We've gone Conservative!

[Zakk]

Ever wake up one morning and wonder "what did I do last night?"

Well I voted Conservative.  So did a fair bit of the rest of the country. My reason?  The Liberal government has made it clear that they want to disarm the country.  Well the law-abiding part anyway.  They propose that they will force people to sell their guns to them, no choice.  Now I give you US brothers hassles sometimes about your over-zealous gun thinking ("even baby has a gun, hyuck!"), however taking guns out of every person's hands (that has gone through the courses and training to legally own a gun), but leave them in the hands of punks on the street is crazy.  I don't even own a gun, but I voted Conservative and signed up for a course that allows me to own long guns, and another one that allows me restricted weapons (semi autos and pistols).  I even visited the shooting range and found out about teaching the children how to respect and fire a weapon.  Next I plan to purchase a gun safe, one of those huge behemoth things.  Safety first with 4 kids in the house.
 With the world in such a state of flux, and the Chinese declaring intent of hostility, it seems absolutely ridiculous that the government wants to disarm us.  It's like waving a bloody hippy peace sign at all our enemies.  Hey, might as well attack Canada, our old Prime Minister pissed off the US president then disarmed the country.  Good move!
 Oh, and if they do manage to take away our guns, I'll meet one of you at the border.  I'll need 2 mp5's, a spas 12, Beretta Px4, and a phased plasma rifle in 40 watt range, er and a pile of ammo. That's the end of my rant, and now I guess I have to go paint my neck red. 

 Oddly enough, the richest and best educated areas in my city still voted Liberal (kind of like the US map on election day).  My rep is a Liberal, even though she was on tv weeks before the election bragging about how there was no way she would lose...guess she was right.

[c64rulez]

Ever wake up one morning and wonder "what did I do last night?"

Why does everybody view this but post nothing ?
Why wouldn't somebody stand like a man and state the simple fact that the best practice is not to wake in the morning, but in the late afternoon, better with a serious hangover and a cheesecake on each side ?

Why does it have to be me every -- insert obscenity here -- time ?

And then I get the blame for derailing. This sucks.

[menace]

yep went conservative here too--I've confirmed that the liberals and NDP are more than adept at stealing money and lining their pockets--i thought I would let the conservatives have a go and see how much they can get before someone catches them--so far the liberals win federally (well over 3 bil pissed away) but the ndp still hold the record for losing the most provincially--(wasn't it like 10 billion or something..)

I guess now that our dollar is on par with the US we might become one of the states after all--just call us the  real beer drinking, full nude show watching, legalized gambling, pot smoking, lesbian loving 51st state-booyeah!

[Harry Potter]

Well the law-abiding part anyway.  They propose that they will force people to sell their guns to them, no choice.  Now I give you US brothers hassles sometimes about your over-zealous gun thinking ("even baby has a gun, hyuck!"), however taking guns out of every person's hands (that has gone through the courses and training to legally own a gun), but leave them in the hands of punks on the street is crazy.

So you guys are gonna be copying Australia in that respect. Good luck.

[fredster]

Only the outlaws have guns    Man, I know I'd feel so much safer having the government having all the guns.  Yep. I'm sure they would be right there to help me so I wouldn't need one.

And Menace, only 3 billion pissed away?  We do that in about 10 minutes in the US.

[DrewKaree]

Well I voted Conservative. 

Welcome to the Dark Side, my imperialist money-grubbing neanderthal friend!

Dammit, where's that evil grin smiley when we REALLY need it?

[Zakk]

 I just cannot sit by and let a government disarm law abiding citizens.  It reminds me of that Simpson's episode where the whole world burned all the weapons, and the aliens came in and took it over with a slingshot. 

 So when fredster sends all the rejects and hooligans up here to Canada, I damn well want to be able to shoot them! 

Now if you'll excuse me, I have a bunch of NRA posters to put up before my wife comes home and rips them down again. 

