is just not recognizing your joystick entries.  There's a place where you can configure input controls for Daphne.  By default, it's probably just set up for keyboard inputs.  You'll need to configure your joystick settings.

When you move the joystick, you should be able to hear a short beep.

Since the game is all prerecorded animations, you don't really "move" Dirk so much as pick a direction that controls the next animation sequence that gets played.  Try watching for flashes in the animation that give hints on which direction to move next.

[Anubis_au]

If my game is set up properly, then my memory of the game must be wrong.

Isn't there an intro video once you start playing the game?

The Daphne version has Dirk at that brick wall and dying within three or four seconds of the game starting... Is this correct?

The truth is, when I was 'testing' the game before, I was expecting an intro video like I (thought I) remembered, so wasn't even pressing directions, thus Dirk died within seconds etc. Just now, ready for it, I got Dirk through some of the scenes.

But it just seems weird... a game can be over in around twenty seconds if you are not ready for it... is this how the game actually plays?

[ahofle]

That's certainly how I remember it.  I remember the first time I tried Dragon's Lair at the arcade.  I instantly died 3 times, one of which involved me drinking a bottle of poison.  Then the 'game over' screen.  I remember thinking "WTF...quickest waste of $0.50 in history." 

You should try the enhancement version.  It's much more logically laid out.

[bfauska]

That's exactly how my game play experience went too in the arcade too.  One of the major reasons I want to try Daphne sometime is that I don't dare risk more money in a real machine when I sucked so badly at that game in the past, but everybody seems to fondly remember that game so I have to try it again.

[Havok]

6. I press Start Game, and it goes through various scenes of the game, not allowing me to make any moves, and so Dirk dies / regens / dies / regens etc

Has anyone experienced this sort of thing with their Daphne setup? Any advice where / what I'm going / doing doing?

If it helps, I'm running Daphne via MaLa via batch file call, exactly as UncleT's guide has it (ie with nohwaccel turned on).

What are you using for an encoder? Daphne may not support it - I have problems with it working on my GPWiz, it seems to only fully support a keyboard encoder...

[shorthair]

What are you using for an encoder? Daphne may not support it - I have problems with it working on my GPWiz, it seems to only fully support a keyboard encoder...

I seem to remember this being a support question asked at the Daphne forum. Although, there is a 'joystick' configuration called 'button config' that may address this?

But, Anubis, I would say you haven't configured it for your controller. Like Mame, it has a default setting set. Unlike Mame, where you can just select a controller supported, you have to do each key manually. No worries, though - just click on the configure button in the Daphne gui, then the config keys button. There also may be a button - or function that pops up when you select 'ok' - to apply this to all games. I remember something like this but can't readily check right now.

[Havok]

I seem to remember this being a support question asked at the Daphne forum. Although, there is a 'joystick' configuration called 'button config' that may address this?

But, Anubis, I would say you haven't configured it for your controller. Like Mame, it has a default setting set. Unlike Mame, where you can just select a controller supported, you have to do each key manually. No worries, though - just click on the configure button in the Daphne gui, then the config keys button. There also may be a button - or function that pops up when you select 'ok' - to apply this to all games. I remember something like this but can't readily check right now.

Hehe - that was me that brought it up in the Daphne forum. They all tried to tell me that the GPWiz was the same as the Ipac... 

I finally got to the point where I was able confirm that you can get the joystick to work, however it does not recognize the buttons. (Even doing the keys\button config)

[ahofle]

It sounds like his controls are not an issue, he just died a lot. 

Just now, ready for it, I got Dirk through some of the scenes.

[Anubis_au]

It sounds like his controls are not an issue, he just died a lot. 

Something like that

Imagine the scene: you've created your own framefile, not sure if its working properly or not, but you start the game anyway, Dirk runs in and is dead in three seconds. Then respawns and dies.

Natural to think the game was stuffed...

Meh, enough defending myself. It works.

Now I just have to get back to making visual pinball look nice...

[dgrams2000]

If the demo is not playing all the way through, there is something messed up in the frame file or somewhere else.
If it (the demo) is not playing through correctly, you won't get the gameplay to work at all.

I haven't messed with my daphne stuff for a long time (since it is working)
but what versions of it, and which DL roms are you using?

[shorthair]

Actually, on the simple running of Daphne, they should be plug and play. Daphne comes with everything (well, except you need a disc or the right files to authorise the use of the DL suite), and you just have to press play. VP you have to set some paths, and keys and video configuration, but that's it. The bonus is the tables and roms are free.

[dgrams2000]

Correct.
(If you are using the latest version, that is)

[Anubis_au]

I haven't messed with my daphne stuff for a long time (since it is working)
but what versions of it, and which DL roms are you using?

I downloaded the latest Daphne version of the website. I don't know what DL rom I have... the framefile has only a single reference pointer, to frame 151.

With my DL rom, upon setup, it goes thru some crazy stuff first (the sequence is mentioned above) but then settles into a normal /correct sequence of title screen, trailer movie, repeat.

