Author Topic: The Pac-Mame Project (Read 5088 times)

cmonkey · « **on:** May 22, 2006, 11:53:08 am »

Pretty much on a whim, I decided the best way to kill the first month of my summer was to build a MAME cabinet. I don't have much arcade experience (born a bit too late), but it all looks like a whole lot of fun. Anyway, so far, I have a model of what I want to do in SketchUp.

The shape and look is based loosely on a MVS-2-25 and the Gotham cab at OscarControls. I don't yet have a theme or a name for it, though.

I'm planning on a 2 player control panel that looks like this, but without the trackball.

Anyway, before I buy the wood, I want to make sure there aren't any fatal mistakes in my design. I could also use suggestions on how to make it better.

edit: Forgot to mention the parts I'm using. I can't spend much on it, so I ordered a set of 2 x-arcade joysticks and 20 buttons. I'm using a 19" CRT and a k6 550mhz with 256mb of ram that I have sitting around. If there's slowdown in the games that I want to play, I'll switch to a dual PIII 1ghz or an Athlon 900mhz with 512mb that I also have sitting around. I'm planning on running Linux on it, most likely Ubuntu or Debian.

dpz147 · « **Reply #1 on:** May 22, 2006, 02:11:43 pm »

A couple things to consider...

I would recommend keeping the trackball. It is the most used part of my cab when company is over. There are so many good party games like Golden Tee, WC Bowling, Shuz, Table Shuffleboard etc. Even if you're not a fan of games like Centipede Missile Command, it will get used quite a bit when you have large groups over.

The other thing most people around here will tell you is to stay away from Linux. I'm not an expert on the matter but if you do a search for it, you'll see the reasons why.

Other than that...good luck. It is a lot of fun.

dpz147 · « **Reply #2 on:** May 22, 2006, 02:21:06 pm »

Sorry...one other note. I know you are trying to save money but if you can go bigger on the monitor, it's worth it. I found a 27" security monitor at a second hand store for $40 and it's awesome, especially if you will be playing vertical games as well. If you absolutely can't afford it right now, you may want to build the cab a bit bigger and adjust the bezel so you can upgrade it later when the time is right.

cmonkey · « **Reply #3 on:** May 22, 2006, 03:14:44 pm »

Thanks for the advice. I'm thinking about leaving space on the control panel for a trackball. I don't really want to pay $100 for one, but I have a keyboard back at college with a ~2.5" trackball on it that I could pull out and stick on eventually.

The inside of the cab where the monitor is is 2' wide, is that enough space for a ~25" TV, or should widen it?

I'm a fan of linux, but the main reason I wanted to use it is you can use two keyboards at once on it (a solution for ghosting/blocking/masking?). One on the keyboard port, one on the mouse port. I have a serial mouse I can use. It would also be nice to have remote system administration via ssh, instead of having to muck around with the cab when I needed to change things.

cmonkey · « **Reply #4 on:** May 22, 2006, 03:33:30 pm »

My friend randomly found Betson joysticks for $4.49 each online. I couldn't find any info on them anywhere, so I ordered two to try them out. I might end up either ordering more buttons and going for a 4 player setup or having a 2 player setup with 2 joysticks per person.

dpz147 · « **Reply #5 on:** May 22, 2006, 04:09:25 pm »

Quote from: cmonkey on May 22, 2006, 03:14:44 pm

Thanks for the advice. I'm thinking about leaving space on the control panel for a trackball. I don't really want to pay $100 for one, but I have a keyboard back at college with a ~2.5" trackball on it that I could pull out and stick on eventually.

I got mine off ebay. I think I paid around $45 including shipping.

Quote from: cmonkey on May 22, 2006, 03:14:44 pm

The inside of the cab where the monitor is is 2' wide, is that enough space for a ~25" TV, or should widen it?

I doubt it, but you might want to measure a few TVs to check. I needed 29" for my 27" TV.

Quote from: cmonkey on May 22, 2006, 03:14:44 pm

I'm a fan of linux, but the main reason I wanted to use it is you can use two keyboards at once on it (a solution for ghosting/blocking/masking?). One on the keyboard port, one on the mouse port. I have a serial mouse I can use. It would also be nice to have remote system administration via ssh, instead of having to muck around with the cab when I needed to change things.