[Scott84]

Conservatives suck.

(end of discussion) 

[patrickl]

I guess the disarming of citizens in Australia was a mess yes, but I still wonder if in the long run you wont save a hell of a lot of casualties if you ban guns. There are still a huge amount less gun related deaths (and actually other crimes too) in countries where guns are banned than when everybody can own a gun.

In the Netherlands only really insane criminals carry guns. You will never stop those and they will kill you (if they want to) even if you do carry a gun. We do have some criminals killing each other (some "mafia" bosses war). Anyway, most "regular" criminals don't carry a gun since the penalties on that are far more severe than the penalties on the crime they actually want to commit (like robbery, breaking and entering or such) So citizens don't need guns and we suffer far less casualties because of that.

I'm glad our gun posession laws have been sane all along. Correcting the mistake of citizens owning guns is indeed almost impossible to correct. At least you will have decades where large numbers of guns are still lingering around. But still I'd say try to go for it. Look up the stats and you will see that guns don't help you. AFAIK you are more likely to die by your own gun than that you will help prevent a crime.

[Zakk]

Conservatives suck.

(end of discussion) 

Well, yes, we will miss the unprecedented corruption of the Liberals, the economy-destroying incompetence of the NDP, and the pot smoking free will of the green party. Hey, what can you do.

[Edgedamage]

Great.

[Zakk]

I guess the disarming of citizens in Australia was a mess yes, but I still wonder if in the long run you wont save a hell of a lot of casualties if you ban guns. There are still a huge amount less gun related deaths (and actually other crimes too) in countries where guns are banned than when everybody can own a gun.

In the Netherlands only really insane criminals carry guns. You will never stop those and they will kill you (if they want to) even if you do carry a gun. We do have some criminals killing each other (some "mafia" bosses war). Anyway, most "regular" criminals don't carry a gun since the penalties on that are far more severe than the penalties on the crime they actually want to commit (like robbery, breaking and entering or such) So citizens don't need guns and we suffer far less casualties because of that.

I'm glad our gun posession laws have been sane all along. Correcting the mistake of citizens owning guns is indeed almost impossible to correct. At least you will have decades where large numbers of guns are still lingering around. But still I'd say try to go for it. Look up the stats and you will see that guns don't help you. AFAIK you are more likely to die by your own gun than that you will help prevent a crime.

My problem with the gun attitude in the States is that you need to take a test and prove you are competent to drive a car, but you can stumble drunkenly into a corner store and buy a gun.  Both can kill easily.  I feel that only trained, licensed people should own guns, but that the training be available to anyone.  If you don't have a driver's license, you will be arrested if you are found driving a car.  Same should stand for gun ownership.  I 100% believe it is a privledge, not a right.  If goofy redneck joe can't write his own name, then he shouldn't be ownin' no dang gun. 
  I'm going to take the courses, I'm going to take the exams, and then I am going to buy some guns and lock them in a vault and hope that I never need them.  The old saying of "I'd rather have a gun and not need it, then need it and not have it" rings true to me. 

[markrvp]

Conservatives Scott84 sucks.

(end of discussion) 

[Dartful Dodger]

I 100% believe it is a privledge, not a right.  If goofy redneck joe can't write his own name, then he shouldn't be ownin' no dang gun. 
  I'm going to take the courses, I'm going to take the exams, and then I am going to buy some guns and lock them in a vault and hope that I never need them.

What should redneck joe be able to do to be able to protect himself, family and country?
You said write his name... but why stop there, when I was in high school everybody had to learn Algebra, maybe that's another thing we should put on the gun ownership test. Since the majority of people in the US are religious we should add some theological questions to it too.  This way the sinners wont have guns. We could also charge people to take the test, and it should be priced high enough to keep the unemployed from getting a gun.

When the constitution was first written the common people couldn't read and write.  But why stop at making reading and writing a mandatory prerequisite to protect yourself we should also make it mandatory for police and fire protection too.  It will be easy to enforce, since we don't let them have guns.