What I want to know if if there are other, different versions of the DL roms, that as soon as you 'load' the game thru Daphne, go straight to the title screen / trailer movie, without the weird "startup" screens my version of the rom has?

Someone else mentioned above that when they play DL their setup has the same weird startup sequences... so are all versions of DL the same, or are there other rom sets out there that are correct from the very beginning?

[dgrams2000]

I would suggest this first.
Since you dont know what rom you are using,
Go to the Dragon's Lair Project Website http://www.dragonslairproject.com/
And download the F2 Roms and get them in place.
Tell daphne to use the F2 roms and then let us know if it is working or not.

It will be hard to troubleshoot if we dont know exactly what you are using.
(since there are so many different roms out for DL)
 

[Anubis_au]

Thanks for the advice dgrams2000... here are the results.

Firstly, I went to the MAME pc, and had a look at what rom files I had, as I couldn't remember downloading any. It turned out the torrent for Dragon's Lair came with a bunch of rom files (for all the Daphne games) and I had simply copied them all over into the rom directory of Daphne. So, I moved all the files out, and replaced it with the f2 version rom, as suggested by dgrams2000.

I tested the game through MaLa, and it came back with an error saying it couldn't find the rom file.

I renamed dl_revf2.zip to lair.zip, re-ran DL thru MaLa, and it worked. That is to say, the game loaded. I still had the same screwy start-up.

Then as I was exploring the Daphne directory I decided to start Daphneloader, which I admit I have not done much with. I noticed that there are several Dragon Lairs in the list, which until now I did not know what the different revisions referred to.

So I clicked on the configure button, hoping to configure Daphne for that rom version etc. That's when I came across the following error:

So, the question is: how do I fix this? And, once I get it fixed, are there any settings that will help my Daphne setup? Is DaphneLoader just a front-end for Daphne or does it also do behind-the-scenes config stuff for teh Daphne executable?

[Havok]

Quit messing around with the old version. The new Daphne Loader is at 2.1.51. You can download it here:

New Daphne

This version will also auto download whatever files you need for the non Digital Leisure games...

[shorthair]

Yeah, what Havok said (with one caveat I'll explain in a second). The new Daphne is automatic. And MaLa should pick it out and run all games, if the paths are set right. (The only fe's I've used Daphne with are Maximus Arcade and GameEx; the former worked the first time, the latter still doesn't work.)

Caveat: I think you did some goofy ---steaming pile of meadow muffin--- the first time round with the old version (of which I didn't even think you could get, at least not through Daphne-emu). Otherwise, except for MACH 3, they all work 'out of the box'. However, the squirrely stuff you're talking about seeing is just the game going though rom testing, goofus. You might be able to turn it off, but it's not an anomaly.

Another thing: you will need to purchase the DL 20th anniversary suite to authorise the files of those games. Since I don't have one, I keep the old Daphne around to play them.

[Havok]

Another thing: you will need to purchase the DL 20th anniversary suite to authorise the files of those games. Since I don't have one, I keep the old Daphne around to play them.

Or... You can do what I did: Point the new Daphne to the original 997 files and you're done. I run them all (including DL, DL2 and TQ) with the new Daphne in AtomicFE, and all is well. You just have to turn off autodownloading for those games that you already have the files for.

You will have to turn on autodownloading for Mach3 and Roadblaster - the new version of Daphne requires new Roms which don't seem to be available anywhere else.

[Anubis_au]

Quit messing around with the old version. The new Daphne Loader is at 2.1.51.

How come that's not mentioned anywhere...

Caveat: I think you did some goofy ---Cleveland steamer--- the first time round with the old version (of which I didn't even think you could get, at least not through Daphne-emu).

Didn't do anything goofy... followed UncleT's guide precisely. Daphne worked, but the Daphneloader returned an error. I just unzipped the file again to check. The Daphneloader executable with the 0.99.7 package (which you still can get from the daphne-emu website) simply has an error, and doesn't work. It's nothing to do with my setup.

I tried the newer Daphne Loader (thanks Havok for the link) and it worked. I could launch DaphneLoader, and disabled the file download etc. in the config for DL. When I ran the game, however, a funny thing happened, in that Daphne outputted only to my 15kHz arcade screen on my ArcadeVGA, and not to the 31kHz PC monitor. The old Daphne version outputted to both. Not that this bothers me (as I'll be running on an arcade monitor eventually), but it's curious so I thought I'd make a note of it.

So, now Dragon's Lair works with old Daphne and new DaphneLoader / Daphne.

But here's the thing: the game runs slower with the new version, and I think it's now at the proper running speed, because the hints now light up with enough time for me to react before Dirk dies. So, on that front, yay. But this new 'slowness' comes with an annoyance: there is now a distinct blank period whenever the game changes scenes / jumps between any two bits of the 'video'.

These blanks are not there when the game is played with the old Daphne, it went smoothly between shots without skipping a beat... but then again, the game runs fast and is unplayable with the old Daphne.

