Which way to go...win or dos?

[RickDIII]

Hey all,

Newbie Question - Been doing a lot of reading and I'm just not sure which way to go.  Running a PII 450 w/ 128mb RAM and win98.  Everything points to running mame in dos, but this limits running some of the better front ends. 

So that leaves me running in win, but what is that going to do to the games?  Maybe I should give up on the cool front ends completely because of the system I using?  Would adding extra ram help out here, or is most of the mame performance processor based?  It looks like I can get quite a bit of ram to a good price, so I'm willing to bump it up to 512 if need be.

Any feedback appreciated.

[AlexC]

I have a 400mhz computer with Win98 DOS using MAME .36 and Gamelauncher.
Runs great, it plays most 1989 and under games without a problem.

[leapinlew]

Hey all,

Newbie Question - Been doing a lot of reading and I'm just not sure which way to go.  Running a PII 450 w/ 128mb RAM and win98.  Everything points to running mame in dos, but this limits running some of the better front ends. 

So that leaves me running in win, but what is that going to do to the games?  Maybe I should give up on the cool front ends completely because of the system I using?  Would adding extra ram help out here, or is most of the mame performance processor based?  It looks like I can get quite a bit of ram to a good price, so I'm willing to bump it up to 512 if need be.

Any feedback appreciated.

Rick - what games are you wanting to play?

Windows 98 and more then 128mb of ram doesn't really offer much of a performance boost. Before I'd bump the memory I'd bump the processor and motherboard...

[Minwah]

I would probably run DOS on that spec machine, with GameLauncher or ArcadeOS.

[RickDIII]

Thanks all.  Will take the advice.  Most of the games  I want to run are older, so I should be fine!

Appreciate all the feedback! 

[leapinlew]

Thanks all.  Will take the advice.  Most of the games  I want to run are older, so I should be fine!

Appreciate all the feedback! 

I don't know if this is common or not... but I had a gateway GP450 that had specs similar to the ones you listed. When I got the joystick hooked up and started playing games it would beep and gameplay would studder. As if too many keys were hit at once or something.

Check that if you can. Just a heads up.

[youki]

Hi,

You config can be enough for win and old game  on a old mame or a fastmame.

The coolest front end requires often more power too.  AtomicFE will run on your config but avoid animated layouts. Mamewah will run too i think.   But i won't bet on FE like GameEX that is really heavy due to the .NET layer.


But i think you will be more confortable in term of performance under MS DOS.  But before starting to choose DOS. Keep that in mind :

-If you don't have a real soundblaster card or you are not sure to find DOS driver for your sound card, you should go on Windows , because mame without sound.... not very fun...

-If you plan to use USB Device (like joystick) , avoid dos too  if you don't now where to find driver for your mother board. and if it exists.

-if you want connect to a real 15khz Arcade screen using VGA , dos solution is cheaper than windows one. Under dos a drivers called ARCMON.SYS exists, under windows you need to buy an ArcadeVGA or use PowerStrip (but hard to configure and not compatible with all video card).

-And the last point, is how are you confortable with dos.

So, now, you can make your choice. Both solution have advantages and disadvantages..

[RickDIII]

Hi,

You config can be enough for win and old game  on a old mame or a fastmame.

The coolest front end requires often more power too.  AtomicFE will run on your config but avoid animated layouts. Mamewah will run too i think.   But i won't bet on FE like GameEX that is really heavy due to the .NET layer.


But i think you will be more confortable in term of performance under MS DOS.  But before starting to choose DOS. Keep that in mind :

-If you don't have a real soundblaster card or you are not sure to find DOS driver for your sound card, you should go on Windows , because mame without sound.... not very fun...

-If you plan to use USB Device (like joystick) , avoid dos too  if you don't now where to find driver for your mother board. and if it exists.

-if you want connect to a real 15khz Arcade screen using VGA , dos solution is cheaper than windows one. Under dos a drivers called ARCMON.SYS exists, under windows you need to buy an ArcadeVGA or use PowerStrip (but hard to configure and not compatible with all video card).

-And the last point, is how are you confortable with dos.

So, now, you can make your choice. Both solution have advantages and disadvantages..

Thanks youki!  Great points to consider.   

My trackball and encoder both connect via PS2.  I'm a little concerned about the sound card, but I think I might have an older soundblaster card lying around from another system. 

I'm more comfortable with unix than dos, but can get by. 

Two more questions...
1) if I connect my trackball through ps2 will it automatically be able to function in dos, or will it require special drivers?
2) I'm trying to figure out the versioning on the mame files.  I think I need a dos version for mame in 092 but can't seem to find a working download.  Am I just missing it on mame.net?

[leapinlew]

Hi,

You config can be enough for win and old game  on a old mame or a fastmame.

The coolest front end requires often more power too.  AtomicFE will run on your config but avoid animated layouts. Mamewah will run too i think.   But i won't bet on FE like GameEX that is really heavy due to the .NET layer.


But i think you will be more confortable in term of performance under MS DOS.  But before starting to choose DOS. Keep that in mind :

-If you don't have a real soundblaster card or you are not sure to find DOS driver for your sound card, you should go on Windows , because mame without sound.... not very fun...

-If you plan to use USB Device (like joystick) , avoid dos too  if you don't now where to find driver for your mother board. and if it exists.

-if you want connect to a real 15khz Arcade screen using VGA , dos solution is cheaper than windows one. Under dos a drivers called ARCMON.SYS exists, under windows you need to buy an ArcadeVGA or use PowerStrip (but hard to configure and not compatible with all video card).