I 100% believe that you don't understand how privileged you are.  I also believe that some people were not taught to hold high value on education, so I will not hold that or the fact that they have a permanent sun burn on their necks from working outside their whole lives against them.  Redneck joe lives over 30 minutes away from the nearest police station. It takes 30 minutes for the police to respond to a crime that's 5 minutes from the police station, redneck joe needs a gun more than you do.

[Zakk]

I hold to Darwinian law.  If redneck Joe is too stupid to read and write (or too lazy to learn to do so), then maybe he shouldn't be able to protect himself with a firearm. 

However, I was being general in that terminology anyway.  What I meant was that redneck Joe should have to take some sort of course on how to properly respect, store, secure and fire that firearm.  Even if it has to be verbal, or he has to respond with gestures and grunts.  If it's the term redneck that is bothering you, please substitute 'Toothless Earl" or " 'married his sister' Jim".

So why is it you need a licence to drive a car, but just breath in your body to buy a gun? 
Give me a reasonable answer to that question beyond "it's our right", and I'll drop the whole thing. 

Wouldn't you feel a whole lot more secure in your fear, if all these people who 'need to protect themselves on a daily basis' were actually trained to do so?  How about the kids that find guns that were improperly stored because the proud new owner never read a word on proper gun storage?

[Dartful Dodger]

So why is it you need a licence to drive a car, but just breath in your body to buy a gun?

I think if you can't spell license you shouldn't get one.

[Luxury]

Redneck Joe, 'Toothless Earl" or " 'married his sister' Jim".

I swear to GOD that you spying on me and my brothers (and sister).  Knock it the ---smurfette--- off!

[Zakk]

Well you do leave the dang curtn's open all the time, dagnubbit! 

[Zakk]

So why is it you need a licence to drive a car, but just breath in your body to buy a gun?

I think if you can't spell license you shouldn't get one.

Touche.  However, it leaves it glaringly obvious that you have no reasonable or even far-fetched notion as to why there is no qualifications put on gun ownership.

 Well, curl up with a copy of the bill of rights, suckle your thumb and hum softly to yourself.   Night night Mary. 

[AtomSmasher]

So why is it you need a licence to drive a car, but just breath in your body to buy a gun?

I think if you can't spell license you shouldn't get one.

Touche.  However, it leaves it glaringly obvious that you have no reasonable or even far-fetched notion as to why there is no qualifications put on gun ownership.

 Well, curl up with a copy of the bill of rights, suckle your thumb and hum softly to yourself.   Night night Mary. 

There are huge differences between driving a car and firing a gun.  The most obvious is that its a lot more likely to hurt someone if you don't know how to drive then it is if you don't know how to properly store a gun.  Another difference is that vehicles are allowed to be in public and around schools and guns are not (in most states at least).  I'm sure there are plenty other reasons, but I know little about our gun laws and am just stating what came to mind after reading your hippy post.  I own several guns and they are all either presents or hand-me-downs so none of them are registered to me

[Dartful Dodger]

So why is it you need a license to drive a car, but just a sperm and/or an egg in your body to have a baby?

Having a gun is a right because our founding fathers saw the need for us to protect ourselves from our own government.  Your testing idea sounds good in theory, but in practice it's letting our government issue tests to see who is qualified to own a gun to protect us from it.

You said you were making a joke about illiterate rednecks, but that's how it starts.  If you tell a joke long enough it becomes acceptable.

What confuses me is, the people who want us to give up our right, are the same people who detest and distrust our government the most.

[Zakk]

So why is it you need a license to drive a car, but just a sperm and/or an egg in your body to have a baby?

Having a gun is a right because our founding fathers saw the need for us to protect ourselves from our own government.  Your testing idea sounds good in theory, but in practice it's letting our government issue tests to see who is qualified to own a gun to protect us from it.