I'm not an expert in this area, but I think all of those issues have been addressed in today's encoders (I-Pac, Keywiz). I haven't had any of those issues.

Quote from: cmonkey on May 22, 2006, 03:14:44 pm

It would also be nice to have remote system administration via ssh, instead of having to muck around with the cab when I needed to change things.

I use VNC. It's free and it works great.

I'm pretty new to all of this myself but this has been my experience when building my first cab. There are much more experienced people around here who might have better advice for you.

cmonkey · « **Reply #6 on:** May 23, 2006, 01:50:50 am »

Ok, I made some modifications. I widened the cab both to allow for a larger monitor and because I'm switching to a 4 player design. It's going to be a bit cramped on the cp, because I want the total width of the cabinet to be less than 36". Everything seems to fit alright. I have the cp templete roughly modelled out in inkscape. I'll try and model it on SketchUp tomorrow.

I'm going to have a fun time getting 56 total inputs out of a keyboard hack, with a set of 20 (4 player with 3 buttons each) and a set of 16 (2 player with 6 buttons each) with no blocking. I looked at some of the keyboard encoders out there, but I'd rather burn some extra free time (I have too much of it anyway) than pay ~$50 to get the number of inputs I need.

theCoder · « **Reply #7 on:** May 23, 2006, 02:15:48 am »

If you are serious about having 4 stations, you will do yourself a huge favor by spending the $$ to get a keyboard I/O card. Ghosting will be really bad if you get 4 people slamming away at 6 buttons each.

How often do you think you will have 3 friends over playing 4 player games? We only have lots of people over 3-5 times a year. 99% of the time it is just me, my son, or both of us playing. Something to consider.

I strongly agree with the dpz147's recommendation on the trackball. When people are over at my place, they can't get enough of Gutterball (bowling game). I'm also a big fan of Missile Command.

Good luck on your project.

cmonkey · « **Reply #8 on:** May 23, 2006, 11:52:35 am »

I'm trying to keep the total cost under $250 (yes, I am delusional), so I'll try doing a dual keyboard hack first (linux supports two ps/2 keyboards). I only need to have a set of 20 and a set of 16 keys that can be pressed simulatiously without ghosting or blocking. I think (according to this) that it is possible using one keyboard, but it is certainly possible with two. If that fails, I'll probably go for an I-pac4, as it seems to be the only reasonably priced encoder with the number of inputs I'm looking for.

Well, the cabinet is going in my basement, which I plan on using for movie nights and lan parties this summer, so there will be many occasions for 4 player gaming.

Also, I left space on the templete for a trackball. I'll have to wait until thanksgiving weekend to bring it back from college and install it though.

Thanks.

dpz147 · « **Reply #9 on:** May 23, 2006, 01:50:12 pm »

Quote from: cmonkey on May 23, 2006, 01:50:50 am

Ok, I made some modifications. I widened the cab both to allow for a larger monitor and because I'm switching to a 4 player design. It's going to be a bit cramped on the cp, because I want the total width of the cabinet to be less than 36".

You may want to make the CP bigger than the actual cab. I don't know what your doors are like, but my basement door is only 32" wide, so my cab is 31.5" but the CP is 36". I don't ever plan on moving but if I do, I only need to take off 3 screws and the whole CP will pop off. Here's some pics if you want to see what I mean.

http://forum.arcadecontrols.com/index.php?topic=52730.0

cmonkey · « **Reply #10 on:** May 23, 2006, 03:50:26 pm »

Yea, that's how I got 36". My narrowest door from my basement to the outside world is 36" wide. I was considering making the cp a separate unit, but I like the look of having it all one piece.

DaveMMR · « **Reply #11 on:** May 23, 2006, 06:13:15 pm »

A 4-Player Cab will go down as my first rejected idea for my cab. The number of 4-player games combined with the number of times I'll have people over playing 'those games' didn't make the effort anywhere near worth it.

You could try the keyboard hack if you absolute have a disposable keyboard - otherwise I'd just go for the Ipac-4.