-And the last point, is how are you confortable with dos.

So, now, you can make your choice. Both solution have advantages and disadvantages..

Thanks youki!  Great points to consider.   

My trackball and encoder both connect via PS2.  I'm a little concerned about the sound card, but I think I might have an older soundblaster card lying around from another system. 

I'm more comfortable with unix than dos, but can get by. 

Two more questions...
1) if I connect my trackball through ps2 will it automatically be able to function in dos, or will it require special drivers?
2) I'm trying to figure out the versioning on the mame files.  I think I need a dos version for mame in 092 but can't seem to find a working download.  Am I just missing it on mame.net?

Question:

Will he be losing any configuration options with his trackball by using it in Dos? Like Acceleration options?

[RickDIII]

2) I'm trying to figure out the versioning on the mame files.  I think I need a dos version for mame in 092 but can't seem to find a working download.  Am I just missing it on mame.net?

 

Found the answer to this one 

[spottydog]

I recommend buying some ram so that you have 512mb or near that amount.
I'm running w98se/484mb ram/avga/1.8ghz cpu with mamewah and the games run excellently - cps1/cps2/neo geo/killer instinct...
There is a very significant drop in performance with mame32. I had been using it recently and I was planning to buy more ram to eliminate the jerkiness in games.
I've been using mamewah also and I was surprised by the dramatic improvement. Games run so smoothly, flawlessly perhaps. I don't need more ram.   

[RickDIII]

Thanks all for the feedback on this topic. 

I have decided to go straight DOS using Gamelauncher.  Most of the games I am interested in are older, so they seem to be running correctly. 

Once I figured out the dpmi thing the rest has been coming along.  What I have left:
1) get mouse working
2) get sound working
3) glauncher won't actually start games, I think I need to change something in the config, I'll have to see.  It is picking up the games, but maybe not executing because of dmame vs. mame.
4) add music etc. to glauncher

Yep, still got my work cut out for me, but at least I have a direction now.

[spottydog]

Hi RickD, I'm using windows command line mame (not dos mame) with mamewah. I play cps1/2/neo geo games, and all are running amazingly.
Do you play these 'older' games or Bombjack/Defender...
You can use your cab to select/leave a game and make it auto-start after switching on your pc.   

[RickDIII]

Hi RickD, I'm using windows command line mame (not dos mame) with mamewah. I play cps1/2/neo geo games, and all are running amazingly.
Do you play these 'older' games or Bombjack/Defender...
You can use your cab to select/leave a game and make it auto-start after switching on your pc. 

My whole issue started when I could not get the windows command line version to run properly.  Kept spewing out memory issues.  So then I decided that dos might offer a better solution because of weaker system. 

I've been running a few of my favorites.  Ghosts and Goblins, Galaga, Marble Madness and they seem to work fine...other than my current lack of mouse/trackball  support.  These are mostly the types of games I'm interested in.  If I run out of gas on these I'll update the pc. 

I was planning on booting directly to dos and then using autoexec.bat to launch glauncher...this should work right?

I haven't touched the software in about a week because I'm in the home stretch on the cab and trying to get it finished.  Then it will be time to get the final configuration and iron out the bugs!  Now - if I would just quit playing games (on the keyboard no less - I would get so much more completed) 

[spottydog]

Hi, I re-read the thread, I think your processor may be limiting. Would adding more ram help? I don't know.
Perhaps if you cleared some space on your hard-drive you could avoid the memory issues.

[murb]

I hope to be contemplating your initial question soon.

I would be interested to know if you have tried any of the stripped down/repackaged WinXP installs floating around.  Some of them say they will work on a 266 processor with 128ram.

[RayB]

Rick,
I use DOS mame. For a system like yours, you need to stick to an older version of MAME (better performance).

My system is Win98se DOS mode, 256mb RAM, 1 ghz cpu. I use 0.78 for all games except vector. For Vector games I use 0.55 (otherwise I can't get full frame rate!). GameLauncher lets you define which emulator to use for each menu of games, so I defined a menu of just the vectors, and it's configured for 0.55. The other menus are configured for 0.78.

I'd say 128 mb is plenty for your specs. Adding RAM won't do anything but waste your money. MAME is all about CPU horsepower. If you want to dump money into your cab, spend it on a faster CPU/mobo.

As for a trackball, you'll need a mouse driver.

[JLR2000]

When I created my dedicated Pole Position MAME cab I used an old PIII 233 running dos (just running PP and and old version of mame)

I found this site extremely helpful....

http://www.mameworld.net/dosmame/

Take some time to read thru it, I didn't use everything but it was helpful.  I used an old ISA soundcard and found it easier to configure, the PCI soundcards at the time (a few years ago) seemed more complicated.  If you do a google search on "dos mouse support" you'll find what you need to get a ps2 mouse recognized (provided you run it at boot time).

Good Luck.

[gonzo90017]

 Hey murb. If you have a Windows XP cd lying around you can make a stripped down version yourself. http://www.nliteos.com/nlite.html It's very easy. I got my windows xp cd down to 125mb. It runs alot faster than a full install. Anyways. I have similiar specs. P2 400 128mb. I tried both the 125mb version of xp, and windows 98 se. I found about a 20% increase in performance using windows98 with FastMame v71. For capcom games I plan on using the windows version of Raine. It runs them at 60fps! Now the only thing I need to figure out is how to get it to load without the gui in Mamewah. And like RayB said 128mb is more than enough for your setup. If you're old enough to remember most computers shipped with 64mb of ram running Windows 98.