You said you were making a joke about illiterate rednecks, but that's how it starts.  If you tell a joke long enough it becomes acceptable.

What confuses me is, the people who want us to give up our right, are the same people who detest and distrust our government the most.

That's a huge contradiction, you are saying that you want to defend the 'right' to own a gun because you need them for for protection from the government, then you say it's the people who don't trust the government that want to take away the 'right' to own a gun. 

I don't want to take away anyone's 'privilege' to own a gun, I'd just like to make it tougher for riff-raff to get them. 

BTW your founding fathers are long dead and buried, and with them should have gone this archaic thinking.

Oh, and sorry about the redneck joke, but it's okay, they're not a minority or anything, so they're fair game 

[fredster]

Zakk,

In America, it's a RIGHT to own a gun.
It's a PRIVILEGE to Drive.

There are restrictions on ownership, based on the rights of the person. When you go to prison, you give up certain rights. Like Voting and owning guns.

Reasonable answers for owning guns:

1) Killing small animals that invade your property (rabid raccoons)
2) Killing other animals that you need to kill (like horse/broken leg thing)
3) Protecting your property from those who wish to damage it. (The police are not under obligation to respond to all calls - look at Katrina)
4) Protecting your family from bodily harm (for the same reason)
5) Recreation - hunting / target shooting
6) Maintaining your ability to arm yourself if invaded from Canada
7) Driving nails in wood at long distances
Assisted Suicide
9) Because we should in order to maintain the balance between the government and the citizens.  Just because we have order today, doesn't mean we will always have order. 
10) Training for our jobs (if you are police or security)

An archaic idea is that the government will always be there to help you. No, I take that back, that's a naive idea.

You all do what you think is best up there in Canada, okay? We'll do the same in the States.
Maybe you guys can figure out what language you need to speak and if you need to break up into two countries to achieve it. 

[Zakk]

Oh fella, I know it's a right.  However, beyond that chest-thumping screeching call, there seems to be no argument as to WHY it should still be a right.  People are abusing the 'right' all over the place.  I think if there had been cars tooling around back in the day of 'your founding fathers', it would be a 'right' to drive, and you'd be defending why it's okay to drive a car without a license _{(must check spelling)}.

"You all do what you think is best up there in Canada, okay? We'll do the same in the States."

Well, you mean unless Bush tells you that we're hiding WMD's in our maple syrup and you decide to invade and "fix" us?  Wow, how about some consistency.  Stop invading countries and I'll believe you.


(All said and done, I did get a chuckle out of that 'assisted suicide' point) 

[Dartful Dodger]

(must check spelling)

Spell check is only a must when you misspell while pointing out how more smart you is than others.

[Zakk]

smartass 

[sirwoogie]

Spell check is only a must when you misspell while pointing out how more smart you is than others.

Grammar check is important too. Be nice.

[AtomSmasher]

Ah, now I understand what your saying, you just hate America.  You make fun of the bill of rights, one of our most important documents, and our founding fathers who laid the foundation for this country as great as it is.  Now I know to just ignore any political statements you make since they will also likely be anti-american hippy crap.

[Edgedamage]

America gave us MONSTER TRUCKS!!! Gotta love them.

[DrewKaree]

Ah, now I understand what your saying, you just hate America.  You make fun of the bill of rights, one of our most important documents, and our founding fathers who laid the foundation for this country as great as it is.  Now I know to just ignore any political statements you make since they will also likely be anti-american hippy crap.

I don't believe this to be the case at all.  While I may not agree with what he says, I certainly believe this to be an inaccurate judgement of Zakk, and a seemingly knee-jerk reaction.

[Dartful Dodger]

If Canada is his really his home, I understand what he's thinking and I sympathize with his plight.  Canadians gave up their guns little by little.  The country divided them up into sports men, collectors, defense, hand gun and rifle enthusiasts.  Then they went after the smaller groups.  The larger groups believed they were safe from losing their rights, or in Canada it's their privileges, but in any case once the small groups lost their rights the smaller groups had no reason to defend the bigger groups so eventually there will be no groups.