JonnyBoy · « **Reply #12 on:** May 23, 2006, 06:45:36 pm »

What you could do is make a fairly full featured 2 player panel, then have USB ports available where two other friends could "plug-in". It keeps down clutter and works for those occasions with a bunch of friends.

cmonkey · « **Reply #13 on:** May 23, 2006, 07:01:45 pm »

I was considering the USB option for 4 player games, but that's a really sub par setup for TMNT. I will have a lot of opportunities for four player gaming, so I think it's worth it.

I have a lot of spare computer parts and not a lot of money, so I'm going for the keyboard hack first.

My friend suggested that I try interfacing a couple joysticks and 4 buttons to the game port if I need more inputs. Are there downsides to that option?

dkammer · « **Reply #14 on:** May 23, 2006, 10:07:07 pm »

Let's remember guys...he's in college. *WE* don't have much occasion for 4 players but a college student will. Think of it...free entertainment...lots of people with no money...they'll flock to his door!

And there's really nothing better than Gauntlet with 4 players...

Good luck cmonkey...more power to ya!

Darren

cmonkey · « **Reply #15 on:** May 23, 2006, 11:11:03 pm »

Thanks for the vote of confidence, dkammer.

I layed out the cp templete on my SketchUp model. It's going to be crowded with four people, but it looks like there shouldn't be any gameplay issues (hands getting in the way of other hands and whatnot).

theCoder · « **Reply #16 on:** May 24, 2006, 01:39:18 am »

Quote from: dkammer on May 23, 2006, 10:07:07 pm

Let's remember guys...he's in college. *WE* don't have much occasion for 4 players but a college student will. Think of it...free entertainment...lots of people with no money...they'll flock to his door!

Think of the free pizza & drinkables. Oh, the college daze.

cmonkey · « **Reply #17 on:** May 27, 2006, 02:19:36 pm »

Anyone good at keyboard hacks? I'm trying to set it up so that it can work with both 2 player with 6 buttons each and 4 players with 3 buttons each. I'm one button away from it working, I think. Can someone take a look at it and see if there are any blocking problems that I'm not seeing. Also, does anyone see a way of getting one more button into it? Thanks.

the XLS file

Edit: I think I got the final key in. I don't see any blocking issues, but I'm not certain. Also, I haven't been able to test if my keyboard can do 20 simultaneous keystrokes, so I'm not sure if this plan is even feasible. I could only get 14 before I ran out of fingers.

cmonkey · « **Reply #18 on:** June 17, 2006, 02:14:20 am »

I've been playing around with a few ideas for my cab while waiting for stuff. Has anyone made a Pacman shaped arcade machine before? Anyway, my plans are down to building the "Pac-MAME" or building a more traditionally shaped cab themed after the TV show Firefly. I've been looking around for broken cabs to try to save some money on this, but no luck as of yet. If I can't find anything in the next couple days, I'll bite the bullet and drive over to Lowes for some MDF.

DigDreams · « **Reply #19 on:** June 17, 2006, 02:24:34 am »

I think the Pac-MAME idea is cool, but it seems like it would be difficult to build. I've never tried to bend wood around a curve like that, but I', certainly not a professional woodworker.

I'd love to see it if you can pull it off. You might even be able to find an old roll-top desk (or make somethign similar) and be able to close it when it's off.

Good luck!

- DigDreams

cmonkey · « **Reply #20 on:** June 17, 2006, 02:30:09 am »

I probably wouldn't use wood for the curved part, as I have nowhere near the woodworking skills necessary for that. I was thinking fiberglass . Never used it before, but now's as good a time to start as any. Or, I could take the easy way out and not curve the top/back pieces at all, since they wouldn't be all that visible. The idea of having it closable does sound good though.

toasty · « **Reply #21 on:** June 21, 2006, 02:50:31 pm »

Dude, if you are able to pull off that Pacman shaped cab, make sure you post lots of pics. That's a stroke of genius, IMO!

Best of luck!

Havok · « **Reply #22 on:** June 21, 2006, 04:55:48 pm »

You should do the Pac Man theme: just get a large enough piece of wood, and cut a curve. If it turns out that the curve is too large, just make two cuts and smooth the join with bondo...

DigDreams · « **Reply #23 on:** June 21, 2006, 06:10:58 pm »

The sides would be easy... It's the back that will be difficult as he will have to wrap wood around the curve, or use fiberglass or something else. It would be really cool though.