I'm just wondering, is there some setting to reduce or even eliminate these blank periods in the game, or is it something I have to live with, the price for getting a proper-speed game finally. It would be nice to have my cake and eat it too, ya know?... anyone? Beuller?

Oh yeah, one last question: the input tab of DaphneLoader, is blank. I bring this up because, one day, I'm going to want to tell Daphne that my U360 is the input of choice.... and I assume this tab is where I'll be telling Daphne about the alternate input. Are other people finding this with this latest version of DaphneLoader?

Other than that, havok and shorthair, thanks heaps for helping me get Daphne to where its at now. DL is much, MUCH better  

[Havok]

These blanks are not there when the game is played with the old Daphne, it went smoothly between shots without skipping a beat... but then again, the game runs fast and is unplayable with the old Daphne.

I'm just wondering, is there some setting to reduce or even eliminate these blank periods in the game, or is it something I have to live with, the price for getting a proper-speed game finally. It would be nice to have my cake and eat it too, ya know?... anyone? Beuller?

You can try and play around with the blank searches option and blank skips in the video tab under Game, and then Options to see if one of them enabled\disabled gets the game looking the way you want it.

Oh yeah, one last question: the input tab of DaphneLoader, is blank. I bring this up because, one day, I'm going to want to tell Daphne that my U360 is the input of choice.... and I assume this tab is where I'll be telling Daphne about the alternate input. Are other people finding this with this latest version of DaphneLoader?

That shouldn't be blank - I would try re-installing in a new directory and see if the tab is blank. My install works fine...

[Anubis_au]

Thanks Havoc... I thought the blank tab was not a software feature I'll try installing again and see what happens...

And yeah, I found the settings / options to tweak the video in DL... have to keep playing with it. I managed to re-create the no-blank-video-but-only-an-instant-to-react settings like the old Daphne had, but have yet to get normal gameplay, no blank video yet.

Have others managed to get their DL to this stage?

Another thing I should note, with my DahpneLoader: it doesn't seem to remember my settings, so every time I go into the config I'm re-entering all settings (which there aren't too many, so its not a drama). But, that added to the blank input tab leads me to suspect there may be something wrong with DaphneLoader... or my copy of...

[shorthair]

I dunno on that one. I dunno. Don't know about the non-cloning of the video signal thing, either. I don't think I've had both my monitors running with Daphne going.

Havok: by Jove, you're a genius. Actually, I just assumed the old files wouldn't be compatible with the new loader. Nice, though. Thanks.

[ark_ader]

Hi,

I read the above posts and its good reading, but I have your answer and its pretty simple really....

In your Textfile that points to the Single Mpeg, where you see:

c:\daphne\mpeg\lair   (this is an example)

151 lair.m2v





replace it with:

c:\daphne\mpeg\lair

-151 lair.m2v


I have a feeling I know where you got that image from....<hint> <hint>   

You should have ran the mpeg seek test and looked at this part of the daphne docs:

http://www.daphne-emu.com/wiki/index.php?page=RunSeektest


The same happened to me when I captured my DL laserdisc and enjoyed all the hassles that came with it.
That will fix your problem. 

PM me if you need more info

[Anubis_au]

I have been a bit quiet on the Daphne configuring front lately, as I've had other things to deal with lately and only managed to get back to it today. But I'm happy to say that it now works very well. I thought I'd share my results for the next would-be victim.

First up, the version linked above by Havok, is stillnot the latest version of DaphneLoader. Once you download it, it then prompts you that there is a newer version, which it automatically downloads for you. My trouble was I had gone into admin tools -> services and disabled all networking for my Mame PC, so I wasn't able to update the software. Once I had enabled all of that, DaphneLoader updated itself to the latest and greatest, and my various problems went away:

1. The 'input' tab in the config, is no longer blank. It now shows the inputs and allows for changes / customisation.

2. There was an option somewhere for a fast boot, which bypasses all the startup crappy screens that Dragons Lair was starting with. That's what started this entire thread to begin with. Fast boot is a very quick bios screen flashing on screen, then the attract video. So for those that had the same crappy boot sequence, the solution is downloading to the latest version.

3. Blank periods between scenes.... meh, getting used to this now...

So thank you heaps to Havok and Shorthair and everyone else who helped with this.

[Anubis_au]

Oh yeah, forgot to mention something else re Daphne, MaLa and UncleT's guide. After I finished playing with the daphneLoader configurator, I wanted to go back to UncleT's MaLa how to guide, and make batch files that can be called from MaLa.

The thing is, when you use the config tool, you are setting many more flags than what UncleT has in his guide.

Once you have the game configured to how you want, run it, quit, then open the daphnelog. One of the first few lines will be the command line call to Daphne.exe from the daphneloader, with all the various flags and how they are set for your system setup.

Copy this into a batch file as per UncleT's guide. I removed one tiny bit of the command line, the bit about the homedir... I found with that removed, everything worked again, I could call Dragon's Lair from MaLa / command line but with every setting / flag set as I wanted.

So, to future people setting up Daphne, good luck, and ask me questions if you need.