Americans saw how quickly Canada lost control, and that's why we don't want to give up the rights we have.  I don't see a reason to own a fully automatic, or a .50 cal, but I know if I give up the right to own one, I might as well give up the right to speak too.

[AtomSmasher]

Ah, now I understand what your saying, you just hate America.  You make fun of the bill of rights, one of our most important documents, and our founding fathers who laid the foundation for this country as great as it is.  Now I know to just ignore any political statements you make since they will also likely be anti-american hippy crap.

I don't believe this to be the case at all.  While I may not agree with what he says, I certainly believe this to be an inaccurate judgement of Zakk, and a seemingly knee-jerk reaction.

I think if there had been cars tooling around back in the day of 'your founding fathers', it would be a 'right' to drive, and you'd be defending why it's okay to drive a car without a license

Maybe I judged too quickly, but that quote tells me he thinks little of our founding fathers and the bill of rights which they made.  That the bill of rights aren't actually rights, just a list of stuff our founding fathers liked to have at the time.

[DrewKaree]

He's trying to show that he believes the differences aren't as "different' as we'd think and using exaggeration to make his point.  I don't take it as him making fun of our founding fathers OR our Bill of Rights.

I DO agree with him being a hippy though

At the very least, he's a dirty dirty Canuck 

[AtomSmasher]

I DO agree with him being a hippy though

At the very least, he's a dirty dirty Canuck 

Now that I can agree with

[c64rulez]

I DO agree with him being a hippy though

At the very least, he's a dirty dirty Canuck 

Now that I can agree with

That's not true. Some are lesbians.

[Zakk]

Ah, now I understand what your saying, you just hate America.  You make fun of the bill of rights, one of our most important documents, and our founding fathers who laid the foundation for this country as great as it is.  Now I know to just ignore any political statements you make since they will also likely be anti-american hippy crap.

Or, you might just say that you don't have an intellgent answer to my questions.  I don't hate America, I don't hate your founding fathers, and I don't hate your bill of rights.  I do think the bill or rights could stand a bit of updating since times change.
 You're getting this from "I think people should take a test before they can buy something that can kill themselves, their children, or others".  Period.  That's it.  There's no more to it.  I've probably got more family in the States then you do, I probably have nicer suits, a better car, more money in the bank, a bigger house, etc than you do.  Don't shovel that hippy crap over the issue and dismiss it.  You stood up and made a statement, and then tried to fluff it off as "you're just a hater, so I'll ignore you".  If you don't want to discuss something, then stay out of it.

 You actually cheezed me off pretty good with your nonesense.  I went back and re-read what I typed, and I damn well did not make any fun of your 'founding fathers'.  They were all great men, and you have a great institution there.  I think there could be some tweaking from time to time, but I do not by any means HATE AMERICA.  I don't see where I attacked your bill of rights either, past saying that I don't agree that it is not showing its age when it comes to the concept of 'guns for all'.  


Drew: thanks for the vote of confidence.  You're bloody well right I don't hate Americans (even if I don't agree with everything they say or do all the time), why else would I bother to interact with so many of them?  

[c64rulez]

what's canada named after anyway ?

[Zakk]

You're an idiot.  Heaven forbid anyone discuss the bill of rights, but posting a vicious, racist bit of trash is okay?  If that's funny to you, then I don't think I'm the one with a problem buddy.  Go back to your warehouse job, and spouting racial slurs.

[Zakk]

what's canada named after anyway ?

Your mama. 
It's huge, smells like fish, and there's nothing of use at the top.
Evidently it's gay too.

[c64rulez]

Dude, how about some kind of minimum purpose to your posts?  I mean, "Your mama. 
It's huge, smells like fish, and there's nothing of use at the top.
Evidently it's gay too."

W.     T.       F.?

Love, c64