- DigDreams

gamecreature · « **Reply #24 on:** June 21, 2006, 06:18:56 pm »

Naw, just do it like Burgertime. The sides could be pac man, the top and back would be regular cab, hidden by the pac shape.

leapinlew · « **Reply #25 on:** June 21, 2006, 09:01:24 pm »

As a suggestion....

Take the $250 and build just the CP and build it right. Trackball, good joysticks etc.

Instead of building a whole cabinet, have the CP just connect to a keyboard and mouse on a computer and the video out could be to a monitor, svideo, rca or whatever your video card will output to. In this way you would have a semi portable gaming platform (you could take it to whomever has the best tv/monitor).

Just a suggestion! Even with this setup - $250 would be tight - but it's do-able. Trying to do a dedicated cab for 4 players at $250 would almost be impossible. Nay! It would be impossible!

cmonkey · « **Reply #26 on:** June 23, 2006, 03:13:01 pm »

Alright, I'll go with the Pac-Mame. That way I don't have to worry about any difficult artwork (I can't draw/paint worth crap). :p

Anyway, I think I can do this within my budget. I've spent $80 for the controls and t-molding. 3 sheets of 3/4" MDF is $60. The computer, monitor, speakers, and keyboard were all free. That leaves $110 for a sheet of lexan, some MDF primer, a few cans of spray paint, some brackets of sorts, and assorted bolts.

leapinlew · « **Reply #27 on:** June 23, 2006, 03:49:45 pm »

80 for the controls and t-molding? How much t-mold is pacmame gonna take?

Keep an eye on that budget, I'd like to see where it all lands.

cmonkey · « **Reply #28 on:** June 23, 2006, 04:09:41 pm »

:p I managed to get 35' of black t-molding for $15 shipped off ebay. The rest of the costs were $36 for two joysticks and 20 buttons, $18 for 10 more buttons, and $16 for two more joysticks. Alright, it adds up to $85, but I was close.

leapinlew · « **Reply #29 on:** June 23, 2006, 05:45:43 pm »

Are you using an encoder like a ipac or a keywiz? Keyboard hack?

leapinlew · « **Reply #30 on:** June 23, 2006, 05:50:26 pm »

Quote from: cmonkey on June 23, 2006, 04:09:41 pm

Alright, it adds up to $85, but I was close.

Heh... the thing is, it's $5 here and $10 there. Next thing you know your budget is blown to hell. Don't get me wrong, it's good to have a budget. I learned that the money is hiding in the details. Like wiring, quick connects, terminal blocks, brackets, paint, paint brushes, power strips, carriage bolts, screws, tools, art, etc.

Good luck! Either keep a spreadsheet with your expenses, or throw your receipts out the window.

cmonkey · « **Reply #31 on:** June 23, 2006, 11:02:35 pm »

I'm going for a keyboard hack, and if it turns out I don't have enough inputs, a dual keyboard hack.

leapinlew · « **Reply #32 on:** June 23, 2006, 11:24:25 pm »

Quote from: cmonkey on June 23, 2006, 11:02:35 pm

I'm going for a keyboard hack, and if it turns out I don't have enough inputs, a dual keyboard hack.

Cool. I look forward to it. Good luck!

DigDreams · « **Reply #33 on:** June 24, 2006, 01:21:54 am »

Quote from: leapinlew on June 23, 2006, 05:50:26 pm

Heh... the thing is, it's $5 here and $10 there. Next thing you know your budget is blown to hell. Don't get me wrong, it's good to have a budget. I learned that the money is hiding in the details. Like wiring, quick connects, terminal blocks, brackets, paint, paint brushes, power strips, carriage bolts, screws, tools, art, etc.

I don't want to even think about what I have spent. You are soooo right.

- DigDreams

cmonkey · « **Reply #34 on:** June 16, 2007, 05:43:35 pm »

Just thought I'd mention, I started working on this again after a year of inactivity. I have the base of it put together, and I'll start taking pictures as soon as I can find my camera.

Anubis_au · « **Reply #35 on:** June 16, 2007, 08:11:31 pm »

I was around these boards a year ago, but I'm interested to see how a pac-man shaped cab would turn out. Keep the pics coming, and good luck with your project!


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